PinkWorld

Just posting a short hello - not sure if I will make it back to check this page later.

There is an active discussion on the Talk:‘Alawi, in which some are arguing that it should be moved back to Alawite, as it is the "common " usage. Would you like to post your comments there?Jemiljan (talk) 16:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

You have previously participated in a discussion at Talk:‘Alawi. If you care, please weigh in on a modification of the move request there. Also, I was interested in your comments about spelling conventions below. It is a thorny issue. On the one hand, I prefer a properly transliterated font, but for many English speakers unaccustomed to this, it can be a burden. On the other hand, I do have a preference for using an apostrophe for the letter 'ayn. What do you think?Jemiljan (talk) 02:31, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

Hey

Welcome! Don't worry about the talkback bit. Ogress _smash! 21:59, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Spelling Conventions

    After introducing the concept of Shia Islam and its various spellings, might it be a good idea to revert to a more Western spelling
- that is, without accent marks and such for the remainder of the article? (Shi'a -> Shia) PinkWorld (talk) 04:27, 25 December 2008 (UTC)Pink

I agree with you but I think this is not an issue to be decided & discussed at this talk page, as this is an issue of policy & convention it should be discussed at higher platform e.g. wikiproject Islam, Arabic, Persian, etc. If you are making such move plz inform me as I'll like to participate in the discussion. Thanx. --Sayed Mohammad Faiz Haider Rizvi (talk) 17:34, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hi there. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. If you can't type the tilde character, you should click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your name and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you! --SineBot (talk) 09:03, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

My dearest SineBot I am fully aware of how to sign my posts. My problem is that I forget to sign the posts until after I click "save page". *rolling eyes* I cannot believe that a bot can post actual posts.
PinkWorld (talk) 23:47, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Pink

RE:Help

1. Which sandbox are you referring to, bro?
2. Ayatollahs can definitely be secular sources if they are accepted in the secular establishment as such. A good example is Tabatabai who wrote the brilliant book Shi'a Islam, one of the first comprehensive introductions to the Shi'a Islamic faith to the West. It is considered a wonderful secular work that is outside his work as a scholar within the Usuli school.
3. You can use old Britannica articles, and in fact really old ones are preferred because they are in the public domain now! The Aga Khan I article takes advantage of this fact.
4. Eick, to be honest, even though I wrote most of the article on Ismailism, I dislike how it turned out. It focuses way too much on history, I need to make heavy changes to it soon. I am also upset at how the Twelver article is currently, I would like to work on that one as well. To be honest, I've suggested to other editors the article on Shi'a Islam with only a little work (basically making sure it satisfies WP:NPOV and WP:RS) could be an FA-class article. I think everyone did a very good job on it.
--♥pashtun ismailiyya 02:55, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

The specific things I hope to see are things that all Shi'a have in common. Getting too specific for the Shi'a Islam article is not what the article is about. And on Wikipedia we have to use secular sources, valid secular sources will be truthful about the faith, there is no reason to be afraid of them. Academic perspectives are the only perspectives acceptable on Wikipedia, and if they are valid, they shouldn't be a problem. The only Shi'a scholars I know of who are acceptable on Wikipedia would probably be Tabatabai, Hamid Algar, and Hossein Nasr. Also, note, things like taqleed and so forth should not be discussed, they are Usuli and Usuli-centric issues should be primarily discussed on the Twelver article. If things turn out correctly, the Twelver section on the Shi'a Islam article will be vague enough that almost all Twelver groups (including perhaps the Alevi, who are Muslim by secular opinion and fatwa) could be included. And as for as talk back, I don't use it. I think it's stupid, time consuming, and inconsiderate to the person you are talking to. It's fine if you want to use it, but you should ask someone who uses it themselves (I think Ogress does). Anywho, hopefully we can get to work soon. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 05:58, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Just a minor correction. We will talk about how the Usuli school is dominant, and how it rose to prominence around three centuries ago, and for most of Twelver history the Akhbari were dominant. We'll also briefly discuss the Shaykhi school and how it lead to the rise of the Baha'i Faith, the second most widespread faith in the world. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Is there a reason you don't want to use secular valid sources? Because as long as they are prominent, they should be generally correct about the faith. Try to find a book that has been published in the West to Western academia, it's possible but maybe not likely that Sadr's work may have reached that prominence. As far as fiqh, the risalas of marja are primary sources hence cannot be used. On Wikipedia just note we won't need to go into fiqh very much at all, in any place. A good person to cite for information on Twelver Shi'a Islam is Juan Cole, he has written many works on the faith. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:24, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

