Talk:2009 Atlantic hurricane season/Archive 2

Article (just a friendly reminder)

The article is already a redirect. Let's keep some restraint this year. We don't want a bunch of articles that have to be re-written significant later on. If you do want to create an article, make sure it is well-sourced, and the content is comprehensive. Welcome to the hurricane season. ♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 15:29, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Since TD1/Ana is not expected to impact land at all, I don't see a need for an article until the TCR comes out. Definitely thorough reviews are necessary from sandboxes before an article is created. CrazyC83 (talk) 17:52, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

There was some rain/wind in North Carolina. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 17:56, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

I've worked on the article in a sandbox and have now published it. I did so because the article is long enough (7.6 kb) and putting it into the mainspace allows for more people to edit it, especially while interest is high. Cyclonebiskit 18:02, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

It is not necessary and not desirable to publish articles on every new system - especially ones not expected to do anything. I think this should be merged. Potapych (talk) 20:04, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Especially if it weakens and does not attain tropical storm status, there is no need in such an article. It should've been developed more before it was published. ♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 20:07, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Why not? –Juliancolton | ^Talk 22:33, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

I already know what the next link in this thread is going to be, so I'll hijack it. Can't we just work on it in a sandbox for the time being, until the TCR comes out? Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 23:12, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Sure, but interest in the article peaks while the storm is active. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 23:20, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

And shower activity in Bahamas. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 22:24, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Benard got an article while Jade does not; and a lot of weak storms that hasn't impact land have an article while some old but devastating storm don't have an article. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 23:18, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Many old devastating storms are just start class. I know you all are just itching to create new articles, just to start new articles (as if there is a wikipedia gold medal for creating new articles), but please remember this project covers all tropical cyclones, not just the bright, shiny new ones. Thegreatdr (talk) 20:28, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

I guess this TD that did nothing, had no name, and was totally trivial is keeping its article. New articles about unimportant storms shows just how uncreative the template for TC articles is. I know it makes me tired of this project. Potapych (talk) 20:54, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

A few of us are Potapych. If you'd like, you can withdraw from the project for a spell, like HurricaneHink did, and/or help with other related projects, such as the Meteorology project, which needs all the help it can get. =P Thegreatdr (talk) 20:58, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Feel free to work on more "important" articles, then. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 20:59, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

No thanks.

Additionally, I didn't agree with having a Norbert article, but if any storm should receive an article from last year, I guess it was that one. It's funny how the death toll in the article says 8, and the official report says 5. Did three people come back to life? This just shows how bad this system of creating shiny new articles is, and how news reports shouldn't be given much importance as sources. Potapych (talk) 21:05, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

So the strongest tropical cyclone to ever affect the western coast of Baja California shouldn't have an article? What should have an article, then? –Juliancolton | ^Talk 21:09, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

The article says western Baja California peninsula. Not west coast. Is anyone reading these articles? Should we be responsible for disseminating these inaccuracies? Potapych (talk) 22:25, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

If I had the rainfall information, I'd have created storm total rainfall graphics for Norbert. I do feel that landfalling storms should all have their own articles. Even after all these years of debating others, and reading their debates, I still haven't reached a firm conclusion about articles for what we used to call "fish storms," which the youth of today seem to call "fish spinners," which I must admit is better imagery. =) Thegreatdr (talk) 21:11, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Lately that criteria has meant that every storm that creates a few sprinkles gets an article. Tropical cyclones are facts of life, but most are not exceptional. Potapych (talk) 22:25, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Exceptional or not, an article can exist if there is significant coverage in secondary, reliable sources; considering that TD 1 was covered by hundreds of news stories, and will continue to be documented in coming months, it is therefore "notable" by Wikipedia's standards. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 22:41, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

I wrote the Norbert article because the NHC forcasted Norbert to strike Mexico. Besides, all named tropical cyclones are notable. Leave Message ,Yellow Evan home , User:Yellow Evan/Sandbox

