Talk:Advance Wars: Dual Strike/Archive 1

AW DS 2

its was at e3 but theres no page.

From VfD

This merely says that a game with this title will be released by Nintendo next year. It does say that Nintendo says nothing else about it, it doesn't manage to present any other information specific to the new product. Now, while I don't see why every commercial product with a fanbase deserves its own page, I do understand that there are arguments for this that aren't necessarily absurd. I can also understand that a long-expected and long-discussed product of some importance that doesn't yet actually exist (e.g. Microsoft's "Longhorn") might deserve an article. But there's no sign that this as-yet non-existent game is in any way significant. Thus it's not notable; delete. Hoary 08:27, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)

• Delete, cf. Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Mobile Suit Gundam Seed DS. --fvw* 11:17, 2004 Nov 26 (UTC)
• Delete: Speculation, nothing exists yet. (I hope it's a game where you write the new screenplay about a dyslexic hobo (Robert Redford) who meets a lonely housewife with a wooden leg (Meryl Streep) and a disabled child (Leo) and then have the studios war over who can offer the best advance.) Geogre 14:12, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)
  • I've played that. It sucks. --fvw*
• Redirect to Advance Wars. I doubt that the DS sequel/remake/whatever will be so distinctive as to merit its own article. -Sean Curtin 03:16, Nov 27, 2004 (UTC)
• Keep: The article isn't speculation. Nintendo has released an initial batch of screenshots that show off a handful of new features, as well as revealing several elements present in past iterations of the franchise. Inclusion of one of these screens and a listing of what is new in this sequel would make it a more than suitable stub. Shouldn't be FWD'd to Advance Wars entry, as the DS sequel is confirmed to include greatly expanded functionality, thanks to the DS's two screens.
• Delete - non-notable - Drstuey 09:40, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)
• Keep. Game is announced and has had screenshots released, and is part of a major video game series. Note The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap, which was created in advance of the game's Japanese release, Prince of Persia: Warrior Within, which has been in existence since September despite the game not coming out for another week, Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas, which has been around since March (The game came out in October), and the much of Category:Unreleased albums. And let's not forget such pages as Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince and, more to the point, Harry Potter: Book Seven. And, just to complete the run, let's go with Law and Order: Trial by Jury to get our non-existant television shows in, and Serenity (movie) for our movies. Which is to say that the fact that a product is not released yet does not seem to be grounds for deletion. Snowspinner 18:09, Nov 27, 2004 (UTC)
• Snowspinner makes some very compelling arguments here. I've been silently abstaining for some time but based on his comments am giving this an extreme keep. —[[User:Radman1|RaD Man (talk)]] 20:31, 27 Nov 2004 (UTC)
• Keep. Andre (talk) 03:42, Nov 28, 2004 (UTC)
• Delete for now. Let the game come out and be a hit before deciding to write an article about it. Rossami (talk) 23:18, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)
  • And be a hit??? That's the most absurdly limiting criteria I've heard on VfD in some time. Wikipedia is not paper. We can at the very least, I would hope, have articles on games that are not hits. Snowspinner 23:26, Nov 29, 2004 (UTC)
    • Comment: No, it's a fairly standard criteria that the community applies to many topics in order to ensure that they can reliably be kept verifiable and NPOV. This is fundamentally the same standard which leads us to delete personal vanity articles, CDs by garage bands, individual buildings which show no cultural or historical significance, blogs, etc. I'm not arguing that the game must become a best-seller. We set the bar quite low. But it ought to have some impact before it gets an encyclopedia article. Rossami (talk)
      • Surely being part of an already successful video game series achieves those criteria. I mean, it's not as though one releases a console game out of one's garage. The market is still small enough that a released game for a console is notable on its own, simply because the costs of development dissuade people who would make non-notable games from trying. But really... do you actually know anything about the Advance Wars series? Snowspinner 18:09, Dec 1, 2004 (UTC)
• Marginal keep. --[[User:GRider|GRider\^talk]] 18:10, 30 Nov 2004 (UTC)
• Keep — User:Goosey 08:40 Dec 2 2004 (UTC)

end moved discussion

Expansion

I added a new section on Gameplay and on the new Combat mode, as well as the transmitable demos. I based all this writing solely on what I know about the game; I based the Combat and Demo sections on the demo I have on my DS. Someone who owns the game could probably expand more on this. Also, that list of new features restates some information I wrote, so some of it may need to be filtered out (plus, half the article is a big list). --gakon⁵ (talk)

I plan to work on this more over the coming months as I progress in the game and I will try to upload CO pics and such, for now I have reorganized some parts of the article so I hope it flows better, Derktar 02:41, September 7, 2005 (UTC).

