Talk:List of characters in The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess/Archive 1

Archive 1

Images

I'm new here and have pretty much no idea what I'm doing. I added some images for Ashei, Auru, Shad and Rusl, but now the page looks really messy. Can someone help?

Character Names

For Chudley/Malver, at the least, there is no official name. The only official source calls him nothing other than "Celebrity Clerk", and the name of his shop does not appear anywhere in the game. Therefore, the section needs to be fixed accordingly.128.211.254.142 14:56, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Ganon and the Twilight King

Please stop speculating on whether Ganon is the Twilight King. 199.126.137.209 20:08, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Okay so really.... SPOILER

Gandorf is NOT the Twilight King. Zelda is one of the bosses or whatever you refer to it that Link must battle, she is possessed by Gandorf and fights very similar to Phantom Ganon.

Can we please add spoiler signs

Really, I was just looking at this page and I see all this stuff about Ganondorf that basically reveals the whole plot.

Of every Zelda game?KrytenKoro 02:23, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Light spirits and goddesses?

Could something be added as to how some of the light spirits are apparently named after the goddesses (Lanayru, Eldin, Fadon and Ordona)?

I see it's been done now (and that I got Faron's name wrong; my excuse is that I haven't played the game myself).

the Lanayru part is probably the only thing you can make a case about. Everything else is a little coincidental. C. Pineda 08:11, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Update and cleanup

This article is really bad. Considering the game has been out for eight days, I wouldn't expect everything to be in future tense and refering to trailers. I assume few people have tried to edit this page because most people haven't finished the game and they don't want to spoil it for themselves. I finished it Saturday, so I'll start cracking down even though my prose sucks.

Done and done! I cleaned up the text, and added that invisitext. For future reference, the formatting is <!-- replace italics with your own words -->.--Zooba 18:08, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Zant's appearance

I am a bit confused about the appearance of the twilight king, primarily his helmet/face, is this a crown or helm of some sort or is he just in human with a monstrous facial appearance?

SPOILERS: It's a helmet (with a retractable tongue). From the videos I've seen, you can see part of his face behind the tongue in an appearance early-ish, and just before his boss battle then his entire face is revealed (although it's still somewhat strange). The whole thing seems to be part of his armour and parts of it can be unfolded and hidden at will. (In addition, it might be interesting to add Zant's lunatic behaviour when you meet him as a boss, in contrast to his more serious depiction earlier - I haven't played the game, but possibly it's because Ganondorf's left him to return to Hyrule personally?)

Thanks, I read the Zant article and saw his real face, wierd and not as good as I expected...

Does anyone know what Zant's clothes consist of? (Robes, shorts, pants etc.)

Does it really matter? It's robes with baggy pants, if it's really that important (like Inuyasha, for lack of a better example). However, that level of detail really doesn't mean anything to the character, and is largely irrelevant.KrytenKoro 05:28, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Game guide information in the boss section

This shit seriously needs to stop. For those reading who don't know, Wikipedia is not a place for GameFAQs style information and strategy. The boss section is a piece of crap because all people add is in-depth strategy. Is there a way to add text only visible on the edit screen that would tell people not to do this? SixteenBitJorge 22:07, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks to Zooba for taking care of that. Now let's see if people actually listen. SixteenBitJorge 19:48, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

The boss section is looking much, much, better now. High fives to everyone who has helped clean that former atrocity up. SixteenBitJorge 21:31, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Zant...suicide?

It says in the section under Ganondorf that at the end of the game Zant actually commits suicide and as a result Ganondorf dies. Does he actually? I thought he died as a result of his lifeforce being attached to Ganondorf's when Link defeats him. Even so, if he actually comitted suicide, the game would probrably not be rated Teen, but Mature instead due to the disturbing theme. Can anyone confirm this?

Haven't played the game, but I've seen an uploaded video of the ending. Zant snaps his own neck, jerking it sideways at an angle with a crunching noise (this happens in some kind of vision), and Ganondorf's eyes go white and his head jerks back right after.

Yes, but before the "vision" of Zant, Ganondorf's Triforce of Power fades from his hand and the gash in his torso where the Master Sword is penetrated looses its glow and goes black. I believe that here he isn't dying, but losing his power instead as the Triforce leaves him. He is still alive, but since all of his power is gone, he no longer has the ability to keep Zant revived, and thus Zant dies. Since their lifeforces were still attached, Ganondorf dies in turn. Does that make sense?

It would make sense, but I don't think it should be written here. It's merely speculation after all. To me, it seemed like Zant just appeares as a kind of illusion for Ganondorf as he was dying, and basically saying "Screw you, now you're dead" by taunting Ganondorf and snapping his own neck.

Throughout the game, Zant has shown that his body is extremely flexible, so snapping his neck sidewards would not necesserily have to kill him either. Again, I think it wa smore of a taunt. Both theories are simple speculation, so please just remove them both from here. Thanks.

I'm sick of hearing this theory. Look guys if Zant's death could kill Ganondorf then Ganondorf would be dead twice. And don't say suicide is different. Zant treated Ganondorf as a god and a master. Never in the game is it hinted that Zant can control Ganondorf. Think of Zant like a parasite. When the host(Ganondorf)dies so does the parasite attached to them(Zant).--74.230.110.248 17:27, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

That's...not quite the theory. The theory is that since Ganondorf said "anything you desire I will desire too", i.e "I will make any wish of yours come true", Zant wished for Ganondorf to die, and that was his personal (crazy) way of communicating that wish.KrytenKoro 23:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

OMG....Ganondorf was LYING TO ZANT he was USING him he didnt care wat zant wanted either way as his "god" he controled the twilight realm anywayDarkest-Link33 (talk) 16:45, 24 May 2008 (UTC)Erik

Zant

Should there be a separate article for Zant? I say there should be, since we have one on Agahnim. PlatformerMastah 02:32, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Yup, I honestly think there should be one, I am thinking abput writing it myself. I just need a picture of Zant unmasked and I'll start :P

Queen Fairy

I think the Queen Fairy she have a small article on this page, after all she does play a larger role in this game than she did in previous games. Does anyone else agree? Tpganon —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tpganon (talk • contribs) 20:04, 6 December 2006 (UTC).

Yeah, man, go ahead and add it. There's an image on the Great Fairy page if you need it. SixteenBitJorge 21:15, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I just wrote it! What do you think? Oh, and how do you add images?--209.74.28.208 00:25, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Ganondorf

I feel there are some knots in the storyline.

• "In essence, Ganondorf is the one behind all the events of Twilight Princess. After he was sealed away in the Dark World, the Seven Sages released him to await execution in Arbiter's Grounds, a prison in Gerudo Mesa. The Dark Lord was ritualy chained to a giant rock and impaled by a blade of light."

if the blade of light did not kill Ganondorf, why did the Master Sword kill him? the latter is also a blade of light (infused from the Sols), is it not? I think the blade of light mentioned in regards to the Arbiter's Grounds could very well be the Master Sword.

