Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Highways/Hong Kong/Archive 1

New templates

Hi all, I've created three new templates: {{traffic volume top}}, {{traffic volume row}}, and {{traffic volume bottom}}, that can be used for creating tables of traffic volume data, as seen in the new A-Class article Kwinana Freeway and relatively new GA Tonkin Highway (which were previously hardcoded). I've written the documentation and WP:TemplateData. These have been coded using parser functions, but I imagine the logic can be executed using a WP:Lua module (I haven't yet learned to code in Lua). - Evad37 (talk) 13:35, 13 August 2013 (UTC)

Cross-posted to WikiProject Highways and other road wikiprojects. Please reply at WT:HWY#New templates

WT:HWY#Sections

There is a discussion at the above page related to what additional sections (beyond the standard route description, history, junction list) can or must be included on a road article. --Rschen7754 05:11, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

Articles to be PROD/AFD

Starting soon.—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 02:23, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Here's the list; users may object here. Most of these articles fail WP:N.

• Arsenal Street
• Apliu Street
• Belcher's Street
• Bonham Strand
• Caine Road
• Cameron Road
• Carnarvon Road, Hong Kong
• Che Kung Miu Road
• Ching Hong Road
• Cotton Tree Drive

• Cox's Road, Hong Kong
• Elgin Street, Hong Kong
• Fei Ngo Shan Road
• First Street (Hong Kong)
• Garden Road, Hong Kong
• Gough Street
• Granville Road
• Gutzlaff Street
• Haiphong Road
• Hankow Road

• Harbour Road
• Harlech Road
• Hillier Street
• Ice House Street
• Jardine's Bazaar
• Java Road
• Joint Street
• Junction Road, Hong Kong
• Kam Sheung Road
• Kimberley Road

---

• Kimberley Street
• King's Road (Hong Kong)
• Kotewall Road
• Kwai Tsing Interchange
• La Salle Road
• Lancashire Road
• Lei Yue Mun Interchange
• Leighton Road
• Ma On Shan Road
• MacDonnell Road

• Magazine Gap Road
• Man Wa Lane
• Marsh Road
• Nga Tsin Wai Road
• North West Tsing Yi Interchange
• Oxford Road, Hong Kong
• Pei Ho Street
• Peking Road
• Percival Street
• Pok Fu Lam Road

• Pokfield Road
• Pottinger Street
• Pound Lane
• Prince Edward Road
• Queen Victoria Street, Hong Kong
• Reclamation Street
• Robinson Road, Hong Kong
• Rodney Street, Hong Kong
• Rumsey Street
• Russell Street, Hong Kong

---

• Sai Sha Road
• Sai Yeung Choi Street
• Sassoon Road
• Second Street (Hong Kong)
• Sha Tau Kok Road
• Sham Mong Road
• Shantung Street
• Shau Kei Wan Road
• Shek Mun Interchange
• Shing Wong Street

• Soy Street
• St. Francis Street
• Stanley Street, Hong Kong
• Staveley Street
• Stone Nullah Lane
• Stubbs Road
• Sugar Street
• Sun Street (redirected)
• Swatow Street
• Tai Hang Road

• Tai Mo Shan Road
• Tai O Road
• Tai Ping Shan Street
• Tai Tam Road
• Tai Wan Road
• Tam Kon Shan Interchange
• Temple Street, Hong Kong
• Third Street (Hong Kong)
• Thomson Road, Hong Kong
• Tin Chiu Street

---

• Tin Hau Temple Road
• Tin Lok Lane
• To Kwa Wan Road
• Tong Shui Road
• Tonkin Street
• Tonnochy Road
• Tsat Tsz Mui Road
• Tsing Yi Heung Sze Wui Road
• Tsing Yi Interchange
• Tsing Yi Road

• Tsuen Tsing Interchange
• Tung Choi Street
• Tung Lo Wan Road
• Upper Lascar Row
• Wan Chai Road
• Water Street, Hong Kong
• Western Street (Hong Kong)
• Wharf Road
• Whitty Street
• Wing Lee Street

