Talk:History of Australia

Cleanup

Until 17th century, Australia was an unexplored place for the world. It was first sighted by the Dutch navigator, Willem Janszoon, in about 1606. In 1642, another Dutch navigator, Abel Tasman, explored many parts of Australia and New Zealand. Later on, in 1770, the British naval officer and explorer, Captain James Cook, sailed along the eastern coast of Australia and landed at the Botany Bay. He named the newly discovered land as New South Wales.

Political Division Today, Australia is divided into six self - governing states and two federal territories, like India's Union Territories which are centrally administered. The six self-governing states are - 1) Queensland 2) New South Wales 3) Victoria 4) South Australia 5) Western Australia 6) Tasmania The two centrally administered federal territories are Northern Territory and Australian Capital Territory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Premium Sites (talk • contribs) 07:41, 9 August 2020 (UTC) I will soon get around to fixing the 21st century history section, but I would also like to ask whether or not the section called 'Historiography' should be kept or should it be deleted. I feel that it should be deleted, this is meant to be a timeline of events not of personal opinions of history writers. I think it would be better to put it in a different article. I have also wondered if the Second Boer War should be added into this, as it was technically the first war to officially involve Australia and it was also the 3rd deadliest war for Australia. What do you guys think? --Collingwood26 (talk) 08:48, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi Collingwood26. Yes I think the subsection on Historiography could go - it sits awkwardly under republicanism at the minute. I dont think we need any further reference to the Boer War. If needs be, it should have its own article. I also think the final section on Afghanistan needs to be hived off to its own article - its far too detailed. I think it's too easy to use wars as a type of bookmark in history. The reality is, most Australians are pretty far removed from the current Afghanistan conflict. CheersNickm57 (talk) 10:21, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Yes, the material on Afghanistan is much too long. A paragraph would be appropriate. I agree that the historiography section should go (it's simultaneously too big a topic and of not enough interest to most people to include here). The whole article probably gives too much weight to the wars Australia has been involved in. Nick-D (talk) 10:42, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

What are you doing Collingwood26? You seem to have deleted most of the previous section (inc Govt and current political context) on 21st Century Australia. Im reverting your most recent edit. Please discuss further here. ThanksNickm57 (talk) 10:47, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi I'm back, I have cleaned the 21st century section. I would like to add more like the Apology to the stolen generation etc. Sorry if I did something you didnt like. I don't think the Afghanistan section is too long I just wanted to help.--Collingwood26 (talk) 11:01, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

It looks like you reverted my edit, I was going to add all the parts from "Into the 21st century" into a more neater context. Please discuss?--Collingwood26 (talk) 11:04, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Sure - I think the material on the contemporary political context of Australia should not have been deleted and replaced with material on 'The Centenary Medal' - what I would call "celebratory history." With Afghanistan, probably the first para expanded is enough.Nickm57 (talk) 11:17, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

I was going to make another article concerning gillard, stolen generation apology, and others. So you don't like the changes I made? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Collingwood26 (talk • contribs) 11:27, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Fine whatever, I made it look 100 times better and you go and revert everything to the crap before. Do it yourself then--Collingwood26 (talk) 11:35, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Sorry you feel that way. Many editors, self included, have contributed to this article over the last year and Im certain all would agree that it can still be improved. But I don’t think they would accept your description of it as “crap” or that your recent edits made it 100 times better. Anyway, the point of this page is to discuss improvements to the article. If you intend to make a new article concerning Gillard etc, and delete it from this - or replace it with material on the Centenary Medal, the onus is on you to explain why.Nickm57 (talk) 12:09, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

As per discussion above, Ive deleted the section on historiography and cut down the section on Australia in Afghanistan. Sorry - could not work out who wrote these, else I would have invited them to comment directly first.Nickm57 (talk) 21:04, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Bali Bombings

I find it strange that there is a big section about Australia's involvement in the war on terror and Afghanistan yet nothing about the 2002 Bali bombings. I would have though that given that 88 Australians died and that it was so close to our shores this as much if not moreso than the 9/11 attacks on the United States a pivotal factor in Australia's ongoing commitment to this war. --Biatch (talk) 02:07, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes I agree Bali Bombings should be included in the 21st century history section, who else agrees? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.189.200.75 (talk) 03:23, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

I am inclined to disagree. It might belong in History of Indonesia, but it did not take place in Australia and did not involve the Australian state in a formal capacity. This is in contrast to the war in Afghanistan, which has involved Australia directly as a state, for over a decade, and concerns invocation of the ANZUS treaty. Even with that significance, it only rates five sentences (and the first two of those probably need to be trimmed down to one). There is also an explicit link 9the treaty) between 9/11 and Afghanistan - there is no such link between Bali and that conflict. hamiltonstone (talk) 03:50, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

