Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2016 December 29
| Language desk | ||
|---|---|---|
| < December 28 | << Nov | December | Jan >> | December 30 > |
| Welcome to the Wikipedia Language Reference Desk Archives |
|---|
| The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current reference desk pages. |
December 29 edit
Chanukah? Challah? edit
Why are Hebrew-derived English terms pronounced without the 'ch'? Obviously, it's a different language, but still why do the English names have the 'ch'? Why can't the English terms be hallah or hanukah to reflect the accurate pronunciation? 66.213.29.17 (talk) 20:55, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- When I go to google and type in "han", the first word it suggests is "Hanukkah". Google is your friend. μηδείς (talk) 21:24, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- It's a case of the Hebrew words being transliterated different in different varieties of English. British English prefers "ch", perhaps thinking of the Scottish (e.g. loch); American English prefers "h". Carbon Caryatid (talk) 22:48, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- See Hanukkah#Alternative_spellings for the full story. Also, English spelling sometimes doesn't really concern itself with how the letters sound, look at "knee" for example. Alansplodge (talk) 22:56, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- Words starting with kn used to be pronounced as spelled. The leading k's went silent by 1750. [1] ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:14, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
- See Hanukkah#Alternative_spellings for the full story. Also, English spelling sometimes doesn't really concern itself with how the letters sound, look at "knee" for example. Alansplodge (talk) 22:56, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- It's a case of the Hebrew words being transliterated different in different varieties of English. British English prefers "ch", perhaps thinking of the Scottish (e.g. loch); American English prefers "h". Carbon Caryatid (talk) 22:48, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- I don't quite know what you mean by "to reflect the accurate pronunciation". The Hebrew letter ח (cheth) has a sound which does not occur in most dialects of English except for non-English words. It is a different sound from that of ה (he), and a careful transliteration needs to recognise that; hence the common used of 'kh' or 'ch'. for the sound. --ColinFine (talk) 23:14, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
- Gutturals like the Spanish j and the Hebrew letter are often equated to the trailing "ch" in Scottish words such as "loch". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:16, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
- I don't quite know what you mean by "to reflect the accurate pronunciation". The Hebrew letter ח (cheth) has a sound which does not occur in most dialects of English except for non-English words. It is a different sound from that of ה (he), and a careful transliteration needs to recognise that; hence the common used of 'kh' or 'ch'. for the sound. --ColinFine (talk) 23:14, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
What they said. And anyone saying "hallah or hanukah" is mis-pronouncing the words. Which is quite understandable. And understandable, if you understand what I'm saying. --Dweller (talk) Become old fashioned! 17:05, 4 January 2017 (UTC)