• Wing Sing Street
• Wong Nai Chung Road
• Wood Road
• Wylie Road
• Yee Wo Street
• Yen Chow Street

To be continued.—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 21:51, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

@Heimstern: I'm curious as to your thoughts on this - I don't have enough local knowledge to form an opinion. --Rschen7754 22:46, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Hmm, I'm not really sure. How is notability generally determined for roads? Heimstern Läufer (talk) 00:41, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

Largely through WP:GNG, and standards similar to WP:USRD/NT (though it tends to vary depending on the country). The reason that this came up is because it seems that there's a disproportionate number of road articles for Hong Kong, compared to other countries (relative to the size of the country/region). But there are plenty of articles on the Chinese Wikipedia for many of the above routes, so I'm not sure what to make of it. --Rschen7754 00:44, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

First off, comparing Hong Kong to "other countries" (excluding, say, Singapore) is going to inevitably produce unusual results because Hong Kong is unusually dense, being all one city. So you'll get a larger concentration of urban roads and fewer long arteries. So I don't think comparisons are likely to work well. As for the list, the only one that immediately sets off a red flag is Prince Edward Road, as that's a significant road and seems likely to me to have the coverage needed to establish notability if we search for it. I need to get off the computer, so I'll come back with more later. Heimstern Läufer (talk) 01:06, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

After a second thought, I took off Prince Edward Road.—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 01:18, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

There may be more of these that could be sourced, though I'm not sure of that. Some probably don't need to be on Wikipedia. Would it be possible to go through this nominations relatively slowly, just to make sure there's adequate time for saves if appropriate? Heimstern Läufer (talk) 12:57, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

Sure, I'll start notifying WP:HK and WP:HWY.—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 21:13, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

Pinging HKRD members: User:Kiewii, and User:Marcnut1996 - in case neither following this page. Neither have posted here previously. -- Nbound (talk) 23:54, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

Repinging.(Conversation is still going on)—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 00:03, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Id suggest a small set (half a dozen?) of PRODs at this point, I think -- Nbound (talk) 03:43, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

I've struck several streets off the list. I expanded and sourced Queen Victoria Street back on October 3. And Caine, Robinson and Pok Fu Lam Rds. are all major roadways. The first two are the "main" streets in the Mid-Levels (the only roads that go through the Mid-Levels that connect Western and Central). And Pok Fu Lam Rd. spans the entire western part of Hong Kong Island (making it somewhat of a "highway"). —Bloom6132 (talk) 08:07, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

Struck out Ice House Street from the list. Just finished expanding it. —Bloom6132 (talk) 00:20, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

I have taken interchanges to PROD.—CycloneIsaac–E-Mail 01:26, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Support – agreed, those are not notable. Next PRODs should be short, insignificant streets (maybe Sun, Soy, Wylie, Wood and St. Francis streets, etc). —Bloom6132 (talk) 21:25, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

Please notify the article creator and WPHK when PRODing HK-related articles. Thank you. Also, I have de-PRODed Stone Nullah Lane. That will not be easy, but I believe that it has the potential to become a nice article. Underwaterbuffalo (talk) 02:31, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Agreed with the need to make these PRODs known. Also, I have struck out Temple Street and Sai Yeung Choi Street as they are both major centres of activity, tourist attractions, notable also for their pedestrianization and the latter for the acid attacks which took place there. Good work Bloom6132 for your work on Stone Nullah Lane! Citobun (talk) 09:47, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Struck out King's Road also, as it is one of the most important thoroughfares in eastern HK island. Citobun (talk) 09:59, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

@CycloneIsaac, Rschen7754, Heimstern Läufer, Nbound, Bloom6132, Underwaterbuffalo, and Citobun: Hi there everyone. Just to share my opinion about this matter--two and a half years after your discussion.