Somewhat TD 1 caused rain to Sable Island as extratropical remnants. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 23:19, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

The point was not that the depression didn't do absolutely anything, more that there shouldn't be so much of a push for writing on everything new. Remember, quality, not quantity, which the project seems to forget. And Yellow Evan, no, the project actually agreed that not all named tropical cyclones are notable. --♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 23:57, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

Seasonal forecasts

Do we use Tropical Storm Risk for seasonal forecasts? Darren23 (talk) 01:05, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Don't see why you couldn't. Just attribute it to its source, and provide the appropriate inline reference. Thegreatdr (talk) 11:56, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

I can see why not - They have the basin boundrys wrong. They have Aus as 100E to 170E, where as offically it is 90E - 160E. I havent checked other boundrys Jason Rees (talk) 14:56, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

It seems like a fairly credible source, though indeed such a glaring inaccuracy (if true) is concerning. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 16:49, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Record for no named storms in the Atlantic

What is the record for no named storms in the Atlantic? It looks like the first named storm might be some time in August. Here is a NOAA graph showing the averages for storms per hundred years. http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/gifs/peakofseason.gif --jwalling (talk) 22:52, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

It's amazing what a few years of over-activity will do to people's psyches...I remember when it was unusual to get a storm in June or July. For underactivity, try 1914 Atlantic hurricane season...only one named storm, and it was in mid-September. -RunningOnBrains^(talk) 22:57, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

I find a few A storm that was named in August that was highly important, Andrew and Allen. So this time it could be a disaster Cat 5 coming. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 05:24, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

• That is significant, as there was also a big El Nino that year. Also there was a big earthquake in Southern California too. I have always felt these things are based on a cycle, and not global warming. This year a Big El Nino is forming, and there was a large earthquake in Baja California yesterday.--Subman758 (talk) 15:02, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

First time since 1988 that no tropical systems formed in June OR July.166.84.1.3 (talk) 04:23, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

No, if I recall correctly Hurricane Andrew formed in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean on August 16th, 1992.--Subman758 (talk) 14:57, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

The subtropical storm in April 1992 counts as a named storm, so 1992 is an early starting season Cyclonebiskit (talk) 15:00, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Does Not!!! Subtropical cyclones were not named at the time, and were not named until 2001; had it been named, it would have been Subtropical Storm Andrew.--Subman758 (talk) 17:34, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Most of the agencys including NOAA, Define named storm as a storm above 33kts that were Tropical or Subtropical.Jason Rees (talk) 23:22, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

So should the lead be changed to something like

Although the season started early with the formation of Tropical Depression One on May 28, it turned into one of the quietest starts to a season since at least 1992.

For the first time since 2000, no storms formed in June or July. Similarly, no named storms formed before July 31, the first time since 2004.[1]

crandles (talk) 11:04, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

One tropical depression is quieter than two tropical depressions in 1992 so since 1987? On 9th Aug it looks like quieter than 1987 or any year since to me. crandles (talk) 11:12, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Now there are two...but still,the lack of named storms this late is of greater relevance to the article than their not forming in specific months...so I hope third time's the charm and my new edit won't be reverted!(Think about what future readers will consider important about this season's start).166.84.1.2 (talk) 06:08, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Okay just to clear this up NOT COUNTING TROPICAL DEPRESSIONS OR UNNAMED STORMS (Since they are not named) THE LAST YEAR THIS LATE IN THE YEAR (Assuming T.S Ana forms before August 28th) A TROPICAL SYSTEM WAS NAMED IN THE ATLANTIC WAS: Tropical Storm Arthur in 1984. Now does this count as a valad record I think so since it has been 25 years. It cant go by "Oh what if this unnamed storm was named..." Okay it wasent even if it had T.S force winds the last named storm to form this late in the year was T.S Arthur. (August 28 – September 6. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 13:15, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

