- The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by PumpkinSky talk 00:11, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
Otium edit
... that according to Cicero otium (leisure) with dignity is the one that stands first and is most to be desired by all happy, honest, and healthy-minded men?
Created/expanded by Doug Coldwell (talk) / 7&6=thirteen|talk . Self nom at 12:43, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
- Date, length and hook are verified. Please give link to the article you reviewed. Leszek Jańczuk (talk) 12:48, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
I see you reviewed International Ultralight Banchee. Leszek Jańczuk (talk) 13:04, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
ALT1 ... that Otium, a Latin term, has a variety of meanings including leisure time in which a person can enjoy eating, playing, resting, contemplation and academic endeavors? Leszek Jańczuk (talk) 21:49, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
- If I can have first preference, it would be ALT1 - rather than the original hook line. Thanks.--Doug Coldwell talk 20:13, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
- If at all possible, could I have the article as the first in the queue and the associated picture included.--Doug Coldwell talk 23:57, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
The article is currently tagged with a factual accuracy dispute. Until that is resolved, it can not appear on the main page as a DYK. Given that the article has been tagged like this for over ten days, I'd suggest that if it is not resolved within the next couple of days, this nomination will have to be rejected. Harrias talk 17:37, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
- The first hook is something Cicero actually did say, although not in a particularly good translation; Miss Yonge's "all men in their senses, and to all good and happy men" is better, and unless the Loeb has a better version, I shall be replacing it. The alt hook is - well- an indiscriminate collection of information.
- On the other hand, the article is a public embarrassment: "Epicurus promised enjoyment in retirement as a concept of otium" is nonsense; compounded by the problem that Epicurus had no concept of otium - he was an Athenian, and did not speak Latin.
The nominator has now asked for awards and recognition from several WikiProjects and programs; the article doesn't merit any of them, since he is mangling sources he does not understand.
On the other hand, maybe if he gets his recognition he will go away and edit a subject he does understand. If you good editors can stand being used as a sop, and Doug agrees, I will support it. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 00:35, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- Could The Thinker picture be used with ALT1? Thanks. --Doug Coldwell talk 00:45, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- I won't comment on the hook, but the image makes zero sense in the article and here. It only increases the sense of sciolism: we all know what thinking is, and Rodin never illustrated otium itself - I also think that the article is riddled with imagecruft (tiny icons of philosophers that you may find in the respective articles, and illustrate nothing particularly relevant to the topic). Dahn (talk) 20:38, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- I was just trying to represent contemplation and academic endeavors as a major part of the meaning of Otium with the picture, which would get attention. But if you feel the picture does not represent that, then we can just go with the hook without the picture. --Doug Coldwell talk 20:47, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- Removed The Thinker picture and philosophers pictures from article.--Doug Coldwell talk 21:17, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- I was just trying to represent contemplation and academic endeavors as a major part of the meaning of Otium with the picture, which would get attention. But if you feel the picture does not represent that, then we can just go with the hook without the picture. --Doug Coldwell talk 20:47, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
- I won't comment on the hook, but the image makes zero sense in the article and here. It only increases the sense of sciolism: we all know what thinking is, and Rodin never illustrated otium itself - I also think that the article is riddled with imagecruft (tiny icons of philosophers that you may find in the respective articles, and illustrate nothing particularly relevant to the topic). Dahn (talk) 20:38, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
Article now appears stable. No evidence of copyvio or plaguarism. Harrias talk 08:10, 1 December 2011 (UTC)