Talk:List of anti-war films

Qualifications

How do we classify whether a film is "anti-war" in order to avoid personal bias? Shawnc 15:39, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

Any realistic war film is an "anti-war film". The entire category strikes me as unnecessary.Michael Dorosh 21:26, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

If this list was based on accuracy, South Park wouldn't be on here. User:65.185.170.172

Yes this list seems rather useless and raises the obvious question of are there "pro-war" films? Example, based on the "any realistic war film is an 'anti-war film' comment above, would that mean such movies as "Lord of the Rings" be considered pro-war? I'd say remove the list except for some very obvious "anti-war" films such as Dr. Strangelove or some other film were the writer/director has come out and said straight up this is an anti-war film as an example for a type of anti-war film. But generally this article just seems to be apart of the WikiProject Anti-War movement and lacks the unbiassed POV wikipedia claims to strive for. YesJesusLovesYou 04:51, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

This whole article is fishy... It seems that opinion constitutes which films are "anti-war" in most cases. A lot of films are not generally "anti-war" but "anti-this particular war." Flags of our Fathers is not an Anti-War film. The film clearly shows the horrors of war, but is not about criticizing America's involvement in World War II or the Pacific War. A film cannot be labeled "anti-war" simply because is shows war being bad. One could argue that The Green Berets is antiwar, for it shows the horrors of war just like any other film.Mdriver1981 03:00, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. Some should definitely be culled but in the meantime I have added some films that are more unambiguously anti-war, such as those featuring conscientious objectors as hero characters and films with more directly polemical anti-war statements, such as Sophie Scholl: The Final Days, Boy Soldiers, Things to Come, Birdy, Diary of Anne Frank, Day the Earth Stood Still, Age of Innocence (1977), Grand Treason, etc, etc. 211.26.1.17 00:41, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

User SatoriSon, please do not roll back my changes. I was removing some less relevant films and I added a number of new oens. Can you please restate these? 210.50.60.91 02:16, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

I've added them again but I have not culled any, so that I do not risk the wrath of the editors. Seriously, though, films like Mrs Miniver, which was used in the war as propaganda, have no place on this list. 210.50.60.91 02:34, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough, but an edit such as this one was pretty severe. I'm sorry I assumed it was vandalism, but that's how it looked on first review. I have re-removed your removal of The Bridge on the River Kwai, Children of Men, Flags of Our Fathers, Kingdom of Heaven (film), M*A*S*H (film), Mrs. Miniver (film), and Platoon (film). Perhaps further discussion of the others would be helpful. -- Satori Son 03:51, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Satori. I won't cull anything else. I think quality rather than quantity should be the key with lists like this though but I'll let others decide as I am not even a registered Wikipedia user. My feelings are along the lines of films that are fairly blatantly anti-war, with characters who are pacifists, anti-war activists and so on are probably the best for the purposes of the list. Films that depict the full impact of war in an attempt to shock can also inadvertantly titillate an audience, thus having the opposite effect. Having said that, it is of course, it is clear to most viewers that Paths of Glory and All Quiet on the Western Front are generally polemically anti-war. By the way, I have also just added a link to an ABC Australia article about a number of new anti-war films in production. 202.138.16.55 04:40, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

I dont think this list is useless considering alot of people would probably expect it. I dont think there's such thing as a "Pro war movie", but certainly some war movies are meant to be entertainment instead of a statement on the horrors of war. Thats why Dirty dozen isn't on this list it's entertainment (I think). Yojimbo501 (talk) 22:06, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Top Gun, Rambo: First Blood Part II, Behind Enemy Lines, 300, Black Hawk Down, Iron Eagle, Heartbreak ridge and The Hunt for Red October could all be considered "pro war" movies. Some of them are even recruiting tools for the military. Equinox137 (talk) 23:51, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I get your point (sort of), but does wikipedia have a "pro war movie" list? And couldn't something used to get recruits be considered propaganda? Yojimbo501 (talk) 20:29, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Possibly....yeah. Equinox137 (talk) 01:16, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

