User talk:HJ Mitchell/Archive 11

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Irony

So I decided to join the copyediting backlog drive next month, because I happened to be on your talk page when the invitation was posted there. Needless to say, I can't afford to lose a week of productive time until at least August.  ;) --~TPW 19:48, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Ha! You go for it, I just don't like unsolicited intrusive automated messages on my talk page, it's busy enough as it is! I'm sure it will only get busier later since I just deleted nearly 100 expired PRODs! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:52, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Hey, I'm more than happy to read unsolicited intrusive automated messages on your page. That's what WP:TPW is all about . . . --~TPW 19:53, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Maybe I should set up a subpage for thankspam and similar unsolicited stuff. I thought, TPW (had to get that ins somewhere ;)), that TPW was about chiming in with useful advice when the "owner" of the talk page is unavailable. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 20:06, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

You mean you want me to work while I'm here? Isn't this supposed to be fun?--~TPW 22:16, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

You should be humbled that I have allowed you the honour of stalking my talk page. The least you could do is make yourself useful while you're here! ;) The preceding comment was made by HJ Mitchell at 22:22, 11 June 2010. The fact that he did not type four tildes ~~~~ should not in any way be held against him.

Was that helpful?--~TPW 01:36, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Bugger off, you! ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:38, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I know, I should quit my day job and apply to be Sinebot's understudy. I hear it's looking for vacation time.  ;)--~TPW 01:50, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Thank spam!

Hello, HJ Mitchell. You have new messages at User:TFOWR/Thankspam.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

And thanks for (a) thinking I'd be responsible enough, and (b) nominating me! I promise to do my best to live up to the trust you've placed in me. Best wishes, TFOWR 20:32, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Sumbuddi's edits on 'Nicola Blackwood'

As soon as your protection period expired, Sumbuddi went right back to his old tricks. he is now on the 13th revision of the exact same text: no matter how many compromises I put forward or different changes I make, he always reverts back to his same text. Not only is he in violation of the 3RR rule, but he has already ben warned to stop reverting, and he kept doing so. he will not even discuss anything on the discusion page, he wont propose anything, he wont aknowledge discussion or compromise, he just reverts, reverts, reverts, to the same POV post every time. Please help. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.49.241.171 (talk) 20:39, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Of note I have bought this up on WP:RFPP. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 20:40, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Rollback

I'm curious about your decision to grant rollback to an inexperienced user, Lurkmolsner (talk · contribs)-- you might want to keep an eye on that? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 23:09, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Inexperienced, yes, but well meaning and off to a good start. As you can see, I left them an informative note about "the rules", albeit in template form and I will keep an eye on them, but at the end of the day, it's only one button and there's not a lot of damage that can be done with it, so I'm usually inclined to AGF unless a check of their contributions shows something concerning (such as a disposition to edit warring). Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 23:16, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

You might want to look at the FAC I just closed, and the responses that editor made there ... could be a concern, maybe not, just a heads up. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 23:58, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. That's... interesting, shall we say, but not something, on its own, to make me think he doesn't know the difference between vandalism and a good faith edit and it's very easily revoked if it's misused. Btw, completely off-topic, but I could have sworn you were an admin! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:37, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh I can hear the gears turning now . . . --~TPW 01:38, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Yoshinori Watanabe

Hi there; may I say first of all that I am perfectly happy to see the article gone. As I have said in various threads, i felt that WP:AfD was more appropriate, but clearly opinions differ. You may not have noticed that there were references included in earlier versions of the page, and of course a Google search confirms the accuracy of the article absolutely. Hence my approach to it, but good riddance anyway. --Anthony.bradbury^"talk" 23:12, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Well if I have to invoke IAR to get rid of it, it's not the kind of thing we need hanging around. From what I read (I did my homework before zapping it) there were sources in an earlier version but they didn't or no longer do verify the information. If someone wants to add unquestionably reliable sources to it that unquestionably verify the information, I might consider restoring it. Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 23:20, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Marko Dapcevich

Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Marko Dapcevich. One vote - a "Speedy Keep" - brought this AfD to an early closure. I don't want to litter the current AfD with this now that I think about it. ----moreno oso (talk) 03:09, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Looks like that one was withdrawn by the nominator, but generally WP:Speedy keep only applies in fairly limited circumstances. People often !vote "speed keep", but 9 times out of 10 have no idea what speedy keep means or are confusing it with the snowball clause. One of the many, many (cough) delightful (cough, cough) facts admins need to know! ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 03:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

(Dog gone, there's that kitty again.) I have participated in many AfD's. I'd like to think I've been the swing vote on many. I do know what Speedy Keep means. If other editors follow the WP:PERPETRATOR link and my direct quote thereof, they should all vote Keep. And, with the second Strong Keep just in, I would expect more Keeps ala it's going to be snowing soon. ----moreno oso (talk) 03:21, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if it ended within a few hours with a non-admin SNOW closure. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 03:27, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I wonder if I wore dark glasses - would the kitty still scare me? Ooh, ooh! I've never closed an AfD. That would be novel! How many votes or hours do you envision it going? ----moreno oso (talk) 03:30, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

