Talk:Imam/Archive 1

Archive 1

Untitled

Imam is a term for an Islamic religious leader. In any country, as long as the person leads the people in worship, He is an Imam.

The article Shia Imams, Sayyid and Imams 80% identical information. They need to be combined into one page because there is currently not enough information for two pages. Otherwise edits to errors in the one will need to be in the other because of the copied information.

Needs work

This needs work. The following pages and this one should refer to each other and be used to improve each other:

• Imam
• Shia Imams
• Twelvers
• Ismailis
• Zaidis

—iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 21:04, Dec 1, 2004 (UTC)

Categorization

The whole Imams > Cat: Imams> Cat: Shia Imams > Cat: Religious Leaders needs re-thinking.—iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 23:06, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)

Definition

As Ashmoo observed a couple of yours ago the definition offered does not explain the usage of Imam as a title for respected religious scholars. For example I looking at "Imam Muhammad ibn Shihab az-Zuhri" which strikes me as extreme. But Imam is common in, for example, Imam Bukhari. Somebody with a better understanding of the nuances than I have should rewrite the definition of Imam DKleinecke (talk) 18:40, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

I just observed that this usage is described toward the end of the article - but it should be at the beginning also. To anyone except a Shi'ite this is probably the second most important meaning (after prayer leader).

The table of Shi'ite Imam's strikes me as a grotesque example of Shi'ite POV. I think this article should limit itself to a list of the Imams with their dates and that all the rest of the information whould be relegated to articles on the individual imams. But I don't want to start an edting war so I have changed nothing DKleinecke (talk) 18:50, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Is the word 'imam' in Arabic only used for Islamic religious leaders? In Indonesia, it applies as well to non-Muslim religious leaders (for example the Catholic church here appoints their imams and the Bible in Indonesia is filled with the word 'imam'). And also in Indonesia, the husband is 'the imam' (the spiritual leader) of his wife and children (This expression is used by Christians as well). Is this how it's used in Arabic too? Because it's definitely not being used that way in English.KaluQ84 (talk) 04:32, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

start of article

I've suggested re-doing the definition at the start of the article. The previous text is

an Islamic leadership position, often the worship leader of a mosque and the Muslim community. Similar to spiritual leaders, the imam is the one who leads Islamic worship services. More often, the community turns to the mosque imam if they have a religious question. In smaller communities, an imam could also be the community leader however most Imams are there for religious guidance.

I'm not sure what "similar to spiritual leaders" means, and I'm not sure that we have evidence to rank which of these functions is more or less frequent. Here's what I've proposed instead:

an Islamic leadership position, often the worship leader of a mosque and the Muslim community. Imams may lead Islamic worship services, serve as community leaders and scholars, and provide religious guidance. Religionista (talk) 02:52, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Redirecting Imaum to here?

Imaum currently is an article this basically says that it's a synonym for Imam. Knowing very little about the Muslim faith, I figured I should ask before I redirected here, in case Imaum is actually more than just another spelling of the same word. Flooey 07:03, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

The French are better than us

What do you think of how this look? I thought it was pretty cool (taken from fr).

		1	`Alî (661)
	╔═══════════════════════	═══	╣
	Al-Hanafîya		Fâtima (633)
	│		├────────────────────	───	┐
4	Muhammad ibn al-Hanafîya (700)	3	Husayn (680)	2	Hasan (669)
	Occultation		│		│
	Kaysanites		│		│
		4	`Alî Zayn al-Âbidîn (712)		Zayd ben al-Hasan
	┌───────────────────────	───	┤
5	Muhammad al-Bâqir (791)	5	Zayd ben `Alî (740)
	│		Zaydites
6	Ja`far as-Sâdiq (765)
	├───────────────────────	───	─────────────────────	───	┐
7	Mûsâ al-Kâzim (799)			7	Ismâ`il ben Ja`far as-Sâdiq (760)
	│				Ismaéliens
8	`Alî ar-Ridâ (818)				│
	│			8	Muhammad al-Maktûm (caché) (813)
9	Muhammad al-Jawâd (839)				│
	│			9	`Abd Allah al-Wafî (caché) (828)
10	`Alî al-Hâdî (868)				│
	│			10	Muhammad at-Taqî (caché) (840)
11	Hasan al-Askarî (874)				│
	├───────────────────────	───	┐	11	`Abd Allah ar-Radî (caché) (881)
12	Muhammad al-Mahdî (???)	12	Ibn Nuzayr		├──────────────────────────	───	┐
	Occultation		Alaouites	12	Ubayd Allah al-Mahdî (934)		Qarmates
	Duodécimains		Nuzayrites		Fatimides
					│
				13	Al-Qaim (946)
					│
				14	Al-Mansûr (952)
					│
				15	Al-Muizz li-Dîn Allah (975)
					│
				16	Al-Azîz bi-llah (996)
					│
				17	Al-Hakîm bi-Amr Allah (1021)
			┌────────────────────	───	┤
			Occultation	18	Az-Zahir (1036)
			Druzes		│
				19	Al-Mustansir bi-llah (1094)
			┌────────────────────	───	┤
		20	Nizâr	20	Mustali (1101)
			Nizârites		Mustaliens
			│		│
		21	Hadî	21	Amir (1130)
			│		│
		22	Mohtadî	22	Abû al-Qâsim al-Tayyib (1142)
			│		Occultation
		23	Al-Azikrî Salam
			│
			etc.

