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I need help to write my first article

I would like to ask if someone can help me to rewrite an article about a contemporary artist.According to the notes I have received, I am having problems with the encyclopedic way to write. Joannych Joannych (talk) 22:09, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

Oh, come on, Joannych! This is not some minor problem with 'encyclopaedic tone' - you are clearly determined, both here and on Spanish Wikipedia to promote an article about this person. And to do it again and again. These pages have been deleted multiple times, on both sites. Robert McClenon might have been gentle with you in commenting about tone of writing but, quite frankly, you need to worry more about how to meet our Notability Criteria, especially WP:NARTIST. Your key priority is to find sufficient published reliable sources to support the article, or it has no chance of becoming an article here. Then you need to write in a neutral, encyclopaedic voice, not as a "big-me-up" promotional piece. If you cannot do that, then please leave it to someone who can. I need to ask: are you employed or paid by the artist to create this page? It seems highly likely to me that you are, or perhaps you are related to them? Either way, please declare any Conflict of Interest you have before further editing. Nick Moyes (talk) 23:20, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

I'd noticed the deletions from es:WP when I wrote what's below, but not the deletions from en:WP. Yes, first, Joannych, declare any conflict of interest. -- Hoary (talk) 23:32, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

I suppose that you're asking about Draft:Adrian Arguedas Ruano. Here's the first half of a sample:

Adrian Arguedas is one of the most versatile exponents among Costa Rican visual artists and in the last 25 years, as one of the leading, visible and most prominent artists in Latin America.

Exponent of what? Also, this highly laudatory assertion would require very sound referencing -- not just one or two citations of fluffy write-ups in magazines, but instead books, published by university presses or similar, surveying Latin American art.

Here's the second half of the sample:

He used various materiality respects throughout his artistic journey showing great versatility,

Past tense: Is he retired, or dead? What is a "respect"? What's a "materiality respect"? By "journey", do you mean career?

There's no referencing for either the first or the second half of this. I'm sure that many editors could make the English read more smoothly; but thanks to the lack of referencing, for all they (or I) know, this could all be fictional. The whole thing looks like a PR release (complete with an unreferenced list of exhibitions, presented in reverse order).

Start by adding solid references (where these exist). Continue by removing any assertion for which you can't present solid references. Then attend to the prose style of what's left in the draft. -- Hoary (talk) 23:28, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Joannych - It is not helpful to start multiple threads in the same forum at the same time about the same issue. Do you think that we don't notice that we were still talking to you above? Do you think that we are too stupid or too busy to notice? Editors who ask the same question over and over again, including more than once on the same page, do not get anything useful accomplished that way, but they do annoy the reviewers. Robert McClenon (talk) 23:44, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you all for your responds... I don't understand the way you work, it seems to me that you are trying to make so difficult for others to write articles... I can understand that not everyone can write, but you guys have a lot of different links and procedures that we have to follow in order to add information in this online "Free Encyclopedia". Even in Spanish wish is my native language and English, you keep avoiding people to add information. The artist that i am trying to write this article about, have a lot of information about his professional trajectory and artwork style in books articles, TV program, university links, museums, galleries, etc. It is not that I am trying to add his information in Wikipedia today... it is for sure that some day his biography would be part of this encyclopedia just because. I work in a totally different field. I think it is clearly easy to notice that I am not a philologist or literature professional, I don't read books, and I am not a writer... I really want to finish this article because I like to to the best I can, but if you put it so hard i rather not to continue... i am not anybody who like to keep arguing with Nickname people...i don't like arguing at all.. if you consider yourself anonymous then write this article... Joannych Joannych (talk) 00:52, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Joannych has disclosed their COI on their talk page, and I have added the connected contributor template to the draft. The disclosure was i am not getting paid for creating an article.... actually, this is going to be my first article, I am doing this for an artist that i know, it would be based on multiple articles and books about his career.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 01:04, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you i have requested the article deletion joannych Joannych (talk) 02:07, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

I am sorry to see this, as I and several other editors have been working on the draft. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 02:21, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Robert McClenon The creator of Draft:Adrian Arguedas Ruano now wants to delete it, and tried PROD, which was rejected as it applies to articles, not drafts. Would a Speedy deletion tag be the right way to go? If so, would you please do the honors? Tagged that way, the creator would have some time to change mind, and then act on that by deleting the Speedy deletion tag. David notMD (talk) 02:32, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

User:David notMD - I have put a G7 tag on the draft with a diff to their comment above. User:Tribe of Tiger - You can contest the deletion. I am not expressing a view at this time on whether to delete, and am only acting as a scribe. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:43, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

@Robert McClenon, David notMD, and Tribe of Tiger: I found evidence that he may be in six museum collections, and was able to confirm one so far. I have removed the deletion tag(s) and done som preliminary cleanup. He appears notable.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 03:09, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

@ThatMontrealIP: thanks, will try to help. I have not searched for sources, just yet. The over the top prose can be remedied, easily...as long as we have sources. Regards, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 03:19, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hoary: i forgot to ping you also. In short, I'll keep an eye on the user's COI issues and try to rescue the draft.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 03:22, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, User:ThatMontrealIP. This seems to be a case where a difficult editor almost prevented a notable subject from getting an article; but Wikipedia is a collaborative effort, a very large collaborative effort. Robert McClenon (talk) 03:59, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Robert McClenon Agreed. We are a collaborative process. Judging an article subject on the basis of an editor seems to be poor policy. Notability should stand alone. We may not “like” a new editor, perhaps because they have not, within a week’s time, or so, instantly understood and complied with our many and varied policies. Who is punished, by our refusal to accept a new article subject, on this basis? Are we to say, “you are a poor WP editor, therefore we will cut off our noses to spite our faces”, and refuse to consider a new article subject, because it has not been properly presented? I think we are better than that, and I am sure that you, as an experienced editor, would obviously agree that a “difficult editor” should not prevent us from adding worthwhile articles. Many thanks to @ThatMontrealIP: for their good work. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 04:18, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Two Observations

First, I looked at the current version of Draft:Adrian Arguedas Ruano, and I think it is well on its way to being accepted as a C-Class article of an artist whom we should have an article about. The artist's agent didn't do him any service, but Wikipedia volunteers are doing what makes Wikipedia what it is.

Second, User:Joannych - If you don't want to contribute to Wikipedia, you do not have to do anything here. Blanking the article was disruptive, and you have been warned now. Insulting the Wikipedia community is common enough, and the big girls and big boys of the Wikipedia community know how to ignore being insulted by uncooperative editors. Whether you improve your attitude or go away or get blocked is mostly up to you.

Robert McClenon (talk) 15:15, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

To know , how to edit

where can I find the articles to edit? Iitianeditor (talk) 06:09, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Iitianeditor. Please check out Wikipedia:Community portal, which lists plenty of articles that need work. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 06:13, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Templates in other language

I think that this may not be the best place to ask this question, but asking here for lack of a better platform. I recently started editing on sa.wikipedia.org. I would have asked their, but it is not a very active site. Some of the templates like Template:Cite news and Template:Infobox school display their result in english not sanskrit ( example- see मॉडर्न विद्या निकेतन विद्यालयाः शृंखला). What can I do to help translate the template and correct this?--User:श्रीमान २००२ (User talk:श्रीमान २००२) 09:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC) User:श्रीमान २००२ (User talk:श्रीमान २००२) 09:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

In principle, you can edit templates just as you can edit anything else. In practice, templates may be s-protected or protected; if you can't edit a template (or are nervous about doing so), then perhaps make suggestions in the template's talk page. -- Hoary (talk) 09:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

. . . However, the "principle" (and policies, etc) may be different at sa:Wikipedia. Still, using a talk page to offer your services would surely be an acceptable way of starting out. -- Hoary (talk) 09:46, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hoary: Thanks. Posted at the talk page.--User:श्रीमान २००२ (User talk:श्रीमान २००२) 10:04, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Animoz

Second question: (i ran out of space on the last one)... I can't find a listing for Animoz, which is an excellent game for kids that highlights the plight of endangered species. i am happy to feed the basic info about this new game (created by a university student last year in Adelaide) to said geeky person, using some quick and simple way to communicate with each other directly, ie something like this page we are on? 60.241.157.11 (talk) 08:47, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

I've changed the headline to just Animoz and put the question where it belongs, in the large edit field below. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 08:53, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please place your main question in the larger edit window instead of the smaller edit summary/section header window. This has been fixed for you here. Please understand that Wikipedia is not just for merely telling about something. This is an encyclopedia that summarizes what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen to say about a subject, showing how that subject meets the special Wikipedia definition of notability. This game would need to have such coverage in order to merit an article- significant coverage goes beyond brief mentions or descriptions, such as news reports or independent reviews of the game. 331dot (talk) 09:04, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

so, just to finish off the story on Animoz - here is one link i have found already fame.org.au/news-and-media-animoz-fight-for-survival ( and there appear to be quite a few more but they were on locked news sites (subscriber only) thanks, Pip  60.241.157.11 (talk) 09:07, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Being a subscriber only website or otherwise paywalled is not a barrier to using a source on Wikipedia, see WP:PAYWALL. Sources are not required to be free or easy to access, only that they be publicly available. Again, please place your edits in the larger edit window. If you are using the mobile version or the app, you may find it easier to use the full desktop version in a browser on your phone. 331dot (talk) 09:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys, thanks for the quick response and guidance with where to put my info. (I hope my earlier query got through ok, the one about not being geeky enough to even know which line i am supposed to be on...?) So in my earlier query, I raised the question of whether I (and other would be contributors) could simply be offered a chance to be paired up with someone who knows their way around the site. I can supply a topic and all the relevant independent news source http links no problem. But i just don't have the time or patience to painstakingly learn my way around this (somewhat arcane system) you've got here. Making my living takes up most of my energies, I confess. My idea with being paired up with someone willing to develop an idea to full status on wikipedia is a matter of trying to help you guys improve your general community engagement ( so its prompted by more than just mere exhaustion and brain fade at the end of each working day by the time i get to type this to you!) After successfully helping to create a page stub on wiki about ten years ago (when i found it a lot more user friendly, simpler and easier in every way), I am pleased to see that page still exists, and still shows my own special contribution. Wonderful stuff. But in ten years i notice a worrying trend - only around ten percent of your contributors are women! I wonder if any stats are being kept on all this, because the less-user friendly it is as a site - the fewer women will want to engage with it. I know i am straying off topic, but the question seems a crucial one re Wikipedia's sense of itself as represenatational, which it clearly can never be if only a very tiny proportion of contributions come from women. I put forward this question because i for one, would be much more encouraged to get involved again if i had an opportunity to be paired up with someone who could 'run with' a new bit of info that could help expand wikipedia's reach. My early training is in journalism, so i am used to just jumping onto a computer and filing a story (after researching it of course), without all the hoops i find i have to jump if i want to be part of helping create the best wikipedia possible. thanks, Pip 60.241.157.11 (talk) 09:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

sorry, my apologies - now i realise i was supposed to put Animoz on the subject line, so my last entry ended up in the wrong spot: templates in other languages (see how i need to be paired up with someone else who already knows all this stuff... wouldn't that save you a lot of time correcting all these dumb newbie mistakes? :) 60.241.157.11 (talk) 09:37, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

No, you were not supposed to put Animoz on the subject line; you were supposed to look for the section titled "Animoz", click on the option to edit this section, and then edit it, adding new material. But I have (I hope) cleared up after you. I don't spend much time correcting this kind of mistake, because very few people make it. Your confusion in dealing with a talk page is unusual. -- Hoary (talk) 09:43, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Two comments:

The site you link to above has a lapsed security certificate. This is not a problem as far as Wikipedia policy is concerned; but it may deter people from trying to view the page.

Animoz is not listed at boardgamegeek.com. Their standards for listing a boardgame are much lower than Wikipedia's. Maproom (talk) 10:18, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Article Creation

Hi,I really love writing and reading. So far I've written about 10 dialogues and compositions and I want to create an article. The problem is that I don't know how to. Lady Pakun .k (talk) 11:36, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Lady Pakun .k, and welcome to the Teahouse.

Please see #Article Approval inquiry below, where I answered much the same question for an unregistered user. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 13:27, 15 August 2020 (UTC)

New-to-Wikipedia editors are advised to put in more time editing existing articles before trying to create one. Good luck, either way. David notMD (talk) 06:04, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

Lady Pakun .k |If you want to actually create an article,listen to David notMD . Probably after your 20th or 50th edit, you may be geared up for advice, but if you don't want advice, I think you may want to read the pages related to wikipedia article policies after your 100th edit .Nihaal The Wikipedian (talk) 11:57, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia App Payment Support

Can you bring google play payment support in Wikipedia Android App. Please do this so that people who want to support Wikipedia but can't, Can donate Wikipedia by using Google Gift Card. Thanks to Wikipedia for helping me in my school projects from years. A 13 years old supporter of Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vishwaroop7 (talk • contribs) 2020-08-18T14:21:37 (UTC)

Hello, Vishwaroop7, and welcome to the Teahouse. Thank you for wanting to donate. Donations are collected and processed not by Wikipedia, but by the Wikimedia Foundation, so nobody here has any input to how they are collected. donate:Ways to Give has information about different ways to give, but I don't see Google Gift Cards there. At the bottom it says "For questions, please contact donate@wikimedia.org", so I suggest you mail them and ask. --ColinFine (talk) 13:33, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Follow-up to Editing a draft page in VisualEditor

Hi. I'm editing a new draft in VisualEditor, "David J. Zimmerman", and when using editor tools such as "fix ambiguous links" or "fix missing links" I'm getting the warning "this page may not be private..." This seems to be a new issue as several days ago I was able to use those tools. Thanks! VictorMooney (talk) 01:13, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Draft:David J. Zimmerman. Nick Moyes (talk) 01:19, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome back, VictorMooney. I'm just off to bed, so won't be able to help you directly, but could I ask you to clarify exactly which tools you are referring to? I did a quick visit using Visual Editor (which is not my main editing method) and I am unclear if you are using some installed script to run a ref-fixing tool. I wasn't aware of the two editor tools you refer to as being standard within VE. I think the more you could explain, the easier it might be for someone else to respond to you. Sorry I can't help further tonight. Regards from the UK (where it's currently 2:30am!) Nick Moyes (talk) 01:27, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, Nick Moyes. At the bottom of the draft page, "David J. Zimmerman" there is a yellow box titled, "Review waiting, please be patient." Various tools are within that box such as, Where to get help, How to improve your article, Editor resources and Reviewer tools.It is the Editor resources that I was attempting to use. Sleep well! — Preceding unsigned comment added by VictorMooney (talk • contribs) 01:38, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, VictorMooney, I get that too. The link to dabsolver is to a site identified by IP address rather than a domain, and Firefox (my browser) warns me that it might be dodgy. If you look at User talk:Dispenser/Dab solver, you'll see that others have had this problem too. The last comment says it "requires accepting an expired certificate", so browsers are warning you that the certificate on the website is expired and it's possible that the site or the link has been hacked. I haven't looked at Dabsolver, but I rather doubt that it will ask for a password or any other confidential information, so I think it's probably safe to use; but caveat utilitor. --ColinFine (talk) 09:47, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, ColinFine. "caveat utilitor" indeed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by VictorMooney (talk • contribs) 13:52, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Osbourn Dorsey

Hello. Can someone tell me how to change a page name please? I've just added a page on Osbourn Dorsey, a widely Googled inventor, but have mis-spelled his name as Osbourn Doursey in the page title. Can I repair this or do I need to delete the page and restart?

Thank you Universal Kakistocrat (talk) 12:52, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

• @Universal Kakistocrat: Such a rename is technically known as moving a page, here from Osbourn Doursey to Osborn Doursey. It is much easier that deleting-recreating, and preserves the page history. Your account is semiconfirmed (more than 10 edits, more than 4 days old) so you should be able to do it yourself (see Wikipedia:Moving_a_page#How_to_move_a_page). If you encounter technical difficulties, please ask again.

Regarding the article itself, I strongly suggest scrapping the patent body - does it really help the reader? Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 13:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Tigraan. That's exactly what I was after. I agree with you about the patent text. It was just me being lazy. There's a hanging reference as well. I plan to use sections of the patent to show that Dorsey's patent has nothing to do with knobs/handles and also the patent drawing in the reference to show a knob predating 1878. I'd left the text there ready for me to edit, on the basis that no-one was likely to stumble on it before I'd got back to it. Do you have a recommendation with how to deal with that circumstance? Or do most people write articles outside Wikipedia before dropping them in complete? For the time being I've moved it onto my own talk page. RegardsUniversal Kakistocrat (talk) 13:43, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Your own Sandbox as a better place. David notMD (talk) 15:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Universal Kakistocrat: You seem to say that the article is not ready yet. I have moved the page to Draft:Osbourn Dorsey, in the draft space, in order for you to edit it before it goes live; an equally valid alternative would have been to move it to one of your user subpages (e.g. User:Universal Kakistocrat/Osbourne Dorsey).

If you are not sure of what you are doing, I suggest submitting the article via the articles for creation process instead of reinstating it into the mainspace once you are done editing it. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 15:38, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

This is in my Sandbox, Can You Help Me With Your Input (Opinion) to increase the chances of getting it published?

