- The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by — Maile (talk) 18:55, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
| DYK toolbox |
|---|
Seyhan Gündüz
edit... that international women's football forward Seyhan Gündüz was capped 32 times, scoring 8 goals, a rate of 0.25 a match?
- Comment: Not a self nomination.
Created by CeeGee (talk). Nominated by Matty.007 (talk) at 15:52, 14 December 2013 (UTC).
Hook is not easily verified by the source. Are they international/national caps? Scored 8 goals at which level. No matter how I crunch the numbers the two columns provided here under totals, do not add up. More clarification needed. EagerToddler39 (talk) 02:35, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
- EagerToddler39! Thanks so much indeed for your attention. You're right, it's confusing. Sorry for the troubles, my bad. She had eight goals in official and four in friendly matches. I tried to clarify the fact in the article by adding relevant text. However, the hook needs to be modified now accordingly. I hope the nominator will put a hand on. --CeeGee 11:12, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
- to be complete sure, I propose --CeeGee 19:44, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
- ALT1: ... that women's football forward Seyhan Gündüz was capped 32 times internationally, scoring 12 goals, a rate of 0.375 a match? --CeeGee 19:44, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
-
Done --CeeGee 20:12, 7 January 2014 (UTC)
-
- I'm not very comfortable with the article. I see a few inconsistencies such as she started the season playing for Dinarsusspor but in the very next statement it's mentioning her first season with Zeytinburnuspor (both in the same year). These two statements also lack citations. y main concern is that the entire article is based on table summaries. Her name is scarcely mentioned elsewhere. I would love to see at least one other type of source where her name is mentioned in something more than just a list. I also like neither the proposed hook nor the ALT. EagerToddler39 (talk) 00:50, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
ALT2:... that women's football forward Seyhan Gündüz made 32 international appearances for Turkey?EagerToddler39 (talk) 00:50, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
- First of all, thank you very much again for your in-depth review. I've fixed the typo mentioned and added four newspaper sources relating to her club time as requested. I have to say that I find your ALT not much interesting. --CeeGee 08:24, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
- I notice the changes. However, since I don't understand Turkish I'll defer to someone else checking things out. Agreed with you on the ALT I proposed. I'm still not comfortable with the hook so I'll also leave that to another reviewer to make a decision. EagerToddler39 (talk) 03:15, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
- Aha! Normally, reviewers use Google's inline translation feature for foreign language sources or simply AGF. Anyway, in order to be helpful in this matter, I can suggest you to contact someone from the list Wikipedia:Translators available#Turkish-to-English if you don't mind. I appreciate a progress also in the name of Matty.007. A better hook is always welcome.--CeeGee 08:24, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
Alt 3: ... that Seyhan Gündüz national football debut was in 1997?Matty.007 17:22, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
Please note that the initial reviewer EagerToddler39 has given up the reviewing process inexplicably, and requested me to ask someone else for this purpose as posted in his user talk page. Interested reviewers wanted. --CeeGee 08:03, 12 January 2014 (UTC)- You commented that I gave up the process "inexplicably" however that is not the case. Early on I indicated that my "main concern is that the entire article is based on table summaries. Her name is scarcely mentioned elsewhere. I would love to see at least one other type of source where her name is mentioned in something more than just a list." However your subsequent edits, as you summarize, were to add "four newspaper sources relating to her club time". The edits you made did not address those concerns I raised. They still only had her name included in a list. I said that I don't speak Turkish to indicate that I won't be able to find a suitable source to recommend. Therefore, because I'm not comfortable recommending the hook without those improvements I indicated that you should request another reviewer. I notice your DYK has gone unattended for a while and would love to help move it forward. However the improvements I requested need to be made first. EagerToddler39 (talk) 02:43, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
- First of all, I commented that after waiting three days for your respond to my immediate comment on January 9. Your objections on January 9 were that firstly you don't understand Turkish language and you needed someone else checking things out, and secondly you were still not comfortable with the hook so you'll also leave that to another reviewer to make a decision. Upon your requests, I recommended you to call someone from the list of Wikipedians, who can translate from Turkish language, and the nominator, User:Matty.007 made another hook suggestion the same day. You didn't react to those proposals three days long, and I assumed that you're no more interested to follow up the case. And now, after eleven days you say you didn't give up. Nice! I repeat my recommandation that you can still ask someone from the a.m. translators list, and make your comment on the ALT3 hook. BTW, can you pls provide me with a WP rule for DYK eligibility that an article must have the requirements you post today that sources such are listed in the said article are not sufficient. It will help for me. Thank you for your time. --CeeGee 09:43, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
- The improvements in sources I recommended have to do with establishing notability. Articles featured on the main page under DYK must meet Wikipedia's notability guidelines. According to Wikipedia:Notability (sports), "Trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may be used to support content in an article, but it is not sufficient to establish notability. This includes listings in database sources with low, wide-sweeping generic standards of inclusion, such as the College Football Data Warehouse." That's why I asked you to provide a published source that covers Seyhan and not simply database listings with her name or club. Thanks for the recommendation to consult a Turkish translator. However once you locate a source and update the article that would be enough. EagerToddler39 (talk) 17:19, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
- Pls check newly added ref.--CeeGee 18:54, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
- I would appreciate a brief summary of what that source says - a rough translation of the pertinent section would suffice, just to confirm that it's not just another trivial listing. For editors who may query the article subsequently I believe you could paste to article's talk page. Access to the article requires subscription. In any case I may be searching for a needle in a haystack since the ref doesn't indicate the page on which I'd find the article. At this stage I'm not comfortable AGFing that source. EagerToddler39 (talk) 02:50, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
- Pls chack Talk:Seyhan Gündüz. If still any further doubts, I can give you my password at your e-mail address so that you can enter that newspaper archive. --CeeGee 15:44, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
- Your password won't be necessary. I've checked the article and it looks good. Gonna approve DYK now. However you could still improve the article by providing sources for "which was already the Turkish Women's Football League champion for three successive seasons", "her club won the championship, their fourth successive achievement" and "Ekinlispor, who was the league champion for the second consecutive time" EagerToddler39 (talk) 16:21, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
Article new enough and long enough at time of nomination. No obvious copyvios noticed though this is not completely verified as some sources are in Turkish. Article uses inline citations and hook is properly sourced. No issues with neutrality. Issues with notability and sources have been addressed. EagerToddler39 (talk) 16:21, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
- - Restoring tick for ALT1. EagerToddler39 (talk) 14:36, 27 January 2014 (UTC)