Wikipedia talk:Canadian Wikipedians' notice board/Archive 22

City nicknames

Should we be adding every nickname we can find from any source for cities and adding them to infoboxes as seen at Edmonton? --Moxy (talk) 15:44, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

As there is a link to the list of nicknames, I would think the most prominent one(s) (which may be difficult to determine) would be more appropriate than listing them all.--kelapstick^(bainuu) 15:50, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

This is what I am thinking..infobox is for regurgitating content from the article...not for OR by bloggers and those trying to sell newspapers. Just because a source can be-found does not mean it merits inclusion... as we are looking for Encyclopedic content. (WP:NOTEVERYTHING) -- Moxy (talk) 15:59, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Take for example Toronto, I have frequently heard it called (by numerous people/media) T.O. (and subsequently T-Dot), The Big Smoke, an Hogtown. However A city within a park is referenced on Name of Toronto to the parks and trails website, which says that it is a city within a park, rather than a nickname (and the neutrality of it being a nickname by said organization would generally be in question). --kelapstick^(bainuu) 17:10, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

I don't think we should list every nickname that has ever been used, no matter how infrequently or by whom or for what purpose. Edmonton's list now includes far too many nicknames (11), including some that have limited use or were created for disparaging purposes. Note that there's no consistency across Canadian cities since a sampling of articles on major Canadian cities shows Montreal with no nicknames, and Halifax and Quebec City with only one. Meters (talk) 19:14, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Only very common nicknames should be included, I would say. As it is, most of these wouldn't actually qualify in my view. For instance, "Gateway to the North" and "City of Champions" are marketing slogans, not nicknames. "Redmonton" and "Deadmonton" are derogatory epithets, not nicknames. Etc. Resolute 19:37, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Generally, I would think that the principles of WP:GNG should be applied. Although not specifically designed for content within an article, it does lay out the basics of determining what is notable and what is trivial. The determining factor as to whether a nickname is sufficiently notable for inclusion shouldn't be simply that a source can be found wherin the nickname is used, but that a source exists that specifically discusses that nickname. For instance, where Toronto is concerned, we have articles such as this one that discuss the use of the "T-Dot" term. That would be good evidence that "T-Dot" is a notable and widely-used term. Other sources discuss the whole topic in a broader sense, such as this one. Pyrope 20:13, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Good start, but media coverage that discusses a nickname does not necessarily mean that a term is widely used. Deadmonton is a problem. It was coined as a derogatory nickname by a foreign columnist or reporter (who was booked into a hotel in the middle of nowhere) during his visit to the 2001 World Championships in Athletics. So, of course the use of the nickname by the journalist was widely discussed in local media, but that does not mean the nickname itself was actually in use. If a journalist called a notable Canadian politician Mr. Scum Sucking Dirtbag, the resultant coverage would probably make the incident notable, but the coverage would not show that "Scum Sucking Dirtbag" was a widely-used nickname for the politician in question. There's a subsequent history of attempting to justify use of the term Deadmonton because of a one-year spike in murder rates, so this is not so cut and dried.

I don't know what the best solution to choosing which nicknames to list in the infobox is, but having 10 or more nicknames listed is not way to go. It would be far better to have a section in the article devoted to discussing the various nicknames than to cram them all into the infobox. Meters (talk) 20:56, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

In reference to Meters last sentence, I agree. There are already pages devoted to the Name of Toronto and Name of Montreal that list nicknames and discuss some as well as an article on Nicknames of Vancouver. I think this would be beneficial for larger cities like Edmonton, Calgary, Ottawa, Winnipeg, etc. For cities such as Fox Creek, Alberta there would be no need to have a whole new page and would be fine with the one in the infobox.Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 21:18, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Only nicknames that can be reliably sourced should be noted. For example, one of the nicknames that was removed from Greater Sudbury pursuant to this discussion was "Sudz" — and while this nickname can certainly be confirmed by a simple Google search on "Sudbury Sudz", it exists only in user-generated discussion forums and hashtags, and isn't actually found in any source that would actually meet Wikipedia's referencing standards. That's exactly the kind of nickname that indeed we shouldn't be publishing, lest we open the door to random editors adding entirely nonexistent nicknames that they created themselves — we should rightly include only nicknames that can be verified in reliable sources. But the problem is that we've had that discussion before, but people keep adding unsourced and self-invented nicknames anyway — keeping this clean requires more vigilance than most editors have actually been putting into it. Bearcat (talk) 21:32, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree with Vaselineeeeeeee that there's no need to separate out he nicknames for those places with only a few. Just to clarify, I was suggesting a separate section in the article to discuss nicknames for cities with many, rather than a separate article, but either works.

I don't think that simply requiring reliable sources for nicknames addresses the problem of listing too many nicknames in the infobox. It's a given that not-reliably sourced nicknames can and should be removed, but what about cases where there are simply a large number of reliably sourced nicknames for a city? Meters (talk) 22:32, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Omg no.. not a section for nicknames ...looking for encyclopedic content added to these articles. Having the first sources people see being POV media editorials and blogs really reduces the integrity of any article. Keep all the B class trivia in its own article. -- Moxy (talk) 22:51, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

so your suggestion is to have a separate article? As I said, I'm fine with either solution, as long as we stop stuffing nicknames into the infobox. And I don't think "POV media editorials and blogs" would qualify as reliable sources, so they shouldn't be in the infobox, a separate section, or a separate article. A source is either reliable or it isn't. Meters (talk) 23:07, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

My preferred solution would be to limit infobox nicknames to a small number (say two, or three at most) in common usage and just to ignore any others (no section, no article) but I doubt that people could ever agree on a means of determining the most common. Meters (talk) 23:14, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

It should be mentioned here that List of city nicknames in Canada already exists. PKT(alk) 00:02, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. I was sure I had seen a list for Edmonton but I could not find the article. Meters (talk) 00:11, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Even though List of city nicknames in Canada already exists, some should still be displayed on the city page itself (either infobox, an added heading for a section, or new article) for consistency. Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 00:22, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

One problem with sources is they wind up retrenching names that aren't really valid as ongoing nicknames but because of academic blather about the term and that one columnist/blogger abroad uses it as the title of his column has wound up giving it more weight than it deserves; and allows for inclusion of wrong, often POV, assertions about it. More actual nicknames for Vancouver like "Van", "YVR", "the 604", "Vancity" and "Big Smoke" are harder to source, as they are not studied or pumped-up avidly as "Hongcouver" has been, even though it's long dead in the water in Vancouver itself, except in an ironic sense - and not happily on either side of the ethnic fence. That section linked is overkill, like much else in that article. UNDUE in the extreme. And not really a nickname; not in use in ordinary speech on a daily basis.Skookum1 (talk) 02:12, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

I've just amended the passage about it in Nicknames of Vancouver to refer to that overbuilt bit on the CCinBC article, to qualify its modern context. Its actual origins, said one long-ago article, in the National Geographic as I recall but maybe a Vancouver Sun or other local article, were with freshly-arrived Hong Kong youth making a brag; when it hit the papers, the Chinese political and business crowd denounced it as discriminatory; even though "we" (regular Vancouverites) didn't like it anymore than they did. Now it's an academic fief...but not a nickname as such. More like a "tag" that's taken on a life of its own. BTW if the Nicknames for Vancouver article covers it sufficiently, the section on the CCinBC page is sometning like a POV fork; but then the add-er of that content has serious POV issues as well as OWNership issues, 'nuff said for now, but "when is a nickname not a nickname?". When it's being used for propaganda reasons and academic tirades, I submit.Skookum1 (talk) 02:25, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

About the Vancouver nickname 'Vansterdam'; I think it originated during the era of the former premier of B.C. Bill Vander Zalm who was of Dutch descent. A play of words combining Vancouver, Amsterdam and Vander Zalm.-- Kayoty (talk) 03:54, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

No. If the term was even around then, and I'm not sure it was, its main derivation is the Vansterdam Cafe on West Hastings near Cambie. There's lots of Dutch-descent/origin Canadians in Vancouver; but Vander Zalm is famously a Surreyite; the name has nothing to do with him, never has.Skookum1 (talk) 05:53, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Wasn't the nickname a reference to pot smoking? --Skeezix1000 (talk) 18:00, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

A few comments.

1. As mentioned above, List of city nicknames in Canada exists. It was once garbage with a vast amount of unsourced, OR-based and unacceptably sourced (blogs, forums, ad sites, etc.) entries. It was partially cleaned up and then culled over an 18-month period to comprise only referenced items, most of which were based on their usage by reliable sources. With that article now in reasonable shape, any city nickname that has widespread usage has a home there so long as it is verified by an acceptable reliable source.
2. Limiting city infoboxes to a specified amount of nicknames (one, two or three) is a reasonable idea but is utopian. It is difficult to achieve. How do we measure which three get to remain? If all are measurable, what happens if the fourth is a negligible hair behind the third?
3. That being said, infoboxes are intended to summarize content that is actually embedded within articles. If a reliably-sourced nickname is (or can be) worked into the prose of an article, I think there is justification to then include it within the infobox. Right away, that would drop nine of the eleven at Edmonton leaving “Festival City” and “Gateway to the North”, though “City of Champions” could easily be worked into the prose of that article and retained in the infobox. (Note it was coined by former mayor Laurence Decore, who cited the community's response to the 1987 tornado as evidence that Edmonton was a "city of champions," which later became the city's official slogan.) Employing this approach to all major cities, the balance of nicknames could be wikilinked to Nicknames of city or List of city nicknames in Canada.
4. South of the border, there are inconsistent approaches throughout the U.S. I’ve looked at all the articles of the American cities listed here. Most cities have between three and nine nicknames listed in their infoboxes. A few have one or two. One has none, though two are mentioned in the article's prose (Austin, Texas). Here are three interesting approaches observed to consider:

a. two cities simply used the {{Main|Nicknames of "city"}} template within the infobox's nickname parameter in place of any nicknames – see New York City and Washington, D.C.;

b. at Houston, Texas, it lists "Space City (official), more..." where more... is wikilinked to Nicknames of Houston; and

c. at Chicago, it uses a similar approach but with multiple nicknames... "The Windy City, Chi-Town, The Second City, City of Broad Shoulders, and others found at List of nicknames for Chicago".

I personally like a combination of 3., b. and c. For Edmonton for example, the infobox could read "City of Champions (official), Festival City, Gateway to the North, more..." where "more..." wikilinks to List of city nicknames in Canada#Alberta (in lieu of there being no Nicknames of Edmonton article).
Food for thought. Hwy43 (talk) 10:34, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

I think that is a great (b) and (c) are great ideas, and agree there could be say three nicknames, and a wikilink to "more", which is the link to the list of Canadian city nicknames. I like it. Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 12:19, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

@Vaselineeeeeeee: just a point of clarification. I'm not suggesting an arbitrary maximum of three. Just in Edmonton's case, under the scenario of nicknames that could be explained within the prose of the article, I think three would be appropriate for that article. Hwy43 (talk) 05:04, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Perhaps we can add a line or two to WP:CANSTYLE, setting out the practice exemplified by (b) and (c) above. We'd also want to reference Pyrope's WP:GNG comment above, where we need more than examples of the name being used (e.g. the thankfully failed efforts to add "The 613" to the Ottawa infobox]]) but rather reliable sources discussing how the name is currently and broadly used to reference the City. Moreover, we should address Skookum1's issue (similar to the case where people tried to add "Tehronto" to the list of nicknames at Toronto), whereby the name needs to be widely used for the city generally, not in reference to particular aspect(s) of its economy or people. There should also be mention as to whether derogatory nicknames, and municipal slogans, can be included (e.g. perhaps we could put an end to the perennial "Scarberia" debate). --Skeezix1000 (talk) 18:09, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree with Skeezix1000. Derogatory nicknames such as "Deadmonton" and "Negitivipeg" should not be used. I also agree that "Tehrono" is not a nickname of Toronto, yet just a way people pronounce it. This can also be said for Calgary. Nobody says "Cal-Gary", people tend to say "Cal-gry" because it has been an accustomed way of saying the name, rather than a nickname. Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 20:02, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Agree that pronunciations are not nicknames. My reference to Tehronto/Tehranto above was actually a reference to a nickname used in reference to the fact that so many monied Iranian immigrants were for a time choosing to settle in Toronto (a portmanteau of Toronto and Tehran). I don't remember the details, but there was at least one editor who felt very strongly that Tehronto/Tehranto belonged in the infobox. One difficulty we had at the time was that the Tehronto/Tehranto nickname had been discussed in the mainstream media, so the editor in question took the position that it was more than adequately sourced. Whether used positively or derogatorily, nicknames such as Hongcouver and Tehronto don't really refer to the city broadly, but rather refer to one demographic aspect. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 21:10, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Too many of the so called nicknames are not. They are advertising/marketing slogans that are barely used. So now Yellowknife has "The Diamond Capital of North America" a trademark slogan sourced to NWT tourism and not used on the city website (http://www.yellowknife.ca/en/index.asp) or really anywhere else. I looked through the List of city nicknames in Canada and it looks more like a list of advertising slogans and should probably be moved to a title that reflects that. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 21:36, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Ah, just thought. We should make a change to the {{infobox settlement}} so that there is a like that reads "| advertising_slogan=" so that things like "The City of Champions" (Edmonton) and "Polar Bear Capital of the World" (Churchill) could be kept separate from proper nicknames. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 21:44, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

@CambridgeBayWeather: A trimmed "| slogan=" parameter would be sufficient. Slogans were brought up once at the infobox's talk page and no one responded.
List of city nicknames in Canada could be moved to List of city nicknames and slogans in Canada, but I do note that the "slogans" is mentioned in the first sentence of the article. Makes me wonder if a "slogan" is generally regarded as a type of "nickname". Hwy43 (talk) 04:58, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

[edit conflict] Yes, there is a significant distinction between slogans (generated by the municipality, a tourism authority or some other public authority) and actual nicknames. For example, "technically beautiful" is not a nickname. Whether some slogans might evolve over time into nicknames (City of Champions?) is a question for the sources. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 21:46, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Not incidental that the rebranding name of the board of the GVRD, "Metro Vancouver", is pushed by the media to refer to the GVRD as "Metro" as if that was its name; and in Toronto the media use that same term. Not 'in the metro' or 'in the Metro region', but "in Metro". But that's rebranding not just taken hold but pushed by the media machine (who are the organ of the advertising/p.r. industry, necessarily). It's irritating to hear "weather in Metro today will be" or "citizens of Metro". Way too brave new world for me. Is a nickname? No more than "the pause that freshes" is a name for 7-up. The Uncola etc.....Skookum1 (talk) 23:03, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

I also agree with Skeezix1000's suggestion of incorporating the consensus outcome of this into WP:CANSTYLE. I suggest we confirm a consensus approach first here (unless we feel we have already), followed then by sidebar discussions (such as whether derogatory nicknames can be included). Hwy43 (talk) 05:13, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

The nickname field appears in the infobox next to the flag, coat of arms, and motto, all official emblems. I feel that the nickname needs to be relatively official, and in wide usage, whether it is promotional or not. The infobox is a summary and a snapshot of the article, and should not list every nickname that can be reliably sourced. 117Avenue (talk) 04:06, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

@117Avenue: good observation about where that field is presented. Makes me wonder if the original intent of that field was to be inclusive of unofficial nicknames and official nicknames (i.e., official slogans). Hwy43 (talk) 05:25, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

I think it was in discussions on Talk:Blackbeard or if I'm remembering Bluebeard, on Talk:Gilles de Rais, such that someone had used some obscure academicist term in lieu of "nickname" or "sobriquet" and fought off those last two terms; can't remember what was settled on; the lexically anal around Wikipedia will use obscure terms when common ones aren't good enough for them.....so "slogans, nicknames, branding names, sobriquets and [wahtever it was]" is more like it.Skookum1 (talk) 09:22, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

117Avenue. I agree with you about them being in wide usage but I'm not so sure about being official plus it may be difficult to source either. Both "The Big E" and "E-Town" for Edmonton have sources from the Journal and the Sun. However, there is no indication that either is widely used or in any way official. I looked through the cities official site and couldn't find anything to indicate that they use a nickname, not even the Champions one. Hwy43. Yes just slogan would work. Perhaps the list could be separated into sections for nicknames, slogans, etc. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 12:15, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Didn't Edmonton recently dump the City of Champions slogan? Or am I imagining that?

@Skeezix1000: No and no. It was considered but retained, though I heard a couple weeks ago it is resurfacing again. Hwy43 (talk) 07:19, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

I think nicknames, by their very nature, are unofficial (although once commonly used, they might be adopted and made part of a slogan). If we are going to have slogans, I think we need two separate and distinct fields, one for official slogans, one for nicknames. And for the slogans, we need to decide if we are limiting it to the current slogan generally used by the municipality (often there isn't one), or also include slogans that are used by any public authorities (tourism associations, etc.). Skeezix1000 (talk) 13:57, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

I 100% agree with Skeezix1000 last post. Most nicknames by nature are unofficial. I also agree that the nickname list needs to be separated into two sections of slogans and nicknames. We could also add another field to the infobox called "slogans". However some nicknames can go both ways for example Guelph, Ontario "The Royal City" can be used either way which can be hard to distinguish between the two. Also, municipality slogans should be listed as well as tourism slogans, as I think they are important as well. Municipality slogan of Yellowknife, "The Diamond Capital of North America" is just as important as a tourism slogan for Churchill, Manitoba, "The Polar Bear Capital of the World" Vaselineeeeeeee (talk) 20:16, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree that tourism slogans can be just as important, if not more so ( I ❤ NY being the best example). But most tourism slogans are often forgettable/routinely superseded (and non-encyclopedic), whereas arguably the slogan a municipality currently uses (if there is one) has some encyclopedic value, no matter how pedestrian or dull it is. And some places have more than one tourism agency throwing out slogans into the wide world (for example, at any given point there might be four different campaigns for tourism in Ottawa). We need to figure out some way to include the good ones like "The Polar Bear Capital of the World" without inviting people to include every single "Kenora is for lovers!". --Skeezix1000 (talk) 17:24, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Just noting, also, that some municipal 'titles' re rotating and not permanent; Lillooet was for a while "Logging capital of British Columbia", somewhere else has that now. Mission used to be "Strawberry Capital of Canada"; that title now I think Abbotsford has (Mission's berry industry was wiped out by the Japanese internment; they'd had 75% of the berry farms and no one else knew how to work the patches like they did) and the Great Flood of 1948. The latter was a municipal brag, the former some kidn of forest industry branding "badge of honour" or whatever; things t hat rotate like that probably shouldn't be mentioned; though historic ones like Mission have relevance in historical terms.Skookum1 (talk) 16:27, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Most municipal slogans are replaced over time. If it's the current slogan, not sure the fact that it will likely be replaced at some time in the future makes it less encyclopedic. Skeezix1000 (talk) 15:40, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

"Logging capital of British Columbia" was likely an honourary and temporary title bestowed on the community by the logging industry. The national forestry industry, and the provincial one in Alberta IIRC, bestows these annually to different communities to mutually market both the industry and the community. The national forestry industry bestowed "Forestry capital of Canada" to Whitecourt for two years in a row in 2013 and 2014. Many other communities have held the same title for one or more years. By no means should these be considered nicknames (maybe this is mentioned already below... working on catching up on this discussion). Hwy43 (talk) 07:27, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

• So what are we doing here??? Think its best we dont have the first sources people see be bad ones...what do others think here? -- Moxy (talk) 17:54, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

Entering nicknames like has been done on the Edmonton page is ridiculous. Any newspaper can come out with a nickname for the city which then becomes a source which then cannot be removed from the page. The nickname section is being abused. A nickname should be a name that has been used over an extended period of time (suggesting 20 or 30 years) and referenced as such not just with a newspaper reference.-- Kayoty (talk) 20:40, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

CANSTYLE city nicknames draft #1

Okay, thanks for the reminder, Moxy, and good point, Kayoty. Here is a rough first attempt at some language for WP:CANSTYLE (hopefully, it can be made more succinct without losing any of the points that people made above):

In articles on Canadian places, all names within the infobox’s nickname field must be appropriately referenced with reliable sources which discuss how the nickname in question is currently in wide use by the general population. Merely supplying examples of usage (even in mainstream media) is insufficient. Nicknames used in the infobox should not be derogatory, nor should they only reference one particular demographic aspect of the place in question (e.g. Hongcouver, Tehranto) or one particular event (as such references quickly become dated, e.g. the Megacity). The field should be limited to two nicknames; additional nicknames should be provided through a link to the appropriate section in List of city nicknames in Canada or to the "Name of [place]" article (if one exists) (for example, "Town, NewfieJohn, more..."). Slogans used by the municipal government or local tourism authority, although they might be encyclopedic in their own right, are not necessarily nicknames unless they are used colloquially by the general population, and should otherwise not be included in the nickname field.

