Talk:Alexander Kartveli

Birth date/place

I have changed the birhtplace information: Tbilisi to Tiflis and Republic of Georgia to Russian Empire as Georgia was a part of Russian Empire at the time. DesmanaMoschata (talk) 14:45, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

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Major projects

I feel like the A-10 qualifies, and is probably more commonly known today than anything else Republic created, being the only one continuing in USAF service Darthkenobi0||talk 10:21, 1 October 2017 (UTC)

I remove Gloster Javelin, not Alexander Kartveli project. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.191.44.68 (talk) 21:53, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

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Kartveli Designing the A-10 Thunderbolt II

I was recently wondering why there isn't a part in the article where Kartveli designed the A-10, Viewed history, and found out they`re reverting edits on the A-10, Why is this happening? I was thinking about adding how he designed the A-10 and it said to go over to the Talk Page and discuss it, It`s clear how he designed it and not Pierre Sprey,I wanted to ask this before actually writing a section for it. MaxtheManepic3345 (talk) 00:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

Historically, the claims that Kartveli designed the A-10 were rooted in Georgian nationalism, being spread by sources linked to Georgia. There was a long discussion about it somewhere, but I can't seem to find it. Perhaps BilCat would know where the discussion took place.

It may be worth looking into the editing patterns of the editors who added the A-10 to the list. I've noticed that some of them seem to have been abandoned after adding the A-10 to the list, which could be a sign of sockpuppetry. - ZLEA _T\^C 01:26, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

It does kind of make sense that it would be due to georgian nationalism since he designed things like the P-47 and F-105 and georgia wanting to just glorify him or something also the part where people say it was Pierre Sprey (which it wasn't,He only worked for grumman if i recall correctly,Fairchild Republic and grumman are two different companies) And there is a massive argument about who designed it,But most likely it was Kartveli but i do understand it being reverted since there are massive disputes about who designed it MaxtheManepic3345 (talk) 02:51, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

It was reverted because the consensus is to exclude the A-10 from the list. If you have some evidence that he did help design the A-10, then I recommend that you try to get the consensus changed. - ZLEA _T\^C 05:38, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

I found it. - ZLEA _T\^C 01:28, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

I haven't followed this discussion after a longer absence from editing this article. Some of the claims are not truthful and include rather weird, fallacious conclusions, like "nationalism". That may be the case for some, but not all. I would suggest to take a closer look at the sources anyway, before drawing any assumptions. There is the website "alexanderkartveli.com", that was created by the Georgian based "Alexander Kartveli Association", which likes to promote the idea that the A-10 was designed by Alexander Kartveli. However they too, mostly refer to magazines and statements made by associations and sources from the US, or abroad. ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRHSJad0PvM&t=47s ) They are partially also just bluntly quoting Wikipedia. That is the only "Georgian-linked" "conspiracy" I could find. Now, sock-puppetry and what others are doing is a different matter. But not every action is, should and can be labeled "nationalism", when information to a person or subject is added by people from the same birthplace, regardless of wheter they are wrong and there is some back and forth in the process. Most of the time, its just people thinking they are ight and being stubborn. I was guilty of that myself. Nothing also just falls from the sky. The initial inclusion and edits were first and foremost rooted in claims and statements, picked up from various sources. I was one of the editors who worked on, expanded the article and included the A-10 on the list of contributions because some references, other than the alexanderkartveli.com website, stated that he was, albeit not specifying to what degree exactly, involved in the A-10s development and/or consultant to and/or part of the Fairchild Hiller leadership at the time. Like mentioned in journals or Air Corps News Letter, for example volume 52 of 1969. Other Editors eventualy chimed in and disputed the reliablity of some sources. Which is absolutely fine. I haven't really made an effort since, to discuss or find better ones as skimming through, this apparently has become a loaded topic. Apparently even before my longer absence from this article, an edit war erupted over the A-10 designer question. There was admittedly not a dedicated enough attempt from my side to collect evidence for this article, after catching a mention or two and some literary reference for the first time. I will eventualy collect all the material I've stumbled accross and put them on the talk page for us all to decide wheter or not they were reliable. TheMightyGeneral (talk) 09:40, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

@MaxtheManepic3345 Don't be discouraged by that. If you think it's a good enough source, you can share it. Maybe if you're not sure, do it first here on the talk page. TheMightyGeneral (talk) 09:59, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

He designed the fucking A-10

Where is the part about him designing the A-10 ? Barteg1 (talk) 17:43, 17 February 2023 (UTC)

@Barteg1: You can help by providing a reliable source that describes him as the designer. ~ Pbritti (talk) 18:31, 17 February 2023 (UTC)

A-10 Karteveli

I`ve found a few sources that Karteveli designed the A-10:First one is this http://idaaf.com/alexander-kartveli-aircraft-engineer-and-design-genius/ Second one is this:https://mod.gov.ge/en/news/read/1898/alexander-kartveli-and-usa-air-force%E2%80%9D Third is this:http://www.alexanderkartveli.com/a10 Fourth is this:https://planetags.com/blogs/planetags-blog/a-10-thunderbolt-the-turbofan-tank-buster Plus he worked for Fairchild Republic AND Designed the P-47 Thunderbolt and multiple other aircraft like the F-84 and F-105 designed by Fairchild Republic so it would make sense he designed the A-10 since he designed multiple other aircraft made by republic, And Pierre Sprey never designed the A-10, Or the F-15 since BOTH of them were made by different companies, F-15 was McDonnell Douglass, A-10 was Fairchild, No way he could design the A-10. Plus he came up with the concept of the F-XX which is an incredibly bad concept and he was laughed out of the room for it and he`s also a known fighter mafia member.MaxtheManepic3345 (talk) 17:20, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

None of these sources are reliable:

• [1] The only sources given in this amateur-written article are Wikipedia and a Georgian government source.
• [2] This is the Georgian government source cited in the previous source. Georgia has historically been pushing the claim that Kartveli created the A-10 because Kartveli was Georgian.
• [3] This is very clearly a Kartveli fan site.
• [4] This is a blog which was created to advertise a product sold by PlaneTags.

We need reliable sources to back any claims made on Wikipedia. - ZLEA _T\^C 17:51, 19 March 2023 (UTC)