Talk:Lavdrim Muhaxheri/Archive 1
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| Archive 1 |
Original Research & Synthesis Issues
A quick yes/no question --- do you believe that there are still OR & SYNTH issues going on with this page as it currently stands? I have a proposal on how to resolve it if there is still conflict over this issue. TIA. Tiggerjay (talk) 20:46, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
- yes many parts are OR and problematic to NPOV and reliable sourcesKewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 21:19, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
- Excellent, this is what I'd like for you to do -- please note that it will be refactored.... below please list each statement you believe is OR / NPOV / SYNTH /etc...followed by one or more reliable sources to illustrate the problem with that statement... Please use
*to list these, for example:
- Excellent, this is what I'd like for you to do -- please note that it will be refactored.... below please list each statement you believe is OR / NPOV / SYNTH /etc...followed by one or more reliable sources to illustrate the problem with that statement... Please use
- "Quote number 1 that you think is a problem"
- "Quote number 2 that you think is a problem"
Please use this format and I'll reformulate it into a table elsewhere, and we'll take these one at a time... Thanks Tiggerjay (talk) 21:35, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
- Lol.--Zoupan 22:50, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
- Wow, just wow..--Zoupan 22:54, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
Review of article
This is a former Rfc post and remains as a review since no conclusions have been made. The new Rfc -post in section 'Regarding NPOV on alleged beheading footage' is based on the first part in this review, comments can be made on it under that section and reviews are both needed and appreciated. KewinRozz(talk) KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 15:43, 18 February 2016 (UTC)KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 15:35, 19 February 2016 (UTC) KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 21:52, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
| This RfC was withdrawn by the proposer. |
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| It has been hidden because it became WP:TL;DR and may distract from otherwise constructive discussion on the balance of the page. The requester has been advised to focus on discussing these points as individual topics, instead of en-masse. (non-admin closure)Tiggerjay (talk) 20:35, 23 February 2016 (UTC) |
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Hi everyone, the past two to three weeks the biography on Lavdrim Muhaxheri has undergone significant changes in statements and size and therefor I'm asking for review of the article on (1)natural point of view, non - judgemental language[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Neutral_p oint_of_view]] (2) recentism/bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Systemic_bias Bias(3)defamation/libel Wikipedia:Libel to reach consensus on the parts below. Version 1 is per 18 - 19 januari 2015. Version 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Lavdrim_Muhaxheri&oldid=700078366#cite_note-KosovaPress-10 Version 2 - current Version 1 has 70 articles per 19 january 2015 from a successive increase of articles from october 2014 with around 30 articles. Version 2 has 47 articles + 2 under references with 49. Some articles replaced from version 1, version 1 has 7 sections: - Early life - From NATO to Islamic State (IS) - The alleged beheading of a 19-year-old Iraqi soldier - Public reactions and critique in media and social networks - Muhaxheri's impact on the state of Kosovo - The U.S blacklisting of Muhaxheri - Media coverage of Muhaxheri in 2014 and beyond version 2 has 3 sections: - Early life - Joining Jihad - Activities and media reports
Prosection Kosovo prosecution claims that Muhaxheri has traveled to Syria at two occasions between 2012- 2013 in a group of individuals from Kosovo, many of the members have been pointed out as students of imams at a mosque in Kosovo.The Kosovo prosecution have requested and been granted an international warrant for Muhaxheri’s arrest based on his affiliation with the group, which is affiliated with Islamic State based on textmessages between Muhaxheri, an imam and other indicted members. The textmessages that Muhaxheri has obtained from the imam and other members include instructions related to recruitment, such as escorting recruited members between Syria and Turkey. The Kosovo prosecution has said that Muhaxheri didn’t participate in the fighting with the other indicted members of the group. Muhaxheri was last