Talk:Sam H. Harris Theatre/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk · contribs) 21:50, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

I'll take a look at this one. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 21:50, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

Prelim

• No edit wars
• Candler Building (New York City) and 42nd Street (Manhattan) are duplicated links in the lede
• John Barrymore is a duplicated link in main text
  • I've fixed both of these. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• Images are correctly licensed

Lede and infobox

• Link auditorium
• "had acquired the theater's site"
• "used it as a movie theater until 1994" out of interest, this suggests that Cohen was still alive and owning the theatre in 1994?
• Main text says theatre closed permanently in 1994 not 1996
  • I've addressed all of these issues. I'm not sure if Cohen was alive in 1994, but it was a movie theater until that time. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

Description

• "the theater was demolished in 1997" suggests work was completed in this year but later text says possibly 1998
• Link vestibule
• Link Shakespearean comedies
• Link auditorium
  • I have fixed all of these as well. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

History

• "in late 1912...Early the next year, a syndicate headed by Sol Bloom acquired the library building" this disagrees with the lede, which says Bloom acquired the land in 1912
  • I've fixed the lead. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• Would be nice to have a word or two on who Bloom was
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• "not only movies but also plays" Broadway productions, as per the lede?
  • That is correct. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• You keep using the word "legitimate" - maybe this is just me, but I'm not sure what this means in the context of theatre productions?
  • Basically, all Broadway shows are legitimate theatre shows. This is in contrast with other types of theatrical productions like vaudeville, burlesque, or film. In this context, the word "legitimate" is used specifically to distinguish from the films that the theater also presented. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• " in August 1914" no need to repeat the year
  • Removed. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• Link Broadway at first mention
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
• Link World War I
  • Done both. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• "in September 1916" Ibid repeated year
  • Removed. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• If Cohan continued to stage The Royal Vagabond how was the run interrupted?
  • The performers went on strike, and the performances resumed when the strike ended. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• "partnership had dissolved"
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
• You say Honey Girl is produced after the partnership is dissolved, but Honey Girl opens in May and the partnership dissolves in June?
  • Even though the partnership wasn't dissolved until after Honey Girl opened, Cohan had already stopped working with Harris. As such, Cohan wasn't involved in the production of Honey Girl. I've now clarified that this was the first show that Harris presented at the theater by himself. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• I think the note on the renaming and Lew Fields context could be put into the main text, otherwise it's a little confusing to understand why renaming one theatre lets Harris rename another
  • I have done that now. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• "in December 1924"
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• Who was Charles Wagner?
  • As far as I could tell, he was just another theatrical operator. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• The sale to the Shubert brothers is worded in such a way that I'm unsure whether Harris was given part owner of the Music Box or if he gave up part ownership as part of the Harris sale?
  • Oops. Yeah, he gave up part ownership in the Music Box. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• "in September 1927"
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 22:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
• Are there not more specific dates for Yes, Yes, Yvette, The Trial of Mary Dugan, and Congai? Ibid plays on next line
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• Is George Cohan the earlier George M. Cohan? Might be good to clarify that yes, that's one of the original theatre leasers there!
  • Indeed. I've now added that. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "in March 1933"
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• Know anything about who Cohen was?
  • Not really, other than the fact that he was a theatrical operator. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "Following a renovation" any knowledge on the extent of the renovation?
  • A new sound system was added, but I'm not sure what else was added. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "The Brandt family" who?

• I will add a little more about this later. Basically, movie theater operator William Brandt acquired a bunch of theaters on 42nd Street beginning in the 1930s.

Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

• "The Selwyn and the other 42nd Street theaters" it is useful to state the Selwyn here? Why not just say that Harris was among the theatres that..
  • Oops. I copied this paragraph from the American Airlines Theatre article and forgot to change the name (I meant "The Harris and the other 42nd Street theaters..."). Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "although Finkelstein said none of the company's 42nd Street theaters showed hardcore porn." what?! That's a bit left field! Perhaps a little context as to why he would have to make that statement?
  • Another side effect of me copying this paragraph from the American Airlines Theatre article is that I forgot to mention that many of the theaters on 42nd Street were showing pornography by the 1970s. This tidbit was also in the American Airlines page but in a different section. I have now rectified this as well. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• Link exploitation films
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "His report helped motivate..." how so? What did it say?
  • The source I'm using (Stern et al. 2006) does not elaborate on this. It mentions that the report focused on "the impact [the theaters] made on the street", that many of the theaters' facades had already been heavily modified, and that they could not study the theaters in detail or consult many of the original architectural plans. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
• "The LPC had started"
  • Done. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
• Confused as to why the LPC designation bit from 2015 onwards is included. If the Harris was already demolished, what relevancy did these discussions have on it?
  • The whole situation is a bit strange. In 1982, when the theater still existed, the LPC began considering designating about 50 Broadway theaters as city landmarks. The commission voted in 1987 and 1988 to preserve most of the theaters, but it postponed designation for the Harris and other theaters on 42nd Street. Between 1987 and 2015, the LPC had never formally rejected the designation of the 42nd Street theaters, which meant that even though the Harris had been completely destroyed, it was still being considered for landmark status. The 2015 decision was a formality that put the Harris out of this state of limbo; in theory, the LPC still could have protected a structure that no longer existed. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• "The city government selected the Nederlander Organization in April 1982" does the Cinema Circuit not still own the Harris at this point?
  • It did, but the city government planned to seize ownership of the Harris through eminent domain (which I think is discussed in the same section). Epicgenius (talk) 12:57, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
• Should "The Durst Organization" be "the Durst Organization"? (and is there a more particular date for the acquisition?)
  • For your first point, yes. For the second question, unfortunately, I couldn't find any news pieces published immediately after the acquisition occurred. Epicgenius (talk) 12:57, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
• When did Adie come around?
  • As far as I can tell, he did not. The city and state governments were going to acquire the theater regardless of whether he agreed; he could voluntarily sell it to the city and state, or they could acquire it from under him via eminent domain. In this case, the only way to get Adie to leave was by acquiring the theater through eminent domain. Epicgenius (talk) 12:57, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
• What's AMC?
  • AMC Theatres, which in the U.S. is usually known simply as AMC. Although I just realized that I have never mentioned AMC in this article, so I have now done so. Epicgenius (talk) 14:43, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
• If you're using the BID acronym then introduce it with the full Times Square Business Improvement District
  • I have changed this to the full form of the name. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

References

• You've got a slightly dodgy referencing style; there's some sfn in use as well as the various newspaper articles, but there's some full book references in the citations too. For example, Bloom gets his The Routledge Guide to Broadway as sfn referencing and listed in the sources section, but his Broadway: An Encyclopedia referenced in full as a citation without sfn. I'd suggest trying to clean this up so you're using only one style of referencing. Morrison is listed in full both in the citations and the sources section, and I can't tell whether you've used the Cort Theater report at all.
  • In this article, I've used {{sfn}} (actually, {{harvnb}}) if I needed to cite more than one page range from the same source. However, if I'm only citing one page range, I find it easier to cite it directly in the text, rather than using {{harvnb}} once and having readers scroll to the bottom of the page. I've removed the Cort Theatre report, as it's not used in this article. Epicgenius (talk) 22:42, 8 April 2023 (UTC)
    • I have moved all the book references down to the "Sources" section of the article. All other types of citations are inline references, so they should now be consistent. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)
• Referencing spot checks look good, AGF to a high degree considering the large amount of sources and reliability of the contributor

@Epicgenius: Hi, that's all I have for now. Will await your comments. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 21:50, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

@Pickersgill-Cunliffe: Thanks for the comments. I have just addressed or replied to some of your issues, and I will fix the remaining issues within the next few days. Epicgenius (talk) 22:42, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

@Pickersgill-Cunliffe: Thanks again for the review. I appreciate your patience and have now addressed all of your comments. Epicgenius (talk) 15:56, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

@Epicgenius: I've made a couple of minor and hopefully uncontroversial edits. Am happy to pass this article as satisfying the GA criteria. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 18:02, 17 April 2023 (UTC)