We will just follow what the NHC says in their monthly report.Jason Rees (talk) 22:32, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Im all for waiting for Ana to form into a tropical storm and for an NHC statement as well before any jumps are made. Just as a quick note, I have been following TD2 and it looks like its hitting a lot of dry air, so TD3 may form into a TS before TD2 does, the fact is though we cant crystalball it. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 18:35, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

It simple We have to wait for an NHC/WMO statement. Anyway there has been a lot of Dry air about this year, but TD 02 is going to be opening up the way for what should become TD 3 - Its gonna be a few intresting weeks in all basins as we reach the NHEM Peak. Jason Rees (talk) 22:45, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Add 90L to article?

it is widely believed this was at least a TD if not TS. Here's a good source for it, with a professional report on it as a source. I'll leave it up to someone more 'in charge' of this article to decide. "However, during the night of 22 May, the storm entered a region of low vertical shear near the coast and quickly began to organize, despite slightly cool sea surface temperatures. The storm reached its peak of 1003 millibars and 35 knots as it moved ashore. Landfall occurred at 1200 UTC on 23 May near the Alabama/Mississippi border."

(92L is discussed here as well, but personally I think "subtropical" named storms should just be thrown in the trash. Too much ambiguity. 92l formed in like 17C water, meaning it was more likely a polar low, though even nhc said it had some warm core characteristics)

Entry: http://www.wunderground.com/blog/Weather456/comment.html?entrynum=252

90L report(pdf): http://download465.mediafire.com/yjzngdnh0ndg/en5t5utyzmz/TCR_AL_902.pdf

-Winter123 (talk) 01:51, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

• Need NHC to add it in, they are the RSMC (Anhamirak) 67.87.69.243 (talk) 02:09, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

As Anhamirak said we can not mention it in the article as it is not an offical storm of the 2009 AHS. Also dont forget that INVESTS come and go all the time.Jason Rees (talk) 02:26, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

I prepared this section and just need more corrections and impact.

90L formed on May 15 on a developing surface trough and originated on May 5 from ITCZ and moved westward across the Atlantic basin. On May 14, while a frontal system accelerating across Florida peninsula and created deep flow across the system and eventually producing shear over it which made the tropical wave drifting northward. On May 16, deep convection developed over it and it became better organized around the circulation. However, at that time no low level circulation developed and its central pressure remained high (1015 milibars), but as it reached Cuba a low formed and which spawned a low level circulation. By May 18, the shear increased and that is when it upgraded into a tropical disturbance and designated it 90L. Strong wind shear made this storm difficult to strengthen and the storm became disorganized. The low soon became disorganized and its deep convection decreased. A frontal system over Florida produced shear on it and eventually absorbed the low. However, the low pressure center is not completely absorbed. On May 20, the low level circulation center formed again and a weak but broad circulation developed, at that time it is centered in the northeastern region of the Gulf. On the following day, minimal convection formed around the weak circulation. By that time, it developed a weak low pressure and eventually became better organized. On May 22, National Hurricane Center began to issue the probabilities on the low and it was also being upgraded into a invest. Convection began to form around the storm and the low level circulation became better defined. That night, convection flare up rapidly around a cut off circulation and its old convection has became its convective band as the storm grew. In the 1200z advisory, National Hurricane Center upgrade the chance of formation to "high" as it rapidly organized. The next morning, Deep convection formed around the center and its got better defined. Despite having a high chance of formation, it was not upgraded to a tropical depression nor a tropical storm. The Invest made landfall near Dauphin Island that day and moved inland Bayou La Batre and reached its peak winds of 35kts and lowest air pressure of 1003 milibars. As it moved inland, its deep convection dissipated and became disorganized. On May 24, it became extratropical and became better organized with its remnant circulation clear. As it move into dry air it began to rapidly weaken, and by next day, it became disorganized and starting to move towards the northeast.

HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 05:10, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Even if the given link were an authoritative source (which it isn't), the day we stop going by what the NHC says is the day all our articles become a big, inconsistent mess. I am wholly against this addition. -RunningOnBrains^(talk) 06:58, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

If you want to make an article out of it, fine. That's what the non-tropical storms project is for. But it cannot be called a TC unless NHC calls it one. Thegreatdr (talk) 20:23, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

90L was a tropical storm. closed LLC with deep convection right over the center, looked great. Likely the only tropical storm this season and it was not upgraded. A stain on the nhc record that needs to be revised later this season. Matthurricane (talk) 07:51, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Trust me, there are bigger "stains" within HURDAT, which will be rectified in the Atlantic hurricane reanalysis, such as missed hurricanes, like in September 1992. Thegreatdr (talk) 19:54, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

No named storms since...

Because it's becoming an issue, I figured I'd bring it here. The NHC explicitly said the following about the history of named storms before August:

SINCE 1944...THERE HAVE BEEN THIRTEEN YEARS IN WHICH A
TROPICAL STORM WAS NOT OBSERVED BY THE END OF JULY...MOST RECENTLY
IN 2004.

Now, from looking at best track data, we know for a fact that this is not true; although Alex in 2004 did form on July 31, it was not upgraded to a tropical storm until August 1. How do we remedy this situation? -RunningOnBrains^(talk) 16:19, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

simple No named storms in june/july Jason Rees (talk) 16:25, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

If Alex formed in July but was named in August, won't there be no named storms in July? If this is true, wont the sentence in the article be right? Darren23 (Contribs) 16:34, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

The key word their using is named storm, by that they mean no system attained tropical (or subtropical) storm status during the entire month. Alex did form at 1800 UTC on July 31 but was not named until August 1, so it does not count towards the July storm total. Cyclonebiskit (talk) 18:58, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Inconsistency between articles about record activity

This article lists the 1983 Atlantic hurricane season as having the least named storms on record. If you go to that article, it lists the 1914 Atlantic hurricane season as the least named storms. I think what we're trying to say is record low activity for the era of weather satellites, but this should be mentioned, or made consistent in some way. -RunningOnBrains^(talk) 16:46, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

The bit right above it says since 1950; I figure whoever made it assumed people would assume 1950- for all of them. --Golbez (talk) 17:30, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Just when I thought it was since 1944, when the recon era began. =) Don't expect 1983 to keep those numbers when the reanalysis pays the year a visit. Thegreatdr (talk) 18:00, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Since this is relevant IMO so ill post here - is this ok to do?? Jason Rees (talk) 23:24, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Ana

We now have Ana active. Since it could threaten Florida in the near future, should Ana be given an article? If so, then I would be happy to create one. Cheers, Dylan620 (contribs, logs)^{help us!} 13:20, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Do we have to have one now? Can't we wait until it threatens land? Darren23 (Contribs) 13:36, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Why not wait 24 hours and then see? --Anhamirak 13:42, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Wait a bit to see what it does first. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 14:13, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Wait for at least the Tropical Storm Warnings to be put up as otherwise it makes the season article redundant.Jason Rees (talk) 16:19, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

By the way, the running best track upgraded Ana (then TD2) to a 35 kt tropical storm back on August 12 for a while. ftp://ftp.nhc.noaa.gov/atcf/tcweb/invest_al022009.invest CrazyC83 (talk) 14:22, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Wait until it actually has impact, Felicia is a good example, I jumped the gun with that one. Cyclonebiskit (talk) 21:13, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Late Season Start

Not counting depressions or extratropical unnamed storms the last season that had its first named storm this late was 1992 with Hurricane Andrew (It was named on August 16, or 17th) is this notible? It is a 17 year diffrence.

