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Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Emanuel Moravec

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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article promoted by Kges1901 (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 01:20, 12 October 2018 (UTC) « Return to A-Class review list[reply]

Emanuel Moravec edit

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Nominator(s): Chetsford (talk)

Emanuel Moravec (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Sturmvogel 66 was nice enough to just pass this through to GA so I thought I'd now submit it for A-Class. This article is about Emanuel Moravec, an interwar Czechoslovak infantry commander and staff college instructor who called for the country to declare war against Germany in 1938. When that failed, he cast his lot with the Germans and was appointed Minister of Education of the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia. His son, Igor, was probably the only Czech national to serve in the 3rd SS Panzer Division Totenkopf (though the "only" claim is not contained in the article as it's WP:OR). When I found this article it was just five sentences long. Chetsford (talk) 22:16, 9 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Image review

  • File:Emanuel_Moravec.jpg: given the dates involved, this seems unlikely to be own work
  • File:Logo_Czechoslovak_Army_(pre1961).svg: what is the copyright status of the original design?
  • File:Emanuel_Moravec_-_ministr.jpg: not seeing support for that tag at the given source? Same with File:Ceska_mladez.png
  • Voice_sample_of_Emanuel_Moravec.ogg needs a more complete FUR. Same with Moravec_at_Week_of_Czech_Youth.ogv. Nikkimaria (talk) 20:35, 10 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nikkimaria - thanks for this. I didn't even think to verify the images already existing at the Commons were correctly licensed! Anyway, I've removed the offending images and completed a FUR for the two AV files. Chetsford (talk) 02:10, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Okay. Can you clarify where the tag for Emanuel_Moravec_-_ministr.jpg is coming from? Not sure it's supported. Also, what is the status of File:Emil_Hácha_5.jpg in the US? Finally, the fair-use tag at Moravec_at_Week_of_Czech_Youth.ogv should be swapped out - it is for screenshots, and this is a video clip. Nikkimaria (talk) 02:14, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nikkimaria - thanks for catching these. I think a lot of these are uploaded by users at the Czech Wikipedia who play a little fast and loose with images in the same way they do with textual references. I'm going to remove these and propose them for deletion at Commons and will replace the infobox image with a NFCI headshot. Will also correct the fair use tag on the movie file. Chetsford (talk) 03:23, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nikkimaria - just finished updating this if, at your convenience, you wouldn't mind giving it a check to make sure I got everything right this time? Chetsford (talk) 07:31, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Is anything more known about the provenance of Emanuel_Moravec_headshot.jpg? Nikkimaria (talk) 13:23, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I don't, unfortunately. The credit on the website of the Czech National Museum says "source: National Museum" but doesn't provide any deeper details. Chetsford (talk) 17:36, 11 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments: G'day, thanks for your efforts with this one. Unfortunately, this isn't a subject I am familiar with, so apologies if I miss something. I have a few observations: AustralianRupert (talk) 14:24, 14 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