contents of sandbox

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to navigationJump to search John Homenko, The Distinguished Lunatic John Homenko (born 1955) is a renaissance person: an international classical pianist, accordionist, composer, environmentalist, guitarist, music producer, photographer, singer, songwriter, software developer, translator (Russian, French, Italian), and literary writer.[1] He has written over 300 musical pieces in various genres: classical, pop, jazz, hip hop, and rap. He has written already over a span of 50 years starting at the age of sixteen. His songs have been used internationally by groups notably Gil Scott-Heron. He gained the moniker, "The Distinguished Lunatic" by appearing at a New York Metropolitan Opera performance, wearing a Daffy Dan tee shirt, among well-to-do designer clad attendees.[2] 1 Early life 2 Musical career 3 Radio 4 International concerts 5 Promoting The Environment 6 Notable 7 Discography 8 Books Published 9 Filmography 10 External links Contents 1 Early life 2 Careers: Music and Software Development 3 Radio 4 International Concerts 5 Promoting The Environment 6 Notable 7 Discography 8 Books Published 9 Filmography Early life John Homenko began his musical career playing the accordion at age eight at Renwood Elementary School in Parma, Ohio. In 1966, he began studying piano with Ron Kohout a well known Cleveland and New York jazz pianist. While studying piano he began a long career of writing folk, rock, pop, classical and jazz songs. He played local night clubs and various coffeehouses in the Cleveland area such as "Peabody s", "The Fantasy Nightclub", and "Brother's Lounge". He studied classical piano with Ron Kohout through out his college years. Between 1981 and 1992, Homenko performed as an opening act with the name, "The Pulse" and "The Distinguished Lunatics" for such headliners as the Forecast, Suzanne Vega, and Livingston Taylor. Careers: Music and Software Development Music The release of the album Prospect Avenue got him some public recognition due to the local hit song, Kenny Kings, "KFC". In 1977 he performed on the air on Cleveland's Saturday Feature Weekly Showcase, Studio A, hosted by Larry Collins featuring Ed Alisauskas on guitar. He soon added Wendell Cowell on congas from the band Gil Scott Hering to the group, supplying percussion. They toured either under the name "The Pulse" or "The Distinguished Lunatics" from 1980 until 1990, and produced the albums: "Prospect Avenue", "God Grades On A Curve", and "The Altar Boy's Got A Hickey". In the early 80's Homenko produced the direct-to-disk digital solo album, "Nine Days In A Coma". He played in the band "The Distinguished Lunatics", 1984 through 1986. In the late 80s to early 90s, he produced the albums "From A Romance To A Funeral March", "I Thought About You", And "1998" His latest releases include "The Altar Boy's Got A Hickey", "Don't Go There Charlie Hebdo", and "Vote For None of The Above ("About The 2016 Presidential Election"). An avid producer of folk music, he has produced five recordings for the band, "The Distinguished Lunatics", and has written over three hundred folk, pop, jazz, and classical songs. He still plays many venues, including the Hessler Street and Coventry Street Fairs in Greater Cleveland, Ohio. In 2002, Homenko took a master class with the 1999 winner of the classical Cleveland Piano Competition, Antonio Pompabaldi. Homenko released and sold a classical CD, "From A Romance To A Funeral March". In 1982, Homenko wrote a short vocal piece to welcome the new conductor to the Cleveland Orchestra, Maestro Van Dohnanyi. He sent the recording to the Maestro. In 1990, Homenko became a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's Musicians Consortium, advising the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame on matters of purchasing keyboards and amps to be used at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. [3] The Distinguished Lunatic's Album, "Prospect Avenue" became part of the the Chicago Libraries' permanent "Blues Collection" in 1993. [4] Software Development Homenko developed software programs ranging from the use of facial recognition, robotics, sensor measuring to the use and design of multi million row databases. He participated in the NASA Space Challenge for three years in a row utilizing his software skills to promote the environment.[5] Radio In 1984 he performed on the air on Cleveland's Case Western Reserve's Saturday Feature Weekly Showcase, Studio A, hosted by Larry Collis featuring Ed Alisauskas on Guitar. [3] In addition, Homenko's song, "Let It Rain, Gas On The Plain", was featured on Click and Clack's National Public's Radio Syndicated show, "The Tappet Brothers". Homenko collaborated with Russell Rucky and John Agostin on a musical called, "Prospect Avenue", Cleveland Ohio. Homenko was the sole perosn who wrote a muscical using Cleveland, Ohio, as the main subject. This was followed by two award-winning critically acclaimed works: "Work/Eat/Sleep", "I Almost Got A Date", and "If Only They'd Realize Life". International Concerts Homenko has played solo piano across India and China, mainly college campuses. He played in twelve cities in India and teamed up with sitar and tabla players in 1984. Upon returning from China, he wrote a chant, "Work/Eat/Sleep" which was inspired from Tibetan chants, which was a type of the "pre-rap" song. His song, "Oriental Melody" was used by Gil Scott-Heron, an international recording artist, while touring Europe. Promoting The Environment Homenko led the campaign to get bicycle racks on Cleveland Area Buses and Rapid Transit cars by gathering signatures and presenting to The Regional Transit System in Cleveland, Ohio, in 2000. Locally, Homenko grows milk weed to save the Monarch butterflies from extinction. He recycles his rain water, clothes washer's water, and dish water to the point he only uses less than 20 gallons per week. He has been mentioned as one of the most ecologically minded individuals in America several times in the Cleveland, Ohio local newspapers. He continues to take great pride in his compost pile, recycling of water, and low use of electricity and gas from his local utility suppliers. Homenko helped produce a book of children's pictures with The Council On Human Relations" in Cleveland, Ohio in 1985 to promote racial harmony in the Cleveland, Ohio schools. Notable Homenko received the lifetime American Legion Award for leadership, courage, and life time achievements. He spent four and one half years volunteering at a nursing home, playing piano and using his spoken Russian to help out Holocaust survivors. Discography Prospect Avenue (Dark Night Studios, Rocky River, Ohio, USA) 1988 (Pearl Ann Studios, Parma, Ohio, 1988) 1998 (Pearl Ann Studios, Parma, Ohio, 1998) From A Romance To A Funeral March (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2000) I Want To Be A Kid Again (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2015) I Like Butts (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2017) God Grades On A Curve (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2018) Accidental Lament (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2018) From Parma, Ohio, To Parma, Italy (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2010) The Altar Boy's Got A Hickey (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,1998) Dark Nights (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2009) Coffee, I Like It Black (thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com,2018) Books Published Children's Book (Cleveland Press, 1985) Off The Cuff (Amazon Press, 2017) Growing Up In Parma, Ohio (Amazon Press, 2018) Computer Art (Amazon Press, 2016) Posters of the band, "The Distinguished Lunatics" (Amazon, 2017) Filmography Homenko filmed a one hour video of his travels to China and Tibet in 1986 and sold the video to university libraries in the US and Canada in order to raise money to bring a Chinese student to study in the US. He raised enough money and found a sponsor for the student. The film, "China And Tibet 1986" is available on to view through JohnHomenko.com's website for free. [6] Homenko recorded The National Taipei Orchestra at Cuyahoga Community College in Parma, Ohio and distributed his recording to the library for free. Homenko wrote a "Cleveland" musical, "Prospect Avenue", based on his album, "Prospect Avenue". The musical was presented to "Dobama Theatre" in Cleveland Heights, Ohio, but was not produced by the theater. External links http://www.JohnHomenko.com John Homenko's Website http://thedistinguishedlunatic.wordpress.com https://sites.google.com/site/johnhomenko/ear-eye-entertainment/china-and-tibet-1986-video Homenko, The Distinguished Lunatic, John. "Cleveland International Piano Competition 2013 Street Pianos". You Tube. John Homenko. Retrieved 17 June 2019. Crump, Sarah. "Designers Out In Force At Opera". Google. Cleveland Press. Retrieved 17 June 2019. Santelli, Robert (March 8, 1996). "Musicians Cosortium". Rock And Roll Hall of Fame (March 8, 1996): Page 1. Retrieved 17 June 2019. Chicago Libarary, Chicago Library. "Chicago Blues Project". Acquisitions. Retrieved 17 June 2019. NASA Space Apps Challenge, NASA. "Environmental Applications". https://2019.spaceappschallenge.org/. Retrieved 17 June 2019. External link in

—Thedistinguishedlunatic (talk) 13:29, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Suggested edit to opening para, removing laudatory puff:

John Homenko (born 1955) is an international classical pianist, accordionist, composer, environmentalist, guitarist, music producer, photographer, singer, songwriter, software developer, translator (Russian, French, Italian), and literary writer.[1] He has written over 300 musical pieces in various genres: classical, pop, jazz, hip hop, and rap. He starting writing musicat the age of sixteen. His songs have been used internationally by groups including Gil Scott-Heron. He gained the moniker, "The Distinguished Lunatic" after appearing among well-to-do designer clad attendees at a New York Metropolitan Opera performance, wearing a Daffy Dan tee shirt, .[2]

Only my own thoughts. BTW is Gil Scott-Heron a group?Universal Kakistocrat (talk) 14:35, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please don't post the content of an article or draft here, Universal Kakistocrat. Use a sandbox, or create it as a draft using articles for creation. --ColinFine (talk) 14:40, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Your User page is also NOT a place for drafting content. Please move what you have there to your Sandbox, and then clean up your User page. David notMD (talk) 15:22, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

• @ColinFine and David notMD: The collapsed content contained the sig of the person who actually posted it here, Thedistinguishedlunatic. I've moved the sig below the cob. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 16:26, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

New article request with COI

I have a conflict of interest with Gotransverse, meaning I am advised not to create a page for the company due to Wikipedia's COI rules. However, I would like to know if I could be of assistance in requesting the Gotransverse Wikipedia page by providing independent and reliable sources as I am very familiar with the company. How should I go about doing this while adhering to Wikipedia guidelines? Any and all suggestions are welcome. Kksmt (talk) 15:52, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi @Kksmt:, and welcome to the Teahouse. I doubt that Gotransverse qualifies for an article under Wikipedia's inclusion criteria (see WP:CORP). Could you provide us what you consider to be the top WP:THREE sources supporting the notability of Gotransverse, so that we can evaluate them and give you further advice? Thanks, Calliopejen1 (talk) 16:46, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Centennial, Colorado - how-to ref and clarify?

This is a very specific question, but related to other similar problems I am helping with on other articles, so, I'm asking so I can learn the right way to fix this. 2nd paragraph of history of Centennial, Colorado says: A number of court cases eventually established the right of incorporation to take precedence over the right of annexation.

I happen to know which court cases (and acts of the legislature) and where you can find said cases/acts, but...

1. the cases have long technical names like: CITY OF GREENWOOD VILLAGE, Appellant/Cross-Appellee, v. PETITIONERS FOR the PROPOSED CITY OF CENTENNIAL, Appellee/Cross-Appellant. There are at least two, plus petitions, etc. *Won't all that get in the way of readability?*
2. So... they want us to cite the court cases? How? This is one of them:https://caselaw.findlaw.com/co-supreme-court/1419117.html Is there a better way to get the info without citing the technical case mumbo-jumbo?
3. There are no less than five websites that quote this Wikipedia Article word-for-word. None give references. Finding a non-primary ref amongst all the copycats is... difficult. Mostly, there are news articles on the subject, most are very one sided, either for Greenwood Village or for Centennial. The language used in the news articles has neutrality issues, (as does this wikipedia article if I'm understanding the objections).

How do you fix this? Is the info superfluous? Is there a better way to state it so it is not so objectionable? Thank you! Katrazyna (talk) 06:48, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Katrazyna. The article about Centennial, Colorado contains far more content about the incorporation process than I ever recall seeing in an article about a city. If that process was really so controversial, then there should be plenty of independent, secondary sources discussing the controversy. It is not necessary to exclude sources that are "one sided" as long as the Wikipedia article fairly summarizes both sides of the issue, without pushing a point of view. Any website that is based primarily on the Wikipedia article is not an independent reliable source and should not be used as a reference. Articles should be based, as much as possible, on coverage in independent, secondary sources. Court rulings are primary sources that should be used only with great caution, and usually not at all. If independent secondary reliable sources do not discuss and analyze the court ruling, then why should an encyclopedia? As to whether the information is "superfluous", that would require a comprehensive survey of the reliable sources that have covered the founding of this city. I do not have that expertise or interest, but perhaps you do. The broad answer to your question is that you should improve the article, based on bringing it into compliance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 07:24, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, that was my understanding. To clarify the question, the and tags, on the surface seem to be asking for a list of court cases and citation on the same, which would be inappropriate for Wikipedia. However, I think the implied meanings of the tags is that the information should be removed or appropriately reworded, and sourced from there. My question is which of these options is the right one. If the only sources turn out to be the court cases then should it be eliminated? If we can find more sources (such as news articles), we still don't want a list of court cases. What kind of wording would be less "vague" than "a number of court cases", and be more inline with the purpose of Wikipedia? Is there a way to look for Wikipedia articles that would be a *good* example of a typical article of this sort?--Katrazyna (talk) 14:18, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Katrazyna: I would use your judgment. There's no clean answer here. If the statement were sourced (even to a source listing the exact case names), I personally think it would be fine to say "a number of court cases". I doubt the reader needs the exact case names, and if they want further detail, they can go to the sources. But having no case names and no source makes it impossible to verify. (It certainly would be easier to search Google Books if the case name were there....). All this to say, I wouldn't be too dogmatic in how you approach the tags, which are just one editor's opinion. I'd start with looking for sources about the city's founding, see what they say, and go from there. Calliopejen1 (talk) 16:53, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Reason of rejection (Wencke Synak)

Hello dear community,

A Wikipedia admin reviewed the first page I create on Wikipedia: Draft:Wencke Synak, and rejected it because as he said there are no reliable sources.

However, the German actress shows significant coverage being featured in IMDB, Amazon Prime Video, Spotify, Deezer & Cast Upload. This criteria is then fully met!

Moreover, you can look for example in the category of german actresses (in the bottom of the draft) and you'll find that dozens of actresses with lower number of reliable references have their pages published without any note even.

Please, reconsider reviewing the page and tell me your point of view about what I said and if I'm right.

Kind regards RobertLasper (talk) 11:14, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

RobertLasper Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I would first point out that it is a poor argument to cite other similar articles as a reason for yours to exist. As this is a volunteer project where people do what they can when they can, it is possible for inappropriate articles to go undetected, even for years. We can only address what we know about. It could be that the other articles you see are also inappropriate. Standards also change over time, and what was once acceptable may not be any longer. Please see other stuff exists for more information. If you'd care to point out some of these other articles you have seen, we can address them.

Your draft was declined, as you note, because the sources you have given are not independent reliable sources with significant coverage of this actress, showing how she meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable actress. IMDB is not considered a reliable source as it is user-editable. Streaming or social media website also aren't usually considered reliable sources as it is not difficult for any person to post their work (or others') to such places. What is required are reliable sources like news reports or independent reviews that have a reputation of fact checking and editorial control that have chosen on their own to give this actress significant, in depth coverage. Significant coverage goes beyond brief mentions, interviews, and routine announcements. Please see Your First Article for more information. 331dot (talk) 11:20, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello,

Thanks for the clarification.

I fully recognize that citing similar pages is a poor argument. However, it's not just 10 or 20 pages, but more than 50 that I checked and some of them were created/edited recently.

I'm sure that there are hundreds or even thousands of pages of artists that are based on IMDb or Spotify...

IMDb publication can be author-edited but needs to be approved by the admin tea of the website.

Moreover, you can't publish in Spotify, Deezer... If you're not a well-known musician.

I don't want to change the Wikipedia policy about sources :) but let me tell you that all sources I cited are verified and controled.

Also, please give me advices of reliables sources for artists.

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by RobertLasper (talk • contribs) 12:36, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

RobertLasper Yes, it is entirely possible that there are hundreds if not thousands of articles that do not meet guidelines and should not be present on Wikipedia. Again, as this is a volunteer project, people do what they can when they can, and evidently someone has not taken the time to weed out inappropriate articles about German actresses. If that's something you want to undertake(I'm guessing not), feel free.

Please read WP:RS to learn more about what reliable sources are. A site that merely publishes, say, music or films does not establish notability. It might be okay as a source for what work they have done, but that would be all. 331dot (talk) 12:40, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

 105.234.166.2 (talk) 13:06, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello,

Yes of course, I can go ahead and edit those pages too. But I'll need to know example of reliable sources for artists. I've read the articles of Wikipedia in this sense but I still need more help from an experienced admin here.

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by RobertLasper (talk • contribs) 14:00, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

RobertLasper Any editor can help you with this, not just an administrator. I'm not aware of specific sources considered reliable for artists. But in general a source is considered reliable if it has a reputation of fact checking and editorial control. That disqualifies things like blogs that are not overseen by an editor and do not check or verify things they claim as facts. Usually reliable sources includes news reports(though not interviews with the subject) or independent, unsolicited reviews of the subject or their work. 331dot (talk) 14:04, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Though it's not just for artists, a general list of sources and their level of reliability can be found at this link. 331dot (talk) 14:06, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Again,

Please tell me what do you think about the following sources: https://www.rtl.de/cms/besuch-auf-der-kinderkrebsstation-diese-maerchenkoenigin-zaubert-kranken-kindern-ein-laecheln-auf-die-lippen-4104678.html http://jjschreibt.de/2016/beruehren-wie-es-nur-die-kunst-kann/ https://www.schauspielervideos.de/fullprofile/schauspielerin-wencke-synak.html http://sofahelden.com/index/artikel/Interview-mit-Schauspielerin-Wencke-Synak/8436

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by RobertLasper (talk • contribs) 17:34, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

I am new to WP family and willing to learn how to write a page for myself

Hiya I am recently joined Wikipedia editor page and would like to learn how to write and edit the information. I tech in university in STEM subject it would be handy if i learn and i can teach our students too. I did look into you-tube not really helpful to be honest, any one would like to be my mentor and i will be sincerer student to learn

Thanks in advance, MBasha81 (talk) 15:40, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@MBasha81: consider the resources listed under Wikipedia:Education program/Educators. You can direct any questions about those to Wikipedia:Education noticeboard. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 17:31, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Uhm, how to put this diplomatically! If you really do teach at a university, then I'm guessing that your language--and probably the language of the university at which you teach--is not English. You might see if there is a Wikipedia version in your language. Uporządnicki (talk) 15:51, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, MBasha81. It's great to see a few more scientists around here, especially when they recognise the value that Wikipedia can play in helping students research specialist STEM-related subjects. I think the time has long passed where every university told its students that Wikipedia is unreliable. A really great place to start to understand how we roll here is Help:Introduction, and maybe even try out our interactive tour called The Wikipedia Adventure. As a science educator yourself (and I'm guessing you might work at a Welsh university?), you might like to be aware of Wikipedia:Education program and some of the resources that are available for educators to run organised programmes for students. Obviously, you would need to gain an understanding of the basics of Wikipedia before trying to assist other students, or to set them assignments. (The worse thing you could do is tell students to create a new page on a topic about something that we simply would never accept - so it's important to learn how you can utilise Wikipedia effectively.) There are more resources at https://outreach.wikimedia.org/wiki/Education.

I do sense that one or two of your edits have been interpreted as promoting particular research work. I've not checked in detail, but it is better if you can cite sources which interpret that research, rather than using the original research in its own right. It's also a good idea to be clear on your WP:USERPAGE about your involvement in any such research work by saying a few words about yourself and your interests in using and editing Wikipedia. You don't have to identify who you actually are in real life - though it's not too hard to guess - but if ever anyone questions an edit you've made, then understanding your background and intentions really helps to make other editors appreciate what you're trying to do, and to guide you if needs be. Regards from the East Midlands, Nick Moyes (talk) 20:04, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Question

I was told that.... "I wanted to let you know that one or more of your recent contributions to Carmen Yulín Cruz have been undone because they did not appear constructive." However I deleted information that was "not constructive about Trump". Please explain? Trumpster2020 (talk) 20:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Trumpster2020, The answer is very simple. By making the edit you did you expressed an opinion. We don't accept opinions. You also removed a cited fact from an article. No-one cares about anyone's political affiliation here, just the protection of articles from vandalism. Indeed you may not realise it but you have received a level 1 warning for removal of material from articles. Fiddle Faddle

Placename policy

Could you direct me to the policy for using local names in the English-language Wikipedia, please? (I can only find policies on foreign languages but I'm not using a foreign language but the indigenous one.) I was entering some text this morning for a village in an area where the majority of people speak Welsh. I didn't delete the English names but placed the indigenous name first. I see that this is what happens on several other pages in many languages but I'm told that I'm contravening policy by placing the Welsh name in the text. I think it's crucial that this is dealt with properly as we are slowly losing the indigenous names, sometimes replaced with meaningless English ones. Thanks. Gorwel2 (talk) 18:22, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi @Gorwel2:, The policy is Wikipedia:Naming conventions (geographic names). Basically, we use whatever name is most commonly used in English-language sources. If English-language sources generally use an indigenous name, we'll use that. If they generally use an English name, we'll use that. See also WP:RGW about how Wikipedia isn't the right place for advocacy. We're not interested in shaping the world, just reflecting the world the way it is. 18:31, 18 August 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Calliopejen1 (talk • contribs)

Hello Gorwel2. I do agree with the anonymous reply immediately above. Because this is English Wikipedia, it is appropriate to refer to places in Wales by their common name as used in English. Thus, Germany, not Deutschland; Anglesey, not Ynys Môn etc. Putting the Welsh name first (or indeed even second) in an article that simply mentions that placename and then links to its page is not really OK. What is a very good idea, however, is to ensure that the lead sentence of any article about a Welsh place on English Wikipedia does indeed have the Welsh name immediately after it, if it is spelled differently in Welsh. Similarly (but I haven't actually checked), I would not expect Welsh Wikipedia to have its articles fiddled with in the same way, with English spellings of place names put before Welsh ones, and certainly not on the dubious grounds that too many of us damned English happen to live there! Sorry if sounds harsh, but this his how we work it. Does that make sense? Nick Moyes (talk) 20:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Working on an article

I am currently working on an article titled User:Charlie Smith FDTB/W.I.P.. Every time that put anything under Heading Level 2 with the the "==" on either side, the remainder of the article becomes italicized. I'm not sure why this is happening and I would appreciate some help. Thank you, Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 21:30, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB:  Fixed here. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:41, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you very much. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 21:45, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please check my article

Good day, guys!