I understand. Looking at it again jaan, I think perhaps before we get to work we should do some moving around and editing. The article on Islam is an FA-class article. Why don't we design it like that? If you like the idea I'll go ahead and see what I can do with it. From that point on, I'll mark section that we need to write, expand, or reference on. The most important thing that we need to right is information on Imamate. Imamate splits Shi'a Islam in two, those who don't believe in traditional Imamate (the Zaidi) and those who do (the Twelver and Ismaili). Thereon, the nature of Imamate can differ. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:58, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Most of the information under the "Branches" section is copy and paste. It should be shortened or preferably re-written with the overall article in mind. And I'll be calling it a night soon myself, though, what spiritual happiness it is to stay late and become tired working for Sahib al-Zamaan! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 07:36, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

The Ismaili section is primarily a copy and paste of the start of Ismailism. But that was a while ago, the article has slightly changed since. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:02, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I am hoping the branches section will only be very small by the end of all this. I hope before the branches section we have something detailing the beliefs and practices all Shi'a Muslims share in common. There aren't too many practices in common, so we'll need to concentrate on beliefs. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:14, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Okay, that sounds fine. Just know, you don't need page numbers, the book's name will be fine, so stuff online should be good. Al-Islam has upst some of our Sunni editors before, so I don't know if we cna use that. And I live in a somewhat small place too, but it's in California and Tehrangeles isn't too far away. We'll figure something out eventually, insha'Allah. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:43, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Yep, California has a VERY large Iranian community. If I recall correctly, in Tehrangeles, around one third of the Iranians are Persian Jews. However, throughout California overall, we have Baha'i, Zoroastrians, molhed (atheists), and of course Twelver Shi'a Muslims, who I think are the largest group after those who don't identify with any faith. When I used to work near Tehrangeles there was a Twelver Masjid nearby that was apparently the Iranian "star" masjid, where all the big Iranian actors, actresses, and musicians went. They were hadith rejectors but still distinctively Twelver Shi'a. It was nearly empty most of the year except on I believe the Nights of Destiny in Ramadan, where they actually had chaffeurs at the masjid. Also, when I used to do Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu, a boy who I taught, his father helped trained the Shah's forces against the revolutionary forces. And Imamate will be within beliefs, and insha'Allah tomorrow I'll organize the article so we can work on it. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:14, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Me too; khuda hafiz, ma'salaama, fi aminullah, good night, or whatever your ethnic origin prefers! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:24, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

lol, part of the Shiachat generation methinks? --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:42, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Both those are primary sources from scholars (who are primary sources in Usuli Twelver Shi'a Islam)! I'll try to overview some good secular sources tomorrow, that you can access as well, insha'Allah. And RevertMuslimsAssociation, I used to know through a friend the girl who owns it. I'd be somewhat prepared to have brown men clawing at you though on that website (I think they do that!), but if you're taken you might be fine. If you want an intelligent Twelver place, join AIMIslam.com. However, it's sadly a website that seems to be pumping velayat-e faqih propaganda. Nothing wrong with Khomeinists mind you, but a website dedicated to propaganda of it is a bit much. Eick, I should be asleep too, I have uni tomorrow, but meh, I'm just going to ditch Chemistry and end up arguing with a conservative the place of post-modern art in contemporary liberalism (<3 California). Anyway, if you stay on Wikipedia, it will be hilarious (italics worthy mind you) because it means 90% of the Shi'a Islam Task Force is women, and 90% of the Sunni Islam Task Force is male. Primitive understanding of monthly female biology asserts we will win this war. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 10:11, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