reported to be in Syria on 5 Oktober 2013, based on textmessages Media coverage There are media reports have claimed that Muhaxheri appears in the following videos and footage; IS –propagandafilm Clanging of the Swords IV, an RPG – video, on beheading footage from Syria, a video from Iraq. There are media reports that have claimed that Muhaxheri has been killed in Syria and Iraq at three different occasions between 2014-2015. These reports have been denounced in other media reports that have claimed that publicized images and comments at IS militant Facebook accounts disconfirm the reports of Muhaxheri’ s death. In 2015 there are several media reports about Muhaxheri’s whereabouts that have been denounced by authorities; in November - December 2015 Muhaxheri was reported to be in Macedonia. This was denounced by Macedonian police department. In November 2015 Muhaxheri was reported to be in Kacanik, Kosovo, the report was denounced by Kosovo authorities. In December 2015 Muhaxheri was reported to be paralyzed in Syria, and later in December 2015 Muhaxheri was reported not to be paralyzed and to be in ar – Rutbah Iraq , on Muhaxheri was reported to be in Albania, this was denounced by an Albanian International Affairs analyst due to unverifiabillity. Forensic and analyst opinions The forensic anlazysts of the published videos and footage alleged to be of Lavdrim Muhaxheri are not convinced that the footage is of the same individual and when and where the footage is taken. On IS –propagandafilm Clanging of the Swords IV; According to Ebi Spahiu, a researcher at the Albanian Institute of International Affairs(AIIS);"he [Muhaxheri] would have come out with a stronger message".[1] On RGP video Researcher Ebi Spahiu stated that Muhaxheri was in the video but questioned whether it was new footage that proved he was still alive; "The media in Kosovo and Albania are treating it as a new video without considering that it may be old [footage]". Foreign policy analyst Adrian Shtuni stated that it was possible that the video was new footage, or at least newer than August 2014 but questioned whether Muhaxheri was in the video;"In a photograph of Muhaxheri taken around the summer of 2014, the militant appears to be heavier than he is in the video, although his outfit is the same", suggesting that the RPG video was taken at a different time than the two photographs. Foreign policy analyst Shtuni further claimed that it was possible that Muhaxheri was emulating other senior IS figures.
Comments, discussion and questions about the parts of the review can be added under 'Comments' below. KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 10:39, 4 February 2016 (UTC)KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 10:45, 4 February 2016 (UTC)
1. The first part concerns text about alleged beheading footage. In version 1.1) has taken a neutral point of view,NPOV, by avoid stating opinions about Muhaxheri being in the beheading footage as fact and described the footage in a non-judgemental manner ". In version 1.2) it’s precluded that the footage is authentic and that Muhaxheri is in the footage . 1.1) On 29 July 2014, an individual posted two (2) images to a Facebook page under the pseudonym "Lavdrim Muhaxheri" that, to some extent, give the impression of a man having beheaded an unidentified young man.[8][14] In the first photo, a man is seen standing over the young man, holding his left hand over the subject's jaw and holding a knife in his right hand. In the second photo a man is seen holding what has been assumed, by some, to portrait a young man's severed head. Thus the photo only shows parts of the head from the side and in absence of greater portions of the face, heavily covered in a substance that, by some, has been assumed to be blood. [14] 1.2) On 29 July 2014,[17] Muhaxheri uploaded photos to a Facebook page where he is seen beheading an unidentified young man in Syria.[18] In an interview with the Albanian daily "Dita", posted on 2 August 2014, Muhaxheri said that he had acted according to the Quran, and had did only what the KLA did during the Kosovo War. The young man was described as a 19-year-old spy.[19] Muhaxheri's claim about the KLA's history was disputed by Kosovo's Minister of Justice, Xhavit Jashari.[20] The neutral point of view (NPOV) [[7]] stance in 1.1) is based on that the journalist of the reference article assumes that Muhaxheri has posted the footage based on that the Facebook account username is Lavdrim Muhaxheri. It’s also the journalists opinion that Lavdrim Muhaxheri is in the footage, it’s not excluded that the footage could be of someone other than Muhaxheri since the footage isn’t authenticized. By NPOV; avoid stating opinions as facts and prefer a non-judgemental language. The Kosovo authorities have stated that the alleged victim in the footage is unidentified (reference article 14 in version 1). Some articles claim that the footage is from Syria, others from Iraq. In the interview with Gazeta Dita, Muhaxheri (or whoever called in that interview) claimed that the victim was a 19 – year old Iraqi soldier. The footage is unverified to when and where it’s taken. 