Talk:Flight Pattern/GA1

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewer: Amitchell125 (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

Happy to review the article. AM

Review comments

Lead section / infobox

• Link act (Act (drama)); critics; choreography; narrative is non-linear (Nonlinear narrative); tension (Suspense).

• I linked non-linear and tension. The rest I do not want to link because they are common enough words that the average reader will be able to understand without the link, per MOS:OVERLINK. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Understood, but please note that linking is not just about uncommon words, but can be used to "increase readers' understanding of the topic" (see WP:LINK). In view of this I would certain considering linking choreography, a key term in this article. Amitchell125 (talk) 17:33, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

I agree with your thoughts about choreography, and have wikilinked it. Z1720 (talk) 18:06, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, Z1720. AM

• Introduce Crystal Pite; Marcelino Sambé; Kristen McNally (here and where they first appear in the main article).

• I don't know what you mean by "introduce". The Pite and Sambe are wikilinked, and their roles as choreographer and dancers are mentioned. I think any additional information about them would be off-topic. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

My apologies for not being clearer, I would for instance amend a one-act contemporary ballet by Crystal Pite to something like 'a one-act contemporary ballet by the Canadian choreographer and dancer Crystal Pite'. It shouldn't be necessary for readers to use links or have to read on so as to work out who a person is. This is particularly true in the lead section, which "may be the only portion of the article that [someone reads]". (see WP:LEAD). Amitchell125 (talk) 17:41, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Added that Pite is a Canadian choreographer. I don't want to put dancer here because I do not think she is performing anymore at this time (choreographer is her current occupation, dancer would be a previous occupation). Added "dancers" before Sambe and McNally's names.

• The ballet won the Laurence Olivier Award for Best New Dance Production – I would add the year.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Add a comma after Light of Passage.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• queues – I would elaborate on this a bit to ensure readers are clear about what is being referred to here, as queueing is not generally associated with ballet dancing.

• I put "formations of queues" and wikilinked queue to help explain this.

• Consider incorporating an image within the infobox (I can help upload a non-free image if you wish).

• I have uploaded an image, please look to see that the licencing is correct. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

It looks fine to me. AM

• Consider red-linking Light of Passage, as a work that could be considered to be notable in its right.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

1 Choreography

• The external video is an excerpt (this should be made clear).

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:38, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• It is generally good practice for a link to appear whenever it first appears in a section (MOS:REPEATLINK), so the links made in the lead should reappear in the main text (i.e. in this section, and other link elsewhere): act; ballet; choreography; Pite (with her full name).

• Introduced Crystal Pite, using full name and wikilink. The others I think are common enough words that they won't need wikilinks. Z1720 (talk) 16:38, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks (I would link choreography though, see above).

Done, per above. Z1720 (talk) 18:11, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Link Marcelino Sambé (in the caption); crescendo.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:38, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

2 Development

• Link Crystal Pite (in the caption); motif (presumably Motif (narrative)).

• Done

• Introduce Lucía Piquero Álvarez.

• Done

• Nancy Bryant; Jay Gower Taylor; Tom Visser – are these individuals notable enough to mentioned here?

• Since they were part of the production of the piece, I felt they should be mentioned. There are no FAs in dance productions, so I used film FAs as templates for the article structure; they often include various production credits and since Flight Pattern has so few, I included everyone that I could cite as involved in the production. Z1720 (talk) 16:50, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Understood. AM

3 Performances

• Introduce Sidi Larbi Cherkaoui.

• I think including information about Cherkaoui would be off-topic. He's wikilinked and I think it's clear that its referring to a piece that he created. Z1720 (talk) 16:53, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

I disagree, please see comment above about introducing. Amitchell125 (talk) 17:54, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

I added "choreographer" before Cherkaoui. Z1720 (talk) 18:13, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• It finished its original run – ‘Flight Pattern finished its original run’, for the sake of clarity.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:53, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Christopher Wheeldon’s Within the Golden Hour – ‘Wheeldon’s Within the Golden Hour’.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 16:53, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

4 Critical reviews

• Link repertoire.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Evening Standard is in italics.

• Done Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Her choreography – ‘Pite’s choreography’.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• described by reviewers as beautiful and a masterful showcase of ensemble choreography – as not all reviewers described the work in this way, I would put the words by Watts and Schabas in quote marks, and name them.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• and avoided – the text needs to be amended here, as it reads as if the reviewers did this, not the work.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• Sambé and McNally's performances were positively highlighted by reviewers – the citations don’t verify the text here, they only give two examples of positive reviews. The text should, I think, reflect this.

• I removed the sentence, as I think the subsequent sentences give more specific detail about reviewer's comments on Sambe and McNally's performances.

• Sambé's performance was called emotionally powerful - why emotionally? Neither of the sources use this word. Consider modifying to something like ‘Sambé's performance was called powerful by some reviewers’.

• I changed the sentence to put Watts's comments in quotes.

• while reviewers praised – ‘whilst other reviewers praised’?

• Done Z1720 (talk) 17:22, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

More comments to follow shortly. AM

5 Themes and analysis

• I’m unclear why the first paragraph appears here, so late in the article. Consider moving it up, perhaps to the top of the article, under the title ‘Theme’.

• I looked through some FAs on theatrical productions, and sections such as "Theme" and "Critical analysis" usually appear later in the article. I put the Theme after Development because I think it was easier for the reader to understand, and chronologically accurate, to explain Pite's influence in creating the piece before the critical analysis. Perhaps "Themes" should be placed before "Critical reviews"? Z1720 (talk) 17:33, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Understood—there's no hard and fast rule here (applying them is in part what GA reviews are about). I would move it up to where you suggest, though.

I swapped "Themes" and "Reviews", mostly because I think reviews should proceed the "Awards" section. Z1720 (talk) 18:15, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• The text of the second paragraph belongs within the choreography Section.

• Agreed. Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:33, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

7.1 Citations

• As Ref 18 (Financial Times) cannot be accessed without subscribing, consider adding 'url-access=subscription'.

• Done, and did the same for New York Times. Z1720 (talk) 17:40, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Many thanks. AM

7.2 Works cited

• The Oxford handbook of contemporary ballet - ‘ The Oxford Handbook of Contemporary Ballet’.

• Done. Z1720 (talk) 17:41, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

8 External links

• The external link doesn’t lead to any information about the work, and so should not appear here. There is an external link to the work from this website (found when a search is made, but it is a subscription only link, and so this should not be used either (WP:LINKSTOAVOID).

• Removed. Z1720 (talk) 17:42, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

On hold

I'm putting the article on hold for a week until 15 August to allow time for the issues raised to be addressed. Regards, Amitchell125 (talk) 14:18, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

• @Amitchell125: Comments above. Z1720 (talk) 17:42, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Passing

Passing the article now, many thanks for all your work, and for introducing me to a great example of contemporary ballet. Amitchell125 (talk) 18:16, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.