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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Veronica Mars episodes

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by User:Matthewedwards 18:59, 15 November 2008 [1].

List of Veronica Mars episodes

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Cornucopia and I have been cleaning this up for a while, and have recently concluded a peer review. Since Veronica Mars is off the air, the list is comprehensive and complete. We're seeking formal recognition for the list, and anticipate resolving any lingering issues in this process. Jclemens (talk) 04:37, 26 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You need to offer more than that for it to carry any weight. Matthewedwards 00:14, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • "PCH biker gang" Write in full on first use, so that non-So-Cal residents what the PCH is Done
  • "Southern California seaside town" I've never heard "seaside" in So-Cal.. How about "coastal" or "beach"? Done
  • Use EpisodeNumber= and EpisodeNumber2= from {{episode list}} for the series and episode numbers, which will negate "(1-01)", which doesn't make sense Done
    • I went ahead and deleted the (s-ep) numbering, since the airing order is consistent with the production code. Jclemens (talk) 03:50, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • {{episode list}} has been modified so that instead of using Aux1= and Aux2=, you should use DirectedBy= and WrittenBy. Entries will have to be reversed though, because it forces the Directors column to appear before Writers column Done
  • For the viewing figures, use Aux4= rather than Aux3=, which will place them after the airdate. This makes more sense because the viewing figures occurred as a result of it airing. Entries will have to be reversed, don't forget Done
  • Episode summaries could do with being expanded. They seem more like teasers at the moment. See Wikipedia:Plot_summaries and WP:PLOTSUM Done
    • Clarifying question: What's another article that you consider a good model for total length in plot summaries? Jclemens (talk) 01:35, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The_Simpsons (season 9), The_Simpsons (season 8), (any of The Simpsons lists, actually), The O.C. (season 3), Degrassi: The Next Generation (season 7), Blue Heelers (season_13), and The Office (US TV series) season 3 are pretty good. They've been promoted recently, so they'll indicate the lengths that are okay.
Degrassi: The Next Generation (season 1), List of Desperate Housewives episodes and List of Stargate SG-1 episodes were promoted some time ago and need a bit of attention. Matthewedwards 04:01, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you very much. Working on the tables now. Jclemens (talk) 04:05, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Regarding the plot summaries, do you mean that they are too short, or that some contain vague sentences. I think the length of the summaries are good as-is, it's just the vague parts that need to be cleared up. Is that reasonable? Corn.u.co.pia / Disc.us.sion 06:52, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I have increased the length of all summaries to two or more lines, and I have cleared up any vague sentences. Are the summaries fine now? Corn.u.co.pia / Disc.us.sion 12:56, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Matthewedwards 00:14, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Understood. I'll get on those tonight. Jclemens (talk) 01:23, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

More comments

  • Please follow encyclopedic WP:TONE. "dad", "kid", "cops", and "couple of" should be "father", "student", "police (or sheriffs)", something more specific done
  • Specialist words such as "bumfights", should be wikilinked done
  • "who took pictures of her and sent them to her mother and the Moon Calf Collective" needs refactoring.. the pictures weren't sent to the Moon Calf Collective done
  • "Rap producer" sentence case done
  • "Veronica finds out that her mother left rehab, asks her to leave town." is not a complete sentence done
  • "bus' driver" --> "bus driver" done
  • That's all I've caught, you could try to enlist a copy editor from Wikipedia:Peer_review/volunteers. I've also found User:Scartol and User:97198 to be good. Matthewedwards 00:17, 1 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thanks for the feedback. I've gone through the entire list again and found and fixed several more issues. How important do you judge the necessity of an outside copyeditor at this point? Jclemens (talk) 04:34, 1 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Killervogel5
Comments from Killervogel5

I've reviewed this list (mostly because my girlfriend would be horrified if I didn't, she's a huge fan) in its entirety, only some little things to fix.

  • Section headers (year ranges) should use en-dashes instead of hyphens. Done
  • In the lead, correct the following: "The second season decreased to an average of 2.3 million viewers, however it included the series' highest rated episode with 3.6 million viewers."→"The second season decreased to an average of 2.3 million viewers; however, it included the series' highest rated episode with 3.6 million viewers." Done
  • "high-school"→"high school" Done
  • "The CW President"→president Done

Otherwise, very well done, well-constructed and well-organized. This list meets the criteria and is definitely worthy of promotion. Cheers. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 23:16, 30 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • As my comments have been resolved, I support this excellent candidate for promotion. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 01:47, 31 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your review and kind words. Please let me know if I've missed anything. Jclemens (talk) 01:31, 31 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments -

Otherwise sources look okay, links checked out with the link checker tool. Ealdgyth - Talk 16:51, 4 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 22:53, 11 November 2008 (UTC) [reply]
Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)

Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)

  • "Balancing murder mystery, high school and college drama"-->A balance of murder mystery, high school and college drama... Done
  • "introduced in the first episode of the season and solved in the finale."-->in which the conflict is introduced in the first episode of the season and solved in the finale. Done
  • "In September 2008, Entertainment Weekly's Michael Ausiello reported that Thomas still planned to make a film, even though he was busy with other projects." The second comma is not needed. Done
  • "which would likely involve Veronica solving crime in college"-->in which Veronica would likely solve crime in college. Done
  • "Thomas has had a meeting with DC Comics to talk about a Veronica Mars comic book series." "talk about"-->discuss. Done