And, how would someone close it? ----moreno oso (talk) 03:31, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, since you'e opined, it's probably not a good idea to close it, but, hypothetically... Edit the entire page and put {{subst:afdtop}} keep per WP:SNOW (or whatever the result and rationale is) at the very top (above the section heading). Then put {{subst:afdbottom}} to (where else!) the bottom. Then remove the tag from the article, tag the talk page with the template inside the hidden comment of the AfD tag and you've closed the AfD. Or, if you want the lazy way to do it, copy the last line of code from user:HJ Mitchell/monobook.js into your monobook or vector.js! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 03:50, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Rats! I opined. Listen on another note, Sack tapping is on the frontpage as a DYK factoid. It is getting major league hits. And while I did improve the article, I will admit that I am not WP:OWN about this. However, as part of the DYK process several admins went over the article and one placed a copyedit tag on it. Then a copyeditor went over the article and it is at its present state - minus a public domain image that another editor didn't like. Could you take a look at how it getting edited tonight? ----moreno oso (talk) 03:57, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

So keep an eye on WP:OLD and close the odd blatantly obvious "keep" if you want to get into AfD closing. What on Earth is "sack tapping" doing on WP, never mind the Main bloody Page! And what is t with the tagging and general messing up that these supposedly experienced editors are doing? I'd help keep an eye on it, but it's way past my bed time! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 04:06, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the assist and I'll keep my eye on the OLD. As for Sack tapping, there is some heated debate on how intense bullying is these days. I put a comment on its talkpage stating that today's children face bullying on a scale most parents or older people cannot comprehend. Yes, we had lots of similar dumb games but with YouTube and cam phones, the stuff goes viral and you have a notable case where like in Minnesota a kid is minus one scrotum. If you look at the girl, who committed suicide because one mom invaded her Facebook page with comments that pushed her over the edge, you begin to appreciate what kids are up against. ----moreno oso (talk) 04:14, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Huggle Help

You have granted me Rollback rights.Thank you very much for that.Now I've downloaded Huggle.But, when I try to log in.It says "Huggle is not enabled for your account."Please reply and me with that.$Max Viwe$ (talk) 10:34, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

• Read the first line of this page- namely, "Note: If you have not used Huggle before, add the text enable:true to before downloading." Courcelles (talk) 10:36, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

• Hey, Thanks.$Max Viwe$ (talk) 10:42, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

• No problem, you know what they say... "When all else fails, read the directions!". Courcelles (talk) 10:44, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Arkansas floods

I know this is what WP:ERRORS is for, but it's "severe" not "sever" ~DC _{Let's Vent} 15:46, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I already fixed it! My keyboard's playing up today! Thanks for the note, though! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 15:47, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

About the deletion of Schools and colleges in Surat

• Please take a look at the article.It look like it has been written to advertise each schools.It should be considered to be deleted.$Max Viwe$ (talk) 16:54, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I deleted it under CSD G11. It was borderline, but it was pretty crappy article and nobody seems to have put any work into it to make it less spammy since it was created. In future, you can use the template {{db-spam}} to request deletion, which adds it to a queue for some poor admin (usually me!) to clean out! Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 16:59, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

• Thank you very much.$Max Viwe$ (talk) 17:13, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Semi-Protection on Ukrainian Articles

Thanks for semi-protection for Kharkiv and Dnipropetrovsk. Please can you do the same for Lviv‎ and Kiev. The same tiresome users who hide behind not-logged in status to make annoying edits are at it again - 87.210.232.221 and 94.157.184.50.--Toddy1 (talk) 17:27, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

There doesn't seem to be much I can do. The IP editor is certainly making a nuisance of himself, but it doesn't look like vandalism so you;ll just have to try to persuade them to come to talk pages and discuss it. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 17:34, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I would have liked to persuade him to log in.--Toddy1 (talk) 17:37, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, they're not obliged to log in, but if they have an account and they're logging out to avoid getting their account blocked, that's disruptive and both can be blocked, but you'd need good evidence of that to get a checkuser to check. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 17:41, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

World Cup

Good idea. Cheers.--Chaser (talk) 19:06, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! I can't take all the credit, there was a discussion about it on ITN/C a week or two ago and there seemed to be some support for it and "The World Cup begins" isn't any more informative to anyone who hasn't been living in a cave for the last week than just a quick link so I thought I'd be bold and just do it. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:12, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Novice editor ribbon

• I've become novice editor.but, I don't know how to put Novice editor ribbon on top left part of my user page.Please help me.$Max Viwe$ (talk) 19:51, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