Note: I am talking about the date when this storm was named. Ana was named on August 15th. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 14:51, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

If you look at the first tropical or subtropical cyclone with 35 kt winds, the last time the season started so late was 1984 (STS 1 on August 18) as 1992 had an April subtropical storm. It is possible though that those stats may change in the best track if the May low in the Gulf gets reclassified as a tropical storm. CrazyC83 (talk) 20:54, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Subtropical storms are not normally named. As i said I am talking about the LAST TIME A SEASON STARTED SO LATE WITH A NAMED STORM STS1 in 1984 was not named and Subtropical Storm One in 1992 was not named. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 20:53, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

NHC count Subtropical Storms as Named Storms regardless of weather they were acctully named or not so thus 1984 is the last time a season started so late.Jason Rees (talk) 01:09, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

You are right, subtropical storms can be named and The World Meteorological Organization uses a set of names for Tropical systems every year but they did not count "Subtropical 1" as a named storm. See: Tropical cyclone naming for more.

Anyways Hurricane Andrew in 1992 was named on August 16, or 17th while Tropical storm Ana was August 15th, the 1992 hurricane season started one to two days day later when Hurricane Andrew was named on the 16 or 17th. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 23:02, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

You are not listening to us, The NHC count Subtropical Storms as Named Storms regardless of weather they were acctully named or not so thus 1984 is the last time a season started so late.Jason Rees (talk) 03:26, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Okay count "Subtropical 1" in 1984 that lasted August 18 – August 21 assuming its August 18th that it got tropical storm force winds that was the FIRST Tropical storm strenth storm of that year, Andrew still formed and was named between August 16th and August 18th. This seasons first named storm was on August 15th.

Dates the named storms were named:

• August 15th, 2009: Ana
• August 16/17, 1992: Andrew
• August 18th, 1984: Subtropicalstorm 1

Knowledgekid87 (talk) 00:02, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

I actully found out that subtropical storms were not named until 2001 or 2002 according to these wiki articles see: 1992 April subtropical storm and Subtropical cyclone Since 1992 and 1984 are before that date they were not named. Hey im not trying to be a let down it would have been a better feat if it had been 1984 but facts are facts. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 00:08, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Bill

Typical - you wait ten weeks for a named storm and then two come along at once!--Keith Edkins ( Talk ) 21:03, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

And a third may be brewing in the Gulf (currently 91L). If that one develops though, it would likely require an immediate article for TD4/Claudette. CrazyC83 (talk) 03:28, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Eh, not immediate, we're trying to limit the number of articles as they can easily become quite unnecessary. Cyclonebiskit (talk) 03:30, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Pretty close, as there would already be land impacts involved and tropical storm warnings would be immediately required for the northeastern Gulf Coast. CrazyC83 (talk) 03:38, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Yes, but at that point, is it really necessary to make an article? Cyclonebiskit (talk) 03:40, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

If it's close to impacting land, of course. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 03:50, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

To save any pointless arguments now - Lets see what happens when it happens. After all this argument has been dragging on since before the start of the year. Jason Rees (talk) 03:57, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

TD-4 a TS ???

Oh please there is no cyclonic circulation. NOAA and the NHC are going on a naming binge just like last year because they want their precious predictions to be right. So they can continue to tout this Global Waring is causing more hurricanes crap.--Subman758 (talk) 14:48, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Take it to the Hurricane Wiki please which is the appropiate place not here Jason Rees (talk) 14:51, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Why

Why can't we include the current predictions for active storms? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60'smusic (talk • contribs) .

Because of something called WP:Crystal which states wikipedia is not a Crystall ball.Jason Rees (talk) 15:58, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Individual articles

We should probably get Claudette its own article any storm threatening or impacting land is usually notable, so im curious if anyone is currently working on this. -Marcusmax(speak) 18:31, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm actually close to finishing the article :x sorry for not mentioning this before. Cyclonebiskit (talk) 18:35, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Without a doubt. This thing has erupted pretty quickly and reports that flooding in low level of the impact zone is iminent. Brudder Andrusha (talk) 19:09, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Well written?