  • in the lead you link World War II but not World War I: suggest both or neither for consistency
  • in the infobox, "1942-1945": should have an endash
  • in the Early life and education section, do we know the names of his parents?
    • G'day, not sure if this has been addressed, or if this information isn't available? AustralianRupert (talk) 12:26, 4 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
      • @Chetsford: G'day, not sure if you saw my comment above. This is the to only remaining point for me. Do you know if these details are able to be reliably sourced? If not, no worries, but just let me know. Cheers, AustralianRupert (talk) 01:02, 27 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
AustralianRupert - I apologize, I missed your question. I did check on this and was not able to source the name of his parents, unfortunately, or at least to a RS. The corresponding article on the Czech Wikipedia [1] does list his father's name as Jan Petr and the source appears to be respectable, however, it's offline and difficult to obtain so I can't affirmatively state it actually says that. I would usually just GF it, however, they seem to have a laissez faire approach with sourcing over there so I'm not sure it would be faith well placed. Chetsford (talk) 01:43, 27 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
No worries, that's a fair call. Added my support now. Regards, AustralianRupert (talk) 02:02, 27 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • in the Early life section, suggest linking officer
  • in the Early life section, do we know why he chose to change sides?
  • The Imperial Russian Army captured Moravec in 1915 and made him a prisoner of war: suggest that this might be smoother as Moravec was captured by the Imperial Russian Army in 1915
  • in the Fist Czechoslovak Republic section, link major
  • Moravec wrote and published extensively using the pen name Stanislav Yester: was this fiction or non fiction? What were the topics he wrote about?
  • Igor Moravec fought on the Eastern front: should be "Eastern Front"
  • ordinary Czechs' to...: the apostrophe isn't necessary here
  • for the titles in the Publications section, I suggest adding English translations as well as the original title
  • in the External links: "a scene..." should be "A scene..."
  • Citation # 25, GRATIAS AGIT Award should be "Gratias Agit Award" per MOS:ALLCAPS
AustralianRupert - thanks, kindly, for the review. I've just amended the article to address all these points. Please let me know if you see that I've missed anything. Chetsford (talk) 05:51, 1 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Lingzhi edit

  • Almost everything is "Missing identifier (ISSN, JSTOR, etc.); Missing archive link;". But otherwise well done. Lingzhi ♦ (talk) 14:09, 18 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Lingzhi thanks much - I've updated references. Please let me know if I've overlooked anything. Chetsford (talk) 01:13, 4 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Lingzhi - just wanted to check and see if there were any other issues or if you see that I've overlooked anything? Chetsford (talk) 03:58, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Nick-D edit