Thoughts? --Skeezix1000 (talk) 22:13, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

User:Moxy and User:Skeezix1000, thanks for taking the bull by the horns and actually moving us towards a decision. I'll have to return later with comments, but my initial take is that this is a very good summary. Meters (talk) 16:18, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Two things:

• Is "general population" the residents of the city in question or a wider group (regional/provincial/national/whatever)>
• "Derogatory" may be difficult to determine in some cases. Is Edmonchuk derogatory? How about Cow Town or Winterpeg? (I'm not saying that any of these are or are not major nicknames.) Meters (talk) 04:05, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

Good questions. I would assume general population would typically be local/regional. Not sure that nicknames need to be notable nationally or internationally to qualify. The reference was really intended to distinguish from nicknames used by specific groups (e.g. there was a time where people were inserting "Raccoon City" as a nickname in the Toronto article because that's what a number of sci-fi fans/gamers call it). As for derogatory, I agree but I think we cannot be too prescriptive and I think that's a determination best made on the talk page of the article in question. I wouldn't consider any of your examples to be derogatory (although Edmonchuk falls in the same group as Tehranto, Hongcouver, etc.) Deadmonton strikes me as derogatory. Some derogatory names lose their negative connotations over time. Not sure most Torontonians in the 1890s considered Hogtown to be a flattering nickname, but I don't think it carries any sting today. The determination of derogatory will depend on the context, and ultimately on what the sources say. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 13:31, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

Quick sidebar: Never heard of "Edmonchuk" being construed as derogatory or offensive. More than anything, it seems to be a celebration of Ukrainian heritage in the area. Hwy43 (talk) 07:35, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

Looks good. A very good summary.-- Kayoty (talk) 06:01, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree that general population considered should be the local or regional residents who use the nicknames. I also agree that the issue of whether a nickname should be considered derogatory can be decided on the articles' talk pages. I doubt Edmonchuk is a nickname that sees enough use to be considered for the infobox under the suggested rules. It was just an example of a name that might possibly be controversial since it refers to the many Ukranians in the Edmonton area. I don't know if they consider it derogatory or not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Meters (talk • contribs) 06:27, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

Five comments:

• At the end of the second sentence, I would like to see the following added within parentheses:

"(though are sufficient for inclusion at List of city nicknames in Canada)".

• Applying a suggested limit to the amount of nicknames should be avoided given the two examples at Template:Infobox settlement have seven and eight. We should avoid being at odds with Template:Infobox settlement.
• Before the last sentence, add the following sentence:

"These additional nicknames can also be mentioned within the prose of the article so long as they are reliably sourced."

• I agree that the general population should be at the local/regional level, but not preclude the higher provincial/national/international levels.
• As for municipal slogans, I think we should explore the potential of having a separate parameter for these as discussed earlier this month above. I will make a request at Template talk:Infobox settlement with a link back to this discussion.

Request for slogan parameter placed at Template talk:Infobox settlement#New slogan parameter. Hwy43 (talk) 21:22, 1 February 2015 (UTC)

Also, yes, thank you User:Moxy and User:Skeezix1000 for pushing this along. Hwy43 (talk) 08:20, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

Speaking as a native Vancouverite, Hongcouver IS a derogatory term, disliked by both sides of the ethnic equation; "distasteful"; there's a POV screed being built right now, with a featured section on the name, where one "scholarly" source says "Hongcouver shirts were on sale everywhere" and others assert, quite falsely, that the "Vancouver elite" coined the term. But hey, those sources are "peer-reviewed" and foot-noted and the authors have "alphabet soup" after their names so it all must be true huh? Yeah right Perhaps they were on sale, but I'd wager around Chinatown or in one or two of the "headshops" on Granville or West/East Hastings, but I was there then and don't remember them and if they were on sale it wouldn't have been widespread; and nobody I can think of would have worn them, including Canadian-born-Chinese Vancouverites, even those with family ties to Hong Kong; and being on sale for a short while and being seen widespread with people wearing them are two entirely different things; that same source doesn't provide an actual data-source for that as to where they were on sale ("everywhere" is a pretty broad brush and typical exaggeration with such "scholarly" rants). Allegation is guilt in today's world, especially when only one kind of sources with a heavy political bias is used to build such (to me) completely fictional "truth".

It's not like we ever liked the name, more it made us shudder, though we were blamed for it when SUCCESS complained about them, and pressured National Geographic to change their article title on their feature article about the influx. News cites for that are long-vanished as CanWest Global destroyed all its digital archives in 1993 when Izzy Asper bought the news empire, and CBC had too much decorum to cover it much, if at all - and their archives, online anyway, don't go much back than 2000, if that far, as I've found about various news items on various topics that are near-impossible to research unless you spend time in the hard-copy archives e.g. at the Vancouver Archives or the VPL or in a special collections section of the SFU or UBC libraries.

Story goes it was coined as a brag by newcomer kids, and spread....distasteful to those of us from there, and offensive to those who took it as a racist slur ("Hong" in Vancouver is a derisive for someone Chinese, whether from Hong Kong or not). Nobody ever like the name, when it's used by a Vancouverite it's said with some distaste and only ironically. It's not a nickname, not locally, but has currency overseas where an entire regular blog in the South China Morning Post and....academics and those who only read and cite them assert it as an emblem of white racism against the Chinese. But fiction and reality rarely meet when ethnic diatribes are being composed as if authoritative because "scholarly" works include such a thing...... it's maybe a portmanteau or one of those other technical lexical terms that recur around Wikipedia....it's not a nickname. More like an embarrassment to all concerned. But man, it sure has currency.....and one hell of a lot of so-called "scholars" obsessing on it in the course of building their case about evil ol' gwailo.Skookum1 (talk) 06:45, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

That linked item is IMO entirely UNDUE and over-built as the term is not relevant to the culture of the city itself; and the sources are obscure and POV in nature to start with, and that article being very selectively bombarded with highly POV constructions systematically excluding non-"scholarly" and prejudicial sources by its self-appointed principal author-cum-OWNer. Tons there is TRIVIA and UNDUE and overbuilt with a very clear POV bias. Skookum1 (talk) 06:58, 31 January 2015 (UTC)

User:Hwy43, thanks for those comments. Agree with all, except perhaps the limit on examples. Don't necessarily disagree, but also not sure that the examples you mentioned represent guideline or policy (unclear if the examples were ever even subject to discussion), and if we find that it represents a problem on Canada-related articles I don't think we're precluded on recommending a limit in the Canadian MOS. To be honest, there seemed to be strong concern about nicknamecruft/nicknamefarms and a number of suggestions above about limiting the # in the infobox (especially given that we have List of city nicknames in Canada to which we can link, which isn't necessarily the case for every country). I was simply trying to capture all the comments people had made. What do people think?

Thanks for the rant, Skookum, which once again fails to even slightly WP:AGF. I honestly stopped reading it at a certain point. More than interested in hearing your views if you can start from the premise that the rest of us are as smart as you and as interested as you in reaching a good conclusion. Skeezix1000 (talk) 14:15, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Skeezix1000 how about expanding from two to three? I feel that some cities will have more than two nicknames that meet the other criteria but there won't be room for the third. By expanding to three, I think we would address most of the situations that have more than two meeting the criteria. Hwy43 (talk) 18:52, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

I have no problem with that. There is no magic to two. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 13:18, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

CANSTYLE city nicknames draft #2

I tweaked the text based on comments above:

In articles on Canadian places, all names within the infobox’s nickname field must be appropriately referenced with reliable sources which discuss how the nickname in question is currently in wide use by the general population. Merely supplying examples of usage (even in mainstream media) is insufficient. Nicknames used in the infobox should not be derogatory, nor should they only reference one particular demographic aspect of the place in question (e.g. Hongcouver, Tehranto) or one particular event (as such references quickly become dated, e.g. the Megacity). The field should be limited to two or three nicknames; additional nicknames should be provided through a link to the appropriate section in List of city nicknames in Canada or to the "Name of [place]" article (if one exists) (for example, "Town, NewfieJohn, more..."). Slogans or mottos used by the municipal government or local tourism authority, although they might be encyclopedic in their own right, are not necessarily nicknames unless they are used colloquially by the general population, and should otherwise not be included in the nickname field (although consideration could be given to including them in the motto field of the infobox).
These conventions apply to the use of the nickname field in the article infobox. References to nicknames, slogans and mottos in the body of an article or list are subject to Wikipedia's other content policies and guidelines.

Let me know any comments. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 19:25, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

• Comment all looks good except referencing mottos in the last sentence of the first paragraph. Slogans and mottos are sufficiently different IMO, and slogans are more appropriate within the "nickname" field rather than the "motto" field as they are in essence self-imposed nicknames. Assuming no new separate "slogan" field is created at Template:Infobox settlement (request placed and discussion underway), and if a particular slogan meets the "colloquially by the general population" requirement, what if the guideline states that the slogan should be suffixed with " (official slogan)" to differentiate it from the other one or two non-slogan nicknames listed? Hwy43 (talk) 06:39, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

First, thank you for adding a subheading. That's actually tremendously helpful. Second, I personally think mottos and slogans can, in many instances, be the same thing. But if you think differently, I can delete the word - no need to get into that debate here and now. Third, I don't think slogans are the same thing as nicknames. Frankly, slogans better belong in the motto field with the "(official slogan)" suffix. But I am happy to go with the consensus. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 12:50, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

To me the motto is an officially decreed phrase, often found on the city crest for example. Slogans are non-official inventions. They may be created by any group that wants to push an idea for any reason (marketing, publicity, tourism, whatever), and they come and go. Some slogans resonate with the population and have more staying power, and may eventually turn into nicknames. After 25 years or so, "The City of Champions" for Edmonton is pretty close to being a slogan that has reached nicknamehood. Meters (talk) 17:17, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

I would agree that City of Champions is undoubtedly a nickname, given how the numerous sources discuss it. Ironically, it's no longer the slogan. I'm just going to steer clear of the motto/slogan issue. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 20:28, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Okay, we seem to be running out of steam and it seems like awhile back we reached consensus on the wording, but for this whole nickname/slogan/motto reference. The issue here is nicknames, and since we've settled on text for nicknames I will add it to CANSTYLE (I will remove the references to mottos, as noted above). As for slogans, I note that there are blank parameters in infobox settlement. If there are official slogans which do not meet our test for nickname (an unlikely situation, since the most well-known slogans, like City of Champions, presumably would meet our test) but are otherwise encyclopedic (unlike so many forgettable official slogans), a blank parameter can used to include them in the infobox. We might also get a slogan field for the infobox at some point. Hopefully, this wraps things up, but please let me know if anyone thinks I've crossed a line by wrapping it up prematurely. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 20:50, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

"Hongcouver" as SYNTH/POV and UNDUE

Please see Talk:Nicknames_of_Vancouver#UNDUE_and_SYNTH.2FPOV_re_.22Hongcouver.22_on_another_article.Skookum1 (talk) 06:35, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

article needs overhaul in lead-up to Duffy trial

The article on the Canadian Senate expenses scandal is badly in need of attention in the lead-up to the Duffy trial starting in April, when the country's eyes will be fixed upon it. This trial is particularly important as it relates to a major scandal by the government in the months before election expected in October. The article was updated as events were transpiring back when the scandal was fresh; it's thus largely a repository of news sources relating to the scandal. I feel a total rewrite is in order. Check out this section of the talk page for further details, if glancing at the article isn't convincing enough. I'm unlikely to be able to give much attention to the article in time. Ienpw III (talk) 05:24, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

Meetups

It seems that there are several meetups and editathons planned for this weekend with the aim of creating/improving articles about women artists. See Wikipedia:Meetup/ArtAndFeminism.—Anne Delong (talk) 12:51, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

The Brier

Category:The Brier has been put up for renaming, see WP:CFDS -- 70.51.200.101 (talk) 07:04, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

It has now been listed at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2015_March_7#Category:The_Brier -- 70.51.200.101 (talk) 12:52, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

Input requested

Please see: Talk:Cypress Hills massacre#RfC: Article title. Viriditas (talk) 03:23, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

42nd Canadian federal election

Persistent vandalism – IP hopper from Vietnam changing party position at Liberal Party of Canada with no sources that has been reverted by many...I have asked for page protection. I think this will come up more and more because of the upcoming election year...can we get a few more eyes on the article(s) pls. -- Moxy (talk) 17:54, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Done. Good suggestion. We might all want to consider adding the articles of the major parties and party leaders to our watchlists, because is Moxy is correct and the fun that the upcoming election will produce. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 18:47, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Lets make a list for all to add to watch list --Moxy (talk) 19:28, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

• 42nd Canadian federal election
• Conservative Party of Canada
• New Democratic Party
• Liberal Party of Canada
• Bloc Québécois
• Green Party of Canada
• Forces et Démocratie
• Stephen Harper
• Thomas Mulcair
• Justin Trudeau
• Mario Beaulieu
• Elizabeth May
• Jean-François Fortin

North Oshawa?

I noticed a North Oshawa which points to a university. Does Oshawa have a region called "North Oshawa"? -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 07:15, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

Not that I have ever heard of, nor can I see anything like it on the city's website. PKT(alk) 13:02, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

I haven't heard of it either, but then again a web search yields many legitimate links to businesses and organizations named "North Oshawa XYZ" (eg - North Oshawa Medical Centre, North Oshawa Park, North Oshawa Farmers' Market, North Oshawa Lions Club), and it has also been mentioned in the Toronto Star article Oshawa: the GTA’s final frontier for development. Perhaps this should redirect to Oshawa instead, and a new redirect named North Oshawa campus created to replace the redirect to UOIT. Mindmatrix 13:50, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

I am inclined to agree with Mindmatrix on the outcome, anecdotally, I know that there are two Portuguese clubs in Oshawa, one north and one south. They are north and south Oshawa, not Portugal, however that is more of a locational distinction, not a political distinction.--kelapstick^(bainuu) 17:17, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

I don't believe it is actually called North Oshawa. I think we should RFD this though as it is incorrect. Mrfrobinson (talk) 20:14, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

Oshawa certainly has northern and southern ends, but only in the cardinal direction sense and not in the sense that there's any specific area of the city whose proper name is "North Oshawa". Apart from two links intending the "UOIT campus" sense of the term which were added by this redirect's creator at the same time as he created the redirect, the only existing redlinks to this term were from Oshawa's federal and provincial electoral districts. And any contextual value they could have provided there would have been entirely dependent on there actually being a distinct article about "North Oshawa" rather than a redirect — so I'm just about to unlink them both in Twinkle. I'd agree that if this redirects anywhere, it should be to the city rather than to UOIT — but I also wouldn't object to simple deletion, since I don't see how it's a particularly likely search term in its own right.

Similarly, the "North Oshawa Campus" of UOIT isn't called that per se — it's the main campus, so while "North Oshawa" is sometimes used when it's necessary to distinguish it from the smaller downtown campus, again that's just a geographic clarity marker rather than a proper name as such. But again I don't actually see it as a likely search term in its own right — neither the "North Oshawa" nor downtown campuses of UOIT really need their own separate articles independently of the main one on the institution itself, and neither campus is likely to be expected or used by any Wikipedia users as a direct search term in its own right. So I don't really see any particular value in creating "North Oshawa Campus" as a new redirect to UOIT, though I have no objection if somebody really feels strongly that we should do that — but "North Oshawa" without the word "Campus" attached to it, redirecting to UOIT instead of the city of Oshawa, is definitely, wrongoliciously wrong. Bearcat (talk) 22:03, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

• North Oshawa has been nominated for deletion -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 05:07, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

2 IP's that keep editwarring

So we have 2 IPs that have been editwaring for months. We need to have this stopped asap. 99.233.25.49 and 46.233.116.121 see here for an example of the problem. I am not sure who /what version is best as its been done so many times. Looking for help here in reviewing the edits. -- Moxy (talk) 16:25, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

Both IPs need to be perma-blocked. GoodDay (talk) 16:50, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

Ok we have to take this to Admins I guess .-- Moxy (talk) 18:12, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

Actually, I think GoodDay is mistaken. I don't see a block on 46.233.116.121, and the block on 99.233.25.49 was only for a week. The latter has made edits today. PKT(alk) 03:34, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

I looks to me that user User:99.233.25.49 is also UnbiasedVictory or Cm7 smcs (A banned user). They all do the same type of edits ...with the same pattern...they edit info boxes for flags and links and outcomes - never leaving an edit summary or add sources for the changes. UnbiasedVictory is a bit different and he may not be associated with this but Cm7 smcs and the IP have edited the same pages.-- Moxy (talk) 17:05, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Ok still lots of odd edits =Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Light2Shadow -- Moxy (talk) 18:11, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

*Look like a duck? Gamerprof? -- Moxy (talk) 17:23, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Hard Choices, new article about book on climate change in Canada

I've created a new article about the book on climate change in Canada, titled, Hard Choices: Climate Change in Canada.

