Talk:Rusyn language/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Why moving Rusyn language to Western Carpathian dialects?

Why this moving? Rusyn language is officaly recognized by Slovakia. However, in Ucraina it is consider to be just a dialect.

In fact Rusyn language has many 50% from Slovak (West Slavic language) and 50% from Ucrainian (East Slavic language). Just because it is written in Cyrilic letters there is no reason that it should be consider to be a dialect. Skrabbit (talk) 14:36, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Rusyn is one of the Western Ukrainian dialects from the Carpathian mountains. Boiko, Hutsyl, Bukovynian are also. No academic source has ever stated that Boiko, Hutsul, Lemko are dialects or variants of Rusyn.--Bandurist (talk) 05:34, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Rusyn is recognised in Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Poland and Slovakia as a minority language.. Moving the article about Rusyn language to "Western Ukrainain dialects" is a non-neutral action since it represents only the official point of view of the Ukrainian state. This would be the same as, for exemple, moving the page about Macedonian language to Western Bulgarian Dialects--- It is unacceptable, since against neutrality policy of Wikipedia. Let's not politicise the encyclopedia!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.226.107.182 (talk) 11:07, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

References

what kind of references are those? There are no dual opinions. There is only one fact that Rusyn language is the Ukrainian language. That has been studied and proven fact. The word Rusyn comes from the country of Rus and later the Halych Rus. During Poland and Hungarian occupations people got confused as they were told that Ukrainians are closely related to Moscow and is the Moscovite invented nationality. That is of course a "bologne". Nonetheless that issue keeps on popping now and then due to listening to some self educated know-it-all people. Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 18:07, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Official language in Slovakia

Hi, I checked ref [1] given to support "Official language in Slovakia" article entry and found no mention of Rusyn language there. I'm going to remove that, please provide a confirming quote from the source if you intend to put it back. --windyhead (talk) 14:46, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Do you speak Slovak?

http://www.kbdesign.sk/cla/projects/language_policy/legislation/Zkon%20a%20pouzivania%20jazyka%20nrodnostnych%20mensin.htm Law Nr. 184/1999 "§ 2 (1) Ak občania Slovenskej republiky, ktorí sú osobami patriacimi k národnostnej menšine, tvoria podľa posledného sčítania obyvateľov v obci najmenej 20 % obyvateľstva, môžu v tejto obci používať v úradnom styku jazyk menšiny.

If the citizens of the Slovak Republic who are persons belonging to national minorities, are the last census in the municipality at least 20% of the population in this village can be used in official communication language of the minority.

List of minorities according the villages is available on the pages of Census population at http://www.statistics.sk/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kprwiki (talk • contribs) 21:26, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Further references (it is just a sample I have just found; Rusyn language is used on the local scale):

Osoba, ktorej materinským jazykom je jazyk spĺňajúci požiadavku základnej zrozumiteľnosti z hľadiska štátneho jazyka, môže v úradnom styku používať svoj materinský jazyk.

Computer translation: A person whose mother tongue is the language of satisfying the basic requirement of clarity in terms of the state language in official contacts may use their mother tongue.

It applies e.g. to Czech language and Rusyn language. http://portal.gov.sk/Portal/sk/Default.aspx?CatID=39&aid=591

Public defender of rights - page in Rusyn language http://www.vop.gov.sk/49

President candidate - official pages in Rusyn http://www.zuzanamartinakova.sk/ru/index.php

Court where the speach was in Rusyn language - http://www.cassovia.sk/news/13543 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kprwiki (talk • contribs) 21:50, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your links. You can add information from sources to article. None of those sources tells that Rusyn is official in Slovakia however. The source must explicitly say that for that information to be added to article. Until such source is provided please don't add that into article. --windyhead (talk) 12:42, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

There is no such source, which explicitly says that Rusyn is offical in Slovakia. The law joins 2 facts:

1, population census - people say which is their nationality + mother tongue language

2, and the law 184/1999 as well as other laws who state the conditions under which those languages can be used, but in none source it is written explicitly such list of languages whos it concern (probably due to political reasons - Slovak national party (Slovak nationalists) and Hungarian questions).

Other source - check up Slovakia section http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Charter_for_Regional_or_Minority_Languages

Nevertheless Rusyn is really offical in those municipalities and therefore it can be mentioned on wiki. There are villages where knowledge of local people of Slovak language is in fact very poor (simmilar to villages where Hungarian spekaers are the majority). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kprwiki (talk • contribs) 13:19, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

Use of word "autoteunic"

"Rusyns living outside of their autoteunic region often do not speak it fluently."

I have not come across the word "autoteunic" before so I looked it up on Google, and every single result was either this Wikipedia article or a page derived from the article. The word was not found in any page unrelated to this article.

I also looked up "teunic" and the only results were irrelevant - for example, people's usernames on forums or the name of something in a video game.

I therefore feel that this word is unlikely to mean much to the vast majority of people reading the article, and that people who do not understand it will struggle to find out its meaning. I think it should be replaced by a word that will be more readily understood. However I do not want to replace it myself as I am not sure quite what is meant. I'm assuming it means out of the region where the language is generally spoken, but I'm not sure.

If you understand what is meant and can think of an appropriate way to edit this sentence, I think this would improve the article. --Crana (talk) 11:00, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Given the context, I'd say you're right about what it is supposed to mean. Maybe "autochthonous" or even simply "main" could be used here? --JorisvS (talk) 11:13, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

I replaced it with "traditional home". This seemed to be a bit more specific about the area without drawing a boundary around it. --Taivo (talk) 13:19, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Weird POV in Classification Section

"The Stratfor centre for the analysis and study of Geopolitics states that the support of Rusyn separatism will lead to the political disintegration of Ukraine in order to return it to the control of the Kremlin. [14]" This seems pretty out of place is an article on a language or dialect. Nowhere else does the article mention separatism, and a state recognizing multiple ethnic groups or languages does not imply a breakdown of a state. I think this is really inappropriate. Mahabhusuku (talk) 00:45, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

That and the paragraph about culture centers are both out of place here. --Taivo (talk) 01:34, 1 February 2012 (UTC)