Talk:New Delhi metallo-beta-lactamase 1

Find a better name

The article is renamed to 'Plasmid-encoding Carbapenemase-resistant Metallo-B-Lactamase'. You may suggest a better name that doesn't have a city name included in it.

The current name doesn't even make sense. Not sure why it was changed. Carbapenemase is the generic class of antibiotic resistance enzymes, so carbapenemase-resistant is wrong. Plasmid-encoding is wrong too, since the article is about the enzyme specifically and not the plasmid. Even cleaning it up to "plasmid-encoded metallo-beta-lactamase" would be wrong since that would just be the name for most of the metallo-beta-lactamases found on plasmids and not the specific one this article is about. This name change seems to have been made to suit the "patriotism" of certain editors and readers. Ashwan (talk) 14:55, 17 April 2011 (UTC)

- I agree, and I dont understand the fuss regarding the naming - Naming the enzyme after its location of discovery has a history, this is far from the first instance it has been done. Also, naming usually indicates who or where, or from what sample etc the discovery was made, it does not neccessarily indicate that the enzyme, bacteria, etc conclusively originated in that place or that person (e.g. Salmonella is named after Dr Daniel E. Salmon, the man responsible for administrating research that led to discovery of Salmonella sp). VIM (Verona integron-encoded metallo-β-lactamase) was discovered in samples of Pseudomonas aeruginosa in Verona, Italy (1999), SIM (Seoul imipenemase) was discovered in Seoul, South Korea and SPM (São Paolo metallo) first characterized from samples in Sao Paulo, Brasil (1997). The naming in these instances caused none of the reaction that has been caused in India, and disputes regarding the name and subsequent denial/conspiracy theories subtracts from the importance of antibiotic overuse/misuse and the development of polydrug antibiotic resistance. Absolutelypants (talk) 00:13, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

This is a science article

The conclusions of the Lancet article have credence and should be reported in this Wikipedia article. I think someone's sense of national pride was hurt and now they would like to 'erase' good scientific conclusions for that reason alone. Politicians, in many nations, have a long history of trying to suppress science that negatively affects their public relations image. This Wikipedia article is a scientific article and politics should be left out of it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.12.114.43 (talk) 19:26, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I concur. -- chulk90/discuss/contributions 23:08, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

New source just out

doi:10.1016/S1473-3099(10)70143-2 Dysmorodrepanis (talk) 18:43, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

"Emergence of a new antibiotic resistance mechanism in India, Pakistan, and the UK: a molecular, biological, and epidemiological study" is first source referenced in article. Rod57 (talk) 15:29, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

cases number

" identified 44 isolates with NDM-1 in Chennai, 26 in Haryana, 37 in the UK, and 73 in other sites in India and Pakistan."

Source is the Lancet (ref #1) `a5b (talk) 10:56, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Misleading article

This is clearly nothing but a bad propoganda by some pharma company trying to make money by scaring people. Why just concentrate on cosmatic surgery.. what if somebody travels for an apendix surgery?? This report and article is written in biased language without sufficient scientific data and research.. Wiki needs to remove this article for cleaning ASAP.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.106.252 (talk) 16:06, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I fully agrtee that this is a report created for propaganda purposes and thats why it is semi protected so that the propaganda can go on uninterrupted. The author's report was unceremoneously edited and added to to change the slant. The author does not explain that there are other drug resitant bacteria NOT ORIGINATING IN INDIA widely spread in US and Europe but the author does not warn against elective surgery in US and Europe. That alone will show that this is a propaganda that has to be stopped by wiki ASAP. I also recommend that India impose extra penal duties on products of teh company that has alternatives so that the companies are penalised for such wanton attacks. I remember clearly the palm oil lobby(western owned) in Malaysia doing propaganda that coconut oil is bad for the heart and palm oil is better. The Indian Doctors fell for it and the result was reduction in use of coconut oil. Now everyone knows that coconut oil is the BEST and palm oil is bad because the western interests are no longer having interest in palm oil plantations. Either the wiki must be honest and straightforward and stop allowing it to be used for propaganda purposes or declare that it too is an instrument for propaganda of western interestsSankara Menon (talk) 08:39, 13 August 2010 (UTC) Menon