Help with suggesting additional secondary sources would be appreciated at the article's talk page, at Talk:Hard Choices (Coward book).

Thank you,

— Cirt (talk) 02:58, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Canadian IQ

This news article [1] might have something to be added to some Canadian education or intelligence articles -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 07:06, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

How to best display Chinese in pages of Canadian persons of Hong Kong origins?

Please see Talk:Jenny Kwan for a discussion on how best to display Chinese for Canadians of Hong Kong origin such as Jenny Kwan, Olivia Chow, and Michael Chong? Among the issues:

• Should the Chinese be embedded in the person's infobox? (as opposed to Template:Chinese)
• Should Cantonese and Mandarin be included, or only Cantonese?
• Should Simplified Chinese be included with the Traditional characters?

WhisperToMe (talk) 18:28, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Only Traditional Chinese, since Hong Kong continues to use Traditional and not Simplified. If they don't speak Mandarin, it's NPOV-bias to place Mandarin pronunciation in there. Cantonese-only should be the default situation, since Hong Kong pre-1997 was Cantonese, and continues to be Cantonese. Simplified is NPOV-bias, since it isn't used by the person. There's a separate box available for all that stuff, stop stuffing it into the person infobox. If they have no strong links to Mandarin, Mandarin should not be indicated. If they didn't reside in a Simplified using jurisdiction, then that should not be indicated as they are not strongly linked to it. -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 06:13, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Do you think the discussion should be centralized at Talk:Jenny Kwan? WhisperToMe (talk) 18:44, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Langley, BC

So, when a news article that I use as a source says that something is in Langley BC, I should be able to link Langley, BC and have the link work properly. I should not be pointed to a disambiguation page. Only those who actually live in the Vancouver area are aware there are two different entities, and most news articles written elsewhere don't make the distinction. It is completely inexcusable for Langley BC to be a disambiguation page when both of the "ambiguous" Langleys are essentially in the same location. Oiyarbepsy (talk) 15:31, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

It sounds like you should write an new article that is an overview article covering both the two Langleys, since the two current articles would not cover each other. We can do that by converting the disambiguation page into an overview article, with two prominent subheaders for each Langley and {{main}} attached to point to their articles. -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 20:00, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Alternatively, you can read the news article you want to use as a source and work out in which sense they are referring to 'Langley'... Pyrope 22:59, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

An overview article is not the answer. A consolidation of the city and township into is not the primary topic. That very thing happened with North Vancouver, which was largely unsourced and mostly original research before finally being converted to the dab that it originally should have been. Possible solutions? Lobby the local media to start distinguishing between the two in their coverage. Lobby the city and the township local governments to amalgamate. Obviously these solutions are in jest. In the meantime, it is what it is. Hwy43 (talk) 01:41, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Like most such articles, it says "a facility in Langley BC", with no other details, since it's not an article about Langley. If most sources don't treat it as ambiguous, we shouldn't either. I lean towards Langley BC going to the city - just like Los Angeles goes to the city, not the county. Oiyarbepsy (talk) 02:44, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

We can't ignore facts. There are two Langleys. It's not up to use to decide whether we "lean" towards one or the other. The media is ambiguous about a lot of things - media shortcomings don't dictate changes to Wikipedia policies. It is possible that one of the Langleys might be found to be the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC (like Los Angeles), in which case it would qualify for the Langley, British Columbia title, a hatnote would be added to the top of the primary topic article, and the other article would either be disambiguated or (if possible) renamed. But in order to do so, one would need to initiate a discussion (ideally through WP:RM), provide notice at the relevant talk pages, and then demonstrate how one subject is the primary topic (it's not enough to say one leans towards one or the other) and achieve consensus for the move. --Skeezix1000 (talk) 17:17, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Whether you like the fact or not, there are two distinct places which have the same name. An incorporated municipality is a class of topic that should always have an independent article of its own, rather than being smooshed together into a "two things with the same name" combo article — so the only valid question is how the two articles about the two Langleys should be named.

We have a process in place whereby you can propose a change for discussion — but I suspect that it would be difficult to establish a clear consensus either way. I recognize that "the city should automatically take WP:PRIMARYTOPIC over the township, because city" is a potential argument — but so is "the township should take primary topic over the city, because it's four times larger by population". And if the media are really that poor at distinguishing which Langley they're talking about, then media usage isn't going to answer the question very effectively either. But it's not Wikipedia's role or responsibility to pretend that Langley City and Langley Township aren't two separate things just because they happen to have the same name — they are two separate things, and therefore must have two separate articles. Bearcat (talk) 18:28, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Echo Bay, Northwest Territories

Dear Canadians: This old AfC submission will soon be deleted as a stale draft unless someone takes an interest in it. It needs some attention from someone familiar with the geography of this part of the country. All populated places are notable, but this may be another name for a place that already has a Wikipedia article. Can any one shed light on this?—Anne Delong (talk) 16:57, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

See Echo Bay Mines and Port Radium. The population reference is for Echo Bay, Saskatchewan.-- Kayoty (talk) 17:27, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

I have seen these articles. Do you mean that there has never been a place in the NWT called Echo Bay? Or that there was, and it is now called Port Radium? If the latter, this can be merged and redirected. —Anne Delong (talk) 04:49, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

I found one reference for Echo Bay, Northwest Territory (here) at the same location as noted on the Port Radium page (for Port Radium). It appears that Port Radium was called Echo Bay perhaps during the later mining operations at the site by Echo Bay Mines. It also appears that Cameron Bay located nearby (here) was also called Port Radium for a time (according to the Port Radium page).-- Kayoty (talk) 05:35, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

From what I can tell, the most accurate way of looking at the situation would be that Echo Bay and Cameron Bay were distinct "neighbourhoods" within a larger entity called Port Radium, rather than either of them having changed their name to Port Radium per se. Both Echo Bay and Cameron Bay would certainly have the potential to qualify for separate standalone articles, if we could actually write and source anything genuinely substantive about them that wasn't just a straight repetition of content that we already have in the main article about Port Radium as a whole — but at the level of content and sourcing that's been provided in this draft, it should just be a redirect to Port Radium. Bearcat (talk) 16:21, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Echo Bay, NWT is one of two bays on Great Bear Lake or the later name of Port Radium. According to The Great Bear Lake: Its Place in History, "The name Echo Bay was originally applied by Bell and Camsell to the innermost bay at what is now Port Radium - not to the neighbouring fiord-like bay, as it applies today." (last sentence of page 240). Also the Port Radium Mine Remediation Plan, 2.3.1 Discovery of the Mine (page 2-5, 2-6) and 3.1.1 Location (page 3-1). The first, original, is probably the bay located at 66°05′11″N 118°01′16″W (now Inner Labine Bay, Port Radium Mine Remediation Plan Figure 1.1-1) and the second, current, at 66°04′52″N 117°58′50″W. As for the renaming of Port Radium see, Great Bear Lake at the Canadian Encyclopaedia in the history section second paragraph. I'm not sure that this has anything useful but there are some interesting pictures. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 22:06, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, Bearcat, Bearcat and CambridgeBayWeather. I have move the page to mainspace and redirected it to Port Radium for now. The redirect can be undone if someone wants to write up and source the title. —Anne Delong (talk) 09:08, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

Are city rankings published by magazines, newspapers, etc. appropriate/encyclopedic?

Please join the discussion. Hwy43 (talk) 02:26, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

Rogers Centre or SkyDome

Please see talk:Rogers Centre for the discussion -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 05:29, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Southern Cross (wordless novel) Featured Article Candidate

I've nominated the article for the Canadian artist Laurence Hyde's wordless novel, Southern Cross (wordless novel), as a Featured Article Candidate. Please contribute to the review here. Thanks! Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 12:03, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Extremely Decent deletion discussion about Canada sketch comedy group

• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Extremely Decent

Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Extremely Decent for deletion discussion about Extremely Decent, Canada sketch comedy group.

Thank you, — Cirt (talk) 17:49, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Discussion has closed; result was no consensus. PKT(alk) 12:15, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

"Ken Thomson"

The usage and primary topic of Ken Thomson is under discussion, see talk:Ken Thomson (footballer) -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 04:21, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Guess work editor

About User:UnbiasedVictory- I have noticed as have others (by all the reverts) that we have an amateur historian making lots of guess work edits. For e.g this edit to the numbers of people involved. Any search would find that only 320 of the main force were actually involved ....yet we have the numbers changed without a source. I am very concerned that this guess work is happening all over. Not many edit summaries or sources for all the changes with some edit summaries referring to other Wiki articles as the source. In a small amount of cases a web site is used for a source....over real publications...this is what is leading me to believe we have someone not familiar with the scholarly community on this....never seen a real book used by this editor. I think we need to take the time and review most of the edits. Some are ok...as guessing sometimes you get it right ...but overall we need to look at the edits closely as our scholarly publications on the subject are never referenced. -- Moxy (talk) 16:41, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

This individual continues to add and change information without referencing sources. Numbers being changed without a source is especially problematic. Some of it may well be true. Willy nilly changes such as these do affect the credibility of WP. I don't think there is malicious intent. I think this is a relatively inexperienced editor who doesn't understand the importance of proper referencing. If there are more serious infringements, I would take this to Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. BTW, real books aren't necessarily the "best" sources; I have come across errors in books, and many Web sources are scholarly and accurate.-- BC  _{talk to me} 21:54, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Will watch over the edits closely ..... I also agree that some web pages are ok... my concern is that not one Canadian historian has ever been used for a source...thus this indicates to me a lack of familiarity of the subject. . -- Moxy (talk) 14:56, 9 March 2015 (UTC)

We need to look at all the flag changes - like here. --Moxy (talk) 15:01, 10 March 2015 (UTC)

User:UnbiasedVictory is now globally locked...but I think its for the wrong reasons.. Looking at all the 2,107 edits ....I will have to slow down on the reverting..as I have found that I have reverted some good edits. Could I get some help here.--

I've been following many of his edits and have started to ignore most because they seem legit. I'm only reverting the addition of material or changes to content that are likely to be challenged such as changes in stats, numbers, etc. since this stuff should obviously be cited. However, it is a lot of work to fact check his edits even if the edits aren't "likely to be challenged". I'll go back and check any reverts when I get a chance.-- BC  _{talk to me} 18:44, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

@User:Brian Crawford could you also watch over 99.233.100.189 they are also a guess work editor (some believe the same editor). As seen here ...they are mixing up the Red River Rebellion and the Red River Campaign. Then we have others like here more guess work Chesapeake Affair was 1863 while the "Capture of the USS Chesapeake happen during the war of 1812. Just need more eyes on this pls. Again some edits are good ...but its clear its all just guess work.-- Moxy (talk) 04:35, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Agreed..some edits are okay, but in the long run this editor is causing headaches. I also believe it's the same editor. I'll keep an eye out. --  BC  _{talk to me} 05:38, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

if your interested Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Light2Shadow ..pls see my last post and what I think may be best. -- Moxy (talk) 05:49, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

AFDs for Ottawa city councillors

Two articles on Ottawa City Councillors have been put up for deletion. I believe these articles have been tolerated in the past, as Ottawa is important enough as the capital city of Canada, and the country's fourth largest city. AfDs are: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/George Brown (Ottawa politician) and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jean Cloutier. -- Earl Andrew - talk 02:55, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Category:Historical Chinatowns in British Columbia

Category:Historical Chinatowns in British Columbia, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for deletion. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you.RevelationDirect (talk) 03:02, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

I would really like to state hello there.

Hello almost all I'm nev here, and also Let me point out howdy to everyone previous users: ). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.67.252.254 (talk) 12:13, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

Picture for Hon James Richardson

I could use a little help with the proper means to upload photos. Parliament has one - http://www.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/Files/Parliamentarian.aspx?Item=c42c88dd-3857-40fe-a2dd-a5dc179e8ffc&Language=E&Section=ALL

and I'd like to put it on James Richardson's page - James Armstrong Richardson. Can someone assist? Thank you GMTEgirl 18:32, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Hi GMTEgirl, the first step in uploading photos would be finding one that is appropriately licensed for use on Wikipedia, and unfortunately I don't think this one fits the bill. As a House of Commons photo, it is protected under Crown copyright. Nikkimaria (talk) 20:26, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Darn. What about one utilized in a newspaper in 1976 ==> https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1946&dat=19761014&id=XVAxAAAAIBAJ&sjid=86EFAAAAIBAJ&pg=2996,3583229&hl=en 39 years ago...perhaps not enough? Thank you

Sorry GMTEgirl, no. For non-Crown works in Canada copyright is typically extended for the life of the author plus 50 years, and most Canadian works published after 1923 that were still copyrighted in 1996 remain under copyright in the US (where Wikipedia is based).

If there really is no appropriately licensed image available, you might be able to get away with claiming fair use of a biographical image, since the subject is deceased - but you'd need to make sure you can justify such an image. Nikkimaria (talk) 22:54, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Move proposal: Disambiguate Burning of Parliament (British) and Burning of the Parliament Buildings in Montreal

There is a proposal to move Burning of Parliament to Burning of British Parliament and Burning of the Parliament Buildings in Montreal to Burning of Canadian Parliament. Please take part in the discussion at Talk:Burning of Parliament#Requested move 8 May 2015. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 15:16, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Politicians resigning/dying on election day

On Alberta's election day, after the results were clear but before all polls had reported, Jim Prentice resigned. We have a policy at WP:CANSTYLE#Terms in office saying that if a politician resigns or dies after the election but before taking office, we list them as holding the office between election day and their resignation/death. Presumably, if someone resigned or died before the election, they would never take office, even if they won the election. Jim Prentice raises the interesting question of where the cutoff line is. Should we count someone as briefly holding office if they resigns/dies on election day at a time when they probably won but not all votes are counted? —Arctic Gnome (talk • contribs) 19:19, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

→ Please keep discussions together and reply at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Governments of Canada.

Quebec Winter Carnival

Quebec Winter Carnival is being vandalized often and needs some more watchers.-- Kayoty (talk) 05:00, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

It seems to be mostly people from Toronto. And several instances from the Peel District School Board -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 03:53, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

CFUN-FM listed at Requested moves

A requested move discussion has been initiated for CFUN-FM to be moved to CKKS-FM. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 22:47, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Jovan Blagojević listed at Requested moves

A requested move discussion has been initiated for Jovan Blagojević to be moved to Jovan Blagojevic. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 23:22, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

"Quebec"

The article name of Quebec is under discussion, see talk:Quebec -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 04:14, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Someone has mentioned that British English should be used to name the Quebec article -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 07:21, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride !

You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride!

• What? Wiki Loves Pride, a campaign to document and photograph LGBT culture and history, including pride events
• When? June 2015
• How can you help?

  1.) Create or improve LGBT-related articles and showcase the results of your work here

  2.) Upload photographs or other media related to LGBT culture and history, including pride events, and add images to relevant Wikipedia articles; feel free to create a subpage with a gallery of your images (see examples from last year)

  3.) Contribute to an LGBT-related task force at another Wikimedia project (Wikidata, Wikimedia Commons, Wikivoyage, etc.)

Or, view or update the current list of Tasks. This campaign is supported by the Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, an officially recognized affiliate of the Wikimedia Foundation. Visit the group's page at Meta-Wiki for more information, or follow Wikimedia LGBT+ on Facebook. Remember, Wiki Loves Pride is about creating and improving LGBT-related content at Wikimedia projects, and content should have a neutral point of view. One does not need to identify as LGBT or any other gender or sexual minority to participate. This campaign is about adding accurate, reliable information to Wikipedia, plain and simple, and all are welcome!

If you have any questions, please leave a message on the campaign's main talk page.

Thanks, and happy editing!

User:Another Believer and User:OR drohowa

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Another Believer (talk • contribs) 02:47, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Four corners (Canada)

The article Four corners (Canada) has seen different views from numerous users in the past. But the current discussion about rewriting the article only has two participants. 117Avenue (talk) 05:30, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Lists of people

Organization by their reason for notability (politicians, sportspeople), or alphabetic? -- Zanimum (talk) 18:06, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

My preference is alphabetical. Bearcat (talk) 18:33, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

It depends on the length of the list. List of Canadians is improved by grouping by reason for notability, IMO. On the other hand, List of people from Windsor, Ontario isn't as long, and a simple alphabetical sort is good enough in that case. PKT(alk) 19:30, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Both. If it is short enough to fit on one page (and be a reasonable sized section), you can convert the list to table and use class=sortable to sort by key, and choose the sort keys (birth date, death date, surname, occupation, birth province, etc); if it is not short enough to fit on one page, create lists both ways, alphabetic sublits and topical sublists. -- 70.51.202.183 (talk) 05:37, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

Montreal Folk Life Festival

Did anybody hear about "Montreal [American?] Folk Life Festival" of the 60s/70s ? They are surprisingly little mentioned in known sources (mostly here), and I'd like to verify its mention here (1969). Whrer do you suggest look? (what newspaper etc) trespassers william (talk) 23:37, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

My short Googling tells me that the festival was officially called the "Festival of American Folklife" and was arranged by the Smithsonian Institution. A good start would be to look through the archives of Le Devoir and The Gazette. - SweetNightmares 01:54, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

New Wikipedia Library donations

Hello all, I wanted to let you know of some recent donations we just opened up at the Wikipedia Library, including Canadian portal WP:Erudit. Please sign up for the accounts if you think you can use them. Cheers, Nikkimaria (talk) 00:03, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Credit union articles

Quite a few of the credit union articles such as Meridian Credit Union (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) and Windsor Family Credit Union (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) seem to need quite a bit of work - both to take them beyond stub status, and to add independent references. Me-123567-Me (talk) 20:46, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Unannounced student project

I've just come across several articles, one of which includes an edit summary "McGill University: Hist 334 Final Edit". It appears that students in this McGill University class were required to choose an article to improve. There was no announcement on WP that I know of, no instructor page that I've been able to find, and no edits by the students outside their respective assigned/chosen articles. I think we should review these articles, because such unannounced projects tend to produce essay-like articles more often than not. Mindmatrix 14:44, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

The course is the winter session of HIST 334 taught by Catherine Desbarats. Mindmatrix 15:30, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

List of students and articles (please add others as you find them):

• Mcgillcodexcanadensis (talk · contribs), Codex canadensis, (diff)
• MartinFlesche (talk · contribs), Seigneurial system of New France (diff)

I have removed the edits to this article...just a copy and paste of this book. I will look at the other....do we have more of theses? -- Moxy (talk) 16:33, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

I've yet to find others, but there surely must be. I don't expect that only two students completed the assignment. Mindmatrix 19:22, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

• I found more copy vios today ...all should watch over our new student editors -- Moxy (talk) 05:19, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

We are about to be overwhelmed by students Wikipedia:Training/For students/Training feedback -- Moxy (talk) 13:48, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

