Poweplay

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LionMans Account (talk) 01:05, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Azeem Azam

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, introducing inappropriate pages, such as Azeem Azam, is not in accordance with our policies. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. The page has been nominated for deletion, in accordance with Wikipedia's criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be removed without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. GiantSnowman 09:25, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

There is no evidence in reliable sources that Azeem Azam has ever played professional football, and much of the information was false. GiantSnowman 11:28, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

This is why i left match stats off until they become available. i temporary created a page purposely leaving of match stats, the information i obtained are from Fox Sports and ESPN whom are the biggest sports networks in the world and are not in the habit of printing false info. I strongly ask you let the page exist, I will add match stats only when they become available.

There is nothing from ESPN and the 'Fox Sports' website is wrong. GiantSnowman 11:55, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I am sorry to disagree with you snowman, but i have seen Azam play on TV in spain. However here sre the links to ESPN and FOXSPORTS, how are these fake???

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/football/news/detail/item844954/

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/football/news/detail/item829969/

http://www.foxsportsasia.com/football/news/detail/item828433/Fit-again-Azeem-chases-new-horizons/

Please can you explain to me how these are fake when clearly some of the game are on here, however i have not added them until they are available on the transfermarkt.com, surly you are not claiming these offers and articles on Fox Sports and also covered originally by ESPN as it states in the articles are fake? are you claiming these huge sports sites are printing false info.

Those websites are false. How come a British Asian player hasn't got any coverage at all in British media? GiantSnowman 12:10, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Looks like this guy has been doing more on the side than his linkedin profile says. I noticed every story seems to have his name on the byline. Might explain why he's moved from ESPN to a no-name PR firm. LionMans Account (talk) 19:36, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

He is not Asian he Arabic/Turkish why would you say he is Asian?? I fail to see why Fox Sports to print false info as i have stated i have seen Azam play. However by the looks of things hes always played abroad he might be born here but he has not took on british nationality and has opted for his Arabic heritage instead. I am amazed you are claiming outright that Fox Sports and ESPN are printing false info without doing their own research (i am amazed by that claim you have stated). I have no affiliation with Azam. However i did meet his agent at a press conferences as this is what i do for a living, to organize press conferences venues for Sports companies. How can we resolve this matter? As i said if you can let the page exist i will add accordingly when info on Azam become more available.

If there is info you would like me to remove from the article i will do so.

If he is Arab or Turkish, he is still Asian. Regrdless, my point stands - why has a British player not had any coverage in British media? Or any media other than dodgy websites? I have not seen anything from ESPN, and yes I stand by my point that Fox Sports Asia has reported false information. You met his agent - did his agent ask you to write an article? The last editor who created a false article on Azam (including claims he had played professionally in France and the United States) had been asked to do so. GiantSnowman 12:39, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I am sorry but i totally disagree with you. ESPN are the people who originally ran the article Fox sports have aken over the site,

Abdominal injury sidelines Quaranta - Washington Times

www.washingtontimes.com/news/2003/may/17/20030517-122330.../print/ May 17, 2003 – The Washington Times · News .... Azeem Azam, a British forward of Turkish descent, trained with United yesterday. Blackburn at RFK?

Please can you explain the above brief article in the (Washington times) in 2003. it is obvious Azam was out there playing and training this is in the Washington times. I dont write articles i dont work for a newspaper. from my understanding Azam has a few offers right now abroad that will be in the main stream media next week and onwards covered by different paper conforming certain offer (This sis what i have been informed) secondly the offer from Al Ahli UAE clearly states the news broke in Dubia media and television, so i fail to understand what the journalist has to do with confirming a offer that has been aired on UAE tv. There are a few more sites i can point you to with different journalist. http://www.zimbio.com/Soccer/articles/Ujo4G6n6gaq/Azeem+Azam+Palermo+Al+Ahli+radar...these cant be all lieing, i dont understand what your stances is here, these are confirmed offers...by the looks of your bio your in football, if you ask the FA who holds Azam registration they will inform you the Spanish FA does. So how can all this be lies.

