Talk:Young Goodman Brown

Symbolism

I think including a section on symbolism would we a great idea. Symbols might include Faith's pink ribbons, the staff, and other things. The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 00:08, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. I'm sure it's not too hard to find sources on that sort of thing. --Midnightdreary (talk) 01:35, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

I was thinking maybe Faith's pink ribbons, the staff, and the forest, to name a few. Should I go ahead and put them in? The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 00:57, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Well, look for reliable sources and don't add original research. --Midnightdreary (talk) 01:12, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Hmmmm, would Sparknotes work? They have insightful stuff about stories. The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 22:29, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Nope. See here. A reliable source on this sort of thing is usually peer-reviewed or by an established expert/scholar. I'll do some digging one of these days; I have a fairly decent library of Hawthorne biographies and critical analysis of his work. --Midnightdreary (talk) 22:54, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Ah, I had a feeling it wasn't, but I coudn't exactly put my finger on a clear answer. Hm, I'll do some searching too, but youre probably a much better authority on these things than I am. I just happen to take interest in certain short stories. The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 01:00, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Hi, Im doing a literary analysis for my english class, and i need some sort of imagery or sybolism(used in the development of a theme; symbolic meaning, found in "Young Goodman Brown")to write about in my paper, and im really stumped, an could use imediate help 99.175.219.45 (talk) 02:18, 8 October 2009 (UTC)PoLLo99.175.219.45 (talk) 02:18, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, this page is not for homework help. Try the Wikipedia:Reference desk? --Midnightdreary (talk) 03:03, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

--Kbrewer36 (talk) 20:54, 10 March 2010 (UTC)There's been a ton of ink spilled on symbolism in the story, but there's also a legitimate argument about whether these are really symbols or not. Faith's pink ribbons can also just be a realistic detail. So while the symbolic meaning should be discussed, there should be an acknowledgment that symbolic interpretations are contested. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kbrewer36 (talk • contribs) 18:48, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Expansion?

Does the Analysis section really need expansion? From what I can see, it is quite thorough, and might be ready to remove that tag. The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 19:13, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

What it really needs are sources! My guess is that the expansion tag was up before someone added all the unsourced info. The stuff without sources is subject to removal at any time as original research. --Midnightdreary (talk) 01:10, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Hm...so, should we remove it? I'll try to find the person who added it and ask for sources. Hopefully, it's not just out of his brain. Mr. Wayne (talk) 23:30, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

The history of the page is so confusing that I can't find who added that stuff. So, I decided to add that tag for original research. I'll see if I can come up with sources. Mr. Wayne (talk) 23:39, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

If it really bothers anyone, we can always just remove the stuff that's lacks cites. A portion of it already has footnotes so we can leave that and add back the expansion tag. --Midnightdreary (talk) 23:53, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Wow, you're pretty prompt. :) So, is the box I added ok? Mr. Wayne (talk) 00:04, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

City upon a hill

The reference to Winthrop's "city upon a hill" is a bit of a throwaway anyway, but the author might want to remove or revise it --

"The plot and textual references in "Young Goodman Brown" reveal the Puritans as being like "a city upon a hill" as John Winthrop, a founder of Puritanism, said, and wanting to be seen that way as good, holy men."

That use is based on a common misunderstanding of Winthrop's intention. Winthrop definitely was not saying "we shall be as a city on a hill because we are so good and holy" It was a dire warning to the puritans to watch their collective step because everyone would be watching them:

The Lord will be our God, and delight to dwell among us, as His own people, and will command a blessing upon us in all our ways, so that we shall see much more of His wisdom, power, goodness and truth, than formerly we have been acquainted with. We shall find that the God of Israel is among us, when ten of us shall be able to resist a thousand of our enemies; when He shall make us a praise and glory that men shall say of succeeding plantations, "may the Lord make it like that of New England." For we must consider that we shall be as a city upon a hill. The eyes of all people are upon us. So that if we shall deal falsely with our God in this work we have undertaken, and so cause Him to withdraw His present help from us, we shall be made a story and a by-word through the world. We shall open the mouths of enemies to speak evil of the ways of God, and all professors for God's sake. We shall shame the faces of many of God's worthy servants, and cause their prayers to be turned into curses upon us till we be consumed out of the good land whither we are going.

If the Puritans in Goodman Brown are like a city upon a hill, they've obviously decided "Well then -- we'd better take to the woods!"Grammargal (talk) 21:38, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

The line is unsourced and is probably the personal musing of a prior editor. It seems to have little bearing on the article anyway. It's probably okay to remove it. --Midnightdreary (talk) 22:30, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Assessment comment

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== Symbolism == I think including a section on symbolism would we a great idea. Symbols might include Faith's pink ribbons, the staff, and other things. The Dark Knight ★ of Wikipedia 00:08, 6 October 2009 (UTC) == Theology == Calvinism doesn't believe that anyone is "born in the state of grace." We are all born in a fallen state and rightly condemned by a just God to hell. But He has chosen from all time to redeem some, the elect, by the death and resurrection of Christ. When Christ is preached to these, they accept Him, and are reborn. The first sentence might read "that mankind is in a state of total depravity and are all doomed to hell except those elected by God to be redeemed. " I am not myself a Calvinist, and will ask someone who is to review this. ````eulogos1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eulogos1 (talk • contribs) 18:00, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Last edited at 18:01, 5 September 2011 (UTC). Substituted at 11:10, 30 April 2016 (UTC)