Talk:Rockstar San Diego/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Spy-cicle (talk · contribs) 20:20, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

I might be able to review this in the ~ next week — Preceding unsigned comment added by Spy-cicle (talk • contribs) 20:20, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

Hey Spy-cicle, it's been almost two weeks since you accepted the request. Are you still getting on this? If you don't feel like it, you can still pass it on. IceWelder [✉] 18:53, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

Apologies this has taken longer than expected I have worked on a draft and I am still wading through it, it should be done shortly Spy-cicle (talk) 20:48, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

Hi Lordtobi, Also it may be worth you knowing that I am currently working in the draft section here: Draft:Talk:Rockstar San Diego/GA1 before the review is complete and uploaded. Spy-cicle (talk) 20:48, 17 October 2019 (UTC)

I am still  Reviewing... this but this is what I have so far:

1. Well written?:  Done

2. Verifiable?:  Not done Generally accurate but still have things which are not mentioned in the sources provided. Some things I could not verify include:

 Done After the adjustments made to the article it is now verifable.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 19:08, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

Sectioned comments

Beginnings, partnerships, and Resident Evil 2 port (1984–2000)

• 3rd para: "As part of the Dream Team, the company developed two sports games featuring American baseball player Ken Griffey Jr.: Major League Baseball and Slugfest, released for Nintendo 64 in 1998 and 1999, respectively." Not well sourced it does not state the dates of the games release in that source. Normally this would be fine but both of those article are stubs and could end up being deleted in the future.

  Added additional source here that mentions both release years. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.

• 3rd para: "After six to nine months ... " I cannot seem to find a mention of this with the cited source.

  The claim is from the Gamasutra source used in the prior sentece, added it to this one as well. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done I see the claim now.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:35, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

• 4th para "it fit a two-compact disc" --> it fit two compact discs of the PlayStation game"

  The proposed wording is misleading. Non-tech-savvy readers might be confused on how the studio fit two actual CDs in the cartridge. The sentence should convey that they managed to get the entire game from a size that took up two CDs down to just one ROMc worth of data, which is a tenth of the size. The former wording is the result of the larger GOCE edit made earlier this year. If more clarity is needed, I will look into finding an alternative wording. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

  Looking back on it my proposed working does not help. Perhaps something along the lines of "it fit a PlayStation game with two compact discs (CDs) onto one Nintendo 64 ROM cartridge".  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:35, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

  Rephrased again. It should be a bit less ambiguous now. IceWelder [✉] 18:14, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

   Done The sentence definitely seems clearer now for non-specialist readers.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 19:07, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

• 4th para "The June 1998 opening of the first DisneyQuest interactive theme park in Orlando, Florida, debuted Virtual Jungle Cruise, an adventure ride Angel Studios had contributed to" This does not fit in that section as it previous talkts about the resident evil 2 port suddenly talks about a virtual jungle cruise they worked on then continues talking about the port afterwards. Either remove or integrate this in a different part of the article.

  Right, this was an ordering error. I integrated content not related to the port into the subsequent paragraph. I'm trying to keep it semi-chronological and appropriately concise, but still available and sourced so it can be included in the games table. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:35, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

• 5th para change Midtown Madness article states it released in April 1999 and the source provided states it "should appear on store shelves in the next two to three weeks." but was written in April 2000. With no definitive reference to its exact May 1999 is unclear.

  Classic GameSpot error. The site changed its platform in April 2000 and lost most of the publication dates (somehow), so if there is a GSpot article dated April 2000, it's probably misdated. I replaced the link with an archived version of the original article from late April 1999, where two-three weeks refers to May 1999. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:35, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

Rockstar Games deals and acquisition (2000–2006)

• 1st para "Titled Oni 2: Death & Taxes, the game's production was halted for unknown reasons." Cannot seem to find anything in the source which states it was stopped due to unknown reason.