I agree it needs mention. The article is about the people and culture and experiences of Australia, and that episode was a significant event that everyone -- and the government-- paid attention to. Rjensen (talk) 06:13, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

White Stolen Generations

There is a section on the (Indigenous) Stolen Generation, but shoudn't also the White Stolen Generation be recognized here as well? White Stolen Generations --Collingwood26 (talk) 04:53, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

I have research experience in this field, and the short answer is absolutely not under the heading 'white stolen generation', but yes there could be coverage of the adoption practices involved. The term 'white stolen generation' is very contentious, used occasionally but rejected by many. The prevailing term used in this area is "forced adoption". The WP article also incorrectly attributes a phrase to a journalist that was used by a member of the audience at the community cabinet: "the same past illegal adoption practices..." They are not the same practices, and only in some cases were conducted under the same legislation (or legislative pretence). There is a debate about whether they were illegal in most cases (though certainly were ill-advised, even by standards of the time). This is a minefield. I'm happy to try and maker a contribution sometime, though not just now. hamiltonstone (talk) 05:29, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

It isn't contentious to call it the "white stolen generations", thats just silly. Many historians and media journalists have referred to it as Australia's forgotten stolen generation. When people think of the stolen generation they instantly think of the Aboriginals, the term white stolen generations was created to help distinguish it, although it was essentially the same practice. If you don't want to call it the White stolen generation, then why is it not contentious to call the Aboriginal one a stolen generation? I'm not accusing you of being racist, but your overtone is a tad hypocritical. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Collingwood26 (talk • contribs) 23:39, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

First, it is contentious for it to be the title of an encyclopedia article. It is not a term used by the Australian Institute of Family Studies, the Tasmanian Palriamentary Inquiry, the New South Wales Parliamentary Inquiry, the Australian Senate Inquiry, the Commonwealth Attorney General's Department, the Australian Capital Territory government, the Monash University research project, and so on and so on. The encyclopedia term would almost certainly be either "forced adoption" or "forced adoption in Australia". I will eventually get around to looking at a requested move for the page White Stolen Generation. The article could have within it text and references regarding the comparisons to the Stolen Generations.

The term is also contentious amongst stakeholders for a number of reasons, but mainly because Aboriginal children were taken under the forced adoptions process, and calling it a white stolen generation suggests they are excluded from being recognised. There is also concern that it can undermine recognition of the stolen generation, or to put a racial dimension on an issue that is not racial in nature (forced adoption). I'm sorry, I can't identifty references around that point. Anyway, the main issue is that it is not the preferred encyclopedia term. Cheers, hamiltonstone (talk) 03:56, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

It would be helpful if further comments were made on the relevant article talkpage.  Tigerboy1966  06:10, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Calling it the white stolen generation doesn't exclude Aboriginals from being recognized, on the contrary it is the other way around. For example when the apology to the stolen generations was made was there any reference to white mothers or children? No there wasn't, only Aboriginals and TSI were recognized. Thus this is why the term "white" stolen generation was created to help distinguish it. Even Aboriginals recognize the white stolen generation by the following: After the 2008 Apology to the Stolen Generation, Indigenous leader Max Dulumunmun Harrison, an elder of the Yuin people, helped bring it out last November, when he wrote: “I applaud the Prime Minister’s apology to our mob, but what about the white stolen generation that suffered the same fate? I know many white people who went through the same pain. So why can’t this government do its healing again and apologise to the white stolen generation to bring closure to all this suffering?”[ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Collingwood26 (talk • contribs) 10:39, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Per Tigerboy's comment, can we please keep this discussion on the talk page of the relevant article? I have been responding there, as are others. hamiltonstone (talk) 12:56, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Julia Gillard

Shouldn't Julia Gillard be given more of an introduction, maybe a picture of something. She is after all the first female pm of australia, we have a picture of the first pm of australia so why not the first female pm? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Collingwood26 (talk • contribs) 11:18, 16 August 2012 (UTC)

I don't think more text is needed - it does say she is the country's first female PM - but I do think there should be a photo for her, and we certainly don't need two photos from the 200 Olympics. I'll see what I can come up with. hamiltonstone (talk) 23:10, 16 August 2012 (UTC)

Yes I agree, as she is the first female primeminister she definately should be shown on here. We should remove one of the 2000 Olympics photos and replace it with her portrait. Thanks!--Collingwood26 (talk) 03:46, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

Done. hamiltonstone (talk) 04:16, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

The Trihybrid Theory

Hi, I was reading about Aboriginal Australian history and came across this article which talks about 3 apparent migrations which occurred during Ancient Australia. Here's an excerpt.

