Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates/Chrisye/archive1

• Resolved comments of Mark Arsten (talk)
• Comments: I read over this a month or two back, but I'll take another look. I see we're using British English on it now, but keeping the serial comma.
• I was under the impression that we don't usually link the names of countries now, or am I mistaken? (Indonesia is linked in the lead).

• Removed

• "While Chrisye was in Senior High School PSKD Menteng, Beatlemania reached Indonesia.[6] Responding to Chrisye's desire to play music," Was his desire to play music prompted by Beatlemania?

• Changed

• ", with Chrisye performing the vocals." There's the WP:PLUSING construction, maybe try a semicolon instead?

• Changed to "with vocals by Chrisye."

• Try to be consistent with comma usage when starting sentences with time periods, I see "In 1968,..." and then "In 1969... (no comma)" in the next paragraph. I think no comma is generally preferred in British English, and of course the opposite is true of American English.

• Removed commas deemed unnecessary.

• "to fulfill his father's wishes and become an engineer." Was his father's wish that he go to University or become an engineer?

• His wishes were that Chrisye go to university and study engineering, then become an engineer.

• You start three paragraphs in a row with "In..." in the Band member and early projects, maybe try to vary that a bit more.

Changed.

• From the image caption: "He kept his long hair for the majority of his career, until chemotherapy led to him losing it." Is it just me, or does that sound a bit awkward?

Changed to "His long hair was a mainstay of his appearance for the majority of his career." Hoping that's a bit better.

Scratch that, I prefer Malleus' wording. Crisco 1492 (talk) 03:01, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• "The song then took off, receiving much airplay;[21][23] the album itself was the best-selling album of the year." Maybe remove "itself" here?

Done

• This is a bit off of the FA criteria here, but I'm curious about the translation "Chrisye later described the album as selling "as warmly as chicken shit"". When translating, how do you decide when to translate a word as "shit" vs all the other synonyms?

• "Tahi" is a bit ruder and has more negative connotations than other words for feces, such as "kotoran", "air besar", "tinja", "e'e" (childish word for it), and English-based terms such as "feses". For example, a common insult is "tahi (or tai) lu", which is slang for "your shit". To convey the meaning as best as I could, I chose a word which is rough around the edges and has fairly negative connotations.

• Interesting, thanks for filling me in. Mark Arsten (talk) 03:09, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• The prose looks great thus far, your writing has really improved since I last read your work :) I made some small copyedits, hopefully I didn't introduce any errors. Mark Arsten (talk) 01:57, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Big thanks to Malleus for that; he trimmed excess prose with a vengeance. You did introduce a small error, but I've fixed it. Thanks for the input! Crisco 1492 (talk) 02:58, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

  I do, on the basis that less is more; every word needs to justify its inclusion. Malleus Fatuorum 03:07, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

  Until Jimbo starts paying us by the word, anyway. Mark Arsten (talk) 03:09, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Mark Arsten continued "disillusioned with the Protestant Church." What do you think about just saying "Christianity" here?

• Done

• "collaborated again on Nona (Miss), which was full of social criticism;" Maybe briefly say what the focus of the social criticism was here?

• Source does not say, it only says "... tahun 1984 saya kembali menelurkan album, bertajuk Nona. Album ini makin kental dengan muatan kritik sosial", or, translated, "... in 1984 I released another album, entitled Nona. This album included more social criticism."

• "included harps, oboes, English horns, and a string section." Should this be Cor anglais or is English horn correct here?

• Changed. Forgot, British English. Linked now, as I sure didn't know they were the same thing before opening the article.

• "and became the first Indonesian music video to be broadcast on the American version of MTV." What do you think about "MTV (US)." instead of "the American version of MTV."?

• I'm not too keen on having US in parentheses after MTV.

• "the music video for the title song was also circulated on MTV." MTV US or SE Asia? Mark Arsten (talk) 03:32, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Done
• A couple of those (Nona and the horns) have to wait until I get back home. Can't remember of the top of my head. Gotta go teach now. Crisco 1492 (talk) 03:38, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Nona and the horns kinda sounds like the name of a band, doesn't it? Mark Arsten (talk) 20:57, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• "After several weeks of badgering by Gauri and being introduced to Erwin Gutawa" Maybe rephrase this, it almost sounds to me like this could mean he was introduced to Gutawa for several weeks, or am I mistaken?

How's this?