So edits are going live this week ....good to see we have so many pages that will get improvements....that said we are going to have to watch-our for essay style writing Education Program:University of Ontario Institute of Technology/Critical Race Theory (Winter 2015) -- Moxy (talk) 19:08, 9 April 2015 (UTC)

BTW, thanks for tracking this. I'll try to set aside some time to review some of these. Mindmatrix 12:03, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

So....I was quickly perusing entries in Education Program:University of Ontario Institute of Technology/Critical Race Theory (Winter 2015), and it looks like some students have put in a decent effort (and others not so much, or none at all). The student sandbox articles replicate some articles currently on WP, and we might be able to merge some content, but these definitely appear to be more essay-like than encyclopedic. It also appears that this particular project is over, and none of the articles have moved out of userspace (though I've only checked a few). I haven't checked the other project, or found others related to my original post in this thread. Mindmatrix 12:32, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Judging by this edit, there appears to be another unannounced university editing project. Mindmatrix 16:27, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Index article vs Category

Good day, I'm wondering what is the purpose of this article Index of Canada-related articles. Isn't it the purpose of categories to create indexes of articles? Amqui (talk) 19:45, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

No, indices and categories are separate ways of navigating articles. Indices are navigated through the hotlink [Contents] on the sidebar underneath the Wikipedia logo. Indices are one of the oldest ways to navigate Wikipedia, and predate the category system. Also, indices can be organized in many different ways, and ordered in several different ways, and can have explanatory material, that categories, being autogenerated, cannot do. And the category system is frankly, broken, when you try to navigate it as a hierarchy, since there are missing child-parent associations due to missing categorization levels. -- 70.51.203.69 (talk) 05:18, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Anna Paquin

Actress Anna Paquin is a Canadian citizen. Bryantriplex (talk · contribs) has edit warred on this article (and got a block for edit warring), repeatedly replacing "Canadian" with "Canadian-born". A cited source quotes Paquin: "I am still a Canadian citizen." Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that a Canadian citizen by definition is Canadian. Bryantriplex initially argued that being Canadian-born didn't necessarily make her a Canadian. When I added the source with her quote about Canadian citizenship, he immediately reverted again. After he came off his block for edit warring, he reverted again. Now his argument is that "This Wiki page has almost always described her as a "Canadian-born New Zealand" actress and it was never deemed incorrect. Somebody changed it." If anyone wishes to express an opinion on this issue, I started a discussion at Talk:Anna Paquin#Canadian. Note that I am not a Canadian citizen and have no vested interest in this issue other than trying to keep the article accurate and precise. Thanks. Sundayclose (talk) 00:23, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

New appointments to the Order of Canada

Members, officers and companions of the Order of Canada are generally considered notable. For the latest (July 1, 2015) appointments to the order, please see http://www.gg.ca/document.aspx?id=16133&lan=eng Wikipedia probably has articles on many of these people already, and a mention of the Order of Canada appointment can be added to those articles. If there is no article on a newly-appointed persn, one should probably be written. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 09:47, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

I can't guarantee that I caught everybody who already had an article, but working from a newspaper article yesterday I added it to everybody I was able to (as well as adding them to the relevant member/officer/companion categories.) I did not, however, start a new article about anybody who didn't already have one, although in a couple of cases I created redlinks for them when I knew of a relevant place for them to be mentioned (e.g. I linked Ted Itani in his wife's article, Ophelia Lazaridis in her husband's, and on and so forth.) So I'm certainly not going to claim that I got the whole job done already, but I've put in some effort to assist. Bearcat (talk) 20:06, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

Copyright Violation Detection - EranBot Project

A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These possible copyright violations can be searched by WikiProject categories. Use "control-f" to jump to your area of interest (if such a copyvio is present).--Lucas559 (talk) 20:10, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

Krasne, Saskatchewan

I saw this red link on the dab page at Krasne and thought I'd try to create a stub for it, but... could a local expert determine whether the unincorporated area here is the location of the church here? Should Krasne, Saskatchewan redirect to Rural Municipality of Big Quill No. 308, or at least get a mention there? Or is it that the name of the church is "St. John Bohoslav Krasne Church" and the "Krasne" is part of the saint's name rather than a placename? Over to you. PamD 08:57, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

The church gets a mention in Wynyard, Saskatchewan and List of historic places in rural municipalities of Saskatchewan. PamD 09:02, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

I can't find much information on the community of Krasne, Saskatchewan. The church is also called St. John the Theologian (bohoslav is theologian in Ukrainian) and once had a population of 150 parishioners. See (list of churches (number 321) and here and Location of church). Krasne, Saskatchewan should redirect to Rural Municipality of Big Quill No. 308 with a mention of the church as you suggested,-- Kayoty (talk) 18:08, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

It is recognized as a locality, but be careful in presuming Krasne was ever a community. The locality of Krasne may have very well been only the site of a church that had no other developments immediately surrounding it (like houses, a school, a general store). The church's parishioners may have been from the vast surrounding rural area of farms. The approach to localities in Alberta is to redirect them to their rural municipality. See how these localities, with the exception of a verified former community (Windfall, Alberta), all redirect to Woodlands County. I say redirect it to Rural Municipality of Big Quill No. 308, and perhaps list all localities within the RM per the StatCan reference above as an alternative to, or in addition to, mentioning the church. Cheers, Hwy43 (talk) 04:53, 3 May 2015 (UTC)

I have added Krasne to the list of communities in Rural Municipality of Big Quill No. 308. --papageno (talk) 18:41, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

MV Nimpkish

The MV Nimpkish article has been nominated for deletion. Mjroots (talk) 19:09, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Disputed entry at École Polytechnique massacre

Does anybody have any opinions about Talk:École_Polytechnique_massacre#Disputed_content_re:_Opinions_by_Charles_Rackoff? An anon user is questioning the value of the opinions of an anti-feminist professor. I have questions of my own, but don't know the history well enough to say one way or another. Resolute 19:14, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

"Hockey sur glace"

Hockey sur glace has been nominated for deletion -- 67.70.32.20 (talk) 05:37, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

remote Visiting scholar for McMaster University (possible emphases Canadian literature and popular culture)

• See Wikipedia:Visiting Scholars/Apply. Emphases in areas such as peace and war (with a particular emphasis on the Holocaust and resistance), Bertrand Russell, Canadian literature and popular culture, among other areas.• Lingzhi♦(talk) 05:16, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

Anyone want to create Cannabis in Canada (currently a redirect)?

We at WikiProject Cannabis are making a number of "Cannabis in (country)" articles to improve our coverage, especially given all the media and academic coverage that cannabis culture and legality are getting these days. While there is a title Cannabis in Canada, it just redirects to an article on legality. We have a number of articles in Category:Cannabis in Canada, but no actual primary article.

Would anyone here be willing to gin up a basic article that gives the essentials of Canada's history, culture, and legal issues around marijuana? Probably the great majority of it could be cobbled together using pieces copied and pasted (with attribution) from existing articles, and it'd really help to have one centralized title that the others can all branch from. Anybody up to it? We just created Cannabis in India, and WikiProject India did an amazing job expanding and illustrating it in just a day or two, so we've had some promising precedent from the Country-level projects. Goonsquad LCpl Mulvaney (talk) 12:41, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

Location of X in Canada maps

Someone may have hacked the Canada map data. The 'Location of X in Canada' maps that appear in the right-hand navigation seem inconsistent: see Saskatoon, and Regina, Saskatchewan which are shown within Manitoba. I can't see where to check/ fix this. Scarabocchio (talk) 07:45, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

There's a coord template on the page, and it's tracking a Wikidata property. Regina and Saskatoon look like they have the right coordinates to me though, could your browser be displaying the map incorrectly? I see Regina: 50°27′17″N 104°36′24″W; that looks right, can't see any recent edits to it. Punch it into any map website or look at it on a paper map and it'll line up. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 19:40, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

They look wrong to me as well, in two different browsers. Maybe the conic (?) projection is being treated as rectangular or has a typo in its bounding coördinates. When I add the same map to Edmonton (without saving!), the pushpin is displayed in the middle of Saskatchewan. Trying a couple more, Vancouver is placed near Glacier Park in Montana, Winnipeg north of L. Superior in Ontario, and St. John’s on the very edge of the map at the latitude of southern NS. Halifax actually uses the map, but is shown in the Atlantic off Cape Cod.—Odysseus1479 20:51, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

It appears the pushpin display positions are calculated from the formulæ at {{Location map Canada}}. Let me play with it a bit …—Odysseus1479 20:59, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Oh, the large map of Canada is what you're talking about. I thought it was referring to the map pull-down at the top-right. Never mind me, you're right, it's curiously wrong. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 22:16, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Not exactly sure how the Location map template works, but I've also noticed that Module:Location_map/data/Canada was created on the 23rd of this month. If that's overriding the formulas in {{Location map Canada}}, that could be why this seems to be a recent change. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 22:23, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

That was it. I pulled the equations from the template into that Lua module and the template's working again. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 22:29, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

HMCS Bonaventure

FYI, there's a notice about HMCS Bonaventure at WT:SHIPS -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 05:04, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

"Brampton South"

The usage and primary topic of Brampton South is under discussion, see Talk:Brampton South (electoral district) -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 04:25, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

"Brampton North"

The usage and primary topic of Brampton North is under discussion, see Talk:Brampton North (electoral district) -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 04:25, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

Electoral district renames

Several ridings have come up for renaming, see WP:RM for the listing -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 04:37, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

"Scarborough North"

The usage and primary topic of Scarborough North is under discussion, see talk:Scarborough North (electoral district) -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 04:37, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

Terrebonne—Blainville

Terrebonne—Blainville has been proposed to be renamed, see Talk:Terrebonne—Blainville ; we are also discussing the meaning of "electoral district", "federal electoral district", "provincial electoral district" -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 03:48, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

Jacques Villeneuve

The naming of Jacques Villeneuve (oncle) is under discussion, see Talk:Jacques Villeneuve (elder) -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 04:57, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

Task Force Spirit

I think this task force could use a little spirit.

My first idea is having our own version of the overarching Military History Task Force chevron. I mocked up what I think our version could look like:

Wikipedian CHTF rank

Just a running idea right now. I also though some sort of campaign ribbon, modeled after the NATO campaign ribbon, would work to recognize effort in certain project

Wikipedia Service Ribbon

Just some ideas! Jbaer50 (talk) 04:24, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

condominium information on wikipedia

On the off chance that someone here is interested in helping build info on condominiums... Ottawahitech (talk) 16:51, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

adding Long Table Distillery to Wikipedia...

We would like to have Long Table Distillery added to Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.207.100.232 (talk) 15:24, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Unfortunately, Wikipedia cannot promise instant (or even timely) responses to any individual request for an article about something that doesn't have one yet. This is a volunteer project, so the best we can ever actually promise for any topic is that it'll get an article when someone gets around to writing one — it could take two days or it could take two years, and we can never actually guarantee any timeframe more specific than "it'll happen when it happens". Also, what we need is some evidence of reliable source which demonstrates that it meets one or more of our inclusion criteria for companies — companies don't get an automatic inclusion freebie on here just because they exist. Bearcat (talk) 19:21, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

• Hi 24.207.100.232,I have never heard of Long Table Distillery, but I See that there is already an article here on Microdistillery. Ottawahitech (talk) 18:05, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Advertisement

The template Wikipedia Advertisements promotes Beer, Hockey, and Maple Syrup. Two of these are POV: alcohol and violence. More appropriate terms should be used to highlight Canada: 3 Oceans, Parliament, or Diversity, for examples. The use of this template will increase and this Project ought to make a priority of removing the offensive throwbacks to Bob & Doug MacKenzie.

Wikipedia ads	file info – #110

The job is not too big but takes technical insight beyond what I can contribute.Rgdboer (talk) 23:05, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

I think the only problem is "Beer", which is not closely related primarily to Canada. Replacing it with "Poutine" could do, but then two items would be mostly Quebec (Poutine and Maple Syrup) -- Oceans, Parliament and University is not closely related primarily to Canada, so are not good choices ; there are however, beavers, caribou, wapiti, Canadian geese, musk oxen, polar bears -- 67.70.32.190 (talk) 05:04, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

• Characterizing hockey as "violence" is POV. As this "ad" is not used in article space, I suggest there are more productive areas where effort within the WikiProject be spent. I say it is fine as is. Hwy43 (talk) 05:28, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
• The "ad" — which is an internal banner to promote this WikiProject within the corpus of Wikipedia editors, not something that's getting onto CTV or The Globe and Mail as some grand philosophical statement of Canadian identity — is not about promoting any particular set of values per se. It's just using a couple of symbols commonly associated with Canadian culture as an attention-grabber to promote this wikiproject, not alcohol or "violence". And Hwy43 is absolutely right, conflating hockey with violence is POV — any sport, even chess, can get violent if its participants decide to brawl in the middle of the game, but that doesn't make the sport itself a fundamentally violent thing. And to address the alternate examples you raised, "diversity" is not uniquely characteristic of Canada — it's a value quite common to many countries around the world in the 21st-century, and is not something that specifically connotes Canada to the exclusion of anywhere else. So it's not a suitable replacement. Simply put, we have much more important things to worry about right now — namely, a federal election campaign, and the inevitable onslaught of partisan WP:POV bullshittery and the equally inevitable invasion of attempts to misuse Wikipedia as a hosting platform for unelected candidates' campaign brochures — than this trivia. Not a priority. Bearcat (talk) 16:32, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

Not to disagree with the “fundamental” part, or most of the rest for that matter, but chess is a lousy analogy. Hockey, like many team sports, includes a level of physical contact and confrontation that would constitute criminal assault in another context, so I think it’s fair to characterize it as “violent”, even if one doesn’t believe fighting to be part of the game (as some do) or at all condone the more dangerous fouls, e.g. kneeing & boarding. Not that merely mentioning it implies a POV either, but on the spectrum of violence it’s clearly in a different category from, say, short-track speed-skating, or volleyball, let alone chess. That said, it’s arguably less violent than most of the football games (other than soccer), and certainly less so than the ‘harder’ combat sports.—Odysseus1479 00:51, 11 August 2015 (UTC)

• I really don't know what to make of Hockey being considered too violent to be a symbol of Canada. This ad, and the MacKenzie brothers are examples of self-deprecating humour, which is about as Canadian as one can be, under the circumstances. If beer is considered too taboo for advertisements, then lets come up with a sensible alternative. But I really don't see this as a major issue that we should be concerning ourselves with.--kelapstick^(bainuu) 16:44, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

The advertisement is objectionable. Self-deprecating humor is not a defense: see Nicomachean Ethics: §4.4.7 Honesty about oneself. Further, the advertisement aggravates the Gender gap in this Project. Further, reference to the "game" may favor a candidate that wrote a book about its history. Concussions from ice hockey have damaged young men, and often they cannot do their school work at the level of young women; leadership in several Provinces has passed to women.Rgdboer (talk) 23:03, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Oh, you can't seriously think that you just gave a serious or substantive argument. For one thing, Wikipedia as a whole has a gender gap just by virtue of its userbase inherently skewing "internet geek", and there's no evidence that this project attains any special level of dubiousness on that count. For two, lots of women like (and even play) hockey too — it is not an exclusively male pastime, and any gender gap in Wikipedia's userbase simply cannot be laid at the feet of the word "hockey" existing in an internal banner ad for an internal wikiproject. For three, what exactly does "reference to the "game" may favor a candidate that wrote a book about its history" have to do with anything that this banner has anything to do with, given that an internal project banner is not going to impact the results of a real-world election in any way, shape or form? For four, young men can get concussions from car accidents too. And for five, women premiers have about as much to do with the banner as Ken Dryden (see, I knew perfectly well what you were talking about even if I fail to see how it has anything to do with the matter at hand) does. Get a stinking grip. Bearcat (talk) 23:23, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

My, my, but you seem to be allowing your own prejudices to cloud your judgement. For myself, I know plenty of women who enjoy both hockey and beer, and more than a few guys who can't abide one or the other. As for self-deprecating "humor" being a "defense" (sic and sic; this is WP:Canada, after all), I think other fine Canadian traditions you ought to bear in mind are tolerance and trying to see the best in people and actions. Regarding your other comments, I have no idea how that banner might "favor" (sic, again) a candidate (are we voting for editors now? I didn't get that memo...), and how the pleasantly egalitarian attitude of the Canadian electorate toward the gender of their premiers might relate to it is anyone's guess. Go have a nice lie down, or a beer. Pyrope 23:25, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Sorry about the offending orthography but it is pleasing to see some refinement in one area. Since this WP:Wikiproject is the umbrella covering all projects in Category:Canada WikiProjects, it pertains to our nation branding. The three identifiers used currently harken back to the staples theory of Canada's economy when miners took turns buying a round for the boys after they returned to the surface. Such a rear-view mirror glance at the country obstructs the view ahead, was criticised in 1967 by Marshall McLuhan in his The Medium is the Message, and is certainly a disgrace today.Rgdboer (talk) 22:02, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

You're raising a ruckus about an issue that isn't a priority in any sense of the word, and you're not saying anything productive about it. Seriously, just drop the stick and go find something useful to do — some actual priorities that would welcome your assistance might include assisting with the dablinks cleanup project below, or helping me fix our appallingly bad and woefully incomplete historical coverage of the Genie Awards, or helping to clean up the onslaught of partisan bullcrap in our election-related articles. That's the important stuff that we need to be dealing with, not this trivia. Bearcat (talk) 01:40, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Moving along - nothing to see here. PKT(alk) 14:59, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

What is the logical justification for comma disambiguation being required for lower jurisdictions, such as cities, towns, and regional municipalities?

Basically, should Yorkton be just "Yorkton" or "Yorkton, Saskatchewan"; or Bas-Saint-Laurent vs. Bas-Saint-Laurent, Quebec etc.? The reason why I'm asking this is that I'm having a naming dispute right now concerning US counties, and whether or not names such as Los Angeles County should be named as such or "Los Angeles County, California" in full. Current policy (WP:USPLACE) says that "Articles on counties and parishes are typically titled X County (or X Parish), State." This practice is inconsistent with place-names in other parts of the world and creates unnecessarily inconcise titles.--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 15:06, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

The US follows the USPLACE guideline, whereas the rest of the world typically uses WP:COMMONNAME. I move all articles on Canadian places from Foo, Province to Foo if Foo simply redirects or doesn't exist. Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Canada-related articles#Places covers this. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 15:11, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

The policy that the rest of the world uses certainly violates the principals of WP:NAMINGCRITERIA of Naturalness and Recognizability does it? I mean, I had no idea where Yorkton was until I found a random town in Saskatchewan for an example, on top of that I'm sure most people in the world don't even know where Saskatchewan is. The most common name that someone will type into the search bar (assuming there is no autofill), would be Workton, Saskatchewan.--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 18:59, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

If a user enters Yorkton, Saskatchewan, a redirect takes them where they want to go. The policy is simple: don't disambiguate unless you are disambiguating from something. USPLACE is no example to follow. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 20:51, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

The purpose of an article title is to serve as a location for the page, and not to convey extended information about the topic beyond the minimum necessary to ensure that the page has a unique title that isn't in conflict with any other title. There are, for example, people in the world who wouldn't know what the Toronto Maple Leafs are either, but that doesn't mean we have to move the article to "Toronto Maple Leafs (hockey team)" just because the topic might not be immediately obvious to all users just by seeing the name alone — anyone who doesn't already know what it is can find out by reading the article, and doesn't need superfluous information to be added to the title.