There were three major waves of migration of quite different ancient people who came to the Australian continent from southeast Asia. More than 40,000 years ago, when sea levels were much lower and Australia, New Guinea and Tasmania comprised one landmass, called Sahul, the first to arrive were a slightly-built people of pygmoid stature with dark skin and very frizzy hair. They were Negritos (named after the Spanish "little negro"), and they provided the initial population for the whole of this Greater Australia. About 20,000 years ago, a second type of people arrived from Asia. These newcomers, called Murrayians, were comparatively lightly skinned, wavy-haired, stocky in build, with a lot of body hair. They drove the Negritos before them until the latter retreated to the highlands of New Guinea, the rainforests of North Queensland and to then ice-capped Tasmania. The Murrayians became the dominant population on the east coast of Australia, and the open grasslands and parklands of the south and west of the continent. Then, about 15,000 years ago, a third wave of hunter-gatherers arrived. They were comparatively tall, straight-haired and dark skinned, with very little body hair. Named Carpentarians, they colonised northern and central Australia.

Should this be included? This is the site: http://www.sydneyline.com/Pygmies%20Extinction.htm --Collingwood26 (talk) 08:09, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

No I dont think so. The appropriate place for Joseph Birdsell's theory is on the page about him, or a new page about the theory. There are also numerous easily available sources about the theory, including ones written by Birdsell himself, quite apart from controversial writer Keith Windschuttle's summary cited above. Nickm57 (talk) 21:08, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

Ok thanks--Collingwood26 (talk) 02:20, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

That doesn't make sense, though. Windschuttle is an odious white supremacist with an anti-Aboriginal agenda, no doubt. But Birdsell was a serious anthropologist who proposed a serious theory based on serious evidence, and there's no way to prevent bigots from instrumentalising one's theory in fallacious ways for nefarious ends. Political interests should not bias the evaluation of the evidence, nor keep Wikipedia from mentioning a theory, only because some interest groups may fear that the theory undermines or invalidates Aboriginal claims to their ancestral lands (even though it does no such thing, in view of how analogous facts don't invalidate land claims elsewhere in the world, such as Europe or Asia, either). Maybe due weight means that it should not be mentioned here, but in Aboriginal Australians or History of Indigenous Australians there's certainly a place for it. Birdsell's theory may be out of favour now, but it's not a crackpot idea and testable with genetic evidence, and I'm not even sure it (or some variant) has been conclusively falsified. Even as a historical theory, it still holds encyclopedic interest. Moreover, it is inherently more plausible to assume some sort of hybridisation rather than a single prehistorical wave of immigration and then no further immigration for 60,000 years until the 18th century. It's not impossible, but there's no particular reason to think so, and the opposite is at least equally possible, in view of what we know about changes in geography and climate. And crucially, the article already mentions genetic evidence for a prehistorical wave of immigration, 4000 years ago from South Asia, even if it seems to have been a minor one and doesn't specifically support or even vindicate Birdsell's theory, but it does effectively disprove the orthodox view that Aboriginal Australians have a single origin. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 11:32, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

WSG

This was discussed previously but nothing was done about it. I believe the White Stolen Generations should be mentioned here.--Collingwood26 (talk) 02:11, 19 August 2012 (UTC)

Mega-Tsunami 1500 AD

Hello once again, I was wondering should the mega-tsunami that hit Eastern Australia in the early 1500s be recorded on here?http://www.ancientdestructions.com/mega-tsunami-australia-new-zealand/--Collingwood26 (talk) 13:27, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Your link is broken; this one works. I'd like to see a more reliable source. Rivertorch (talk) 19:53, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Cosmogenic mega-tsunami in the Australia region: are they supported by Aboriginal and Maori legends? Edward A. Bryant, G. Walsh & D. Abbott

Tsunami: terror from the sea Emma Young

David Woodward ☮ ♡♢☞☽ 23:55, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Edit?

I vote to delete the part about Republicanism in Australia, and the Sydney Olympics. Sure both are historical but they aren't important enough to be mentioned on here.--Collingwood26 (talk) 04:36, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

The question should be, how would deleting these sections improve the article ? I cannot see how this would improve it, except for making it slightly shorter--Nickm57 (talk) 08:00, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

these are important issues that have received a great deal of attention from rs. People not interested can easily skip over them--erasure would be a bad mistake. Republicanism remains a live issue and has its own article. The olympics have been the #1 device for letting the world know about the country and have been topics of major scholarly studies. People who want to understand Australian history will want to read them.Rjensen (talk) 19:20, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Size split?