Great, although if you're thinking of a long list of COs, it's not worth it, and probably not a good thing to do. Also, I'm trying to figure out which of those four lists I should move; I think the New Units can stay, although I'm skeptical about the others. Because, people probably won't come to this article and say, "Oh, this COs power is reduced 50%, but his accuracy is up 29.34%." -- gakon⁵ (talk)

Well I was going to go with a character table or something from the original Advance Wars article but instead I might just upload images of the new COs. Derktar 01:45, September 9, 2005 (UTC).

If you plan to make a table with CO stats and stuff, put it on a Wikibooks module (probably called Advance Wars: Dual Strike of course). -- gakon⁵ (talk)

---

This article has been the target of vandalism by several IPs now >_< Anyways, I've expanded the article once more. First off, I've added a new section for the various game modes in AWDS; second, I removed the CO differences section; it's Wikibooks material, and could be transfered to a module for this game over there some time. I also removed the Game Differences section, as most all of it's contents are elsewhere in the article now. Lastly, I uploaded a screenshot to go with all that new text. Hope this was worthwhile... gakon⁵ (talk) 23:28, 28 September 2005 (UTC) (also, I think it's safe to say we can remove the Cleanup tag; does anyone else agree?)

Clean Up

This article was on the clean up list, so I took a stab at it. I reformatted many of the entries under "gameplay" and tried to take out some of the things that made it sound more like a FAQ or guide than an encylopedia entry. I'm still not sure if we need all of these detailed lists. I'm unsure about the list of reviews/ratings as well, does anyone have a good reason why they are there? This still needs a lot of work to make it an encyclopedia article rather than a FAQ, but hopefully this is a start. BCampbell 16:47, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for cleaning up the Gameplay section; after I finished writing that I realised it was pretty unorganised. I think I'm going to remove the entire secrets section, as well as the CO Changes and Gameplay Differences section. New Units can stay, and I think New COs could stay as well. -- gakon⁵ (talk)

Wars character articles.

Anyone wanna set up some articles and templates for the Wars characters? - A Link to the Past (talk) 05:16, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

I have little knowlege concerning Wars characters (do you mean COs?); but I'm wondering do you mean to make one for each character, or a page to talk about them all? And making a Wars template wouldn't be a bad idea, although some articles for Wars games don't exsist and most of 'em are underdeveloped. -- gakon⁵ (talk)

I will see if I can create a template for CO characters. That way, every AW character would have a Wikipedia page, where it would be easier to explain the different changes they may have suffered between versions. -- ReyBrujo 00:36, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

Actually, there should be three templates, one for each AW, as there are some caracteristics that are not shared (in example, COs had only one Power in AW --I think--, there are affiliations in AW:DS --the Tag level depending on how well each character carries on--, etc). The question is, which template to use if a character was in more than one game? -- ReyBrujo 00:51, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

Statistics (CO stats and the like) are not suitable for Wikipedia (see WP:NOT); it'd be better to move the stuff to Wikibooks. -- gakon⁵ (talk)

Basic information should be CO powers, description of the character's personality, history and appearance, specialty, and acts in each game in the series. - A Link to the Past (talk) 22:37, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

So far, the following articles have been made:

Lord Sturm

Flak (Advance Wars)

Lash (Advance Wars)

Adder (Advance Wars)

Hachi

Feel free to improve upon these as you wish. - A Link to the Past (talk) 08:24, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

Interaction with AW/AW2 GBA cartridges

When you start the console with AW:DS, and the GBA slot has the AW or AW2 cartridge, you get a couple of bonuses. In example, when you play with AW2 plugged in, you get Sturm's Land and Lash's Land maps, and Advance Warpaper 2 wallpaper. If anyone is able to check the maps and wallpaper with AW, maybe we could add the information as an "Extra" section. -- ReyBrujo 02:05, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