Thank you for the opportunity to ask questions here. Please let me know what I can change in my article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Famous_people_from_KBR/sandbox I submitted it but got a feeling they will decline it. I feel like wiki rules are too complicated. Famous people from KBR (talk) 17:02, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

This page is largely a copyright violation from the subject's own web site and I have tagged it for speedy deletion as such. Wikipedia is not interested in what subjects have to say about themselves--we need sourcing from reliable sources which are independent of the subject. --Finngall ^talk 17:33, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Check the footer of the mentioned website. Text and photos are allowed to use. Also check that most information got external links to independent sources and articles, websites, etc. There are more external links than in the majority of existing Wikipedia pages. I know that, as the wiki is a source of the information for me. There is not even 1 source to the website. Well, how can you change the biography of a person? Should it also be unique for Wikipedia? no, it can't be my friend. All information has been collected specifically for the website and wiki. Page on the wiki supposed to be released even faster than the website. So we are not violating copyright rules, we own this text. If proves needed, let me know, we can arrange it. We are just trying to show the world that there are people from our small region who achieved significant results in the world arena. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Famous people from KBR (talk • contribs) 17:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Famous people from KBR: thanks for that clarification. When you say "we", what do you mean exactly?ThatMontrealIP (talk) 18:39, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

By "We" I mean few editors. We might be new to Wikipedia but we have experience in coding, web, writing articles, etc. Hope you noticed that in our first article. We would be useful for Wikipedia and will try to establish it as a reliable source of information for our region. Not just Yandex and Google. ThatMontrealIP — Preceding unsigned comment added by Famous people from KBR (talk • contribs) 19:16, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Famous people from KBR:, I have left you a message at your Talk page concerning your username in this discussion. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 22:21, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Mathglot Thank you, responded there.

Admin please remove these edits and block the editor

Hi All, Please help to remove these edits from public view. They are highly disparaging and obscene. Editors have changed the edits but it is still visible in the page history.

Also Please block this user who is only editing to vandalize the article. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/MohitGemini

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Nigerians_in_India&diff=prev&oldid=962326543&diffmode=source Guy Foxx (talk) 21:10, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Guy Foxx: I have hidden three of those edits on the basis that they are somewhat offensive and BLP violations. The others are not so bad, and will remain in the edit history. The editors in question have not made sufficient bad edits to warrant a block, though they have received at least one low-level warning. Please continue to monitor the article and their edits, if necessary. Persistent bad faith editing should be reported at WP:AIV, where we would normally expect you to have already given the necessary warnings, and only report them once they continue. Bear in mind that highlighting inappropriate edits in the way that you have done here only serves to draw attention to them, so this is not really a sensible thing to do. In future, please do so more subtly, and follow the advice offered at WP:REVDEL. An article that is receiving sustained vandalism from multiple editors can be given protection for a short period of time. You can make requests at WP:RFPP should this ever happen again. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you @Nick Moyes: for your quick response and the action I requested. I am sorry that my method of highlighting these problem edits was judged as "not sensible", I do understand why you said so. Actually, I was not sure how or where I could have reported it. Before coming here, I did check Wikipedia:Administrators and also Wikipedia:Requests for administrator attention to decide the right forum where I need to post this request, but those pages did not talk about hiding revisions. With no other option left, I posted my concern here as my last resort before giving up on this. Now that you have clarified about REVDEL, I will seek help from there if needed in future. Finally, may be you or someone could add the guidance on REVDEL on Wikipedia:Requests for administrator attention too. I wish you have a very good day.Guy Foxx (talk) 22:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey so I am trying to update a page

So I am trying to update the Deltarune page because their were a few things that needed to be updated but this is my first time ever editing and I need either advise or a link to something that can help me with that. Yeeterboi135 (talk) 23:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Yeeterboi135, welcome to Wikipedia. You can find useful resources at Help:Getting started. The issue with your edits at the moment is that you're not citing your sources, i.e. you have to say where you got your information from. You can do this with the citation button in the Wikipedia editor, see here. Please let us know if you need any further help :) Ed talk! 00:00, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Regarding Approval of New wikipedia Article

Hello,

I recently added a article on wikipedia, but it got rejected twice saying insufficient sources, now i added more sources, can anyone help me by checking the article & tell me that whether i can submit it again or need to add more sources. My sandbox url where the article is published right now https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Hnfatema/sandbox Hnfatema (talk) 10:47, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

This is about somebody named Whitney Noelle. It comes with a photo. This photo is Hnfatema's "own work", and it's Whitney Noelle's "own work", or so we read. (Actually it looks at first glance like UNHCR's own work, but on further inspection looks stranger and stranger.) Anyway, please read and digest Wikipedia:Autobiography. -- Hoary (talk) 11:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

The photo is very strange! A pretty young woman, with a disembodied, mysterious hand sitting on her shoulder. A menacing figure in the background, who seems to be preparing to stab her. Yikes.Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 19:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger, The photo is not only strange, it appears to require full permission to be in Commons at all, and I have just tagged it as requiring that permission there, which means that it is uo for the Commons slow motion seven day speedy deletion process unless permission is received Fiddle Faddle 19:26, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Timtrent: when I first looked at its Commons info, I thought "this will not be around for long!" A seven-days wonder, then. It looks like some sort of weird Photoshop mash-up.Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 19:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger, I like the Commons method of challenging speedy deletion. It does a full deletion discussion nomination. But the discussions there are often uncontested Fiddle Faddle 20:06, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Timtrent, there are two versions of the ice-pick mash-up at Commons (or anyway two that I know of); just now I added the where's-the-evidence-of-permission? template to the second one. -- Hoary (talk) 22:30, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hoary: Perhaps the photo is a cautionary tale? As in WTF? Invading someone's "clean laboratory", dressed in a non-sanitary evening gown, while sporting a dead, possibly infectious, hand on your shoulder, may lead to an ice-pick stabbing. Commons won't be pleased, either.Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 02:57, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hnfatema Actually, Draft:Whitney Noelle Declined twice, and then Rejected. Given Rejected, do not resubmit, even though you have added more content. You can either ask the editor who rejected it "why" on that person's Talk page, or ask at Wikipedia:Help desk. Whether the image is properly attributed is a separate issue. David notMD (talk) 12:38, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

How to upload photos

I take my a lot of photos and noticed they could benefit some of the pages on here. How can I upload new ones to Wikipedia pages that are relevant? Can I do it from phones? Dosp416 (talk) 02:51, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Dosp416! You could upload your file here! Please notice the copyright matters when uploading! Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 03:05, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

how to make my page seen on search links

 Adam Timothy Mayemba (talk) 06:52, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Adam Timothy Mayemba: All you've done so far is to create a Userpage - which is not an encyclopedic article. Please use the Article Wizard to create an article. You can find advice on how to create it at WP:YFA. Please note that autobiographys are strongely discouraged and I personally haven't seen somebody suceed so far. Also, an Wikipedia article might not nessesarely be desireable. Victor Schmidt (talk) 07:20, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Trouble in moving/redirecting/renaming a page

I would like for this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Stuart_Bertolotti-Bailey to be the only one for Stuart Bertolotti-Bailey AND Stuart Bailey (from which I messily redirected it), and I would like for the category 'Wikipedia' to be removed – that was also a mistake.

I have no idea how to fix this mess. Please help me! TheServingLibrary (talk) 12:29, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi TheServingLibrary, welcome to the Teahouse. If you want to move a page to where appropriate, just click the "move" button beside "View History." You can do it by hovering over the "More" button. When a page is moved, the previous name is already a redirect, so that's instant solved. I hope that's what you're asking. GeraldWL ✉ 12:42, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi sorry this is not what I mean. I just want to have one page called Stuart Bertolotti-Bailey. With no redirects. And the category 'Wikipedia' that appears before the name is wrong. Should I deleted the whole thing and redo it? How do I even do that? OMG what a mess TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:00, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

TheServingLibrary, That is not possible. You can remove the redirect once you move it, but that is considered blanking a page, and an editor should not blank a page. Just keep it a redirect, there's no harm. GeraldWL ✉ 13:07, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Okay, thank you. How do you remove the redirect? I basically need to undo the last couple of things I did (the redirect and change of category) but I can't find a way to do it. Thank you so much for helpng me. TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:09, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Also, for some mysterious reason it doesn't let me visually edit but only source edit the page now... what a disaster. TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:10, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

TheServingLibrary, done. The contents have been migrated to the unprefixed page. GeraldWL ✉ 13:14, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Gerald THANK YOU. Thank you sooooo much. TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:21, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

One last thing: do you know why I can't simply edit the page anymore, but the only thing I can do it source edit, which is very inconvenient? Thank you again!! TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:22, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

TheServingLibrary, you can visually edit the page. Just go the the right top, see that pencil icon? Click it, and click the eye icon where it says "Visual edit." GeraldWL ✉ 13:26, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

AMAZING. THANK YOU. SORRY to be so bad at this. TheServingLibrary (talk) 13:31, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hyperlink country names in "List of __ by country" articles?

In an article listing something by country, should the countries be hyperlinked? For example, at List of legal entity types by country, the countries are not linked, but I have seen articles in the same format (countries as section headers) in which countries are linked. What's the policy on this? I'm guessing not linked (?) CampWood (talk) 03:21, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi CampWood. I'm assuming you mean WP:WIKILINK when you say "hyperlink", but generally links shouldn't really be added to section headings as explained in MOS:HEAD. You probably have seen such a thing done in other articles per WP:OTHERCONTENT, but that doesn't necessarily mean it should've been done. In the article you cite above as an example, it might be possible to add a hatnote (e.g. {{Main}}, {{Further}}) at the beginning of each section to a relevant article like is done for List of legal entity types by country#India and List of legal entity types by country#Russia or even possible to add a link inline like is done for List of legal entity types by country#Albania; however, I'm not so sure that linking to the main article about a country itself is really going to be very helpful to the reader of an article about legal entities unless there's a specific section in the main country article which covers such a thing in more detail. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:25, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Got it, thanks. CampWood (talk) 14:37, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Create an article

 Rxdd Sxvxge (talk) 12:10, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Rxdd Sxvxge, welcome to the Teahouse. Do you have any details on what article you want to make? Like biographies or films? That way I can give you specific infos. GeraldWL ✉ 12:17, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Herllo, Rxdd Sxvxge, and welcome to the Teahouse, and Wikipedia. Irrespective of the kind of article you want to make, I would advise you that creating a new article is the hardest task there is for a new editor, and you will probably have a very frustrating and disappointing experience if you try it before you have spent some weeks or months adding value to Wikipedia by improving existing articles and learning how Wikipedia works.

If you're planning to write an article about WH1P G4NG, then I strongly suggest that you carefully study NMUSIC before you start, and find several places where people who have no connection with WH1P G4NG, and not prompted or fed information by them, have chosen to write about them - at least three or four paragraphs - and been published in a reliable source. If you cannot find suitable sources to establish that they meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then no article about them will be accepted, however it is written, and all effort you put into doing so will be wasted effort. A quick search has thrown up nothing relevant, so I doubt that they are notable in Wikipedia's sense. In any case, please look at Your first article before you try that task; and if you have any connection with WH1P G4NG yourself, please also read about editing with a Conflict of interest.

I'm sorry if this sounds negative, but our experience is that hundreds and hundreds of people come here for the purpose of promoting themselves, or their band, or their company; and they uniformly have a tough time, because that's not what Wikipedia is for. If, on the other hand, you are here to help us build a (neutral, non-promotional) encylopaedia, then Welcome! I suggest you start with The Wikipedia Adventure. --ColinFine (talk) 14:43, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Commons files vs. Wikipedia files

What is the difference between files uploaded to Wikimedia Commons and files uploaded to the File namespace on Wikipedia? Is one better than the other? Maka, the Two Star Meister! (talk) 12:25, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Maka the Two Star Meister, welcome to the Teahouse. Commons files and Wikipedia files generally do not have any difference, you can upload your files in either place (although it is encouraged to upload on Commons as editors on other projects can use it). However, if the file you're uploading is copyrighted, upload it on Wikipedia, because Commons does not accept them. Copyrighted files should also comply fair use. GeraldWL ✉ 12:39, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

• (edit conflict) @Maka, the Two Star Meister!: All files uploaded to Wikimedia Commons are available under a free license (I would say usually CC-BY-SA but I do not see a Commons page that says everything is available under that license). Therefore, they must come from a source that itself can be relicensed as such. On the other hand, the File namespace of en-Wikipedia (Wikipedia in English; rules are different on, say, the German version) may contain copyrighted materials if they satisfy WP:NFCC. Notice that these criteria are (intentionally) stricter than the fair use legal restriction given by Gerald Waldo Luis.

As a general rule, you should migrate everything you can to Commons, and keep as local files those who have copyright restrictions (typically, album covers, film posters etc. that are used to illustrate articles about the subject they promote). Files from either location can be used in English-Wikipedia articles in the same manner. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 12:47, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

• The Wikimedia movement includes about a thousand Wikis, including around 300 language versions of Wikipedia, plus Wikimedia Commons. If an image is on Wikimedia Commons it can be used on all of those thousand Wikis, plus others from outside the movement. But if an image is only on one language version of Wikipedia it can only be used there unless someone copies or moves it. Think of it as the software looking at two wikis whenever an image is specified, the wiki you are on and then Wikimedia Commons. So if you can release the image under an open license and you want as many people as possible to use it, then Wikimedia Commons is the place to go. But if it isn't your work, for example you are uploading a low resolution copy of a book cover or album cover under the fair use provision then stick with the English language Wikipedia as Wikimedia Commons does not host "fair use" files. ϢereSpielChequers 13:11, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
• As an addition to WereSpielChequers, copyrighted files should only be used in either: 1) The article it is about, meaning for primary identification; 2) The article where relevant. If t is option 2, then you must add a sourced commentary about said file, see Jaws (film)#Music as an example. It does not only preview the main theme, but also gives information that casual readers may be interested to know. If you cannot find a commentary, do not use it mainly for decorative purposes, at least until you can find one. Images are supplemental, so it is not required to have one if there can't be one. That's what I can say. GeraldWL ✉ 13:24, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
  • I think you mean other people's copyright:). By default what we do and upload is copyrighted, but under a very open license that allows others to reuse what we have done provided they comply with CC-BY-SA. If anyone wants to upload images that other people own the copyright of then I would suggest reading the relevant policy in full. ϢereSpielChequers 14:02, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
    • Yes, I'm referring to non-frees that aren't ours. GeraldWL ✉ 14:47, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

How to create a Background

Im creating a page for a client. Id like to know how do I create the different sections: Background, Personal, Professional, etc., Dahlia Vetreese (talk) 15:01, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Dahlia Vetreese, welcome to Wikipedia and the Teahouse. Per Wikimedia's terms of use, if you are editing for financial reasons, you must declare it on your user page. You can read more about this at WP:PAID. You must not edit further until you have declared this. After you've done this, you can read more at WP:YFA, which contains lots of info about making your first page. Ed talk! 15:06, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Dahlia Vetreese: I'm really sorry, but I felt it appropriate that I should block your account on the grounds that it appears to be that of the politician Dahlia O. Vertreese. Ignoring the typo in your username, in your post above you refer to having a client for whom you are being paid to create an article. Logic tells me that the politician is paying you to write about her; that you haven't much of a clue what you're doing; and that you are not actually Vertreese herself. If you are her, then the instructions on your talk page explain how to get your account unblocked. Likewise, if you are not her, there are also instructions there for you to follow. Either way, we do not permit draft articles to be created on a userpage, and such pages will be deleted if we find you creating them there. See WP:USERPAGE for more information on what is and isn't acceptable. Once unblocked (or editing under a new account name) please then declare your paid work as per this obligatory policy: WP:PAID. Then please use the Wizard to create a draft at Articles for Creation, which you can then submit for review when its ready.

To be perfectly blunt: anyone expecting to receive payment for creating an article for someone needs to have actually spent some time in advance learning how we operate here, rather than wasting our volunteers' time sorting their own mess-ups. We're perfectly happy and willing to help other volunteer editors who make mistakes when they start out, but paid editors with clients should already be competent enough to work things most out for themselves, in my view, and only seek support when it's genuinely needed. Sorry this sounds grumpy, but the rest of us are not here to help you set up a business, or earn money on the side. Please start from Help:Introduction and take the time to learn how things work before setting yourself up to work for other people. Regards from the UK, Nick Moyes (talk) 16:22, 19 August 2020 (UTC)    

In brief, abandon this account. Start a new account with a different User name. If you intend to try to create and article about the NJ politician Dahlia Vetreese, then declare your paid situation on your User page (see WP:PAID). Then, per Nick Moyes use Articles for Creation. However, and this is an important however, Vetreese is already identified as the mayor of Hillside at Hillside, New Jersey, and it is extremely unlikely that she meets Wikipedia's criteria of notability to warrant an article about her solely because she is a mayor. The mayor of New York City warrants an article, mayor of Hillside, not. David notMD (talk) 16:41, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Copyright issue

Hi. I'm a new editor working on Draft:David J. Zimmerman and am not clear why the posting of certain external links poses copyright questions. I received this comment from a reviewer. "→‎External Links: commenting out what's hosted at squarespace.com and whose copyright status is therefore dubious undothank" There are several articles written about David J. Zimmerman which no longer appear online. The external links I posted were links to pdf's which were created from the articles when they were online. Thanks. VictorMooney (talk) 22:04, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

This is the edit in question. (As it happens, I'm the person who made it.) The first of several such articles is something titled "Taking on the Tragic in Unconventional Portraits", from the Wall Street Journal. Can you demonstrate that its reproduction on squarespace.com is authorized by the copyright holder? (I find this hard to believe, particularly as the WSJ imposes a paywall.) -- Hoary (talk) 22:16, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. No, I can't demonstrate the reproduction is authorized. Can you suggest what might show authorization? Would emails from the publications be sufficient? I appreciate your help. — Preceding unsigned comment added by VictorMooney (talk • contribs) 22:41, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

VictorMooney, they look to be PDF print outs from the websites of the actual publications - you might just want to link to the original, even if they implement a paywall. A quick google will do this. Ed talk! 22:55, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, Ed. I'll keep those links off the draft until I find a good solution. I did read in WP "help" that linking to sites with a paywall is discouraged. VictorMooney (talk) 00:58, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@VictorMooney: While free-to-read sites are preferred, a paywalled source is still better than nothing (it can usually be found/read by someone with access at WP:RX if needed). Just to clarify part of the original question, when a source looks like it's a potential copyright violation, one reason we don't want to link to it because it's more likely to disappear than other sources. Also, archivers watch for new citations on Wikipedia and archive those cited pages, which I think could create a problem for them, too. From a moral standpoint, I think it's best that we do what we can to not support copyright violators. (BTW, note WP:INDENT for the preferred discussion page formatting. Thanks.) —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 01:42, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the information, AlanM1. It's very helpful.VictorMooney (talk) 16:47, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

What do I do if I want an Image removed?

Hi. I just wanted to know something which could be helpful. Suppose I wanted an image that I uploaded deleted. What do I do? Because it's not possible for us(non-admin) to delete. Do I have to contact an Admin? Do I have to give reasons? MRC2RULES (talk) 17:04, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey @MRC2RULES! The best course of action in your case is to ask for Wikipedia:G7 on the file page. Hope this helps! Ghinga7 (talk) 17:25, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Can I create a new article for Baalveer Returns?

Can I create a new article for Baalveer Returns? Baalveer Returns is a new show and it should not be joined with Baal Veer.  WEST SA01 (talk) 17:01, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

WEST SA01, I suggest reading this tutorial on how to create an article and checking whether the article subject passes the general notability guideline. If you believe it is notable enough for an article, click here to create an article with the article wizard. — Yours, Berrely • ^Talk∕_Contribs 17:44, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

How Do I Upload A Image On Wikipedia?