I wouldn't call Black Hawk Down pro-war. True, they're trying to remove a genocidal dictator, but it does go far in portraying the horrors of war. If it were a pro-war film, they wouldn't have put in that one scene where you see a man carrying a badly wounded child, and they would have not shown in such graphic detail the extraction of the bullet from Cpl. Smith. Perhaps Black Hawk Down is a bit of both the pro-war and the anti-war film. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.38.9.196 (talk) 22:29, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Agreed. Also, movies that are merely anti-Nazi or anti-Communist or anti-genocide are not necessarily anti-war. And some of the choices on the list were simply bizarre- how exactly is Taxi Driver antiwar? 67.239.63.243 (talk) 02:00, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Vandalism

Someone had attempted to delete the extensive list of anti-war films we had compiled. This list has now been restored but please keep an eye on the page to prevent further vandalism. 210.50.56.115 (talk) 05:19, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

That's because most of them aren't actually anti-war films, they're just films with a gist of "war isn't great". An anti-war film is a film that concentrates specifically on the effects of war, rather than its plot or characters. Saving Private Ryan for example concentrates on the soldiers' mission to find the title character, not on the events of war they are involved in. Come and see on the other hand concentrates on the destruction of villages and the death of civilians, rather than the ambitions of the character: there is a clear divide between such films. I continue to believe that this list needs serious modification. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.229.224.133 (talk) 09:27, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Flags of Our Fathers, Anti war?

I want a few opinions. Is it anti war? Tell me why it is or isn't. 70.108.199.3 (talk) 15:37, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

It is not because it depicted the raising of the flag on Mount Suribachi and the Iwo Jima battle, not political criticism of World War II or war in general. It depicted war realistically, but didn't push a point of view as typical anti-war movies do. There was no political message to the movie at all like there was with Lions for Lambs, Stop-loss, and similar movies. In movies such as those, you don't have to look for any sort of message, it's there and it's plain and obvious. With a movie such as Flags of our Fathers, there's only an anti-war message if you're actively looking for one as you watch it. Equinox137 (talk) 01:30, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I second that. The film didn’t push the anti-war type message as they typically do. --DavidD4scnrt (talk) 07:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I have removed a good amount of movies on this article's list. Don't get me wrong, there have been a lot of anti-war movies and some of them have been quite good, but a lot of what was on that list didn't even remotely qualify as anti-war movie. Equinox137 (talk) 05:12, 19 April 2008 (UTC) Both Flags of Our Fathers and The Americanization of Emily are anti-war films. However, they both acknowledge that a particular war may be necessary. The message in both of those films is that political leaders should not be encouraged to enter a country into war with the prospect of parks and roadways being renamed for them.Chester polarbear (talk) 03:28, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Saving Private Ryan is anti-war

To me Saving Private Ryan is a very powerful anti-war movie, because the story is about one man losing all three of his brothers in World War Two. Doesn't that sound like anti-war? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.248.237.217 (talk • contribs) 22:19, April 22, 2008 (UTC)

NO. There was no political message in SPR. There was no criticism, even subtly, of America's involvement in World War II or of war at all. Just because a movie that takes place during a war, shows realistic combat, and delves in the personal loss that families and soldiers endure....doesn't make the movie automatically anti-war. Same thing with Black Hawk Down. That movie (i.e. BHD) specifically goes out of its way to avoid the politics of the situation....i.e. "when the first round buzzes by your head, politics and all that shit go out the window." Hell, they even made a FPS game based on the movie. This is a distinct difference between movies such as Saving Private Ryan or Black Hawk Down and something like Casualties of War, Sir, No Sir, or Born on the Fourth of July. Equinox137 (talk) 03:20, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I agree with Equinox137 on both Saving Private Ryan and Black Hawk Down, but those entries keep getting re-added to this list. Let's please discuss further instead of edit-warring over it. — Satori Son 21:02, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I have just removed those entries yet again and added a genuine film, Hiroshima Mon Amour, by the same director who made Night and Fog. I have also restored a few others - it is interesting to note that certain editors consider films about Gandhi and Sophie Scholl to NOT have anti-war themes whereas he felt Black Hawk Down to be totally acceptable. Given ludicrous edits such as that, maybe this page should be locked for a while? 202.138.16.103 (talk) 10:35, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