Accordingly, the naming convention for geographic places used by every country in the world besides the United States is that a place goes at just "place" if its name is unique (for instance, no other topic on earth could ever be located at just Iqaluit) or if it's the primary meaning (nobody would ever seriously expect the title Toronto to be about anything other than Canada's largest city) — but gets disambiguated by an appropriate higher geographical division (comma province, comma state, comma country, etc.) if it's not a unique name. Preexisting fame, or adding more information to the title on behalf of users who don't already know what the topic is, have nothing to do with it. The rule for all other topics is that any article always gets the simplest title that it can be given without creating a conflict with other topics of comparable or greater importance — and and we don't need the naming rule for geographic places to be different than the one we use for companies or book/film/television/album titles or people or other non-geographic topics. The rule has to be the same as it is for other topics: the title does not need to contain any more information than the minimum necessary to ensure that it has a unique location that isn't competing with other topics located at their simplest possible titles.

The US contingent has always had a different rule for itself, by which only the very largest US cities can claim unique name or primary topic as a valid reason to be located at just "Place", and smaller places must be at "Place, State" regardless of whether they satisfy one of the criteria that would allow them to be moved to a shorter title — but no other country has ever had any consensus to follow that rule instead of the one that would apply to any other topic.

All of that said, I'm a bit confused by this discussion. Both your title and your initial question seem to be arguing against the current WP:USPLACE convention — and thus I'm not too clear on why you would bring the discussion to WikiProject Canada, as if USPLACE (which we don't follow) had anything to do with us. Then in your second question you seem to be arguing that Canada should shift to following a USPLACE-style "comma-province disambiguation always required" convention instead of the one we currently use — thus doubling the confusion because now I don't even know which side of the coin you're arguing in the first place. Bearcat (talk) 19:50, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

In line with this topic, there is a discussion about the primary topic or use of a dab page at Talk:York. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 21:11, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

My post here is more of a thought experiment than anything. Of course I realize that Canadian articles don't follow WP:USPLACE. I'm trying to learn about some of the arguments why Canadian and Australia (and possibly others) have made the switch to [sic] "city, state" over the past few years.--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 21:06, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Actually, it's the other way around—WP:CANADA (and other projects, such as WP:JAPAN) used to follow a similiar guideline to USPLACE. Over the years, those guidelines have been overturned virtually everywhere except for the US, and place articles have been gradually moved to their un-disambiguated versions. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 21:17, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Sorry I actually meant "made the switch from "city, state" to just "city". The logic that USPLACE apologists use is assuming that the "city, state" format for most non-major cities is the most recognizable format. However this same thing could be said about nearly every country in the world. The most commonly recognized name for Jeddah to most humans is Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, even though the article titles is the way it currently is. Anyways as pertaining to Canada, do you think you could point me to some of the archived threads about this topic?--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 18:27, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

The arguments for preemptive disambiguation of US places are extremely poor and frequently challenged. They pretty much come down to:

(a) most American places need disambiguation anyways, so let's just do them all

Most Canadian city names are unique, as are most city names of most countries in the world—this is a uniquely american issue

(b) in causal conversation, people actually say things like "Chicago, Illinois", even when they are in Chicago and are aware that Chicago is one of the best-recognized cities in the world. Why do they do this? I doubt even Americans know.

This is untrue of most other places in the world. Nobody says "Tuktoyaktuk, Northwest Territories" or "Sault St Marie, Ontario" in casual conversation, nor do they say "Dresden, Saxony" or "Nagoya, Aichi".

Basically, the arguments don't hold any water even in the American case, and are entirely invalid everywhere else. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 21:29, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

It's actually not true that most Canadian city names are unique — there are certainly places whose names are genuinely unique (especially if they derive from aboriginal languages, or are saint-names in Quebec which come with attached predisambiguations like -de-Litchfield or -du-Ha! Ha!), but far more of Canada's undabbed cities are just straightforward primary topics rather than names which are genuinely unique as such. And people will, of course, say "Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario" if there's a contextual need to distinguish it from the one in Michigan — while the one in Ontario is larger, the population differential between the two isn't so strong that we can credibly make a primary topic call on it. But you are certainly correct that people don't preemptively say "Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario" in every context — but I don't believe for a second that people actually do that for Chicago either. Bearcat (talk) 20:39, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Actually, the math's been done: nearly 50% of US placenames require disambiguation, while most Canadian ones are unique (apparently I chose a poor example with Sault Ste. Marie). I'm astounded that you'd assert you "don't believe for a second that people actually do that for Chicago either". It's like you live on a different continent than the one I grew up on. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 07:26, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

I hear people say just "Chicago" without a trailing "Illinois" all the freaking time — far more often, in fact, than not. And trust me, I don't live in any alternate reality, as much as I may wish I did sometimes.

I'd like to see where that "percentage of unique names" math is documented, as well — I didn't thoroughly review the entire list of Canadian cities, admittedly, but at least among Canada's 30 largest just six (20 per cent) of them can actually claim uniqueness for their name. Those six being Winnipeg, Quebec City, Gatineau, Longueuil, Saskatoon and Greater Sudbury. And even two of those six only get it on a technicality — Quebec City is an extremely common but technically unofficial name for a city whose official name is (obviously) not unique, and Greater Sudbury is an officialism that's actually less common in the real world than the unofficial and non-unique "Sudbury".

A lot of Canadian place names may seem on first blush to be more unique than they really are, because they don't share their names with any other significant places whose existence the average person is likely to know about — but you'd actually be wrong if you said there were no other Torontos, Montreals, Ottawas, Calgarys, Vancouvers, Mississaugas, St. John'ses, Trois-Rivièreses, Bramptons or Edmontons in the world (in the case of Toronto, you'd even be wrong if you said the Big Smoke was the only one in Canada, because there's a small village called Toronto in Prince Edward Island, too — and in the case of Mississauga, there's a First Nations reserve near Blind River which begs to differ with the notion that McCallion Country is even the only Mississauga in Ontario.) In reality, Canada most certainly does not have an appreciably higher proportion of unique city names than the US does — we might have more that get "primary topic" status by virtue of being exponentially more famous than any smaller namesake, but that's a different question entirely. Bearcat (talk) 17:48, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

Only on Wikipedia will you find such a pedantic discussion about something so trivial that it conjures such thinly-veiled insults as "are you even living on the planet Earth?" Instead of being negative, aren't there infoboxes to be filled? POV's to be erased? New members to recruit? Articles to assess? Deletion requests to be closed?

As for the discussion at hand, I am indifferent. On one hand, I agree that having, e.g., "Sudbury, Ontario" might be more specific and preferable for internationalization. It's also good to be consistent. On the other, I do think simplification and minimalism is preferable in a place where there is already overwhelming information. Additionally, the majority of people who will be searching for it will already be familiar with its context: they may have picked up on it from an acquaintance or the media; they will not be randomly searching for "Kuujjuaq" because their cat stepped on their keyboard. And even if they did, the infobox there would provide them with more precise information.

In the end, isn't easy navigation, not standardization, the goal? The vast majority of people searching for "Ottawa," for example, will want the capital, and others may use the disambiguation page and/or hatnote. I doubt that people, even those unfamiliar with Canadian geography, will be looking for "Ottawa, Ontario" or even "Ottawa, Canada" when they come here. - SweetNightmares 15:54, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

The USPLACE guideline is not as crazy as some are suggesting. There's a list of exceptions including Chicago which do not follow the comma rule. Since there would be endless argument over which should get the exception, the list of exceptions follows an available standard, which is the Associate Press's guideline for datelines of articles. A similar guideline for Canada would have exceptions definitely including Ottawa and Toronto. And although Chicago, Cleveland, Pittsburgh are among the exceptions, I have certainly many times heard "Chicago, Illinois" and "Cleveland, Ohio" and "Pittsburgh, PA" (pronounced P. A.) and so on. Y'all can go jump in a Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada! :) --doncram 04:07, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Vandalism

If someone has time, please help watch and revert the vandalisms by IP 184.162.66.234. This vandal is persistent since yesterday with several attempts to insert bogus data in tables about past Canadian elections. -- Asclepias (talk) 15:59, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Laureen Harper

I know that people don't pay that much attention to the AFD process anymore (the sheer number of discussions I've seen that had to be relisted twice for complete lack of any participation at all attests to that), but I wanted to bring it to people's attention that there's a current case that's a bigger deal than usual: even though there's a standing consensus that Spouses of the Prime Ministers of Canada are a class of topic that are notable and eligible for articles, a user has tried to get Laureen Harper deleted on WP:NOTINHERITED grounds. The discussion's at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Laureen Harper if anybody wants to weigh in. Bearcat (talk) 18:28, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Alma, Ontario

The Wikipedia entries for Mapleton and Centre Wellington townships both claim that the town of Alma was included in the township boundary when they were formed in 1999. I don't know which is correct, but the current map of Mapleton in Google maps shows it includes Alma. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.191.90.91 (talk) 09:32, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

The last version of MapArt's Ontario Road Atlas that I have access to places Alma square on the border between the two municipalities, and even on Google Maps it's only just tucked into a notch sticking out from a borderline that would actually be bisecting Alma if it had stayed continuously straight. It's entirely possible that one of the two is wrong about exactly where the border is located, or that the community is actually divided between the two — but due to the conflict between the two, we'd need further sources to confirm one way or the other, if anybody knows where a more definitive source can be found. Bearcat (talk) 07:45, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Alma appears to be just within Mapleton, Ontario. See census map or municipal map of Centre Wellington. -- P 1 9 9  ✉ 19:24, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for that, those both confirm that the border notches around Alma per the Google Maps version of things — and as official government maps, they're obviously way more definitive than any commercial mapping company that may be prone to error. I'll fix the articles accordingly. Bearcat (talk) 21:03, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Does anyone live in Dawson City...?

Hi! Does anyone live (or have friends or family who might live) in Dawson City, and would be prepared to take a photograph for an article? I've recently expanded an article on the O'Brien Brewing and Malting Company, a fascinating brewery active just after the Klondike Gold Rush, but it is lacking a decent photograph. The Dawson City Museum has some bottles produced by the company on display, and there is a beer wagon in Dawson City that once belonged to the company (seen here), but there are no suitably licensed photographs of either. Does anyone know of someone who might be able to help in taking a quick snap or two...? Hchc2009 (talk) 11:29, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

Ontario Retirement Pension Plan

I started this stub less than a week ago and don't have time to work on it. I just checked its wiki-statistics and I see that this new page has already had more than 10,000 views. This is unusual in my experience because many people in Canada do not use Wikipedia as a source of knowledge. It would be a shame if no one helps build up this page to show Canadians what Wikipedia can do. Ottawahitech (talk) 09:51, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

It's getting a ton of views because of Kathleen Wynne's electoral grandstanding. I don't know enough about the topic to add anything useful to the article though. Resolute 20:36, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. Just to clarify for non-Canadian editors, Kathleen Wynne is not currently running for election - the current elections are federal, I think. Ottawahitech (talk) 16:36, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Granted, but she has inserted herself into the federal campaign in a way that provincial premiers normally avoid. We're all free to have our own opinions about whether her interventions are justified or "grandstanding", but Resolute wasn't implying that there's a provincial election underway.

Onto the matter at hand, though: you do have a bit of an unfortunate habit, when creating a new article, of actually doing the absolute bare minimum necessary to verify that the article's topic exists, and then expecting everybody else to do the rest of the work for you on the "actually adding any real substance or sourcing to the article beyond this is a thing that exists, the end" part of the equation. If it's that important to you that the article "show Canadians what Wikipedia can do", is there a reason why you can't be the doer instead of trying to guilt everybody else into it? Bearcat (talk) 18:28, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Guilt others to "Do the rest of the work" for me? --I thought ownership of articles on Wikipedia is frowned upon, No??? But in case you are REALLY interested, the reason I start a lot of articles, and not develop all of them from the getgo, is that I have been the target of the delitionist faction at Wikipedia, and have learnt the hard way not to put all my eggs in the same basket. BTW I was not implying that resolute was implying, I was simply trying to involve others who are not familiar with Canadian politics in this discussion. Ottawahitech (talk) 23:44, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

There is no "deletionist faction" at Wikipedia, if what you mean by "deletionist" is that the deleters are getting rid of stuff for no particular reason, and no blame whatsoever falls on the articles for not being up to snuff — what there is, is an insistence on proper sourcing that supports a legitimate claim of notability. And we all have that same responsibility — the only difference is that some people are better than others are at actually putting in the amount of work it takes to ensure that responsibility is being met.

I, for instance, have had very few new articles that I've created ever actually nominated for deletion — and trust me when I say that it's not because I'm more popular around here than you are (some people actually bloody hate me for being such a hardass stickler for proper sourcing, and not letting musicians' PR-toned Bandcamp profiles or unelected political candidates' campaign brochures slide through unchallenged), but because I actually do the work it takes to ensure that my new articles actually pass our keepability standards right off the bat.

I'm going to give you an example here: remember Randall Denley? You created that a few years ago, without ever asserting any notability besides his unelected candidacy in a forthcoming election, and then snarked up a storm that he was notable for other things besides that without ever actually showing or sourcing a single solitary word about what any of those other things might actually be — and it got redirected to a candidate list accordingly. Well, click on that link again and see what's there now — and then click on the edit history and check out who made it that way. It ain't that I get an automatic "keep because Bearcat" pass and you get an automatic "delete because Ottawahitech" fail, trust me — it's that I actually invested the time and effort to actually make it a better article than you ever did. You stacked and sourced his notability onto his unelected candidacy, and then pitched a holy fit when you were told that unelected candidates don't get articles on Wikipedia just for being candidates — I stacked his notability onto three novels, and thus got him past WP:AUTHOR. (And the fact that it's been able to stick around despite the original deletion discussion should also be a clue that I was right when I told you last year that AFD does not constitute a permanent ban on the subject ever having an article, but that a new article about a previously deleted topic can be recreated again, if somebody's actually willing to put in the work needed to make it better than it was the first time. You didn't believe me then, either — but guess what? I really was telling you the truth.)

So, funnily enough, putting more into your new articles than "this is a thing that exists, the end" is precisely how you could avoid being the "target" of such "deletionist attacks" in the future. Bearcat (talk) 02:50, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

Well, I am glad that you have better luck with articles that you write, and thank you for writing the Randall Denley article. I on the other hand am still not sure what is notable and what is not — see for example Las Brisas condominium, an article that I recently started about an Ottawa condominium where each owner is(was?) facing a $66,000 special assessment to pay for renovations. This article is now at AFD. Ottawahitech (talk) 09:27, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

Especially when it comes to a localized topic like that, the key to demonstrating notability is to keep in mind that your audience is not just your neighbour down the same street, who's looking for local information about local topics — your audience is also in Vancouver, Los Angeles, Singapore, Oslo, Mumbai, Sydney, Istanbul and Johannesburg. And notability is sustained over time, as well. A thing doesn't automatically get a Wikipedia article just because it's gotten into the local news for a day or two over one incident; it gets a Wikipedia article if and when there's been a long-term range of coverage of diverse aspects of it, demonstrating a reason why the entire world, not just one neighbourhood in Ottawa, needs to read the article.

But that article doesn't demonstrate any reason at all why the world needs to know about it — and it also fails the thing I pointed out above about writing and sourcing more than just "this is a thing that exists, the end". Bearcat (talk) 15:51, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

that article doesn't demonstrate any reason at all why the world needs to know about it

Thanks for the continued dialogue , Bearcat. I can’t help but wonder if what you said above can be translated into “notability is in the eye of the beholder”? (I assume you are responding to my comment about Las Brisas condominium above and not to the article at the top of this discussin?Ottawahitech (talk) 12:50, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Anyone else missing Skookum?