  The reasons aren't entirely clear as the game was never announced. For verifiability's sake, though, I removed the 'unknown' part. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 15:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

• 2nd para "Key to the acquisition were the companies' successful partnerships over the previous three years." I could be missing something but could not seem find anything within the two sources that indicate this.

  Both sources mention that their cooperation (past and present) was beneficial to both parties. However, it didn't quite fit where it was (between two separate reasons why Angel agreed to the sale), so I removed it. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.

Controversy, Red Dead Redemption, and layoffs (2006–2011)

• 2nd para "During the latter's development, mismanagement led to a number of delays and increased development cost" I am not sure how the first source about RD revolver Q&A is relevant here.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 15:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

  Good point. Might have been used for something in the past but seemingly no longer. Removed the source for the time being. IceWelder [✉] 16:25, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.

• 2nd para " Martin had been a producer for Rockstar Vancouver for four-and-a-half years" I cannot seem to find anything in the source which suggests Martin was at San Diego for 4.5 years.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 15:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

  Good point. I cannot find this claim anymore. I wrote parts of it over two years ago and the source might have gone offline. I removed the Vancouver claim for now (relevance was limited anyway), might find the original source again later. IceWelder [✉] 16:25, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

   Done Confirmed fix.

Later activity (2011–present)

 Done Everything seems verifible here.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 15:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

Games developed

I am not sure if it is worth putting Virtual Jungle Cruise or Sky Pirates VR in the Game developed table.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 15:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

• I do think so. They are location-based games, but they are still games in the traditional sense. IceWelder [✉] 16:25, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

   Done Yes you are right as are still games in the traditional sense.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 17:00, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

3. Broad in coverage?:  Done

4. Neutral point of view?:  Done

5. Stable?:  Done

6. Images?:  Done confirmed by second opinion.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 12:05, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

Previous Comments Not sure Difficult to tell if this passes criteria as there are only 2 images. Possibly try and add another relevant image of the GTA series or another relevant image of a game they have developed. I may need to seek a third opinion on this one.

As game images are non-free and would only be used decoratively, not for context, this would run afoul of our WP:NFCC guidelines. I thought about adding images of the offices and the founder, but have not found freely licensed versions of either. What would you think about an image of the N64 to highlight Angel Studios' presence in the Dream Team? IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

You are right having game screenshots would not meet WP:NFCC. Honestly, considering this is my first GA review I will call for a second opinion on whether this meets the Images criteria for GA articles as I would not want to risk to promote an article to GA without properly meeting the GA standards.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:17, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

We could ask e.g. @Rhain or @TheJoebro64 for this. IceWelder [✉] 16:25, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

I am still  Reviewing... this but this is what I have so far (this is still subject to change)

Good stuff so far, I'm answering the concerns in-line for clarity. IceWelder [✉] 06:57, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

Second opinion

I am requesting a second opinion on whether this article meets GA criteria of the use of media throughout the article. Considering this is my first GA review I am not sure if this meeets the Images criteria for GA articles and I would not want to risk to promote an article to GA without properly meeting the GA standards. The rest of the criteria has generally been met so far (except verifibility which is currently being worked on).  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 16:25, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

Per the good article criteria, "the presence of media is not, in itself, a requirement"—considering that the article has two images, I'd say that it is sufficiently illustrated. I also agree with Lordtobi that any additional images would likely be deemed as decoration; images of some of the company's key people (Angel, Wasserman, Martin) would be perfect, but unfortunately none seem to exist under a free license. With that said, I think this GAN passes the criteria for Images. Good luck with the rest of the review. – Rhain ☔ 00:17, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

@Rhain: Thanks for your input on this GAN; now to finally wrap this up.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 12:04, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

Finishing Review

Congratulations @Lordtobi:, I am happy to announce that this has offically passed GAN, it certainly has been interesting to read about Diego Angel's love of tequilla, his 'Sippy Wippy's' and the birth of Red Dead.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 12:12, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

Wicked, thanks! IceWelder [✉] 12:34, 3 November 2019 (UTC)