You can just copy the templates you want from WP:SVC. The templates for Novice Editor are in this section. You can have a look at the code of my userpage to see where I put mine if you want- sadly I've been having some problems with vandals lately, so you can't edit it. Hope that helps :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 20:26, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

suite life on deck episodes protection

I tried to put this on before the protection but the edit stoped me. I have been watching the page and I really see a problem with the ips's. Some of the edits are mostly good faith edits. Yes some unsoursed has been put on the page. When episodes summarry's are put on the page for the episodes AussieLegend says theuy are incorrect. When I see the episodes on youtube from a commercail the summarys do match what the ip is putting down. I do agree a reference can be helpful but if it a unrealistic summary then go a head and revert. the episode Break up in pairs. The ips, are putting The kids travel to Paris, where Cody and Bailey plan to celebrate the one-year anniversary of their relationship. Meanwhile, Zack and Woody are pursued by art thieves when accidentally they grab the wrong satchel which has a priceless painting. At the end Cody and Bailey break up when things don't go right. When I watched the preview That seemed to flow. Also I did look at other episode summary's on TV guide, MSN and other sites I did find they some what matched. So I don't think this page should be protected and if it gets worse or something then protect it. I don't seen in any harm to what they are adding. Mostly it is good faith.Checker Fred (talk) 22:11, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

The trouble is that the vast majority of the edits do not comply with our policies on verifiability and original research, or style guidelines such as WP:WAF. However, if you disagree with my actions, you're welcome to request review on WP:AN or seek the input of another admin at WP:RFUP. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 22:20, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Query

Do you think short term semi-protection would be appropriate for Hell's Kitchen (U.S. season 7)? I've been noticing that recently, lots of IPs have been messing around with the progress chart, and it's just been sort of a waste of time to revert these. Thanks. Connormah (talk | contribs) 22:19, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

At the minute, no. It seems to be coming in waves (probably related to the time it's airing), so maybe an hour of protection at exactly the right time would help, but it doesn't seem so intense it couldn't be dealt with by various reverting scripts, but I'll keep an eye on it. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:13, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

No problem, thanks for the response. Connormah (talk | contribs) 01:35, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Unblock request of Gonads3

Hello HJ Mitchell. Gonads3 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), whom you have blocked, is requesting to be unblocked. The request for unblock is on hold while waiting for a comment from you. Regards,  Sandstein  07:01, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Jorge Vargas González AfD

Hi, could I take part of this request for deletion?. If I could voted, I would say this:

• Strong Keep Maybe the person isn't notable outside Chile, but he was very notable when he took part of several controversies around the town, Pichilemu, where he was mayor. Additionally, his song 'Heredero de tu Amor' was very popular in 2004 [1] Chile hasn't charts, but the article states it received high play in some Santiago radios. His controversies have received coverage from the most important newspapers in Chile [2] [3] --Diego Grez ^{let's talk} 01:52, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, and cheers. --Diego Grez ^{let's talk} 01:52, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I also think I could help expanding the article after my restrictions are lifted. What do you think? --Diego Grez ^{let's talk} 01:55, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

ARGH! You gave me an edit conflict! On my own damn talk page! I had a look at the history and you've obviously been involved with the article, so I'll copy that over for you. If you need to reply to anything later on, post here and I'll see to it. Btw, can you email me, I want to talk to you. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:58, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. And mailed :) --Diego Grez ^{let's talk} 02:18, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

This may sound weird, but I really want to comeback and edit without restrictions, that are really being a pain. I have even clicked the edit tag, but later I remember that I can't save :-P --Diego Grez ^{let's talk} 17:22, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

'Sack Tapping'

<snigger> Sorry, couldnt help it! I got involved in this too. See them revert you diff, (UnCivil !); me revert diff; and another edit 3 minutes after me diff. You shoulda let me know HJ, I wasn't very busy. I don't mind babysitting articles! --220.101 (talk) ^\Contribs 09:47, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Sorry 220.101.28.25. What did you actually wanted to revert? Did you revert to remove the tags or the content? I was under the impression that you only wanted the tags removed (just as HJ Mitchell did because you copied HJ Mitchell's edit summary). By saving an older version of the article, the old content was also replaced. Thanks, Davtra (talk) 10:18, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

The tags, or the uncivil edit summary more so! (No need to be formal btw, 220.101 or even 220 will do). 220.101.28.25 (talk) ^Contribs 10:51, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