If you where to scroll to the bottom off this link you will see Azam was training in MLS with washington DC http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2003/may/17/20030517-122330-8194r/print/

That Washington Post link simply confirms he trained with a professional club, and the Zimbio link is clearly not a reliable source. You state "This sis [sic] what i have been informed" - who has informed you? Has anybody (linked to Mr Azam or not) asked you to write the article? If a professional club has offered Mr Azam a contract, then it should have been announced by the club / by reliable local media. Where's the Italian reports? You have not been able to provide any of that - because they are not available, because the information about Mr Azam is false. Please also sign your posts using 4 x tildes (~) - ~~~~ GiantSnowman 13:02, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I do not understand why a person would be training with DC united as confirmed if he is not a footballer. That is quite clear for anyone. As i have stated to you before this is the Spanish Media rumoring the signing of Azam in their media http://www.abcdesevilla.es/hemeroteca/historico-27-06-2006/sevilla/Deportes/azeem-azam-el-fichaje-fantasma-de-los-verdiblancos_1422197112697.html.........it is quite obvious this guys is a footballer albeit not with lack of games but i hoping they become available soon..As i have stated i am not a journalist of any kind and dont work for any news papers for me to write and Articles..I am just taken back by your stance on this (as it is almost personal to you for some reason) even though Spanish media, American and dubai media are telling you otherwise. Are all these site lieing as they are very big and respectable sites. If you can tell me what to do here, i would be grateful, what if basic info is posted as the page is up and running and when more info becomes available that is to your liking we can add to it. Poweplay (talk) 13:30, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I'm not doubting that Mr Azam is a footballer, I am saying his career has been massively inflated. A dodgy website rumouring that he might sign for a club is not the same as him actually signing for the club, is it? That is what I have issue with. GiantSnowman 13:34, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I appreciate what you are saying but how is Fox Sports Washington times and original piece done by Espn dodgy sit. if it was in the sun or mirror etc i could understand your stance, but these are broad sheets and sports sites. Poweplay (talk) 13:38, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Wanted to state i didn't say he had signed for UAE club i did say he passed the offer up. looking for something else. I would actually really appreciate your help here on how i could create an article that would suite your own criterion and we can then add to it as he progress in is career etc. can you help please. Poweplay (talk) 13:40, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I note you have taken this to Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Help desk, best to discuss the matter there. GiantSnowman 13:45, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I took it there as i was advised to if i have a dispute, however if we can reslove this here between both of us i would appreciate it. Poweplay (talk) 13:57, 11 May 2013 (UTC) I am basically asking what would you be happy with in the article and il work around your preferences until your hapy to add further to it Poweplay (talk) 13:58, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Remove all information that is not verified by a reliable source so that leaves "Azam trained with DC United in 2003." GiantSnowman 14:01, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Ok that leaves us with very little what if we stated he rumored to have turned down offer from UAE and removed everything that sound like fact and replace it with rumored to have? Poweplay (talk)

Rumours are not really considered encyclopedic. If you want I will move the article back into User:Poweplay/Azeem Azam for you to work on and then we can review in a day or two? GiantSnowman 14:08, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Firstly much appreciated. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Poweplay/Azeem_Azam What you think as i have replaced everything with rumored to have, is there more you would like to strip from it? thanks for your help Poweplay (talk) 14:19, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Ok you let me know what your happy with i have been infomred that there are more respectable newspapers breaking stories this week on his new offers and they will confirm previous stuff. I will keep you posted. Again much appreciated. Poweplay (talk) 14:23, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

As the editor who initially nominated this article for deletion, I would advise not to waste your time on this. Even if Azam the person is not a hoax, his football career is. He claims to have played for three clubs in the MLS and two in Europe, but all the reliable player stats websites do not have him ever making a first team appearance, and as a result he fails WP:NFOOTY. With regards to your last comments, are you Azam or being paid by him? Number 57 14:29, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Not at all i have never met Azam, as my convo with giantsnowman. I know some what of the history off events, however as i have informed on this page, Mr Azam stats where removed from basesoccer and transfermarket due to some claimants pretending to be his representative. They are waiting for that info to be applied back to the initial sites. I wrote on the article there where claims he was offered deals in MLS and never claimed he played there, however he did train there. i am only confirming other material that i found on fox sports Espn. Poweplay (talk) 14:37, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

If you have never met him, or do not have anything to do with him, how do you know that stats were removed from soccerbase and transfermarkt? Number 57 14:42, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

