Draft talk:Yehezkel Nisanov

Contested deletion

This article should not be deleted. Nisanov has a page on the Hebrew Wikipedia and the fact that he was member of Hashomer, involved in russian politics and the early zionist movement makes him a notable person.

@User:DutchPatriot “Involved in russian politics and the early zionist movement makes him a notable person.”? Read WP:POLITICIAN, before making these claims. There are no much reliable secondary sources available about this person which can buid notablity, read WP:GNG. Grabup (talk) 17:17, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Why would it be allowed to create a hebrew page but not an english one? DutchPatriot (talk) 17:27, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

@DutchPatriot, Hebrew Wikipedia is different from English Wikipedia, the rules guidelines and all. Isn’t it?@Yeheskel Nisa? Why you removed the tag? There is no secondary sources which build WP:GNG to the subject? Grabup (talk) 17:32, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

There seems to be some secondary sources, and I moved the "claim of notability" to the lead from the life section. It may not be the most notable person ever but there seems to be reliable secondary sources on the subject, so putting an A7 tag right away seems a little extreme. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 17:34, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Can you please share some secondary reliable sources here, I can’t see it. Grabup (talk) 17:39, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Well I don't see why the two secondary reliable sources used in the article don't count.

• [1] (in hebrew)
• [2]

Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 17:43, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

@Flemmish Nietzsche, The first one is a Israeli government website! How can you think it is a secondary source? It a primary source, The Israeli government site will obviously prays him as the subject is connected to Israel. Also, you can read WP:PRIMARY, which says “ Primary sources are original materials that are close to an event, and are often accounts written by people who are directly involved. They offer an insider's view of an event, a period of history, a work of art, a political decision, and so on. Primary sources may or may not be independent sources. An account of a traffic incident written by a witness is a primary source of information about the event; similarly, a scientific paper documenting a new experiment conducted by the author is a primary source for the outcome of that experiment. For Wikipedia's purposes, breaking news stories are also considered to be primary sources. Historical documents such as diaries are as well.”

And the second article is not looking as a reliable source at all. Also, the source does not icluded any editorial details, how can we rely on this source? Grabup (talk) 17:56, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

I am aware what primary sources are. I was not initially aware the first source was an Israeli government website — I do not know Hebrew and just assumed from the name it was not affiliated with the government.

However, my point wasn't really that these are great sources but rather that nominating the article for A7 SD is a little extreme for what is appropriately dealt with as a WP:DRAFTIFY, the point being to "allow time and space for the draft's improvement until it is ready for mainspace." This article can accumulate reliable and secondary sources if is is not deleted right away, where I feel A7 should be used only when there is no sources or there is obviously no importance of the subject. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 18:01, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Yes, draftify can be done. But for now the article is not ready for main space. Grabup (talk) 18:04, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

 Done Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 18:04, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Wdym “it’s different”? If there is a Wikipedia page about him, that means he was more or less important to the early Zionist movement. Especially when there are multiple sources about him. DutchPatriot (talk) 17:36, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

In my opinion this article should be given a chance to grow to mainspace standards. The subject is mentioned in many sources. I found six on my computer before searching online, though only two were more than passing references. To editor DutchPatriot: you should start all of your new articles in draft space, as so far none of them have been ready for mainspace in their initial versions. Zero^talk 05:45, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

To editor DutchPatriot: Another thing, we don't do memorials. When you write articles about people you have to take care that it has a dispassionate voice and doesn't sound like a funeral speech. Zero^talk 05:50, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

I didn't add the "death" part DutchPatriot (talk) 12:40, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

I created that section and I wasn't referring to it. I was just giving you general advice. As you know, most of the sources on people like this are full of effusive praise. My point is: stick to the facts even though they are harder to find. Zero^talk 13:40, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

Ok DutchPatriot (talk) 15:14, 22 April 2024 (UTC)