Split - Article is over 100 kB, and should be split out starting with "Colonization". Thoughts? Suggestions?--Jax 0677 (talk) 18:41, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

If we are going to split it, I suggest using the existing Australian History articles, (see list on the page) as the guide. The other articles are under-developed anyway.Nickm57 (talk) 20:35, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

splitting it up will only confuse readers who have to reassemble the entire article themselves from scattered pieces. We can assume our readers are intelligent enough to read the sections that interest them, and to skip all the other material. If someone wants to read the article from start to end, we can assume they are capable of allocating their time to do that. Rjensen (talk) 08:13, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

I assume you are suggesting creating some daughter articles, and retaining a more concise "History of Australia"? The article is indeed too long, because there is excessive detail in some sections. hamiltonstone (talk) 22:55, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

Splitting is a bad idea. Some trimming and transfer to specific period articles makes more sense.Ozhistory (talk) 23:48, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

I'm not an expert in Australian history but I would venture to suggest the final para of the section Great Depression seems to be overly detailed about a cricketer and the horse Phar Lap. I suggest this could be cut to a couple of sentences if included at all. It seems to me rather out of place for a general national history article and would properly go in the sub-articles. --bodnotbod (talk) 00:56, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Pre-1788 Colonization

Hello I am wondering whether or not this should be included, Dutch historian Van Zanden has written a book titled "The Lost White Tribes of Australia" which sits in several parts and claims that there is proof that the first settlement of Australia was made in 1656 which is well over 100 years before colonization is thought to have happenend.--Collingwood26 (talk) 02:30, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

A self published text apparently, and a theory not supported by any one else. For other views about this and the 1834 Leeds Mercury newspaper report that it is based upon, see Marc Glasby's "West Australia Now and Then" [5] and Karen Severud Cook's "THE SECRET AGENDA OF WESTERN AUSTRALIAN EXPLORER, ROBERT DALE (1809-1853)" in The Globe No.54, p23-34, which can be read online for free if you apply for a (National Library of Australia) card online [6]. Henry Van Zanden is apparently an Australian writer and former teacher.Nickm57 (talk) 09:54, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

There is great lack of information in the Pre-1788 section. There must be scholarly investigations worth mentioning? At the very least there is the work done by Rex Gilroy. Factrules (talk) 23:10, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Murrawarri republic

Does the last sentence really belong in this article? We could hive it off to the article on Australian republicanism?

Unless I'm missing something, it seems to me the 'Murrawarri republic' is potentially nothing more than all those other cranky, like things of this nature I've seen come and go with no impact a thousand times before. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.164.18.43 (talk) 13:57, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Malays/Indonesian 'discovery' pre-Janszoon??

I remember reading somewhere that Malays/Indonesians were know to have visited Australia before Europeans arrived. Is there any evidence for this? And if so surely it deserves a few lines in this history page.

Sdrawkcab (talk) 18:54, 22 July 2013 (UTC)sdrawkcab

There is an entire page on this - Makassan contact with Australia, but the evidence that it was pre-Janszoon is not conclusive. The page is linked from the end of the third paragraph.Nickm57 (talk) 22:20, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

It's also mentioned in the main article of this page - that the contact happened about 1720 or later

Montalban (talk) 01:43, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

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Recent edits

I've just reverted the article back to its 30 March 2016 status to remove several paragraphs of lightly referenced material on Australian politics since 2007. The material was written in an unencyclopaedic tone, and much of it seemed to be its author's personal assessments. Nick-D (talk) 11:06, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Inclusion of Frontier Wars and Genocide

Hello, I was wondering if this page could be modified to be more reflective, descriptive, and respectful of Australia's history? Many wars, massacres, acts of dispossession, and death are not included in this predominant Post-Invasion accounting. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Afterafairgo (talk • contribs) 09:19, 21 October 2016 (UTC)

Bathurst

The article contains the following error

to the outright hostility of Pemulwuy and Windradyne of the Sydney region.

Windradyne was not 'of the Sydney region', but in the region of Bathurst 203.2 km (126.3 mi) away.

Montalban (talk) 01:42, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

Copy edit required, unable to do it myself

Towards the end of the third paragraph of the section Great Depression the following sentence appears:

With multimillion-pound debts mounting, public demonstrations and move and counter-move by Lang and then Scullin, then Lyons federal governments, the Governor of New South Wales, Philip Game, had been examining Lang's instruction not to pay money into the Federal Treasury.