  • Please provide specific page numbers for all citations. Several repeatedly used references are currently to large blocks of text, so WP:V is not met at present.
  • Can you please explain why Prague in Danger: The Years of German Occupation, 1939-45: Memories and History, Terror and Resistance, Theater and Jazz, Film and Poetry, Politics and War is a reliable source on this topic, especially given that it's used so extensively? It appears to be a reflective memoir.
  • I'd suggest strengthening the first sentence to make it clear that he was a collaborationist (I presume this is what he's best known for)
  • What was Moravec's job and status in 1936? It's pretty amazing that he got two hours of Beneš' time just before the Munich conference. In what position was he advocating mobilisation, and how did this align with the advice from the head of the military?
  • "Moravec reportedly offered Ferdinand Peroutka release from Buchenwald in exchange for accepting a position writing for Lidové noviny, an offer Peroutka declined" - who was Peroutka and what was Lidové noviny?
  • "During his period as a Protectorate minister, Moravec adopted an anti-Semitic worldview that largely mirrored that of the Nazi Party" - as I understand it, it's highly unusual for someone to become anti-Semitic (especially stridently so) in middle age. Presumably he was hostile towards Jews before this? (as was shamefully common at the time worldwide) Nick-D (talk) 05:40, 11 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nick-D - thanks, much, for the review.
  • *Please provide specific page numbers for all citations. Several repeatedly used references are currently to large blocks of text, so WP:V is not met at present.
 Done
This is not done. Please break up the large page ranges to the specific page which supports each fact. Nick-D (talk) 08:47, 11 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nick-D - sorry, I misunderstood your page comment. I've now added Template:Rp to all books referencing more than two pages. Chetsford (talk) 12:02, 11 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
This is still not done. Please provide the relevant page number for each fact, not broad ranges of pages for each work. Nick-D (talk) 11:19, 3 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nick-D - the only instance I can see where there's a range of more than two pages cited is He also promoted the idea of Czech culture as an historic component of Germanic culture. which cites a range of three pages. Unfortunately, this sentence is not succinctly limited to a corresponding sentence on a single page and is a summary of three pages of content discussing this aspect of Moravec's views and writing. Instances where a range of two pages are cited are for similar reasons. For instance, In response to the German ultimatum, Syrový declared that "further concessions from our side are no longer possible"; 42 Czechoslovak divisions were mobilized in preparation for an expected German invasion. cites a page range 201-202; the Syrový telegram is discussed at the bottom of page 201 of the source and the number 42 is invoked at the top of page 202. Chetsford (talk) 02:18, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'm most concerned about reference 5, to which multiple things are referenced to "Pynsent, Robert (November 2007). "Conclusory Essay: Activists, Jews, The Little Czech Man, and Germans" (PDF). Central Europe. 5 (2): 217, 224–225, 272, 229, 236–240, 255–256." The three page range for the large number of references to Demetz's book (which I continue to be concerned about) should also be fixed. Nick-D (talk) 08:37, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nick I apologize that I don't understand. The Rp template provides specific page numbers (or a short range of numbers in cases where a point is summarized from content contained in multiple pages) within the text for each claim. The page ranges in the References section are only a compilation of all those individually invoked in the text and don't support any specific point in the way the inline citations do. I'm not entirely clear how I could remedy this to your satisfaction other than converting the citation style to short citation format. Sorry if I'm misreading. (Edit - I did see one of the Demetz references lacked the Rp template so have corrected that.) Chetsford (talk) 11:02, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I missed that the page numbers now appear in the article's text. Nick-D (talk) 11:37, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'd suggest strengthening the first sentence to make it clear that he was a collaborationist (I presume this is what he's best known for)
 Done
  • Can you please explain why Prague in Danger: The Years of German Occupation, 1939-45: Memories and History, Terror and Resistance, Theater and Jazz, Film and Poetry, Politics and War is a reliable source on this topic, especially given that it's used so extensively? It appears to be a reflective memoir.
You're correct. It is primarily a reflective memoir, however, is interspersed with historical chronicles and I've only used those sections. Kirkus [2] described these as "... a vast amount of political and cultural material, veering between scholarly and autobiographical approaches. The academic analysis is at times intimidatingly dense, but readers who persevere will be rewarded with rich, balanced profiles of significant figures ranging from Konstantin von Neurath, the Nazi-installed leader of Bohemia and Moravia, to Franz Kafka’s beloved Milena Jesenská, an essayist who was active in the resistance movement." and PW [3] describes it as "Interspersing political and cultural history with snippets of memoir"
  • "Moravec reportedly offered Ferdinand Peroutka release from Buchenwald in exchange for accepting a position writing for Lidové noviny, an offer Peroutka declined" - who was Peroutka and what was Lidové noviny?
 Done
  • "What was Moravec's job and status in 1936? It's pretty amazing that he got two hours of Beneš' time just before the Munich conference. In what position was he advocating mobilisation, and how did this align with the advice from the head of the military?
 Done
  • "During his period as a Protectorate minister, Moravec adopted an anti-Semitic worldview that largely mirrored that of the Nazi Party" - as I understand it, it's highly unusual for someone to become anti-Semitic (especially stridently so) in middle age. Presumably he was hostile towards Jews before this? (as was shamefully common at the time worldwide)
It's possible he was anti-Semitic prior to middle age, however, I have seen no RS that unambiguously says this and - purely on personal speculation - I think it might equally likely have been the case that he became an anti-Semite of convenience, rather than conscience, following the German occupation. I base this assumption on the Pynsent article which introduces Moravec's suddenly Anti-Semitic statements as "subserviently accepts a version of the Nazi line", however, that is still somewhat interpretive to the point I didn't feel I could insert a definitive conclusion without veering into the realm of OR.
Hopefully I didn't miss anything, but please let me know if so! Chetsford (talk) 08:40, 11 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Nick, have you had a chance to review Chetsford's latest responses? Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 09:19, 3 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I've been horribly remiss with this review: commented above. Nick-D (talk) 11:19, 3 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
G'day Nick, are all your observations addressed here? This looks about ready for promotion, but I just wanted to check if you felt there was anything outstanding. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:24, 9 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not opposing promotion, but can't support it either due to my concerns over Prague in Danger being so extensively used as a source. Nick-D (talk) 03:41, 9 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments by Ian edit

Seems like a good, succinct bio on someone I admit I hadn't heard of.