Well, some of these articles definitely fail to be notable to be a separate article on its own. Despite this, I think that to delete and redirect everything, just for the purpose of adhering Wikipedia's principles to be unwise, people have worked on it for a long time after all. However, we're here to produce useful and quality work, so merely because efforts are made doesn't mean these efforts should stay. I believe we could do something in between delete all' and retain all.

I suggest the following: Start with the list List of streets and roads in Hong Kong. Currently it is nothing more than a plain list of road names with no much content. Rename the list as List of lists of streets and roads in Hong Kong, and split this current list of road names into individual lists, organised by region. Now, I consider most of the above-listed road articles are not completely obsolete, some are even rather peculiar tourist spots (eg. Pottinger Street). I think what we can do here is to put the less-notable articles into these individual lists I just mentioned, and give a brief introduction to the location, meaning and origin of its name, history etc. alongside, while neglecting the trivial bits of the original article. Again, I'll use Pottinger Street for example:

Road	Overview	References	Photograph
Pottinger Street	also known as the Stone Slabs Street (石板街) by locals since the street is paved by granite stone steps. The street was named in 1853 after Henry Pottinger, the first Governor of Hong Kong, serving from 1843 to 1844.

The more notable streets goes into the list as well, but they will be linked to their respective main article. When tens/hundreds of these road articles that used to be individual pages are organised in such a way, we can both adhere to Wikipedia policies while having no valuable information lost. Readability will also improve as a result. Wishva de Silva (talk) 12:07, 4 July 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for reviving the discussion. It is obvious to me that the way to go is a table format summarizing the details of the less notable streets, while also listing and linking the notable ones. Your work at List of roads in Lantau is fine and follows what has been done at Private housing estates in Hong Kong, basically for the same reasons, i.e. non-notable entities have their own article, do not survive AfD or PROD, so the material contained in these articles should be collected in a table format list. The main hurdle is that creating such tables requires a very substantial amount of time, as anyone who has worked on them will know. So, while most people certainly agree with having such tables, I believe that they simply do not exist because noone has taken the time to create them. This is also true for the "Private housing estates", which is far from being complete. So if you feel like creating these lists and tables, please go ahead.

Now, if all the content of an article about a street has been ported into a table, it will be a pretty uncontroversial move to convert the article into a redirect to the table. Otherwise, you will need to have a discussion.

A good example is in fact Pottinger Street, which you seem to believe is not notable enough, if I understand your meaning properly. Pottinger Street is in my opinion quite notable and with proper work could probably become a "good article". See for instance the case of Shelley Street, which one would have probably thought to be rather obscure, but turns out to be fairly notable after enough research, and could be further expanded.

Finally, I would keep the title as "List of streets and roads in Hong Kong", as "List of lists of streets and roads in Hong Kong" would be unnecessarily complicated, and in fact inaccurate until these sub-lists exist, which may take a few years.

Thank you for the notice and for the work, and again, please start creating these tables if you can. Underwaterbuffalo (talk) 09:39, 7 July 2016 (UTC)

@Underwaterbuffalo: Thanks for replying! Well, umm... I probably wasn't very clear about this but Pottiinger Street is definitely 'Notable' in my opinion, the non-notables to me would include most of those individual alleys in the New Territories or New Kowloon, as well as short lanes within the city proper. I was just using that street as an example. I'm currently on a holiday but will get to starting such lists soon. It'd be great if you and others can help. For months I have been creating these individual road articles and now things start to get a little boring and I began to reconsider. After all of those information collection for a road article, they still cannot exceed Stub Class. It's a dead-end thereafter--no breathing space for that article anymore. In essence, to me keep creating more is no longer worthwhile. Again, my idea is to redirect all the non-notables to the list(s) which are to be created. Wishva de Silva | Talk 16:40, 9 July 2016 (UTC)

Proposal for a shields request page on WP:HWY

There is a discussion on WT:HWY regarding a proposal for a shields request page on WP:HWY - Evad37 (talk) 03:19, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

