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Tessa Sanderson edit

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I've listed this article for peer review because following Sillyfolkboy's helpful review last year when I nominated this as a GA, I'd like some pointers on improvements required to get it ready to nominate as a featured article. Are there any important sources that I've missed? Any sections that need expansion or trimming? I'll try and fill in the gaps in the tables wherever possible, now that it's easier to get into the British Library.

Thanks in advance for any improvement suggestions, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 21:45, 13 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Sportsfan77777 edit

I'll review this article. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 19:19, 2 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

First, I'll note that I reviewed Shelly-Ann Fraser-Pryce recently for GA status and think that article is basically FA-quality and a good guide for this article.

Lead

  • I'm curious as to why she is labelled as both a javelin thrower and a heptathlete when it seems like she was primarily a javelin thrower. (The heptathlon is only mentioned three times in the rest of the article.) If you do that, then you don't need to clarify javelin as much in the rest of the lead
  • I don't think you need the comma between her name and CBE.
  • The second sentence is two separate points, should be split in two
  • "Black" should be capitalized. (see e.g. this explanation)
  • I would think the number of Commonwealth records should be listed before the number of UK records since Commonwealth encompasses more countries.
  • Is "UK senior records" the correct term? I would think "UK national records". "Senior" seems easy to confuse with above a certain age (i.e. what "Masters" is)
  • Clarify the age range for "Masters"
Added. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also, check if Masters should be capitalized? Our own article on Masters athletics seems inconsistent.
Sources seem genreally not to capitalize this. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • "ongoing" doesn't seem to be the right word for something in the past. Maybe "longterm" or "longtime"?
  • The last paragraph doesn't seem like the right place to mention the rivalry, given the rest of her career is only discussed in the first two paragraphs.
Moved. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Add one or two main details of the rivalry. (Did someone "win" the rivalry?)
added Whitbread "...who took the bronze at the 1984 Olympics." BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I don't know if "aired" is the correct word. I think TV shows "air", but I don't think TV channels "air"?
  • I don't think it's worth listing the progression of all three UK honours or mentioning they were part of the New Year's Honours. As the lead doesn't really discuss the progression of her career, it seems like the honours are given WP:UNDUE weight. Just the date of the current honour (CBE) might be fine?
  • Should it just be "Vice-Chair"? (as with the current Vice-Chair)

Early life

  • I don't think "born of Ghanaian ancestry" is grammatically correct.
  • she was in the care <<<=== start a new sentence
  • "was in the care" doesn't have parallelism with "until going to live"
  Pending
Has been copyedited. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • "P.E." ===>>> "P. E." or spell it out? (Is this a British thing?)
  • also making threats <<<=== start a new sentence
Early life comments addressed. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Early career

  • First mention in each paragraph should be "Sanderson", not "she". This comes up a bunch of times.
  Pending
Amended. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Clarify the age range for Intermediate javelin (maybe her age becomes redundant then?)
  Pending
  • with (add "a throw of") 39.18 m
  • After this competition, Sanderson decided to focus on the javelin event rather than pentathlon <<<=== It's not so clear that Sanderson had participated in the pentathlon. Maybe "multi-event disciplines including the pentathlon" at the start of the section?
  Pending
  • I'm not sure something like "achieving 50 m" is a proper way to state the distance of a throw.
    • Added "a distance of"
  • 1976 ===>> The 1976 season (can't start a sentence with a year.)
  • Also the two "1976"s in that sentence seems unnecessarily. And I'm pretty sure it's "the Olympics".
  • I don't think it's necessary to state where Fuchs qualified. (or at the very least, the sentence structure is not good.)
  • (add "in") the 1978 CommonWealth Games
  • "with both of them losing out" ===>>> "as both of them lost out"
  • "to coach her. He agreed to become her coach, and she moved" ===>>> "to become her coach. After he agreed, she moved"
  • ", with Antoaneta ..." ===>>> "behind Antoaneta Todorova and her world record throw" (Try to avoid ", with" when possible if it has the "non plus -ing" structure --- see advice from User:Tony1/Noun plus -ing)
  • The Achilles tendon operation sentence does not have parallelism.
  Pending
Now copyedited. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 17:42, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Should have something like "When Sanderson returned, she finished fourth"
  • No need to repeat the full "1983 World Championships" in back-to-back sentences