What the hell was that? "Undid disruptive edit by HJ Mitchell". Ouch! I've warned them about personal attacks. If it wasn't notable, it wouldn't be on the Main Page (I should know, I spend most of my time dealing with the Main Page). That said, Davtra's right in that you should have just reverted the tags, not the whole content, but it's easily fixed. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 10:28, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I was trying to get some sleep too, as very little for ≈ 24-30 hours! Then I saw this jolly little article, so I did wot I did, now I'm getting messages that I have to reply to, Boo Hoo! Looks like you didnt get a lot of ZZZs either HJ? 220.101.28.25 (talk) ^Contribs 10:51, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I believe Huey45 has his own rules of what an encyclopedia should be and how it should be written. I believe he edits in good faith. He appears to be a grammarian or linguistics expert. He thinks American English is not a language and will conflict with other American English editors. Best to keep an eye on Huey45. Thanks, Davtra (talk) 11:15, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I just restored this article to one of its versions before all the heavy handed edits took place with the frontpage DYK visits. I probably should have went back a couple of more. Mundial time. The Netherlands versus Denmark is boring and no Shakira yet. Univision shows non-stop action. ----moreno oso (talk) 12:10, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Whenever you have the time

can you take a look at Talk:2010 FIFA World Cup schedule and see if i was in the wrong. I admitted i may have been overzealous in the revert, but the other editors have also absolutely refused to want to discuss the matter which i have repeatedly done. They simply state that editors #1,2,3,4 have said it shouldnt be there and then count that as consensus for removal. i've ceased reverting but still await discussion. i've also said the removal can be found with an agreement that another editor suggested (and suggested one of my own) but they dont want to discuss it anymore, now the conversation went into wikipedia guidelines instead of content.

On the 2010 FIFA World Cup page one of the editors from the previous page (who was alerted through a discussion board that did not fairly represent each view yet came to a conclusion in 6 minutes to remove) removed data without talk on the talk page (where i had already explained my addition for) 2010_FIFA_World_Cup#favourites_section.

Thanks. Lihaas (talk) 16:44, 12 June 2010 (UTC))

• I'll take a look. Unfortunately, such disputes are not uncommon with such topics due to the sheer number of editors whoa re going to be editing that page and it'll probably get more heated over the next 4 weeks as the tournament plays out, so you just need to keep a cool head. I'll have a look now before I go back to dealing with {{editprotected}} requests. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 16:49, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
  • Ouch! There's nothing wrong with being bold, but the consensus seems against your proposals, but someone has some serious ownership issues! Hardly surprising, though. Just keep your chin up and do your best and drop me a line if it turns nasty and I'll tell everyone to calm down! :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 17:06, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Yeh, i acknowledged being overzealous with the reverts, but i did call for discussion with at the time no one did. Cool though, im resorting to discussion on this and other pages (As you know). I'll be waiting for some rational responses too. But to clarify as per WP:Consensus "consensus can't wait forever" if no one wants to discuss it.?(Lihaas (talk) 17:06, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

If nobody wants to discuss it, then just go back to the old fashioned bold, revert, discuss but not bold, revert, revert, revert! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 17:10, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Hosni Mobarak

An inappropriate photo has been uploaded to the infobox for Hosni Mubarak. THis photo features the flag of Israel behind the head of the President of Egypt. An image of MObarak with with the flag of Egypt in the background was removed. This is not a good faith contribution. The uploader named the provocative image in a way which is very plain -- File:Mubarak flag.jpg.

I don't know what to do about this. Your name was on the page protection notice; and that is why I am contacting you. --Tenmei (talk) 02:14, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

The best thing to do is discuss it on the talk page if the reverting continues. The contribution may well be in good faith, so you should get a consensus there. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 16:40, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Re: Stone Temple Pilots (album)

Resolved

 – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 17:07, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi HJ. I started a discussion regarding an article I'm working on at Wikipedia_talk:Good_article_nominations#Will_a_.22dead_link.22_brimming_with_good_faith_hold_back_a_nom_from_reaching_GA.3F in the hopes of getting people's opinions on a wall I hit a week or so ago. As someone who's worked with me closely on the GA process, I value your input, and I need as many honest opinions about what to do with this article before I spend any more time on it. Thank you! – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 05:34, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Actually, nevermind! I removed the section entirely and have a new idea of how to incorporate some of the info. Disregard above message, thanks! – Kerαunoςcopia^◁_galaxies 17:07, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Reviewer - many thanks!

Thanks HJ. Just need to work out what to do with it now...!  ;)

Leaky Caldron 18:44, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

You're quite welcome. As I understand it, it does sweet FA until the devs actually implement whatever euphemism we're using to pretend this isn't flagged revs! ;) WP:REVIEWER has the nitty gritty, though. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 18:47, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Many thanks from me too! Salvio ( ^{Let's talk 'bout it!}) 18:53, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

And from myself as well (plus apologies for the spam). — Gavia immer (talk) 01:53, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

A request

Hi HJ, do you have any interest in closing an unblock discussion as an uninvolved admin? It's this discussion on AN to unblock Peter Damian, and specifically I'm looking for someone to sum up the consensus, so that Peter has a pointer for the future in terms of what's expected of him. I've posted here on AN/I about it. Don't worry, though, if you'd rather not. SlimVirgin ^talkcontribs 18:49, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Hey, I've closed it. My closing statement is a bit long, but it was a long discussion and warranted more than just a "meh, no consensus, let it drop into the archives". If you'd relay those thoughts to Peter, I'd appreciate it and he's welcome to email me via WP if he wants me to clarify anything. Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:18, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

