Talk:Balfron

Untitled

The phrase ‘the new school, although architecturally a piece of sheer brilliance’ is exceptionally subjective and has no place in a non-biased article. It has been removed.

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Should this not also apply to the comment on the management? Is the detail on the state of the building current? Youth groups - reference to Fire Cadets removed as they have been disbanded. No Christian youth group operates at the moment. 217.43.144.88 (talk) 23:01, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

Wolves Vs Vikings

The removal of the following seems extreme:

Modern historians believe that an attack by Vikings was more likely, as they did steal children. Haakon’s Saga and Exchequer Rolls of the time give evidence of a Norse invasion as far as Stirling Castle through the Endrick Valley in 1263 – the same year as the Battle of Largs.

This is a valid reference to an alternative version. It would be more appropriate, surely, to ask for a relevant source? Shipsview (talk) 16:32, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

At first I would have thought so, especially since the Vikings are mentioned in the source for the rest of that sentence, but on further investigation I'm not sure. The most significant discussion about Viking involvement in Balfron I can find is this, which suggests that the idea of a Viking attack on Balfron only really came to light in 1999 and doesn't mention any effect on the name of the village. So while we should mention the Vikings in some form, the naming discussion might well be better left out, at least until something more convincing turns up. Alzarian16 (talk) 16:58, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

The saga which states that Alan MacRuairi (not a viking) went far across Scotland, and slew many men, states that it was the actually the Scots who impaled little children when they invaded Skye in 1262 (this act was actually the final straw for the Norwegian king, who launched his expedition the following year because of continued Scottish aggression into the Isles). This makes me think that the webpage is muddled and not reliable for unpublished theories. Like Alzarian16, I don't see any specific evidence linking the town to vikings.

Since Buthbren looks completely different than Balfron, I searched GoogleBooks and found this snippet: Balfron (parish, Stirlingshire) Both- ~ Bal- Buthbren 1233; Buthbrene 1303; Balfran c.1609 (? Cumbric or Pictish *pren 'tree'). It's from NOMINA, volumes 20-22, page 18, published in 1997, which is journal of the Society for Name Studies in Britain and Ireland. Maybe someone has access to that journal at their library and can read the full paper. So it seems that, despite what the webpage says, the placename dates to 1233, before Alan's rampage of 1263, and that the name may have British/Pictish roots. I wonder if the whole wolves story is a case of folk etymology. It'd be interesting to see the earliest reference to such a tradition, and the earliest date of the 'village of mourning' etymology; I wonder if the man who first came up with this etymology was unaware of the 1233-1303 forms of the name.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 08:30, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

Excellent comment by Brianann. I came to this talk page all ready to harumph only to find that someone had got there before me! This is a typical case of Gaelic myopia and arrogance. Balfron is within the original vice-royalty of the Lennox where Brythonic was spoken really up 1100. So the original name is clearly "Welsh" and means what Brianann says. The fact that it has since been corrupted by Gaels who were completely uncaring of the meaning is a secondary matter. There is a similar problem with Balquhidder which retained its original Pictish pronunciation into the 1500s and spelling at least as far as the Ragman Roll. Strictly speaking it could mean "the house made of wood" (cf Welsh "pont bren"), but given the existence of the oak tree which was already old in 1300, it is more likely to mean "the house by the oak tree". Freuchie (talk) 21:57, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

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Village or Town

Balfron is a village, as defined by the Community Council, and elsewhere. Can we please bring editing wars to an end til an different category is defines. Shipsview (talk) 19:42, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

References