  • Prose-wise, no outstanding concerns but pls let me know any issues with my copyedit.
  • Structure and level of detail seem reasonable.
  • Source review:
    • No red flags leapt out re. quality (noting the response to Nick's query about one source) but no harm someone more familiar with the subject/sources having a look also.
    • Formatting-wise, I agree with Nick that we need more granularity in citing the sources. For instance, the way you've cited Demetz is fine, because only one page range is used from the book to cite the info in the article. When you come to say Pynsent though, you should list the book details under a separate Sources or Bibliography section, and employ a short citation (e.g. author, year, page nos.) for the part(s) of this article using p. 217, a short citation for the part(s) using pp. 224–225, etc.
  • I'll take Nikki's image review as read, assuming all resolved.

Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 02:24, 4 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your review! I don't believe we have a style requirement for WP:SFN as per WP:CITEVAR? Chetsford (talk) 03:45, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
No, as WS says below, it's just one of several citation methods (I don't use it myself). Anyway it looks to me that individual statements are now cited to relevant page numbers, and that's the main thing. A couple of bits of formatting:
  • You could safely remove the sets of page ranges from the cite book templates for which you've employed the RP page numbering, as they're now redundant.
  • It would be worth trimming the infobox of unused and/or unlikely to be used parameters, as it just clutters the first part of the article in edit mode.
Overall though my comments have been addressed sufficiently for me to support. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 00:40, 7 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by White Shadows edit

  • Some of the citations use "P" or "pp" to donate pages cited, while others lack that. Citation 5 is a good example of this.
  • Other citations lack page numbers, which is something other editors have mentioned so I won't go into detail there.
  • Who is Radola Gajda in the "See also" section?
  • I'll be sure to bring up anything else that catches my eye.

--White Shadows Let’s Talk 01:09, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

White Shadows - thank you for the review. The difference between "p/pp" and no "p/pp" is because some sources are journals and some are books. The cite templates on WP insert "p/pp" for books and does not for journals. While I agree it's not consistent, I'm afraid it's out of my hands. Insofar as citations lacking page numbers, at the present time the citations that don't have page numbers are those which are unnumbered, such as websites (for example: [4]). I've removed Radola Gajda from See Also. Chetsford (talk) 02:23, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
That can be fixed if you place the journals in a reference section and only cite the author and the page number(s) in the citation itself. Websites are fine when it comes to not having page numbers, that's not to be expected.--White Shadows Let’s Talk 02:56, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The WP:SFN citation style to which you're referring can't be mixed with the referencing style used in this article according to the policy under WP:CITEVAR if I read it correctly? Chetsford (talk) 03:40, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
SFN is just one method to cite things though. It's certainly my preferred method, but it's not the only one. If you place the journals in a reference section and create citations using the <!ref> tags, you can then include the page(s) from said journal. It doesn't seem like a huge issue, but I've never seen an ACR pass with citations that don't actually include the pages of whatever book/journal is being cited.

If you're still having problems or are confused by anything that I'm saying (communicating in text does that), please just let me know. I'd be happy to help fix the problem if I can be of any service.--White Shadows Let’s Talk 05:06, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I just noticed the page numbers in citation 12 were removed during a previous edit. I'll replace them. Could you clarify that's what you were referring to as I don't see any other journals referenced without page numbers? Also, as far as I can tell all the journals are presently in the References section and use !ref> but let me know if it's displaying differently for you. Chetsford (talk) 10:11, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Update - I've added the page numbers for citation 12. It was just one page for all three points so I didn't use the RP template. Chetsford (talk) 18:28, 6 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

CommentSupport by PM edit

This article is in good shape. A few comments from me:

Lead
  • the lead sentence should properly define his notability. It is clear that he was a notable writer, and that should be included. Suggestion: "Emanuel Moravec (17 April 1893 – 5 May 1945) was Czech army officer and writer who served as the collaborationist Minister of Education of the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia between 1942 and 1945. He was also chair of the Board of Trustees for the Education of Youth, a fascist youth organisation in the puppet state.
  • point out that he served in the Austro-Hungarian army, Russian Army and Czechoslovak Legion in WWI then fought alongside White Forces against the Bolsheviks, including links
  • some context for his collaboration is needed, suggest adding that he turned to enthusiastic collaboration after the occupation of rump Czechoslovakia and creation of the puppet Protectorate
  • Other than his son Igor serving in Totenkopf and being executed for treason, I don't think any of the personal stuff is needed in the lead, as it isn't significant. I would instead add a couple of sentences summarising the Legacy section
Resolved
Early life etc
  • link conscription and World War I
  • do we know what regiment he served in?
  • do we know when and where he was captured, what battle for example? and where he was held?
  • do we know when he was paroled?
  • explain that the First Serbian Volunteer Division consisted of former POWs, including Serbs and those from nations of the A-H Empire
  • do we know what fierce engagement he suffered shell shock in?
  • explain Czechoslovak Legion in-text
  • explain that the Legion fought on the White side against the Bolsheviks in the Russian Civil War
  • do we know where he fought during the Russian Civil War?
Resolved
Career
  • link Czechoslovakia, normally you wouldn't link well-known countries, but as it no longer exists...
  • apparently the War College was called the War School at that time, and link
  • commissioned as a major, and in what year?
  • do we know any more about his postings between commissioning and 1931? Seems a bit sparse.
  • suggest "In parallel with his military career," also do we know what newspapers he was published by, and their politics?
  • if writing under a pen name, how did Masaryk link Moravec to Yester? Was he outed or something?
  • Czechoslovakian Army
  • combine the para that starts "In 1938 Moravec" with the single sentence para above.
  • link Edvard Beneš and state his position
  • is there a link for the territorial demands Poland made, if not, then a quick explanatory sentence would help here
  • Beneš backtracked on mobilisation or his rejection of concessions?
  • note b should be in the body, as it explains Moravec's political philosophy of the time
  • Beneš' diplomatic incompetence?
  • Resttschechei is a German term and not helpful, perhaps rump Czechoslovakia?
  • add that the Protectorate was a puppet state and link puppet state
  • Czech Lands jars, just say the puppet state
  • were only intelligence officers sent o/s? What about the pilots of No. 312 (Czechoslovak) Squadron RAF and other Czech military types that served with the Allies?
  • point out in the text that Moravec tried to leave before the Germans moved in, as it isn't clear
  • if V uloze... is the most popular of his works, it should be in the Publications list. Also say when it was published to inform the timeline.
  • explain that the Board was a fascist and Czech nationalist youth org
  • explain who Heydrich was, SS-Obergruppenführer und General der Polizei and Acting Reich Protector of the Protectorate, effectively the military dictator of the puppet state
  • Hácha in full, link, and explanation that he was the President
  • In his new post as minister of education
  • Protectorate schools
  • State President Hácha
  • at what point in 1943 did he discuss it with Frank? The reason I ask is that Frank was only promoted to Obergruppenfuhrer in June 1943. Also, state that Frank was Reich Minister for Bohemia and Moravia at the time
  • fn 18 needs page number(s)
  • state that Buchenwald was a concentration camp
  • suggest "During his tenure as a Protectorateeducation minister"
  • Tatsachen und Irrtümer should be in Publications if it is being discussed

"...the Czechoslovak resistance group, the Three Kings,"

  • to go after Reinhard Heydrich
Resolved
Personal life
  • state that Rykov was a prominent Bolshevik
  • Yuri Moravec
  • Karl Hermann Frank
  • rank and position for Jodl
  • explain what Igor was tried and executed for and by whom he was arrested and tried
  • who arrested Yuri and what was he tried and sentenced for and by whom
Resolved
Legacy
  • Emil Hácha
  • suggest "or Jaroslav Eminger, who was later completely exonerated for his service in the Protectorate government"
  • who was Cyril Svoboda? position I mean?
  • in the quote "people such as"?
Resolved
Publications
  • add the ones I mentioned above
  • add oclc's
  • Just need to decap the title of the Borufka citation
General
  • the newspaper articles should all have page numbers for purposes of verification