Its just me perhaps, but I'm just going to boldly say that the entire first paragraph needs to be rewritten and rephrased because I think the choice of words and "style of writing" flat out sucks. I have been reading wiki for years and I don't think this article is on the wiki-level at all. I know these three storms have formed quickly but come on. It's kind of disappointing. Altarboy420 (talk) 08:40, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

I decided to do a re-write for the introductory part of the article. I merely thought that the first was poorly written and am not quite sure that my version is any better but I gave it a whirl. Altarboy420 (talk) 09:20, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The biggest problem with leads in season articles is that they do not come together during the course of the season that well. Jason Rees (talk) 09:35, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Bill

Does anyone have an article ready to go for our rapidly intensifying hurricane? It seems highly probable that Bill is going to strike land somewhere. Altarboy420 (talk) 16:51, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

It looks notable enough now to make the article as Bill is the first hurricane of the year, however as for a possible landfall Juliancolton said "If it's close to impacting land, of course" It is currently predicted that bill remains over the atlantic for at least the next 3 or 4 days. Knowledgekid87 (talk) 13:03, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

First of all, it's not really Rapidly intensifying, and can we wait until it gets close enough before making one, we dont want to jump the gun on this one, like Felicia, which was the 1st major hurricane and was predicted to impact Hawaii, but not much impact though. This might end up like a Fabian, or a Fish storm. Darren23 (Contribs) 17:20, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

We should probably give Ana an article now instead, I would imagine someone is already working on this. As for Bill only time will tell if it needs an article or not. -Marcusmax(speak) 19:37, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

You imagined correctly. I'm currently working on Ana's article Cyclonebiskit (talk) 19:42, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Lets see what the planes come back and tell us about BILL tommorrow before we consider an article.Jason Rees (talk) 20:38, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Even if it bombs out to a major hurricane, it is still at least 3 or 4 days from land impact - if there is any. CrazyC83 (talk) 21:00, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Is anyone actually working on a good Bill article? Darren23 (Contribs) 00:42, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Juliancolton is planning on writing it once the storm becomes more of a threat to land. Cyclonebiskit (talk) 00:53, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Indeed; I have a sandbox started at User:Juliancolton/Hurricane Bill. Feel free to help. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 03:21, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

I've added initial preparations for Bermuda with reference. Brudder Andrusha (talk) 00:46, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks! FWIW, I plan on publishing Bill after the 11pm advisory tonight. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 01:11, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

The 11:00PM advisory just came out =) Knowledgekid87 (talk) 22:41, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Hurricane Bill (2009) ←  Done –Juliancolton | ^Talk 03:55, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

template "current disaster" on hurricane bill section

i put the tag "current distaster" on "hurricane bill"'s section. why was it reverted as "uneeded?" i realize the article is updated VERY frequently but it still deserves a tag until the storm dissipates. other current disasters/events typically get one. --98.116.115.180 (talk) 21:09, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

it is not needed as Bill is currently not of a threat to land and no other disasters/events dont ussually get a template.Jason Rees (talk) 21:11, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

There is a great possibility that this is going to damage to Bermuda. Preparations in that country are on the way. Brudder Andrusha (talk) 00:36, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

One but not Ana?

Just out of interest - any reason TD One has its own article but TS Ana does not? Seems a bit bizarre IMHO. Thanks, Sarsaparilla39 (talk) 12:58, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

No one has got around to writing one yet.Jason Rees (talk) 13:09, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm working on it right now Cyclonebiskit (talk) 13:11, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Ana's First "Life"

Was Ana really a TS the first time, or was it a depression? The timeline currently shows that Ana was a depression in its first "life", is this true, or is it just a person adding false info to the timeline? Hurricanekiller1994 (talk) 22:57, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

According to the Running Best Track, which is quite possibly the final best track, Ana was a Tropical Storm for 12 hours on August 12. Track Cyclonebiskit (talk) 23:05, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Format

This may have been discussed since there are so many storms, if so I apologize for bringing up an old issue.

