Talk:Al-Haq

NGO Monitor

77.103.124.152, NGO Monitor are not an WP:RS for factual information especially about a living person. They can be used as a source for information about NGO Monitor as an organization and their own opinions. If you would like to include factual information sourced to NGO Monitor you need to establish that they are a reliable source for the specific information in this specific context via WP:RS/N. Secondly, "activities related to his involvement in the PFLP since 1985" does not comply with WP:NPOV. No evidence of "his involvement in the PFLP" has been made available so this is not a verifiable fact, it's an accusation, an unverifiable claim and should be presented as such via something like "his alleged involvement". Sean.hoyland - talk 16:37, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

..and Canada Free Press are not an RS by default. They publish opinion pieces not factual pieces. Again, you would need to establish that they are a reliable source for the specific information in this specific context via WP:RS/N. Sean.hoyland - talk 17:18, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Sean- if the evidence cited by a government is secret for reasons of national security, that does not mean that there is a blanket ban on citing it as a justification. The article presents the issue as if Jabarin was denied free movement on completely arbitrary grounds. What the NGO Monitor article does, citing uncontested facts (i.e that Jabarin has been in administrative detention for eight collective years) only provides clarity as to the Israeli government's long-standing assertion that Jabarin is involved with the PFLP. Clearly, there is sufficient evidence to justify denying his movement on the basis of that claim, as it succeeded in front of a tribunal which had access to evidence which was available exclusively to them on the grounds of national security. This does not mean that he is necessarily involved with the PFLP, just that there are clearly grounds cited by the Israeli government which satisfied the Supreme Court. It certainly does no injustice to Jabarin, or the reader, to understand that this is not an isolated, arbitrary decision on the part of Israel, but rather part of a long-standing argument over Jabarin's alleged involvement with the PFLP.

Now, I have cited ABC news, which cites the same court documents that are apparently sourced by Al Haq (which is still not justified as a reliable source on matters pertaining to this affair, in my opinion). I hope that helps. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.103.124.152 (talk) 18:24, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Yes, that looks fine to me. Don't forget you can always use Israeli RS like JPost and Haaretz. It might be easier to find relevant articles although having said that, JPost appear to be in the middle of an upgrade so their site is a bit dysfunctional at the moment. It's also trashed all of the existing JPost citations in wiki which probably number in the thousands so if you fancy a mindnumbingly boring task replacing the urls with ones from google's cache this is a rare opportunity...

To be a bit clearer, I didn't say 'there is a blanket ban on citing it as a justification'. It's fine doing that as long as it comes from an RS. It's just about using sources that are designated as reliable in wikipedia and being careful about what is said without attribution using wikipedia's narrative voice. i.e. to make it clear that it is, as you say, the "Israeli government's long-standing assertion that Jabarin is involved with the PFLP." rather than wikipedia just flat out saying "Jabarin is involved with the PFLP" as if it is a fact. It's spelled out in Wikipedia:Npov#A_simple_formulation, "Assert facts, including facts about opinions—but do not assert the opinions themselves."

Al Haq/Jabarin are a reliable source for their own statements and opinions about the issue just like Shin Bet and the HCJ are reliable sources for their own statements and opinions about the issue. From our perspective we have no way of knowing who's right and it doesn't matter anyway. We just need to comply with WP:V, WP:NPOV and WP:BLP(for Jabarin specific info). Sean.hoyland - talk 11:39, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough, Sean. Thank you for your clarification and cooperation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.103.124.152 (talk) 14:00, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

criticism and controversy

sean.hoyland - why was the criticism and controversy section removed? there is indeed plenty of of criticism and controversy over al haq. there are similar sections for hrw, ai, ngom, etc. - why not here?

the first item was this:

Al Haq is a leader in the anti-Israel "lawfare" movement. Its case against the British government to end export licenses to Israel was dismissed by the UK Court of Appeal on November 25, 2008. Al Haq originally brought the case in November 2006 to "secure the implementation of the July 2004 [ICJ] Advisory Opinion on Israel's Wall."