• "The Triforce of Power gave him power to survive execution and break free from the chains."

why did Ganondorf revive after the execution, but did not revive after Link kills him? where did the Triforce of Power possibly go? I am assuming Ganondorf still has the Triforce of Power. let's remember the Triforce on his hand can fade in and out, but never seems to go away. is there any evidence that Ganondorf is straight-out dead? if he was just plain dead, there would be no later (in the timeline) games with Ganondorf in them. I think Ganondorf never lost the Triforce, but only lost it's power. how the Master Sword made the Triforce stop working, and the blade of light used in the execution did not, is a big puzzler.

• "He slays a sage"

what exactly does slay mean? kill? weaken? make the sage need to be revived? and are these the sages of OoT, meaning Rauru or Saria could have been "slayed"? Scepia 05:11, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Because the Master Sword was made to repel and banish evil is why it could kill him. It's not the Master Sword that Ganondorf was impaled with by the Sages, as Ganndorf keeps that sword, and it's totally different in appearence to the Master Sword. And it is used by Ganondorf in the final battle, where both swords are present.

He was never killed, that's why. The Triforce protected him, but it couldn;t protect him from the Master Sword, for reasons mentioned above. And he must've died, as if you rememebr, Zant says that as long as Ganondorf is alive, he will live. Yet when the Triforce fades, Zant dies. Therefore, Ganondorf must've died. And remember, Ganon can be revied, like seen in the Oracle games etc...

Slay means he killed the Sage, which he did. However, these Sages were not the same as the ones from ocarina; after all, these ones seemed to be made of pure light, and only guard the Twilight Mirror and handle affairs with it, such as criminal basnishment.

Hope I have answered some of your questions. (61.91.191.6 13:02, 7 December 2006 (UTC))

when Ganondorf was executed, how was that any different from his death by the Master Sword? your logic seems to be what happens in the series, but it is confusing. Scepia 00:58, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Look, there is nothing really confirmed, but there are a lot of possible reasons. First, it could be possible that the Light Master Sword was simply more powerful than the Sword used by the Sages to impale Ganondorf, and that's why he survived it. Second, maybe the first Light Sword attack was just able to weaken Ganondorf, as he called upon his triforce of power to survive. However, his white glowing wound has never healed, and that's what his weak point was. Impaling the scar again with the Master Sword, that was finally enough to beat Ganondorf. Third, it could be that the triforce of power was simply exhausted after the fight with Link. After all, it had to keep Ganondorf alive after his "execution", in his spirit Form in the twilight realm, it had to give him a new human body and it had to face off against another triforce wielder. After Ganondorf wa smortally wounded a second time, there simply wa snot enough power left to live on. And finally, maybe the power of the Sword depended on the power of the wielder. That would explain why the triforce-possessing hero of courage was able to slay Ganondorf, while the sages were not. Serpit

Sounds like OR to me. All we can really go on is what's in the games and what's been explicitly stated. Far be it from me to stop you from speculating, but please leave it out of the articles. -- Digital Watches! 06:32, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Just some input I want to add in about this article, and also some changes I want to make to this article itself. One, I believe that Ganondorf didn't have the Triforce of Power until after he was impaled with the Sword of Light. If he had it, he wouldn't have let himself be captured. Just as the sages say, by some divine prank, he was chosen as a wielder of power of the Gods. Yes, he survives his impalement because of this sudden boost in his power, and yes, he killed one of the sages. However, he didn't come out of it without injury - his chest still has the injury he receieved, to which Link in the final battle uses in to his advantage to defeat Ganondorf. Also, the mention of Laruto in the article is pure speculation, and should be removed. I'll go ahead and do that. --WarriorofZarona 20:16, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

If you are interested in studying Zelda, than you would learn that the only weapons capable of inflicting damage on Ganon are the Master Sword, Light Arrows, and Silver Arrows. The Master Sword doesn't need to be filled with Sols to defeat him, and the sword the the sages used, even though filled with Sols, wasn't much more than an ordinary blade.

The sages also say they overestimated themselves - and they say Ganondorf HAD been chosen, not that he was right then. In any case, the reason given by Ganondorf himself has nothing to do with the Triforce. He claims the malice left behind by the imprisoned Twili as the thing that repowered. Since the ToP only pumps up his dark magic, it would make sense for him to be captured even though he had it, if his magic had run out.

And he's captured/defeated tons of times, even with the ToP. It's not that powerful. If it was, Link could do the same thing and never worry about being beaten.74.140.118.84 06:34, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Ok, not sure if this was stated, but this section is very long to read. anyway. Ganondorf was "executed" by the sages, different from Ocarina of Time. He did kill a sage because, as we see in OoT, a sage is merely a normal being with enlightened powers. Also, stated in the OoT, the Master Sword is the only sword that is the "bane of evil". And is the sole blade capable is slaying Ganondorf for good. The triforce's power cannot be "exhausted" for it is a gift from the goddesses. But rather it left Ganondorf because it feels he is no longer worthy of wielding the Triforce of Power, because in OoT it states that the Triforce pieces go to the one it feels best represents it, so it obviously no longer felt Ganondorf worthy. The Master Sword weakened him, but didn't cause him to die. However, without a triforce piece, Ganondorf is open to death, and with the link he shared with Zant, Zant was able to kill him, because it was his wish (OR moment, maybe because he thought Ganondorf failed him as a God). and a request, no more useless responses like "This is only original research". Please, stop with that, if we say we want to put it in the article, then critique it. otherwise, be quiet. C. Pineda 08:27, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Again, the Triforce of Power does not give him any new powers, it really only strengthens those he has. As for inexhaustible - that's shown to be false many a time - even Link's and Zelda's don't work like that - the Triforces merely strengthen what is already there. For "worthy" - that's for the first time they are touched by an unworthy - after that, it's whoever can grab them. Ganon shows this many times in the series. I actually doubt that it truly "left him", as in every other case of that happening, an actual golden triangle comes out of Ganondorf - the crest doesn't just disappear. The avatar theory might explain it, but still, all it seems is that, again, he has lost his power, so the Triforce has nothing to increase. As for his dark magic - yes, the game even says this - that he was not revived by the Triforce, but that his powers were returned by being so close to such hate and malice as the execution grounds.

"Sage"-...nearly all the sages in OoT seemed to have already died - in fact, a few of them (like Darunia) had to have already died. Think Highlander - they come back from the dead, and then gain their power.

"Master Sword" - actually, it just said that it was the "Blade of Evil's Bane" - the Four Sword is another, and apparently the Golden Sword works too.

My own personal theory about the execution, which actually explains why the Sage's thought they had overestimated their ability (as opposed to the popular, contradictory theory that the Goddesses suddenly chose to imbue a captured, powerless criminal with the ToP) is that, like each game with the Sages shows, they are integral to maintaining the seal...but what if they wanted to be done with Ganon? They must have either seen or guessed that as long as he was not fully dead, the seal was just a stall. He was also stripped of his power at the end of OoT - he still had the Triforce, but not anything for it to operate, as was shown. So, wouldn't it be very simple for them to just release the seal, take him to the old execution grounds (or just open the seal there, away from people he could harm, since it's hard to imagine them transporting him in a cage or something), and attempt to remove him once and for all?