There is a Lancet sciencific article, which states, that most of people with NDM-1 positive bacteria have been travelled to India for medical procedures. `a5b (talk) 18:38, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

" Many of the UK NDM-1 positive patients had travelled to India or Pakistan within the past year, or had links with these countries." - from abstract. `a5b (talk) 18:40, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

+ from UK alert: "Many patients with NDM-1 positive isolates have recent medical contact in India or Pakistan, where the enzyme is accumulating swiftly, probably via efficient plasmid transfer"

Thats only report funded by pharma companies who are going to be benefitted from this. Only one report based on handful numbers is not a conclusive report to raise any alerts. There are many other viruses already present worldwide which are resistant to antibiotics.. what prrof this report has that its spreading rapidly in which case those hospitals should have seen more than only 30 odd patients each in India.. Conclusive comments made in article about travelling to India for medical treatments can not be supported by any evidance —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.106.252 (talk) 19:00, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

All viruses are resistant to antibiotics, you're confusing them with bacteria. Tim Vickers (talk) 19:32, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I meant bacteria.. There are already known strains of bacteria all over the world, which are resistant to most known antibiotics.. there is no need to scare people by pointing fingers at some country with hidden money making agenda for some big pharma companies —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.106.252 (talk) 20:00, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Please limit your comments to how to improve the article content and where we can find reliable sources and what those sources say about the topic that should be included in the article. Other discussion comments will be removed. Active Banana (talk) 20:32, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Removed discussion comments as suggested. I hope someone helps this article by including more medical fact related data. Data about different resistant bacteria that are already existing all over the world. So people can decide themselves whether this is true alarmic situation or not, instead of promoting what one report says.69.74.106.252 (talk) 20:49, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Following articles categorically establishe that there were handful of superbugs known to scientific community since 2004 and none of them are of Indian origin. In fact these six ESKAPE bacteria account for 2/3rds of the healthcare-assisted infections in the USA. please take a look at http://www.idsociety.org/Content.aspx?id=12800, http://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/591861 and www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMp0804651. I do not know if the Lancet article even mentions any of them: if it doesn't, the authors sure are culpable of selective, malignant propaganda. In any case, Can someone include it in the wiki article?

In empirical science like medical research (where any plausible drug/treatment is to be validated against placebo), the media claims on this work are highly irritating. What is the study's null-hypothesis? what is the statistical significance of these assertions? There should be study on 0) the % of people "infected" who has actually traveled to INDIA 1) that this number is "consistent" _across_ citizens of various countries who visited India 2) this against the odds that the traveled citizens could have picked up any another drug-resistant bacteria from their home country or travel to other "developed" nations. Only if the last odds are overwhelmingly against the India, the first two studies have any validity. This is ignoring the statistical significance of people who have the infection but not gotten it from South Asian countries.. Medicos need thorough grilling on statistics..

Poorly written

This is a poorly written article, but I'm not sure how to fix it up. Would appreciate if someone took the effort. 69.196.170.150 (talk) 16:37, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Will someone read this and modify the article appropriately

http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/was-the-superbug-imported-into-india-44285?trendingnow —Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.118.254.210 (talk) 16:56, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

NDM-1 is not a gene, but bla_NMD-1 is

Hello. In the both research papers (lancet and Yong 09), gene is called bla_NDM-1 and enzyme itself - NDM-1. bla stands for beta-lactamase and encoded as gene and NDM is _Some Place_ Metallo-beta-lactamase (a chemical), so, please, change the definition.`a5b (talk) 18:53, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

ref-1(lancet): Antibiotic susceptibilities were assessed, and the presence of the carbapenem resistance gene bla_NDM-1

