Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2019 April 12

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April 12

Translate into Latin

I want to translate a phrase into Latin, but I only know "medical Latin", which doesn't include all of the proper rules. So, I believe I have the correct words, but likely not the correct forms. The English phrase is "What is Caesar's shift?" I've translated that as "Quid est Caesaris transmuta". Note, that the "shift" in use here is a "change" such as "he shifted to one side". I wonder if it should be non-possessive, which would be in English "What is the Caesar shift?" In that case, Caesar isn't an owner, but an adjective. Regardless, my goal is to figure out if I used the wrong words. If they are correct, is the form correct for this use? 12.207.168.3 (talk) 14:05, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

It would be very difficult to translate this until you pin down the meaning of "shift" more specifically (a physical movement or a change in belief, etc.). The verb would normally go at the end, but literally translating the four words of English into four words of Latin might not produce the best Latin result. Transmuta is a verb imperative (not a noun, as far as I'm aware)... AnonMoos (talk) 04:33, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

It is a physical shift. Caesar moved two chairs to the left. He shifted two chairs. If I ask what his shift was, you would say it was two chairs. I picked Caesar because it is a well known old Latin title. 2600:1005:B059:6137:C496:7BDC:91AE:98F7 (talk) 13:15, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

I don't think it would be useful to try to translate the sentence (which is already somewhat awkward in English) literally into Latin word-by-word. Probably the simplest version would be Quoad Caesar motus est? -- AnonMoos (talk) 14:16, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

Maybe "quousque" for the question? I know the immediate association will be Cicero and Catiline, but it does literally mean "how far" in a physical sense. Adam Bishop (talk) 16:05, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

It seems like you want to ask "What did Caesar shift?" (the answer being "two chairs"). Jmar67 (talk) 15:31, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

This relates to the Caesar cipher. You translate the letter A to C, B to D, and so on, giving a shift of 2 letters. You can similarly shift by other amounts, rot13 being a favorite for some purposes. 173.228.123.166 (talk) 23:46, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

This cipher produces a host of valid words in amongst the unreadable scramble: see Wikipedia:Reference desk archive/Language/November 2005#November 14 (Loopwords). -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:45, 14 April 2019 (UTC)

I don't know if this helps, but when Suetonius describes the Caesar cipher, he uses the verb "commutare". Adam Bishop (talk) 14:05, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

173.228.123.166 -- the original question was very difficult to understand (and therefore very difficult to translate) without any context. If it refers to shifting the alphabet in a Caesar cipher, then something like Quanto Caesar litteras movebat? becomes appropriate... AnonMoos (talk) 01:25, 16 April 2019 (UTC)