I suspect this needs to be split into two sentences. Probably a period after '...federal governments" and then a new sentence beginning "The Governor of New South Wales..." but I'm unsure if that's the correct thing to do. --bodnotbod (talk) 00:45, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Does the article tell us what became of the Dutch colonies?

Forgive me if I've missed something, I've just completed - after many hours - reading and editing the whole article and can't bring myself to revisit any of it.

But I don't recall any part of the article telling us what happened to the Dutch colonies. It seemed like the Dutch and British had half the continent each for a while. Then I recall the British encroached on the Dutch parts. But I don't recall, for example, any resistance from Dutch colonists to the British seeming to eventually take over the whole continent. Did the British assimilate the Dutch? Did the Dutch just leave? I repeat, I apologise if all this is dealt with. If not, it would be a good thing to include. --bodnotbod (talk) 03:46, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

There were no Dutch colonies.Nickm57 (talk) 06:16, 3 December 2016 (UTC)"Although various proposals for colonisation were made, notably by Pierre Purry from 1717 to 1744, none was officially attempted."Nickm57 (talk) 06:19, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Ah. Well, that would certainly explain it then, ha ha. :) Thank you. --bodnotbod (talk) 19:44, 4 December 2016 (UTC)

Emu-war

Greetings. Could anyone add a section dedicated to the Great Emu War waged in 1932?

--2001:4646:18D3:0:8434:303B:C136:D8E1 (talk) 21:58, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

And how would that improve the article? There is already a page on it. Nickm57 (talk) 23:56, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Only insiders can edit this article?? Wikipedia:Dispute resolution to follow

@Skyring deleted every word I had added about colonisation and about sovereignty from the UK because of Dubious material and unreliable sources.

 22:03, 12 February 2017‎ Skyring (talk | contribs)‎ . . (285,015 bytes) (-10,202)‎ . . (Dubious material and unreliable sources. Pls discuss on talk) 

So every source I had cited was unreliable? Or was the revert edit really an excuse to revert the article to the point that its "owners" had it. Who owns this article? Is Wikipedia not an encyclopedia built collaboratively?

Does that mean "collaboration by a handful of insiders"? Peter K Burian (talk) 15:17, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

So let's discuss this on the Talk page as required by Wikipedia:Dispute resolution

Many of the citations are to a Government of Australia document. Is that dubious?

http://www.australia.gov.au/about-australia/australian-story/european-discovery-and-colonisation |title=European discovery and the colonisation of Australia - European mariners |author= |date=2015 |website=Government of Australia

http://www.australia.gov.au/about-australia/australian-story/european-discovery-and-colonisation |title=European discovery and the colonisation of Australia - First Fleet and a British Colony |author= |date=2015 |website=Government of Australia

And is the Australian Broadcasting Corporation a dubious source?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2010-12-07/australia27s_last_brick_of_nationhood/41892 |title=Australia's last brick of nationhood |last=Donovan |first=David |date=6 December 2010 |website=Australian Broadcasting Corporation |publisher=Australian Broadcasting Corporation

And is Sydney Law School a dubious source?

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=984994 |title=The De-Colonisation of the Australian States, Paper No. 07/19 |last=Twomey |first=Anne |date=May 2007 |website=SSRN |publisher=Sydney Law School Research |access-date=12 February 2017 |quote=Statute of Westminster 1931, the Australian States remained 'self-governing colonial dependencies of the British Crown' until the Australia Acts 1986 came into force Peter K Burian (talk) 15:38, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

WP:DISPUTE Talk page discussion is a prerequisite to almost all of Wikipedia's venues of higher dispute resolution. If you wish at any time to request a Third Opinion (3O), use the Dispute Resolution Noticeboard (DRN), or open a request for mediation (RFM), you will be expected to show there has been talk page discussion of the dispute. Peter K Burian (talk) 15:42, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Calm down. This is Wikipedia. Nothing gets lost. We're discussing the problem now. What's this source, please? --Pete (talk) 18:09, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Could you avoid so much unnecessary formatting please Peter - bold, indenting, double spacing before adding your name etc. Please follow the conventions. It's quite hard to read otherwise. I also reject this complaint of "insiders" - it's frankly nonsense as I'm sure you now realise. I've written on this page too and although I'm pretty busy in real life I've watched what you were doing. Given your heavy dependence on online sources I wondered how thorough you were being. For example, why delete the reference to Kenneth McIntyre, the key theorist for the highly contentious Portuguese discovery theory? Admiral Arthur Phillip? I've never read a Historian use this title in relation to the British colonisation of Oz. Happy to provide further comments when I have time. Nickm57 (talk) 20:37, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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External links modified