If you read the history off chat between me and Giantsnowman, you will see that i explain i organize events for press conferences mostly for skysports and other sports networks this is where i was informed of Azam ordeal, He was attacked online and this has been also covered by huffington post? If you read the history of convo you will see this has been explained in detail Poweplay (talk) 14:46, 11 May 2013 (UTC) Basically once the stats become available we can add accordingly, il work on it better with giantsnowman, i dont see why the references i have provided are not suitable as they are fox sports espn huff post washington times etc. give me some time and i will change it so it is more suitable until more info becomes available to add to it and make it reliable Poweplay (talk) 14:52, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, but I don't think this article is going to happen. I have very strong suspicions that fake articles and stats are being inserted to various internet sites (such as this) in order to create the false impression that Azam is a professional footballer. The last version of the article was being edited by someone who takes payment for editing Wikipedia (and who also wrote one of the articles you are referring to), and I wonder whether this may be happening elsewhere. Number 57 15:01, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

No one else has edit anything apart from me, and any of the blogs o google will not be used hence why we are only applying official sources as references, we will not be using any nonsense website as references, Once player stats go up on official sites that is the ref we will be using, all i am asking is until those official sites with match stats become available, give it the benefit of doubt until such time, however if these stats do not become available then we remove the page. I have only used official sources so far. Poweplay (talk) 15:15, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

My concern is that the subject may be paying for sites to contain incorrect information. Number 57 15:17, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

are you saying paying Fox Sports etc? but what about washington times huff post etc which are confirming his affiliation with these clubs whether they where offers or just training there. there are pics off him playing for betis etc however i have not bothered listing anything like this. He clearly is a footballer how successful i think is the issue, however i have changed everything to rumor until there are official info. Giantsnowman wants to go by newpapers. so we are waiting for more official sources, I dont think what any one would gain by claiming they are a pro footballer if they are not which opens them upto more ridicule. From what i seen at the press conference, i can only confirm what i heard. as i said it is really no bigdeal to me if this page is up or not Poweplay (talk) 15:27, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

• Update - Number57 has e-mailed Nottingham Forest, they have never heard of the player, it's looking more and more likely this is an intricate hoax. Unless you can produce some credible, reliable sources sharpish then we will re-delete the article. GiantSnowman 19:56, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

I am waiting for sources to return to me as well. If you want to delete it, i will leave the ball in your court what i ask is that once the guy is playing again, then you create the wiki page. I cant see why new papers in seville etc would print nonsense however soon as i hear back from my sources with credible info, il post it ASAP.As i said before it dont make no difference to me if this page is up or not. However i can verify from the press conference i was at this guy is a genuine footballer. this is not a hoax, if you delete it i kindly ask you to remove the hoax bit until all player stats are on Basesoccer/transfermarkt Poweplay (talk) 23:11, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Newspapers print rumours, which can easily be spread. And we know that hoax players (like Ali Dia) can get trials at clubs. The fact that Nottingham Forest have no recollection of this player makes it even more likely that there most of the claims for this "player" do not have their basis in fact. I have now deleted the article again. If Azam does ever make a first team appearance for a professional club, contact me on my talk page and we can have the article restored. Number 57 08:17, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

(edit conflict) What "sources"? Again, are you in contact regarding this article with Mr Azam or any of his representatives? Neither Basesoccer nor Transfermarkt are reliable sources, and the only reliable, verified info we have is that this guy trained briefly with DC United 10 years ago - where is the rest of his so-called career? GiantSnowman 08:18, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

My sources are through my boss who sets up the press conferences for clubs etc he's contacting people he knows at the FA and Sky sports, the press conf i saw with my own eyes was real, i cant understand why sky sports,Euro sports etc would be at a press conference about this player if he was not a player. secondly from my understanding Azam was at Forest academy as a kid of age 14 etc who did Number 57 exactly contact to get this clarified how many kids pass through academies every year? hundreds. I think sending a generic email to a club asking about a academy player 14/15 years ago is quite laughable, unless you sent it to someone at the club you know. Anyways i will take you up on your offer of you re-creating the article again again. i can assure this guy will be playing. Poweplay (talk) 10:28, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