• "The new album, which retained the title Badai Pasti Berlalu, cost Rp.800 million (US$ 95,000) to produce and promote, in part owing the the cost of employing another Australian orchestra, the Victorian Philharmonic Orchestra." Looks like a typo here.

• Changed "another" to "an". The conversion rate between Rupiah and dollars is crazy (right now one USD is Rp. 9,200 or so).

• "was controversial because of its portrayal of a woman in tight clothing." Should this be "due to" here? (I can never get those straight.)

• Neither can I... perhaps Malleus can weigh in, or I can ask Dank.

  Strictly, it should be "owing to". Malleus Fatuorum 23:10, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Oh my.I don't think I ever use "owing to" in my writing..." Thanks. Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:16, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

  The rule, such as it is, is that "owing to" modifies verbs and "due to" modifies nouns, although there's a body of opinion that the distinction is overly pedantic. Malleus Fatuorum 23:25, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Learn something new every day. Thanks! Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:29, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

  BTW, Note [A] isn't linked to anything; looks like you've forgotten a {{cref2}} somewhere. Malleus Fatuorum 23:46, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Thanks. I thought I had that... guess not. Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:12, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

• "the most important Indonesian songs since the country's independence" Maybe finish that with "independence in 1945"? Mark Arsten (talk) 20:57, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• Changed. Good point, I keep forgetting that not everyone knows that. Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:47, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

• "Chrisye died at 4:08 am WIB (UTC+7) in his home in Cipete, South Jakarta." Do we usually link UTC? (Honestly not sure.)

Not sure either. Since we use it everywhere on Wikipedia, I assumed not.

• "On 1 August 2008, Chrisye's last single "Lirih" ("Gentle Voice"), written by Aryono Huboyo Djati, was released posthumously." Could we remove "posthumously" since it's clear he had died by then?

Agreed

• "Jockie, however, felt that Chrisye's voice lost its dynamics when mixed with mellow music, which led to the rock-influence in Jurang Pemisah." Could you clarify what lead to the rock-influence here?

• Better? Changed to "which led him to give their collaboration Jurang Pemisah more of a rock feel"

• The Style section seems a bit short, maybe see if there's a way to add to that. Although that's just a suggestion on my part.

• I could give an example or two from the testimonials in the biography

• Better?

• "Chrisye has been described as "legendary" by several journalists,[95][96] In 2007 Rolling Stone Indonesia..." Was this comma supposed to be a period?

Yes

• "the original Badai Pasti Berlalu is the second-best-selling album Indonesian album of all time" I think there's one too many albums there. Mark Arsten (talk) 01:29, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Oops. Fixed. Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:45, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

• "In 1979 he was selected as Favourite Singer of the Indonesian Armed Forces." I'm curious, was that a poll, or was there a selection panel or something?

• Source says "... penyanyi yang dinobatkan sebagai Penyanyi Pria I Kesayangan Angket Siaran ABRI (1979) ini.", which translates as "... this singer who was chosen as the Armed Forces Radio Favourite Male Singer (1979)." Nothing further on that.

• "Aciu Widjaja, now President-Director of Air Asia," Is there a good way to avoid the use of "now" here?

• As of 2007, perhaps?

• "In his biography, Chrisye noted that he enjoyed eating at roadside foodstalls well after his marriage and would be perplexed when people stared at him." What does his marriage have to do with this?

• Timeframe. He doesn't give a specific year when he stopped doing so.

• "After they had children, there were times when Chrisye had little time to spend with them as he was busy performing or recording; however, he attempted to spend as much time with them as possible, at times picking the children up from school." Is there a good way this sentence could be tightened up?

• Trimmed.

• "Chrisye released 31 albums during his lifetime, one with Guruh Gipsy, 21 studio albums, and nine compilation albums." I'm not sure this is compliant with WP:NUMERAL.

All numbers.

• "Chrisye also released many singles,[88] several of which were used as theme songs for Indonesian soap operas. "Pengalaman Pertama"..." What do you (and Malleus) think about a colon instead of the period here?

• I'd rather keep it separate because otherwise we'd have a one sentence paragraph.
• I agree with the colon, much better. Malleus Fatuorum 02:02, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

• Okay, sounds good. Crisco 1492 (talk) 02:18, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

• Alright, I finished reading the article, and am leaning support. Mark Arsten (talk) 01:40, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

• Thanks for the review, I'll get hopping on those things you have indicated. Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:53, 1 March 2012 (UTC)