Then the stories for OoT and TP nicely mesh - because no matter how you look at the end of OoT, Ganondorf was still a threat: Link went back to the point after Ganondorf had already placed the curses, and so it is quite possible there was his earlier self still playing through the Child part of the game - this could also explain Majora's Mask and why Navi left, as this would be the time Navi was called by the Great Deku Tree (which would conveniently explain why Link can't find her - she only exists in a time loop), and Link was racing either to prevent his earlier self from letting Ganondorf get to the Triforce, or merely looking for Navi (since it might actually be safer to let a known configuration play through, since Link knows Ganondorf will eventually be defeated). This would also neatly explain some of the "Time paradoxes" in the game, like the Song of Storms.

It could be postulated that killing Ganondorf in the Adult timeline removed him from both timelines - but in that case, why didn't Zelda immediately send Link back to before Ganondorf got the Triforce, and kill him then? It doesn't make sense to have to save both periods unless there is a disparate element to them.KrytenKoro 15:06, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Um. Possibly unsourced statements/OR?

I'm not sure of this, but it seems like a lot of statements in this article are original research. The one that REALLY caught my attention was the statement that Hena is a descendant of the fisherman in OoT. Now, while it's entirely plausible that Nintendo would have such a detail as some sort of easter egg, it sounds more like the same theorizing that leads to the assumption that any given Zelda game is tied to all the others in a direct, chronological manner, which I've yet to hear an official statement for. So could we get some sources or get rid of some of this assumed information? -- Digital Watches! 02:52, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

we know TP takes place 100 years or so after OoT (per Nintendo Power mag). just go to the Fishing Spot, look at the picture of the fisher from OoT, and she'll mention there's a possible relation. honestly, why do we need sources for much anything? Scepia 07:57, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

While NP is usually reliable enough, I have two main gripes. One, a resemblance in a picture isn't exactly explicit. Two, NP is an American publication, and may not get all of its information from the team responsible for creating the Zelda series and/or keeping track of whatever continuity the games may have. The second one isn't so major, but even so, I say we should leave it out of the article until we've got an explicit source. -- Digital Watches! 23:58, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

it was an interview with Aonuma, and it would be pretty hard to screw up the translation of 100 from Japanese to English. the 100 years thing was stated before as well. "Twilight Princess was developed with Ocarina of Time as its starting point, so there are aspects of the story that are based on Ocarina of Time. The main connection is that Twilight Princess is set about a hundred years after Ocarina of Time."

EDIT: well, we don't need to source everything. we all know Midna's name is Midna. is a source going to make that more real? honestly, if it's so obvious as this is, what's the problem? I'm quite sure no one would honestly say different. Scepia 01:31, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

Very wrong. Things like a constant continuity between the games is not "obvious" as you have said, and thus strictly needs sourcing as per the policies of Wikipedia. Midna's name is stated in-game, and I don't even understand how those two situations are comparable. As for this interview, please find a copy from a reliable source that's verifiable by an independent source and then we can use it. -- Digital Watches! 06:24, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

New problem: Telma. Are the rumors that call her a Gerudo descendant in-game? If not, that sentence should be removed, and I will do so. If someone reverts it, please point out that the rumors mentioned are in the game itself, otherwise it's OR. -- Digital Watches! 23:58, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

never heard of it in game, although digging around a lot might yield that rumor in the game. Scepia 01:31, 18 December 2006 (UTC)

If there's no source for it and it's not in game, then it's OR or speculation. -- Digital Watches! 06:25, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

There is no Moblin King, those are Bulblin and his name is Lord Bullbo

This is a common misconception, there are NO moblins in Twilight Princess, those are Bulblin a whole new race exclusive to Twilight Princess, seemingly based off of Lord of the Ring Orcs. Here is artificial artwork from the official Japanese site.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/PHANTOM_EXE87/Picture42.png

I am correcting this. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.119.64.233 (talk) 02:00, 20 December 2006 (UTC).

I was under the impression that Bulblin was just the Romanised Japanese spelling of the creatures known as Moblins in the Western translations. The Romanised text on the picture reads: "King Bulblin & Lord Bullbo" note the "&" that means that Lord Bullbo is not the name of 'King Bulbin' but more likely the name of his steed (if you can call something thats not a horse a steed). Changing the origional Romanization of Japanese names is common in games to make the names sound more like they are conventionally prounounced in the West. For Example in the game 'Final Fantasy VII' the caractor Arith became Aris in the West. So to present a picture from a Japanese website is probably not the best evidence of a caractors name in the West. It would be the equivilent of using a french Website to argue that the english word for twilight is crépuscule. I am not 100% sure either way of the names of these charactors in the UK and US but if they are Bulblins a little more evidence is needed than a picture from a Japanese website (is there a similar page on the english language websites for example, that'd be fine so long as it was the official nintendo one or a scan of the page in the official guide showing the name). Shearluck 23:49, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

"The original Japanese name for the Moblin is モリブリン" (wikipedia article about moblins). Compare. I wanted to check another site too, but I couldn't find it back. Anyway, I guess it's fairly safe to assume Bulblins and Moblins are not the same.DreamingLady 09:36, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

I know the japanese site says that it is King Bulblin, but a lot of the japanese names were drastically changed for the american release. Do you know if there is an official source for your claim?128.211.254.142 05:47, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Golden Wolf or Undead Warrior?

I was just wondering what we should to refer to this character by. Personally, I would say the latter, as it is an Undead Warrior who masquerades as a wolf, and doesn't seem to be the other way around. --Zooba 11:37, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Calling them "Undead Warriors" might be a spoiler. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 11:39, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Plus, the Prima Guide refers to them as either a White Wolf or Hero's Shade. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 11:42, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

I think it'd be best to mark it as the Hero's Shade. I don't think that the prominence of spoilers is a good argument - the page is full of them as it is. I'll rename the section Hero's Shade and alphabetise it correspondingly. --Zooba 22:34, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't know hwy the Prima guide is considered God, but the official Nintendo Power guide calls it the Hero'

s Spirit. That is its official name. in fact, rather then getting acceptance to this, I'm gonna change it, if it hasn't already. C. Pineda 02:45, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Identity of Hero's Shade

Given that it is the only one major game confirmed to precede Twilight Princess, can't it be inferred that he is the Link from Ocarina of Time? --Guess Who 00:10, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

However, although OoT is the only Zelda title to proceed TP, anything could have happened between them. --Zooba 01:30, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Nothing says that anything major happened in that timespan. --Guess Who 00:33, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

actually, Majora's Mask comes before TP as well. what we know is OoT -> MM and also OoT -------> TP. but none of this speculation belongs on Wikipedia. Scepia 02:05, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Majora's Mask features the same Link as Ocarina of Time. --Guess Who 00:33, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Also keep in mind that we haven't verified any source that connects OoT with TP, as far as I'm concerned. -- Digital Watches! 06:27, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Several interviews have noted that Twilight Princess comes after Ocarina, and prior to Wind Waker. --Guess Who 00:33, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