More comments later. Dabomb87 (talk) 13:19, 7 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comments. I've made the corrections as suggested. Jclemens (talk) 16:10, 7 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Veronica starts her Junior year at Neptune High by freeing new student Wallace Fennel" Why is "Junior" capitalized? Done
  • "Celeste Kane hires Keith to follow her husband Jake, and Veronica stakes out a seedy motel where he meets an unseen woman." Who is "he"? Done
  • "hallucinates"-->dreams of.
    • Going to rewatch this episode. I'm pretty sure it's actually an hallucination, not a dream. Jclemens (talk) 18:19, 8 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "When Veronica's pregnant neighbor Sarah goes missing," "goes missing"-->disappears. Done
  • "goes missing" Same as above. Done
  • "Paris Hilton guest stars." As who? Done
    • "Aaron tries to grieves after Lynn's suicide, but Logan thinks that he is faking." Done
      • Disagree with this one. Aaron turns out to be a psychopath, and the insincerity of his grief is actually a plot point. Jclemens (talk) 18:19, 8 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Veronica also has to contend with a classmate who is getting mysteriously harassed." "getting"-->being. Done
  • "Logan tries to save Veronica, and they end up kissing." Is he successful? Done--I think. tries->intervenes should clarify that sufficiently, I think. Jclemens (talk) 18:19, 8 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "as it was the same drug used on her prior to her rape at Shelly Pomroy's party." "prior to"-->before. Done
  • "surviver"-->survivor. Done
  • "When blame for the bus crash lands on the driver,"-->When the bus driver is blamed for the crash.. Done
  • "He asks Keith to run for Sheriff, and he accepts after seeing Sheriff Lamb's investigation of the bus crash case. Kevin Smith guest stars. " Who accepts? Who does Smith guest star as? Done
  • "but finds no skeletons in his closet" Don't use unclear idioms, be more straightforward. Done
  • "Veronica learns that Terrence Cook, Jackie's father, has a lot of gambling debt, and is being blackmailed by Sheriff Lamb. Veronica finds a voice mail message left by someone on the bus crash which suggests an explosion caused the bus crash. Veronica shows it to Keith, who does not go public with the message, and instead gives it to Sheriff Lamb." Use something other than "Veronica" to start one of the sentences, mix up the sentence starts. Done rewrore most of the paragraph.
  • "Joss Whedon guest stars." As who? Done
  • "He tells Keith of his plan of incorporating the wealthy part of Neptune, which would widen the divide between the rich and the poor."-->He tells Keith of his plan to incorporate the wealthy part of Neptune, which would widen the gap between the rich and the poor. Done

I will finish the comments later. Dabomb87 (talk) 16:11, 8 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again for your excellent feedback. Jclemens (talk) 18:19, 8 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "She also learns that the bridge witness, Dr. Griffith"—"She also learns"-->"Veronica learns". Done
  • "a case involving two "09er" boys versus a poor Hispanic woman"—"versus"-->against. Done
  • "Logan flirts with sophomore Hannah, the daughter"-->Logan flirts with Hannah, the sophomore daughter... Done
  • "Feeling guilty for not helping her, Veronica sets herself to catching the rapist." The wording is not correct here. Done--reworded
  • "no one was going to believe them as a suspect." "as"-->to be. Done
  • "the party is robbed Point Break-style" Can we have a term that is more understandable to all readers? Done
  • "and no hair or DNA from the rapist has ever been found at the crime scenes" "has"-->had. Done
  • "Mercer is arrested after Parker recognizes his cologne as that of the rapist"-->Mercer is arrested after Parker recognizes his cologne to be the rapist's... Done
  • "Patty Hearst guest stars. " As who? Done
  • "In order to salvage their friendship, Logan dumps Veronica as a girlfriend" Done
  • "but Logan gets stuck babysitting an eleven year old girl"-->but Logan has to babysit an eleven year old girl instead. Done
  • "DC Comics to talk about a Veronica Mars comic book series"-->DC Comics to discuss the a proposed Veronica Mars comic book series. Done

Dabomb87 (talk) 04:54, 11 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again for the detailed feedback. Do you have additional ideas for the two suggestions I disagreed with? Jclemens (talk) 05:34, 11 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Side-issue (not really) can you merge&redirect all the episodes to this list? The episodes, asides from the premieres and finales are completely not noticeable and should be only limited to this list. Nergaal (talk) 10:24, 9 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am currently working on the individual episodes, so they will be kept for now. Corn.u.co.pia / Disc.us.sion 07:25, 10 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from SatyrTN
  • The only concern I have is that the final paragraphs probably belong in the main article, but not in the *list*. Other than that, the list looks good.
  • Support this nomination. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 04:01, 15 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support but please add a hatnote-link for season 3 to this LoE. I am neutral on the inclusion of the the section "Cancellation and future". When/If all seasons get articles though, it can/should be reconsidered if each season intro in this LoE really needs to be this long (I am fine with this now as this LoE also serves as a season overview beyond its LoE purpose). – sgeureka t•c 08:26, 15 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Understood. Ideally, we will be breaking out all three seasons and make corresponding changes to this list when those articles go live, too. Jclemens (talk) 17:43, 15 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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