2. The second part concerns text about Muhaxheri allegedly being seen in IS - propagandafilm Clanging of the Sword IV. In version 2.1) has taken a neutral point of view, NPOV,[[8]] by avoid stating opinions about Muhaxheri being in the "Clanging of the Swords IV" – video as fact, in version 2) it’s presented as a fact. 2.1) In March 2014 it became publicly known [10][11][not in citation given] that Muhaxheri had joined the Islamic State (IS) when he was assumed, or possibly confused to appear in the IS-released propaganda film "Clanging of the Swords IV" in parallel with the emergence of an older video with Lavdrim Muhaxheri.[2] In the IS' propagandafilm, a man who's often pseudonymed as "Lavdrim Muhaxheri" in public is seen tearing and burning his Kosovo passport while proclaiming that there are no manmade borders between Muslims in the world.[6][7][12] 2.2) In March 2014[11] it was reported that Muhaxheri had joined the Islamic State (IS) based on his appearance in the IS-released propaganda film Clanging of the Swords IV in parallel with the emergence of an older video with Lavdrim Muhaxheri.[2] In the IS propaganda film, Muhaxheri is seen in public tearing and burning his Kosovo passport while proclaiming that there are no manmade borders between Muslims in the world.[9][10][13] The NPOV [[9]] stance in 2.1) is based on the that article 10 in version 1 claims that Muhaxheri is the man seen in "Clanging of the Swords IV" while the claim is questioned by a researcher in article 11 in version 1. By NPOV; avoid stating seriously contested assertions as facts. 3. The third part concerns claims about Muhaxheri's involvement and role in the Islamic Youth-Kaçanik, a part of Islamic Community of Kosova (ICK). Version 1 (3.1) has taken a neutral point of view, NPOV, by describing Muhaxheri’s role in Islamic Youth-Kaçanik in a nonjudgmental language while in version 2) (3.2) he is presented as a leader. 3.1) Muhaxheri served with NATO in Afghanistan from 2010–2012. Thereafter, he returned to Kosovo and joined a newly founded group within the Islamic Community of Kosova (ICK) organization called Islamic Youth-Kaçanik.[10] 3.2) Muhaxheri served with NATO at a training camp in Afghanistan between 2010 and 2012, then returned to Kosovo. In late 2012, he became associated with extremist Islamist associations, first with a local organization, "Parimi", which then established the Islamic Youth-Kaçanik organization, in which he was appointed emir, leader of the military organization.[12] The organization was formed within the Islamic Community of Kosova (ICK).[11] There’s differing information between articles on Muhaxheri’s involvement in the organization Islamic Youth-Kaçanik, some, ref 12 in version 2, claim that he was a leader and some claim that he joined as a member, ref 8 in version 1. Further, noting that version 2 describes the religious organization Islamic Youth-Kaçanik as a military organization according to ref 12 in version2, might be due to recentism; ‘articles overburdened with documenting controversy as it happens’ and/or ‘articles created on flimsy, transient merits.’https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Systemic_bias
4. The fourth part concerns claims about Muhaxheri’s involvement and role in Islamic State 4.1 Muhaxheri's declaration of joining IS [2] shed a new light on the ongoing revolution against the Bashar al-Assad regime in Syria; that the revolutionary forces, or militias, were far from as cohesive and synchronized in the battles against the Syrian Armed Forces and other revolutionary groups in Syria as was commonly believed in the West.[13] In the IS propaganda film, "Muhaxheri" and his followers, a group of 100–150 Albanians from Albania, Macedonia and across Europe swore allegiance to IS commander Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi al-Husseini al-Qurashi for battling not only Assad's forces but also pro-democracy groups,[7] revolutionary groups such as Free Syrian Army[13] and groups opposing the Sunni/Husseini Muslims in Syria. Muhaxheri's faction was described as one that sees Syria as a country to be ruled by the Sharia law by adherence to Shahada, and in coalition with groups close to Al-Qaeda.[7] 4.2 Muhaxheri joined the Syrian War as a mujahideen in 2012, and then returned to Kosovo in 2013.[12] Muhaxheri was present at the 2013 Ramadan festival, as part of the Islamic Community of Kosova, in Kačanik, as evidenced by photographs.