Steven Spielberg mentioned in various interviews about the film that he wanted to make war look as unglamorous as possible. The bloody Omaha Beach scene serves as a powerful anti-war argument. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.38.9.196 (talk) 14:48, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

Fog of War Hi all, Fog of War is a Academy award winning documentary - so is a documentary Film a film and does it go on the list ? If not do we have a seperate anti war documentary article ? Bill Ladd —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bill Ladd (talk • contribs) 21:34, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

Definition of an "Anti-war film"

I see I'm not the first person to see that this is a rather subjective subject, with no no clear definition of what constitutes an anti-war film. If a film that simply accurately shows what war is like is "anti-war", then presumably War is and "anti-war article". My own POV definition would be more like a film that makes a point that was (or a specific war) is wrong and shouldn't have been fought (after all, a film could make the point that war is hell, but necessary none the less).

But in any case, its not for me, or any other editor to define what an "anti-war film" is, so I've stuck a tag on the definition in the first line. Wardog (talk) 12:27, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

2 adds and a request for comment.

I suggest adding ATTACK! and Stalag 17--both worth watching time and time again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.251.166.143 (talk) 20:40, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

Just fixed a couple of links by disambiguation, and added two films that I consider obviously qualified:

• By Dawn's Early Light (Fail-Safe 30 years later)
• Crimson Tide (1995) (Fail-Safe under water)

I have another proposed addition I'm a bit less sure of and would like to know if any of the long-time editors of this article have any comments, to wit:

• Soldier Blue (1970)

thx —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fat&Happy (talk • contribs) 07:47, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

A suggestion on how to classify an antiwar film.

Authors of this article should provide citations from reliable sources containing statements from important film staff to decide whether it is an anti-war film or not. Otherwise it is just a subjective interpretation of each film made by individuals who have no participation in the film(thus no authority to decide) which makes the list useless as a reference. This could be done by citing interviews where the film staff states their ideas behind the movie, in order to decide whether it was made consciously an anti-war film or not. Otherwise it should be classified as a war film, or more specifically: a world war 2 film, iraq war film, etc.

Like others, I raise the question of what then is a pro-war film? Are films which are not anti-war pro-war? Who is to decide? My personal view is that these categories should be unnecessary, we cannot classify every movie into "anti" and "pro" films, such as classifying a film criticizing the American government as an anti-american film or a pro-religion film, etc. Most of these movies can be classified as simply war films. Additionally I would say that these classifications may or may not contain negative connotations for each individual viewer which may inhibit the viewer from wanting to see the film or to look at the film without a biased predisposition.

A war film will always involve controversial issues, which in turn will always be subject to individual interpretation; such as the debate of whether the nuclear bombing of Japan was justified or not. That is, was it primarily a way to put an effective and quick end to the war or was it also decided upon as an opportunity to test the bomb so that war specialists could do research on the effects it would have on a population? In my view it is entirely up to the viewer of these films to decide. Hence, I suggest this article either be integrated into the war film article under a sub-section(removing those films which cannot be cited as being antiwar), or be deleted entirely until the authors of the article can provide citations from the film staff itself stating that the film was meant to be against war in the general sense. Thank you.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Yyunn (talk • contribs) 11:45, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Rambo series?

I've heard from Sylvester Stallone himself that the movies Rambo III (and presumeably the other movies) are antiwarmovies. they do have very brutal scenes that point in that direction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.120.172.21 (talk) 20:57, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Gallipoli

This is the only film I ever saw that I can classify as anti-war. When i Saw SPR as a teen, my mother was angry that I cheered on the Americans killing Germans, which I admit in my naivety was sorta wrong. Yea Germany was the 'bad guy' but the young being killed were no less 'bad' or more 'good' than any other grunt. With age though, I matured and began to see war for what it was and I did not see war films in the same light. This was especially true after watching Gallipoli. It shows the perspective of young men eager to fight, a sentiment I had some of as a youth. That was slowly ground down throughout the film, culminating in a a shocking and abrupt ending. Watch this movie if you haven't and tell me if you agree. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.108.3.241 (talk) 12:38, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

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