lol... there was once this guy who came to this Shi'a forum and said he had an ailment (which he wouldn't tell us lest it scare off potential women) that meant no one wanted to marry him, but he really needed a wife. I messaged him and pretended to be a transsexual (as per Khomeini's fatwa) saying that within a few months I would be a woman and asked if he would be willing to marry me. He rejected moi! Anywho, I'm really off to sleep right now, but I'm glad you said "khuda hafiz", I'm anal about all my Muslim friends using that instead of all those other heretical goodbyes. Allah hafiz is the worst. Anywho, khuda hafiz! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 10:28, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Yes. You can also select two article dates and then compare them, and undo it that way too. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:26, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Sweeeet, though it's odd Hertz didn't revert it completely. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:46, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I am planning on copying how the article on Islam is. If you feel uncomfortable working on this article, the Twelver article needs lots of work... --♥pashtun ismailiyya 07:13, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Also sis, for the article on Shi'a Islam, and other work you insha'Allah will be doing on Wikipedia, you can feel free to ask me via Wikipedia/e-mail/AIM/MSN about Zaydi and Ismaili beliefs, or beliefs in general that distinguish the Shi'a form Islam. I get sometimes a tad concerned with our Twelver editors since they usually have a slight "You worship a white guy who says he is an Imam and has divorced twice" view of Ismailism. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:03, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I'll let you take care of things from the Twelver end. Make sure we don't get Usuli stuff in the Twelver article though, that seems to be a consistent issue with editors who are Twelver, taqleed under Ayatollahs, but don't know what an Usuli is. I am considering doing a write up of the Twelver article, but Allahu 'alim on that. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:19, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Taqleed is Usuli, however, a vast amount of people who actually are practicing Usulis do not know the term Usuli! This includes one guy I know who was an Usuli (somewhat) and did a PhD in comparative religion. He also never heard the terms Deobandi and Barelwi before. In a way it's very funny; for 1400 years Muslims across the globe have generally thought that every Muslim had the same Islam aside from fiqh and aqeedah difference. And then the Internet hit, and Desis (with their sayed caste system), Arabs, Iranians, and Turks, have barely anything in common. The second largest Twelver group in the world, and the largest native Shi'a group in Europe (Albania and Turkey), are the Alevi-Bektashi! Knowing them and knowing Usulis show the two have absolutely nothing in common. Eick, and that's not even getting into the mess Sunni Islam is in right now... --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:32, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Okay, nice. We'll eventually move some things to the Usuli article, but not yet. Look at how I did the history section on Ismailism. Insha'Allah, we need to do the same thing for the Twelver article. We need to start with the lives of the Imams up till al-Askari. Afterwards, we have to detail the several sects with emerged after his death. After most agreed on the idea of the Twelve Imams, the last being Muhammad al-Mahdi, we need to go into how the Four Deputies gained the largest following, with the second most influential being the followers of Ibn Nusayr who later formed the Alawi in Syria. Afterwards, we'll go into the first 700 years of Twelver Shi'a Islam being primarily Akhbari and Alevi-Bektashi, and Shah Ismail bringing Alevi-Bektashi Shi'a Islam to Iran, which later converted to the Akhbari school, which later brought rise to the Usuli school, which later transformed into an institution of political power. If we go through all this, we should have a very complete article, insha'Allah! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:04, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

We definitely will need sourcing in the Shi'a Islam article, so brace yourself! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:57, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Insha'Allah sis, sleep sweetly, and khuda hafiz. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:25, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Wa alaikum assalam

Looking forward to working with you on articles. Salam -Falastine fee Qalby (talk) 06:10, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

RE: ChitChat

Yeah. I mean, even I have an issue with al-Ghazzali who I pinpoint as the founder of modern traditional Sunni Islam, but even he wasn't moronic. The issue with Salafism is that no where in Islamic history can we find this form of radical Athari beliefs prevalent. Some say they don't have a madhab. all they need is the Qur'an and hadith, but then they forget that both the compiler of Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim ascribed to madhabs... --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:44, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Within the followers of Hadhir Imam, the Aga Khan IV, we are split into various cultural traditions, since Ismailism stresses the meanings (batin) over the exterior forms (zahir). These aren't sects or branches, but simply forms of tradition, somewhat like the four madhabs of Sunni Islam but not legalistic at all. Since I am the descendant of Afghani refugees, I follow the Nasriyya tradition, which is a tradition that heavily emphasizes Platonic philosophy and rationalism, as partially built by Ibn Sina who himself was the son of a prominent Afghani Ismaili. Unfortunately, this tradition was killed by al-Ghazzali's witless book, The Incoherence of Philosophers in the Sunni world, and then later killed in the Twelver world by Mulla Sadra, who wasn't a stupid man by any means. The latter spread the way for Khomeini's rise. We Ismailiyya from Afghanistan are the last adherents of this ancient tradition of Islam, unfortunately. But, I have strong faith because of our tradition's strengths, logic, rationalism, humanism, and universalism, our followers can have much stronger influence beyond our small numbers in the thousands. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:14, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Most Ismaili are Nizari, hence follow the Aga Khan IV as the Lord of the Age. We number at I think at around 15 million, but we do not wear headscarves. There is a smaller group called the Mustaali or Bohra, they believe the twenty-first Imam Taiyab abi al-Qasim went into the Occultation and will one day return and bring about an age of justice. However, they are very Shaykhi in their approach and believe that one Shi'a is capable of keeping in contact with this individual. Hence, they have split many times over who this individual is, whom they term the Da'i al-Mutlaq. They are very close to Twelver Shi'a Islam and Sunni Islam, and have mainly Ismaili influence on aqeedah. From my knowledge, the Dawoodi Bohra are the ones who primarily keep a similiar dress code, and they are the largest Bohra group with around one million followers, so I suspect you saw members of their group. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:35, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm glad to hear that sister, it's good you didn't come with preconceived notions of my heresy too! And ma'salaama if you must, but khuda hafiz is always preferable! Fight the battle against the Arab-ization of Islam! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:52, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

