Talk:Hurricane Dean/GA1

GA Review

Hi Plasticup. I will be reviewing your article. It is the first GA review I have ever done so I hope I can help you out. Do you mind if I just fix little errors myself, or do you want everything listed here? —Mattisse (Talk) 19:48, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Feel free to fix anything you see. In an article this size that is the only way to accomplish anything. Plasticup ^T/C 13:21, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• This sentence in the lead needs some fixing: "Remarkably, none of the deaths were the result of Hurricane Dean's exceptionally unusually Category 5-strength landfall."

Maybe you could leave out the "exceptionally" as "unusual Category 5-strength" might cover it, along with "remarkably".

• How about ""Remarkably, none of the deaths were the result of Hurricane Dean's unusual and exceptionally intense Category 5 landfall."" Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

  If he is thinking about FAC, the "remarkably" should be removed as POV. —Mattisse (Talk) 01:17, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Someone removed it, stating that it needed a citation to ensure NPOV. Nevermind that it was in the lead and was well cited thoughout the body of the article. Anyway, it should be alright now. Plasticup ^T/C 13:21, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• Also, I have a question about a related sentence: "The hurricane's intense winds, waves, rains and storm surge were directly responsible for at least 37 deaths...". Are not these events part of the landfall? Is it "landfall" that usually causes deaths? (Living in a hurricane zone—in fact facing a hurricane at this moment—we are always being told otherwise.)

  Not always. A hurricane can cause massive damage without actually landing anywhere, especially if its right-front quadrant passes over land. Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

  But what about this case, Hurricane Dean? —Mattisse (Talk) 01:17, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

There were intense winds, rains, and storm surges all over the Caribbean, where Dean did not actually make landfall. So yes, in this case the events are not necessarily parts of the landfall. Plasticup ^T/C 13:21, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• This sentence needs some clarification, perhaps with punctuation and/or rephrasing: "Although Mexico bore the brunt of Hurricane Dean's strength, the landfall missed major population centers and caused little more damage there than early in its formation when it passed the French overseas department of Martinique."

  How about ""Although Mexico bore the brunt of Hurricane Dean's strength, the landfall missed major population centers and caused $800 million (2007 USD) of property damage in the country. This amount was slightly more than the damage Dean caused when it passed the French overseas department of Martinique early in the storm's formation."" Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

  Much better! —Mattisse (Talk) 01:17, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

I don't want to get into country-specific damage totals in the lead, but I agree that the original sentence was confusing. This is what I have replaced it with: Although Mexico bore the brunt of Hurricane Dean's strength, the landfall missed major population centers. As a result, it caused little more damage there than early in its formation when it passed the French overseas department of Martinique as a Category 2 hurricane. Plasticup ^T/C 13:21, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• This sentence is not entirely clear: "On August 18, 2007, 10,300 barrels (1,210 m³) of oil and 11 million cubic feet (310,000 m³) of natural gas were shut in per day,"

  Not really sure what's wrong with it. "Shut in" is a term in the oil exploration industry for when wells are shut down and the oil/gas remains below the oceanic or continental surface. Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

  Then isn't that called jargon and to be avoided per MoS? —Mattisse (Talk) 01:17, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

I made a page, Shut-in (oil drilling), and wikilinked to it. Plasticup ^T/C 13:55, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• "Fifteen countries felt the effects of Hurricane Dean as its path through the Caribbean Sea claimed 42 lives." Is this different from the 37 lives in the lead?
  • Yeah, that's wrong. Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

And corrected. Plasticup ^T/C 14:05, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• "encountering favorable conditions": I know your source does not explain what "favorable conditions" are, could you possibly explain (or wikilink) for those of us trying to understand hurricanes?
  • Tropical cyclogenesis#Requirements for formation Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

  Great to link that in. —Mattisse (Talk) 01:17, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Done. Plasticup ^T/C 13:55, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• "The Cayman Islands were expected to suffer brutally...". Perhaps another word is better suited, as brutality seems like something dictators do.
  • That's Plasticup's style... he can defend it himself. :P Titoxd^{(?!? - cool stuff)} 00:04, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

You know what's coming here... brutal is a word with a meaning, and that meaning accurately describes the effects of a Category 5 hurricane. Especially when most of your country is only a few feet above sea level. Plasticup ^T/C 13:55, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• I believe Tony says that when a "to" is implied in a range ("Rainfall amounts of 4–8 in (100–200 mm) fell across the states") you should use the word "to" and not a hyphen or ndash.

Fixed there, and in a few other places. Plasticup ^T/C 14:05, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• I'm curious why in your Aftermath section, you have not kept to the same heading format as the other sections.

There wasn't much aftermath in the Greater Antilles, except for in Jamaica, so it didn't make sense to continue the "Greater Antilles" subheadings and only write about one island. Same goes for Belize and the "Other regions". Plasticup ^T/C 13:55, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• Some of your wording is idiosyncratic, but that can be personal preference. The article is excellent, well-referenced and well-organized. The grammar and wikilinking are good. Ready for FAC I'd say, after you fix a few things mentioned above. —Mattisse (Talk) 22:55, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

My Lord, this is the most detailed GA nomination review I have ever seen. Don't worry, that's a good thing. I'll be giving this review my full attention in a few hours. Plasticup ^T/C 10:34, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• Comment - You know that "exceptionally unusual" will never pass FAC, but, of course, will not hold up things here. Could you not say "Hurricane Dean's exceptional Category 5 landfall strength" or something similar. "Hurricane Dean's exceptional landfall strength, even for a Category 5"? Exceptional and unusual have, more or less, the same meaning. —Mattisse (Talk) 15:11, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• Everything looks great and I am passing the article. —Mattisse (Talk) 15:19, 19 August 2008 (UTC)