"Go and do not falter, my child." Wasn't this line said to Link in Ocarina by the Deku Tree? -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 06:31, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

No. --Guess Who 00:33, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

...And? -- Digital Watches! 06:56, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

if it's the same, that's interesting at least. sadly, it is OR. maybe we'll get an interview about that soon :) Merry Christmas! Scepia 07:14, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Looking at all the evidence in TP, I have a hard time believing it's only 100 years after OOT. More like 200 at the least. Anything could have happened in between. Maybe Hero's Shade is the one who imprisoned Ganondorf so the sages could kill him. And why would he have to be OOT Link? There have likely been Links before him (even if OOT was the first in the timeline.) that could be him. And again, he doesn't have to be a Link either. I mean, he's a lot bigger, wears different clothes and talks!(^^)

The Link from Ocarina IS the one who imprisoned Ganondorf. If you'll recall, the game ends with Ganondorf being sealed with the sages in the Sacred Realm. There may have been Links before him (Minish Cap and Four Swords Links are commonly said to be before them), but Hero's Shade has not died yet (recall that he says he had to pass on the skills before he could pass on), so he must have been a recent Link. He's not substantially bigger, and obviously he can't wear the Hero's Clothes because the current-day Link is wearing them. He talks, but there's no reason he can't, since he's not the player character anymore. --Guess Who 20:53, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Don't tell me you think the scene shown in TP is the ending of OOT. Those were completely different in every single aspect! I'm talking about who got Ganondorf in those chains after his return. And why would he have to be a recent Link? Why couldn't he be an older one?DreamingLady 21:35, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

The "scene shown"? Which one? Only one scene prior to fighting him actually had Ganondorf in it, and he wasn't mentioned again until after the Zant battle. The game never mentioned him making a "return" prior to the events of the game. --Guess Who 01:20, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

The one in which the Sages send Ganondorf to the Twilight Realm (cause they couldn't think of anything else :/). It is shown when Link first meets them in TP. It is not the ending of OOT, meaning that after his banishment in OOT, he has come back at least once and then was send to the Twilight Realm. That means someone other than OOT Link defeated Ganondorf prior to TP (even if it was an army that defeated Ganondorf, there still has to be one person who risked and did more to get that result). Maybe that person is Hero's shade.DreamingLady 07:45, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

The ending of OoT has Ganondorf trapped with the Sages in the Sacred Realm, right? After he is trapped in the Sacred Realm with the sages, he kills one of them and the rest banish him to the Twilight Realm to keep him from causing more damage. That's what the scene shows. --Guess Who 08:52, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Okay, what's all this business of Ganondorf being in the Sacred Realm/Dark World as the sages send him to the Twilight Realm from there? That all happened at the Arbiter's Grounds, which is found in Gerudo Desert, which is found in the LIGHT REALM. In my speculation, Ganon was never in the Sacred Realm before this event. He never escaped nor did he ever enter the Sacred Realm, meaning he was "arrested" by the sages for a heinous crime, involving either control of Hyrule, or the breach of the Sacred Realm - which is why Ganon is all tied up with chains. Jeremy Plaza 12:09, July 1, 2007

The ending has Ganondorf with the Triforce of Power, something the Sages know getting trapped into the Sacred Realm. I don't believe the Sages got trapped with him, since Zelda didn't go either. Anyway, that doesn't matter. The Arbiter's ground however is located in the Light World. The Sages don't look or act like the ones we know from Ocarina of Time (who were prepared to face danger head on and alone). These things are cowards of the worst kind, sacrificing others just so they are safe (ie, sending Ganon to the Twilight Realm, leaving the Twili to deal with him).DreamingLady 10:14, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

The Sages stay in the Sacred Realm anyway - that's where the Temple of Light is. We don't know if Zelda went with them, since she sends Link back to the past and that's the last we see of her. Arbiter's Grounds is indeed in the Light World, but the Sages obviously have some business there, since they have Ganondorf chained against the rock right in front of the mirror. The Sages don't look like the ones from Ocarina, but then, they don't look anything like their future counterparts in the Wind Waker either in that they do not take on their original appearance before they became Sages, so their appearance could be considered a retcon of their original. Third, the characters in Ocarina by and large had little personality. Character development prior to Majora's Mask was never a strong point of the series, so remarks about their personality have little bearing. --Guess Who 22:00, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

And they aren't required in their own temples? Then why would those exist in the first place? Though the chamber of sages, or whatever that place is called, is located in the Temple of Light, there's no reason to assume they stay there forever. It is implied that there's a sage bloodline in various TLOZs, and being stuck somewhere were you can't reproduce doesn't seem like a very good idea to secure that bloodline. Besides, isn't it implied Impa got a descendant? One we don't see or have reason to assume existed in OOT? (okay, there's no real reason to assume he/she wasn't born at that time either). Zelda also can't have gone with them for otherwise we wouldn't have a royal family anymore. Back to the topic of Light World-Sacred Realm/Dark World: you're saying yourself they can still travel between the Light World and Sacred Realm(?). So why are we talking about being stuck in the Sacred Realm? And "if" this was what they did to try to kill Ganondorf after OOT, why didn't they do this earlier? You know, when sage nr. 7 and the Hero and the Master Sword (sage nr. 8 and 9) helped them and they had a better chance? And no, it is not for the ToP. Besides, when and why should he have lost it? I don't really care the sages don't look like the ones from OOT (although I wonder why they all look so....human :\), but their personality is significantly different. OOT did have a good focus on personality. Even ALTTP had that (or otherwise, LA). And those are not what the sages from TP have. Also, I'm terribly sorry, but I don't understand what you are saying about the looks of the sages. Could you repeat that?DreamingLady 01:42, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Those aren't the sages of OOT. The game says that they are ancient and guarded the mirror since ancient times. Bly1993 03:14, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Isn't this section about the Hero's Shade? Anyway, dosn't anyone think it's worth mentioning that the Shade mentions that none of the tecniques after number five don't go outside their bloodline, implining that they're related?

I think he may have been implying the bloodline of the hero, of which Link is (and presumably the hero's Shade as well, wha with his last pieces of dialouge in the game). That doesn't necessarily mean they're ancestrally related, but I suppose it's not out of the question. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.62.64.131 (talk) 03:05, 17 January 2007 (UTC).

70.23.11.193 00:08, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

The Ocarina of Time ends with the seven sages sealing Ganon in the Sacred Realm, which later became the Dark World (ALttP). The sages are all "alive" afterwards, and they knew Ganon had the Triforce of Power BECAUSE HIS THEFT OF IT PRECIPITATED THE EVENTS OF THE GAME. In Twilight Princess, they chain him up at the prison grounds and attempt to execute him. AT THAT TIME, he gains the Triforce of Power, slays a sage, and is sent to the TWILIT REALM, which was made specifically to keep the Twili AWAY from the Sacred Realm. The two stories are as opposite as you can get while still having Ganondorf sealed.

