Talk:Olimpie

Date of premiere, spelling of the title, and identity of the conductor

BnF has a "Notice de spectacle" concerning this work here. It lists the title as "Olympie" and the date of the premiere as 28 December 1819. (Both of these differ with New Grove Opera, which has "Olimpie" and 22 December 1819.) The Paris Opera's first librarian Lajarte, who inventoried the score and the libretto in his collection, spells it "Olympie", but states that the premiere was on "le mercredi 22 décembre 1819 (le livret porte, par erreur, la date du 20 décembre" [1]. Tamvaco 2000, p. 619 ( snippet view at Google Books), agrees with the BnF, that the premiere was on 28 December, also spells it "Olympie", and says in a footnote that the conductor of the premiere was the recently appointed co-chief conductor Henri-Justin-Joseph Valentino. (He and Habeneck were appointed in 1819, after the retirement of Louis Luc Loiseau de Persuis.)

• Tamvaco, Jean-Louis (2000). Les Cancans de l'Opéra. Chroniques de l'Académie Royale de Musique et du théâtre, à Paris sous les deux restorations (2 volumes, in French). Paris: CNRS Editions. ISBN 9782271056856.

As of this moment I have the feeling we should use the information from BnF and Tamvaco and put the info which differs in other sources in footnotes. --Robert.Allen (talk) 03:20, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

When I came across these discrepancies, I really knew nothing much about this opera. It was pretty much a failure, and according to Lajarte, Spontini made substantial changes during the initial run, and from the surviving music, it is almost impossible to determine how it was initially performed. Apparently the 1821 German version (titled "Olimpia"), which was mounted under Spontini's supervision, survives (at least as a vocal score: OCLC 83342850 with German and French text), as well as the 1826 French version (titled "Olimpie"; see libretto at Gallica [2]), which is the version used in the Albrecht recording, although apparently the recording chooses to use the original spelling "Olympie". I am relying on OCLC 18396752 for this information. I do not have the recording. According to Hugh McDonald, writing in the Penguin Guide, Berlioz praised the opera as "in every way worthy of the composer of La vestale". Berlioz must have seen the 1826 revival. There is a French vocal score at IMSLP (with the title spelled "Olympie") and a facsimile edition of the 1826 (?) full score from a copy in the New York Public Library, with an introduction by Charles Rosen (ISBN 9780824029432). --Robert.Allen (talk) 07:07, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

FWIW, Casaglia's Almanacco has Olympie for the premiere, Olimpia ("Olympia", "Olimpie") for the Berlin performances and Olimpie for the final version. The latter apparently includes an aria by Weber! I also notice among the principals there Laure Cinti-Damoreau (as "Olympie"!) and Adolphe Nourrit - it might be worth expanding the roles table to include the final version's premiere cast. I'd be inclined to leave it as Olimpie but give a nod to the other forms. (Oh, and Casaglia has the conductor of the original premiere as Rodolphe Kreutzer!.) --GuillaumeTell 18:20, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

Proposed move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was not moved. - UtherSRG (talk) 03:33, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Olimpie → Olympie – This is the spelling of the name as listed at the Biobliothèque nationale de France and in Tamvaco's 2000 book which covers the history of the Paris Opera during the Restoration. See above comment, "Date of premiere, spelling of the title, and identity of the conductor", for more details and links. --Robert.Allen (talk) 20:38, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

• Weak oppose – After some discussion with two other editors at other locations and some more research, we are thinking that we should probably leave it as Olimpie and just add some discussion of the variants in the spelling to the article. --Robert.Allen (talk) 19:40, 15 March 2012 (UTC)
• Weak oppose – In line with what I wrote on WikiProject Opera today [3]... A lot of these "contradictions" are simply the result of the preferences of type-setters in the case of pre-20th century works and the fact that the spellings of many words are (or were) in free variation. Note that on the autograph score Spontini himself spells it "Olimpie". As long as the re-direct is in place and the alternative spelling is mentioned in the lede, leaving it at this title is fine. As an aside, it's the same with Rossini's wife, Olympe Pélissier. Her first name is also in free-variation in sources. Rossini spelled her name "Olimpe" in his letters to her. Voceditenore (talk) 12:53, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.