Talk:Penlee lifeboat disaster

Solomon Browne

can you explain what "solomon Brown " is and what's happened — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.161.226.206 (talk) 06:10, 22 May 2006

Everything is clearly explained in the article. Icundell 23:21, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Tribute poem

I have removed the section from the article that contained the memorial peom (more appropriate in Wikisource?) but the text is below:

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A Tribute

The year 2006 marks the 25th anniversary of the Penlee Lifeboat Disaster. The following poem was written by Brian O’Dowda (Bodowda@ntlworld.com) in January 1982 and is dedicated to the heroism of the Solomon Browne’s crew.

Duty

Teatime in Cornwall on a Saturday night,

Just six days to Christmas, the storm at its height

A maroon was sent up that brought men at the run,

But this was Penlee, and the year eighty-one.

Cox Richards saw the fearful might of the sea

And breathed a soft prayer that the boat would slip free

He’ll not get her launched, the experienced ones knew,

But William calmly selected his crew.

He turned back Neil Brockman though eager and brave,

And slipped the ‘Browne’ towards the wild tempest wave.

“Just one from each house” His cry lost on the storm,

But out of such wisdom legends are born

James Madron, Nigel Brockman, say their names with pride,

With Barry Torrie and Gary Wallis; but why had they died?

For a Lloyds Open Charter and a deadly delay,

While a tugboat stood handy – but would owners pay?

Kevin Smith was on leave but he didn’t wait,

With Charles Greenhough and John Blewett went to their fate.

To man the swift lifeboat and take on the storm

For saving men’s lives is why they were born.

And what a staggering total of lives they had won

Solomon Brown’s tally had reached ninety-one!

She crashed through the gale for the three-hundredth time

To raise her saved number to around ninety-nine.

They succeeded at first past their own wildest dreams

To pluck frightened victims from the coaster’s deck beams

One, two, three four were hauled safely aboard

While a Culdrose Sea King could do naught but record

The fantastic bravery of the Solomon’s crew

Returning time after time – what more could they do?

In sixty-foot seas that were December cold

That fearless young crew that would never grow old

But the heroic rescue was doomed from the start

When the furious storm played her own heartless part

Reclaiming those lives so desperately won

From Mousehole and Penlee, in the year eighty-one

Brian O’Dowda January 1982

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-- ALoan (Talk) 10:56, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

In my opinion - the poem could have remained in the article ClemMcGann (talk) 11:21, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

BBC documentary

In August 2006, the BBC had a very good documentary on the disaster on TV. It had a long interview with the helicopter pilot who tried to help and saw parts of what happened. Oddly, he was an American Navy pilot on exchange with the Royal Navy at the time.

It was very moving and could be a source for additional information here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mjmarcus (talk • contribs) 16:48, 20 Aug 2006

Henry Moreton

At the start the captain is Henry "Morton". In the crew list he is "Moreton" Which is it, and could the article be corrected accordingly? --Skunkbot Not a robot. Thought it just sounded cool. 21:16, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Moreton (according to Penlee: The Loss of a Lifeboat, by Michael Sagar-Fenton). Thanks for spotting that, will correct it now. DuncanHill (talk) 21:27, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Both spellings are used in different sources. The reference I've used says "Morton" so I've reverted to that until someone can find a definitive answer (or wants to quote another source!) Geof Sheppard (talk) 17:48, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

The spelling is consistently "Morton" in this thread (referenced in the article), including comments apparently from relatives and friends of Henry Morton. (Though their reliability is perhaps slightly undermined by the fact that one of them spells his Christian name as "Henrey"!) Vilĉjo (talk) 22:38, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

Lacmn

The rank of Lacmn, commonly rendered LACMN, stands for Leading Aircrewman in the Fleet Air Arm of the British Royal Navy, if this page's editor feels it would be helpful to insert it somewhere convenient to describing the crew complement of the Sea King search-and-rescue helicopter.The similar rank of Leading aircraftman is abbreviated (LAC).
☺ Dick Kimball (talk) 16:03, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

Gold Medal

Noteworthy to add to the 'Aftermath section'? RNLI annouce the Gold Medal awarded to Coxswain Trevelyan Richards is missing, potentially stolen. http://rnli.org/NewsCentre/Pages/RNLI-in-appeal-for-missing-gold-medal-awarded-to-Penlee-coxswain.aspx — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.37.157.209 (talk) 22:45, 2 September 2016 (UTC)

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Date changed

Someone has changed the date of when the MV Union Star was launched from 19 November, 1981, to 11 November, 1981, the editor, @Popcornfud also added that the source shouldn't be used at all. Can anyone explain this?

Sincerely, 49.192.44.178 (talk) 11:59, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

Hi.

All claims on Wikipedia require citations to reliable secondary sources. See WP:CITE.

The citation used in the article is this page. It says On December 11 1981 captain Morton set sail on his maiden voyage. I took that to mean this was when the ship was launched — however, I might be misreading this, and I'm happy to be corrected by someone who knows more about nautical terminology than me.

Issues:

1) I'm not sure if this site is a reliable source for Wikipedia purposes, in which case we can't use it anyway.

2) If we don't use this source then we need to find a reliable source to use for the date instead. Popcornfud (talk) 12:17, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

The 'Submerged' website gives a sailing date, not a launch date, but Penlee - the loss of a lifeboat states (page 2) that the Union Star's voyage "had begun at 5.00 pm on the 17th" with 4 days allowed for the voyage - which makes a lot more sense than starting on the 11th. I suggest we remove mention of a launch date but retain the fact that it was a maiden voyage, which most sources confirm. Geof Sheppard (talk) 16:31, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

Awareness of Title

This is more to maintain awareness and i however thankful that the introduction immediately mentions everything neutrally and mentions the sixteen people that lost their lives, I get so annoyed when other sources only mention that eight lifeboatmen lost their lives.

So this post serves in a hope that this is maintained, the only unfortunate thing remaining is that the title of the disaster doesn't refer to the Union Star or provides an Alias in some way and i wonder if this could be discussed further. Fmountford (talk) 11:05, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Article titles are based (partly at least) on WP:COMMONNAME, and while there isn’t a formal name for the tragedy, I think “Penlee lifeboat disaster” is more common than anything else I’ve seen.

You are right on the rest of your post: the lead should make clear that 8 died from the Union Star and 8 from the lifeboat. - SchroCat (talk) 11:10, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

The MV Union Star doesn't have an article of its own, but could be created as a redirect to this one. Geof Sheppard (talk) 16:14, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Just checked and MV Union Star already exists and redirects to Penlee_lifeboat_disaster#MV_Union_Star; Union Star is a disambig page which lists the page and provides a link to the article. - SchroCat (talk) 16:22, 8 June 2023 (UTC)