As for the Hero's Shade, OOT Link was never stated to have failed in his quest to become a hero, and it is implied that Shade was unable to finish the deed; he is probably the one who played a part in sealing Ganon in the Twilit Realm, this would indeed count as a failure. At any rate, the fact that he's a ghost implies that he died trying to save Hyrule, and he is definitely older than Link was at the end of Majora's Mask. There's really nothing but the nostalgia linking him to OoT Link, and as for knowing the "magic songs"? The Hylian Royal family (and random bystanders) knew most of them too, and besides, they're magic songs. You know what they are when you find them.128.211.181.52 23:37, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Considering there is nothing whatsoever to even imply that he's the Hero of Time. He looks completely different from Link, and wields a sword in his RIGHT hand (yeah, the GC version came later an whatnot, but since it was the first announced, and since Nintendo has implied SO MUCH that the Wii versions' mirroring is non canonical). Also, Ganondorf never LOST the triforce of power. Not yet, anyway. Also, the thing about being a ghost implys nothing of saving hyrule. Otherwise, the above user is someone I agree with ALOT. No offence, but it seems like the only reason people even thought he's OoT Link is because they're excessive OoT fanboys. I IMPLY NO INSULTS TO ANYBODY. It's THERE opinion, I acknowledge it, just saying that it seems people are just trying to find connections to OoT. It's creepy. -Chao9999 00:22, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Even though I don't think he's OOT Link, or maybe even a Link at all, I have to admit there are a few hints. And I'm pretty sure that in the NGC version, HS is a lefty. I agree about everything else. Especially the part about OOT fanboys. I simply hate them (note: fanboys, not fans. The difference is a brain. (BTW, also not saying everyone who think he's OOT Link is a fanboy, even though most are)). Kinda like them trying to prove everything that has an eye(-ish) symbol is a Sheikah. Or better, thinking the Sages always have been the same individuals.DreamingLady 08:35, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

BING. Right there, basically *WARNING: This may offend some* only hardcore OoT fanboys who think OoT is the best and unbeatable and thought that there even WAS a plot (come ON, almost no real plot progression, good game, but seriously, plot wasn't strong), thinks that the "Hero of Time" is the only Link, and thinks that Ganondorf is brown because in ONE scene he looks brown-ISH, and they cannot bother to play future games because WW is "too kiddy" and TP is "on a lame system". Whoa, rant. *Ok, you can come back now*. Anyway, my point is that it seems like people are just trying desperately to find connections with OoT. It's just stuipid, really. -Chao9999 00:11, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Regardless of whether he's OoT's Link or another Link i think its pretty obvious that he's a Link of some sorts. Afterall Link is a master swordsman and considering that these are master skills with the sword its common sense. And by the way i think that is the same Link from OoT myself. Kou Nurasaka 2:40, 22 May 2007

---

He is another Link; it doesn't matter which Link he is (he doesn't necessarily have to be any of the Links from the games). Even if N has yet to confirm it, there's far too much evidence that he is another Link.

1. He says that he "accepted the life of the Hero". And who is always called "the Hero"? Link.

2. He says that the last 2 or 3 of the Hidden Skills are never taught to those outside the bloodline of the Hero, or in other words, those who are not Link.

3. Identical fighting style and choice of weaponry.

4. Like TP's Link, he too can transform into a Wolf.

5. Like the other Links, he too has an affinity for music.

6. Seriously, who else could it be? Some other master swordsman who fights just like a Link would and was another Hero? Yeah, right. Besides, this is Zelda we're talking about here, a series of games with a massive, epic medieval fantasy storyline. A common fantasy plot element is having the Wise Old Mentor who teaches the Protagonist be a past relative of the Protagonist, and the Zelda storyline is FILLED with common fantasy plot elements (done well, mind you, but common nonetheless).

7. Every other sword-wielding foe in the game has a dominant hand that's the opposite of Link's (in other words, in the GC version Link and the Hero's Shade are left-handed and everybody else is right-handed. In the Wii version Link and the Hero's Shade are right-handed and everybody else is left-handed). Psydon 18:46, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

If you can't reliably source it (I'm quite sure you can't), it's original research and should not be added to the article.--Atlan (talk) 20:46, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

The Hero's Shade might be OOT Link because of Well, Navi, Navi died between OOT and TP, So without Navi, Link couldnt Figure out the monsters Weaknesses, leading to his defeat, proving it might be OoT Link, and the reason The Wii's Link is right handed is because of right Handed Wii Remote Users.

The 'little group' at Telma's

The four people at Telma's; Ashei, Auru, Shad, and Rusl...what do you think they call their group? Obviously they're paramilitary, and they make better soldiers than what we've seen of the Hyrulian Army, so wouldn't you think they'd be knighted after the events of the main story? That is, of course, if Link mentioned them to the Princess. Anyway, if they got knighted, what if they'd be known as the Guardian Knights, as those mentioned in A Link to the Past?

Either way, the group should be placed in a single sub-header. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.248.154.51 (talk) 01:55, 28 December 2006 (UTC).

They are called "the resistance" are they not? andre1010

"Aisha was the girl in the Resistance Movement who pointed you towards Peak Province."[1] —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Scepia (talk • contribs) 07:32, 1 January 2007 (UTC).

Main Character Descriptions

...Should be kept on their main article. Thats how it works. (61.91.191.8 15:44, 1 January 2007 (UTC))

{{editprotected}}on the Ilia page the statement:and according to the game's official website, she has true affection for him.[23] should be deleted as the official website does not in any way prove this and it goes against the Fringe Theroy ruleGoldenWolfy (talk) 23:42, 30 May 2008 (UTC)Tera

 Not done It has a source. The official website is not often a reliable source, so taking info from there is not proof one way or the other. PeterSymonds (talk) 08:23, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

{{editprotected}} sry if i wasnt supposed to use the editprotected thing again. I meant that his source gave no evidence at all

.."gave no evidence" of what? Wikipedia articles aren't supposed to "give evidence to prove one side or the other", they are supposed to encyclopedically present the known info. You should probably read WP:SOAPBOX. The line is a character description from the prologue section of the official site, and so is appropriate for her section.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 05:30, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

You know what just for u, I read that prologue 6 times. The most i see is sisterly affection. Listen i understand the whole 'this is medevil times' thing but i dont think Nintedno planned for him to date somone like a little sisterGoldenWolfy (talk) 14:59, 1 June 2008 (UTC)Tera

Not done: The phrase is an exact quotation from the source, and so it appropriate when suitably indicated and cited. Happy‑melon 16:03, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Postman

The postman makes appearances throughout this game. Shouldn't he therefore also get a mention?

I wouldn't know why not. He's the only not storyline related character that returns in this game and should be mentioned.DreamingLady 21:51, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I put the Postman in. His article is rather short, so if anyone wants to flesh it out, be my guest. I did mention that he hums the "Zelda chime" and the "You found a key" tune when he delivers letters, but I know how some of you feel about trivia. --Luke

Clean up needed!

