Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2007 August 29

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August 29

Word Category

In which classical word category (preposition, pronoun, conjunction etc.) is the word "as" in "X was very good, as defined by Y"? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.210.116.228 (talk) 21:35, August 28, 2007 (UTC)

What you're asking about is the part of speech of as in this sentence. The way you've worded it, it's classified as an adverb by the American Heritage Dictionary (sense 3). But I wonder how firmly should we separate this usage from the second conjunction definition, since it can be taken to mean "as it has been defined..." The problem is that as means "in the manner in which," where "in the manner" is adverbial, but "in which" introduces a subordinate clause with a conjunction. It seems to me the AHD adv. 3 definition goes too far in limiting the meaning to "in the [specified] manner"; I think I'd regard it as a conjunction in all these cases, including your sentence. (By the way, some people might take issue with as as a "preposition" in the AHD too.) Wareh 01:29, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

In this kind of case no two grammarians would agree with each other... and there are plenty of cases like this, which makes us think over the very idea of "part of speech", defined so strictly by our high-school teachers, and supposed to pose no ambiguities.--K.C. Tang 02:02, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

It would probably be marked as an adverb, which is usually where the hard-to-categorize words get dumped. Some prefer instead to slap it with three or four different labels; definitions of as seem to appear frequently with "adverb", "conjunction", or "preposition". For a modern linguistic analysis you might try looking in something like the Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (which I don't have access to). Strad 05:20, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

nordic floating s

Is there an official name for that "floating s" that seems to afflict the English of Nordic folks who don't have a firm grasp of the language? "OK Freds, I've gots no times for dats". Gzuckier 16:41, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

"Unfounded stereotype"? Spiro in My Family and Other Animals does that too, and he's not Nordic. —Angr/talk 17:35, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Interesting. Maybe it's a more general thing with English spoken by foreigners with limited English? I still can't find anything vaguely relevant via google, searching for all kinds of things. I can't believe some linguistics PhD hasn't done a thesis on it. After all, if you can find articles on Northern cities vowel shift and Canadian raising. Gzuckier 19:58, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Are you even sure this really happens? I like Metalocalypse too, but I've never heard anyone actually talk like Skwisgar. Recury 13:50, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

My day job is transcribing medical reports. Many of our doctors are foreign-born. The worst offenders in misplacing -s are two with Vietnamese names. (I don't think we have any Scandinavians.) —Tamfang 19:51, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Swedish/Japanese pidgin or creoles

Hello, does anyone here know of a place to find information on any pidgins/creoles formed from Swedish and Japanese? I'd be very much interested for linguistic reasons, and mostly because those are a couple favorite languages of mine. --69.237.198.63 17:38, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

There is Rinkeby Swedish, which is spoken today. During the 19th century, there was Yokohama Pidgin Japanese, and during the early 20th century, Japanese-based pidgins developed in Manchuria, Taiwan, Micronesia and perhaps other parts of the Japanese empire. These are no longer spoken, except occasionally by elderly people who remember them. Marco polo 18:56, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Are there any pidgins that arose from the contact of Swedish and Japanese? ;-) —Angr 21:52, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

There have been rumours of Gothenburg Whorehouse Japanese and Osaka Business Swedish, but they rarely meet. Xn4 03:37, 30 August 2007 (UTC)