WT:HWY/ACR#ACR for lists

We are discussing how lists should be reviewed at our A-Class review before a featured list candidate nomination. Your input is welcome. --Rschen7754 06:00, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

New template: infobox highway system

The US has had {{infobox state highway system}}, but now there is a more generic {{infobox highway system}} designed for a more globalized use. Imzadi 1979 → 21:57, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Citing a map

Please join us at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject U.S. Roads#Citing a map for a discussion on possible updates to the format of map citations in Citation Style 1 using {{cite map}}. Imzadi 1979 → 16:40, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

Pageview stats

After a recent request, I added WikiProject Hong Kong Roads to the list of projects to compile monthly pageview stats for. The data is the same used by http://stats.grok.se/en/ but the program is different, and includes the aggregate views from all redirects to each page. The stats are at Wikipedia:WikiProject Hong Kong Roads/Popular pages.

The page will be updated monthly with new data. The edits aren't marked as bot edits, so they will show up in watchlists. You can view more results, request a new project be added to the list, or request a configuration change for this project using the Tool Labs tool. If you have any comments or suggestions, please let me know. Thanks! Mr.Z-man 03:07, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Layout consistency

I've started a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Highways#Layout consistency regarding the layout order of non-standard sections (ex Tolls, Services, unique top-level sections etc), which I have come to notice varies even between Featured Articles. Your input is appreciated. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 21:27, 27 July 2014 (UTC)

Comment on the WikiProject X proposal

Hello there! As you may already know, most WikiProjects here on Wikipedia struggle to stay active after they've been founded. I believe there is a lot of potential for WikiProjects to facilitate collaboration across subject areas, so I have submitted a grant proposal with the Wikimedia Foundation for the "WikiProject X" project. WikiProject X will study what makes WikiProjects succeed in retaining editors and then design a prototype WikiProject system that will recruit contributors to WikiProjects and help them run effectively. Please review the proposal here and leave feedback. If you have any questions, you can ask on the proposal page or leave a message on my talk page. Thank you for your time! (Also, sorry about the posting mistake earlier. If someone already moved my message to the talk page, feel free to remove this posting.) Harej (talk) 22:47, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Proposed changes to ACR

Please see WT:HWY#Change of outlook at ACR for a discussion on a proposed change to how ACR works. Rschen7754 (delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:00, 14 December 2014 (UTC))

WikiProject X is live!

Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to Wikipedia:WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Route template up for deletion

Note: {{HK route nav}} is up for deletion at TfD. The deletion nom statement is "Redundant to {{HK routes}}". --146.199.151.33 (talk) 21:46, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Street article titles

Crossposting here.—CycloneIsaac (Talk) 05:38, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Potential changes at FAC

There is a proposal at WT:FAC#FAC nom preparedness to potentially require a Peer Review or A-Class Review before nomination. The idea is that would the change streamline the reviews at FAC to push articles through there faster by requiring more of the advance prep work to be done before an FAC was initiated. Such a change would mean revitalizing and using WP:HWY/ACR more in the future. Imzadi 1979 → 20:58, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

2016 Community Wishlist Survey Proposal to Revive Popular Pages

Greetings WikiProject Highways/Hong Kong/Archive 1 Members!

This is a one-time-only message to inform you about a technical proposal to revive your Popular Pages list in the 2016 Community Wishlist Survey that I think you may be interested in reviewing and perhaps even voting for:

• Fix and improve Mr.Z-bot's popular pages report

If the above proposal gets in the Top 10 based on the votes, there is a high likelihood of this bot being restored so your project will again see monthly updates of popular pages.

Further, there are over 260 proposals in all to review and vote for, across many aspects of wikis.

Thank you for your consideration. Please note that voting for proposals continues through December 12, 2016.

Best regards, Stevietheman — Delivered: 18:01, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Popular pages report

We – Community Tech – are happy to announce that the Popular pages bot is back up-and-running (after a one year hiatus)! You're receiving this message because your WikiProject or task force is signed up to receive the popular pages report. Every month, Community Tech bot will post at Wikipedia:WikiProject Highways/Hong Kong/Archive 1/Popular pages with a list of the most-viewed pages over the previous month that are within the scope of WikiProject Highways.

