- The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Allen3 talk 15:35, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
The ScareHouse edit
... that the USA Today calls The ScareHouse in Etna, PA one of America's scariest Halloween attractions?
Created/expanded by User:Margee Kerr (talk). Self nom at 14:56, 9 September 2012 (UTC)
- This is my first dyk! If there are any trouble please leave a message on my talk page!PS Please feature during daytime hours in the United States--Margee Kerr (talk) 15:04, 9 September 2012 (UTC)
- Article well developed and nicely illustrated. Congrats, Margee Kerr. All pics, including the DYK lead submission (right), although uploaded to Commons with the CC Share Alike 2.0 Generic license, prominently feature a copyrighted logo.[1] This as a serious problem. Please note, that the pic used for illustration at USAtoday.com article has been cropped (with logo removed) to avoid copyright infringement.[2] We ought to do the same here, because none of the pics in your article qualify as free, so it's only a matter of time before they get deleted. The actual logo is expressly copyrighted by its owner. Also, I don't think we would actually need the link to Travel Channel, because the hook already sounds (more less) like an infomercial and actually, is not supported by the reference (as oppose to USA Today link for example). The article size is OK, however, it has been created almost a month ago, on 17 August 2012.[3] Please consult the rules at the top, and good luck with your next submission within five days of the article creation. Thanks. Poeticbent talk 13:58, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
Age counted based on date moved to mainspace, which was 9 September. Image should be cropped, yes. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:00, 18 September 2012 (UTC)
- I'd give it a go-ahead providing the image is removed, but where do you see, Crisco, that it was actually moved to mainspace on 9 September? Can you link it for me please? Thanks. Poeticbent talk 20:32, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
- Here. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:20, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
- I'd give it a go-ahead providing the image is removed, but where do you see, Crisco, that it was actually moved to mainspace on 9 September? Can you link it for me please? Thanks. Poeticbent talk 20:32, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
- Thanks for the i-link, Crisco. The nominator could have made it easier by leaving a comment about the article being moved from user space at that exact time. Still, the hook is not supported by the reference. The Travel Channel and USA Today/Travel are two different things, and most importantly the actual factoid is mentioned by USA Today/Travel here as originating from Hauntworld Magazine instead... I just added that link to the article. Please, see my ALT1 below.
- ALT1: ... that Hauntworld Magazine named The ScareHouse in Etna, Pennsylvania one of America's scariest Halloween attractions? Poeticbent talk 15:54, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
- Ummm, I don't see this referenced in the article? It does not mention the Hauntworld Magazine, and the link you gave seems not to mention The ScareHouse at all? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 23:46, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
- See paragraph six in USA Today article: "Larry Kirchner, editor of Hauntworld Magazine... has just issued its annual 13 best list of haunted houses. PHOTO GALLERY." This where the list of America's scariest Halloween attractions cited by USA Today originates from. Therefore, if you quote USA Today (as referenced in our Wikipedia article), you actually quote Larry Kirchner of Hauntworld Magazine to be exact. Poeticbent talk 18:00, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- Ah, I see. Although the phrase "as reported by US Today" may be fine, as we often attribute such reporting, without going into details of the reporting source (hooks have limited space, after all).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 18:11, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- See paragraph six in USA Today article: "Larry Kirchner, editor of Hauntworld Magazine... has just issued its annual 13 best list of haunted houses. PHOTO GALLERY." This where the list of America's scariest Halloween attractions cited by USA Today originates from. Therefore, if you quote USA Today (as referenced in our Wikipedia article), you actually quote Larry Kirchner of Hauntworld Magazine to be exact. Poeticbent talk 18:00, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- Ummm, I don't see this referenced in the article? It does not mention the Hauntworld Magazine, and the link you gave seems not to mention The ScareHouse at all? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 23:46, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