How do I upload an image on Wikipedia? WEST SA01 (talk) 19:15, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi WEST SA01, welcome to the Teahouse. You can find help regarding uploading images at WP:UPI. Ed talk! 19:40, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Or read Illustrating Wikipedia:A guide to contributing content to Wikimedia Commons ~ Amkgp 💬 19:43, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Change the title of a draft

Hi! I'm working on my first contribution. Could you please help me on finding a way to change the title of a draft I'm preparing? And, once finished, how should I proceed to submit it to revision?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Fast_Know_Times_in_Pyrenees_routes_and_summits

Thank you Zocodo (talk) 21:03, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Zocodo: I changed the name myself to a title that seemed sensible, but if you want to change it to something different (or move a different page), the instructions are at Wikipedia:Moving a page (moving = changing title). I also added a template to the top of the page. When you think it is ready to go live, press the submit button to have other editors review it. Before you invest more time in the draft, however, I suggest you ask at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Running to make sure this is the sort of article Wikipedia usually hosts. I'm not sure that it is, and I don't want you investing more time into it if it is bound to be rejected. Good luck, and thanks for your contributions! Calliopejen1 (talk) 22:36, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Ok @Calliopejen1:, thanks for your feedback!

What makes an edit vandalism?

What makes an edit Vandalism. I am pretty new to editing and I corrected the List of Republicans who oppose the 2020 Donald Drumpf presidential campaign article to correct the incorrect statement that Mitt Romney was senator of Massachusetts, when he was actually Governor. This was flagged as vandalism and I am not clear on how it was vandalism. Can someone please explain this to me? Victor Scimitar (talk) 13:32, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Victor Scimitar! If you're referring to this edit [1] labelled as "Edited to show Mitt Romney was the Governor of Massachusetts, not Senator", then it's presumably because you also changed Donald Trump's name to "Donald Drumpf" throughout the entire article. YorkshireLad  ✿  ^(talk) 13:44, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Agreed with YorkshireLad. Even if you hate the subject, such vandalism will ruin Wikipedia as an encyclopedia and is vandalism, just like real-life vandalisms. I understand that reference tho. GeraldWL ✉ 13:51, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

I was unaware I was doing this, I have an extension that does that automatically, I apologize and that makes sense why that got flagged. Sorry — Preceding unsigned comment added by Victor Scimitar (talk • contribs) 14:03, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

UPDATE: I have deleted the extension and that should not be an issue any further — Preceding unsigned comment added by Victor Scimitar (talk • contribs) 14:05, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Victor Scimitar: That's funny. Glad you fixed it. —Naddruf (talk ~ contribs) 14:56, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Not the first time that extension, (despite its amusement factor), has caused problems! Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:15, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Creating a page on Wikipedia

I would like to be able to create a biography of a living author and am looking for advice and or assistance. This is a new author, has written 4 books - 3 of which are on Amazon.

 Not2Doubt (talk) 22:06, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Not2Doubt Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Successfully writing a new article (not just a "page") is the absolute hardest task to perform on Wikipedia. It takes much time and practice. New users are much more likely to succeed at if they first spend time editing existing articles in areas that interest them, to get a feel for how Wikipedia operates and what is expected of article content. It's also a good idea to use the new user tutorial.

If you still want to try, you should read Your first article. This author would need to receive significant coverage in independent reliable sources, showing how they meet Wikipedia's special definition of a notable author. If you can do that, you should use Articles for creation to create and submit a draft. Keep in mind it is not difficult for people to write and publish a book, and subsequently put it up for sale online, so merely being available on Amazon is not part of the notability criteria. 331dot (talk) 22:13, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Not2Doubt. Start by reading the notability guideline for creative professionals and Your first article. The fact that three books are sold by Amazon is of no significance, since Amazon strives to sell every consumer product under the sun. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 22:20, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Also, Not2Doubt, if they are a new author, it may well be TOOSOON. Note that if they do not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then all work you or anybody else puts in to try and create the article will be wasted effort. --ColinFine (talk) 22:57, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Not2Doubt, Even if an article is deemed WP:TOOSOON, as well noted by ColinFine, you can save it offline. I have found that MS Notes perserves the wikitext markup. Then, a few years later, when additional WP:RS have accumulated, you can update the previous version, and submit. Frankly, I would never attempt to write a new article, without saving my work offline. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:47, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Saved edits reverting to original

I started to edit an article called Death of Elijah McClain that has a number of errors, saved my edit, and the article reverted to the original article. This being my first editing experience, I'm hoping you can help! Sjrflyfisher (talk) 23:28, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Your edits were undone by two editors, both times with edit summaries saying that your edits were WP:POV and asking you to discuss your edits on the article's talk page. See [2] Meters (talk) 00:21, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Ping the users in question, HandThatFeeds and Armadillopteryx. Meters (talk) 00:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hi Sjrflyfisher. If you look at the page history for Death of Elijah McClain, you'll see that the edits you made here and here were reverted by two other editors here and here. The edit summaries left by the other editors state that they have concerns about the WP:NPOV of the changes you made and advise you to seek WP:CONSENSUS for them on the article's talk page. This is kind of how most disagreements over article content, etc. among editors are expected to be resolved on Wikipedia. One editor makes a WP:BOLD edit that they believe is an improvement, but another comes along and either completely undoes or partially revises the changes that were made because they feel they weren't in accordance with relevant Wikipedia policies and guidelines. When that happens, the thing to do in most cases is to try and follow WP:BRD and seek a resolution through discussion on the article's talk page. So, that's where you're at now. You should start a discussion about this on the article's talk page and see if you can address the concerns of these other editors. You shouldn't try and force your preferred version through with this discussion no matter how right you believe you may be because that's likely going to be seen as edit warring. It's OK if you didn't know any of this because you're a new editor, but now that you do it's best to follow Wikipedia:Dispute resolution. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:31, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

New Picture

I recently uploaded a picture called File:Rabbi Ber Hersh Heller (from Reb Yaakov 1993).png under Fair Use, however I later discovered that it may in fact be in the public domain. The photo seems to be extracted the previously uploaded File:Vilijampolės ješivos rabinai ir mokiniai.png, which is in the Public Domain. If the picture I just uploaded is in the public domain as well, it should be listed that way. If someone can help me clear this up, will be appreciated. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 21:35, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: I would keep your upload listed as fair use. I don't think there is really enough information to conclude that File:Vilijampolės ješivos rabinai ir mokiniai.png was an anonymous work, which is the basis of its public-domain claim. I don't feel strongly enough about it to nominate File:Vilijampolės ješivos rabinai ir mokiniai.png for deletion at Commons as non-free, though. Calliopejen1 (talk) 22:28, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Okay, thank you. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 01:11, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Dextrose

When researching "dextrose"(corn sugar), Wikipedia erroneously redirects the reader to "glucose" (blood sugar). I want to write a page confirming that dextrose is corn sugar manufactured from cornstarch per Code of Federal Regulation 21CFR184.1857. I would greatly appreciate your assistance. Thank you!  DextroseIsCornSugar (talk) 23:27, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

When I search, Dextrose redirects to Glucose, as does Corn sugar (via Dextrose), but I see nothing for Dextrose (corn sugar). There is also Corn syrup and High-fructose corn syrup. Not sure if this helps. David notMD (talk) 00:31, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Dextrose redirects to Glucose because it is one of the isomers of glucose. It is a glucose. Per the article " The d-isomer, d-glucose, also known as dextrose, occurs widely in nature", so while "corn sugar" is indeed dextrose, it's not really correct to say that "dextrose is corn sugar". I don't see a need for an article about this. Anything that is needed that is not already in the glucose article can be added to that article. We can always add a new redirect if needed. Meters (talk) 00:39, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

To add a (possibly obvious) point to this discussion, glucose is not merely blood sugar. In addition, 21 CFR 184.1857 defines corn sugar, not dextrose, though it notes that corn sugar can be called dextrose. It does not say that all dextrose is corn sugar. I think we handle this issue appropriately by having the disambiguation page at corn sugar, though possibly an article could be written about the corn sugar-specific refining process outlined in CFR Title 21, should you be interested in writing that article. Calliopejen1 (talk) 00:47, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Actually, I may need to retract my last comment given that the refining is covered at Glucose#Commercial_production. Calliopejen1 (talk) 01:08, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

It's probably worth pointing out that this is a global encyclopaedia, with readers and contributors in many parts of the world outside the USA, so the Code of Federal Regulation 21CFR184.1857 won't be of much interest to a lot of our readers. HiLo48 (talk) 03:48, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to Submit New Content

Hello, a few weeks back I tried to research Kitchen Island here on Wiki and noticed that there was no information on this subject. So I went to research this subject and published my findings on my blog Now I would like to share my findings with your reader. LLC28146 (talk) 02:32, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@LLC28146: Previous discussion is at Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2020 July 23#I would like to submit a missing article section. I'm afraid blogs are generally not WP:reliable sources, especially trying to cite your own blog as a source. What you would need to do is summarize the main points (it would be too long if you went into that level of detail here) and cite the sources you found (if they are what Wikipedia considers reliable). Note that you should not copy text directly from your blog, even if you wrote it; even if it were freely licensed (I didn't check), as a practical matter, it's likely that someone will come along and think it's a copyright violation. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 02:58, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

AlanM1, I think he's saying that he has researched it and saved his research on his blog for a while. LLC28146, if the subject you're writing on is notable and has independent reliable sources that has talked about it, you can make an article about it. If you are unsure whether your article is worthy of being on Wikipedia, you can make it a draft first; if you are sure already, submit it for review and an editor will decide. GeraldWL ✉ 13:31, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Right – I was anticipating, based on past experience, what "share my findings with your reader" might mean. Most people naturally don't want to do the same work twice. I'm trying to suggest that the blog should not be used directly, neither by copying text from it nor citing it as a reference. Instead, it's necessary to use the sources that the blog post was based on to expand the section in the existing Kitchens article or, if appropriate, splitting it out to a separate "Kitchen island" article. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:30, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

AlanM1: Exactly what I thought. GeraldWL ✉ 03:53, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to replace images?

Hello,

I'm trying to replace the logo for the Royal Hong Kong Police. However, I can't quite get my head around the Wikipedia interface/system. Could someone please elaborate on this?

Thanks. Blokeston (talk) 23:51, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Blokeston. Why for you want to replace the logo? Did the Royal Hong Kong Police change its logo in some way? Is it a completely different logo or is it basically the same logo that's only changed in some minor way? Replacing an image bascially involves either uploading a new image or uploading a new version of an already existing image. If you can clarify why you feel the logo needs to be replaced, then it will be easier to give you a more specific answer. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:33, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Marchjuly, I can't see any reason as to why the logo needs to be changed. The logo has not changed. I'm assuming Blokeston just wants a different style of the logo (there are many styles of it), but I don't see any significant need in replacing it. GeraldWL ✉ 04:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

HOW TO MAKE CHANGES TO A PAGE ?

 Positive Mitu (talk) 05:42, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

If you are trying to ask why your edits to Bhaage Re Mann were reverted, the page history tells you that it is because they were unsourced. In at least some cases your changes directly contradicted the cited references. Less significantly, the changes were also malformatted, for example in the presentation of lists. --David Biddulph (talk) 05:53, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to create artist page?

Hello, I am Saurabh kakade and I am a professional music composer & sound engineer on Unplugged21 Productions (www.unplugged21.com) Guide me create my artist page. Saurabhkakade21 (talk) 04:17, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia is an encyclopedia; it is not a website for you to use for self-promotion. David Biddulph (talk) 04:20, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Saurabhkakade21. What David posted above is true in that Wikipedia is not really intended to be a place for you to promote yourself or your activities. Perhaps try looking at Wikipedia:Alternative outlets to see whether there's some other website you can use which would be better suited for that type of thing. Now having posted that, Wikipedia is a place where encyclopedic articles can be created about subjects deemed to be Wikipedia notable. Which means if you are considered to be Wikipedia notable for some reason (for example, Wikipedia:Notability (people)), then perhaps someday someone will create an article about you. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:00, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Article deleted by mod without review or talk?

The article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martyn_Iles was written by me after I noticed a dead link - the article had been deleted (for suspicious reasons in the first place - clearly mod-personal reason)

How can one appeal a new draft deletion by the same moderator?

I've been threatned to be blocked after writing a neutral article on a very prominent activist in the AU political space. I guess they don't want that person to be notable, but they clearly are. (Martyn Isles, ACL)

The moderator has made some unfounded assumptions and allowed for ZERO feedback or talk before deleting the article of a _Very_ prominent activist in AU.

called conflict of interest, citing I had been asked to write the article, which I was not said person wasn't noteworthy (probably one of the most noteworthy activist in modern AU history) said not enough evidence that he is in that position (which is clearly rubbish) a google search finds pages and pages of info.

Can that moderator be blocked from moderating a page they disagree with personally (clearly in this case) but using power to continually delete?

Also can the page be restored by another moderator without fear of the original moderator deleting it again?

Need some direction here as I'm just about to write a series of other missing articles in AU politics and want to make sure I understand the process as right now I'm gobsmacked at this mod. Dawesi (talk) 07:09, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Dawesi. It appears that Draft:Martyn Iles was deleted for being overtly promotion and also because of Wikipedia:Conflict of interest concerns. It appears that an article by that same name had been previously deleted a few months ago as well per criterion WP:G5. I'm not an admin so I can't see the deleted pages, but there are admins who are Teahouse hosts who can. One possibility is that the even though you might be trying to create an article about this person in good faith, those who tried to do so before caused so many problems that now the motives of anyone new who comes along are going to be highly scrutinized. If the draft you created was basically a repeat of the page that was previously deleted, then it was almost certain to end up being deleted by some administrator.

You seem to have been involved in a pretty contentious discussion about this on your user talk page with an administrator named Nick-D and that has carried over to your post here at the Teahouse. While I understand how you might be feeling frustrated, claiming an adminsitrator is abusing his power or did with he did because of personal reasons is unlikely to find much sympathy here at the Teahouse or anywhere else without specific proof. All administrator actions can be reviewed, but the best thing you can do would be to explain how this person meets WP:BIO or WP:NPOL (things might not be as clear-cut as they seem to you) and see if you can get the draft restored again via Wikipedia:Deletion review. However, if by chance you're somehow connected to a previously banned account, or are somehow connected to the subject of the article, then your best bet would be follow relevant policies and guidelines and as upfront about such a connection as you can. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:29, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

The article here was blatantly promotional of the subject, and was written on behalf of the subject's communications officer (see User talk:Nick-D#Martyn Iles). There seems to be a campaign to use Wikipedia to promote this person, or at least a fundamental misunderstanding of how Wikipedia works. Nick-D (talk) 07:44, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Editing question

How do I edit only for myself? RealFeelings (talk) 19:17, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

RealFeelings Welcome to Teahouse. Its unclear what is your question. Can you elaborate it ? If you are looking for creation of an article. Read Your first article ~ Amkgp 💬 19:46, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

RealFeelings, do you mean an article private to yourself? If you are referring to a draft, you can make one at your sandbox or making a page called "Draft:[name]". If you meant a published, private article, sorry, you can't make pages viewable by yourself. Kinda different from YouTube here. GeraldWL ✉ 08:22, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Multiple declines

I was wondering if it has a negative effect if I get rejected multiple times while trying to submit a publication?

And if so, to whom may I turn to formulate my article in a suitable way for Wikipedia?

(LLC28146 (talk) 01:48, 20 August 2020 (UTC)) LLC28146 (talk) 01:48, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Your Sandbox draft User:LLC28146/sandbox has been Declined, then Rejected, the latter indicating that in the opinion of the reviewer there is no potential to improve the draft to a version that could be accepted as an article. The Kitchen article has a short paragraph on the kitchen island which you could consider expanding, and adding references (a weakness of the entire article). Please first learn how to create references, as what you have in your draft is wrong. David notMD (talk) 01:54, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@LLC28146: I strongly disagree with the rejection (as in, no potential for acceptance) of your article. Kitchen island is a topic that I'm stunned we don't have an article on already. I think the first task is to find some suitable references that could form the basis of the article. I'm going to do a bit of digging and get back to you. Calliopejen1 (talk) 07:11, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@LLC28146: Okay, it's not as easy to find sources about this as I would like. (Domestic life is always devalued and not written about as much as one would expect...) Anyways the main problem with your current draft is that there is a lot of original research/original synthesis/inappropriate use of primary sources. Wikipedia is a tertiary source and should summarize what secondary (not primary) sources say. I am going to add a further reading section to the article that contains footnotes that should be the basis for the overall article. I would delete most/all of what you currently add, and rewrite the article solely based on what these sources say. (Or what other additional secondary sources say, if you can find additional secondary sources.) Calliopejen1 (talk) 07:25, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

(ec) @LLC28146: Once you have assembled suitable sources, you should have a look at WP:TONE and maybe compare your draft with language used in Kitchen and other B-class or better articles in the subject area. The style of writing in the draft is just not what is expected here. It's too informal, addressing the user directly and personally by a single essayist, as though one were involved in a discussion. What's expected is formal (even "dry") language of an encyclopedia article that reflects what many (inline-cited) reliable sources have written. This is what the first decline was about. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 07:37, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@LLC28146: and @Calliopejen1:, Frank Bunker Gilbreth Jr. and his wife/co-worker, Ernestine Gilbreth Carey did some time and motion study research regarding the most effective layouts of a kitchen. (Obviously important, as they had twelve children!) Although they were well-known for the industrial applications of their work, they had a lasting impact on kitchen layouts. Perhaps some of the above will provide some leads. If sources can be located, I can assist with copyediting for proper WP:TONE. Good article subject! Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 09:51, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to make a hurricane season article?

"subject": hurricane season article

How to make a hurricane season article? i've been trying to make a hurricane season on this site. how do you make a hurricane season article? Sanvid2395 (talk) 08:53, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Sanvid2395. Hurricane season already exists; a disambiguation page leading to relevant articles. Is it another kind of "hurricane season"? Please specify. GeraldWL ✉ 09:17, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Sanvid2395 and welcome to the Teahouse! Depends of what you mean. As you can see, hurricane season is taken. Do you mean something like the the articles listed at Pacific hurricane season and Atlantic_hurricane_season#1494–1850_(pre-HURDAT_era)? If so, it's like the any other article, but you can look at the articles listed there for inspiration. Gather your WP:RS and summarize them. Take the time to read Help:Your first article if you haven't. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:20, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@Sanvid2395: See also Wikipedia:WikiProject Tropical cyclones, whose members might be able to offer specific advice, encouragement or guidance. Nick Moyes (talk) 09:55, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Publishing an entry

I have now made an entry, it is in the sandbox and I think it is ready to go public. How can that happen? Sand7043 10:11, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@Sand7043: I have added a submit button for you and cleaned up a bit. See also Wikipedia:So you made a userspace draft. Victor Schmidt (talk) 10:20, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to write a biography

Hello dear friends , thank you for providing a platform where i can find some answers to my questions . I wanted to publish a mini biography about a young talent , a singer . Who recently was verified by spotify . He also wanted to have an introduction on Wikipedia. I'll be glad if you guide me through the procces . Hamrazz (talk) 11:22, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Hamrazz and welcome to the Teahouse! Take a look at WP:BIO. If you conclude "Yeah, I have those sources, no problem!" move on to WP:YFA. If not, edit about something else, the article will not be accepted. WP:TUTORIAL may be of help. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:17, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hamrazz, coupled with what has already been said to you I’d like to add that if you are friends with the person in question, it is generally not a good idea to create the article yourself. See WP:COI. Also take a thorough look at WP:GNG. Celestina007 12:35, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Digital Fashion - reason for deletion?