I think there are many books out there sis; it's the matter of familiarizing yourself with secular readings as opposed to religious ones. And I wouldn't suggest swapping the history from Ismailism. When I wrote that, it was very brief and I kept in mind that later I would be discussing Muhammad ibn Ismail as well as the Fatimid Empire. The Twelver article will need to concentrate more on each Imam and how those Imams contributed to Twelver theology, as opposed to Ismaili theology. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:32, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Tabatabai's work, "Shi'a Islam" is readily available online! You can find it here. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:50, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Goodies! Just don't speak to me in that gross Paki language. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 06:59, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Pashto is actually the language of my people, however, Persian is too prominent among Pashtuns and Afghans alike for me to not drop a word here or there for. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 08:45, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

I disagree with your theory of mixing and matching. Muslim converts to Islam in the West ruthlessly become Desi, with the only exception being the minority who become Arab (primarily the Salafi). A year into Islam they are eating biryani, know Bollywood actor names, have considered dancing to Bhangra at least once, and love Desi clothes and plan to wear them at their weddings. To be honest I can't blame them; the Desi form of Islamic culture is by far among the most charismatic and beautiful. Arabs have no culture or history before Islam, and presently most of their culture is Westernized. Iranians may have culture and history before Islam, but are becoming increasingly Westernized (even Ahmedinijad is wearing Western clothing). Muslim Desis are among the last few who still wear their native clothing, still are extremely active in literature, actively support a religious music industry, and constantly keep bonds with their culture. Even to this day, Sunni literature on the Ahl al-Bayt, and even generic religious scholarship, from the Subcontinent is so beautiful any Shi'a would love to say it is their own. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:23, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

I can't tell you what the state of Afghani culture is, really. In the West we do somewhat fine. But, our country has not had a chance to industrialize, we've been invaded by the Soviet Union which we defeated (the most powerful military in its day, only nation ever to do so), then invaded by the United States which put in a government run by a mafia, and have been in the Afghan Civil War for the past thirty years. I really don't know how Afghani culture is going to stand in the future, unlike Pakistan, Iran, Egypt, we have never had the chance to actually modernize our nation and see how our culture survives.

As a Muslimah, it is so frustrating and heart-breakening. I have seen Pashtuns and several other ethnic groups raise signs and chant for peace in Palestine, never once in my life have I seen an Arab go to a rally for peace in Afghanistan. When have Muslims ever thrown a peace rally for Afghanistan, made ribbons, made flags, and made chain letters that says Allah will curse you if you don't forward the e-mail to ten people by Asr time? Apparently eight Afghans are not worth one Palestenian (look up the populations of the respective states), and apparently Jews are a worse enemy than atheists. And none of it surprises me; in a poll in Arab countries, Arabs were asked to state whether they identify as Muslim, Arab, or their country of origin first. All countries chose Arab, except Lebanon, which identified as Lebanese first and foremost. This contrasts with my family's village in Pakistan that says, “Islam is the greatest of all religions,” and hardly identify as Pakistani at all. While Palestine might be an Islamic issue, it strikes me that 90% of the attention it is getting is from Arabs. In fact, an Arab-produced show that aired in the Middle-East was about the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and about an Arab man who goes to fight and falls in love with a native girl. By the end of the series the protagonist realizes the ultimate truth; Afghanistan is a diversion from the true issue at hand: Palestine.

