Talk:Shalom bayit

White lies

In practice shalom bayit (or whatever your preferred spelling is) can go far beyond white lies. Sometimes it even goes to all out denial of facts from one or both parties. Is "white lies" a strong enough way to address this? 173.62.224.156 (talk) 05:18, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Name

The term is not "Shalom Bayit," but "Sh'lom Bayit." How should this be addressed?

Who says it is? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.202.91.69 (talk) 11:36, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Here is a rabbi who says so: http://books.google.com/books?id=uuizffmvKqQC&pg=PA216&lpg=PA216&dq=shlom+bayit&source=web&ots=JV4HKsJhZM&sig=wxjJCAPUESHZcsq2B9GrqlWoegg&hl=en&ei=J6aZScS4A4OB_gbh25T8CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result

Yeah, the vowel is an "eh" sound so it should be shelom. Ehh, it's just semantics. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.232.27.103 (talk) 16:12, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Requested move

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was move Anthony Appleyard (talk) 17:16, 22 February 2009 (UTC)
Shlom bayit → Shalom bayit

• Agree. Shlom bayit does seem to get more Google hits than Shalom bayit, but the first spelling looks awfully weird to me. In baal teshuva circles, they always say Shalom bayit:

Aish.com articles

Ohr.edu articles

Chabad.org articles.

Yoninah (talk) 23:07, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

• Actually this seems to be a fairly uncommon transliteration. Google is clever, so you have to do a search like this to get a real count. I see how "Shlom bayit" might be grammatically correct based on לgeneral principles of Hebrew, but is it actually correct? But even if it is, in this case the predominant English term should probably win out anyway. Support. --Eliyak T·C 23:56, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

• Suppport - Look at the external links section. No one says Shlom or Sh'lom. In Hebrew, the shin of shalom is vocalized with a komatz. Either shalom (in sifaradit) or sholom (in ashkenazis) would be a correct transliteration. Phil_burnstein (talk) 00:55, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

• I agree that "Shalom" is more appropriate. Danielb613 (talk) 04:29, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

• Strongly oppose The term is Hebrew one, and according to Hebrew grammar and proper usage, it is shlom bayit. The fact that yeshiva students and others who do not know Hebrew grammar mispronounce it is not a reason for perpetuating the mistake on Wikipedia. Anyone who types in "shalom bayit" should be redirected to shlom bayit. The argument that "it looks weird" is weird.--Gilabrand (talk) 04:58, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Gila. I acknowledge your expertise in this matter, but I have a source that seems to partially disagree with you.

"Yes, merge - Chamin and Cholent are one and the same. Cholent is the Yiddish term, which is the most widely used, whereas Chamin is Hebrew and mainly used in Israel (primarily by Sephardi/Mizrahi families).--Gilabrand (talk) 07:21, 13 July 2008 (UTC)"

The quote implies that we should use the most common English usage, rather than the Israeli usage, in wiki transliteration. Phil_burnstein (talk) 12:21, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, Gilabrand, but I edit late at night. I was trying to paraphrase WP:Naming Conventions: Article names should be easily recognizable by English speakers.Yoninah (talk) 17:24, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

• Agree Besides being a more common usage, the comment above that Hebrew grammar rules should apply is incorrect. The phrase entered Hebrew via Yiddish, and in Yiddish it is actually pronounced (correctly) as sholembayis or shulembayis. --Redaktor (talk) 13:04, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Shlom bayit is based on Yiddish??? That is so ridiculous it doesn't even deserve a reply. I just read a comment by some Wikipedian who writes that the original language of the Bible was Greek. Do you think it was Yiddish? --Gilabrand (talk) 14:11, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

• Support move to Shalom bayit per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (common names) and Wikipedia:Naming conventions (use English). The request here is a bit confused because it says right under the requested move, Shlom bayit → Shalom bayit, yet the actual move request is the opposite which accords with that the current title is Shlom. In any event, if we are to follow our common names policy, then this is not a close call. 18,700 for Shalom bayit verses 350 Google hits for "Shlom bayit", i.e. a rato of 53:1. A book search is equally lopsided: 407 hits verses 12 hits a 33:1 ratio. News articles also: 269 for the move target verses 28 for the current title. Unless it can be shown that WP:UCN does not apply here for some reason, the move should be done.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:55, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

Note to Fuhghettaboutit: The WP instructions said to put the move notice at the top of the talk page and open a new section heading entitled "Requested moves", which I did. Those other posts that you refer to were there from more than a year ago. I just added a section heading to them to make it clear that they're not part of our consensus discussion.. Yoninah (talk) 08:45, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

• Support Per Shalom. Chesdovi (talk) 14:24, 17 February 2009 (UTC)
• Support I have never heard it being pronounced without a vowel after the "sh". When speaking (in English) to an Israeli, it is pronounced "shalom"; also when in print (for example Artscroll) it would be spelled "shalom". In Yiddish speaking circles it is always pronounced "sholom" similar to "Olom haba" instead of "Olam haba". To the English speaker both (an ‘a’ or an ‘o’) are correct. Itzse (talk) 22:42, 17 February 2009 (UTC)
• Support The page should be under what MOST people use. Yossiea ^(talk) 15:49, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
• We don't have unaminity (do we ever?), but I think we have consensus. If no one objects over the coming weekend, I will move the page to 'shalom bayit' and create a redirect from 'shlom bayit'. Phil_burnstein (talk) 17:41, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Literal translation

I changed the literal translation from peace at home to peace [at] home since peace at home would be "shalom babayit". The actual literal translation of the colloquial "shalom bayit" would be peace home - quite nonsensical, if you ask me. The literal translation of the correct Hebrew term "sh'lom bayit" is peace of home. -- -- -- 23:34, 26 July 2012 (UTC)

Update: On 29/Dec/13, an anonymous editor changed the literal translation from peace [at] home to peace of the home. -- -- -- 22:32, 15 June 2016 (UTC)

Charity

There's a charity in San Francisco called Shalom Bayit that focuses on dealing with domestic violence. They should probably get their own entry and a referral from here, but lacking that, at least mentioning them in this article would make sense. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.174.32.192 (talk) 09:59, 21 November 2013 (UTC)