Template:Did you know nominations/List of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Michael Schumacher
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by PFHLai (talk) 03:03, 13 June 2016 (UTC)
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List of Formula One Grand Prix wins by Michael Schumacher edit
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- ... that Formula One driver Michael Schumacher was on the podium in every race of the 2002 season, including eleven race victories, breaking the record for most in a season?
- ALT1:... that Formula One driver Michael Schumacher holds the record for the most Grand Prix victories with 91?
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Ariel Award for Best Director
Moved to mainspace by Cowlibob (talk) and The Rambling Man (talk). Nominated by Cowlibob (talk) at 11:01, 5 June 2016 (UTC).
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This article is long enough, moved to mainspace on May 30 so new enough, and referenced. The hooks are both referenced and true (I know my F1!). My only quibble is over neutrality, because there are aspects of his career that are missing. For example, it mentions the infamous Hill crash (which was not at Jerez - that was his Villeneuve crash) but not that Hill has explicitly stated his belief it was deliberate (and that this view has wide acceptance). Yes, the Villeneuve one was causing an avoidable collision and he was excluded, but would someone unfamiliar with the history know that in both cases taking out his opponent meant winning the championship. On the other hand, the '96 Spanish race defies easy description, it was a true masterclass. On this topic, one person's opinion is as valid as another's and I am not suggesting the text is POV, just incomplete. Basically, some expansion and a copy edit would help but the article satisfies DYK requirements as I understand them at present, hence the tick. EdChem (talk) 11:46, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
- @EdChem: Thanks for the review. Neutrality is a criteria of DYK so if you don't think the list is neutral, please change the icon to , am happy to fix issues. Good catch on the 1994 race, fixed. Perhaps I could add something like "Some attribute the collision as deliberate by Schumacher to secure the championship but the FIA race stewards labelled it as a racing incident." For the 1997 race perhaps "In the 1997 season, Schumacher won five races but was disqualified from the championship after the FIA deemed him to have deliberately caused an avoidable collision with eventual champion Jacques Villeneuve at the European Grand Prix in Jerez in an attempt to win the championship." Cowlibob (talk) 12:14, 5 June 2016 (UTC)
- @Cowlibob: I have changed the symbol, as suggested, though I do think it's already better than stuff I have seen sail through. I think the changes you suggest are promising, though "Some" re Adelaide is weak. Hill has spoken on this directly as have others - a potential ref is here. On the Villeneuve collision, I think a link to the FIA decision would be appropriate. The MS article says "Schumacher was punished for unsportsmanlike conduct for the collision and was disqualified from the Drivers' Championship". Unsportsmanlike is the sort of word I would use.
The article you have written is a list of wins and not a review of his career, so the choices for inclusion are different. However, when I think of Schumacher and wins, I also think of the race he should have won but he collided with Coulthard trying to lap him, it was a wet race and MS was much faster than everyone else but still pushing to add to a huge lead (Belgium 1998). I also think of the US GP where he slowed to try to create a dead heat with Barrichelo and ended up second by a tiny margin, 0.011 s. (USA 2002) Do you think these are appropriate for the article, or not? (Not suggesting the DYKtick is contingent, genuinely interested in your opinion.) I also think that mention of his retirement and return is appropriate, noting no wins on return. Maybe something like "Schumacher retired from Formula One at the end of the 2006 season, returning to racing from 2010 to 2012 for Mercedes. His last Formula One victory was recorded at the 2006 Chinese F1 Grand Prix, and his final podium at the 2012 European Grand Prix at Valencia." EdChem (talk) 14:28, 8 June 2016 (UTC)
- @EdChem: I've made some edits to the article. Thanks for the input. I'll take each point in turn. I've added that the 1994 collision resulted in him winning the championship. Elaborating further is probably too much for this article especially as the official view is "racing incident" so it's not clear cut. I've added to the 1997 incident to show that FIA determined it to be deliberate. With a career as storied as Schumacher's there's probably going to be many potential near misses, I think it's enough to discuss the races he did win. Have added sentences on his first and second retirement and his last win was in China. Cowlibob (talk) 17:34, 11 June 2016 (UTC)
- @Cowlibob: I have changed the symbol, as suggested, though I do think it's already better than stuff I have seen sail through. I think the changes you suggest are promising, though "Some" re Adelaide is weak. Hill has spoken on this directly as have others - a potential ref is here. On the Villeneuve collision, I think a link to the FIA decision would be appropriate. The MS article says "Schumacher was punished for unsportsmanlike conduct for the collision and was disqualified from the Drivers' Championship". Unsportsmanlike is the sort of word I would use.
- @EdChem: Thanks for the review. Neutrality is a criteria of DYK so if you don't think the list is neutral, please change the icon to