Please notify the nominator when you have questions/issues. Particularly when dealing with a new editor and their first DYK. There is even a dedicated template for doing so at the top of this edit window, making notifications as easy as copy and paste. PS. Other thoughts: logo is indeed a problem, see commons:Template:Logo - all logos are presumed copyrighted; a proof needs to be presented that this logo is licensed under a free license or pictures with logo will have to be deleted. [http://www.scarehouse.com/ only uses full @ language, so it appears that the logo is copyrighted. At the same time it is my understanding that scarehouse employee agreed to license the photos under a free license, so this issue should be clarified at commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Broken Doll.jpg. Till it is clarified, this article will either have to be delayed or dyked without a pic. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 15:52, 23 September 2012 (UTC)
Anyway, I thought I'd propose an alt hook, a the Ghost Hunters connection looks interesting, but the claim that they visited the ScareHouse five times couldn't be verified with the end-of-para ref. Sigh. No other nice hook comes to mind, and the creator is inactive. Double sigh. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 23:50, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
There appear to be problems with both hooks, the creator's last post was two weeks ago on this template's talk page promising some action, and her edit immediately prior to it was 13 days earlier. Piotrus, you seem to have been her mentor: can this nomination be saved—presumably without the image—or is it time to let it go? BlueMoonset (talk) 01:49, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- I've been trying to contact the nominator, but she is not responding. Perhaps you could post a warning of impending DYK failure on her talk? I think that it should be possible to come up with an alt hook, without a picture, I just can't figure out one that's interesting. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 16:02, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
Sorry folks, I'll give this attention tomorrow, I'm trying to get other photos together but if I can't in time and it has to be a failed nomination I understand. --Margee Kerr (talk) 16:37, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- Photos are of a secondary concern, as the nomination may be featured without them (it will simply attract fewer views). Our current concern is finding a good hook that can be properly referenced. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 18:11, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
I deleted the photo and updated the reference to the USA link. --Margee Kerr (talk) 20:29, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- We can certainly wait a day or two more, as long as this won't become another two to four weeks more :) But please note that we don't reference hooks in the DYK, what you need to do is to fix the reference in the article itself. Also note the Poeticbent comments about the source above. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 21:56, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
I deleted the reference to the Travel Channel. --Margee Kerr (talk) 13:58, 9 October 2012 (UTC)
- All right. I think that this ref is good enough for the hook, and as I wrote above, while USA Today is citing another source, it's common in reporting, and it's fine to report the newspaper rather than the source. I think the article is good to go now, although a second opinion would be welcome, as I was somewhat involved in the editing and would prefer not to review this myself. Shame we were not able to get any freely licensed photos suitable for DYK illustration (i.e. logo-free). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 16:15, 9 October 2012 (UTC)
Ok great, is there any further action needed on my part? Margee Kerr (talk) 12:30, 10 October 2012 (UTC)
- Could you provide citations for the outstanding citation needed requests in the article? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 14:43, 10 October 2012 (UTC)
Talk page comments: I'll clarify the travel channel citation and try to get some photos that do not have the logo in them. thanks! --Margee Kerr (talk) 16:35, 23 September 2012 (UTC)
I'll work on this tomorrow and get it updated, thanks for your patience! --Margee Kerr (talk) 16:27, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
- New reviewer needed, now that outstanding issues have been taken care of. BlueMoonset (talk) 07:34, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
- I'll just note that this may make a good Halloween hook. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 16:25, 21 October 2012 (UTC)
. Good to go. Some of the claims made about this attraction being named word's scariest has not been borne out by the text/references when closely consulted. In light of possible Halloween use, I have gone ahead and adjusted text and fixed refs. Consider using this DYK?Nom between now and Halloween/October 31st.
See following Alt Hooks, either one is supported by good refs:
- ALT HOOK 2: ... that The ScareHouse is one of The Wickedest?
- ALT HOOK 3: ... that even though The ScareHouse's Creepo the Clown hates early Christmas decorations he wears a Santa hat?
Shearonink (talk) 04:44, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
- ALT4: ... that Pittsburgh walking dead among the recreations of landmarks were inaugurated as the third haunt within The ScareHouse in 2011? Poeticbent talk 07:32, 28 October 2012 (UTC)