Not one as urgent as when we did the bosses, but one is needed nonetheless. This time it's the details that people are forgetting. By "little details", I am referring to proper formatting ie. the correct formatting of game titles (in italics, please), and correct wiki-linking (ie. proper page titles, using the # formatting, etc.)

Also, as nice as it is to see the page expand so much, we need to keep a general standard. First of all, I think it would be a very good idea to implement links to the Places in The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess page wherever possible, and vica versa. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Zooba (talk • contribs) 22:26, 3 January 2007 (UTC).

• And yes, it is indeed wonderfully ironic that I bemoan bad formatting before forgetting to sign my comment. I was rushed off the computer. --Zooba 22:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Did a minor clean-up on Argorok's section: removed the part about the battle-area resembling a Harry Potter Quidditch ring, as it wasn't relevant to the article.--Aveil 23:28, 19 January 2007 (UTC)Aveil

Dark Rider?!

In the boss section, there is a boss called Dark Rider, Ganondorf. Even though you did fight Ganondorf on horseback, that battle wasnt considered a true boss fight because it lacked the subtitles giving the bosses name and a little description and Dark Rider, Ganondorf isnt an official name. I don't think the mention of the fight should be removed but it definitely should not be titled with made up names liked Dark Rider, but simply it should be mentioned in between the other two boss fights. I'm sorry if Dark Rider, Ganondorf was an official name and I just forgot about it but I definitely dont remember Dark Rider as a name. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jarvisganon (talk • contribs) 22:09, 5 January 2007 (UTC).

Um, I also just noticed that there is another unofficial boss: the Feeder of Darkness, Twilit Bloat. That is also another unofficial name- that fight wasnt even really a boss, that giant insect guy you fought was more of a sub-boss. He should be just plain taken out of the article. Where are these names coming from?!

Those names are featured in the PRIMA Official Game Guide for TP, at least, and so I believe they are rather credible, although to my knowledge the guide doesn't explicitly say these are the names NOA certifies. I agree that the Twilit Bloat is not a major boss and shouldn't be listed under the "boss" category. But if the motion (below) to include minibosses is agreed upon, someone should move it there. --Tryforceful 09:56, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I thought those names came from a strategy guide, I wouldn't consider them official. If someone has a Nintendo Power strategy guide, I think it would be good to use those.

Prima makes stuff up, until we get a credible source, no trust to them. Nuff said. -Chao9999 00:12, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Nintendo's player guide calls the fight Dark Lord Ganon then lists a on horseback phase and a final battle phase, maybe we could do something like Dark Lord Ganon on Horseback and Dark Lord Ganon Final Battle, although it probably isn't neccessary. BassxForte 20:53, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Minibosses

I'm wondering whether to put minibosses somewhere in there. What does anyone think? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.77.61.40 (talk) 06:11, 7 January 2007 (UTC).

Ook and goron-guard-person definetely should be on the page. I'm not sure about the rest.DreamingLady 09:51, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Yeah. I'll add those two to the bosses section.

Hmm...come to think of it, maybe they should go in the secondary chaaracters section. That might work better.

Skull Kid

Look, I don't know who would be stupid enough to make a fuss over a freaking lantern in the first place, but oh well. I scrounged the internet and couldn't find a damn thing about the lantern or any screenshots (proof that it's a stupid thing to fuss over). If I feel like doing another play-through, I'll happily take a photo of the Skull kid to prove my statement. But seriously, if anyone with at least half a brain sees the close-ups the game makes of the Skull Kid, if they look at the ground they will clearly see the lantern emits rainbow-colored light. My point is, if anyone could be so kind as to help, I would very much appreciate it. Thanks.SilentWind 00:20, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

(As in, the light INSIDE the lantern appears blue but the light it casts around the Sacred Grove is a rainbow of colors).SilentWind 00:21, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm not doubting it's true, but the real question here is, does it matter? JackSparrow Ninja 00:51, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

I don't think his section should be written as "he" when Skull Kid (Stalchild, rather. The Stalchilds in the english version are Stalbabies) is a species of monster (very likely transformed Kokiri). This isn't fanon either, there are clearly multiple Skull Kids in the Lost Woods in Ocarina of Time.

And they all get the Skull Mask at the same time, and if you kill one, they all disappear together. Plus, Majora's Mask refers to it as one, fairly ancient and important being, and says nothing about him being cursed. It's fair to assume that this was another urban legend designed to keep the Kokiri in and others out of the forest (just like the "Kokiri will die if they leave the forest" lie.128.211.179.52 17:16, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Malo Mart

Does anyone have a Spanish-language version of the PAL edition of this game, and can tell me whether Malo's name was changed? Seems like they probably would have.. cuz otherwise that shop would sound hilarious. Lol "Bad Mart"

Oocca

So Ooccoo is the american name, and its real name is Obachan/Gramma... so then what is the real name of the 'Oocca' race? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.122.208.51 (talk) 19:22, 6 March 2007 (UTC).

A SLIGHT resemblance to Ridley?!

If you asked me, I think that Argorok (in his first form) looks like a red and black version of Meta-Ridley from Metroid Prime (not any other Meta-Ridley, just this one). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.222.232.9 (talk) 03:06, 9 March 2007 (UTC).

Bosses non-notable?

Uhm... mind explaining why you find the bosses non-notable characters?[2]
I've got a feeling not everyone agrees.

Cheers JackSparrow Ninja 09:20, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Not-notable in a character article. And they're not not-notable characters - they're not characters. - A Link to the Past (talk) 23:21, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

The boss section is fine. I would suggest leaving it alone. They play an important role in the game. If you don't think they are notable enough, why not just remove almost every character listed in this article?Pastel kitten 20:00, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

So conversely, why not add every single living creature in Zelda TP to the article? Wikipedia is a discriminate collection of information, and really, the majority of the bosses are only there as a more significant enemy - they have no backstory, no forestory, no personality, unknown intelligence (with the exception of the Fire Temple boss), no relationships to speak of. They're really just a part of the gameplay, like an enemy would be - I mean for instance, most of the bosses are replaceable, as they only serve to block the player from progressing. - A Link to the Past (talk) 04:19, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't get why they're in the 'characters' article. They really belong in the 'enemies' article, but those don't exist for individual games, and it would be choked if all bosses were included, so I think bosses belong on the game's article. Still, they're fine here. In several cases the bosses are themselves transformed characters.

Like I've said before, the only notable enough bosses are either important bosses like Ganon or Majora, or recurring bosses like Vire (from the Oracle games). - A Link to the Past (talk) 21:34, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Diababa is merely a curse of the Fused Shadows, and the only effect it has had is to poison it's own little pool. So, not really notable. Fyrus is important, as it effects all of the Gorons. Morpheel is slightly important, as it has affected all of the Lake and Hyrule Castle Town by draining the lake. Stallord is kind of important because it is animated by Zant, but only he knows it's even there, so really not. Plus, it's not even cursing anything, so it's very literally only an obstacle for Link, and not a real problem. Blizzeta is surely important to the story. Armogohma is like Stallord and Diababa - only noticeable because it is there. It isn't even casting darkness on the region. Argorok is surely important, as all of the Oocca notice it, and it has been tormenting them.