Hello there, I've just tried to add an edit to the Digital Fashion page - the company I work for, The Fabricant www.thefabricant.com is the world-leader in this field. Our work is already linked to in an article on the wiki page by Forbes magazine. I mentioned us and added our website as a link but it was instantly deleted by the editor 'Night Snitch'. What was the reason for this instant deletion? Thank you. 95.97.145.67 (talk) 14:29, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Firstly we do not include external links in the body text of an article. Secondly we don't include spam links, as Wikipedia is not for promotion. Additionally you need to read about conflict of interest, and you must make the mandatory declaration of paid editing, as required by the WMF Terms of Use. --David Biddulph (talk) 14:44, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Userbox

How does one create a userbox? ----MountVic127 (talk) 20:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC) MountVic127 (talk) 20:20, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi there, MountVic127, and welcome to the Teahouse. You'll probably get all you need to know at Wikipedia:Userboxes, and may well find that there is already a userbox in existence to advertise your particular interests. But it's a fun exercise to make you own. Hope this helps, Nick Moyes (talk) 20:29, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@MountVic127: Go to templates in the editor and type userbox, tap it, and type whatever you want . Regards.Nihaal The Wikipedian (talk) 15:31, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

search history

How do I delete my wikipedia search history? 2.24.151.167 (talk) 15:55, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi IP, welcome to the teahouse. As far as I am aware, Wikipedia does not have a search history feature and your search history is not tracked. You can clear your internet history in your browser and Google, there are many tutorials on how to do this online. Ed talk! 15:59, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Draft:SysCAD

Hi, I am looking for some advice on satisfying software product notability for Draft:SysCAD. I have trimmed back the article since the first submission, removed referenced with only passing mentions, and added references which show use in different industries and for different applications. Could you please give some advice on what is seen to be missing? DanMunchie (talk) 10:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Some sources that are wholly independent of the company and developers, DanMunchie? (Disclosure: I haven't looked at most of your sources, I'm just going on the titles, authors, and what you have cited them for). See WP:CSMN. --ColinFine (talk) 10:53, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

All are independent except (1) (Company website info page) and a co-author on (5). — Preceding unsigned comment added by DanMunchie (talk • contribs) 12:30, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Ah. I had a brief look at reference 2, and misread it as being about the model that SysCAD is based on, which would clearly make it not-independent. I see that I was wrong, it is about using SysCad: I apologise for that. It might therefore be independent. However, "The authors would also like to thank the staff at KWA, [...] for providing training and support in relation to the implementation of the milling model within SysCAD" raises some doubt in my mind about its independence. More importantly, though, I don't believe the paper contains significant coverage of SysCAD: while it might be a worthwhile citation for the article, it cannot in my view contribute to establishing SysCAD as notable. Which three of your references are independent sources which do provide significant coverage? --ColinFine (talk) 15:29, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

No worries. Reference (3) is independent and contains the most significant coverage of all the references. I may also add this reference as well. The difficulty is SysCAD is a tool, in the same way Excel is - it is somewhat unusual for someone to include details on the working of Excel when reporting the results of a project which extensively used it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DanMunchie (talk • contribs) 16:37, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to put a notice?

How do you put a notice in an article that a particular content needs to be moved to another article? WEST SA01 (talk) 16:50, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@WEST SA01: Welcome to Wikipedia. Start by initiating a discussion on that article's tak page to get input from other interested editors. When there is consensus on the change then someone can make the needed edits. RudolfRed (talk) 17:43, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to move a draft to a real article

Hello. So recently (Like hours ago), the first "Virtual Fire drills" took place. I made draft for Virtual Fire Drills as the topic will be an article just because of it being a new COVID thing some schools are doing in America. I currently have the draft submitted, however, because it is so new (hours ago; new), There isn't much information on them. I know the topic will get more information soon, as it just started today. I am a new account, so I couldn't directly make the article page. Can someone either approve the draft (As it will be edited so much more once more information comes out about it) or move it from the draft state to the main article state? {This is also mentioned on Portal:Current events, just no direct article for it yet} Thanks in advance for help. CurrentWeather (talk) 18:56, 20 August 2020 (UTC) CurrentWeather (talk) 18:56, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather, welcome to Wikipedia and the teahouse! Per other newer editors, you should allow for the review to take place first in order to receive feedback. We don't give priority to specific articles, and they're usually reviewed randomly. FYI, this article will definitely need some expansion and signs that it passes WP:GNG. Ed talk! 18:59, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

How to create a article on our own?

 27.59.254.173 (talk) 16:06, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, IP user, and welcome to the Teahouse. My answer is, spend a few months improving existing articles before you try it. Creating a new article is one of the most difficult tasks there is in editing Wikipedia, especially for new editors; and those that try it before they have spent time learning how Wikipedia works and what are its requirements, often have a miserable and frustrating time. We delete hundreds of articles every day, many of them by people who have tried to create an article before understanding what this involves.

I advise you to take The Wikipedia Adventure if you haven't already, in order to learn about the process of editing Wikipedia; then to head to the Community portal and see some tasks that you might like to help with. Then when you are ready, please read Your first article. User:ian.thomson/Howto is also useful.

And did I mention that writing a new article is difficult, and I don't recommend it for new editors? --ColinFine (talk) 16:39, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

You might find things easier if you register an account. It makes communication with other editors easier (collaboration is an important part of the process here), and you can customize your environment with various gadgets and settings. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 20:58, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm new here. How do I get an article reviewed?

Hey, I am trying to get an article published about what I see to be a notable and novel political movement. I think that that am doing everything correctly but I wanted to make sure that there wasn't anything else that I am supposed to do to get it published.

The movement says that it is trying to unite the USA by providing a third ticket that unites both the left and right side of our politics. I think it is a notable and novel movement and has already gotten some media attention. I think having an article on it will be an important contribution to wikipedia. Can someone help me get it reviewed for publication? Is there anything else I have to do?

Here is my draft: [[Draft::Articles_of_Unity]] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Articles_of_Unity

Thanks! Stagename2020 (talk) 20:42, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@Stagename2020: Your article is in the queue for review, which is more like a blob than a line. It will reviewed when a volunteer gets around to reviewing it--please be patient! Calliopejen1 (talk) 21:11, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

(ec) @Stagename2020: Since you think YATP (yet another third party) is "notable and novel", I have to assume there is a reasonable chance you are attempting promotion, and have a COI, possibly paid. Please read those links, especially the last one, and make any necessary declarations required by our terms of service. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:17, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Article

Hey I want to publish an article about famous athlete but I’m not a creator how I can published it? Djdjdjdj12345 (talk) 18:28, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

The question here appears to be that Djdjdjdj12345 has been editing Draft:Kristina Vramencalieva, is not the person who created the article, and wants to know if can submit it? Or does that have to be the article creator? David notMD (talk) 18:37, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

It appears that another user User:Jjanhone is being paid to edit the same article. Theroadislong (talk) 18:42, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@Djdjdjdj12345, Jjanhone, David notMD, and Theroadislong: Any autoconfirmed user may at any time move any draft from draft space top the main article space, if s/he thinks in good faith that the draft meets the standards for an article, particularly the notability standards. The editor who does the move need not be the editor who created the draft, nor then one who has made the most edits to it. However, when multiple editors are working actively on the same draft, as seems to be the case for Draft:Kristina Vramencalieva, it is better practice and more courteous to obtain consensus for such a move before making it. In this case some copy-editing is needed, in my view, and additional cited sources would be desirable. There may also be a problem with the neutrality of the text. By the way, when a draft is not part of the WP:AFC project, I think it is better not to use AfC-style comments, but instead t0o post on the draft talk page, just as for an article. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC) @David notMD and Theroadislong: DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:25, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

New Article Question

Hi -I was wondering how I could edit my article to ensure that it gets approved after my next round of edits. Could you please help me understand where I need to cite/edit? Thank you!

Draft:Dada Group

Dsg61 (talk) 17:05, 20 August 2020 (UTC) Dsg61 (talk) 17:05, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Dsg61, welcome to the Teahouse and the world of drafts. Because your draft is declined due to no citations, you may have a better chance now that you have added several, however I would like you to add references in section "history" sentence 2, 5, as well as section Leadership sentence 2. In the sentence "The two platforms are interconnected and mutually beneficial," what do you mean? Do you meant that you personally think the two companies are important or what?

I also suggest you add this infobox to the top of the draft, putting information about the company, and possibly its logo. You must upload the logo in a low resolution, and have it tagged with fair use, and upload it here.

That's probably what I can suggest for now. Good luck in the next review. GeraldWL ✉ 17:38, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

One thing which would make life easier for a reviewer would be if you were to consolidate the places where you have used the same reference more than once, see WP:REFNAME. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:01, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

And doing so would make more obvious the fact that there are only five sources cited: the SEC registration (which is a primary source, and cannot contribute to notability); A CNBC article based on an interview, which cannot contribute to notability; and three press releases published by PR Newswire, which "is generally unreliable, as press releases published on the site are not subject to editorial oversight" (WP:Reliable sources/Noticeboard/Archive 260#PR Newswire and SYZYGY for Millennials WP article), which cannot contribute to notability. Please read CSMN, Dsg61. Don't spend time on an infobox until you've found reliable independent sources, since if you cannot demonstrate that the company is notable, all the work you or anybody else has put into the draft will be wasted effort. --ColinFine (talk) 22:34, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Why do you accept that one of your contributors steals stuff from my blog?

 Thesoccerdagger (talk) 22:45, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Can you supply more details of what’s happened? Neiltonks (talk) 22:47, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Neiltonks, might have something to do with Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/IncidentArchive1044#Thesoccerdagger,_Thecnsl,_Shotgun_pete,_plagiarism,_harassment,_and_aspersions Ed talk! 22:58, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) The op has very few edits. There is this and this blanking of large sections of the Hector Cribioli (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) article. There is also Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive1044#Thesoccerdagger, Thecnsl, Shotgun pete, plagiarism, harassment, and aspersions and User talk:Jackmcbarn#Thesoccerdagger and Shotgun Pete. MarnetteD|Talk 23:00, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

User initially claimed to be writing about friend's blog thecnsl.com [3] but now claims to actually be the creator of the blog [4] [5] [6] who was soft blocked as user:Thecnsl. So, either sharing the account or not giving us the full story upfront. Meters (talk) 23:42, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you now you see what kind of unreasonable individual this is. He is constantly throwing false accusations and libel about me and wikipedia members. Every single example he has presented I have provided a defense about my actions. At least two editors have come to the conclusion that I have done nothing wrong. Just observe his actions he is a liar and a hypocrite. He has not provided one defense of his actions about getting "inspiration" from wikipedia to write his blog posts. All I did was write several basic (year, team name, league, achievement) English wiki articles with reliable secondary sources. The cnsl.com operator believes he has a monopoly on NSL/CNSL content? Does he own the copyright to the newspaper articles? First of all no one on wikipedia is forcing that site to close down. So the operator is exaggerating and lying. Second the operator is a hypocrite because he hasn't explained why is it permissible for his website to contain player articles (Robin Megraw, José Testas, Corcel Blair, Attilio Galassini, etc) on older existing wiki articles, but when an editor from wikipedia wants to include basic NSL/CNSL info from a reliable secondary source in order to create a new article that is a problem. For the second time Soccerdagger hasn't responded to the question about player Olinto Sampaio Rubini? They both claim that the cnsl.com website is purely for fun so why the outrage? No editor from wikipedia is getting publicly recognized or paid for their contributions! None of their articles provide specific reliable sources and you have no copyright to the newspaper articles or league info. No to mention there are numerous player articles on the cnsl.com website with no wikipedia articles. To me it sounds like the operator is competing with wikipedia over NSL/CNSL content and wishes to make some profit off this stuff. If it's all for fun as he claims then there is no issue. He refuses to answer the questions or come to some reasonable conclusion and is constantly throwing accusations left and right. Now he using another wikipedia account which he claimed original was his friend. Can this conversion finally come to a conclusion as this operator doesn't want to be civil or reasonable? All he is going to do is throwing accusations, exaggerations, provide no defense or counter defense and make disruptive edits. If he truly does have an argument then he doesn't need to constantly use libel and ad hominems just provide a reasonable argument or defense. Shotgun pete (talk) 8:33, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Revolution Without Ammunition

Hello, I tried to publish the following article which is my new political ideology. It was rejected. I cited the only source which I used. Please kindly advise. Thank you!

condensing for brevity
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Revolution Without Ammunition The political ideology of Revolution without Ammunition was developed by Frederick Omoyoma Odorige, a Nigerian Military Scientist, Activist and Evangelist. He is originally from Urhuoka, Abraka in Delta State of Nigeria. The concept evolved in 2017 during his doctoral program at the National University of Public Service Hungary when he researched on Just Wars and Bad Peace: Nigerian Peace Keeping and Conflict Resolution since 1960. He connected his research with the political upheaval in Nigeria and how to involve the people's voices in order to enthrone a citizen-owned government. Revolution in this concept, is used to connote intense nonviolent protest to change all aspects of poor governance. The theory is based on the understanding that there is an imperative need to have a peaceful revolution of the people and the system whenever the government fails on its campaign promises - social contract - or when the suffering of the people becomes devastating and hopelessly linger without succor. The point where aspirations and expectations dangerously degenerate into artificial poverty and insecurity thereby endangering the lives and properties of the people should be the point to call for a protest revolution in order to collectively fight towards achieving stability and progress. The long silence of the people aids continuing bad governance. It is a national danger when the commonwealth of a people is cornered by a few. Whenever the rights and privileges of citizens are taken away by government, it gives birth to psychological warfare and trauma. Whenever violence is used as a method to provoke positive change, it could lead to violent conflicts where innocent and vulnerable ones may suffer as casualties. In such a situation, winning the peace become as destructive and complicated as the conflict itself. Peaceful and strategic revolutions must be executed without any form of violence or use of any form of lethal ammunition which usually end up killing more of the oppressed while the oppressors are secured by security agencies from the resources of the oppressed. Moreover, it is easier for the oppressed to escape from the country because they have looted resources at their disposals. Odorige opined that such revolution protests are difficult to organize in a diverse society. For it to succeed, all tribes, religion, region and political parties must put aside their differences and cooperate towards nation building for the common good of all. Cooperation is the most viable way of sustaining and promoting national patriotism for collective growth and equity. When the people put aside their differences against rulers, the possibility for change become easily achievable. Though the theory of Revolution Without Ammunition is hinged on Nigeria as a case study, it could also be applied to the politics of other countries experiencing a widening gap between the government and the people. Unarmed peaceful protesters have been killed by security agencies during the military and civilian government. Therefore, it is a call for citizens to put aside their differences in tribe, religion, region or political party affiliations and speak with one voice on a common platform. If there were national heroes who put aside their differences to fight colonialists for independence, new heroes must also emerge to fight the few neocolonialists who siphon the commonwealth of millions of her suffering citizens. In order for such a revolution to succeed, regular enlightenment programs must be implemented for the people to demystify, expose and drastically weaken the strategies of self-seeking politicians so that the unenlightened ones could be more conscious and emboldened to stand up for the protection of their rights. Public enlightenment is very vital in Nigeria because the many years of military rule and the use of security agencies by democratic governments to suppress peaceful protests has instilled so much fear into the people. Such actions bordering on awareness raising shall come about through various confidence building mechanism that boldly strengthen the citizens beyond defeat. This consciousness metamorphoses into rejecting mediocrity. The theoretical goals of the concept are to build citizen-owned governments where those in position of authority are constantly reminded of their roles as public servants instead of allowing them to impose themselves on the people as public masters. Odorige believes that the constant enlightenment through the social media in various languages and the use of town criers in remote villages could succeed in restoring the courage, confidence and rights of the people without necessarily destroying or burning the properties belonging to the government and private individuals. Constant writing, petitions, public speaking, workshops, conferences and boldly exposing the failures of government are ingredients of revolution without ammunition. One of the most vital elements of the concept when elaborate negotiations fail, is the final application of civil disobedience or open protest. In this case, citizens must stay at home and suspend all social, economic and political activities until their needs are met. This has become necessary because there is a wide gap between the people and those in government because representatives of the people mostly reside in the state and federal capital cities. They hardly interact with the people to understand their problems. Poverty could be an impediment to civil disobedience. Oppressive governments usually weaponize poverty as a tool against the people so that they do not have the courage to stay at home for fear of hunger. The long suffering of the people in the midst of huge natural resources is usually as a result of their long silence when politicians amass wealth for themselves and fail to keep their campaign promises. The people must not watch as politicians loot their collective resources which leave the people impoverished and hugely unsecured. A peaceful revolution is imperative in a country like Nigeria where federal legislators earn the highest in the world; borrow to entirely fund national budgets while millions of children continue to stay out of school within a society that lack basic infrastructures. It is even worse that despite her enviable natural resources, it has become the global capital of the world. A repressive situation such as this was made possible because politicians impose their selfish agenda and flagrantly disrespect the rule of law. Whenever such a revolution is delayed, future generations are bound to suffer and pay debts they know nothing about. In order to avoid this, it is expedient that the people form a common front where they could forcefully but peacefully change government policies that are inimical to progress, security and welfare. The people must be alert enough to sense early warning signals whenever a government is steadily derailing. Every strategy that is wrongfully raised by failed politicians must be quickly uprooted by the people through the instrumentality of networking, voice, protests, petition, persistence and prayers. The closing of work places, markets, schools, banks, transportation, and all forms of supplies and ceremonies must be sustainable and uniform across the country. In so doing, all economic, social and political meetings are suspended for a period of time until the government listen to the demands of the citizens. This become necessary especially when those in government consciously create a gap where the expectations of the people are neglected. The steady process of confidence building which lead to Revolution without ammunition must conclude with the goal of forcing government to do what is necessary within the ambit of the law and within a given time frame. The challenges of this concept are hinged on the fact that the people mostly work for daily survival. When poverty is used as a weapon, the people find it difficult to stay at home for too long. In that situation, the people must quickly flood the streets as a way of shortening the period of staying at home. A flood of human heads overcomes the power of the gun. The fear of violent repression by security agencies often deter citizens from protesting. The irony of the repression by security agencies is that the police and soldiers are also part of the suffering masses. Security chiefs usually receive financial benefits to keep bad governments in office. In that situation, the people must flood the streets in large numbers that could overwhelm that of the security agents. Before then, the enlightenment campaign must be extended to the security agencies in order to weaken their resistance against the revolution. Revolution in this contest is an orchestrated protest of citizens to revolutionize a decaying system. It is the positive action of the people where their numbers are large and their demands are well articulated from a period of time to a time when the demands must be met. This concept albeit relate to the teaching of Sun Tzu the classical Chinese Military strategist who posits that 'To fight and conquer in all our battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting'.1<ref>Art Of War https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/sun-tzu/works/art-of-war/ch03.htm<ref> There must come a time in the life of a people when real change does not come only from the promises of politicians but from the determination and strong will of the people. The point must be reached where the people do not seek a leader to be at the forefront of the revolution because everyone will automatically become a leader towards achieving a common goal. On the day of freedom the majority must boldly stand up and say NO to vote buying; NO to insecurity; No to disenfranchisement; No to corruption; No to rigging; No to bogus salaries for state, federal legislators and the executives; No to the murderous herdsmen; No to political godfathers; No to Boko haram and their sponsors; No to unsteady electricity supply; No to inadequate health care facilities; No to politicians who travel abroad for health care while our people die at home; No to delay in the payment of salaries and pensions; No to budget padding; No to injustice and the detention of Nigerians without trial; No to those that continue to undermine the voices and rights of citizens; No to recycled leaders; No to indiscriminate allocation of oil blocs; No to marginalization and the continuing environmental degradation in Niger Delta and other regions; No to inflated and abandoned projects; No to selective anti-corruption fight; No to V.I.P. treatment to some persons in prison; No to life pension for former Governors and former Presidents; No to some religious leaders that have lied and led us astray; No to state electoral commissions inaugurated and manipulated by Governors; No to disenfranchisement; No to whatever has held us down as a people. We stand up to reclaim and redistribute our commonwealth.

—Fodorige (talk) 23:56, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Fodorige Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Wikipedia is not a place to write about things that we create one day or our own personal theories or thoughts. This is an encyclopedia, where in order to merit an article a subject must receive significant coverage in multiple published independent reliable sources, showing how the subject meets the special Wikipedia definition of notability. Your ideology needs to be noticed and written about by others in order to merit a Wikipedia article, and you shouldn't be the one to write any article about it, as you have a conflict of interest as the originator of this ideology. If you just want to tell the world about it, you should use a personal blog or social media. 331dot (talk) 00:06, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Please Respond: I am Christopher S. Adams, Jr., Major General, USAF (Re) and wish to replace and update my photograph with an Official P, IS NOT an official Photograph. Please advise as to the proper procedure.