ref-3 -- about types of carbapenemases

"The NDM-1 enzyme is a class B metallo-beta-lactamase, while other types of carbapenemase are class A or class D beta-lactamases[3]". But Abstract says: " A consistent number of acquired carbapenemases have been identified during the past few years, belonging to either molecular class B (metallo-beta-lactamases) or molecular classes A and D (serine carbapenemases), ", so NDM-1 is not the first metallo-beta-lactamases (class B) carbapenemase. `a5b (talk) 19:15, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, class B is the metallo-beta-lactamase. It is class of carbapenemases, which can be metallo- or serine- or some more beta-lactamases. `a5b (talk) 19:17, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

ref-Yong: "class B enzymes or metallo-β�-lactamases (MBLs)"

all standard antibiotics

"are resistant to all standard intravenous antibiotics for treatment of severe infections."[2]

Does this mean, that NMD-1 positive "superbugs" are resistant for all 10 thousands of antibiotics, or that they were resistant for all drugs (dosens), used in this 37 or 50 cases in vivo?

Importantness of the article

As NDM-1 is a topic getting more and more popular, so i suggest to rise its importantness in different template:

google news[1] have 3430 articles

google search [2] have 5.38M result

recently continously reported by medias, and became a headline of a HK newspaper Apple daily[3], which then cause a wide discussion on it, and compare it with H5N1, 2009 H1N1 InfluenzaA, and SARS, etc. .

Suggested importantness

microbiology:mid/high MCB: high/top medicine:mid/high/top

C933103 (talk) 18:32, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

No, importance is relative to more general articles on the same topic, so for example the top-level article on antibiotic resistance in general is a Top-importance article, with the more specific article on Beta-lactamases as a class as a mid-level importance article. This means that this article on one specific type of beta-lactamase is only a low-importance article. 19:16, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Vegaswikian (talk) 05:13, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

---

Plasmid-encoding Carbapenemase-resistant Metallo-B-Lactamase → New Delhi metallo-beta-lactamase 1 — The current name of the article is not what the enzyme is commonly known as either in the news or in scientific literature. This enzyme is a carbapenemase so calling it carbapenemase-resistant is not only wrong it is exactly the opposite of the function. Also, there are many metallo-beta-lactamases encoded on plasmids, so the current name is not specific enough. It seems to have been renamed out of a false sense of "patriotism". Ashwan (talk) 09:21, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

Support The current title is inaccurate and is not used elsewhere. (See [4]). Graham Colm (talk) 09:28, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Discussion

Any additional comments:

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Conspiracy against India

The naming of the bacteria is clearly a global conspiracy against India... global hospital industry is scared of our doctors. Everyone know it's true. Our doctors are better yet can treat patients for a cheaper price than UK doctors. that's why everyone is coming to India for surgery — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.2.129.80 (talk) 23:38, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

Independent of whether it is a conspiracy or not: It is not about the doctors in India, the whole problem is unrelated to doctors. Resistance to antibiotics arises when antibiotics are not taken long enough. (Some kinds of bacteria in the patient are affected by the antibiotic. They need to die all. If only some die, the more resistant survive. So it needs to be taken the full required time.). Everywhere on the world, patients getting prescriptions for taking antibiotics do not really understand that, because it is not easy to understand. It is like that in the US, in Germany, in India, everywhere. But is even harder to understand if the medication is not prescribed by a doctor, but bought in a pharmacy without prescription. That is possible in India. It has nothing to do with the doctors in India. Volker Siegel (talk) 14:37, 30 October 2019 (UTC)

Oklahoma outbreak?

I took out a claim that there was an outbreak in Oklahoma since I couldn't find any mention of it with a web search, including in the OSDH news release page.[5] it said:

and then the bug was transferred to Tulsa where 29 people were infected in Broken Arrow in late February of 2014. The Oklahoma Health department has ordered strict precautions.

173.228.123.145 (talk) 04:05, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

Defeating the resistance mechanism

A new paper here, in Nature will be of interest once reviews are available. We don't want to encourage science by press release, but the university's puffpiece has already been echoed all over the interwebs. [6][7][8] No doubt we'll see a reliable source soon. LeadSongDog come howl! 16:04, 9 July 2014 (UTC) ‎

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