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Terra Nullius

Removed from description of Bourke's Proclamation. He did not use the term. Feel free to check a transcript. The term Terra_nullius does not appear until 1888 or later, as stated in Wikipedia's own article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terra_nullius#First_use_of_the_term_Terra_Nullius Seasalt (talk) 02:45, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

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Real History of discover and exploration of Australia, whit all know sources and historic know facts ( and not same national dutch or english propaganda)

Trying to sell the theory of Dutch have been the first european to discovery Australia, its a completely unavailable theory. All know the portuguese have been the first european to reach it and discover it, to not talk about the maps and pictures of kangaroos, the remain of old fort and portuguese armament and stuck ships and in more of 200 words and names of natural australians derived from portuguese language( its the most powerful argument that English or dutch can´t advocate, because how much time it need to influence a different culture? Or australian indigenous learn and assimilate in a light speed, as no expedition and language portuguese courses next of dutch and english false and historic manipulated claim as the first european to do it have been taken). The Portugal never need to do big defense of that discover(as others as Cristovão Colombo, as a secret portuguese agent) and exploration because in time its not a land with technologies or any type of riches that justify the efforts to maintain it.And the treaty with Spain give to spain that part of World big discover, so Portugal never open make any public or revindicate it. About being the England to discover it, i really try to find but never find any old or today (commonwealth) maritime territory "discover" by british/or dutch as the first maritime route to it, all knows that Portugal lack of population and warpower it was used wisely from his old ally to simply conquer the discover portuguese territories with portuguese routes, and when Portugal remain an obstacle the English manage to "clean" any opposition to it as well know, for example the ultimate of rose map in Africa is one of the most public(because others have been used and not public admitted such piracy, mercenaries, murders, bribery, forge ...) clean of opposition portuguese or not. One thing is sure England conquer it, but not have been the first europeans to reach or exploring it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.93.5.251 (talk) 12:35, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia articles are not allowed to contain original research. All article content must be verifiable and cite reliable sources. The article does mention a theory of Portuguese discovery, and it appears to be quite adequately sourced. If you have a specific suggestion for improving the article and can supply reliable sources to support it, please say so. But be aware that talk pages are for discussing articles, not the topics behind the articles. Rivertorch^FIRE_WATER 15:43, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Unfortunately the expression here is so excruciating I struggle to understand what the writer means. I previously suggested this IP read some of the sources linked to relevant WP pages. Obviously that hasn't been done. Nickm57 (talk) 20:45, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Some proposed changes to External links

Add link to National Museum of Australia timeline under 'External links'

I would like to propose adding a link to the National Museum of Australia's, Defining Moments in Australian history timeline. The National Museum of Australia's, Defining Moments in Australian history timeline is a great and reliable visual resource to understanding Australian History. As an employee of the Museum I am unable to edit the 'External links' myself, as I would be in breach of Wikipedia's conflict of interest guidelines.

Proposed edit: Under 'External links' please add a link to National Museum of Australia's, Defining Moments in Australian history timeline. Website and timeline URL listed below under 'References supporting change'

References supporting change:

Defining Moments in Australian History timeline URL: https://www.nma.gov.au/defining-moments/defining-moments-timeline

National Museum of Australia, Defining Moments in Australian history URL: https://www.nma.gov.au/defining-moments 203.5.124.228 (talk) 05:00, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

Reply 03-JUN-2019

  Edit request declined  

• The proposed link requires that browsers attempting to access the content displayed there allow for the use of Javascript.
• Point #8 @ WP:ELNO recommends that links which require this to access content should not be used in External links sections.

Regards,  Spintendo  05:43, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

Opening sentence

I found a lack of logic in the use of the "Commonwealth" (since 1901), the European settlers (since 1788), and the Indigenous peoples (up to 60,000 ago). I hope my edit, producing a simpler opening that doesn't require knowledge of the specialised colonial term "the Commonwealth", is OK. Tony (talk) 09:56, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

History is the study of the past. Events occurring before the invention of writing systems are considered prehistory. I have rewritten the opening, removing the tautology ("The history of Australia" is the history..." - really?) and removing mention of things that clearly were not history. The prehistory of Australia - i.e. the events before people began writing them down - is covered well elsewhere and we cover it in summary in our first section. --Pete (talk) 17:11, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Changes to structure

Hello all

I have added new content for the political history from 1972 to present. I have also made some changes to the structure. Specifically, I have replaced the heading "Modern Australia emerging 1960s" with a heading Reform and reaction: 1972 to 1996. The previous heading, despite its title referencing the 1960s, mostly covered events from 1972 onwards. It also included subheadings for "culture and the new nationalism" which was mostly about South Australian cinema after the 1960s, and a subheading for "civil rights developments" which was very potted and also mostly about developments after the 1960s. I have given this material a more meaningful title and have moved it to the period covering 1960s to 2000. The material however still needs a major revision and expansion.