right|thumb|350px By the end of the Soviet Invasion over one-third of Afghanistan's population were refugees in Iran and Pakistan. Iran has gracefully dealt with this issue recently by proposing that they kick Afghanis out after years of denying them citizenship, health care, and education. The second largest city in Afghanistan, Kandahar, which once had 200,000 inhabitants, was left with 25,000. One out of every thirty people in Afghanistan are still disabled because of the war. By the end of the war child mortality was 31%, I don't believe it has ever been that high in Palestine. All this happened, but the Muslim world was mostly silent; Palestine, a much smaller nation population-wise, which didn't produce a tenth of the influence Afghanistan had on Islam, was more important. Palestine is important, but how could you compare it to Afghanistan in terms of sheer human life, in terms of aggression? One can say the start of aggressions between the newly arrived Jewish immigrants in Israel and its Arab inhabitants were muddy, in fact, it was the Muslim community which first started violent acts which escalated. But you cannot say the same for Afghanistan being invaded by the two greatest world powers in its day and being ruthlessly ruled by Deobandis in between invasions.

Mahmoud Ahmedenijad is worried about wiping Israel off the map. He states that in the news to the evil Western powers, and he meets the lovely Saudi king, and tries to cross Sunni-Shi'a borders. But forget the ethnic Twelver Shi'a Pashtuns being massacred in North Pakistan by the reformed Taliban. Ethnic Shi'a Pashtuns are in low numbers, and intermarriage, genocide, and deculturalization means that in a few centuries we may not exist at all, even I have given hope of marrying a Pashtun Shi'a to continue our heritage. Forget that though, let's try to make Sunnis like us.

The rant is over, and I'll go on to answer your question. We have produced the likes of Ibn Sina, Rumi, and even perhaps Abu Hanifa's family. To give an educated guess, I feel that the Persian-speaking and Shi'a parts will lean towards Westernization while the Pasho-speaking parts will lean away from Westernization but accept modernization. I hope that these cancel each other out, so that we have a Persian nation that has not abandoned its culture, unlike Westernized Iran and Sovietized Tajikistan. As for reverts, I can't interact with the ones who adopt Arab culture. The ones who adopt Desi culture are often very sociable and fun, and to be honest, I feel they understand Islam much better in that how it interacts with our lives as opposed to those who adopt an Arab view. The revert I liked the best was by far a revert who didn't adopt any culture at all, he was a normal Mexican-American and we would argue whether the West coast or the East coast was better. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 10:29, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Most of the information I told you I got straight from the Wikipedia page on the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Insha'Allah, I am currently working on a website and organization that will serve and cover news about the Afghani Shi'ah community, as well as aid our struggle in keeping our separate identity from Pakistani and Iranian Shi'ah. We will also cover other Afghan-related communities outside the country, such as Afghania (NWFP), and Tajikistan. And I don't have a background for that image, sorry, I just found it on Wikimedia commons when I was looking for stuff to design my page with. As far as on Wikipedia, I am currently the "head" of Wikipedia:WikiProject Afghanistan and Wikipedia:WikiProject Pashtun. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 00:57, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Sources

Thanks for your note. Of course I would be interested in seeing your sources. Please paste tem on the talk page in the section on medical facilities at the top of the page. Salamat. Tiamut^talk 14:53, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Here are some I was going to add myself:

• http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28677373/
• http://www.reliefweb.int/rw/rwb.nsf/db900SID/CJAL-7NBTXQ?OpenDocument
• http://www.gmanews.tv/story/144447/Red-Cross-condemns-shelling-of-Gaza-hospital
• Senior official gives shelling of UN Gaza compound
• amnesty
• Save the Children suspends aid
• detailed rundown of events of 15 January including hospital bombings, firing at medics, attack on UN warehouse

And the section on the talk page is in archive 16 (Wow!).

No puedo escribir en espanol bueno ahora, pero comprendo mucho. hasta luego mi amigo.