I am wondering why we don't use a format like the one below - It works much better on screens with wide resolution - and acts very similarly for people with smaller resolutions. --Trödel 15:04, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

---

---

This page created to discuss format

Hurricane Bill

Main article: Hurricane Bill (2009)

Hurricane Bill
Current storm status Category 3 hurricane (1-min mean)
Satellite image Forecast map
As of:	11 a.m. AST (1500 UTC) August 20
Location:	22.6°N 61.7°W ± 10 nm About 380 mi (610 km) N of the Leeward Islands About 695 mi (1120 km) SSE of Bermuda
Sustained winds:	105 knots | 120 mph | 195 km/h (1-min mean) gusting to 130 knots | 150 mph | 240 km/h
Pressure:	951 mbar (hPa) | 28.08 inHg
Movement:	NW at 16 kt | 18 mph | 30 km/h
See more detailed information.

Late on August 12, a strong tropical wave associated with an area of low pressure moved off the African coast with deep layers of moisture observed. Later that day, the wave became better organized with a low level circulation forming, but without any significant convection. That night, the area of convection became more concentrated, but wind shear increased since the previous advisory. On August 14, the disturbance strengthened more and its convective bands became stronger with better circulation, indicating that the disturbance would soon become a tropical depression. Later, on August 15, even though some of its deep convection dissipated, it was officially named Bill, the second named storm of the 2009 season. Early on August 17, an eye appeared on visible and infrared loops and Bill strengthened into a hurricane, the first of the 2009 season. Bill then briefly underwent an eyewall replacement cycle, as the eye had contracted to a half its original size. However, strengthening continued and on the evening of August 18, and Bill rapidly strengthened into a major hurricane. Current computer model forecasts are showing a possibility of Hurricane Bill or its remnants making landfall in Atlantic Canada early next week.

Current storm information

As of 11 a.m. AST (1500 UTC) August 20, Hurricane Bill is located within 10 nautical miles of 22.6°N 61.7°W, about 380 mi (610 km) north of the Leeward Islands and about 695 mi (1120 km) south-southeast of Bermuda. Maximum sustained winds are 105 knots (120 mph, 195 km/h), with stronger gusts. Minimum central pressure is 951 mbar (hPa; 28.08 InHg), and the system is moving northwest at 16 kt (18 mph, 30 km/h). Hurricane force winds extend up to 105 miles (165 km) from the center of Bill, and tropical storm force winds up to 260 miles (415 km) from the center.

Watches and warnings As of 11 a.m. AST (1500 UTC) August 20, the following warnings and watches are in effect: Hurricane watch Bermuda For latest official information see: The NHC's latest public advisory on Hurricane Bill. The NHC's latest forecast/advisory on Hurricane Bill.

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Timeline - trace change in category

I understand that my suggestion may be difficult to implement, but in my view, it conveys additional information at a single glance:

Suggestion: Replace the single category color (peak category) by the day-by-day actual category color.

-- Schewek (talk) 14:14, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Its a nice idea but as you said it would be difficult to implement across the basins.Jason Rees (talk) 15:06, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

The graphics's is much too small for that. --Matthiasb (talk) 19:34, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Danny

The rainfall graphics will be delayed, pending how NHC wishes to consider the convective, non-frontal low which formed just north of Danny this morning. It is unclear how the storm was treated this morning in real-time will hold up in post-analysis. After all, there was no frontal zone analyzed with hundreds of miles of Danny, or the low which formed just to its north this morning. That low just linked up with a front a few hours ago near New England. Thegreatdr (talk) 20:47, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

Danny sandbox

I am working on Danny. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 05:50, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

I think Juliancolton (talk · contribs) is working on it. Darren23 ^{1000 Edtis!} 13:02, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

But I started first and I have done a lot. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 19:17, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Remember it's not a competition. I personally am against an article until the TCR comes out, since we really don't know much about the storm, especially during and after its dissipation (rumor has it that it may have re-formed before it hit New England).-RunningOnBrains^(talk) 18:20, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Oy gevalt. Thegreatdr (talk) 18:31, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Maybe merge Danny article to 2009AHS section? HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 05:06, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Erika

So who has a work page up and running for Erika yet? -Marcusmax(speak) 23:49, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

No need for it yet, a weak TS which hasn't affected anything. Darren23 ^{My Contributions} 23:52, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Even if, its good to know ahead of time whos working on these storms so there are no conflicts later down the line. -Marcusmax(speak) 02:13, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Erika needs an article

It says on the page for the season, that Erika has made landfall. Doesn't that mean she needs her own article?