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

It is probably best not to talk about an editor who is no longer here and not able to respond or defend themselves. Resolute 17:22, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

---

I miss skookum, mainly for selfish reasons. I cannot add him to wp:missing Wikipedians because he is indef blocked… So thought I would come here to see if anyone else misses him? Ottawahitech (talk) 17:23, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

I do! Yesterday I was thinking of him as I edited at Skookumchuck. (I found my way there because I was trying to clear one of wt:Canada's remaining dablinks.) As I converted it from a dab to a SIA I learned about what a Skookumchuck is: vigorous tidal whitewater/rapids at outlets of British Columbia's fjords. --doncram 23:45, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

The guy could be a pain sometimes with his abrasive communication style, but he was definitely always committed to getting the content right. And that's a type of commitment that seems all too rare on here sometimes. Bearcat (talk) 02:46, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

I'm really sorry, Skookum1, if you are watching, but life here on Wikipedia is way more peaceful, serene and less dramatic. He was a great contributor, but his entrenched battleground mentality, emotional verbosity and expectation for others to do the work on his behalf did him and others that tried to help him little to no favours. Helping him, or explaining to him on the rare occasion that we was wrong, was a massive time sink. I remember helping to barely snatch a "keep" from the jaws of "delete" on an AfD for him that should have been a slam dunk keep if he could just take a technical, evidence-based approach rather than his habitual approach. I have no doubt many of his requests for help were ignored by others despite him being correct due to the time sink issue. I believe this as I was one of them, and I don't doubt therefore there were others feeling the same way. I do hope he is now healthier and less stressed, and I wish him all the best. If he were somehow to return and use a reformed approach, I would be over the moon. Respectfully, Hwy43 (talk) 05:12, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Assistance request

It's just been brought to my attention that an anonymous user, User:68.194.86.101, has spent at least 12 full hours today editing literally hundreds of Canadian politicians to readd succession footers to the bottom of the article for positions whose successions are already listed in the infobox at the top of the same article, in violation of the principle of avoiding template creep. Although so far they appear to have stopped once I asked them to stop, they've edited more than enough articles that it's going to take at least a few people to get them cleaned back up — one person isn't going to be able to get them all done alone. Are there any volunteers willing to help out? If so, you can see the articles that need fixing via their edit history; anything that has (current) at the end of the edit, meaning that they were the last user to edit the article, needs to be reverted while anything without that notation has already been fixed. Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 21:32, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