That's me done. Nice work so far. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:53, 31 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Peacemaker67 - thanks very much for this thorough review. I'll be getting to this shortly and will ping you when I'm done. Chetsford (talk) 21:47, 4 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Running update on updates:
  • Lead: all updated per suggestions; let me know if I missed anything
  • added
  • Legacy: all updated per suggestions; let me know if I missed anything
  •  Done
  • Personal life: mostly updated per suggestions; in point of fact Yuri and Igor were both arrested by the Sbor bezpečnosti, however, I don't have a secondary RS for this
  •  Done
  • Early life etc: I've updated insofar as possible. There's some information I just don't have, unfortunately. (By way of comparison, our entire article on the Carpathian Front is just two sentences I wrote a few months ago just to have something to WL to!)
  • There are still a few things to do in the other sections, I've done a few, I'll leave you to do the rest.
  • Publications: added newspapers.com page #s and book oclc #s; added Prague in Black but the PDF returned a broken link for me ... still working on other sections and will continue putting running updates here
  • Career: updated insofar as possible with the following notes:
  • commissioned as a major, and in what year?
Unfortunately I don't have the year of his commission.
  • do we know any more about his postings between commissioning and 1931? Seems a bit sparse.
Unfortunately I don't have further details beyond his service in the 21st Regiment.
  • if writing under a pen name, how did Masaryk link Moravec to Yester? Was he outed or something?
By my reading of the material it is suggestive that it was a literary, not secret, pseudonym.
  • Beneš' diplomatic incompetence?
If we worded it as "disillusioned with his incompetence", I think we (WP) would be making an affirmative statement that Beneš was incompetent, whereas if Moravec was "disillusioned with his competence" Moravec is the one questioning the presence or absence of competence.
  • add that the Protectorate was a puppet state and link puppet state
I don't think, technically, the protectorate was a puppet state in the way of Slovakia or Manchukuo where there was the appearance of independence but sovereign powers were held elsewhere (Germany or Japan) as the protectorate was an overtly incorporated subject of the Reich with no pretense of independence and Hacha was legally subordinate to the Protector (unlike Jozef Tiso who was legally a sovereign but practically subordinate to Hitler).
  • were only intelligence officers sent o/s? What about the pilots of No. 312 (Czechoslovak) Squadron RAF and other Czech military types that served with the Allies?
I believe, but correct me if I'm wrong, that RAF 312 was crewed by Czechs who individually fled and volunteered of their own volition as opposed to being "sent" per se. The Czechoslovak intelligence operators actively sent abroad under official orders a few hours before the state extinguished itself as part of continuity of government planning.
  • at what point in 1943 did he discuss it with Frank? The reason I ask is that Frank was only promoted to Obergruppenfuhrer in June 1943.
I don't have a date on which the discussion occurred, however, the full source refers to Frank by the title Obergruppenfuhrer on which basis I deduce it was after June, however, I removed the title out of a preponderance of caution.
Chetsford (talk) 09:08, 6 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Still a few things to do. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:51, 7 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Peacemaker67 - thanks again for the review. I've finished updating the rest of the sections. Let me know if you see that I've missed anything or have any questions or further edits. Chetsford (talk) 03:56, 8 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Just the decapping of the title of the citation. Otherwise good to go. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:55, 8 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks - done! Chetsford (talk) 22:15, 8 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Catrìona edit