to which you removed the controversial and critical sentence and left the other information. not clear as to why?

the second item was this:

Al Haq regularly submits politically motivated reports to the UN Human Rights Council. For example, the Civic Coalition to Defend Palestinian Rights in Jerusalem – a coalition comprised of 18 NGOs including Al Haq, Miftah, Defense of Children International/Palestine Section (DCI/PS) and PWGAAC -- falsely claims that Israel engages in "racial segregation," has enacted a policy of "Judaization" in Jerusalem, and implies Israel is falsifying Jewish historical ties to Jerusalem.

you removed this completely. it is a complaint and criticism of al haq that they do this. why remove it? thanks. Soosim (talk) 18:13, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

References

al haq and btselem

dlv - you reverted my edit. i don't see it in the RS as you suggest. (not sure the RS is RS but that's a different story). this is the link, yes? http://www.cartercenter.org/news/documents/doc181.html#previous - i do not see the use of the word 'counterpart' anywhere. they are two separate and completely independent organizations with no 'counterpart' on either side or anywhere. Soosim (talk) 14:19, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

The second part of this passage is cited to a supposed CBS article named "The case of al-Haq". the link is dead[1] and Gooogle search for the article title produces no relevant results,[2]. Furthermore Google search for the quote recently added to the article (“most of its members are supporters of Fatah and other members of the PLO terrorist organization”) supported by this source produces no hits at all.[3] Dlv999 (talk) 22:31, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

again: i am having a problem with the word 'counterpart' - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/counterpart - these two organizations are not counterparts. let's find a different word. how about we leave it non-pov just state that both organizations won the prize? Soosim (talk) 06:31, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

From the cited source: "Two groups, one Israeli and one Palestinian, which document human rights violations in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, were selected to share the $100,000 Carter-Menil Rights Award today."

Our article: "Al-Haq and its counterpart, the Israeli human rights organization B'Tselem, were co-recipients of the Carter-Menil Human Rights Prize in 1989"

From your dictionary def: "one having the same function or characteristics as another"

According to the cited RS these are two groups (one Israeli, one Palestinian), "which document human rights violations in the West Bank and Gaza Strip". They are two groups "having the same function or characteristics as another" ie they are counterparts. Dlv999 (talk) 06:40, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

Unless anyone can address the points raised above regarding the material attached to "The case of al-Haq" source I intend to delete it as unverifiable. Dlv999 (talk) 13:00, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

a) dlv - what passage are you referring to? the case of al haq was from a book, not a cbs article, no? b) and i removed the award material anyway from that section since there is nothing to indicate that al haq has anything to do with btselem. Soosim (talk) 15:04, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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External links modified

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Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 May 2022

Al-Haq الحك meaning is The Truth Hamdala99 (talk) 16:35, 28 May 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:41, 28 May 2022 (UTC)

Like Al-Haqq? Selfstudier (talk) 17:01, 28 May 2022 (UTC)

To add to article

To add to this article: the August 2022 raid and closure of Al-Haq's West Bank office (along with six other Palestinian human rights groups) by Israeli forces, which was reported in the international media. 173.88.246.138 (talk) 14:00, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

 Done Selfstudier (talk) 14:04, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 August 2022

Please change "cite web|url=https://english.wafa.ps/Pages/Details/130475|title=" (ref 48) to "{{cite web |url=https://english.wafa.ps/Pages/Details/130475 |title=Israeli forces raid offices of several Palestinian CSOs in Ramallah}}" (add curly brackets and title, not sure about spaces, but they don't seem to matter). 176.247.136.49 (talk) 22:26, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

 Done Selfstudier (talk) 22:33, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Ahmad Jabarin

The mention that the group’s executive director, Shawan Jabarin, has been convicted of recruiting and training PFLP terrorists by Israel, is lacking. However it is an important fact to clarify the situation regarding its alleged link to PFLP. Bageralg (talk) 23:50, 20 September 2022 (UTC)