Welland francophone population

There seemed to be some concern about whether or not Welland has a large francophone population. According to a city website drawing on census figures, 10.5 per cent of Wellanders list French as their mother tongue. Considering it's 3.2 per cent for the rest of the Niagara Region, and 4 per cent for Canada as a whole, I'd say this constitutes a large francophone population. The referencing website is http://www.welland.ca/EDC/profile/cDemographics.pdf

```` — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.48.190.120 (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

Radio Broadcasting in Canada-- Need an Article?

DonnaHalper (talk) 19:57, 5 September 2015 (UTC)I'm an American, a former broadcaster and current professor, with many years of experience writing about media history. I was looking for an article about the history of radio in Canada, to see if there were something I could add to it. But all I found was a long list of the stations, and a link to the Canadian Radio Broadcasting Foundation, which has a history that was written in 2005. Would you like an entry about radio in Canada, and if so, what would you like it to contain-- I'd be happy to take a stab at it!

@DonnaHalper: Thanks for sharing your plans with us. I myself am not familiar with the topic radios in Canada, but I am sure there are others here who are and who may pop in later, so keep checking... Ottawahitech (talk) 17:12, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 18:05, 6 September 2015 (UTC)I am not referring to "radios"-- although the technology is certainly a part of the story. I am referring to radio, the mass medium that began in Canada with XWA circa 1919-1920. If you want me to write about radio broadcasting in Canada, I'd be happy to start that essay!

@DonnaHalper:; WP:BEBOLD! If there's a gap in information that you can help to fill, go for it. PKT(alk) 19:23, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 23:59, 6 September 2015 (UTC)I am always happy to fill gaps in information if I can! Speaking of that, I also note you need entries on two great Canadian broadcasters-- Ken Soble and Jane Gray; or perhaps an article on Women Broadcasters? I can help with any or all of these. The one thing I have never done is start a new article: I know how to take a stub and make it into a full article, as I just did with both Night Heat and Scott Hylands. But if it's never existed, I am not experienced with that first step in creating it. I looked at the instructions, but I'm a visual learner and found the directions confusing. If anyone can help by creating a stub for Ken or Jane, I can take it from there!

@DonnaHalper: I created a stub: Jane Grey (broadcaster) -- I hope you can do something wonderful with it. Thanks for helping build wikipedia. Ottawahitech (talk) 01:53, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 18:05, 7 September 2015 (UTC)You are a saint! Can you also create one for her mentor, and a great Canadian broadcaster, Ken Soble (also on your list of folks you need entries for), and I will write one for him too. I hope you will like them both.

Quick starter draft on Ken Soble ready for you. Thanks so much for the offer, we need all the help we can get for some of this stuff and the attention of experts in the field is very much welcome. Bearcat (talk) 19:04, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 06:49, 10 September 2015 (UTC) Okay, Ken Soble is absolutely not a stub anymore. See if you like what I did-- I hope you found it thorough. I do need help though-- for some reason, I couldn't get the reference list to come out right, and I don't know why. The list of sources I used printed out twice and the category ==references== didn't show up in the category box no matter what I did... Can someone fix it? Sorry I can't figure out what I messed up. (Btw, I didn't mention Mr. Soble's religion or say much about his family. Should I have?) I'm gonna do Jane Gray's entry next. Any other broadcasters screaming out to be removed from the "stub" category?

Fixed, it was missing a </ref> Curiocurio 14:25, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 21:21, 10 September 2015 (UTC) Aww, thanks-- must have missed it. But was the entry okay? Can we now officially removed Mr. Soble from the list of entries that you need worked on? I'm starting on Jane Gray next. Other suggestions are welcome.

DonnaHalper (talk) 04:54, 12 September 2015 (UTC) And Jane Gray is also no longer a stub now. I hope you liked my work; let me know if there's anyone else you want me to expand upon.

We do have an article on History of broadcasting in Canada. Rjensen (talk) 06:53, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

DonnaHalper (talk) 04:11, 13 September 2015 (UTC)Yes, but it seems kind of general. Perhaps I can add more specifics to it!

Reconciliation Canada

Hi there, I am new to Wikipedia, so I apologize if this is posted in the incorrect place. I work for the non-profit organization Reconciliation Canada and I believe our organization deserves a Wikipedia page. I have tried to follow the guidelines on the Wikipedia:FAQ/Organizations for requesting a page for my organization. I have submitted requests on both Wikipedia:Canadian Wikipedians' notice board/Requests and on Wikipedia:Requested articles. The request on the Canadian Wikipedians' Notice Board can be found here. Please advise on any next steps or changes required. As I said, I am new to Wikipedia, and I appreciate all your help and feedback! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jpvancouver15 (talk • contribs) 00:05, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jpvancouver15! I'll take a look for some sources we could use to help determine the the notability of the org. You could help us by posting any major news coverage about Reconciliation Canada that you know of. A quick look at Google shows some possibilities. Best, The Interior (Talk) 00:45, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Hi there,The Interior! Thank you for your help! Here are some news articles that reference the work and history of Reconciliation Canada:

• Thousands walk for reconciliation in Vancouver;
• Reconciliation Week Envisions 'New Way Forward';
• Vancity's values-based banking brings CEO Tamara Vrooman in contact with global icons;
• Walk for Reconciliation 1 of top B.C. news stories of 2013;
• Thousands join Reconciliation Walk in Vancouver to heal wounds of residential schools;
• Pride and reconciliation buoy canoe ceremony;
• Bernice King, Reconciliation Walk Draw Thousands In Vancouver

Please let me know if I can provide any further information! Jpvancouver15 (talk) 16:47, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Jpvancouver15, great. Keep them coming if you have any more. It would be great to have a piece that covers the org in detail. I'll see what I can do over the weekend. Chief Robert Joseph really needs a page as well. The Interior (Talk) 17:24, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, The Interior! Here are a few more. These pertain more to the organization in general:

• Hardship and hope catalyze the desire for reconciliation
• Finding a new way forward with Aboriginal people

I will also track down some news pieces referring specifically to Chief Joseph.Jpvancouver15 (talk) 18:37, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Corey Haim

Hallo, Canadians !

Would it be possible to take a photo of the tomb of Mr. Corey Haim, some time ? Greetings from Germany, Cologne!, keep up the good work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.209.75.96 (talk) 14:13, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Find A Grave says he’s buried at Pardes Shalom Cemetery, Vaughan, York RM, Ontario. That’s about 2700 km from where I live, but no doubt some of us are much closer.—Odysseus1479 23:25, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

Shalom ! Odysseus, thank You for your reply. Sorry, I don't know that's so far away from You. :(. תודה, i have מקווה, greetings from Cologne (i am roman-catholic), i am a Croat, Hungary are not far away from Germany and Croatia, send You best wishes from good, old Europe, שוב תודה :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.209.75.96 (talk) 15:09, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

{{Canada-sport-stub}}

Template:Canada-sport-stub is not noticeably Canadian. Instead of having the flag behind the sports items, shouldn't we have a red maple leaf superimposed on top of the sports items?

-- 70.51.202.113 (talk) 06:30, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

The article Sport in Canada has been rated as Top-importance/C-Class. Does not look like there is a lot of interest in the topic? Ottawahitech (talk) 12:18, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

I have updated the template to my suggested format, as I find it better, and no one has objected -- 70.51.202.113 (talk) 05:28, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

RfC for Elizabeth II

There is an RfC for the lede sentence to the Elizabeth II article which essentially amounts to should the lede say "Elizabeth II is Queen of the United Kingdom and 15 other independent states", or "Elizabeth II is Queen of the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and 12 other independent states". If anyone is interested in the topic and has anything to add. trackratte (talk) 19:46, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Current events/Canada/Terms of use

Could do with some more comments at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Current events/Canada/Terms of use especially dealing with the second comment. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 10:20, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

Criminal Code of Canada

"Criminal Code of Canada" has been requested to be renamed, see talk:Criminal Code of Canada ; also the article itself is in somewhat poor shape, with unusual massive notes instead of being paragraphs, lack of inline references, mixtures of external links and refs, and weird external links sitting in the middle of the page. -- 70.51.202.113 (talk) 06:25, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

Doesn't this project have an canlaw sub-project? Ottawahitech (talk) 10:18, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

AfDs for buildings/structures in Stirling/Magrath/Warner area of Alberta

For those that may be interested:

• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Prairie Queen Hotel
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Andrew Larson House
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stirling Elevator
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Warner elevator row
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Neils Hogenson House
• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Harker House

Cheers, Hwy43 (talk) 21:40, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

@Hwy43: Thanks for posting this here. Unfortunately it appears that those few participating here have no interest in preserving (this type of?) wikipedia content. Actually it appears that the readership of this talkpage is quite low for a project of this size? Ottawahitech (talk) 10:42, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

I miss Skookum - a lot

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

With respect, Ottawahitech, I closed the last thread for a reason. Also, this is a noticeboard about topipcs relating to articles within the WP:CANADA project. It is not a generic discussion forum. Resolute 22:17, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

---

When I first posted this I said I missed user: Skookum1 for selfish reasons, but now that I think about it I believe I miss him for much more than that. Other than being great with words, I believe Skookum was a rare individual who wasn't afraid to speak his mind when helping the wiki-untouchables and he had a rare insight into things others don't. I wish there were more like him around.

I also wish this community was a bit more tolerant towards those who do not follow the norms, if only for self preservation. In my experience societies that ex-communicate those who are different just because they are different, risk having more enemies on the outside than on the inside, something that in the long run contributes to their demise. Oops TLDR. Ottawahitech (talk) 21:43, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

I am closing this as there is no reason to "beat a dead horse". Mrfrobinson (talk) 00:33, 10 October 2015 (UTC)

---

With respect, user:resolute are you the owner of this talkpage? Ottawahitech (talk) 10:52, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

Go read Wikipedia:Wikipedia_is_not_a_forum please. Mrfrobinson (talk) 13:26, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

No more than you are, Ottawahitech. But as has already been noted, Wikipedia is not a forum. Nor is making a WP:POINT a good idea. Your posts are not adding anything constructive. Move on. Resolute 14:21, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

Ottawahitech, if you want to discuss this further, I'm happy to do so over email. However, I agree with Resolute that discussing the merits of a blocked editor here on a open noticeboard is not desirable. The Interior (Talk) 15:21, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Old City of Ottawa

I cannot find an article for Ottawa like the one for Old City of Toronto — there must be one somewhere? Ottawahitech (talk) 10:15, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

Wouldn't that basically be Bytown? Resolute 14:22, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure Ottawahitech is talking about Ottawa as it existed prior to the municipal merger of 2001, when Ottawa and Nepean and Vanier and Kanata and Rockcliffe and Gloucester were separate things. We do indeed have an article about the pre-1997 core of Toronto as a separate topic from the current city — but conversely, we don't have articles about the pre-1971 version of Winnipeg, the pre-2001 versions of Hamilton or Sudbury, or the pre-2002 versions of Gatineau or Montreal, as separate topics from their post-merger iterations. In all of those cases, the city's entire history is covered in the same article as the current post-merger incarnation, and the pre-merger incarnation does not have a separate article as a standalone topic from the post-merger one.

This isn't a thing we automatically do every time a municipal merger happens — it's a thing that can happen if there's enough editor commitment to actually writing an article that's substantive enough to warrant standing alone as a separate topic, but it's not a thing that must automatically follow from all municipal amalgamations. So it's a thing that Ottawa could have if people were actually prepared to put serious work into writing a good article about it — but it's not a thing that Ottawa would automatically get as an inevitable consequence of the 2001 merger, so there's no requirement that it must exist. Bearcat (talk) 17:15, 10 October 2015 (UTC)

Considering the weird situations resulting from the megacities creations, a "old-city" type coverage should be contained in the prior supramunicipal organization articles (ie. Metro Toronto, Montreal Urban Community (after the partial demergers, this was revived as the Montreal Agglomeration Council), etc) -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 03:22, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

AfC submissions

See Draft:Working income tax benefit (WITB) and Draft:Canada's Ecofiscal Commission. Best, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 18:46, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

2015 Federal election & the potential premature edits

Just a reminder. We better be on our toes, just in case the Conservatives don't end up with the most seats. In such a scenerio, many related articles will be prematurely updated, before an actual change of government. GoodDay (talk) 23:48, 15 October 2015 (UTC)

Flesh out an article?

Anyone familiar with the book The Fight for Canada? It's up for AfD and I've found enough reviews to justify a keep, but I need help from someone familiar with the book (or its subject, Canadian history) that could write out a good summary or place other information in the article. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 04:39, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

Édouard Beaupré‎

I've reversed edits on Édouard Beaupré‎ twice already. There seems to be some confusion over the height and weight of this person although references are in place.-- Kayoty (talk) 17:41, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

FAR

I have nominated Banff National Park for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here.--Jarodalien (talk) 00:45, 19 October 2015 (UTC)

"Hockey pool"

FYI, there's a suggestion that a merger of hockey pool into fantasy hockey should be done, for the discussion, see talk:hockey pool -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 03:54, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

Leader of the NDP: isn't it John Horgan?

If you go to the BC NDP page, the leader is John Horgan, not Adrian Dix. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.194.254.129 (talk) 19:14, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

The BC NDP page is correct. Where does it say that Dix is still leader? ---- Patar knight - <sup>chat</sup>/<sub>contributions</sub> 19:46, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

I think it's possible the IP is getting tangled up on the fact that Dix, not Horgan, is the last leader listed in the "election results" table — but that's also entirely correct, as Horgan became leader after the most recent election, and hasn't yet led the party into an election himself. Bearcat (talk) 22:46, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

Input requested

Wanted to ask for some input from the Canadian contingent about this Daily Xtra article from earlier this week. In theory, it would be a naturally good source for a couple of details contained therein — but there's a big, potentially explosive red flag: towards the end of the article, there rests the sentence "The NDP ran five other gay and lesbian candidates that were defeated: Scott Bell (Saskatoon Grasswoods), Jacqui Gingras (North Okanagan-Shuswap), Paul Harris (Red Deer-Mountain View), Deborah Chief (Selkirk-Interlake-Eastman) and former Saskatchewan finance minister Andrew Thomson (Eglinton-Lawrence)."

Now, y'all know me — Category:LGBT politicians from Canada is one of the things I actively follow, to the point that I could even name you several unsourceable closet cases beyond John Baird. And on WP:CANQUEER I've been actively tracking the known LGBT candidates during the election, so that I'd know which ones would require the WP:LGBT project tag if they won seats on Monday (I already had Bell, Gingras and Harris on that list, as well as both Randy Boissonnault and Sheri Benson.) But Andrew Thomson's a new one even on me — and indeed, on at least an initial search of both Google and Proquest I can't find a shred of evidence that any reliable source has ever said this before either (even Xtra's own website doesn't bring up a shred of evidence that even they've ever said this before.) So for the moment I can't figure out whether this is a fuckup on Xtra's part, a recent coming-out that just didn't make the news because a politician coming out is hardly news anymore, a forced outing of a person who's actually still in the closet, or a thing people already knew which somehow escaped me and for which I'm just not looking in the right place for backup confirmation.

Obviously I'm not going to use this source in and of itself to describe or categorize Thomson as gay on Wikipedia — for the moment, I'm not even using it for the straightforward facts it is good enough to source, precisely because I don't want to call any more attention to the Thomson problem than absolutely necessary — but I wanted to ask if anybody knows of any other source that would corroborate. Bearcat (talk) 23:25, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

It's probably a case of a wrong name by accident or something. Maybe call or email the original reporter and ask? Otherwise wait for another source. Me-123567-Me (talk) 21:21, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

I did some searching of my own and nothing came up besides the Xtra article you mentioned except an obviously unreliable poll in which most people classified him as LGBT. I second emailing the original reporter to see if there's a print source or hard to find internet source that they used. ---- Patar knight - <sup>chat</sup>/<sub>contributions</sub> 12:32, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

Horrible new article [[ Timeline of Canadian history ]]

Should we keep Timeline of Canadian history an unsourced article that contains many things unrelated to Canada? Or just redirect the page as it was before back to List of years in Canada, Looks like someone gave up on the page. I dont see any benefit to the new article over all the info that is listed in the list of years. -- Moxy (talk) 17:32, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

the very thin article has problems all right--but timelines are basically indexes to other Wiki articles where you can expect to find documentation. I think its useful-- the list of years has far too many entries for someone new to Canadian history and it does not easily reveal major events. It should be expanded, I suggest. Rjensen (talk) 23:47, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

It needs to be redone by someone that is aware of Canadian content...15th,16th 17th centure have nothing to do with Canada. This article needs real work a redirect fr now is best over having un sourced - unrelated shit. Now we have a copy and paste of our BIB that is on another page. PS even list need sources Wikipedia:Stand-alone lists#Citing sources. Think I am going to ask for deletion. -- Moxy (talk) 23:57, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

"Unsourced" is not a valid reason for deletion. Perhaps a better idea is to brainstorm (on the article talk page), what should be included and what shouldn't. I mean, I could probably do up a decent referenced list in a couple hours this weekend using my own ideals for criteria. But why not make it a collaborative project and I'll volunteer to copyedit for consistent style and add whatever sources others don't once we're done? Resolute 00:04, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Ehh, probably useful if expanded properly. Though yeah, the deaths and succession of British and French monarchs is irrelevant to a timeline of Canadian history. I wouldn't even count electoral results in the list - except for the first. But if someone wanted to clean-up, source and expand, I'd say more power to them. Resolute 23:55, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

I trimmed away a lot of the useless European stuffing. I like timelines, and I think they can be very useful. Especially at a lot of different people had to them, thereby providing a sense of the most important developments in Canadian history. Rjensen (talk) 00:03, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Stephen Harper's infobox

We need some input at Harper's infobox. Should we include or exclude Harper's supposed departure date as PM (i.e November 4, 2015), before he resigns? -- GoodDay (talk) 07:13, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Seriously??? November 4 is only 1 week from now, but this discussion will likely drag on far beyond November 4. ;-) Just put up with it for 1 short week. BTW, WP:CRYSTALBALL#1 deals with this. -- P 1 9 9  ✉ 12:26, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

AfC submission 29/10/15

See Draft:Robert Jaffray Christie. Thank you, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 17:20, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

Provincial & Territorial seats in the House of Commons

Would someone update the post-2015 election totals, in each provincial & territorial article? GoodDay (talk) 00:44, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

Are the numbers solid yet? Unless I missed the news, there’s at least one judicial recount still to be done.—Odysseus1479 03:35, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

Likely not until November 9th. Debouch (talk) 12:27, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

At least three recounts: Edmonton Mill Woods in progress with results expected Oct 29, Montmagny–L'Islet–Kamouraska–Rivière-du-Loup starts Oct 29, Barrie–Springwater–Oro–Medonte starts Oct 30. Meters (talk) 05:17, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Edmonton Mill Woods review completed (minor count change but seat remains Liberal), and the riding article has been updated. Meters (talk) 05:57, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

Action Plan website taken down

For anyone that may have time to fix/update links or refs, the website "Canada's Economic Action Plan" is gone. There are a bunch of links that need to be removed, updated, or linked to an archival source. Mindmatrix 04:52, 6 November 2015 (UTC)

A new article about a Canadian musician

Editors may wish to look at Michael Laucke.—Anne Delong (talk) 02:53, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Rideau Hall & King-Byng Affair

Rideau Hall
Would appreciate some input at that article, concerning number of sources for who's Rideau Hall's official resident. GoodDay (talk) 04:48, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

King-Byng Affair
Woould also appreciate some input at that article. Concerning if we should or shouldn't describe George V as King George V of the United Kingdom. GoodDay (talk) 06:05, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

It's not necessary, GoodDay. The link is not ambiguous - it points to the correct person, per WP:PRIMARYUSAGE. PKT(alk) 13:56, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Neelix

The effect of the User:Neelix editing controversy is that several editors are bringing many of his articles to Afd. Neelix was very prolific and mass deletion would have a significant impact on the representation of Canada on this project. We obviously don't want to keep articles on non-notable topics but in a number of cases I've seen articles that I believe are notable end up there, as well. I would ask that members keep an extra close eye on Canada deletion sorting including the provincial pages during this period as we have a higher than normal volume there. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 11:34, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

See Special:Contributions/Neelix. You can find information about the problematic edits at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Neelix/Evidence, the gist of it being that Neelix has created many worthwhile articles, many dubious BLPs, and tens of thousands of questionable redirects. The user's talk page has a subpage for deletion discussions. The user has also created hundreds (maybe thousands) of categories on Commons, some of which are questionable; there's currently a discussion at Commons' AN/U. Mindmatrix 16:07, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Canada's monarchial succession

We seem to have inconsistency across Monarchy of Canada, Primogeniture, Perth Agreement and possibly others. Is Canada's succession to the throne still male-preference or was that eliminated in March 2015? We need input at those 3 articles. GoodDay (talk) 16:24, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

See WP:FORUMSHOP. --₪ MIESIANIACAL 16:26, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm not favouring one over the other. I'm seeking consistency across related articles. So the Forumshop accusation is baseless. GoodDay (talk) 16:29, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

WP:FORUMSHOP: "Raising essentially the same issue on multiple noticeboards and talk pages..." 1 Monarchy of Canada; 2 Perth Agreement; 3 Primogeniture; 4 here. Even if you discount the "notice" here (though, such often instigate discussion where they're left), that's still three messages about the same issue left essentially simultaneously at three different locations. --₪ MIESIANIACAL 16:37, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Since I'm not pushing for one version of succession over another. I fail to understand your protestation. Anyways, I'll leave that to others to decipher. GoodDay (talk) 16:54, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

The provisions of the succession act came into force in March, except that it only applies to heirs born after 2011. What is the dispute? TFD (talk) 17:41, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Have the provisions come in to force? That doesn't seem to be the case at Monarchy of Canada. GoodDay (talk) 17:43, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Please take any further discussion of this issue to Talk:Monarchy_of_Canada#Succession to keep the discussion in one place. Meters (talk) 19:49, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Attention Canadian administrators

I have noticed a recent editing pattern that may be against proper procedure. I would like Canadian administrators and template editors to check out Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard#User:Jerome501. Thanks, 117Avenue (talk) 05:01, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Infoboxes of provinces & territories

Anybody know how to update those infobox so that they show 338 House of Commons seats, instead of 308? GoodDay (talk) 03:27, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

 Done eg. Alberta....before=House seats 28 of 308 (9.1%) -......after=House seats 28 of 338 (8.3%)--Moxy (talk) 03:44, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

"Trudeau Government"

Someone has proposed that Premiership of Justin Trudeau be renamed to Trudeau Government, see the discussion at Talk:Premiership of Stephen Harper -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 07:05, 21 November 2015 (UTC)

Draft articles

I thought I would post this in Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Canada/Assessment, but it looks like it is dead(?), so I am sorry to have to trouble you guys once more. I just came across an article in wp:draft space and added this project's banner to it, but looking at your assessment table I see no Draft articles? Ottawahitech (talk) 05:57, 25 November 2015 (UTC)please ping me

There are definitely several Draft articles with WikiProject Canada banners, but I guess the numbers don't appear separately in the Assessment table. PKT(alk) 14:47, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Request

An anonymous IP has been editing Michael Ignatieff's article to insert commentary about the 2006 Liberal leadership convention, at which Bob Rae released his delegates on the final ballot rather than directly endorsing Ignatieff — specifically, they're trying to directly insinuate that the fact that Rae and Ignatieff were once roommates in university inherently makes Rae's failure to endorse Ignatieff surprising and shocking. This is obviously a WP:NPOV violation, but the IP has already reverted at least one removal of their interpretation, with the edit summary that they "rejected" my "clinical approach" — so I wanted to ask if anybody else has any input on whether this is the kind of assertion that belongs in the article or not. Bearcat (talk) 06:47, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I agree with your undo. Meters (talk) 17:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Request for input

I've posted a request at Talk:Andrew Wilkinson (Canadian politician) for comments on the includability or excludability of disputed content about a "controversy" that the article subject was reportedly involved in — it frankly seems to me like a pretty minor and leading insinuation rather than a genuinely encyclopedic matter, but the editor who's been removing it is an WP:SPA with a likely WP:COI and thus doesn't have any right to unilaterally strip it from the article. Further comments requested. Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 21:14, 29 November 2015 (UTC)

Monarchy of Canada

We need more input at that article, concerning its infobox. The dispute? Should we or should we not, include Rideau Hall & Citadelle in the infobox, as the Canadian monarch's official residences. GoodDay (talk) 04:57, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Discussion located at Official Residences. trackratte (talk) 05:03, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Discussion located at Monarchy of Canada, aswell. GoodDay (talk) 05:53, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

"Line of succession"

Another one to watch...

A new editor, with no prior edit history before this, has been editing Deputy Prime Minister of Canada today to provide a complete list of everybody who's been the top dog on the "act on the PM's behalf" order of precedence since the last time a deputy PM was actually named. I can see a potential case for viewing this as something that could be worthy of listing in that article, but it's far from automatically noteworthy — the biggest problem, in particular, is that the editor is trying to play the list as if that person was the prime minister's "designated successor" in a full-on "line of succession", which is a major misrepresentation of what the orders-in-council actually imply or confer. (Frex, while I have to imagine that Ralph Goodale would be a strong contender to be named as the new PM if something ever happened to JT, the decision in that regard would be up to the caucus and his status in the current operational order of precedence does not constitute a codified "line of succession" that automatically ties their hands.)

