Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2009 September 3

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September 3

Russian proofreader needed

I'm submitting a paper to a journal for publication. Trouble is, it has to be in Russian, which I don't have a very good feel for yet. I've been studying for 1.5 years, and spent this last summer in Moscow, so I have a good feel for speech, but I'm still struggling with idiomatic- and natural-sounding writing, especially in academic style. The paper is about 4.5 pages (US Letter, single-spaced), and I don't have any super pressing deadlines for it just yet. I would need just a really brief overview of whether it just makes sense or not. And yes, every single Russian-language contact I have just happens to be out of town or unable to be reached (it is summer, after all). If anyone can help me out, either email me your email, or leave a msg here or on my talk page, whichever you like. ALTON .ıl 06:39, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Noting that you haven't received any response to this here (unfortunately my own Russian is pretty much limited to Da, Nyet and Vodka), have you considered something like searching out a Russian Expatriots Club, a Russian imported products store, or something else along those lines in your locality, dropping by there, and offering some token payment like a few drinks in exchange for what you want? Also, 4½ single-spaced pages is more than just a trivial amount, and although you say you only want "a really brief overview", my English-language editorial experience suggests that a) someone who would be prepared to do this at all may be uncomfortable with doing just a 'quick and dirty' job, and b) there may be more effort required than you estimate. I myself actually know a native Russian speaker (with a History degree), but although I'll mention this to her when I see her next, I doubt she'd be interested in doing it for a stranger on the Internet except as a professional, paid service. 87.81.230.195 (talk) 21:13, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Chinese Dialect (?)

I went to a public washroom today in Shanghai, and the guy in the cubicle next to me started chatting on his mobile phone. He was speaking Chinese, but I am not sure what dialect it was. I could understand some of what he was saying, but couldn't recognize most of his 'monologue', and there were some sounds in there which I knew did not exist in Mandarin. I guessed it might have been Shanghainese, but it didn't even really sound like that. Anyway, at one point, he spent about three minutes just saying 'wa' over and over again, with varying tones. Does anyone recognize this dialect? --KageTora - (영호 (影虎)) (talk) 21:54, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

I don't know the dialect based on just the description, but I imagine it wasn't Shanghainese; Shanghainese is a different language (as different as French is from English) and if he were speaking it you probably would have understood even less. I imagine he was speaking some local dialect of Mandarin, but other than that I don't know; Mandarin from one province to another is nearly unintelligible already. rʨanaɢ ^talk/_contribs 22:58, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

If Kage has some familiarity with either Mandarin or Cantonese, I would imagine that he wouldn't have much trouble understanding some snippets of conversation in Shanghainese. The difference between the various dialects ("languages") of Chinese is, I think, much less than French is from English; depending on the dialects in question, it might be more like Portuguese vs Spanish.

"Wa" (as in wah?) seems unusual. If it is being repeated many times in different intonations, I imagine that it's being used like "yeah", "mmm" or "aye" - mere acknowledgment. It doesn't seem like any of the southern dialects (Wu, Min or Yue), so is quite likely some variety of Mandarin. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 01:12, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I guessed the meaning, as it was said about 10 or 15 times over the space of three minutes or so. As for the sound of the language, I didn't notice any final stops, which led me to believe it was not a southern dialect. I can speak Mandarin and can get by in Cantonese, this is, as you said PG, why I could understand some of what was being said, but could not work out what language/dialect it was. In fact, I was in the airport at the time and stayed there most of the day, and I heard so many languages it was incredible. Some of them I could guess as to what they were, but others I couldn't place. There was one which sounded a little like Mongolian but I knew it wasn't Mongolian. I was dying to ask them what language it was, but I thought it might be impolite. There was a family that sat next to me and they were speaking some minority language. We got talking to each other in Mandarin, and the Han Chinese sitting around us found it hilarious. Fascinating day! --KageTora - (영호 (影虎)) (talk) 02:05, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Did you get a chance to see the guy's face? Maybe that would offer some clues as well ;) rʨanaɢ ^talk/_contribs 02:10, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Some clues might come from other things you might have heard. Did it have short syllables or syllables with a glottal stop final? That would imply Shanghainese, or a Beifanghua dialect from just north of the river, such as Nanjing or Rugao. It might have been a Wu dialect from further south, such as Hangzhou or Ningpo, or further south, like Jinhua or Wenzhou. My guess is that it might have been something like Nanjing or Tianjin dialect, because they're Mandarin dialects that have some characteristics like Shanghainese. If it didn't have any final stops at all, it might have been something from further afield, like Sichuanhua. Wenzhouhua doesn't have stopped tones, but it is pretty distinctive. Steewi (talk) 03:13, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

It was definitely not Tianjin dialect, because I went to school there and would recognize it a mile off. I'm pretty sure there weren't any final stops - I'm sure I would have noticed as they would be very conspicuous so far north. I'm wondering whether it was Hunan dialect or something close to that. As for the other dialects you mentioned, Steewi, I am not familiar with any of them, so I couldn't say. One more thing I can say, is that there was also definitely no 'erhua', and his pronunciation was very clear and not slurred in any way. @Rjanag - I didn't see the guy's face as he was still talking in his cubicle when I left the washroom. Sorry I can't give any more clues, folks. I guess this will never be answered. I could have waited and asked him, but I think 'where are you from?' would be a strange question to ask somebody in a public toilet! :)--KageTora - (영호 (影虎)) (talk) 03:48, 4 September 2009 (UTC)