Lets wait until the storm dissipates and then make an article, if necessary. --Anhamirak 01:17, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Editing Needed

Hey guys, I was viewing this article and noticed the excessive amount of information for Tropical Storm Danny. Maybe we should shorten that part of the article? I my opinion, the amonut of text contained for Tropical Storm Danny is very unappleasing to the eye. Would it be a good idea to make an article for Danny? (Tropical Cyclone K (talk) 20:52, 6 September 2009 (UTC))

Danny used to have an article, but User:Darren23 merged it. I would recommend speaking with him before undoing the merge. Cheers, Dylan620 (contribs, logs)^{help us!} 20:57, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

As a matter of fact, I'll contact Darren myself about the matter. --Dylan620 (contribs, logs)^{help us!} 20:58, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Danny was merged due to its poor quality, I made that decision per the WPTC IRC. Also, I see that HurricaneSpin (talk · contribs) added too much information to the season article.Darren23 ^{My Contributions} 21:02, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Wat did danny do to deserve an article? - It didnt make landfall so i dont see the need for an article.Jason Rees (talk) 21:10, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Danny should be put back into it's own article just look at Tropical Storm Josephine (2008) if anything Danny had a bigger impact than that, killing one person. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 23:04, 6 September 2009 (AT)

If you all are willing to write the article and pass it through GA, go for it. Otherwise, don't bother. Thegreatdr (talk) 17:55, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

It's sloppy looking, just a huge clump of text. As it did kill someone, and its remnants caused heavy rain throughout New England it would make sense to give it an article. -Marcusmax(speak) 02:07, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

Hurricane Fred

Shouldn't Fred have a sat pic? Hurricanekiller1994 (talk) 17:49, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

Will do so . --Anhamirak 21:30, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

I think the ACE needs to be updated as well, but I don't know where to look for the source of this. 71.174.22.121 (talk) 15:12, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps Fred should have an article, as it did affect Cape Verde as a tropical wave, and its a somewhat record setting storm, as its only the third major hurricane known east of 35°W and is the strongest known hurricane so far southeast on record. Hurricanekiller1994 (talk) 15:41, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

No Impact whilst a TC = No article Jason Rees (talk) 15:52, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Now it is a major hurricane, though. Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 17:38, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

In light of this storm's rare location and intensity, this storm should probably have its own article. It can wait until the storm is dissipated though. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs)/(e-mail) 15:56, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

I second giving Fred an article as it is a notable hurricane. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 12:07, 9 September 2009 (AT)

I'm not sure, but Fred may have impacted Cape Verde as a depression. Can anyone confirm or disprove this? Hurricanekiller1994 (talk) 17:31, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

The NHC said[1]: LOCALLY HEAVY SHOWERS AND STRONG GUSTY WINDS ARE LIKELY OVER THE SOUTHERN CAPE VERDE ISLANDS TODAY. And I started to make the article yesterday (better than my old articles). HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 17:41, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Fred was the easternmost major hurricane on record in the atlantic basin and became a major hurricane only 12 hours after forming. It should get an article no matter what. 76.29.112.198 (talk) 23:49, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Most likely an article will have to wait for the TCR, since unless it reaches the Azores or Canary Islands (not bloody likely with the shear in the way), it will go down as a fish. CrazyC83 (talk) 02:52, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

What is TCR? davidwr/(talk)/(contribs)/(e-mail) 03:30, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Tropical Cyclone Report. HurricaneSpin Talk My contributions 03:32, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

It is a post-storm review by the NHC. --Anhamirak 18:47, 10 September 2009 (UTC)