That's excellent, thank you, just what was required. I'll e-mail Peter a link, and pass on that he's welcome to contact you. Thanks for taking the time to read the discussion carefully. I know it was a lot to read, and it's much appreciated. SlimVirgin ^talkcontribs 19:39, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

JD Costello Page

The article on JD Costello has links that does not work, has no 3rd party references, and is written from a first person perspective. Also includes remarks that are directed at individuals that have no bearing on the page or references. I created the page and the information has been added without reference. Can you have it removed or corrected? I have tried but it seems that it keeps being reverted back ldeffinbaugh 18:53, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

What, specifically, do you think needs removing? Have you tried to reference the information? The first approach is to try to improve things through discussion and normal editing. Unless admin intervention is necessary, I'm reluctant to jump in waving my mop around. You might like to ask at WT:PW for help. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:24, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

talkback two

Hello, HJ Mitchell. You have new messages at BarkingFish's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

BarkingFish ^{Talk to me} | ^{My contributions} 20:59, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

IP vandal - 67.87.198.243

Can you please block 67.87.198.243 as vandalism-only? Has returned from a previous block vandalizing the same pages as well as new vandalism by changing dates without references. I have not warned this user because all previous warnings to this IP (formerly editing as 67.87.198.198) have increased the vandalism activity instead of stopping it. Acps110 ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:03, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

They haven;t edited in nearly 12 hours and they haven't received any warnings. I'd like to, but there's no way they'd be blocked if they were reported to AIV, so it would be improper of me to do it this way. Give them a 4im warning and if they start again, they can be blocked. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:06, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! I wasn't sure how to proceed with this VERY tenacious editor. Warning issued. Acps110 ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Well if they keep it up after the warning, report them to AIV (or here if I'm online) and they should be blocked. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:24, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Not necessary now because after I issued the warning, Dreadstar blocked them and semi-protected the page. (I guess Dreadstar had the IP's talk page on their watchlist.) Acps110 ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:27, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Ah well. What we really need is a template that says "you have been blocked from editing for being a pain in the arse"! ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:38, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Reviewer/Archive 1

Hi HJ Mitchell. Hope all is well. I noticed you archived the contents of Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Reviewer to Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Reviewer/Archive 1. While this is definitely much needed, Kingpin runs a bot, KingpinBot, which automatically archives approved/denied requests to Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Archive. Just thought you might like to know. All the best, FASTILY ^(TALK) 03:08, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I didn't know that the bot was working for the reviewer page, but with around 80 requests on the page, they needed to go somewhere. Once things have calmed down, I'll help clean up the mess I've made! Nice to hear from you. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 03:10, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Alright, sounds great - I just wanted to make sure you were aware of the bot!! Cheers, FASTILY ^(TALK) 03:14, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Admins and improper use of tools

I have to admit I am curious to understand why, if a non-admin misuses a tool that is part of the admin package, it's perfectly alright to strip the editor of it, but if an admin misuses the same tool, they should at most be blocked. Why do you think that it's okay for the admin to continue to have access to that tool? If they are using one tool improperly, does that not increase the likelihood of them misusing another tool in the package? Risker (talk) 04:33, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps, but to strip and admin of their ability to block/delete/protect/assign permissions etc over a few bad rollbacks is a bit like cutting a surgeon's hands off because he stole something. We can always ban administrators from using parts of the package if need be (for example, I don't handle speedy deletion except for uncontroversial deletions, spam and attack pages- as I promised in my RfA) and they can be stripped of the whole package if they don't abide by it. Of course, blocking temporarily revokes their ability to use any of the package.

That said, to the best of my knowledge (though, as an arb, you probably know better than I), admins abusing part of their toolset is fairly rare, whereas a non-admin whacking rollback in an edit war seems more common, though perhaps that's just statistics. I actually think we can be a little hasty with removing things like rollback from non-admins, but then it's very easily granted because it's very easily revoked. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 04:47, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Most admins only use part of their toolset, or only use it in certain areas. (For example, I need major hand-holding to edit anything to do with mediawiki, and I wouldn't touch an edit filter for a million dollars.) The vast majority of problematic admins only abuse one or two tools out of the set. And please don't ever think that removing rollback is a minor thing; it is an enormous slap in the face to the editor involved, in some ways even more so than being blocked. There is only one case in which I am aware that an admin has a specific restriction for using specific tools, and that had to be imposed by Arbcom; and to be honest, it isn't working out very well at this point. To use the malapropism created today by User:Ceoil, maybe it is time to "debungle" the admin tools. Risker (talk) 05:37, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I can think of one or two who only got through RfA on a promise of avoiding certain areas like the plague, but perhaps it is time. It could certainly be a good thing if parts of the toolset could be removed without removing the whole lot so that poor use of one doesn't necessarily have to affect others which are being put to good use. Isn't that up there with reconfirmation and mandatory recall for admins in terms of perennial proposals, though? Perhaps it should be brought up again- either with the community or with the devs. I agree with you on the edit filters, but the admin "read only" mode can be helpful. I can deal with mediawiki, but only handling pretty basic {{editprotected}} requests and with detailed instructions. Likewise with the fiddly permanently protected templates. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 05:48, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Rollback

Thanks for processing my Rollback request so quickly - and yes, you've saved me a request with "reviewer" - thanks again.