You get two maps, 'Hachi's Land' and 'Nell's Land' and an Advance Wars wallpaper if you start a AW:DS game with AW in the DS's GBA slot.Geoff B 06:32, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Sales Data

Sales figures are the last thing I want before I put this on FAC. Any hints? No idea where to find stuff like that >_> -- gakon⁵ (talk)

From what I read, AW:DS sold poorly in Japan, 11,930 units on launching [1]. Hard to get numbers, unless you contact I.S. directly. -- ReyBrujo 16:29, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

That's what I guessed; nothing on the scale of Nintendogs. -- gakon⁵ (talk)

They still have to be mentioned.

Additionally, this isn't ready for FAC - I've gone over the article, and I've been cleaning up a huge load of stuff. There isn't even any word on the story. - A Link to the Past (talk) 22:57, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

Well, admittedly, I don't even own the game yet >_> I plan to buy it in the next week though, and I'll probably spend the entire day playing through the campaign (which I hear is easy). -- gakon⁵ (talk)

I am currently stuck at mision 22, trying to get a S but having some troubles. I have spent so much time in this mission (and with the Warroom) that I forgot most of the story. -- ReyBrujo 22:46, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Dread?

I removed the following from the article:

Dread(Sturm's Dad), to unlock complete hard campain with a overall S rank. All his units have 130% attack and defence. His other abilities are the same as Sturms, yet his super power takes 3 more stars and covers 2 more squares around the edges.

Can anyone verify this, with a link or otherwise? I am currently playing Mario Kart DS, and are stuck in the AW:DS hard campaign at stage 7. -- ReyBrujo 16:17, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

This supposed character doesn't exist, you were right to take it out. - Ultravisitor 17:15, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Story

A plot line needs to be added to the article. I'd add it myself, but I'm not finished with the game. The Republican 02:35, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

I finished the game a while ago, but I don't really know how to put it. The Republican 02:58, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Well, I finally got ahold of the script from GameFAQs and hacked out a story from the script. Please clean up and fix as you see fit. - Hbdragon88 05:43, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Merge

Advanced Wars: Dual Strike is merely a typo, and should therefore be merged here. --日本穣 Nihonjoe 19:31, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Sales Figures and references.

Does anybody know where to find these? It's the one thing holding this article back... - Malomeat 00:20, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

I've tried emailing various Nintendo offices, and got nothing. Geoff B 20:19, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, but that is original research, and cannot be included in Wikipedia. -- ReyBrujo 22:08, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Research Labs

The article states that Research Labs are new to Dual Strike, but they were in AW2 as well. I don't have AW1, so I don't know whether they were in AW1. Either way it needs editing. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.77.237.179 (talk • contribs) .

Sure, feel free to edit that at will. -- ReyBrujo 19:04, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

External links

In response to your edit summary, ReyBrujo, if we do not give the reasons why that site is included, then it sounds even more like advertising. Additionally, without the justification for inclusion, we merely look like we are being favoritist towards one site. The reason Advance Wars Net is being left up is because it is the oldest and presently the largest, shouldn't we say that's why? --tjstrf 15:44, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Weasel words and peacock terms apply to all the article, including external links. Note that there are suggestions, including #5, where it states Adding a link that's snazzier than any of the others. If there's a list of products that gives just their names, and you add a product with a short blurb about how great it is, we'll all know why you did it. Unluckily my summary was cut before finished, I was meaning that having an external link referenced as "the oldest" invites others to add their own links as their sites are "the most visited", "the most linked", "the most populated", "the most amount of articles", etc. Stating that it is the "largest" is a point of view, either by an editor or by the site itself. What are you measuring? As I explained in your talk page,^[2] it doesn't have the most posts (awbunker.com), nor the most amount of members (awbw.amarriner.com). There is no exact way of measuring amount of downloadable content, articles, etc, nor we are expected to do that. Anyone wanting to add his or her link can be pointed here for more information. -- ReyBrujo 15:58, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

The "largest" was based on outdated information (collected 3 months ago) about the forums. Honest mistake there. Well, I guess I'll leave it as is. --tjstrf 16:09, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

No harm done. The bad thing about such words ("largest", "biggest", "most active", etc) is that they are based in a "snapshot" ("today we are the biggest"), while Wikipedia articles should be timeless (that is, there should be no need of continously checking whether the "snapshot" is still accurate or not). -- ReyBrujo 16:14, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

The choice to leave only Advance Wars Net as an unofficial was dubious and not explained. Thus, until suitable reasoning can be given for including only it, the "tidy up" is unnecessary. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Smiles Aloud (talk • contribs) .

