Talk:Luna Park (Coney Island, 1903)

Removed photo

The panoramic I removed is of Dreamland. Luna was north of Surf Avenue and several blocks to the west (left) of Dreamland. -- Cecropia 16:31, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Un-merged two different parks

I have un-merging what seems to have been an un-discussed unilateral merger[1] of the articles Luna Park, Coney Island and Luna Park, Coney Island (2010) that should never have been merged. Two separate parks that have the same name do not go in the same article, "In Wikipedia, things are grouped into articles based on what they are, not what they are called by." WP:NAD. Fountains of Bryn Mawr (talk) 16:03, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

1906 Map from Sanborn Fire Insuranace

I propose adding the 1906 map from the LOC collection of Sanborn Fire Insurance maps.

Luna Park, Sanborn Fire Insurance Map from Brooklyn, 1906, Volume 13, Sheet 26

- DutchTreat (talk) 13:43, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

Looks like a very valuable map for the article, very informative to the reader.--Pharos (talk) 18:49, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

@Pharos: map added to the article, thanks for the feedback. - DutchTreat (talk) 10:38, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cielquiparle (talk) 09:01, 25 January 2023 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

Luna Park at Coney Island

• ... that during the construction of Coney Island's Luna Park, its owners electrocuted Topsy the elephant? Source: Eschner, Kat (January 4, 2017). "Topsy the Elephant Was a Victim of Her Captors, Not Thomas Edison". Smithsonian Magazine.
  • ALT1: ... that during the construction of Coney Island's Luna Park, its owners electrocuted an elephant that helped them demolish the site? Source: Eschner, Kat (January 4, 2017). "Topsy the Elephant Was a Victim of Her Captors, Not Thomas Edison". Smithsonian Magazine.
  • ALT2: ... that a year after Coney Island's Luna Park opened with 200,000 light bulbs, the competing Dreamland opened with several times as many lights? Source: Maeder, Jay (March 13, 1998). "Shine on Brightly Old Coney Island, 1904". New York Daily News. p. 39.
  • ALT3: ... that half of Coney Island's Luna Park burned down shortly after it was sold to its operators? Source: "Operating Lessees to Buy Luna Park". The New York Times. August 3, 1944. "Half of Luna Park Destroyed by Fire as 750,000 Watch; Flames Sweep Over 8-acre Area and Cause $500,000 Loss in 1 1/2-hour Battle". The New York Times.
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Midsommar
  • Comment: For ALT0 and ALT1, File:Topsy elephant electrocution Luna Park, Coney Island January 1903.png can be used.

5x expanded by Epicgenius (talk). Self-nominated at 19:47, 14 January 2023 (UTC).

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: - Not done
Overall: @Epicgenius: good article. Just waiting on a QPQ. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:59, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

@Onegreatjoke: Thanks for the review. I've done a QPQ not only for this nomination, but also for {{Did you know nominations/The Brooklyn Tower}} and {{Did you know nominations/Royalton Hotel}}, which you also reviewed. Epicgenius (talk) 18:49, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Approve. Onegreatjoke (talk) 23:58, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Luna Park (Coney Island, 1903)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Adog (talk · contribs) 05:08, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

In the spirit of GAN reviewing streak to keep myself busy with a new job, I will complete this review likely by Saturday, August 12. I will probably start on Friday, August 11. I look forward to reading about another amusement park. Adog (Talk・Cont) 05:08, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

---

Hello once again, Epicgenius. You know the drill from me. Feel free to push back on anything that is not appropriate or improper:

Prose

Lead

• the other were Steeplechase Park ... "other" to "others".
• Luna Park opened on May 16, 1903, and it was highly profitable ... "it" can be removed.
• Thompson then operated the park alone until 1912 ... "then" can be omitted.
• The western half of the park ... to The park's western half ...
• Although some rides on Surf Avenue continued to operate after 1944, much of the site remained closed for several years; the entire site was redeveloped as the Luna Park Houses between 1958 and 1962. The second instance of site could be "area" or "place" to avoid repetition.
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Development

• "per year" to "annually"?
• Commas before and after "in turn".
  • Both done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Background

• In 1901, Frederic Thompson and Elmer "Skip" Dundy had created a wildly successful ride, called "A Trip To The Moon", as part of the Pan-American Exposition at Buffalo, New York. "had" can be omitted. Same with commas after "ride" and "Moon".
• Thompson and Dundy opted to establish their own amusement park at the end of the season, following a disagreement with Tilyou. This comma could also be removed.
• If the group leased both lands from Frederick Kister, the sentence: As part of the deal, they leased some land from Frederick Kister, and they also leased a strip of land on West 12th Street for 25 years could read as As part of the deal, they leased some land from Frederick Kister and a strip of land on West 12th Street for 25 years. If not, disregard it.
  • All done. Kister only leased one plot of land, but not the strip on West 12th. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Construction and opening