  • It looks like you have made good use of Czech/Slovak language online sources, but I'm surprised there isn't more on him on Czech print sources. When I was reasearching Prague uprising, it became obvious that I wouldn't be able to take the article to featured status because of a lack of access to and inability to read Czech-language print sources, which are the most recent and best quality histories of the uprising. This isn't necessarily a reason to oppose, but just a reminder that comprehensiveness is one of the most difficult criteria to asses as a neutral reviewer. (Update: due to my limited experience with A-class reviewing, I neither support nor oppose the promotion of this article.)
Unfortunately, there is only one definitive book on Moravec, which is a 1997 biography by Jiří Pernes. I didn't use it as a source, however, as it was the centerpiece of a major plagiarism scandal in which Pernes was involved which, I think, was serious enough that it casts doubt on whether the book can be viewed as a RS. Adding a further layer of complexity is that the dissertation from which Pernes supposedly plagiarized may or may not have resulted in the awarding of a PhD, so in case of the latter it wouldn't meet the standards of WP:SCHOLARSHIP. (The scandal was actually unmentioned in Perens' own article, I had to add it last February. [5]) I'm sure most of the content of the book is probably accurate but, for purposes of the article, I treated it as though it didn't exist. Chetsford (talk) 09:16, 6 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
G'day Chetsford. Given Nick-D's questions about the liberal use of Demetz and the fact that he includes an element of personal narrative alongside his historical research, I would like to suggest using Pernes (or another source if available) to corroborate Demetz on those personal details he is used for. Assuming of course that he corroborates them. Failing that, I think that Demetz might qualify as a biased source and should be attributed in-text with a note about the fact that his book contains personal recollections as well as historical research. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:07, 9 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
No problem. This may take a little while as I think the book was pulled after the plagiarism issues but I'll track down a copy make these additions ASAP. Chetsford (talk) 06:11, 15 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
G'day Chetsford, as this is otherwise ready for promotion, I suggest you attribute Demetz with the note. That will satisfy me for A-Class, but the Czech sources and Pernes will be needed before I'd support it at FAC. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:00, 23 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'm happy to help out with this as needed. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:43, 25 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
G'day Chetsford I'd like to wrap this up. If you can address the above I think this can be promoted. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:04, 5 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'm so sorry, I've neglected to check this and then was away for a few days. I'll get this finished off tomorrow. Thanks, Peacemaker67 - Chetsford (talk) 05:47, 11 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Peacemaker67 - thanks for your patience. I wasn't entirely sure how to handle this so let me know if you think an alternate approach would be preferable. However, I've done two things: (1) added the "lay summary" parameters to the Demetz source linking to this [6] explanation of the book's contents from Publisher's Weekly, (2) and added the following caveats in the notes sourced to PW: Prague in Danger: The Years of German Occupation, 1939–45: Memories and History, Terror and Resistance, Theater and Jazz, Film and Poetry, Politics and War by Peter Demetz consists of "political and cultural history [interspersed] with snippets of memoir". References to this volume used in this article do not draw on the book's "snippets of memoir". Chetsford (talk) 19:31, 11 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
That's perfect. I'll just do a final check to make sure this is ready for promotion and list it. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:10, 12 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Source review edit

The sources all look to be high quality and reliable. I did wonder about whether all current scholarship was covered, and found this which contains a story about Moravec and Benes on page 16. Also Prague in Black: Nazi Rule and Czech Nationalism by Chad Bryant and, as Catrìona notes, other Czech and Slovak language sources on this period and Moravec in particular, should probably be examined before a FAC nomination. Most of the sources need a location of publication added, and ISBNs should be hyphenated. A few of the sources need a trans-title field with an English translation. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:58, 1 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Just looking at the Czech article, other Czech language sources that might need to be consulted are Borovička, Michael, Kolaboranti 1939–1945 Praha: Paseka, 2007; Pasák, Tomáš, Český fašismus 1922–1945 a kolaborace 1939–1945 Praha: Práh, 1999; Uhlíř, Jan Boris, Emanuel Moravec. Český nacionální socialista. In: Historie a vojenství, č. 2, roč. 2006, s. 25 – 39 a č. 3, s. 49 – 63; and Uhlíř, Jan Boris, Protektorát Čechy a Morava v obrazech Praha 2008 and possibly some others. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:50, 9 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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