Accordingly, I wanted to ask for some input: is an extended list of everybody who was ever first in the line of go-to guys for holding down the fort while the PM was temporarily unavailable a thing that is even worth maintaining at all? And if there's a consensus for that, can somebody figure out a way to provide a more accurate explanation of what it is, and why it's worth listing, than this editor has been giving?

Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 18:48, 5 December 2015 (UTC)

You're right. There is no formal "Line of succession" in the Westminster system. The replacement of a chief executive is left to the governing party(ies) apparatus (usually the caucus) and the most senior member in the order of precedence is not necessarily the one who gets the top job in the event a leader leaves office. IMHO, the whole section on the Order of precedence is borderline WP:OR and a misuse of a primary source under WP:PSTS, unless accompanied by a secondary source saying the order of precedence is relevant in deputizing the Prime Minister job. Bouchecl (talk) 20:36, 5 December 2015 (UTC)

At the very least, if it is kept, it shouldn't be called an "order of precedence" which confuses it with the Canadian order of precedence. Graham (talk) 22:54, 5 December 2015 (UTC)

Lead image in Canada article

Pls see Talk:Canada#Great Seal of Canada as the second lead image -- Moxy (talk) 23:54, 10 December 2015 (UTC)

Proposing to move this category and its children to "requested images"

Please see discussion at Category talk:Wikipedia requested images by subject#Proposing to move this category and its children to "requested images (of/in ...)". Thank you for your time. JJ98 (Talk) 18:01, 11 December 2015 (UTC)

Tina Fontaine

I have started an article regarding her murder, and would like others to review and contribute to it. --Harizotoh9 (talk) 00:21, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Notice to participants at this page about adminship

Participants here are often really good core content creators, have to know what is notable what what is not, and routinely check sources for reliability. Well, these are just some of the considerations at Wikipedia:Requests for adminship.

So, please consider taking a look at and watchlisting this page:

• Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Optional RfA candidate poll

You could be very helpful in evaluating potential candidates, and maybe even finding out if you would be a suitable RfA candidate.

Many thanks and best wishes,

Anna Frodesiak (talk) 06:00, 13 December 2015 (UTC)

template for Great Seal article?

What would be the appropriate Canadian template for Great Seal of Canada? [2] Qexigator (talk) 19:30, 13 December 2015 (UTC)

New article on historiography of Canada

I have started a new article on the Historiography of Canada. The goal is to bring together in one place the kinds of approaches historians have been using over the last 150 years. Contributions, commentary and editing is most welcome. Rjensen (talk) 06:18, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Pre-1949 Newfoundland

The 1921 Census of Newfoundland article is in Category:National censuses, rather than in Category:Censuses in Canada; I assume that this is because Newfoundland was a separate dominion. Is this the normal way to categorise Newfoundland-wide articles before 1949, or would it better be put in the Canadian category? The article having been last edited in 2013, with nothing at talk since 2011, I don't suppose that I'd get much input if I raised the issue there. Nyttend (talk) 21:05, 20 December 2015 (UTC)

RfC pointer

You are invited to comment at Wikipedia_talk:Manual_of_Style/Canada-related_articles#Redundancy_model. Nikkimaria (talk) 13:01, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Should significant fracking-related earthquakes be included at List of earthquakes in Canada?

See discussion at Talk:List of earthquakes in Canada#Inclusion of significant frack-related quakes? Hwy43 (talk) 11:25, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Down East

is Down (East Canada) different from Maine? Move discussion in process. In ictu oculi (talk) 11:34, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

"Okanagan"

The usage and topic of Okanagan is under discussion, see talk:okanogan -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 05:05, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

help needed on ambiguous links in wp:Canada articles

Hi, there's a number of articles in WikiProject Canada that have an ambiguous link needing to be fixed, including Beresford,_New_Brunswick, Indo-Canadians_in_Greater_Vancouver, List_of_Migratory_Bird_Sanctuaries_of_Canada, and The Tenors. Long-term regulars at the wp:DPL project, and me too now, are fighting towards elimination of all-but-brand-new ambiguous links in Wikipedia within a year now, and could use your help!

I used the cool wp:catscan3 tool today to identify what turns out to be 255 wp:Canada articles having outgoing dablinks, and hooked up its output to repeatedly apply editor dispenser's equally cool DabSolver tool to yield the following list, all teed up for you to click and fix, if you're familiar with the article's topic and/or the specific term that links to a disambiguation page.

CatScan is a powerful tool to find articles meeting simple or complex criteria. DabSolver's tool reviews any page to find ambiguous terms and help you fix them. Usually you would cut-and-paste in an the article name into DabSolver, and you only have to pick which target the term should be linked to, from a drop down menu, as long as the intended target is given as an option on the disambiguation page. Here I have set it up so you can just select the article you'd like to review, and DabSolver will be applied to it. DabSolver usually works. It just can't detect sometimes when the ambiguous term is hidden inside a template call. Clear the ambiguous link by finding the more precise link intended (usually an existing article, but sometimes it's appropriate for the term to be a redlink where an article is needed), or by unlinking the term. It's even more of a contribution, if you see there's a gap at the disambiguation page and you can add a bluelink or a proper red-link (a redlink needs a supporting bluelink, see DAB page guideline MOS:DABRL). wp:The Daily Disambig shows the overall project's progress. It would be great to see the Canada articles get struck off wp:DPL's big working list! TIA for any help. :) sincerely, --doncram 03:53, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

clearing Canada's dablinks

List of 255 below per 17 August running of this CatScan query on Canada's dablinks (to run it again, hit "Do it" at bottom; scroll down to see results below the query)

Someone has been busy...the number actually remaining is down to 234, per re-run of that query, though relatively few of those have been marked as cleared, below. So sometimes if you click on one of the 255 listed below, the reason will be that DabSolver can't find the ambiguous link hidden in a template call, but now more often it will be because the ambiguous link has already been cleared. --doncram 13:16, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

I'd like to note that I've also come across a few cases in this list where a {{dn}} template was, for no apparent reason, still sitting as an unnecessary leftover on a link that had already been corrected months or years ago. So that's also something I would recommend checking for if you hit a link where DabSolver says there's nothing — check the article to see if there's still a ghost tag sitting on a term that's already correctly disambiguated or entirely unlinked. Bearcat (talk) 16:57, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! Total is now 204. --doncram 14:41, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

Suggestion: Avoid any wasted time by setting up two windows side by side or overlapping. I.e., open a 2nd window on your screen with this same URL, and then run the CatScan query in that. Scroll down in that so its current results, a list of the articles which still need fixing, are showing (in a column on the left side of the window). Returning to this window, select an article to fix only if you can also see it in the current CatScan results. I'm not going to bother striking out any more here. I fixed a few but others must be proceeding along too: total is now 194. --doncram 00:21, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Count is now 155. --doncram 01:21, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

List of 255 items in a scrolling box (replaced by list of 132, below.)
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
(cs-1) 1966_Canadian_National_Challenge_Cup (cs-2) 91st_Grey_Cup (cs-3) Ainsworth,_British_Columbia (cs-4) Alberton,_Prince_Edward_Island (cs-5) Alert_Records (cs-6) Allen_Kaeja (cs-7) Amherst_Ramblers (cs-8) André_Éric_Létourneau (cleared by removing disambiguation-needed tag, because performance art has become a valid link target) (cs-9) Aron_Tager (cs-10) Arthur_Skaling (cs-11) Barrie_Colts (two ambiguous links: one should go to Michael Hutchinson (ice hockey)?) (cs-12) Beresford,_New_Brunswick (cs-13) Big_Bear (cs-14) Bob_Brown_(baseball_player,_born_1876) (cs-15) Bob_Wiseman (cs-16) Boompa_Records (cs-17) Brockville,_Westport_and_North-Western_Railway (cs-18) Broken_Social_Scene (cs-19) Buddies_in_Bad_Times (cs-20) CBPO-FM (cs-21) CFB_Halifax (cs-22) Camp_Manitou (cs-23) Camps_of_Scouts_Canada (cs-24) Canada's_Worst_Driver_2 (cs-25) Canada_Prep_Academy (cs-26) Canadian_Business_Hall_of_Fame (cs-27) Canadian_National_Road_Race_Championships (cs-28) Cape_Shore (cs-29) Charles-Paul_Marin_de_la_Malgue (cs-30) Charles_G._Hawkins (cs-31) Charles_Keefer (cs-32) Charles_de_Lint (cs-33) Chester_Stairs_Duffus (cs-34) Chipoudy (cs-35) Chris_Tarry (cs-36) Codex_canadensis (cs-37) Crosby_Heights_Public_School (Cleared by assuming skipping sport is Skipping rope, by far the most likely meaning, though "citation needed" tag added to question whether this is really a continuing, inter-school competitive sport) (cs-38) Cub_(band) (cs-39) Cuper's_Cove (cs-40) Cuppa_Coffee_Studio (cs-41) D._O._(rapper) (cs-42) Daisy_Lake_(Nipissing_District) (cs-43) Daniel_DeShaime (cs-44) Daniela_Bobadilla (cs-45) Dave_Babych (cs-46) Davie_Fulton (cs-47) Devil's_Island_(Lake_Temagami) (cs-48) Diane_Stratas (cs-49) Dominique_Blais (cs-50) Doug_Collins_(journalist) (cs-51) Doug_Parker_(voice_actor) (cs-52) Drew_Neilson (cs-53) Dugald_Donaghy (cs-54) Duncan_Selby_Hutcheon (cs-55) Earls_Cove,_British_Columbia (cs-56) East_Garafraxa (cs-57) Eastwood_Collegiate_Institute (cs-58) Efrim_Menuck (cs-59) Emerson,_Manitoba (cs-60) Evolve_Festival (cs-61) Fred_Whitman (cs-62) Frederick_Widder (cs-63) Fury_Stakes (cs-64) Gary_Bannerman (cs-65) Grand_Desert,_Nova_Scotia (cs-66) Grant_Connell (cs-67) Green_Party_of_Ontario_candidates,_1995_Ontario_provincial_election (cs-68) Greenpeace (cs-69) Halcyon_Hot_Springs,_British_Columbia (cs-70) Haliburton_County (cs-71) Havelock_Country_Jamboree (cs-72) History_of_Richmond_Hill,_Ontario (cs-73) Hochelaga_(village) (cs-74) Hopewell_Parish,_New_Brunswick (cs-75) Humber—St._Barbe—Baie_Verte (cs-76) II_Canadian_Corps (cs-77) Ian_Bell_(musician) (cs-78) Independent_Task_Force_on_North_America (cs-79) Indo-Canadians_in_Greater_Vancouver (cs-80) Ingénue_(album) (cs-81) Investment_Canada (cs-82) James_McGill (cs-83) Jamie_Graham (cs-84) Jane_Urquhart (cs-85) Jason_Marshall_(rugby_union) (cs-86) Jean-Marie-Rodrigue_Villeneuve (cs-87) Jeff_Tedford (cs-88) John_Davis_Barnett (cs-89) John_Drainie_Award (cs-90) John_Elvin_Shaffner (cs-91) John_F._Ross_Collegiate_Vocational_Institute (cs-92) John_Palliser (cs-93) John_Stocker_(voice_actor) (cs-94) Jon_Kimura_Parker (cs-95) Joseph_Heath (cs-96) Junkhouse (cs-97) Juno_Awards_of_1985 (cs-98) Juno_Awards_of_1996 (cs-99) Juno_Awards_of_2000 (cs-100) Juno_Awards_of_2003 (cs-101) Juno_Awards_of_2009 (cs-102) Just_Kidding_(TV_series) (cs-103) Kawartha_Lakes_(Ontario) (cs-104) Kelowna (cs-105) Kevin_James_Maher (cs-106) Kim_Stockwood (cs-107) Kimball,_Alberta (cs-108) Ku_Klux_Klan_in_Canada (cs-109) Kwantlen_Polytechnic_University (cs-110) La_Baie,_Quebec (cs-111) Lachine_Canal (cs-112) Ladner,_British_Columbia (cs-113) Lake_Temagami (cs-114) Lawlor_Island (cs-115) Leah_Daniels (cs-116) Leo_Scherman (cs-117) Leonid_Skirko (cs-118) Les_Usherwood (cs-119) Lethbridge_(provincial_electoral_district) (cs-120) Liard_River (cs-121) Lighthouse_Route (cs-122) List_of_Canadian_Broadcasting_Corporation_personalities (cs-123) List_of_Hudson's_Bay_Company_trading_posts (cs-124) List_of_L_postal_codes_of_Canada (cs-125) List_of_Migratory_Bird_Sanctuaries_of_Canada (cs-126) List_of_Nova_Scotia_provincial_highways (cs-127) List_of_University_of_Western_Ontario_people (cs-128) List_of_communities_in_Lunenburg_County,_Nova_Scotia (cs-129) List_of_filming_locations_in_the_Vancouver_area (cs-130) List_of_historic_places_in_Halifax,_Nova_Scotia (cs-131) List_of_programs_broadcast_by_Joytv (cs-132) List_of_rivers_of_Ontario (cs-133) List_of_sister_cities_in_Canada (cs-134) List_of_ski_areas_and_resorts_in_Canada (cs-135) Malcolm_Tomlinson (cs-136) Manitoba_Theatre_Centre_production_history (cs-137) Marcel_Lussier (cs-138) Margaret_Avison (cs-139) Marianna_Schmidt (cs-140) Mark_Maryanovich (cs-141) Markham_Fair (cs-142) Marshall_McLuhan (cs-143) Marty_Dolin (cs-144) Massey_College,_Toronto (cs-145) Matt_Hern (cs-146) Matt_Zbyszewski (cs-147) Max_Graham (cs-148) Menu_Foods (cs-149) Merritt_Mountain_Music_Festival (cs-150) Michael_Lubbock (cs-151) Mike_Grandmaison (cs-152) Murdoch_MacKay_Collegiate (cs-153) Murray_Favro (cs-154) Music_of_Alberta (cs-155) Music_of_Nova_Scotia (cs-156) Nakusp_Music_Fest (cs-157) National_Film_Board_of_Canada (cs-158) Native_trees_in_Toronto (cs-159) Neil_Diamond_(filmmaker) (cs-160) Nels_Nelsen (cs-161) New_Canadian_Library (cs-162) Nick_Holder (cs-163) Nimpo_Lake (cs-164) North_West_River (cs-165) Nova_Central_School_District (cs-166) Nova_Scotia_Highway_103 (cs-167) OCAD_University (cs-168) Ontario_Arts_Council (cs-169) Ontario_Provincial_Police (cs-170) Oscar_Peterson_at_the_Stratford_Shakespearean_Festival (cs-171) Patrick_J._Whelan (cs-172) Paul-Émile_d'Entremont (cs-173) Pemberton,_British_Columbia (cs-174) Perth,_Ontario (cs-175) Peter_Donaldson_(actor) (cs-176) Peter_Kelamis (cs-177) Pierre_Arcand (cs-178) Pierre_Lapointe (cs-179) Pierre_du_Calvet (cs-180) Pique_Newsmagazine (cs-181) Pitt_Meadows (cs-182) Pomquet (cs-183) Prince_Albert_Radar_Laboratory (cs-184) Prospero_(band) (cs-185) Province_of_Quebec_(1763–91) (cs-186) Purple_Playhouse (cs-187) Random—Burin—St._George's (cs-188) Real_Estate_Channel (cs-189) Red_River_Colony (cs-190) Red_River_of_the_North (cs-191) Rene_Ohashi (cs-192) Rideau_Valley (cs-193) Rita_Wong (cs-194) Ritchie_Bros._Auctioneers (cs-195) Robert_Boston_(politician) (cs-196) Robert_Cohen_(writer) (cs-197) Roberta_Maxwell (cs-198) Rocco_Rossi (cs-199) Rod_Connop (cs-200) Ronn_Metcalfe (cs-201) Ross_Petty (cs-202) Royal_Canadian_Mint_numismatic_coins_(2000s) (cs-203) Rupert_Gayle (cs-204) Rémi-Séraphin_Bourdages (cs-205) SOLOS:_The_Jazz_Sessions (cs-206) Salishan_languages (cs-207) Sauder_School_of_Business (cs-208) Sea_to_Sea:_I_See_the_Cross (cs-209) Separation_Party_of_Alberta (cs-210) ShawCor (cs-211) Shawnigan_Lake_School (cs-212) Shaye (cs-213) Shefford_(electoral_district) (cs-214) Shelburne,_Nova_Scotia_(municipal_district) (cs-215) Similkameen_Falls (cs-216) Simon_Fraser_Student_Society (cs-217) Sir_Alexander_Mackenzie_Canada_Sea-to-Sea_Bicentennial_Expeditions (cs-218) Sir_George_Williams_affair (cs-219) Socialist_Party_of_British_Columbia (cs-220) Solicitor_General_of_Ontario (cs-221) Spuzzum_First_Nation (cs-222) Squamish_Valley_Music_Festival (cs-223) Stephen_Leopold (cs-224) Stirling_School (cs-225) Stratford,_Ontario (changed railroad to railway) (cs-226) Stratford_Shakespeare_Festival (cs-227) Sudbury_municipal_election,_1928 (cs-228) Sunwing_Airlines (cs-229) Tara_MacLean (cs-230) Technological_and_industrial_history_of_20th-century_Canada (cs-231) The_Fisheries_Broadcast (cs-232) The_French_Counts_of_St_Hubert,_Saskatchewan (cs-233) The_Future_(Leonard_Cohen_album) (cs-234) The_Globe_and_Mail (cs-235) The_Path_to_9/11 (cs-236) The_Platinum_Collection_(Shania_Twain_video_album) - left a redlink for Timothy White (director) (cs-237) The_Queen's_Own_Rifles_of_Canada (cs-238) The_Sketchersons (cs-239) The_Tenors (cs-240) Thomas_William_Taylor (cs-241) Thomson_Corporation (cs-242) Toronto_Jr._Canadiens (cs-243) Toronto_Sound (cs-244) Tsimshian (cs-245) Two_Shots (cs-246) University_of_King's_College (cs-247) Upper_Canada_Rebellion (cs-248) Victoria,_British_Columbia (cs-249) Virginie (cs-250) Vlasta_Vrána (cs-251) West_Carleton_Secondary_School (cs-252) William_Moore_(steamship_captain) (cs-253) Wine_Harbour,_Nova_Scotia (cs-254) Woolford,_Alberta (cs-255) Yin_Yang_Yo!

New, nicer list of the 132 remaining is here: wp:Canada/CanadaArticlesNeedingDisambiguation2015. --doncram 01:10, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Running the CatScan query on Canada's dablinks again, there are now 111 remaining. I fixed only a few in the latest decrease of 21. --doncram 22:48, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

99 remaining. "nicer list of 132" is where you go to pick a page to disambiguate, and is working well. 3/4 chance the first one you click will need disambiguating. Thank you to User:PKT for keeping going with disambiguating. I've noticed that many of these are not super-easy to disambiguate. For example to clear Nova Central School District the drop-down menu did not offer the correct choice. It required creating a proper redlink Phoenix Academy (Newfoundland) and posting it properly (with a supporting bluelink per MOS:DABRL) at the Phoenix Academy disambiguation page. Which is progress, why should only U.S.-related "Phoenix" academies be listed, in this page which comes high in Google search display. --doncram 18:09, 20 September 2015 (UTC)

Others may be easy for full-blooded Canadian editors. E.g. for Robert Boston (politician), born in 1836 in ambiguous Melrose, Ontario, I make the educated guess it should be Melrose, Middlesex County, Ontario not Melrose, Hastings County, Ontario, because his article says he represented Middlesex South riding in 1893 in House of Commons. I had to look up where all of those were in many Google maps windows. Questions:

• Q: At Prospero (band), should Veela, singer for Prospero (band) who came from B.C. deserve the same redlink fixup treatment or should she just be delinked (judged not worthy of a Wikipedia article)?
• Q: At Ronn Metcalf, does Niagara big band venue The Castle (active in '50s or '60s, vestige sign at top here) deserve or delinK?
• Q: At Shawnigan Lake School, does CBC programme presenter Bob Kerr deserve or delink? (Google "Bob Kerr CBC" gets hits.)

--doncram 16:38, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

I changed this to Bob Kerr (radio broadcaster) so it's no longer a dab, but it's now a redlink. Mr. Kerr might be deserving of an article. PKT(alk) 16:46, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

Yeah it looks like he is. Especially when i find my way to Category:Classical music radio presenters and to AustralianBC's nav-list of red- and blue-linked presenters in template:ABC Classic FM. To finish on Bob Kerr, then the redlink needs to be added to the dab, with a supporting bluelink. And since describing his importance as being an alumni of his high school would be lame, i found my way to List of Canadian Broadcasting Corporation personalities and added him there, then could add his redlink to dab page properly. That is a fair amount of work to clear one dablink; it's better in this case IMHO but obviously harder than just delinking. Thanks PKT for considering it and making the redlink. The other two can be unlinked i suppose.

Aside: Expanding Template:CBC Radio to list presenters, copying ABC, would be good to do. That makes a worklist in effect, towards building coverage in this area. The "list of CBC personalities" is not friendly, and does not serve that kind of function. --doncram 00:29, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

Dynamic list

For a dynamic hourly updated list see: http://toolserver.org/~dispenser/cgi-bin/topic_points.py?banner=WikiProject_Canada — Dispenser 13:46, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

This list can take a little while to load, but it's much better for picking out issues to fix. Thanks! PKT(alk) 15:09, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Bump. The tool/list is showing 249 links today, down from over 500 when the link was first posted. PKT(alk) 03:18, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

The tool/list is not working for me right now, but I find just 77 dablinks to fix now, when I ran the catscan query (without autorun). It took 245 seconds to finish, after I hit "Do it". A few of them are:

Canadian Forestry Association	42911527	(Article)	938	20160213163317
Canadian National Road Race Championships	32234272	(Article)	10885	20160220153426
Canadian Party of Labour	1078657	(Article)	1834	20160223222707
Canadian Rangers	2858114	(Article)	18915	20160314233017
Caribou River (Thunder Bay District)	44691329	(Article)	3696	20160220153426
Carla Rice	40919626	(Article)	9426	20160220153426
Covenant Awards

Again, the query output gives clickable links to the articles, but doesn't run DabSolver (so cut & paste to DabSolver, is what I recall is how to proceed). --doncram 17:47, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

"43rd Canadian federal election"

The name of the article is under discussion, see Talk:43rd Canadian federal election and Talk:Opinion polling in the 43rd Canadian federal election -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 11:02, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Edit war at Canadian dollar

Hi all. There's been an edit war at Canadian dollar, which spawned a discussion on the talk page. The two involved editors are currently blocked for a few days. Eyes and/or opinions welcome; I'll probably wade into it before the user blocks expire. Mindmatrix 16:05, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

Val-Jalbert

There's an editor (or group of editors) at Val-Jalbert that modifies one POV text (which I've improved slightly) to another POV text in which implications or outright claims are made that opponents of a project are drug users and vandals. Can some of you add it to your watchlist? Mindmatrix 14:49, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Aside: the section about the dam project needs some work and sourcing; I've done a little bit, but it's clearly insufficient. Anyone have familiarity with this project? Mindmatrix 14:51, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

I read about it in the news, but I'll add some material and clean up the messy hydro dam section. When you have a problem like this one, please check with people over at fr:Discussion Projet:Québec. We usually do not follow closely what's going on over here, but some of us also contribute a bit on the English side. Bouchecl (talk) 22:22, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Do you guys over at fr.wiki follow WP:Quebec/WP:QWNB ? -- 70.51.44.60 (talk) 05:58, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Bouchecl. Mindmatrix 16:07, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

Murdoch Mysteries

Input requested at Talk:Murdoch Mysteries, regarding whether the "guest stars" list in the article is getting WP:INDISCRIMINATE, and warrants pruning back to only those personalities whose appearances can be reliably sourced as notable. Thanks. Bearcat (talk) 21:44, 17 January 2016 (UTC)

Esoteric Technical Issue

Several articles about Canadian communities have a "Cite error: Invalid <ref> tag; name "cp2011" defined multiple times with different content". Orillia is an example - the error shows up in the References section for footnote #1. I have been unable to fix these errors. In every case I have looked at, refname "cp2011" is defined in the infobox related to population, but it's not defined elsewhere. I think there's something in the Template:Canada census, which is used to show census highlights from 2011, 2006 and 2001, that is causing this error message, but I don't see anything in the template that defines the refname "cp2011".

Can an editor who understands template coding have a look into this? It will fix error messages on several (many?) pages related to Canadian communities. Thanks in advance! PKT(alk) 01:10, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, I've noticed this error as well. It definitely relates somehow to the Canada census template, because that's where the competing reference tag is located if you try to solve the error by checking where the implicated footnotes are in an article — but I wasn't able to find that tag being defined anywhere in the template either. In reality, templates shouldn't be artificially transcluding references into their articles anyway — in a case like this, for example, the exact same reference is usually already in the article anyway, meaning that the transcluded reference causes this problem because we're using the same name in both places. But if we try to solve it by just renaming the tags in one place or the other to get them out of each other's way, then the article now features unnecessary duplication of the same reference as two different footnotes instead of one. So there's really just no way to make the template-transcluded reference useful without causing problems in the articles. Bearcat (talk) 20:45, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Okay, I've found the problem, and it's actually even uglier than advertised: there's a second template, {{Canada census/reference}}, which is transcluded into {{Canada census}} to create the references that are then transcluded into the articles via the latter template. For the time being, I've changed the coding of that template so that it creates references named cp2year instead of cpyear, to get the transcluded references out of the way of the direct ones — however, changes to templates aren't instantaneously propagated through to all transclusions of that template, so it may take a few hours before the change actually pushes through to all of the affected articles. (I did null-edit one affected article just to check whether the change had worked or not, and it did — but I am not going to sit here for the next six hours nulling the entire list of articles just to force it through faster.) However, because that still leaves the issue of most articles now containing two different footnotes to the same page, we should still discuss totally dropping the transclusion of any references through the template. Bearcat (talk) 20:53, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Or the other alternative, if it's important that the information in the template be directly footnoted, would be to take the defining reference tag (the <ref name=cp2011>Complete URL of the census profile</ref> one) out of each article, so that the template itself defines the reference tag and each individual article only contains callback <ref name=cp2011/> tags to it. Bearcat (talk) 21:13, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Provincial/Territorial symbols

The infobox for provinces and territories of Canada only lists the provincial/territorial flower, tree and bird. Most provinces/territories also have a provincial/territorial animal, mineral, and many have a provincial/territorial fish. Some provinces/territories also grass, soil, and fossil as their symbols. I think that if not all of the symbols, at least the animal, mineral, and fish should be added to the infobox.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Beejsterb (talk • contribs) 21:25, 22 January 2016

I'm not sure. I think that it would be better to remove all of them rather than making the infobox larger. The symbols could have a section in the body of the article. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 16:47, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

I agree with CambridgeBayWeather on this. There shouldn't be more clutter in infoboxes; it makes more sense to me to list provincial/territorial symbols in a section of the respective articles. PKT(alk) 18:05, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

I agree too. Good idea. Ground Zero | t 21:28, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Vita Tornado

The tornado happened on a Sunday afternoon as a baseball tournament was in progress. The funnel swept in from the states. It was June 19, 1955 & I was 10 years old. My parents owned the Old Bill's Inn Restaurant [Bill & Annie Shmigelsky]. Our restaurant was packed with people as many came in for shelter......some joked, some prayed & some cried as my oldest brother Bob & his teammates were stuffing pillows into broken windows. The north side of the tracks absorbed the most damage. The restaurant location was where todays Motor Inn is. The rest. was destroyed by fire a year later & my parents rebuilt and became The Shady Lawn Licensed Rest. & Motel [4 units]...After it was sold in 1968-9, it again was destroyed by fire. References on the tornado are in the Carillon News...Steinbach & also in the 1998 Shewchenko School Reflections [reunion] program with many pictures of the destruction. The school children we were extremely lucky it happened on a Sunday. Thank you Martin Shmigelsky — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.66.168.245 (talk) 04:36, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

Please note that this page is not a venue for posting personal reflections or memoirs — it's a venue for discussion about Wikipedia content which requires the attention of one or more editors for some reason, not a forum to just post any random thing you want to talk about. Bearcat (talk) 22:09, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

To be fair, he may have been looking for the requests page, and provided some information for an interested reader to find sources. I do agree that it could have been done with less anecdote, though. Mindmatrix 14:19, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

Canadian royal succession

We need input at Monarchy of Canada, as to how to present the Canadian royal succession. GoodDay (talk) 20:31, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

Canadian railway station naming

Please see Talk:Hinton, Alberta, railway station for a discussion on the naming conventions for Canadian railway station articles. RGloucester — ☎ 21:44, 23 February 2016 (UTC)

Request for input: Jim Prentice

Hi there. I've been working a bit on this article, trying to fix it up (and hopefully get rid of the pesky template at the top). I've done a bit and it's looking a bit better to me, but I wouldn't mind having some other eyes go over it and see if there are any glaring issues - especially with referencing. Thanks! Ajraddatz (Talk) 06:03, 25 February 2016 (UTC)

Cat meat in Canada

Please weigh in at Talk:Cat meat#Legality in Canada section. Thank you. (A bit urgent.) Anna Frodesiak (talk) 13:56, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

"Alexander Mackenzie"

The primary topic of Alexander Mackenzie is under discussion, see talk:Alexander Mackenzie (disambiguation) -- 70.51.46.39 (talk) 07:01, 5 March 2016 (UTC)

Canada in the American Civil War

Canada in the American Civil War has been proposed to be renamed, see talk:Canada in the American Civil War -- 70.51.46.39 (talk) 07:36, 5 March 2016 (UTC)

New article on Special Olympics pioneer Frank Hayden

I have just started an article on Special Olympics pioneer Frank Hayden. I would welcome any help in improving the article, in particular from editors familiar with biography articles. --papageno (talk) 18:23, 8 March 2016 (UTC)

Downtown Markham, Ontario

I've been cleaning up this article a bit, but it's still a mess. Apart from the poor writing and promotional tone, it appears that this is mostly original research. The city refers to the area as "Markham Centre", to which I've linked in the article. Many edits to this article are by editors who have edited nothing but this article (eg: 99.247.70.112, Packers35, Bungalow8). To me, this appears to be a marketing term by Remington Group (the developers of the project); the website about the location is operated by Remington. Other online mentions (such as at Urban Toronto) are clearly promotional fluff pieces. My inclination is to move this to "Markham Center", or merge it to Unionville, Ontario, Markham, Ontario and/or other articles, but I thought I'd solicit some ideas first. So...ideas? Mindmatrix 03:27, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

I definitely support a move to "Markham Centre", as the City of Markham calls the area. I also think that an article should exist for the area, given that there are articles for all sorts of areas/neighbourhoods of Markham. PKT(alk) 23:47, 11 March 2016 (UTC)