[12] He then returned to Syria, becoming a mujahideen leader.[12] He reports directly to IS caliph Abu al-Baghdadi, leading a platoon of ethnic Albanian fighters.[12] Muhaxheri is a link between the IS and ethnic Albanians in Albania, Kosovo, and Macedonia.[16] Some 500 ethnic Albanians from the Western Balkans fight for the IS, out of whom 232 are from Kosovo (May 2015).[16] Muhaxheri has been described as "intelligent and an experienced military strategist".[16] Both 4.1 and 4. 2 become problematic due to NVOP Avoid stating seriously contested assertions as facts due to recentism [[10]]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Systemic_bias. While article 10 states Muhaxheri as a leader article 7 and 70 doesn’t, it appoints another individual as a leader. In this case that other imams are prosecuted reported to be responsible and leaders for the group Muhaxheri was in, and that some of the indicted individuals ordered Muhaxheri through textmessages. The textmessages are taken as evidence that he’s been involved in recruitment and administration. In version 2 it’s a controversial claim about Muhaxheri reporting directly to IS caliph Abu al-Baghdadi based on ref 12’ from 2014 might be due to recentism; ‘articles overburdened with documenting controversy as it happens’ and/or ‘articles created on flimsy, transient merits.’
5. The fifth part concerns claims of events in contrast to potential libel/defamation This part concern the case of potential libel/defamation if Muhaxheri is claimed or accused of alleged crimes on footage which turns out to be of a militant with similar appearance. One also has to keep in mind that alleged beheading footage doesn’t show the entire picture of events. There’s a youtube – clip containing these two images, that is as close to a video that has been published, but the reason why one thinks that the photos are from a video could be based on the fact of reflection of a camera in one of the two images. The photo itself, is taken as a photo by someone standing next to a videocamera based on a shade of a figure of a videocamera (or something that looks like a videocamera ) a bit further to the right (left if mirrored) the individual holding a videocamera, and not from a videocamera. The second image only shows part of a head. In compare to other beheading footage, where the entire head is visualized, the intention of not showing the entire head leaves a question- mark. Based on such remarks, it’s journalists opinions that are being presented about the footage; Articles frequently take the perspective of a resident of the Northern Hemisphere and ignore the Southern Hemisphere perspective.
Aspects to review the article from wiki - guidelines; (1)natural point of view, non - judgemental language[[11]] (2) recentism/bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Systemic_bias Bias(3)defamation/libel Wikipedia:Libel Regards, KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 15:37, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
KewinRozz (talk) 09:39, 4 February 2016 (UTC) removed Rfc bottom tagKewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) KewinRozz (talk) 18:09, 20 February 2016 (UTC) |
My attempt to close the discussion has failed, see subsection Comments about previous Rfc removal below. --T*U (talk) 09:47, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
{{Rfc bottom}}
Comments about previous Rfc removal
Lengthy discussion about the proper procedure of closing an RfC
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This section "Review of article" was opened as a RfC by User:KewinRozz 1 February. It was withdrawn by the proposer 17 February in order to open a new, more specific RfC below. In order to avoid further discussion in the present thread, I closed the discussion with standard templates. For some reason I have not been able to understand, this was resented by the proposer, who removed the opening template (but not the closing template). I have painstakingly tried to explain here, but User:KewinRozz has kept on edit warring to remove the opening template. One result is that the RfC-bot is treating the closure template as a RfC template and confusingly listing the comment after the closing template as a separate RfC... I hereby give up. For the record I have nowiki-marked my attempt of closing. My apologies to everyone for not being able to explain this rather simple matter in a satisfactory way. --T*U (talk) 09:47, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
KewinRozzKewinRozz (talk) 12:30, 19 February 2016 (UTC)
I am not sure why I bother, but I will try one last time to explain this:
Are you sure that this is what you want? --T*U (talk) 14:54, 20 February 2016 (UTC)
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