So, Fyrus, Blizzeta, and Argorok are story important, Morpheel is noticeable, and Diababa, Stallord, and Armogohma have no contribution to the story. If we wanted to be very legalistic, we should remove at least the last three, but that makes the section look weird. So, make your own decisions.128.211.254.142 04:46, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Armogohma is kind of notable because it's another appearance of Gohma, but that still doesn't affect the story... Oh, and I created a Bosses in The Legend of Zelda series in order to split off a portion of the Enemies article, in case that helps. Gurko 13:05, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Ganon

I fail to see how he's leonine (lionlike)... I mean he has a mane, but he's always had one. His tail is quite wolflike, and bizarrely he seems to have ape paws.. I remember them being hooves in the game, but I guess I don't remember properly. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.72.21.221 (talk) 22:47, 15 March 2007 (UTC).

You are right about how Ganon is more leonine. I was told this new Ganon is a cross-breed of boar/wolf/lion. However, the paws were taken from a human, just modified to fit the Ganon persona. Jeremy Plaza 12:20 July 1, 2007

Fado

In the Fado section when talking about the name relations it says, "a deceased sage in The Wind Waker." Could someone put insted, "the former sage of the forest" or "the deceased forest sage in the Wind Waker" or maybe get rid of it all together, since we're warning them about "Twilight Princess" spoilers, not "Wind Waker" spoilers...Maybe?...Please?...

Well, it's not the Forest Sage, it's the Wind Sage. And it's not really a spoiler, since you get to it in the first half of the game, and there's really no suspense attached to it. KoRL seems to know there would be a sage, so it's not a mystery like why Ganon is back, or who KoRL is.128.211.254.142 04:48, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

well...he...was in the...forest...nevermind 16:06, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Fado doesn't appear in the Forest - he only appears on Gale Isle. The Korok appears on Forest Haven, yes, but he's not dead, and he's not Fado.KrytenKoro 01:30, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Source for Character Names?

Charlo Chudley/Malver, Soal Doctor Borville Kili, Hanna, Misha

I personally cannot find any instance in the game where any of these names are given, so I don't know where the names come from (they are not on the official site or player's guide, either). Then again, the game script faq says that the three girls cheer you on while you play S.T.A.R, and I haven't gotten them to do that either, so maybe it's just really hard to find that text. If it is the latter, there should at least be a note so that people will know, because it's not presented clearly in the game. At all.128.211.254.142 04:51, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

The three girls will cheer if you get...I don't know I think it was like two or more star things. As for the names, I have noo idea. I don't recall hearing any names or reading any in the manual/site either. I think it should be removed or changed...or something... 16:10, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

The three girls cheer for you when you get three or more STARS. Also, as a side note, the girls represent each Goddess by their hair colour; red, blue and green, for Din, Nayru and Farore respectively. Jeremy Plaza 12:17, July 1, 2007

Cleanup badly needed

This page is NOT supposed to be a game guide - yet the boss section especially has been turned into such. The only reason the bosses are allowed to be here at all is that they are somewhat important, and are thus semi-characters. If the game guide stuff can't be removed without damaging the boss sections, then the boss sections cannot stay here.KrytenKoro 01:39, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Blizzeta

Um...anyone know where Blizzeta went? She's not on the page. She's definitely a story-important boss, and she needs to go back. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.77.61.40 (talk) 16:34, 6 May 2007 (UTC).

She's right here. No need for two seprate entries of the same character.Takuthehedgehog 17:40, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

vandalism on links profile

i belive this should be fixed promtly i tried to but it did not work —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.49.245.166 (talk) 06:19, 13 May 2007 (UTC).

Link, Midna, Zelda

Anything relevant to Link should be in the main Link article. The same with Zelda, and Ganondorf. However, Midna only appears in this game - sure, she's a major character, but still, ONLY IN THIS GAME - her article should be merged with this one.

In fact, most of the information about those are just repeats of the plot of the game - really doesn't belogn here.KrytenKoro 05:20, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Japanese removed...

When Midna's page was merged with the main TP character page, the mentions of her last line in Japanese and the obvious liberty the translators took in translating it have been removed.

I personally think it's an outstanding point that probably needs to be mentioned, as there is now so much speculation about the English version (what she was going to say when she trailed off at "I"). However, I haven't seen the Japanese version of the game myself, so I can't say if it's actually true.

Feel free to prove me wrong. I just think if you're going to quote what Midna says at the end, you must then include what the writers truly intended for her to say in the original Japanese version.

The source given said it was a translation from a beta version. The text could have been changed in the final Japanese release. Takuthehedgehog 15:53, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes you have a point however it is revealed that americans left this as another clue and even if anyone disagrees it had to go through the japanese and they were ok with it a few rumours are the americans added to tell people that Midna is Links love

Darkest-Link33 (talk) 02:29, 23 May 2008 (UTC)Erik

...no. You need to actually know what the Japanese version said before claiming "it could have been like this in the Japanese"

ありがとうな・・・ (Thank you...)

Thank you...

姫さんが、言ったろ (Like the princess said,)

Well, the princess spoke truly:

鏡がある限り、また会えるって・・・ (Only as long as that mirror exists, there would still be meetings...)

as long as that mirror's around, we could meet again...

[Link]・・・ (Link...)

[Link]...

ま・・・ (D...)

I...

またな・・・ (Don't wait for me...)

See you later...

As you can see, the "I..." is a fabrication of the American translators. As such, it definitely doesn't mean that Midna is supposed to love Link, since it's not even in the original, and only there for lack of a better syllable to insert.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 03:00, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Article Deletion for Zant and Wolf Link

Why were the articles for Zant and Wolf Link deleted? They are both important characters in the game and have a pretty major impact on the plot. But Wolf Link has a major impact on the plot. Jimblack 16:15, 27 May 2007 (UTC)JImblack

Both pages are not gone, they're redirects. I redirected Wolf Link to the Twilight Princess article myself. I did that, because before that, the page was mainly a TP plot description, instead of actually describing the Wolf Link character. Besides, Wolf Link is just Link in a different shape. We also don't give Ganon and Ganondorf different articles. Currently, Wolf Link is best covered in the TP article (it should be the Link article), so that's where it redirects to.

As for Zant, he is adequately covered in this article.--Atlan (talk) 18:06, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Twilight Princess Bosses

Since these are already covered on Bosses in The Legend of Zelda series, should we just have a "see: #Morpheel", type of thing?KrytenKoro 18:25, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

The Bosses in The Legend of Zelda series article is rather extensive for someone who is specifically looking for Twilight Princess bosses. It would mean having to go back and forth the articles just to click the redirects, because it's pretty hard to find the TP bosses in that long list (especially if you don't know their names). If anything, it should be the other way around, with this article being the "main article" for ther TP bosses. --Atlan (talk) 21:52, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

You mean "See: Morpheel" wouldn't work?KrytenKoro 22:16, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

I made sure all the material here was on the Bosses page - it turns out that almost all of them were word for word the same that we had here. The template might work better, but the links look okay for now.