One question, though, about your edit summary, if I may:

Follow, if you would, this sequence:

• 1 Go to WP:ROLLBACK
• 2 Click the link in "How to apply" that takes you to: Wikipedia:Requests for permissions/Rollback
• 3 Click the "add request" link at the top

This is actually an "add section" link - hence my confused initial section heading when saving the edit "whined" about no heading.
But nowhere on that trip did I see an instruction to add to the top of the list - I'm probably just being thick.  -  Begoon (talk) 06:51, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome. It's only a few clicks. That's interesting. I just tested it (I've never used it before- I asked an admin directly for my own rollback button and then I got the admin bit) and it automatically puts it at the bottom and complains when you don;t enter a header. I might query that on the talk page. Thanks for bringing that up. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 07:19, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

If I'd just done what I presume most people do, and clicked EDIT on the page, then I would probably have just copied and pasted the latest entry to the top, and edited with my Username/details etc... The issue, I suppose, is having the [add section] link on the page when that's not how the list is used by convention. No big thing, I expect - but probably worth a mention, since there could be others as thick as me - unlikely, but possible...  -  Begoon (talk) 07:32, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Hathor_Exploration

Hi HJ Mitchell, actually more a question than a complaint: This AfD had no keep votes in two weeks, is that not some sort of a consensus? I read the comment somehow as "on the fence". --Pgallert (talk) 09:21, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, generally, we require a consensus to delete, otherwise we default to the status quo (ie keep the article). Although it's not strictly the way things are done, you could stick a PROD tag on it. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 09:26, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Don't get me wrong but adding a prod after the closing admin has found there's no consensus to delete is something I don't do. You're welcome to help out here ;) But my point was rather: Wasn't that a consensus? How many !voters would it need? --Pgallert (talk) 09:49, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

It's not done strictly on a vote count (WP:NOTAVOTE, WP:CONSENSUS), but that AfD was too quiet for my liking. If an article is deleted as a result of an AfD, it will be speedy deleted if it's re-created (unlike processes like PROD or CSD) and the only way to overturn it is DRV, so we need a pretty strong consensus. Nobody really challenged any of the delete !votes, which is the best test of the strength of an argument, so I wasn't comfortable deleting it based on that and I'm told that we're not allowed to treat "no objection to deletion" as and expired PROD. You're welcome to renominate it or you can prod it with my blessing. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 10:04, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Protection question (templates)

Hi! I've just protected Template:2010 FIFA World Cup Group C (full, three days). Now... I was going to stick on a padlock ({{pp-protected|expiry=July 17, 2010}}) but it occurred to me that will show up on every page that uses the template. What's the best/usual/sensible way to proceed? TFOWR 10:39, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Magic! Also known as <noinclude></noinclude>! ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 10:41, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and you probably want {{pp-dispute}}- it's more specific. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 10:42, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Aha! I knew that, honest! Anyhoo, it is done. Thanks! TFOWR 10:45, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

• The page is auto-tagging itself with pp-indef in the corner now. (Red padlock, which links to the policy for indef protection). I cannot see what is causing this anomaly, any ideas? Perhaps the template space just automatically assumes all protection is due to templates being high risk? --Taelus (Talk) 11:33, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

That's odd. I've seen it happen a few times, but only when I wanted it to. I suppose that's the price we pay for trying to be clever! It'll disappear in 3 days. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 11:37, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Yep, it's no big deal, but I am the kind of person who gets irritated by little things like that! I'm also one of those people that gets very curious about why such things would happen, since thats how we all learn ;) --Taelus (Talk) 11:43, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

It's bugging me, though (I'm curious, too, for the same reason!) As far as I can see, {{pp-protected}} seems to behave the same (I looked at the template to see if there was any template magic going on). TFOWR 12:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Subtle Spam (not!)