• The Brooklyn Daily Eagle initially estimated that Thompson and Dundy would spend $200,000 on renovating ... "on" can be omitted.
• Ultimately, the men spent $700,000 (although they advertised it as $1 million) totally rebuilding ... Comma before "totally"?
• In the next sentence, "of" could be removed.
• Topsy the elephant, who had been bought that season by Boyton to add to the menagerie of animals at Sea Lion Park, was involved in demolishing some of the old rides. could read as Topsy the elephant, which Boyton had bought that season to add to the menagerie of animals at Sea Lion Park, was involved in demolishing some of the old rides.
• ... Thompson and Dundy announced they were going to hang Topsy ... "were going to" to "would".
• ... Thompson and Dundy agreed to more a ... "more a" to "a more".
• Later in the same sentence, "that was" could be omitted.
• Thompson and Dundy ultimately electrocuted Topsy, then killed her using cyanide, in January 1903. Remove the comma after "cyanide"?
• Thompson and Dundy planned to add new rides including ... Comma after "including"?
• ... Leo Wyent and George M. Foley sued to prevent Thompson and Dundy from issuing a concession that would allow a third party ... "that would allow" to "allowing"?
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Operation

1900s

• Dreamland survived until 1911, when it was destroyed in one of the many conflagrations that were common on Coney Island during the early 20th century A few suggestions for this sentence: possibly remove the commas after "1911", change "conflagrations" to "fires", and "that were" could be omitted.
• Thompson and Dundy also added several shows, including "Night and Morning", as well as ... "as well as" to "and".
• ... the sale did not affect Thompson and Dundy's lease of the site. Possibly remove "of the site"?
• Luna Park added several shows ahead of the 1906 season, as well as ... "as well as" to "and".
• The Brooklyn Daily Eagle said that Dundy's death ... consider removing "that".
• Nonetheless, Thompson continued to make improvements to the park ... "make improvement to" to "improve"?
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

1910s

• Prior to the 1917 season, the Luna Park ... "Prior to" to "Before" to reduce repetition?
• During the 1918 season, Luna Park's managers added several attractions pertaining to ... "pertaining to" to "about"?
  • Both done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

1930s

• Luna Park was largely closed during 1934 ... "largely closed" to "closed mainly"?
• The park had gone into receivership the prior month, when the Prudence Bonds Corporation ... remove the comma?
• Same sentence, "had been placed" to "was placed"?
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Early 1940s

• Bill Miller's Luna Park, remove bold lettering per MOS:BOLD?
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Checkpointing so I can clean the house. More to come! Adog (Talk・Cont) 19:08, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

---

Demise

Fire and aftermath

• The western half of the park was completely destroyed ... "completely" may be redundant here.
• Even prior to the fire ... "before" could sound better than "prior to" here.
• ... which amounted to $152,000 and was paid to Prudence Bonds. "was" could be removed.
• The New York Court of Appeals ruled in July 1946 that the park had to be given to the Danziger brothers for $135,000 runs a bit awkward because of the word "given" in association with the idea of being sold. I do not have access to the source, so maybe that is what it says. If not, maybe change the phrasing to ... the park was awarded to the Danziger brothers for $135,000 or something of the like?
  • The source said the judge forced the owner to give up ownership to the Danziger brothers, probably through a forced sale. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Demolition and redevelopment

• In August 1946, the park was sold to Morton S. Wolf and Associates, which announced that they would tear down what was left of Luna Park's interior and build housing for military veterans and their families runs a bit awkward. I would split this into two sentences "Associates. The group announced ...", and rephrase the latter half to maybe: "... they would tear down the remnants of Luna Park's interior ..."
• The park was further damaged by several minor fires. could be Several minor fires further damaged the park.
• ... when Karl Klarnet took over operation The word "operation" should either be "the operation" or "operations".
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Description

• A possible wikilink for "Oriental style" to Orientalism?
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Entrance and main court

• The arched entrance on Surf Avenue was described as ... The who factor may apply here, who described the arched entrance?
• ... as well as a replica of the Piazza San Marco. This "replica" could be changed to "a representation" or "a model" for repetition.
  • Both done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Shows, exhibits, and other facilities

• Each show was maintained by two park attendants could be Two park attendants mainted each show.
• Luna Park contained a Rath House, a German-style meeting hall which could accommodate ... "which could" to "that could"?
• The park also contained the Grand Casino, along the Court of Honor. Possible missing word, "with" should be inserted before "the"?
  • All done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Legacy