Well, what I mean is this: That boss list article is just that, a list of bosses. If it were the main article for all the bosses in all the Zelda games, I think that list would become way too extensive (considering more Zelda games will undoubtedly follow). I think the article is already somewhat out of proportions the way it is. --Atlan (talk) 23:41, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

And yet, the reason that those specific bosses are in that section at the end of the article is that they are characters only by virtue of appearing in the game - other than being bosses, they have no place in the story. Since the bosses page is both more appropriate for them and contained the exact same information, the most we should do on this page is tell them to go to the correct page. If the list is too big, we could seperate it into bosses by game - first into subsections, and then seperate pages if necessary.KrytenKoro 23:51, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm not really fond of the current situation either. I don't really like throwing all the bosses of every Zelda game together in one article as it is now, but I also don't like this copy/paste situation of all the boss info. I think this needs to be worked on on a Zelda-wide scale, not just Twilight Princess, though. Also, your suggestion of splitting up the boss article effectively creates the current situation, where the individual Zelda games have character articles with boss sections. That's not really an improvement. --Atlan (talk) 01:11, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

No. No, no, no, no, no. Doing something ON THE BOSSES PAGE like "Bosses of The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess", and then listing the bosses under that. Not putting them on the characters page.KrytenKoro 01:44, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I got that. But you also said seperate pages if necessary. Anyway, subsections in the boss list article is a good idea, but that needs to be discussed on that talk page first.--Atlan (talk) 11:22, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I see what you meant - I meant an A-M, N-Z type of split pages, not "Bosses of Twilight Princess" article just by itself.KrytenKoro 22:53, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

The "I..." in the last line of dialogue was added in by the NoA translators

From the final Japanese script; this is not a "beta version"

• 【ミドナ】
• ありがとうな…姫さんが言ったろ、鏡がある限り、また会えるって… // Thank you...As the princess said, as long as the mirror's still there, we can meet again
• リンク… ま…またな… // Link...s-see you...

The repeated character is a stutter, not "I..." so a "literal" translation would be simply "Link...s-see you." It appears that the stutter was changed to an "I..." by the NoA team. Wikipedian06 00:38, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

We don't need to go into that much detail over a single word. This is just a description of characters, not of the game and it's translation. Also, your source is some Japanese blog. That's not even a reliable source. Stop pushing this and the Goth edit already, you've been doing it since mid-May and everyone has reverted it.--Atlan (talk) 00:16, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

I go into detail about this because otherwise, people keep posting their stupid speculation about what she really wanted to say, like the edit you just reverted. Wikipedian06 22:19, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

And I'll happily keep reverting all that OR and speculation. I accept your version of the story, since I can read that little bit of Japanese you posted as well. It's just that this is not the right article for that information (and the source isn't any good). That's why I like your current solution, removing the "I..." completely from the article, best. That section can probably be trimmed down even further (all the dialogue cut out), but I think it's okay now.--Atlan (talk) 22:36, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

...Okay? This is the english wikipedia, however - if you want to have a note that the japanese version said it (and you can source it), then fine. But if anything about that line is here, it needs to be the at least the english version.KrytenKoro 02:16, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

No, I don't agree with that, at least not as far as this article is concerned. Why would you want to copy/paste parts of the script? This is a list of characters, not the TP article. That said, it could maybe fit somewhere in the TP article under translation differences, but even that's a stretch. And as for cutting out all the dialogue from Midna's section, that's because a character discription shouldn't need to go into in-game dialogue at all, unless it's pertinent to character's personality. "I...see you later." doesn't really cut it.--Atlan (talk) 13:45, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't get what you're disagreeing with - I said that if there is a reason to have the line there (if going into more detail than "she said her farewells" is really necessary), then the English version needs to be used, since this is the English Wikipedia. If the versions really had enough translation discrepancy to even warrant a note on any article (which I highly doubt - I really don't see how this difference is important in the least), then yes, it should be on the TP article.KrytenKoro 07:27, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, just with having it on this article, but I think that's not really what you meant anyway. We're on the same page.--Atlan (talk) 12:11, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Fused Shadow on Midna's Head

Why didn't Zant take it when he took the other 3? Did he think she looked weird without it? I think we all thought that a little. Just like Demona without her tiara.

What you talkin about, Willis?

But seriously - because he didn't know about it, or because he was only able to take the other three because she hadn't "claimed them" as she claimed her helmet piece (you'll notice that after you get the third, even though you have all four pieces, they haven't joined together yet - maybe she has to bind herself to the power somehow).KrytenKoro 06:03, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

The Interlopers

I believe that's what they were called. The group associated with the Fused Shadow in the very bizarre flashback / illusion / vision that are represented as Shadow Links. Should they be in this article? I don't remember them ever being elaborated on at all besides that vision. TealMan 11:05, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

M.C. Escher's Human/Bird Sculpture

As some know, the M.C. Escher lithograph Still Life with Spherical Mirror and woodcut print Another World contain creatures that bear a very strong resemblance to the Oocca race. So much so that its hard to imagine this is mere coincidence. Is there some quote by Eiji Aonuma or some other member of the development team that gives due credit to these two artworks? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.226.41.102 (talk) 21:54, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Not from what I've heard of; the concept of a bird with a human head isn't too outlandish anyway, so I wouldn't be surprised if this is just mere coincidence. Haipa Doragon (talk) 15:56, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 19:11, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:29, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Name changes

We have three sources for official names: The game itself (see the text dump at ZeldaLegends), the official site and the official guide from Nintendo Power. None of those mention any of the old names. Either they are fancruft or taken from the Prima guide and thus inofficial/deemed to be changed. I'm pretty surprised this hasn't been done before. If you know an additional official source for this names, feel free to name it and change it back.

Borville -> Doctor (see in-game quotes) Chudley/Malver -> Shopkeeper (see official site) Chudley's Fine Goods and Fancy Trinkets Emporium -> overpriced shop (see Nintendo Power Guide) The Group -> the group (name is never capitalized, it's not like it's the NA title of the Resistance) Kili, Hanna, and Misha -> three girls

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Prime Blue (talk • contribs) 11:19, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

I actually said this earlier above, but nobody really answered my question, so I didn't want to change it without verification.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 11:56, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I read those comments and didn't see anyone intervening, so I changed them. We'd better not spread those false names (well, I guess it's a little too late, everyone already adopted them). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Prime Blue (talk • contribs) 22:30, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Ooccoo and Escher

Still Life with Spherical Mirror and Another World (M. C. Escher) by M. C. Escher remind me a lot of Ooccoo. Based on them maybe? I will not add though to article. WP:OR

Carlwev (talk) 20:40, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 22:34, 13 February 2008 (UTC)