-- gren グレン 14:34, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Romanisation of Imam names

I'm no expert on Arabic (I barely speak a word), so instead of altering the names of the Imam to correspond to those titled in their individual articles, I've concealed the 'correct' names in the link. - Sasuke Sarutobi 18:18, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

First imam????

i thought the prophet moh. (pbuh) was supposed to be the last of all "prophets"/or a leader in general that is APPOINTED BY GOD?? i don't understand how shiites still name people after the prophet moh. to be "perfect" and appointed from god. honestly with all due respect,but i find this to be a great contradiction to the basics of islam....i dont know of any hadeeths that support this either...but then again i dont want to go into the hadeeth debate, so i'll leave it at that.

Sunnu Imams section

As an uninformed reader, I have no idea what point this sentence is trying to make: So it is not Imam Bukhari, Imam Muslim,...and so on. Its Sheikh Bukhari and Sheikh Muslim....and so on. Could someone rewrite it? Ashmoo 02:38, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

As an informed reader, there is another glaring error in this section. Women imams may only lead amongst female-only congregations. This sentence makes it as if females in imam position is something approved by all Islamic sects. See here for more info:

One more thing to add related to the issue is: In Turkey, Imams are appointed by the state and they are required to be graduates of a Imam Khatip school or have a university degree in Theology. So this is an official position regulated by the Presidency of Religious Affairs of the Republic of Turkey and only males are appointed to this position while female officials under the same state organisation work as preachers and Qur'an course tutors, religious services experts. These officials are supposedly belong to the Hanafi school of the Sunni sect.

Purple phenomenon (talk) 14:57, 9 April 2017 (UTC)

References

Imam - etymology

Can we have an etymology of the term, and how it changed from what it is in arabic to what it is now? Faro0485 (talk) 02:29, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

Proposed split

I don't know very much about Islam, but it seems like the term Imam means completely different things in Sunni Islam and Shi'a Islam. Therefore, I think this article should be split, with one article for each meaning. --Alynna (talk) 00:29, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

This is done. --Alynna (talk) 05:46, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

I've undone this. With over 500 inbound links, more discussion needs to be put into a split here. If you still think this is appropriate, please raise an RfC or some discussion on an appropriate-minded WikiProject. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward: not at work) - talk 10:14, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

O My GOD,That's not true!

yazeed poisoned Hassan ibn Ali Radi ALLAHu Anhu Not Ameer Muawiyah Radi ALLAHu Anhu!It seems to be written by rafidhi.

59.161.254.21 (talk) 05:48, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

The statement is sourced, at least, if you want it checked for verification that can be done, but to start if you have a reliable third-party source that you can cite saying something to the contrary you should produce it. Peter Deer (talk) 07:24, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

MY edit

Here I just added a new category, which is "Allama". And then I just moved 2 images, because there was written "An imam leading prayers in Cairo", but he was not leading. Therefore I moved it and replaced with a real one, where an Imam is just leading. -- AHLM13 talk 16:13, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

How is an Imam appointed?

As a non-Muslim who has a background in church history, the means by which local church leadership has been appointed over the years is an interesting study in how the church bends with the times. What is the normal practice, what is the basis for this and how far is it actually practiced. This is particularly relevant in the present crack down in Egypt and Turkey on Mosques, with an increasing role for the government in appointing imams. Ender's Shadow Snr (talk) 16:42, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

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Request for comments

Greetings to all,

A Request for comment has been initiated regarding RfC about whether to allow use of honorofic 'Allama' with the names or not?

Requesting your comments to formalize the relevant policy @ Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Islam-related articles

Thanks

Bookku (talk) 18:00, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

Demonstrably False

The second paragraph of the lead makes the false claim that this term is "only applicable to members of the Ahl al-Bayt". It then goes on to mention someone of the 20th Century who used the term (and clearly tens (hundreds?) of thousands of others). You can't have it both ways. Or perhaps the writer needs to learn what the word "only" means. This article is so poorly written that I find it hard to understand why it exists (in its present form). What on Earth is meant that a (Shi'a) imam is "presented as participating in the names [reserved] for God alone"??? Wow. 174.131.63.209 (talk) 11:51, 25 August 2021 (UTC)