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Talk:Franklinford, Victoria

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Problems with article lead

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Latest comment: 15 years ago4 comments2 people in discussion

My research shows some inconsistency's in the lead section. Janet MacDonald reports on her book Double Gold: 1870s Mining and Farming Diaries that the Site for the Loddon Protectorate Station was chosen by Chief Protector George Robinson and Parker when they traveled through the area in 1840. The site as reported by Edgar Morrison in Frontier Life in the Loddon Protectorate was previously an outstation of A.F. Mollisons Coliban Run. There was already a shepherds hut there which formed the nucleus of the homestead Parker erected. Further down in the article Jim Crow Creek is mentioned as being known as Jumcra to the Dja Dja Wurrung? Norm Darwin reports that it was Mollison who named the new run that his shepherds had established, as Jumcra because he wanted to Australianise it from Jim Crow which had been the name the Shepherds were using. A reference from Morrison indicates that it was John Hepburn (who had established the Smeaton Hill Run in 1838) who was responsible for the initial naming of Jim Crow as a story is given of Capt Bacchus riding between Lalgambook (Mount Franklin) and Kooroocheang when he called to his companion (Hepburn) and said, "What do you think we should call these ranges?" Hepburn replied, "Call them Jim Crow" It is thought because of a popular song at the time with a chorus: "Wheel about and turn about and do just so, Turn about and wheel about and jump Jim Crow." The Jim Crow creek winds through the ranges pretty much as the song suggests. Also note the article says the local aboriginals called the Protectorate Station "Lalgambook". This was the name Morrison recorded as the name for the nearby Mount Franklin. Franklinford was actually known as Larne-ne-barramul which means "Habitat of the emu. There is a lagoon 500 yards west of the station with that name. Also I should note that Parker had initially thought that the Jim Crow creek (as many travelling towards the East in those early days before maps had thought) was the upper Loddon. A sketched map by Parker from those times shows his mistake. The creek was also know by various other names including West Loddon. Anyhow, I'm raving on but we might need to tweak a few things around and add some references to sort out the inconsistencies? --Sting Buzz Me... 12:38, 27 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

Definitely a few issues here. Lets take them one by one to sort them out.

  • 1. Who selected the placement of the Protectorate Station? - This seems like a definite conflict of sources. Bain Attword in My Country says that the first site chosen was at Bet Bet creek - but the land was too dry so in Jan 1841 decided to move to a better place. The Dja Dja Wurrung "played a role in choosing the reserve (along with Crown Lands Commissioner Frederick Powlett) by indicating their decided preference for the site.... a large number of Dja Dja Wurrung accompanied Parker there in June 1841 when he established the station after approval was given in March" referenced in Parker Quarterly report 1 June - 31 Aug 1841, PROVic, VPRS 10/3, file 41/207. As this references Parker's report I would tend to favour this account than Janet MacDonald's account.
  • 2. The Protectorate site was previously an outstation of A.F. Mollisons Coliban Run. Attword mentions this in passing and says there is no evidence that Mollison opposed the establishment of the Protectorate or the requisitioning of the land from his run for this purpose. I suggest we use Edgar Morrison, Frontier Life in the Loddon Protectorate as a reference.
  • 3. Jim Crow Creek - name derivation, what it was called by the Dja Dja Wurrung. This is unreferenced in the article. I think I picked it up in my internet searches that the Dja Dja Wurrung called it Jimcra ... maybe from here. Norm Darwin's account seems much more accurate. I think we drop the text in parentheses, unless we can source what the Dja Dja Wurrung actually called it.
  • 4. What term the Dja Dja Wurrung used for the Protectorate station. Bain Attwood on pp26 says "Loddon Aboriginal Protectorate Station at Franklinford; the Dja Dja Wurrung called it Lalgambook." When you say "Franklinford was actually known as Larne-ne-barramul which means 'Habitat of the emu'." do you have a reference for this? Maybe it was generally known as Lalgambook, with a more specific name of Larne-ne-barramul? but I'm starting to conjecture....--Takver (talk) 18:31, 27 December 2008 (UTC)Reply
I have made a couple of tweaks to the article. Points 1 & 2 I did as one edit using the Attwood ref. Point 3 I deleted the text. Point 4 I left as Lalgambook as it is sourced (although the source might be incorrect) Maybe we can put an additional explanation that Lalgambook refers to Mount Franklin and Franklinford was called Larne-ne-barramul, but a source for this would be useful. If you want to add the story on the naming of Jim Crow creek, please do. I don't have a problem with adding that account and reference.--Takver (talk) 18:55, 27 December 2008 (UTC)Reply
Yeah I'm happy with what you've done but I'm pretty sure Lalgambook is the name for Mount Franklin. Parker was pretty conversant in the Jajowurrong (his spelling) language. In Frontier Life in the Loddon Protectorate there are many of the tribes words put into print. Even a lecture given by Parker on "The Aborigines of Australia" to the John Knox Young Men's Association in the Mechanics Hall in Melbourne includes a nearly literal translation of the cxxxix Psalm in Jajowurrong. Nearly literal as he had to leave out verses 5 and 6. He didn't explain why but I read elsewhere in the book that the Jajowurrong had no words for giving thanks i.e. no word for thank you as they had no need for it. Also the supreme being was replaced with "Marmingorak" i.e. "Father of all" as they had no actual word for God. Anyhow, I'm raving on and it is late here. Morrison references Lalgambook as Mount Franklin. I see also that a Parkweb website has a mention of Mount Franklin and also says the Jajowurrong name for the Mount was Lalgambook. The site uses Parkers spelling. here. I have one of Atwoods books here "Telling the truth about aboriginal history" It was a boring piece of crap to read. I wasn't a fan of his writing style and a lot of it seemed cut and pasted together and filled in with a lot of his original thoughts (he references himself). I don't know about any of his other works so can't say until I see them.--Sting Buzz Me... 12:51, 28 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