Huh, wow, so that's what "Peacock Terms" are all about. Alright, I'll apologize for writing this page with that stuff; I would go through the article to remove-fix all instances of weasel words and peacock terms, if I had the time right now. Don't hesitate to do it for me, then! By the way, when I wrote the page, I did not own Dual Strike, so I think it was a bit of an instinct to use these terms when writing. As for the external links section issue, I know A Man In Black's opinion is that there shouldn't be external links if the content of the article can be referenced in citation style in a link's place. Erik Jensen ^{(I appreciate talk!)} 22:18, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Sequel?

Any word on a sequel to this game? --pie4all88 05:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, no. If there were, a link to a source confirming that would be posted on this page right away. Erik Jensen ^{(I appreciate talk!)} 05:54, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Game Status

This game is no longer being sold officially. It's hard to come by now unless you buy off ebay.--Shawn 08:16, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Unless you can find a source establishing the game is discontinued, we can't add that information to the article. -- ReyBrujo 16:49, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Check out this link from Amazon... it lists it as having been discontinuted by the manufacturer: http://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-PS2-ACT-81033-Advance/dp/B0009XEC02 --Shawn 08:16, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Can somebody change the AWDS page to reflect this? I'm not sure how to go ahead with it. I provided a link and if you look it up on Google you can find a bunch more which say AWDS is discontinued.--Shawn 21:55, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't even know if WP includes info like that in articles, TBH. I have yet to see a game article that notes that the subject has been discontinued. Geoff B 01:05, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Well I'd say it's relevant, since this is a relatively recent release. Smiles Aloud 19:15, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I think it's relevant since it's a game that you'd expect not to have been discontinued.I for one wouldn't have spent hours looking for it at the mall if the article had mentioned it was discontinued.--Shawn 07:46, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Names of COs

I think it should say somewhere that the names for Cos stated are not the same as the European ones. It confused me slightly as an Englisg gamer when I read the article. 86.128.229.76 21:17, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

It does on List of Advance Wars COs. --tjstrf talk 00:07, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

black hole

The black hole symbol looks like the nazi swastika, should this be put in?

Answer: No it shouldn't. Because:

1.The army of Green Earth represents German forces. This point is widely accepted around the AW players.

2.The Black Hole symbol, as the name suggests, represents a black hole. Fetch a magnifing glass and see. While the nazi symbol consists of STRAIGHT LINES only, the Black Hole one consists of SOLID SHAPES. Also the angle of view is different.

!D  Actually I am named BNJ representing Benjamin Jones. But that name is occupied. 10:33, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

oozium

oozium-238 sounds a lot like uranium-238 and looks top simular to be a coincicence

That's original research, unless you have a source, so no, neither of these things should be put in, and have already been removed from the article previously, IIRC. Geoff B 11:17, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Sequel

[3] - A Link to the Past (talk) 23:13, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Sweet. Too bad it seems to have the same name as the second GBA game for the moment... I would wager that an article on this sequel should be created once its non-working title is provided by an official source. Erik Jensen ^{(Appreciate|Laugh At)} 18:01, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Sequel screens and video

[4]

[5] - A Link to the Past (talk) 02:48, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Deleted

Hey! Someone deleted the Co's character list! Why? Is it because Dark Conflict has a new cast of Co's because it hasn't been announced that the original Co's are not returning and now it's harder then ever to collect data on them. Or is it because Wikipedia now deletes any files that become "old". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.165.20.50 (talk) 10:08, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

The reason it was deleted was because it did not meet the notability guidelines. <3 bunny 02:57, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

So then why wasn't it merged? Now there's no mention of some characters who played major roles! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.220.35.177 (talk) 10:33, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Game's cover

Can someone add the game's cover to the top right? Looks very empty without it! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.133.162.109 (talk) 16:51, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Hi, done! Megata Sanshiro (talk) 13:31, 4 July 2008 (UTC)