Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2021 November 17
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November 17
editSidi in place names
editOur article Sidi discusses that term's use an an honorific in Arabic, but it also seems to be common in place names, specifically city names. Our lists of cities in Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia reveal a good number of cities called "Sidi..." something or other, and there are a few in Libya and Egypt as well. Is that the same sidi that's used as an honorific title, or is it a different word? (I assume the similarity to the English word city, especially in its American pronunciation, is a coincidence.) —Mahāgaja · talk 10:50, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- The connection is quite simple. The place names are usually named after persons with the honorific used in their name, just like Saint Louis, Saint Paul, Saint Helena, just to mention the first that spring to my mind in English. From other languages I could add Santiago (Saint James), San Marino, Sveti Petar (Saint Peter) and any number of place names in Greece starting with Agios (Άγιος) (masc.), Agia (Αγία) (fem.), Agioi (Άγιοι) (plural). --T*U (talk) 13:00, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- OK, thanks. I had looked up a few of the Sidis but the ones I looked up didn't say anything about the etymology of the name. —Mahāgaja · talk 13:31, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- Perhaps the best known to British people will be Sidi Barrani, where our article says it is "Named after Sidi es-Saadi el Barrani, a Senussi sheikh who was a head of its Zawiya...". DuncanHill (talk) 13:41, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- I have a vague memory of hearing once that some major city in the Arabic world is known as Sidi something-or-other in Arabic but goes by a different name in English. For the life of me, I can't remember which city that was, or even if this memory is real. —Mahāgaja · talk 23:47, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- Perhaps listed here (redirects are in italics). The only major Arab city with an English name significantly different from its native name that I can think of is Al-Quds al-Sharif. Beirut, Cairo, Mecca, Medina, Damascus, Baghdad, etc. all have names that differ, as far as I know, only in the values of vowels or consonants. DuncanHill (talk) 00:17, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
- Let's not forget the Big Apple: New York Sidi. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:34, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
- Casablanca is known as Dar al-Beyda in Arabic, which means the same thing but sounds significantly different. A number of its suburbs are Sidi something or other (e.g. Sidi Belyout), usually named after a local saint's shrine (zawiya in Arabic). Xuxl (talk) 14:09, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
- Let's not forget the Big Apple: New York Sidi. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:34, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
- Perhaps listed here (redirects are in italics). The only major Arab city with an English name significantly different from its native name that I can think of is Al-Quds al-Sharif. Beirut, Cairo, Mecca, Medina, Damascus, Baghdad, etc. all have names that differ, as far as I know, only in the values of vowels or consonants. DuncanHill (talk) 00:17, 18 November 2021 (UTC)
- I have a vague memory of hearing once that some major city in the Arabic world is known as Sidi something-or-other in Arabic but goes by a different name in English. For the life of me, I can't remember which city that was, or even if this memory is real. —Mahāgaja · talk 23:47, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- Perhaps the best known to British people will be Sidi Barrani, where our article says it is "Named after Sidi es-Saadi el Barrani, a Senussi sheikh who was a head of its Zawiya...". DuncanHill (talk) 13:41, 17 November 2021 (UTC)
- OK, thanks. I had looked up a few of the Sidis but the ones I looked up didn't say anything about the etymology of the name. —Mahāgaja · talk 13:31, 17 November 2021 (UTC)