 Mary A. Adams (talk) 16:51, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to The Teahouse Mary A. Adams. You have also asked the same question here Wikipedia:Editor assistance/Requests if you have a freely-licensed image that you own the copyright to, it should be uploaded to Wikimedia Commons, a central location for images where they can be used on all Wikipedia projects. Theroadislong (talk) 17:38, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Mary A. Adams, welcome to the Teahouse. I don't understand what you mean by an official photograph. Do you mean a photograph taken by the government? I don't personally think a government-affiliated person must have an official photograph as the primary identification of said person. Can you help clarify your request? GeraldWL ✉ 17:42, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy link to article Chris Adams (general). Theroadislong (talk) 18:22, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Mary A. Adams. Why did you choose Mary A. Adams as your username if you’re really Christopher S. Adams, Jr.? Are you perhaps a relative of his instead? In addition, is there something wrong (or that you don’t like) about the photo currently used in the article? You can discuss any concerns you may have about the photo at Talk:Chris Adams (general), but before you do that please carefully read through Wikipedia:Conflict of Interest. — Marchjuly (talk) 22:33, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Moved to Talk:Chris Adams (general) § Photograph

(and User talk:Mary A. Adams#Shared use) —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 00:12, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

How long does it take for reference desk questions to get answered?

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

OP has been blocked for a username violation and vandalism; moreover, it's unlikely any further discussion here at the Teahouse regarding this is necessary. The OP's question was sufficiently answered by HiLo48 and want came after is essentially nothing but a bit of WP:DRAMA. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:29, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

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Hi everyone, I was just wondering how long it usually takes to answer a question that got asked at the reference desk. Thanks John Dong Longson (talk) 03:40, 20 August 2020 (UTC) John Dong Longson (talk) 03:40, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Anywhere between minutes and a couple of days. Sometimes not at all if the subject is outside the areas of interest of those who frequent the desk. A bit of a guide can be seen by looking at the timestamps of earlier questions and responses. HiLo48 (talk) 03:44, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

John Dong Longson, the reference desks do not answer questions that ask for medical advice, as yours did. They do not answer questions that involve fart trolling, as yours did. Editors there may be reluctant to answer questions from editors with trolling usernames, as it appears that you have. So, there is all of that. Are you here to improve this encyclopedia or to be a troll? Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 06:12, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Cullen328, my question was not a request for medical advice. A question asking for medical advice would be something like “should we avoid inhaling farts?” Things that are fart-related are not necessarily trolling, and I would ask you to please be mature. Finally, I am struggling to see how you reach the conclusion that I have a “trolling username”. From a juvenile perspective, maybe? “Dong” as my middle name is from my mother’s side of my family - I am half Chinese. Cheers. John Dong Longson (talk) 10:47, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Page has been reviewed notice

I received the notice "The page Thailand Quality Award has been reviewed." I was told by the reviewer that this was part of some patrol process. Two questions related to this:
1) Shouldn't it say article and not page? I have seen more senior editors correct others that articles are articles and not pages.
2) Where in the article is it noted that it was reviewed? I looked in the history and the talk page and found no record of it having been reviewed. --Ian Korman (talk) 02:36, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi IanKorman. The word "page" was probably used without any specific meaning attached to it. WP:NPP is a short-cut for "Wikipedia:New pages patrol", so "page" was probably chosen simply to make it easier to apply to all Wikipedia pages. You can ask about this as well as the part of your post at Wikipedia talk:New pages patrol/Reviewers and someone more familiar with how NPP works probably will be able to better answer your questions. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:50, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Marchjuly. I asked the second question there as advised. --Ian Korman (talk) 03:08, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@IanKorman: You won't find a record of the review in the history or the talk page, but you will find it in the article's log page (linked from the top of the history). --David Biddulph (talk) 03:45, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: Kudos to you. I had not thought to look there since I don't do much editing involving that area. There is even a check box for patrolling. --Ian Korman (talk) 01:26, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Creating a link

Yesterday I added a sentence to a page and also created a link, but was unsuccessful and now the link is sitting down at the bottom of the page. Could someone please fix it? Thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Breedlove 72.216.147.54 (talk) 01:52, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

• Done :D HeartGlow ^(talk) 03:03, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey - you're pretty good with this stuff. Thanks for your help.

Is there a consensus here?

This RfC has been going on for 9 days, and it followed a discussion that went on for 12 days. Many editors have commented and many edits to the disputed part were made. Just when it seemed we can see a consensus at the end, I was informed that there is no consensus there.

I have three questions:

• Is there a consensus there?
• (if yes) How can the consensus be apparent beyond doubt?
• (if no) How can consensus be achieved here?

Thanks. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 01:26, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Aditya Kabir: Have you looked at WP:RFC, which links to the various noticeboards, addresses procedural issues, etc.? —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 01:45, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

I did. This particular RfC is quite muddled already (I happen to be partly responsible for that).

But there was a healthy discussion that followed, where it looked like it had a consensus. Now that is has been explicitly posted that there is no consensus, I can assume only two things - there really was no consensus, or this was a denial of consensus. If the former is true then we need to solicit some mechanism to achieve a consensus. If the latter is true then we need have a mechanism to make the consensus undeniable.

(added) As an involved participant, I am not supposed to close the RfC. But without a formal closer this dispute can't be taken to mediation. It would be even better if we can establish the existence of a consensus already. 21 days of discussion is a bit too long. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 02:19, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Aditya Kabir I don't see how anyone can plausibly describe the pre-rfc discussion as having achieved consensus. I don't really think the RfC has yet achieved consensus either, but a closer might possibly call it as a "rough consensus". You could post at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Requests for closure askign for a formal close by an admin or another experienced editor who is not involved. But wehat is the rush? note that WP:RFC says in the "duration" section: An RfC should last until enough comment has been received that consensus is reached, or until it is apparent it won't be. There is no required minimum or maximum duration; however, Legobot assumes an RfC has been forgotten and automatically ends it (removes the rfc template) 30 days after it begins, to avoid a buildup of stale discussions cluttering the lists and wasting commenters' time. This is way short of 30 days old. Yes it can be closed if consensus has been reached, but if it hasn't more discussion can be allowed. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 06:23, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks. I found out the 30 day stipulation at ANB too. That's cool. BTW, FYI, IMHO, the consensus is not in the previous discussions, it's in the solutions parts of the RfC (sorry for the acronyms, couldn't resist the chance to type a series of CAPs). Y Let me pour you a cup of darjeeling as a token of my regards. This the first nasty disupte I have come across in my 14 years of service here. A bit mystified and vexed by the labyrinth of process. Back in the earlier days it was more about building the encyclopedia and most guidelines were about content. Now, I guess, maintaining the encyclopedia is more of the task and hence the prevelance of community guidelines. One can defintely learn to live with it. Y Another cup? I'll pour one too. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 06:59, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello everybody, There is a big problem out there

So, I can't edit lots of page as i am not a confirmed users. But I've been here for nearly a year and done more than 10 edits. This is the issue here, I should be the confirmed users instead of this. Also, I have obviously done 100+ edits to the wiki, and created some useful pages... Help to resolve my issue, ok. Hypersonic man11^Talk Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 04:43, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Hypersonic man 11. Can you give an example of one of the pages you're unable to edit? It could be that the page has been protected for some reason which means there might be lots of editors unable to edit it. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:03, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I just found that there is a glitch, and also Egyptian Air Force is the page, nvm. But still, thanks,. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hypersonic man 11 (talk • contribs) 05:14, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hypersonic man 11: Egyptian Air Force was semi-protected due to "Addition of unsourced or poorly sourced content". However, with 300+ edits in 10 months, you are auto-confirmed and should have been able to edit it, so I don't know what "glitch" you are referring to (unless it was just that you were not logged-in when you tried). In any case, I see that you have been able to edit the page successfully. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 07:05, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Not having a article

Why doesn't YouTuber Jaiden animations have a Wikipedia page? joel —Other account was deleted (talk) 07:10, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Other account was deleted, welcome to the Teahouse. Jaiden Animations once have an article, but is deleted several times on 25 October 2019, 19 June 2019, 28 August 2018, 3 April 2018, 24 March 2018, and 28 September 2017. There is still an archive discussion, see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jaiden Animations. Basically, he receives little to no independent reliable and reputable coverage by news, magazines, books, etc. to actually have him have an article. See WP:CCS. There is a draft on him right now, see Draft:Jaiden Animations. Before you edit it, kindly see WP:BLP, WP:GNG, WP:YFA. WP:CCS, and other relevant guidelines. Articles need reference sources which are independent, reliable, and reputable enough to cite the claims. Not all YouTubers that have tons of subscribers and views is actually notable in an encyclopedia means, bear that in mind. Let me know if you need to ask anything again. Thanks, from GeraldWL ✉ 07:29, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Help with Tradional Chinese Medicine page

Can I please have some help to improve the Tradional Chinese Medicine page. I am new to Wikipedia. I feel that the page needs some Ballance to put it nicely. I think it has a bit of a narrative happening Shenqijing (talk) 09:12, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Shenqijing Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. If there are specific changes you want to see, please propose them on the article talk page. Please understand that every Wikipedia article summarizes what independent reliable sources state. This includes giving weight to viewpoints as reliable sources report them; Wikipedia does not provide equal time or equal space to all points of view. See WP:FRINGE for more information. 331dot (talk) 09:21, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Like you were told at Talk:Traditional_Chinese_medicine#Critiques, If you are proposing a change to the article, please specify what it is and what sources you are citing to backup that change.. Do that at that talkpage, that's how WP works. Try starting small, say with something you want to improve in the Regulations section, and see how that goes. WP:MEDRS may be of interest. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:22, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Talk Page blanking

Is Blanking a talk page considered personal attack? 118.137.248.125 (talk) 09:17, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

I don't know the entire context of your question, but it's probably not a "personal attack" like calling someone a name. 331dot (talk) 09:20, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hello, IP editor. That sounds more like vandalism if another person does it. You could leave them a warning and escalate, if it happens again. The only person who should be blanking a talkpage is the user themselves (or possibly an admin if the talk page has been used solely by that user for inappropriate purposes). Nick Moyes (talk) 09:21, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Blanking talkpages that are not yours will probably be seen as at least WP:DISRUPTIVE. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:24, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Note: Having asked this question here, the IP editor then immediately blanked article content from the page about Spanish Wikipedia. I have therefore increased their warning notice as it was clearly intentional, and such vandalism will not be tolerated. Nick Moyes (talk) 09:52, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Ah, I get it now. This IP editor has been disruptive across other Wikipedia Projects (see here for their global contributions), and so has come here. Since the start of their editing activities a few hours ago, they've since been blocked on mediawiki.org; meta.wikimedia.org and id.wikipedia.org. If I see one further bad faith edit on en-wiki from them I will definitely be immediately blocking them here too. Nick Moyes (talk) 10:12, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Verifiable references and links

Hi there, I am trying to edit an existing page of a musician (Gayathri Girish). It is a biographic page. I need some help on: 1. identifying if some of my reference sources are acceptable for publication 2. Since the subject is a musician, much of her content appears on youtube and on sites like appleitunes, saavn etc. Is it okay for me to add these as references in the discography section? I find that I am unable to make out where this stops being a reference point and becomes an advertisement. I have noticed links to itunes on some other musician pages, so I am hopeful that this is acceptable. Thanks so much for your time Pratima.lakshmanan (talk) 06:34, 21 August 2020 (UTC) Pratima.lakshmanan (talk) 06:34, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Pratima.lakshmanan: references to youtube and other user-generated sites are sometimes acceptable and sometimes they aren't. It mainly depends on the uploading party. If the uploading party is the subject of the article, it's not acceptable due to WP:SELFPUB and WP:PRIMARY in most cases. If it's not the subject, but another party with some editorial control that would meet WP:RS then it can be acceptable. Victor Schmidt (talk) 07:08, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Victor Schmidt -Thanks for your response on the youtube type links. That is helpful. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pratima.lakshmanan (talk • contribs) 10:20, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

in realstate If one doesnt declose to the bank that they are selling a property, wouldnt that person sell the property eligally? and without an assessment couldnt I reverse the sale of property?

 Chuckified (talk) 11:07, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

This doesn't appear to be related to Wikipedia. We are only able to answer questions regarding Wikipedia and cannot give legal adivice. Victor Schmidt (talk) 11:36, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Request for notability guidelines

Hi, I'm a Wikipedian author who is writing about Indonesian government officials, and was thinking to divert to the viral world. I want to make an article about Muhammad Didit, an Indonesian youtuber who has gone viral as Man who did nothing for 2 hours. You could search the term on Google, and it will generate some web sources, especially the one from Phillipines, who is regarded as the Philippines' newspaper of record. Could someone review the notability of this person? Thank you. Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 02:22, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi, Jeromi Mikhael, welcome to the Teahouse. If you have sufficient sources that can explain things about him, you can sure write one. You are pointing out an Indonesian YouTuber, meaning you'll write a biography. Biographies are usually hard to make, but if you can make one, sure. Only write sentences that can be backed up by sources; do not make unsourced reliable claims. Feel free to ask more things on my talk page if you have a lot more to ask. Terima kasih, dari GeraldWL 06:38, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Do you think I should make an article about the person or the video? Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 12:16, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Jeromi Mikhael, it really depends on the notability. I suggest making the biography, just to add more to the notability of the subject. But if the video is the one notable, write the video. GeraldWL ✉ 12:23, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Here is the draft. Could you asses the notability? Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 12:33, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Jeromi Mikhael, you must describe what the video is about, write the summary, as well as several other things, of course, backed up by the sources. I'll try help you with that. GeraldWL ✉ 12:36, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Ehh...I mean asking you if it's worth it to make an article about the video. It won't be funny if I finished making the video and someone told me that the video is not notable.... Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 12:39, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Jeromi Mikhael, seeing the video getting international notability, I think it is decently worth having an article on it. There's little information I can render based on the sources you give, though. I suggest you do more research to the video, see if there's any interviews or other articles on the subject. That way you can add more stuff. GeraldWL ✉ 13:10, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Eh, I think you could try searching Man who did nothing for 2 hours or 2 Jam Nggak Ngapa-Ngapain video. This particular video is weird because there's more international exposure compared to domestic exposure. Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 13:15, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Request for guidance

Hello. I have been editing Draft:David J. Zimmerman and see that the draft is sorted as "C-class". Being a new editor, I'm not clear on how to proceed going forward with this draft in order to improve its chances of being approved as an article. Is it possible to get specific guidance, or is it simply a matter of waiting until a reviewer has an opportunity to review it? Thanks.VictorMooney (talk) 03:32, 21 August 2020 (UTC) VictorMooney (talk) 03:32, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi VictorMooney. It looks like Draft:David J. Zimmerman is still awaiting an WP:AFC review. I'm not sure what you mean by "Class-C", since that's an assessment that usually only applied to articles, not drafts. You can continue improving the draft even though you submitted it for review. If it turns out that the draft is reviewed and declined, the AfC reviewer who looked it over should leave a comment explaining why and suggesting things that need to be improved.

I'm not an AfC reviewer, but one thing I noticed is that the draft seems a bit "bottom-heavy". What I mean is that there seems to be an excessive number of awards and exhibitions listed (almost as if you were trying to list them all like you would on a CV) when compared to actual textual content about Zimmrman himself. I'm sure that every award an artist receives or every exhbition they hold has a special meaning to the artist, but it's not clear if it has the same relevance to a typical Wikipedia reader. So, it might be better to trim out those sections to only those things which are considered to be truly major awards (possibly those which have or could have Wikipedia articles written about them) and those exhibitions which are truly major ones (like something held a well-known galleries/venues that received lots of critical coverage, perhaps venues which might have Wikipedia articles written about them). One exhbition (One Voice; Portraits from the Tibetan Diaspora) is listed eleven times; for sure, it was held at a different venue each time, but do all eleven need to be listed. The same thing could be said for some of the other entires as well.

What's most likely going to determine whether the AfC reviewer feels Zimmerman meets WP:NARTIST is what's written in the "Life and work" section of the article; so, that's what you want the reviewer to be focusing on. Sometimes adding too many lists of things later on in the might seem like a good thing because "more just has to be better", but it can sometimes be seen as clutter and even a bit of WP:BOMBARD when each entry is being cited. Just is just my general opinion; if you want some more specific advice or suggestions, you can try asking for feedback at WT:VA, Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Photography or Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography/Arts and entertainment since that's where you're likely to come across editors who are experienced in writing these types of biography articles. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:36, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Agreed. Perhaps you could note in the text that "One Voice" has been featured in 11 exhibitions, and then only note the most prestigious under exhibitions. Same for "Deserts", etc. etc. Same sort of thought process for Awards. Quite often, less is more! Best of luck, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 06:32, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, just saw that MJ made some of the same observations- points....two people now, saying the same thing...Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 06:36, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

VictorMooney, the draft is listed as C-class near the foot of Wikipedia:AfC sorting/Culture/Visual arts and perhaps elsewhere. I think that this means "SDZeroBot guesstimates that if the subject is notable and the sourcing good, then the bulk of this article would likely put it in C class." (SD0001 may wish to correct me.) Anyway, "C" does not mean "close to failure" or anything like it. ¶ I'm puzzled by some of Timtrent's comments: (i) "a list of his works is interesting, but almost always irrelevant." This seems to sugges that there's a list of his works. I don't notice any. (ii) "Does (eg) Worldcat hold a directory of his works?" I don't even know what this means. If "Does Worldcat show that any academic or other major library holds a directory of his works?" then surely not, because libraries don't hold directories of anyone's works -- unless these are published books, but published directories of photographers' works are vanishingly rare. (They might exist for 19th-century photographers. As for 20th-century photographers, I can't think of any photographer who has one: not Kertész, not Cartier-Bresson, not Frank.) (iii) "References to self saved pdfs are useless." Those hosted at squarespace.com? I count a total of one (1) of these for the entire article. (A quick glance may suggest that there are also a few others, but these were commented out before the draft was declined.) -- Hoary (talk) 08:42, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hoary, I guess one could quibble and be declined a lot, or one could make the improvements and be accepted. There ought to be no rating on the talk page. Fiddle Faddle 08:47, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, Timtrent, perhaps the writer of the draft should simply knuckle down and delete the list that isn't there, provide info from Worldcat that Worldcat couldn't have for anybody, and remove references that don't exist to self-saved PDFs. The rating isn't on the talk page; it's on Wikipedia:AfC sorting/Culture/Visual arts. (If I've misunderstood something, please correct me.) -- Hoary (talk) 08:59, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you all for the comments. The feedback is very helpful. VictorMooney (talk) 16:16, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Article with incorrect information

Hi. Thank you very much for inviting me to the Teahouse. What do you do if you know an article is incorrect and can prove it? The article in question is KHive. Fastred Tiller (talk) 16:52, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Talk:KHive is the place for discussion of that article. You need to support any suggested changes with references to published reliable sources independent of the subject. --David Biddulph (talk) 16:59, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Making edits to page/article of employer company/brand

Hi Wikipedia Teahouse, Appreciate this platform here and its supportive purpose. What is the best way to make edits/updates to the Wikipedia article for a company/brand ones works for? It should not only more current, but factually accurate. The edits have sources/citations for added legitimacy. Orod.REC (talk) 10:11, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Orod.REC, welcome to the Teahouse. If you want to update a statistic or data, make sure to back it up with reliable source(s). If you want to edit a company on an info, make sure to back it up with source(s) too. GeraldWL ✉ 10:15, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

For a company/brand ones works for, follow the directions at WP:COI. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:19, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Orod.REC: and please make sure that you don't violate the terms of use. WP:PAID has more on this. Victor Schmidt (talk) 11:38, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

WP:PAID is high priority. As an employee, you are required to declare that on your User page. Secondly, as an employee, you are enjoined from editing the article directly. Instead, you are to propose specific changes on the article's Talk page - with appropriate references - so that a non-affiliated editor can review and decide to incorporate or not. David notMD (talk) 17:31, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

I have difficulties putting up an article on Wikipedia

I have difficulties putting up an article on Wikipedia Prof. Fiofio (talk) 19:09, 21 August 2020 (UTC) The article in question is https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ridwan_K.D._Osman.jpeg — Preceding unsigned comment added by Prof. Fiofio (talk • contribs) 19:10, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Prof. Fiofio: The link you posted is to an image, which was uploaded with what appears to be an attempt at posting an article in the image comments. I also see a draft you started Draft:Ambassador Ray Quarcoo which is unsourced and non-encyclopedic, and will not be accepted in its current format. Please read WP:YOURFIRSTARTICLE. (Please remember to sign your posts on talk pages by typing four keyboard tildes like this: ~~~~. Or, you can use the [ reply ] button, which automatically signs posts.) TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 19:56, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Finding an uninvolved RfC closer

Is there a recommended procedure for finding someone to close an RfC, instead of trying editors one by one until you find someone?  --Lambiam 20:11, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Lambiam, try WP:RFCLOSE. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:16, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

How to edit the title of an Article

Draft:Young Kim) I created a new Article, called it- Young Kim, and submitted it for review. However, I would like to change its Title by adding a description, in that there is already an Article under the same name. While I have the first sentence distinguishing among various Young Kims on Wikipedia, I would like to add a descriptor. How do I do that? Under Edit or Edit Source, I cannot get to the Title. Thank you, Jane Plutoplato (talk) 20:24, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Plutoplato Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Since we are talking about a draft, I would just leave a note for reviewers about the title. When and if it is accepted, the reviewer will handle the renaming. For regular articles, changing the title is done with a page move. 331dot (talk) 20:28, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Professional translator - and newbie editor on EN and NO Wikipedia - was blocked from publishing an English version of a Norwegian article - please advise and/or help with publishing

Howdy! I translated the Norwegian article https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Magnusson but was blocked when I attempted to publish the English translation. The reason given was my status as an "inexperienced" new editor on English Wikipedia. In truth, I am a newbie Wiki editor in general. My first article in Norwegian was the article about Oscar Magnusson. I am proud to say that the article is getting a decent number of views. It is also cool to see that other Wiki editors are helping out by adding supplemental info and references.