Nightfall on the Central Highlands

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Latest comment: 15 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

There is a poem in Edgar Morrisons Frontier Life in the Loddon Protectorate that I think I should reproduce here.

"Once, I in fancy, walked along
Beside a dark Jajowurrong
Who, on a summer evening cool,
Strode on to Lar-ne-barramul.

There to the mountain-tops he took
To Moorootah and Lalgambook,
Where to the west his eyes took wing
To Kobratang (or Koorootyng).

Still further west, he saw the while,
The rounded dome of Moorookyle
Then northward where blue ranges tower,
Surmounted by bold Tarrengower.

North-eastward over hill and brook
He could descry Leanganook.
(Which Mitchell to his lasting shame,
Called by a Grecian monarch's name).

He saw the heights of Terrawait
Through eastern ranges penetrate;
He saw the darkening forests throng
The lifted head of Myrniong.

By faith alone, beyond the gloom,
He saw two other mountains loom.
Bold Buninyong lay there asleep
Watched by the mighty Warrenheip.

Then darkness blotted out the view
Until the day should dawn anew.
But hidden by eternal light.
Our dusky friend goes out of sight.

His people long have ceased to roam
The forests of their inland home,
And those who came - for wealth or fame,
Too often scorned the native name.

Will those who cherish things of yore
Those ancient names again restore?
Lest all forget, will YOU make sure
That their rich cadences endure?"

There is a Glossary.

  • "Jajowurrong - Tribal name of Loddon Valley aboriginals
  • Larne-ne-barramul - Habitat of the emu (Franklinford)
  • Moorootah, Lalgambook signify Mt. Stewart and Mt. Franklin (i.e. there to the mountain tops. Some people refer to Mount Stewart as "Lady Franklin")
  • Leanganook - native name of Mt. Alexander
  • Kobratang, Koorootyng - varients of Kooroocheang
  • Terrawait - signifies Mt. Macedon
  • Myrniong - aboriginal name for stone shelter applied by them to Mt. Blackwood
  • Buninyong - in native parlance denotes a recumbent figure with knees drawn up. When view from the north, this name is most apt.
  • Kooroocheang, Moorookyle, Tarrengower, Warrenheip - current names of aboriginal origin applied to notable peaks in the central highlands."

Now if you take a drive to Mount Franklin and go up on top, you should be able to see all those peaks on a clear day? Unless the tree cover has grown too much? I haven't been back there for many years. I'm pretty sure you can't see all those peaks from down at Franklinford (Larne-ne-barramul) but you should see the lagoon and the plaque for the old school and cairn for Parkers Loddon Aboriginal Station? If someone is handy with a camera, a few pictures would be handy for use in these articles.--Sting Buzz Me... 04:11, 29 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

I love the poem, and the glossary is useful. I think the poem may still be in copyright, Morrison died in 1971, otherwise I would advocate including it in wikisource with a link from Franklinford, Victoria and Dja Dja Wurrung. I am more inclined to think Bain Attwood was not accurate that the Protectorate Station was called Lalgambook by the Dja Dja Wurrung. I am happy to change it to Larne-ne-barramul and use the reference as: Edgar Morrison, Edgar, Frontier life in the Loddon Protectorate : episodes from early days, 1837-1842, Daylesford [Vic.], The Advocate, 1967?. No ISBN I love the central highlands - the few times I have visited - I might try to do a trip in February to take some photos.--Takver (talk) 06:49, 29 December 2008 (UTC)Reply

Thanks for straightening up that poem. I love the poem too. I lived in Daylesford and worked in Castlemaine for several years. I remember some mornings driving past the mount and there would be a heavy mist (fog) laying in the valleys. The mountain tops would all be floating in a silver sea of fog just like islands. I too love the central highlands, but Brissy is my home for now. I'm happy with the work you have done to the article. Wikipedia is lucky to have such a skilled editor as yourself on board. I liked that image you added. I hadn't seen that one before. I think Tommy Farmer is on the left? I'll get back down that way again some time myself hopefully.--Sting Buzz Me... 12:13, 29 December 2008 (UTC)Reply
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Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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