Later career

  • The 1984 Olympic gold should be it's own sentence. It shouldn't just be a secondary clause. Otherwise, it's not introduced properly or with the right emphasis.
  • "to have won" ===>>> "to win"
  • "She also" ===>>> "Sanderson also" (Whitbread is the only person in the previous sentence.)
  • "with Whitbread taking" ===>>> "while Whitbread took"
  • "would be focusing..." ===> "switch focus from the javelin throw to the heptathlon"
  • The "threatened" sentence should be broken up in at least two.
  • The Dairy Crest Games sentence should also be split in two.
  • "with Sanderson finishing" ===>>> "while Sanderson finished"
  • The Adam Faith sentence seems a bit out of place, or not phrased properly.
  • The 1988 Olympic sentence is not introduced well.
  • This detail about Tilea is probably not necessary given that the finish was so low regardless.
  • "almost five metres less" seems backwards. It matters how close she was, so rounding down in this manner sounds a bit weird.
Amended. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Added distances. Changed source as the Observer article and a results summary in the same issue have different distances, both wrong. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also, maybe compare to the lowest medal winner for context.
Amended. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Return

  • Did she only return to competition at the masters level? That should be clarified, if true. (Even if that's not the case, the masters level seems to be introduced out of nowhere.) Also state what the masters level is.
Masters is over 40; based on date of birth and competition year, she would have been part of Masters category, but maybe more clarification would be useful. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • The discussion of the rivalry here doesn't seem to fit. It wasn't part of her "return to competition". It was more related to the main part of her career. Though, I might suggest just putting it in a separate "Rivalry with Whitbread" section.
Added section. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I feel like the rivalry setup is never really mentioned. Did it start from one competition? How did it make into the press? Also, in what ways did the press cover it? Right now, the only place the press is mentioned is in the figure caption.
I can't answer all of that, but hipefully the rivalry section covers key points. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Similarly, I think you should summarize how their career results compared, and highlight which were the most important competitions in which they competed against each other.
Added a menion in the lead of 1984 Olympics. Surprisingly, there deosn't seem to be much retrospective comparison in sources, so perhaps the rest of the details are better left in the chronological summaries? BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • If you want an example, I think I did a good job presenting a similar sort of rivalry with Clijsters vs. Henin, where I also had to summarize the press coverage, career results, and key matches and against each other.
I agree that's a good example. As per the point above, there doesn't seem to be quite enough depth in indepencent sources to provide such good coverage for Sanderson/Whitbread. More than happy to add to the article if sources are identified. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Administration

  • "with Sanderson claiming" is another "noun plus -ing" issue

Media

  • Briefly explain what some of the types of shows are at the beginning. I see a few game shows and realty TV, I think. Maybe sub-sort by type of show if that works.
Added some details. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Honours

  • "a British..." ===>>> "the women's British..."
  • The voting explanation is unnecessarily in passive voice.
  • The MBE, OBE, and CBE is probably too much for one sentence. As is, the grammar also doesn't work.
  • "There is also a road" ===>>> "There are two roads" (and fix the rest of the sentence accordingly)
    • Amended to address first and fourth points. Guild of Copy Editors review requested. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 14:38, 6 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Personal life

  • "She had faced as" ===>>> "She has faced as"
  • First mention of Evans here should say "Derrick Evans"
  • Maybe present it as "She sued various newspapers... She was awarded £30,000 in damages..." instead of stating the award before mentioning what it was for.
  • "four-month-old twins" has two hyphens

Statistics

  • I would suggest following Shelly-Ann Fraser-Pryce more for how this is done, and setup a "Career statistics" section to put all of the statistics in under sub-section headers.
  • The statistics order right now seems kind of random. It starts with javelin, then switches to everything, then goes back to javelin, then switches to everything, and then back to javelin again. It would be better to group all of the javelin things back-to-back. Also, I don't know what "Midland Counties Championships titles" are?
  • The seasonal rankings are not a proper line graph. Some of the y-axis labels goes from 9 to 11 to 12 to 21. They should be equally-spaced (or logarithmically-spaced).
  • Relatedly, I would suggest adding the data in a table (like in Shelly-Ann Fraser-Pryce).
  • Also relatedly, I don't know if you need the "Not in top 25" line. I think it's misleading because she never actually dropped out of the top 25; there were just some years where she didn't compete. Just avoiding any data points those years will make it clear that she didn't compete; you don't need to mark it.
Mostly done, except adding a table. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 19:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Overall

  • I think this article is still a bit far from being an FA. Though, the article isn't too long, and I pointed out many of the issues above, so maybe it wouldn't be so difficult to improve. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 18:06, 18 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also, apologies for taking so long with this. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 18:06, 18 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

STANDARD NOTE: I have added this PR to the Template:FAC peer review sidebar to get quicker and more responses. When this PR is closed, please remove it from the list. Also, consider adding the sidebar to your userpage to help others discover pre-FAC PRs, and please review other articles in that template. Thanks! Z1720 (talk) 14:38, 18 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@BennyOnTheLoose: are you still working through these comments? If not, can you close the PR? If you are looking for additional comments, I suggest posting on Wikiproject talk pages or asking trusted editors to comment. Z1720 (talk) 14:06, 11 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Closing this - I'd already requested a Guild of Copyeditors review, amd will work through the rest of the points after that. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 12:25, 14 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
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