We've made some enhancements to the original report. Here's what's new:

• The pageview data includes both desktop and mobile data.
• The report will include a link to the pageviews tool for each article, to dig deeper into any surprises or anomalies.
• The report will include the total pageviews for the entire project (including redirects).

We're grateful to Mr.Z-man for his original Mr.Z-bot, and we wish his bot a happy robot retirement. Just as before, we hope the popular pages reports will aid you in understanding the reach of WikiProject Highways, and what articles may be deserving of more attention. If you have any questions or concerns please contact us at m:User talk:Community Tech bot.

Warm regards, the Community Tech Team 17:16, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Highways#Proposed A-Class Review rule changes

There have been some proposed changes to the A-Class review process at the discussion above. --Rschen7754 20:47, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Popular pages bot disabled

Hi, I have removed this WikiProject from the Popular pages bot config, as it seems Wikipedia:WikiProject Hong Kong Roads/Popular pages is rarely read, and activity here suggests this WikiProject may be largely inactive. If you'd like it back, please ask at User talk:Community Tech bot, preferably with multiple people showing interest. Note also you can use toolforge:massviews to get the same information (though redirects are not included), for instance [1]. Thank you, — MusikAnimal ^talk 15:23, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Lung On Street

Lung On Street has been nominated for deletion. Please share your thoughts on the AfD page. Thanks! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 16:58, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Highways#Length citations in road infoboxes

See discussion above. --Rschen7754 04:13, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

User script to detect unreliable sources

Main page: User:Headbomb/unreliable

I have (with the help of others) made a small user script to detect and highlight various links to unreliable sources and predatory journals. Some of you may already be familiar with it, given it is currently the 39th most imported script on Wikipedia. The idea is that it takes something like

• John Smith "Article of things" Deprecated.com. Accessed 2020-02-14. (John Smith "[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14.)

and turns it into something like

• John Smith "Article of things" Deprecated.com. Accessed 2020-02-14.

It will work on a variety of links, including those from {{cite web}}, {{cite journal}} and {{doi}}.

The script is mostly based on WP:RSPSOURCES, WP:NPPSG and WP:CITEWATCH and a good dose of common sense. I'm always expanding coverage and tweaking the script's logic, so general feedback and suggestions to expand coverage to other unreliable sources are always welcomed.

Do note that this is not a script to be mindlessly used, and several caveats apply. Details and instructions are available at User:Headbomb/unreliable. Questions, comments and requests can be made at User talk:Headbomb/unreliable.

- Headbomb {t · c · p · b}

This is a one time notice and can't be unsubscribed from. Delivered by: MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:01, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

Communication tools

(cross-posted to all HWY subprojects)

The road projects have faced some challenges over recent weeks. While we remain separate projects, I believe we need to be able to work together during this time. Thus, I wanted to highight three recent changes to the methods of communication and collaboration that we have available to us.

1. Template:HWY Announcements - this template lists important discussions as well as certain cleanup categories used across all the road projects/
2. WP:HWY/AAA - this is an Article Alerts page that will be updated with every AFD, GAN, FAC, etc. in every road project. Please consider watchlisting this to stay on top of important discussions.
3. Discord - When Wikimedia IRC on Freenode was shut down, we chose not to migrate to the Libera IRC server. We use the #wpengineering channel on Discord, a more modern chat platform. (It is possible to read the channel history so that you do not miss out on conversations when not logged in, unlike IRC. But for that reason, please consider anything you say there to be public).

Regards, Rschen7754 20:28, 5 November 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Highways#Wikipedia:WikiProject Hong Kong Roads

I have proposed demotion of this WikiProject to a task force of WP:HWY. You are welcome to comment at the link above. Rschen7754 07:57, 2 February 2023 (UTC)