Salamat. Tiamut^talk 01:56, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Alhamdullilah, renovation on Shi'a Islam has begun

I've tagged around four sections under Beliefs that I need you to expand. In general, these beliefs do not differ much among groups, and where they do, I will simply slightly edit whatever you write. I have also started a similiar overhaul on Ismailism (but since I am generally the only person working on it I am going to update it all at once instead a little at a time), I am hoping insha'Allah that perhaps by the end of the year Ismailism and a new article/list I wish to write, Imams of Ismailism, will be FA-Class articles, meaning they are the best articles on the Wikipedia project. The Twelve Imams is the only article/list related to Shi'a Islam that I know has achieved this level of quality, and it was mainly worked on by User:Sa.vakilian and myself. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 09:15, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

All the beliefs that are held by multiple groups (though not necessarily all, only Mustaali and Twelver believe in the Occultation, only Twelver and Ismaili believe in ismah, etc) I have made sections for in the main article. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 22:01, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

You can put it on places like Rapidshare. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 22:27, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

You're referring to the Usul al-Din of the Twelver faith. Imamah and nubuwwah are shared among the three groups. Maybe we will include `Adl. However, Qiyamah, though it is shared by all groups, differs extremely. The sections we need to expand I've made already, I am unsure if I want to include prophethood since that is a basic Islamic belief in itself. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 22:31, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Good idea; the Ismailism article does that already in fact. See you soon, sis. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 22:42, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Tabataba'i

The name Tabatabaei (Ṭabāṭabā'ī, طباطبائی‎) is so cool I ended up reorganising the article on it and linking all the famous Tabatabaeis' webpages. It is a reduplication of a word of uncertain origin meaning "scholar". Its origin as a name is uncertain; it might be Aramaic or it might be from some settled Jahili Arabic dialect. Also, it's a hamza. :-) Ogress _smash! 02:27, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

It has dots in Arabic, not in Persian. I think I copied the Persian form. Ogress _smash! 03:58, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hi there. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. If you can't type the tilde character, you should click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your name and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you! --SineBot (talk) 05:56, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Hey sis

Thought I'd swing by and say peace. I'm one of those non-assimilating converts; my idea of a good headcovering is a Mexican straw cowboy hat and my "shalwar kameez" are jeans and a button-down with some doc marten "khuff". Heh. Anyway, peace! as we say in English.

I do like goat, although admittedly that's probably because my da's Irish. But who doesn't like Indian? Ogress _smash! 02:13, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Pictures

wa alaikum assalam,

This pic best exemplifies the effects of the assault, but the pic along with other pics from the AP bank are under the all rights reserved copyright, so we can't use them. --Falastine fee Qalby (talk) 23:16, 21 January 2009 (UTC) Salam thanks for the link! Is this your web site? --Falastine fee Qalby (talk) 06:50, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Thanks again. I think you are off to good start, and I look forward to future developments. --Falastine fee Qalby (talk) 08:22, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Sources

Thanks for the links. I will start delving into them soon and adding info where appropriate. Sorry for the delay in responding. Ya'atikil aafiya. Tiamut^talk 12:44, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

• Memories of Revolt by Ted Swedenburd has a section discussing land sales. It is hard to find information about Palestinians who sold land, for reasons he explains in the book. I remember a recent book in Hebrew that named names of Palestinian families who collaborated with Israel (it caused quite a scandal here locally, as the names of some established families got dirties, if you know what I mean). Anyway, the book above is a good start and mentions other sources that explored the issue further. Tiamut^talk 13:03, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

RE:Shi'a Islam article

Salaam `alaykum, thanks for your hard work, I can't wait! --♥pashtun ismailiyya 05:19, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Departure

You know that time in every brown girl's life where she has to like, make herself worthy for a future as some hairy man's housewife? Yep, my time has come! Aside from a few articles, I will be drastically cutting my involvement on Wikipedia soon, so we'll go through whatever lasting things I can help you with. Any ideas in particular? --♥pashtun ismailiyya 05:01, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm fine, thanks for asking! You're right, we do focus all the essential core issues in the article itself (I believe I have listed all), and then essential differences are covered in the branches section. You have the right idea. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 20:26, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Since I'm part of the refugee diaspora, most of the weddings I've been to are Pakistani weddings, with one Iranian wedding thrown in for good measure. My wedding, if that tragedy occurs, will probably be Pakistani. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 05:45, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

Tragedy that I might end up in the kitchen cooking Paki food. :@ --♥pashtun ismailiyya 07:42, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

Restructuring

The changes are good! This is a very good editor, and I suggest you work with him quite often, he can help in so many ways. --♥pashtun ismailiyya 05:58, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Belated thanks

For the very good resources you posted online. I still have not had a chance to make use of them, but promise that I will at some point down the line. Very kind of you to think of me though. Cheers, Tiamut^talk 15:36, 12 March 2009 (UTC)