The contact at Forest has, I believed, been a youth coach for 25 years, and given the scarcity of British Asian footballers (especially 15 years ago!) I am sure he would remember Azam. If Sky Sports and EuroSports were at the press conference, where are their reports? What was the press conference about? And again, I will ask - if this guy has been playing football for 15 years, where/what are the details of his so-called career? GiantSnowman 10:33, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Soon as i hear back i will inform you, i have also asked all the relevant questions. The only coach to have been at Forest for this length of period is a person called Ian storie-moor and he is not at Forest anymore, And there is no one else who has been at the club for this long, However from my understanding Azam will play this season, this has come from my boss who contacted his agent, I think we are all unnecessarily carried away with this piece. When Azam plays this forth coming season or pre-season, I am sure we can recreate the article. Far as basesoccer etc you cant just add matches or stats on here as they check them against the team line ups.Again once he plays this all becomes irrelevant, do you not agree?. Poweplay (talk) 12:46, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

I think what we need to do is get rid off all these articles like this on wiki floating about, until such time. I am not happy with all this on my user pages Poweplay (talk) 12:49, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

I'll repeat:

1. If Sky Sports and EuroSports were at the press conference, where are their reports?
2. What was the press conference about?
3. If this guy has been playing football for 15 years, where/what are the details of his so-called career?

Why are you relying on what an agent is telling you? They clearly have a conflict of interest. GiantSnowman 12:51, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Hi Mate. I am not relaying on what agent said, as i said before i was at the press conference, The networks that ran with the stories i.e Espn and Fox Sports thought it was relevant to them as they cover that area where Azam has been offered a deal, I am going on what my boss has told me in regards to media outlets covering stories, they only do it if it is relevant to that area. Sky Sports clearly thought it was not for them, obviously if Azam was a bigger player/ or a well known one then it might have interested them. Espn Star is the sister company to Espn, EspnStar cover all Asia related football, however from my research Fox Sports have bought them out, However they still chose to run the same story. The press conference was about Azam future offers and that he was over injuries and he is looking forward to getting back in the game. I am not at liberties to say who is agent is, however his agent is well known hence the press conference. I am trying to get details to, soon as i can get anything i will let you know on here. I appreciate the agent will have conflict of interest, however why would a well known agent be putting his reputation on the line if Azam was not a player. If he starts playing i assume his details will become more readily available, as he will be in action. Poweplay (talk) 14:20, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

If the press conference disussed future career, did it discuss the past i.e. what has he actually done for 15 years? Other than brief training with DC United in 2003, I cannot see anything else. Plenty of players/agents etc. exaggerate careers in pursuit of the green stuff, I've seen it far too often in my 7+ years here. GiantSnowman 15:35, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

True mate, there are plently of people out there, however this guys got official agents representing him. Real Betis was mentioned.I think he predominantly featured in pre-season etc however those games are not official so there is not much coverage on them, I have a few guys digging for us. I can understand if it was just DC United, however abcdseville mention him signing with Betis or that he has a deal with them, and they are Seville main sports news paper, there where Journalist present at the press conf who has seen Azam play whilst at Betis, if he plays soon then we will know, if not then we will leave it as it is. Apparently he was attacked really badly online where stuff got removed through hackers etc, The events are actually told on Espn. If i come across more stuff i will let you know. I really don't want to spend much time on this until things become more evident.All the best mate, Poweplay (talk) 16:05, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

OK, I'll leave you to do some investigations, if and when you find anything more then please let me know by posting on my talk page as I will no longer be 'watching' your talk page. But please, understand our scepticism - a player in his late 20s with seemingly no professional career or media coverage suddenly signs with one of the top teams in France, and then with one of the top teams in Spain, and then almost with one of the top teams in Italy, then almost with one of the top teams in England? Hmm, suspicions definitely aroused. GiantSnowman 16:08, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

I do see what you mean mate, trust me i would be beyond suspicious if i did not witness the press conference. All most makes no sense. However it does look as though he has spent most of those years with some sort of injuries or other.Lets see what pans out if he plays we will fly the flag lol. as it vindicates me. If he is actually good then all the better. Poweplay (talk) 16:20, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Hello again. I assume it was you that left the message on my talk page. Unfortunately neither GiantSnowman nor myself can change the deletion summaries. Number 57 14:09, 18 May 2013 (UTC)