The English translation of the Norwegian article is identical to the original content, and it would be great to get some assistance with getting it published.

After my attempt to publish the English translation was blocked, I decided to use the option of publishing the English version as a DRAFT. I'm hoping that this means that it will be easy to get help with publishing it later on.

Please contact me if you are an experienced English Wiki editor who can help publish the English version or tell me how to obtain such assistance. EngelskOversetter (talk) 10:03, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

EngelskOversetter, are you blocked in the NO or EN Wikipedia? I tried looking at your talkpage in the NO Wikipedia, and found no evidence of you being blocked. If its true that you were blocked solely for translating and being a newbie, that is a discussion you can bring up at the NO Wikipedia. This is the English Wikipedia, and policies may differ here and there. GeraldWL ✉ 10:15, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm confused here, Engelsk. Is it here or there? I found no evidence of you being blocked. GeraldWL ✉ 10:17, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Working on Draft:Oscar Magnusson is the right way to go. You have never been blocked on en-wiki, nor would you be simply for moving a translation into main article space too soon. Nick Moyes (talk) 10:20, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Rather than being blocked, he is probably referring to being prevented from creating an article directly in mainspace. David Biddulph (talk) 10:21, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

EngelskOversetter, Hello! I think you mean that you can not yet create an article directly because WP:AUTOCONFIRM. I see you created Draft:Oscar Magnusson (wow, no other Oscar Magnusson in en-WP?). It needs more/better sources (see WP:GNG), otherwise it will probably not be accepted. You can try to find interested editors at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Military history. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:28, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Gråbergs Gråa Sång, Hello back! Firstly, thanks to you and the others who have provided feedback to my inquiry. The blocking occurred when I attempted to publish my completed English translation, which by the way, includes a translation of the descriptive text in the original references. All of the original references are relevant to the English version of the article on Magnusson. Oddly, these complete references were omitted when I opted to publish a draft version. It was not my intention to publish an English version without references. It seems quite unfair and unfortunate that the process of publishing a basic English translation of an article in Norwegian must be made so complicated. Furthermore, my understanding is that it was the English Wikipedia rules that prevented me from publishing an English translation, i.e. not the Norwegian Wikipedia. This should be more clearly stated in the notice of denial. In conclusion, the English translation remains unpublished despite the fact that it contains all the original references. EngelskOversetter (talk) 11:21, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Oscar Magnusson/Oscar Magnusson

EngelskOversetter No it doesn't. Your draft has two refs, books by the subject. The no-WP article has several more. Anyway, what is close to demanded on en-WP are WP:Inline citations throughout the text, and your draft has none. The no-WP article has a few, but most of the text has none. Put the references you have in the draft-text where they belong. WP:TUTORIAL describes how to insert references, I mostly use RefToolbar myself. When you think your draft is ready, use the blue submit-button on the draftpage.

About stuff being complicated (they can be, WP takes time to learn), remember that the different language WP:s "rule themselves". An article existing on no-WP does not mean it should exist on en-WP, or vice versa. It's possible that en-WP has generally stricter "rules" than many other WP:s. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:53, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@EngelskOversetter: To put it slightly differently, creating a new article on enwiki is subject to the same standards regardless of whether it is a translation of work from another wiki or a totally new original creation "from scratch". It has to pass notability guidelines, have inline citations for any statements that are not common knowledge or disputable, comply with our Manual of Style, etc. Each Wikimedia Foundation project (individual language Wikipedias, Wikisource, Wikibooks, Wiktionary, Wikidata, etc.) is a separate project, with independent policies, procedures, and administrators.

Please note that blocking has a specific meaning here: an administrative action used to prevent a user from editing the project, usually after bad behavior. This has not happened to you, nor should it. That was the source of some of the mis-understanding above. Currently, your draft has not even been submitted for review – it simply has received some useful comment on its current state from experienced editors here regarding issues that would keep it from being approved. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:12, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Need help with reviewing my Wiki Draft

Hi everyone! I was was submitting a Wikipedia entry for Elizabeth Marguiles who's a known TV personality on Bravo TV - also a known art collector / heiress and daughter of Martin Margulies of the Margulies Private Collection Miami, which has its own Wiki page. Would love to for feedback on the revised draft and how I can have it improved before resubmitting. I've worked through to include more secondary sources as well of some major profiles on her in art world publications. Thank you so much! Giakuan (talk) 20:51, 21 August 2020 (UTC) Giakuan (talk) 20:51, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Giakuan! One thing you need to do is to get the external links like "Galerie Magazine" in the lead out of the text of the article, see WP:EL. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 21:03, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Gråbergs Gråa Sång! Thank you that's so helpful, I'll remove that now. any other edits or feedback welcome as well, newer to this. Giakuan (talk) 21:09, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Giakuan: Hi - it seems that you know Elizabeth. Many of the sources you used for her projects don't even mention her. See WP:COI and WP:PAID. If you make the necessary disclosures, I then recommend blowing up the article, and rewriting it just using the media coverage about her. Don't put in anything that isn't in the sources, and you'll find it will come across as less promotional and fawning, and will be more likely to be accepted. It will be shorter but that's often better. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 00:59, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Becoming an admin

Could you please tell me how to become a Wikipedia administrator?OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 14:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC) OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 14:24, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, OrangeCD-ROM. You can read more about the role and requirements at Wikipedia:Administrators. It usually takes a few years of intensive editing, with many thousands of edits and a clearly demonstrated understanding of our policies and procedures. The wider community are then able to express their views on that person's suitability over a week-long period. Why do you ask? Nick Moyes (talk) 14:39, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to The Teahouse, The only prerequisites for adminship are having an account and being extended confirmed (having both 30 days' tenure and 500 edits) so that you can file your own nomination here Wikipedia:Requests for adminship. However, the likelihood of passing without being able to show significant positive contributions to the encyclopedia is extremly low. I’ve been editing virtually every day for 14 years with more than 100,000 edits, but even now wouldn’t consider I had what it takes to become an admin. Theroadislong (talk) 14:50, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

I think there's a sensible middle ground somewhere between those two extremes! and, Theroadislong, I'm sure you do! (But I'm still not sure I have what it takes to be a good admin - yet earlier this year the community trusted me enough to give me those few extra editing rights and responsibilities. The hard work and attention to detail starts from there. One can only do one's best.) Nick Moyes (talk) 15:35, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Just out of curiosity, does that figure of 500 edits include edits to things like user pages, talk pages, sandboxes, Teahouse questions, and the like? Or does it refer only to edits to actual articles? The reason I ask is that my own edit count seems to be creeping up (faster than I would have expected), but I would guess a lot of those are to my sandbox, which I have recently been using to draft several articles. As I say, I am only asking out of curiosity, not because of any lofty ambition on my part.

Mike Marchmont (talk) 16:22, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Mike Marchmont, pretty much, but the area's you've edited in will be analysed and will be criticised in a RfA. And don't worry, I started in April at like 15 edits and now I'm at nearly 10,000. It does creep up fast, especially if you spend a lot of time here. Ed talk! 16:27, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@Ed6767: Thanks for your reply, Ed. Your edit count is very impressive. Keep up the good work.Mike Marchmont (talk) 18:45, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@OrangeCD-ROM: I usually answer this FAQ by first asking "Why do you want to be an admin?" This usually identifies an incorrect idea in the requester's mind about how Wikipedia works. Also, I did some research on this in July: Special:Permalink/965892924#Applying_for_admin. New users simply do not (and should not) become admins. "Out of about 1100 [current] admins, only 25 joined Wikipedia in 2013 or later. The newest of those joined 19 months ago." —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 20:46, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Okay, I know the following may be rather silly, over-the-top and idealistic, but anyway...

On the off-chance that an editor with the basic 500 edits was promoted to Admin, it would not end well. It would be like sending an unprepared missonary to live with savage cannibals on some strange planet. This editor doesn't know how to hunt, or forage in the forest, or build relationships with the people. They are unacquainted with the language or local history. The editor's cries of "I mean well!" coupled with "You must respect me!" would probably lead to a bad and bloody end.

My observation is that a good Admin is humble, not proud. They chose to wield a mop, not a sword. They seek to serve, not to garner admiration. (All of this may be somewhat idealistic, I know.) So, if a new user is determined to be an Admin, then they will chose to dedicate many years of service, and, even then, wait for their peers (all of us) to recognize their virtues. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 05:46, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey Tribe of Tiger I think you got that absolutely right. I remember when I started out here 10 years ago, I feared I might lose out to other, more assertive editors, and I naievely thought that being an admin would help me get my way, if ever that were needed, and if ever I could become one. That really was an utterly silly thing for me to believe back then. I waited many, many years before discovering that helping out as an admin would be a good move - not for me, but for the Project as a whole. Being an admin gives me no power over any good faith editor, but a fair bit of authority over vandals and WP:COI editors, and the tools to help maintain the encyclopaedia. I spend my time jhelping out and keeping the site clearer of vandals and POV editors, and I regret that I oftentimes find myself having to be brutally blunt - and even rude - about the reality of POV editing here to new users. I try to be fair (and not a complete bastard), and I constantly worry that I am being over-bearing to problem editors. It is a very difficult path to tread, but I, for one, am willing to be recalled as an admin if the community no longer feels that it has the confidence I can serve their needs. We really cannot have naieve or inexperienced editors as admins, but we do need committed editors like you to consider whether being an admin in the future might be something they'd like to aim for. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 23:41, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Dear Nick Moyes, Thanks so very much, for this kind reply! Frankly, I will never be an admin. It would take me too many years to acquire the technical skills, etc., and I am waayy too old to start. As you and I both know now, an admin actually has "less" power in an article dispute, per WP:INVOLVED, not more! New editors do not, of course, understand this. I think your confession of your own earlier misunderstanding, proves my point, regarding "humble". One of the many things I appreciate about WP is that those "in power" are held to a strict code of conduct and responsibility. There is some latitude, or course, but a jury of WP editors, all of whom may state their objections, prevents us from being ruled by "power-hungry Admins" (or editors). I am suddenly reminded of Aladdin, as voiced by Robin Williams, "Great, great power, teeny-tiny living space."

Having read your comments here at the Teahouse over the years, I was very pleased, but not at all surprised, to learn that you had become an Admin. Many thanks for the willing service work you do, by treading the difficult path, and making the hard decisions. Still, you take the time to be kind and helpful! Perhaps, within WP, you wield a mop, but when it come to POV/COI editors and vandals, Admins are like a cherubim, brandishing a fiery sword. (The Harper Collins Study Bible. HarperCollins Publishers. 2006. p. 10.) You good people, who are obviouly committed to our Project, stand as our protectors. Best wishes, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 02:34, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia use in class projects?

Is there someone who has knowledge about issues with students/instructors editing Wikipedia as part of assignments? If so, perhaps you can contribute at Wikipedia:Help desk#class assignment using student sandboxes if necessary. It seems like there was someone among our Teahouse hosts that has dealt with this, but I can't recall who it is (maybe Nick Moyes?). —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 02:46, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: By the time I woke up this murning, it looked like all the salient points have been covered. Nick Moyes (talk) 07:26, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Source of funding

I was wondering that we as Wikipedia seek a donation from the users/visitors instead why not request for a token fee from companies who have Wikipedia pages. As directly or indirectly they are able to advertise their business through a respectable platform. Thoughts? Juliansekar (talk) 09:13, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Juliansekar Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. This isn't really a place to propose new ideas, that would be the Village Pump. However, your idea would go against the very idea of Wikipedia, which is to summarize what independent reliable sources state about article subjects. Wikipedia is not an advertising platform and permission from a subject is not required in order to write about it here. It would be blackmail to approach companies and charge them for something that they have no control over- and removing content from companies that do not pay up would render this a non-neutral encyclopedia. Futhermore, the Wikimedia Foundation's finances are stable and there is no urgent need to change how it raises money. 331dot (talk) 09:19, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

New article

I started to write a page for Jatbula Trail, a long distance walking trail in Australia's Northern Territory. I noticed there's a box that says A page with this title has previously been moved or deleted. I can't work out why the draft was deleted, and I'm not even sure how to contact the user who deleted it to ask. Is it just a case of posting on their Talk page to ask? Canberranone (talk) 09:40, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Canberranone, welcome to the Teahouse. I cannot see any deletion logs on the article you mentioned. Do you typed in the article name correctly? And I'm sure there is a reason stated at the box. GeraldWL ✉ 10:13, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Canberranone: the page Draft:Jatbula Trail was previously deleted by Sphilbrick in 2016 under CSD G13 criteria. See here. You can ask for a copy of the draft via WP:REFUND. Regards, TryKid ^{[dubious – discuss]} 10:47, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Edit not permitted

Few pages display a message stating this page is semi-protected so that only autoconfirmed users can edit it. For example, the Central Board of Secondary Education did not update the page based on a recent government notification and I am not confident if I make edits against the same will my edits be considered as one from the approved editor or not? Please advise. Juliansekar (talk) 11:07, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Juliansekar: Note I've placed double square brackets around the page name to form a link, as you should do on talk pages when referring to a specific wiki page. The article is semi-protected, and so requires confirmed/auto-confirmed privilege to edit it, which you have, having 22 edits and about 16 days tenure. Like any other edit, please be sure you cite a reliable source for your change. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 11:34, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Govt. Source?

Hi, I wanted to ask you that is the documents that are released by a government is considered as a reliable source? I saw an admin denying that government papers are authoritarian and cant be considered as a reliable source. Please help? Jenos450 (talk) 09:24, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Jenos450: It depends on the context. If it is truly a govt. source that can verify the claim(s) and can be trusted, I'll say yes. if you are making more claims that the govt source does not say, you would need more sources. I have not used govt sources a lot though, so I can't say much. But at a first glance, it's no problemo. GeraldWL ✉ 09:28, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: Darn that Bart! —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 11:26, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: Ha! GeraldWL ✉ 11:44, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Should this page be deleted?

Hello. I am new to Wikipedia and came across this page Nicholas P. Clark where some of the information seemed a bit off. I tried fixing it as best as I could and looked for additional references, but could not find much. Of the four remaining references, two are clearly associated to the subject of the article, one is from a Thrive Global (which I understand is blacklisted here), and one seems to be a trivial mention. Khwabeeda (talk) 15:50, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Khwabeeda, agreed. I'll check the sources; if it is off as you said, I'll probably have it tagged. GeraldWL ✉ 16:40, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hello, Khwabeeda and welcome to the Teahouse. Our notability criteria for cycling sports people can be found here. I'm not too familiar with all the racing terms involved (such as UCI World Tours), but at first glance he looks like he might meet them - provided his participation in major events is supported with reliable sources to confirm them. Hope this little contribution helps a bit. Nick Moyes (talk) 16:44, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Nick Moyes Thanks for the welcome! I looked for references, but couldn't find any reliable ones. Shouldn't the page be moved to draft space until additional references are found and the page is fixed? ----

@Khwabeeda: No, I don't think that would be right. The page is almost a year old, so moving to Draftspace at this late stage seems inappropriate, and then could be seen as an easy solution for every page of uncertain validity. I see various options to take this forward. a) Leave as it is; b) Put article up for a deletion discussion; contact page creator and say that's what you're thinking of doing, and ask if they can find better sources; post at WP:WikiProject Cycling to ask for input. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:07, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: I don't see how moving it to draftspace is inappropriate; it's way better than have it flagged for deletion. I don't think leave it as it is is a good thing either; 99% of the claims in the article is unverified. GeraldWL ✉ 09:32, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis: I agree the article seems based on unreliable or non-existent sources. So, if you think that's the case, then a deletion discussion is the right way to go. If you take a look at WP:DRAFTIFY, it explains that moving an article to draftspace should not be used as a backdoor to a deletion discussion. Had this article on Nicholas P. Clark been in put mainspace for just a few weeks, I might have agreed with your idea. But 10 months is a long time, so draftifying doesn't seem appropriate to me. You see, the problem with moving an extant article to draftspace is that it doesn't actually save it from deletion at all. Instead, it might then just sit there for 6 months and then be immediately deleted if nobody has worked on it, but without anyone ever being aware it was moved or having a chance to have a discussion about that deletion proposal, either. No - moving it now would be a very retrograde step, in my opinion. I should admit that I failed to suggest one other sensible option in a) above, which is to tag the article with Template:Notability, which I think I will now go and do. Nick Moyes (talk) 12:35, 22 August 2020 (UTC)  

It's odd that this interview with him, published only a month ago, seems to have been taken down. Cordless Larry (talk) 12:48, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Quite odd. Tried finding an archive, but there's none. GeraldWL ✉ 12:54, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

How to find old versions of articles, before deletion?

