Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2022 March 1

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March 1

Reviews of the war on GoogleMaps

On Twitter, the following tweet came up: Not talking - doing! #StopPutin #StandingWithUkraine We have to inform Russia’s people about the truth! Use #GoogleMaps and write everywhere in the reviews what’s going on! To me this seems a brilliant idea since it allows to write a very personal message. In my case, since I do love travelling, I could select hotels that I would really want to stay in, and since I have the highest respect for the Russians who dare to speak up, I would write warm, compassionate, messages. But my question is: What's the danger? Can the Federal Security Service hack my computer, e-mail, or phone? How to protect myself against that? Compassionate traveler (talk) 23:24, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

@Compassionate traveler: You really shouldn't be writing reviews for places that you haven't been to on Google Maps. Some people actually look at those reviews to decide if they should go somewhere or not. Also, I think Google might have some sort of anti-spam system that will kick in if it detects a lot of reviews from people who haven't actually been to the place they are reviewing. Also, as long as you're not stupid, the FSS cannot hack you since they would have to somehow gain entry to your device. ― Blaze Wolf^Talk_{Blaze Wolf#6545} 23:27, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. Of course I know that “Some people actually ...”. But, equally of course, those people can read. Since I would never write any text that in any way could mislead them, I see no problem with what I write. Let's not get started on the word “should”, or would you want me to tell you what I think you “should” do? Compassionate traveler (talk) 23:40, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

@Compassionate traveler: If you still want to go ahead. Like I said Google might have some sort of anti-spam system for something like this. ― Blaze Wolf^Talk_{Blaze Wolf#6545} 23:44, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

Thank you again. I'm not really concerned about that; that's Google's concern, and I'm not afraid of Google doing anything like what the Federal Security Service might want to do. Compassionate traveler (talk) 23:52, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

@Compassionate traveler: I agree with User:Blaze Wolf on all points except one "Also, as long as you're not stupid, the FSS cannot hack you since they would have to somehow gain entry to your device". If we're talking about a state security apparatus or anyone with a similar level of resources, I don't think it's fair to say someone is stupid simply because they fell victim to one of the many ways social engineering may be used to get someone to do something which will allow something like Pegasus (spyware) to be installed on a device. (And let's not forget all that we learned from the Snowden leaks etc.)

But more importantly, some exploits are zero click and zero day, and it seems even more silly to say someone is stupid simply because a state secure agency was able to find out your phone number and send an SMS to it or whatever; or because they are using a device with such a vunerability especially since while some devices are more vunerable than others, even up to date iPhones have been affected by zero click exploits in the past [1] and frankly I'm 99% sure they still are and the Russian agencies as the US ones and some others know it.

Of course the obligatory xkcd also reminds us why even if your devices really are immune to any sort hack, this doesn't make you safe [2], the Russian security agencies have shown their willingness for extreme measures on foes Poisoning of Sergei and Yulia Skripal & Poisoning of Alexander Litvinenko, so too other other state security agencies.

And yes, it is foolish to think you can take sufficient measures such that a highly advanced state security agency will not be able to work out who you are, where you live, what your phone number is etc unless you're already so informed that amongst other things, you would not be asking a question like this. (For example, I think we can be sure the Russian security service could WP:Checkuser if they wanted to. And since I doubt anyone would have approved an WP:IPBE over this, it's fairly unlikely you are using Tor (network). And even if you are using one of those VPNs which isn't blocked, I wouldn't count on the Russians not being able to work out your real IP.)

Note that this doesn't mean I'm saying you have to worry. You don't not because the Russians could work out where you live, or lack the means to hack your devices or kill you, but because they're not going to GAF, and especially not enough to take such measures.

Note also that although Google isn't going to hack you, they could sue you, depending on where you live get a criminal charge filed against you or even just ban you from their services under any and all accounts. While I don't think any of these are that likely, they're actually far more likely than Russia doing anything and while less unpleasant than some stuff the Russians would be willing to do, I think you'll find they're by no means fun. (If you use Gmail or Google Drive for example, while it's already foolish to lack backups, you could find out first hand how foolish it is when you accounts and their content suddenly disappear without warning. Of course this also means you should either be using an iPhone or an Android device without the Play store.)

BTW to emphasise Blaze Wolf's other point. I hate what Russia is doing with a burning passion, but seeing dumb Google reviews is not going to make me hate what they are doing more. It's going to make me spread the hate for whatever idiot thought it was a good idea to spam Google reviews. In fact while this probably won't affect me, for certain people it's to actually likely to reduce their hate for what Russia or if they already support what's going on, increase their support. People tend to hate spam with a passion.

Nil Einne (talk) 09:42, 2 March 2022 (UTC)

@Nil Einne: Yes that is true. I was meaning as long as you try and be smart and cautious you should be fine. ― Blaze Wolf^Talk_{Blaze Wolf#6545} 13:38, 2 March 2022 (UTC)

Thanks, Nil Einne, that is very interesting information. I understand that it's not as secure as sitting at home in your armchair watching TV, but FSS has bigger fish to fry. So, the danger is far less than what the Russians who dare to speak up are facing. And even if FSS did go after me, that would mean they couldn't use the time to go after the brave people in their own country – so much the better. Likewise, I don't think that Google would want to play the role of sitting on Putin's side of the fence and make that known through a lawsuit. All told, these are small risks I have to accept, if I want to be true to what I wrote in my original post.

Now, there only seems to be one misunderstanding remaining: I think when you used the words “dumb” and “idiot”, you got a little carried away. No worries, I'm not taking offense. All I'm asking is that you please take another look at my OP: If you see anything in it that makes you think I'd write indiscriminate spam that would merit such harsh words, please let me know. Compassionate traveler (talk) 19:17, 2 March 2022 (UTC)

Update: According to this Reuters message, Google might get in trouble, too. Still I think that's unlikely, since it would backfire if Roskomnadzor were to make a fuss out of these nonviolent reviews. --Compassionate traveler (talk) 02:22, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

"Can the Federal Security Service hack my computer, e-mail, or phone? How to protect myself against that?" No. The actions you describe would not give enough technical capability or politica motive for any Russian organization to hack you.--TZubiri (talk) 23:40, 5 March 2022 (UTC)

Thank you, TZubiri, that's good to hear! The technical capability was the reason why I posted the original question here. The political motive is connected to my question to Nil Einne (of 19:17); so it's good that you addressed that concern, too. With that, all my questions here have been answered. Thanks, folks! --Compassionate traveler (talk) 10:08, 6 March 2022 (UTC)