I have also changed the heading "21st Century" (which oddly started with events from December 2007) and replaced it with a more meaningful heading: Australia in a globalised world 1996-present. This covers events since the Hawke-Keating government initiated economic reforms embracing the globalised economy and greater engagement with the Asia-Pacific region. Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 02:44, 20 April 2021 (UTC)

Good work. Thanks. Nickm57 (talk) 05:13, 20 April 2021 (UTC)

Society and culture: 1960s to present

Hello all

I have significantly expanded this section to take it up to the present. I have also moved the section towards the end of the article to achieve a better balance between a chronological and thematic presentation of information. The section on culture still needs a lot of work. Happy to discuss.Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 04:42, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

Indigenous prehistory

Hello all

I have considerably expanded this section. I have replaced some material based on outdated sources with new information based on more recent sources. Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 01:52, 22 May 2021 (UTC)

Indigenous history

Hello all

I have significantly expanded the sections on Indigenous history from settlement to the 1960s and have restructured the sections into a more logical order. Previously Indigenous history from 1788 to the 1960s was very potted and presented separately from the the rest of Australian history. This is unsatisfactory because, for better or for worse, the history of Indigenous Australians since 1788 is inextricably interlinked with the history of British settlement and subsequent waves of immigration. In any event, there is already a separate wikipedia article on Australian Indigenous History. The revised article has a more logical order: 1. Indigenous prehistory 2. European exploration 3. British colonisation 4. Impact of British colonisation on Indigenous people. 5. The subsequent history of all Australians, Indigenous and non-Indigenous.

Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 06:24, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Early European exploration and colonisation

Hello all

I have made substantial edits to the sections on Early European exploration and Colonisation in order to make the existing information more concise and relevant and to make it less reliant on one or two articles. I have also added some new material. Specifically I have:

• Rewritten and summarised information which was lightly paraphrased from articles by Robert J. King. In some cases strings of citations were also lifted from articles by King and presented as if they were separate, supporting, citations. (King’s article Terra Australls, New Holland And New South Wales: The Treaty Of Tordesillas And Australia had been extensively used.)
• Summarised information on early maps of New Holland which was repeated three times in the article and also covered at length in the main article European maritime exploration of Australia.
• Summarised existing information on the plans for colonisation and added new information on the alternative plans for African settlement which were arguably the British government’s preferred option.
• Added new information so the article is less reliant on the views of King (distinguished as he is).
• Moved some information so it is presented in a more logical order. For example, much of the information in the Early European exploration section was about proposals for colonisation which more logically belongs in the Plans for colonisation section.
• Changed the names of some of the subheadings to more accurately reflect their contents.

I think these sections of the article are still too long and include too much tangential information which could easily be cut or spun off into other articles. The article also reads like an essay (or even chapters of a full length book) rather than a concise narrative and summary of the state of the latest scholarship on the topic. I’d be interested to hear the views of other editors on this.Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 01:28, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Your edits to this section look good to me. This section particularly has suffered over the years with enthusiastic nationalistic narratives being dropped in. It was high time for a cleanup.Nickm57 (talk) 05:19, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Colonisation

Hello all I have revised and expanded the sections on the establishment of the various Australian colonies, convicts and colonial society, and exploration of the continent. I have put the material in a more logical order and added more subheadings which better summarise the content. Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 05:02, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 16 August 2021

Lieutenant James Cook charted the east coast of Australia for Great Britain. He returned to London with accounts *favouring* (favoring) *colonisation* (colonization) at Botany Bay (now in Sydney). 2A04:4540:6D1C:4200:D90C:8533:1168:E987 (talk) 13:56, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. —Sirdog9002 (talk) 20:18, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

From autonomy to federation

Hello all

I have added information to this section and put the information in a more logical order. I have added sub-headings for clarity. I have also summarised some information to remove repetitions and excessive detail which is included in linked daughter articles. Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 04:58, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your work on this article.Nickm57 (talk) 07:36, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Establishment of the colony of New South Wales

@Camira: You don't seem to have an active talkpage so I have added this here. Please look at my compromise wording to see if you agree. My understanding of King's article is that the some people compared the Colony of NSW to the foundation of the Roman Empire. The point being that Rome was founded by criminals. The first great seal alludes to this: see convicts casting off their chains and being led into the bright new future. The idea of convicts founding an empire was widely ridiculed in Britain, and the short quote from Phillip indicates that he too dismissed the idea of criminals founding an empire. The full quote doesn't change this point.--Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 05:10, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Federation

