Talk:Ava (given name)

Bookworm857158367

Bookworm857158367 keeps adding the following statement to the article:

"One factor in its increase in popularity may have been the naming of the daughters of actress Heather Locklear and musician Richie Sambora, in 1997, and of actors Reese Witherspoon and Ryan Phillippe in 1999. Phillippe said in a recent magazine interview that he and Witherspoon named their child after actress Ava Gardner."

The statement is supposedly supported by this link [1]. The problem is that the link doesn't say anything about the popularity of this name being increased because of these people. Locklear and Sambora aren't even mentioned. Bookworm857158367, get a grip.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 05:10, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Since you asked for a source, I added the source from one of several books I have that says exactly that. Leave it alone. --Bookworm857158367 (talk) 05:17, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

What does it say? Quote it right here.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 05:19, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

This is getting ridiculous. "Glamour girl name given big popularity boost -- it's in the top 10 and sure to climb even higher -- when several high profile stars such as Reese Witherspoon chose it for their daughters." I don't plan to dig through my bookshelves for the other references I have that say essentially the same thing right now, but most mention Witherspoon and Heather Locklear as a reason for the popularity of the name. And I remember reading news articles that referenced them when Ava first hit the top 10 a few years ago. --Bookworm857158367 (talk) 05:27, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

So Locklear and Sambora shouldn't mentioned in the article. Obviously you know why (Wikipedia:Verifiability). I'm marking them as unreferenced for now, and will remove them tomorrow maybe.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 05:47, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Still ridiculous, but I have added yet another reference. --Bookworm857158367 (talk) 05:56, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

You added a blog, which are not reliable sources per Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources. You should know all this stuff by now.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 06:11, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Considering the subject matter, I think a blog is sufficient, but since you insist I have added yet another reference that lists Heather Locklear and Richie Sambora among the many celebrities who have daughters named Ava who have contributed to the boost in popularity of the name. And now that this has reached the heights of ridiculousness I am going to bed. --Bookworm857158367 (talk) 06:36, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

It's not sufficient because it's not a reliable source. Can you quote the book you gave? Citing and verifying sources isn't ridiculous, it's how Wikipedia works; mindless edit warring over something you aren't willing to take a second look at is ridiculous.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 07:30, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

I've cited the page number and the book it's from, which is sufficient if you or anyone else cares to look it up. The entry itself is a dictionary entry: "Radiating the sultry retro glamour of Ava Gardner, and propelled by its hot celebrity-favorite status, this name has made a spectacular clumb up the popularity charts for parents across the board." Under the entry is a list of celebrity parents, in order of the age of their children: ... Heather Locklear and Richie Sambora ... Reese Witherspoon and Ryan Philippe ... etc. etc. etc. who have used the name and contributed to its popularity. And now I am really done with this discussion. It is more than adequately cited. --Bookworm857158367 (talk) 12:56, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

I have no idea what Brianann MacAmhlaidh was trying to achieve here. Wikipedia's problem is not failure to correctly report pop culture fads. Its problem is the consultation of actual literature for claims that concern the "ancient" periods before 1990 or so.

It is perfectly straightforward that the name experiences a surge of popularity, and that this was triggered by some celebrity babies. THis can be trivially and adequately referenced by any number of online sources.

The mode difficult bit is the origin of the name, and as usual, the article was messing this up. There are three origins of the name, or three distinct but homonymous names here.

1. the medieval name, which went extinct apart from its derivation Evelyn.
2. the modern name, which arose in the 19th century and became popular with Ava Gardner.
3. the Persian name.

The only problem is posed by the modern name, as it seems to arise from nowhere. It was a fad of the Victorian era to give more interesting or exotic spellings to existing names, and it is likely, and the supposition of the Oxford Dictionary of First Names, that Ava simply arose from this fashion, presumably as a variant of Eva and/or Aoife.

The name only needed to be picked once, by the parents of Ava Lowle Willing (b. 1868). As Ava Lowle Willing became a famous socialite, and her daughter a famous heiress, no more was needed to start the new name on its course towards popularity.

The question is reduced to, can we find any modern use of the name predating 1868. The Oxford Dictionary says there is no known use prior to the 19th century (since the old name Ava had disappeared in the 11th century or so). So if we can identify people called Ava born in the early 19th, or better yet in the 18th century, it would be an interesting addition to the article. If we fail to locate any reference to Avas born before 1868, we will be able to state that she was the first known bearer of the modern name Ava. --dab (𒁳) 08:46, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20111206020758/http://appellationmountain.net/2010/09/29/baby-name-of-the-day-ava/ to http://appellationmountain.net/2010/09/29/baby-name-of-the-day-ava/
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080418073155/http://www.parade.com/articles/editions/2008/edition_03-23-2008/In_Step_With...Ryan_Phillippe to http://www.parade.com/articles/editions/2008/edition_03-23-2008/In_Step_With...Ryan_Phillippe

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Meaning of a girl's given name

Ava as a female name, is related to Catholic? 41.186.78.51 (talk) 10:08, 2 June 2022 (UTC)