William012 (talk · contribs) spamming was very 'subtle' wasn't it? NOT ! BTW you have been at 'it' for 19 hours(!) by my reckoning, don't forget to rest! The vandals will still be here when you get back! -- 220.101 (talk) ^\Contribs 11:21, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I've been on and off. I'm having another argument with my body clock! And yes, he was very subtle, inserting some crappy spam link into every article he could find. Erm, no. Blocked! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 11:24, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Contact Tournesol on Swedish Wikipedia

Hello! Could you have a English language talk with Tournesol on Swedish Wikipedia? He is an administrator on Swedish Wikipedia. I don't say that you have to speak Swedish with him, he knows English quite well too. You can look at his contributions on English Wikipedia (this Wikipedia). He wants to tell the administrators on EnWp (English Wikipedia) about my contributions on Swedish Wikipedia. His user page is here and his talk page is here. Heymid (talk) 13:56, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

My first close - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Gallery of triband flags

I just closed Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Gallery of triband flags as transwiki to Commons. Now, for the big bucks, how does that happen? ----moreno oso (talk) 23:02, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I've contacted an admin I work with around the Main Page (who is also a Commons admin). Hopefully he'll be able to help. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:08, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Cool. Aw man, there's that kitty again. Kitty want a fishy? ----moreno oso (talk) 01:12, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Meow! Btw, did you install that AfD-closing script? HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:17, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

{{trout}}

Quite. Thank you for the fish, though it's more likely to get eaten by the archive bot. Ah well, I'm sure the bot'll enjoy it! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:27, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

(edit conflict)

Yes, I did. Thanks. I tried to find a regular AfD I could close last night but there were three others and they were complicated. I looked again today and saw the one I closed. I just wish the script provided a button for the transwiki option. ----moreno oso (talk) 01:30, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

I relisted five tonight; close one as Keep and wanted to Delete Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/All Pro Dad. However, it seems as a newbie or probie, I don't have the delete option. Could you review my actions? ----moreno oso (talk) 02:29, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

In this DIFF1, an editor asked my reasons for relisting. In this second DIFF2, he reverted the relisting without waiting for my answer which is visible in the first DIFF1. What your impression on this? ----moreno oso (talk) 02:46, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Hello! Some sort of server issue is preventing me from importing the pages to Commons, so I'll try again later.
Note that four of them (Gallery of bordered flags, Gallery of flags with cantons, Gallery of flags with crescents and Gallery of flags with plants) were manually copied and pasted to Commons in 2007 and 2008 (under the titles Bordered flags Flags with cantons, Flags with crescents and Flags with plants), so we can either overwrite the Commons pages or merge the Commons histories with the portions of the Wikipedia histories that predate them. (If there are no major differences, the former option would be easier.) Either way, given the lack of significant prose, there shouldn't be any copyright/licensing issues. —David Levy 03:33, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

You live in the UK? ----moreno oso (talk) 04:50, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Me? The flag on the userpage not give it away? ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 04:52, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

No, and that brings up a great point - I *really* need to look at userpages regardless if I trust somebody. I saw your comment about the time and understand Universal Coordinated Time. ----moreno oso (talk) 04:55, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You'd be surprised what you can learn by reading (or just glancing at) someone's userpage! Yes, I'm in the UK, but I seem to be in a dispute with my body clock, hence being active at such an absurd hour! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 04:58, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

• Got you on my watchlist and see your post about the time where you live...brought up a question. Isn't all of England on GMT? - NeutralHomer • Talk • 04:58, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Ah, that's another of the hundred and something talk page stalkers I can put a name to! Currently, the UK's on British Summer Time (GMT +1). HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 05:00, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Kinda like the US has Daylight Savings Time, I guess. :) - NeutralHomer • Talk • 05:03, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Same principle, just the other side of that big blue wet thing! :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 05:07, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Tell me about body clocks. I got up at 4 am (about 11am your time) to watch the Mundial. I *dig* when Univision shows Shakira doing the Waka Waka (This Time for Africa) song. I wonder if she has seen a grown bear's um, er, ah teeth. Yeah, that's the ticket! Teeth! ----moreno oso (talk) 05:08, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Ah, gotcha :) I didn't know England had Daylight Savings Time. I have learned something. Neat! :) - NeutralHomer • Talk • 05:12, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Me too. I've learned that Shakira looks great in Africa. Now, if she was in my living room. . .----moreno oso (talk) 05:16, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Indeed! Though, there are others I'd pick if given the choice. Sadly we'll probably have to settle for a screen in the living room. I s'pose you could go to Africa, but that'd be pricey. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 05:19, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Lily's easy on the eyes but she's young to be my um, er, ah young playmate wife. I gotta find a gal I think is here. ----moreno oso (talk) 05:23, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I got nothing. All the gals I like have no PD image. I'd marry Ana María Canseco and would be captivated with her friend Giselle Blondet. ----moreno oso (talk) 05:41, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You can try Flickr- some of the folks there can be willing to release their photos if you ask nicely. We're getting a little old for my own tastes, though. Saying that, Shakira's older than I thought... HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 05:56, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I've looked for the correct licensed pix but none exist. Yeah, I thought Shakira was all of 22 - she looks so young. Maribel Guardia appeared in H Magazine at 48 in stockings, garters and heels. I forget how the English put garters - it's quaint. --moreno oso (talk) 06:00, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