Hello all

I have added information to this section and put the information in a more logical order. I have added sub-headings for clarity. I have also summarised some information to remove repetitions and excessive detail which is already included elsewhere in the article and in daughter articles. I have replaced inadequately sourced information with sourced information. Happy to discuss. --Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 01:38, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Establishment of further colonies

Hello all

I have reversed repeated edits to this section by Caltraser5. The reason why Queensland is discussed last in this section is simply because it was the last colony to be proclaimed. There is no good reason to change this or to delete the sourced sentences which discuss the background to the establishment of Queensland as a separate colony from New South Wales. I have previously raised this in my edit summaries and on the user's talkpage.

@Caltraser5: Hello Caltraser. Please discuss your concerns with this section here and seek consensus before you make any changes. Thank you. --Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 00:43, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

The use of founding of colonies in the subheading misled me to assume it was about the founding of settlements but according to Aemilius Adolphin, that it is about self government only. With that I have restored my prior edit, and removed the section on Moreton Bay Penal settlement which is irrelevant to the subheading, since it is only referencing self governing provinces, of which Queensland was not independent until 1859.--Caltraser5 (talk) 02:28, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Use of Peter Gouldthorpe convict flash mob artwork

I suggest the illustration "A singular act of female rebellion in Van Diemen's land" be removed immediately. It appears to be a 2004 artwork by Tasmanian artist Peter Gouldthorpe, not an 1838 work by an unknown author, as originally claimed by the uploader to commons. I have nominated it for deletion. That possibly infringement of copyright aside, respected historian Lucy Frost has argued the event did not even occur. See [[7]]. While it’s true that another well respected historian – Claire Wright has suggested it may have happened, [[8]] there is enough controversy that it should not be used without fair and balanced discussion - which would not be appropriate here anyway. Nickm57 (talk) 01:37, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

I have just noticed, Michael Connor also provided a summary of the problem with this story in Quadrant back in 2010. [[9]] Nickm57 (talk) 02:00, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

First World War

Hello all

I have significantly expanded this section, I have added sub-headings on the Home Front and the Paris Peace Conference for clarity. I have also summarised some information to remove detail which is already in daughter articles. I have replaced inadequately sourced information with sourced information. Happy to discuss.Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 06:24, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

That might be getting a bit long, especially as we have good-quality articles on various aspects of Australia's involvement in the war. The article as a whole probably has too much material on military and political history (I say as someone who mainly edits on both topics!). Nick-D (talk) 08:26, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your work. The addition is well written but I tend to agree with the other Nick. (I speak from experience. I spent a lot of time on this article a few years ago and found it very difficult to get the balance right). Cheers Nickm57 (talk) 12:20, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the feedback. I'll go back to it later and trim some of the detail. I think the section on the inter-war years also needs some trimming so I will have a go at paring them both back. --Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 22:00, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Story

I replaced the word "story" in the lead sentence with "history". I'm sure there's a better way to word the lead sentence, but I had to get "story" outta there. Masterhatch (talk) 14:41, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

History by historic filmmaterials

Please add to the article:

• Lisa Matthews (Director), Rose Hesp, Alec Morgan: Australia in Colour (2019), 8 films, each 45 Min. Colourised films of original black-and-white footage of Australia’s film archives. An Review by Luke Buckmaster: Hugo Weaving narrates a thrilling revitalisation of history. At The Guardian, 5 March 2019 --Fr23456 (talk) 20:45, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

Why? Would you mind explaining how this would improve the article? Nickm57 (talk) 00:42, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

The first film contains a very well illustrated „short history“ since 1860. It is usefull for all readers, not only the young ones.Fr23456 (talk) 18:19, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

I have placed a welcome with links to useful articles on the wikipedia project on your talk page. Please take some time to read these. Of special interest might be the guidelines around what constitutes a reliable source. This will give you an idea why there are no TV documentaries listed here - or in most other articles. Nickm57 (talk) 20:36, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

Chronological order of settlements

The establishment of the colonial settlements in the article should reflect their historical chronological order, so Queensland should follow Tasmania, Western Australia next, Victoria, and finally South Australia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.63.186.170 (talk) 00:06, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

First World War: Emden

I just restarted on Wikipedia with a new account so I am not able to edit this article yet. Just FYI: The German battleship Emden mentioned and linked at the beginning of the chapter about the First World War was built in the early 1920s and therefore cannot be the "Emden" the article wants to refer to. 172.58.109.207 (talk) 09:49, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

I've fixed the link, thankyou.Nickm57 (talk) 10:07, 13 January 2024 (UTC)