Critical reception

• Luna Park's electric tower had inspired the construction ... I would remove "had".
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Namesake

• The original Luna Park site contains a cooperative apartment complex called Luna Park Houses, which was completed in 1962. "which was" may be redundant.
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

References

• 2, missing website parameter. Possibly "Untapped New York".
• 31, "www.heartofconeyisland.com" to "Heart of Coney Island"?
• 254, "USA TODAY" to "USA Today".
  • All done, but I've removed the Untapped reference because I had some concerns about its reliability. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Additional comments or concerns

• The reference in the infobox could possibly be moved to when the park opened in subsection "Construction and opening".
• MOS:DUPLINK – "Steeplechase Park" twice in lead, unlink in the second paragraph. "George C. Tilyou" in subsection "Background", original in "Development". "Shoot the Chutes" in subsection "Rides and attractions", original in subsection "Construction and opening".
• In the subsection "Background" in "Development", the sentence: Sea Lion Park had several centerpiece rides, but the bad 1902 season ... may need further clarity. I assume the 1902 bad season was related to bad attendance. If so, I would specify or for another reason why it was bad.
• In subsection "Construction and opening", I would replace "charged" in the sentence: Dundy was charged with raising capital for the project ... to "entrust". An initial read of the sentence might infer the other if not attentive.
• In the same subsection, the link to Shoot the Chutes could be included earlier at: The lagoon and the Shoot-the-Chutes attraction ... unless the hyphens indicate a specific named attraction rather than the general manufactured attraction.
• In subsection "1900s" in "Operation", wikilink "Japanese tea garden" to Japanese garden and "Himalayan mountain" to Himalayas?
• In subsection "1930s", I would consider adding links for "vaudeville", "handball", and "flat rides".
• In subsection "Demolition and redevelopment" in "Demise", facade to façade?
• Same subsection, Fred Trump acquired the eastern half of the park ... could be Fred Trump acquired the park's eastern half ...
• Same thing with Trump bought the western half of the park ...
• Same subsection, spacing issue for the ref: ... New York City Subway's Coney Island–Stillwell Avenue station. [203].
• I am not too sure if the sentence: In an organized publicity stunt, Thompson and Dundy announced they were going to hang Topsy and sell tickets to the event. is supported by this source. The article mainly talks about the circumstances of, and leading up to, the elephant being executed. It does not really mention the public spectacle it was. Though, from Topsy's own Wiki-article, I think this source or this one already in the article could be subbed in.
  • All done (except for the facade comment, since Merriam-Webster seems to indicate that the unaccepted version is more common in American English). Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Well written + verifiaiblity

• The article is well written, with some minor grammar/sentence structure issues to be addressed. The layout follows the manual of the style guide, and the references are laid out well. The article cites a variety of reliable sources, and there seems to be no original research. As far as plagiarism/close paraphrasing/copyright goes, it is mostly ok. Earwig does pick up some items on the list, namely from Antique Almanac. It seems that there are phrases and pieces that are still highlighted in this article that were before the major contribs occurred, leftovers from the bygone. I would scan through what is highlighted and change the wording, and ensure sources do match. I would also go through the list and do the same with other sources, such as this one. I saw Untapped on the list source and in this instance, they may have copied the Wiki-page or vice versa; both problematic as it could put the source's reliability into question or the article. I will do a source spot check after my full read-through and break. Adog (Talk・Cont) 23:02, 12 August 2023 (UTC)
• After looking at it, the Antique Almanac site seems to have copied from us without proper attribution (they left a footnote bracket in but didn't actually provide any footnotes). I've removed Untapped for reasons that I mentioned above. Other sources, like Westland, seem to be highlighting proper names and common phrases. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Broadness + focus + neutral

The article's topics are both broad enough and focused. No complaints, lots of great detail that is not too much or goes off-topic. The article's content is neutral and fair towards these subjects. Adog (Talk・Cont) 23:02, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

@Epicgenius: Spot checks are mostly all good and my review should finish up here. The article was another good read. The hot streak on the Coney Island amusement parks, kinda like the video series...anyways. The only problems are minor prose and close paraphrasing from the article's earlier iterations that need to be double-checked and rephrased. Other than that, all good. I will put this on hold after 48 hours. No rush! Adog (Talk・Cont) 03:24, 13 August 2023 (UTC)

Images + stability

The article's images are relevant to the content and are properly licensed (one of them is a FA-image, nice). The article is stable. There are reverts only to vandalism, with nothing actively disputed in the article's contents. Adog (Talk・Cont) 20:47, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the detailed review Adog. I appreciate it. I've now addressed all of the issues you've mentioned above. Epicgenius (talk) 15:45, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.