What does that do for me? Do I get a raise? *Actually* now that I peeked at Maribel, I did get a raise. . . ----moreno oso (talk) 06:04, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You can try asking people nicely to release them. You'd be surprised how often it works (that's where all but one of the images I've uploaded to Commons came from). Yeah, I wouldn't have put Shakira a day over 22 either if I hadn't just read her article! Are you sure Maribel is 48? She doesn't look it! Couldn't resist- I googled it! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 06:13, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Her article says she's 51 now. I think she is that old because she won Miss Costa Rica back in the early 70s or late 60s. Did you go to Yahoo or Google and see her in GHH? Woah. She usually works out and most times I see on a show, she wears fishnet stockings which make her legs look nicely tanned. She seems like a classy chick, good singer and so-so comedianne. She married an older guy Joan Sebastian. That guy can sing tunes from the top of a horse like Roy Rodgers in his prime. ----moreno oso (talk) 06:18, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) ...this is one of the stranger talk page threads I've read. :P But heck, she really doesn't look that old.{{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 06:20, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

It's the kitty's fault. I think he's territorial. ----moreno oso (talk) 06:24, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

It's the kitty's fault you got a raise? {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 06:25, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, not the kitty onscreen. That cat freaks me - really. I remember the first I came here to post something and I jumped back from the keyboard. The next time I felt like I was on LSD - and I don't do drugs. Maribel does it for me. ----moreno oso (talk) 06:28, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

She really doesn't look that old! Either that kitty has more authority than I do (I work harder for less than you guys! :P) or somebody's into bestiality. I'm not sure which is more disconcerting! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 06:31, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately in HD, she's beginning to show her age. Several years ago, somebody said that HD would be like TV which killed radio stars. I saw this one gal tonight who had more pancake makeup than some stiffs in a casket. ----moreno oso (talk) 06:34, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

OK, I am confused....where be this kitty we are talking about? Only one I see is the "serious business" kitty. - NeutralHomer • Talk • 06:35, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

This kitty but you have to google her. She appeared in H Magazine which is like Playboy several years ago at 48. ----moreno oso (talk) 06:41, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Wowsers! - NeutralHomer • Talk • 06:43, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You guys are all so male... :P I think the (onscreen) kitty is funny. Maribel, otoh, makes me feel old. Which is incredibly weird. {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 06:47, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

We can't help it! ;) But seriously, I wouldn't believe she was 48 in that shoot! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 06:51, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Take a look at Pauley Perrette (you would know her as "Abby" on the American drama NCIS. What would you say her age is without looking at her page? - NeutralHomer • Talk • 06:54, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I love NCIS! I'd put her in her late 20s at most, but now I'll have to check. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 06:57, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

...23. (Damn! How do all these women do it?) How old would you have guessed Maribel was in that Playboy shoot? {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 06:58, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

...and you would both be wrong. Pauley Perrette is 41! Sourced and all here on Wikipedia. Fourty-freakin'-one! Some good genes. - NeutralHomer • Talk • 07:00, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

*Pick jaw up from floor* She's how old? 41? Bloody hell! I would have put Maribel in her early 30s at the very most. She looks damn good to say she was getting on for 50! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 07:02, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Really?? She looks like she could be in my class! {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 07:03, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I did the same when I seen how old she was on IMDb. Couldn't believe it. Born in 1969...that is crazy, man. :) - NeutralHomer • Talk • 07:05, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

But she doesn't look a day over 25, if that! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 07:11, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I know. They even said in an episode of NCIS: Los Angeles (not sure if you get that over there yet) that she was in her "mid 20s" and everyone was like "we know that ain't true" on IMDb. Can't remember where we got the source for her birthdate from on her page. - NeutralHomer • Talk • 07:18, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

A discussion about deletion turns into a discussion about NCIS? Davtra (talk) 07:57, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Welcome to my talk page! You get used to it! Do grab a chair and join us, I'll put the kettle on. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 08:20, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I'll put the kettle on. You need to get back to mopping. (Actually, both are pretty housewifey things to do...) What about something a little stronger? {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 08:27, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I would, but it's now 09:30 am! I do a like a good whisky, though- hence the name of my alternate account! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 08:33, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm UTC-12, so it's about the right time to start drinking here. (Ignoring that I'm very underage.) Oh well, coffee for us all then. {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 08:37, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

UTC-12? Where does that put you geographically if you don;t mind my asking? A country or even a continent would do, I'm just curious! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 08:40, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Oops, I meant UTC+12, not UTC-12. Quite a big difference. (And the article should give you a decent guess.) {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 08:44, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Hmm, the UTC-12 article is quite interesting (I didn't know that existed)! So a typo is the difference between an uninhabited area of the North Pacific and somewhere probably considerably warmer! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 08:51, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, exactly. And it's also the difference between Sunday morning and Monday morning... *groan* It's hard being the first to greet Monday. :P {{Sonia|ping|enlist}} 09:01, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome :) Davtra (talk) 23:43, 14 June 2010 (UTC)