Hi there Teahouse friends! I'm trying to find what a page looked like, and what the content was, before it was deleted. The page I'm looking for is Matthew Prince, and I was looking for a link somewhere on this page:

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Matthew_Prince&action=history

What am I doing wrong, or where would I find this type of content? The reason I am asking is that sometimes I find pages which are redirects, or which have been deleted, and I'm curious to see what was written before. Nickgray (talk) 12:02, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Only administrators can see deleted revisions of articles. Therefore you can not find them. Ruslik_Zero 12:40, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

That's not strictly accurate. Some articles get scraped by third party sites before they're deleted. I used to visit Deletionpedia if I felt the need to try to find an old article. Sometimes I would get lucky most times I wouldn't. Nick Moyes (talk) 12:59, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

How to remove "Peacock|date=August 2020"

Please suggest me what are the steps needed to be taken if a reviewer kept Template:Peacock, I wrote the article based on the references I got. So suggest me how to improve my page Chemancheri Kunhiraman Nair, where User:Melcous added a Template:Peacock. Please tell me what are the steps needed to be taken. Rahulsoman (talk) 13:04, 22 August 2020 (UTC) Rahulsoman (talk) 13:04, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Rahulsoman, and welcome to the Teahouse Some examples: "renowned": that is an opinion. "an inevitable part of cultural history" - that is opinion. "Unfortunately" - that is editorialising. Wikipedia articles should never contain any evaluative language, good or bad, unless they are directly quoting a reliably published source independent of the subject. Wikipedia articles should never be indicating to the reader how they should regard something: while most people would agree that it is unfortunate for a couple to lose their first child, it is the business of an encyclopaedia to say that that happened, but not to say whether it is unfortunate or not. More subtly, "he got [a] chance to learn" is putting a spin on it, again prompting the reader how to regard the events. Does that make things clearer? --ColinFine (talk) 13:53, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi ColinFine, thanks a lot for the detailed review it really helped me a lot to understand about the writing style. Now I tried to correct the Chemancheri Kunhiraman Nair and edited as you mentioned. Once again thanking you for your kind reply. If possible please go through the page and try to give some feedback. Rahulsoman (talk) 15:12, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Rahulsoman, {{Peacock}} means that the article uses promotional wording, and that is clearly the case in the article. The article sounds extremely promotional and some of the writing doesn't seem to maintain a neutral point of view. Aim to make the article less promotional. — Yours, Berrely • ^Talk∕_Contribs 13:56, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Berrely Thanks for your reply, I tried to remove the wordings the promotional wordings, which appears here and there in the article. ColinFine was making me clear where I am violating a neutral point of view So hope current version of article is okey. Rahulsoman (talk) 15:12, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Just a reminder that it is not "your page" but rather, "an article" which anyone may edit. David notMD (talk) 15:45, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Questions about publishing a new article

I am attempting to publish a new article. I worked on it in my talk page and then submitted it. I now notice that it looks like I submitted my talk page to become an article in wikipedia. The link is here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:RedBeardBandit. Is this something I should fix by deleting and re-copying or does it happen every time you attempt to publish an article? What would be the best course of action? Or is there a simple way to rename the draft? Any help is appreciated. RedBeardBandit (talk) 15:49, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

The reviewer will create an appropriate title. Puzzled as to why the refs appear before the table. David notMD (talk) 16:03, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

It's not intentional. How do I fix it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by RedBeardBandit (talk • contribs) 16:06, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@RedBeardBandit: - a bit of effort has fixed your odd reference formatting. Two issues with your table were stopping it from closing (it crossed a section header and it didn't have a closing "|}"). Nosebagbear (talk) 16:44, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nosebagbear: Thank you so much for your help. I never would have figured that out on my own — Preceding unsigned comment added by RedBeardBandit (talk • contribs) 16:59, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Editing

How can a Celebrity edit his own page and not allow others to edit his details? Shaheryar Shabbir (talk) 16:18, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Shaheryar Shabbir: Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a platform for public relations. We do not allow the subjects of articles, nor their family or employees, to control the content. Articles are based on reliable sources; preferably, the sources should be secondary sources unrelated to the subject. —C.Fred (talk) 16:21, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

If this celebrity wants total control over what’s written about him, then perhaps he or his representatives should try another website like some of the ones listed in Wikipedia:Alternative outlets. On Wikipedia, the subjects of articles don’t have any final editorial control over article content per Wikipedia:Ownership of content. — Marchjuly (talk) 17:13, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

To find articles to be removed

How to delete some articles ? Iitianeditor (talk) 18:20, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Iitianeditor, welcome to the Teahouse. It's not clear why you wanted to delete articles, as deletion are nominated purely because it is not worthy of inclusion in Wikipedia. Only administrators can delete it, but there must be a consensus. You can engage in deletion nominations at WP:AFD, but before you do so, kindly understand Wikipedia's notability, encyclopedic tone, citations, etc. guidelines as well as WP:DEL to familiarize yourself with deletion and inclusion. It's best for you to edit before participating in a nomination. GeraldWL ✉ 18:35, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict)@Iitianeditor: Before looking for articles to delete, I recommend you get a good sense of what determines if an article should be kept or not. Visit the Articles for deletion page and read some of the nominations. Look how the discussions are voted on and eventually closed. When you are comfortable, you can vote yourself. Then you can look for articles that are tagged for notability and see if they can be improved or nominated for deletion. Good luck and thanks for trying to improve the encyclopedia! TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)}

@Iitianeditor: We are all here to build an encyclopaedia, not to dismantle it. As a completely new editor here, finding articles to delete is above your paygrade right now. Please learn to create good content first, and understand the policies and principles that content is based upon; only in that way will you understand when other content is bad. I would also just add that we do not vote on article deletion; we justify deletion or retention in a 'Deletion discussion, based purely upon our policies of what is and is not notable. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 19:08, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

Nick Moyes I also want to help build the encyclopedia, but according to guidelines. non-encyclopedic content should be removed. I've read the guidelines and I believe I've come across a few articles that should be deleted. If I'm mistaken, I'd be happy to learn and improve.Iitianeditor (talk) 17:29, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey Iitianeditor, I see you've already started some AfD discussions: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hassanikhel, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Shoaib Akram and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tariq Hafeez. And it's not as if the responses were walls of "keep" vote-nots. So well done, I guess. What puzzles me is that the heading above your question is "To find articles to be removed": you should not actively go looking for articles to delete. Instead, you find deletion candidates while editing normally. Also, please make sure you have WP:alternatives to deletion in your mind: deletion is a last resort. Kind regards from PJvanMill)talk( 22:52, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

PJvanMill sure, i'll also try to handle some pages in another way.I was just sure from my side that those pages should be removed according to the wikipedia policies.Iitianeditor (talk) 17:22, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Using Lang codes for foreign words in etymology section -- review edit

Hello all,

I just made an edit to Water § Etymology adding Template:Lang tags to all the foreign words. I wanted to make sure this is a correct edit (tags, templates, punctuation, italics, etc) -- could someone take a look and let me know? CampWood (talk) 17:38, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

CampWood, all okay there, although if I were you, I wouldn't use it, as I see no changes in it. GeraldWL ✉ 17:46, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

How do I protect a page and block a user?

How do I protect a page and block a user who edited our page with defamatory information? The protect your page resources (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_guide/Protecting) indicate the first step is to click on the "protect" button at the top of the page but I have yet to find one. Where do I submit a request to block a user? There are tons of resources on why/how but not WHERE. I have two IP addresses but no username for the person who allegedly edited our page. 204.194.207.1 (talk) 03:07, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

An IP cannot protect a page or block a user. You may request a block at WP:AIV (a complicated case may need to go to WP:AIN) and request page protection at WP:RPP. Please note that you do not own a Wikipedia page even if it is about you or your company. See WP:OWN. WP:COI may also apply.

It's useful to actually tell us what article you are talking about. Meters (talk) 03:24, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

I am guessing Lathrop & Gage. An editor vandalized the page two days ago and you reverted that added content. This has not been repeated (yet). I suggest you check the article daily, for a while, and see if the behavior is repeated. Editing of this sort can result in the offending editor being warning in their Talk page, and only if persists, blocked. P.S. It is not "our page". Rather, it is an article about a company which, within reason, and with references, anyone can edit. David notMD (talk) 03:36, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

I looked at the IP's history, but the Lathrop & Gage edit was made by a named account and the IP says he or she does not have a username for the editor making the edits, only IPs. Meters (talk) 04:04, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

The IP file a protection request for Lathrop & Gage, which was denied, as the reviewer did not see persistent vandalism. As an unexpected consequence, the article has now been tagged as perhaps not meeting notability and depending on primary source references, which puts it at risk for an AfD. It survived an AfD in 2014. David notMD (talk) 09:12, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

This is very helpful. Thank you all! 204.194.207.1 (talk) 18:51, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Request content advice from seniors re. AfD

I think Ghazi Hur Mujahid Faqeer Arbelo Katpar should be marked for AfD as it does not meet WP:N. There are hardly any citations/sources. The ones that are there, do not meet the 2 WP:RS standard, and only refer to the person in passing. I have made efforts to find better sourcing in RS but in vain.

However, I am a newbie and would appreciate advice from seniors, before I press the trigger.

Stefania0 (talk) 13:05, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Stefania0, I agree it does seem to fail WP:GNG, if you like I could submit it for you? — Yours, Berrely • ^Talk∕_Contribs 13:24, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Berrely Thank you! Would appreciate that. Pir of Pagaro VIII appears to have similar issues. Stefania0 (talk) 13:29, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

I agree. Giraffer (munch) 21:50, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Draft guidance

Hi. I've been editing Draft:David J. Zimmerman and have gotten very helpful feedback here. I've addressed the issues discussed, and would appreciate any additional guidance on the draft before I resubmit. Thanks. VictorMooney (talk) 20:54, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@VictorMooney: I think it has a ways to go before being submitted again. There are many unsourced claims. Mutualart.com is not a great source, and I also see several press releases, which are generally undesirable sources. My two cents would be to not try to cover everything possible. That which is covered should be amply sourced by good references.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 21:05, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

The above draft also requires some revision deletion by an admin, to remove version of the draft that contained significant copyright violations. So, definitely not ready for submission. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 21:19, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@ThatMontrealIP thank you for the link to the Earwig's page. Many of the listed "violations" are from David J. Zimmerman's web site, and others are from published articles (TIME, "Clothing as Artifact..."). One other is flagged several times - One Voice: Portraits from the Tibetan Diaspora. How are those violations? Can you suggest a fix? VictorMooney (talk) 21:43, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

VictorMooney The problem is that you copied infomation, word for word, from the sources. We are not allowed to do that. See WP:COPYPASTE and WP:COPYVIO for info. You must use your own words. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 22:03, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Someone else wrote the text that was the source of the violation. Directly copying it here is indeed a copyright violation. Such texts can be paraphrased, but it has to be done carefully and also has to be attributed. The source I mention just prior is also a primary source, so we would not usually paraphrase that. Perhaps some of the other editors can give you some tips on article composition and avoiding copyvio. The main thing is to write in your own words ans to attribute where appropriate.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 22:06, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, ThatMontrealIP & Tribe of Tiger! I appreciate the feedback. VictorMooney (talk) 22:33, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @ThatMontrealIP, VictorMooney, and Tribe of Tiger: I have done the revision deletion (REVDEL) on Draft:David J. Zimmerman. Some of the copied text came in very early in the draft's history, so almost all of the revisions had to be removed from view. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:37, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Oh, a minor mpoint of formatting, VictorMooney. Please do not leave blank space at the start of a paragraph, as if for a paragraph indent. The wiki software takes that as indicating program code or other literal text, and renders it in a mono-spaced font, which is not what you normally want on a discussion page. You can indent the whole paragraph with one or more leading colons, but we do not normally use first-line indents on text paragraphs here on Wikipedia. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:42, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

    One more question. Can you explain why "One Voice: Portraits from the Tibetan Diaspora" was flagged as a copyright violation? It is the actual name of a publication as well as the name of an exhibition. Also, numerous external links were flagged. They too are the actual title of published, online articles. Thanks again. VictorMooney (talk) 22:50, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Please read the above comment, from DESiegal, in regard to formatting. I fixed the first "error" that you made on this page, but I am leaving this one for the time being, so you can see for yourself, why this is a problem. It puts your words in a Big Grey Box, in Large Letters/Text! Indent your paragraphs with colons, : , not spaces. The colon system allows us to see successive replies in an orderly fashion. Thanks so much, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:15, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm honestly not trying to make you crazy! Just a bit of a learning curve...VictorMooney (talk) 23:25, 22 August 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by VictorMooney (talk • contribs) 23:24, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) VictorMooney If by "flagged as a copyright violation" you are referring to the out put of the "Eawig Copyvio detection tool" that tool is not as smart as a human. It will tag matching text as a possible violation, even when the text is a fact, such as the title of a work, or the name of a place. It will also flag properly quoted content, inside quote marks and with a proper citation. Any reviewing admin, and most if not all AfC reviewers, know to discount this kind of match by the tool. How3ever, text copied from a published article such as "One Voice: Portraits from the Tibetan Diaspora" is protected by copyright and is properly flagged as a violation when copied word for word. But I based the revision deletion primarily on text copied from https://www.davidzimmerman.com/about and did not need to look into other possible violations, be cause a revision that co9ntains any significant copyright violation will be deleted where other copying is acceptable or not. If you want further information about what kind of copying is acceptable, please read WP:COPYRIGHTS, and if you still have questions, please come back here, post your questions(s) and I or others will try to answer them. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 23:30, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you DESiegel. Since the current version of Draft:David J. Zimmerman does contain significant copyright violations, will the draft be deleted shortly? I certainly would like the opportunity to rewrite those sections which are in violation. I'm also glad to hear that humans are still smarter! VictorMooney (talk) 00:00, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

At present, VictorMooney, the only text flagged (in this draft) by the Earwig tool is a pair of quotations, both properly marked and cited, and several mentions of the titles of works. Neither of those types of text violate Wikipedia's copyright policy much less fall under the copyright speed deletion criterion. Nor am I aware of any copying not caught by the tool, nor of any other issue which would warrant deletion. So unless there is a serious problem that I am quite unaware of, which I doubt, this draft is not likely to be deleted any time soon for copyright infringement, or indeed for any other reason. I do a good deal of handling speedy deletions and copyright revision deletions here (although not nearly as much as some admins) so I think my assurance is worth something.

The issue now to be dealt with is Notability and the relevant guidelines are WP:GNG and WP:NARTIST. Ar article that clearly meets either will generally be considered as notable, and one that meets both will pretty much always be so considered. I have not reviewed the references currently cited -- for all I know this would already pass. But if not, reviews of Zimmerman's work in reliable sources that are independent of him, and significant coverage of him in similar sources would be what is needed.

Feel free to ask any further questions. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 01:53, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Need article writing help

I wrote an article about a female author, cited everything, and it was rejected because it sounded like an advertisment and the sources were not independant enough. I am not sure what I did wrong and am looking for help, thanks. WikiJSPN (talk) 02:11, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

courtesy link: Draft:Katya Cengel

Hello, WikiJSPN and welcome to the Teahouse.

I would say i8t is more that Draft:Katya Cengel sound rather like a resume or CV. It carefully lists every position and award, but does not go into much detail about any of them. It also doesn't report much that any third party has written about Cengel. Note that the draft was not Rejected but rather was Declined. "Declined" means "This isn't ready yet, please fix these issues and try again." "Rejected" means, "This will never be a valid article, stop wasting everyone's time by submitting it." An important difference. Perhaps DGG who did the review, would care to comment further. I have not reveiwed the references cited in detail, but quite a few of them seem to be stories written BY Cengel, not ABOUT her. The latter are much more valuable to a Wikipedia article, and should predominate.

I hope these comments are helpful. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 02:45, 23 August 2020 (UTC) @WikiJSPN: DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 03:11, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

{{U|WikiJSPN}. As I see it I'd call it more PR than a CV, but the real point where DES and I agree, is that it was not a NPOV encyclopedia article . Consider the quotation, which would do on her web page or a publishers advertisement."On finding interesting feature stories, Cengel said "Adventure does not have to mean traveling to a different country, it is more a way of looking at things and being receptive to something entirely new and different." Rather, List her books, in full bibliographic format, inclluding refernces to 3rd party reviews in major reliable sources. Do not include minor work she may have written.

And don't be disheartened. Some of my first work here was declined or deleted also, and that's true of most of us. DGG ( talk ) 04:02, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Forgot Password

A fellow editor user:Taymeedeeray reached out to me as he is not able to access his account . It seems he has forgotten his password. Please how can he access his account Haryanfe (talk) 07:49, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Haryanfe. Please see Wikipedia:FAQ/Technical#How do I recover a password I have forgotten? for more information. -- Marchjuly (talk) 08:01, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks Haryanfe I remembered my password I can now access my account Taymeedeeray (talk) 08:05, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

How are editing disputes resolved?

Re: Roswell UFO incident

You can see by the edit history that I edited the first line to read "...aerial craft..." Aerial craft includes weather balloons. But other editors want the first line to read "...balloon..."

My question: how are editing disputes resolved?

Thank you. Dannydunnontheoceanfloor (talk) 08:51, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Dannydunnontheoceanfloor Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Editing disputes are typically resolved through discussion amongst the editors involved on the article talk page. Typically such discussion will involve arguments based in Wikipedia guidelines or other logical arguments, resulting in a consensus as to how to proceed. If discussion is unable to resolve the dispute, there are avenues of dispute resolution to use. 331dot (talk) 08:55, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Dannydunnontheoceanfloor, yes, the talkpage is the first and best way to resolve any dispute. Plus, you need to be aware of WP:3RR. Very important to read this! Not observing the three revert rule can land you in trouble, much faster than a punctured weather balloon. The editors who watch the article will see that you have posted a note on the tp (talkpage) and discuss with you. Best, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 09:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Disruptive Editing

Hi. Someone is currently changing wikipedia articles disruptively. I issued a warning but is there a board like this one where admins can look into it and block them?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/81.164.30.20 Julia Domna Ba'al (talk) 09:54, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Nevermind I found this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents

Julia Domna Ba'al (talk) 10:04, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Julia Domna Ba'al: plain vandalism can go to WP:AIV, which is much faster than Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents. Victor Schmidt (talk) 11:46, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Should this IP editor be blocked?

Every edit this IP address has made, in the last 3 days, has been reverted, by multiple editors (including one by myself), because they're all vandalism. What is it going to take to get this guy blocked? JimKaatFan (talk) 06:30, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi JimKaatFan. It's probably going to take someone to seek administrator assistance at WP:ANV or by directly contacting admin. Any administrator can block a WP:VOA (even without warning) when they come across one if they think it's necessary to stop further disruption, but only an administator can block an account. There are a number of administrators who are also Tea House hosts and "reporting" such an account here will sometimes lead to one of them stepping in and taking action; however, you might get faster results if you go to one of the administrator noticeboards, particularly after multiple warnings have been issued and the account still hasn't stopped. At this point though, the IP seems to have stopped so a block might be seen as more punitive than preventive; moreover, any block issued might simply be for a day or so which means the IP can simply wait until it expires before coming back. Maybe taking a wait and see approach is better now, and then seeking administrator assistance if the IP comes back and continues the same types of edits. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:56, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Tyhank yo9u, JimKaatFan. I have blocked the IP address for a period of 72 hours. I note edits from that IP last year that were not vandalism, so it is no doubt dynamic. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 14:11, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Can you review the draft I created for Shourya Deep

Can you please review the draft I created Shourya Deep and tell me how to get it approved.  Prakash mesra (talk) 13:53, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Draft:Shourya Deep

Hello, Prakash mesra and welcome to the Teahouse. There are several things you could do that would improve this draft:

1. Remove promotional language and language that expresses an opinion. Text such as one of the finest directors of Bollywood should not be in a draft or article unless it is a quotation, attributed to a specific person, with a citation to match. See WP:QUOTE.
2. Phrases such as he showed interest in acting under the influence of his mother who herself was a theatre artist. should be cited to a source or removed, probably removed, unless this early interest was widely noted and mentioned by independent sources.
3. Do not cite the IMDB. It is not generally considered reliable, although a single link to an actor's IMDB profile in the external links section is OK. Remove all such cites.
4. Do not cite any wikis, including other Wikipedia articles, and including Wikiwiki and WikiBiodata.
5. Always give dates (or at least years) of publication of sources if they are known.
6. Always list the author(s) of sources if they are known.
7. If a publication has page numbers, list the page or pages where the information cited appears.
8. Always give the name of a source in a citation, not its web address. Use "Your News", not "yournews.in." in the |website= or |work= parameter.
9. Do not provide the subject's exact birth date unless it is already widely published, or the subject has published it himself, as on his own web site. In either of these cases, provide a citation to the publication(s). See WP:DOB.
10. Finally, wait patiently. There are many drafts awaiting review, and not as many reviewers as might be wished. It may take weeks or even months for a reviewer to get to your draft. Or it may be reviewed tomorrow. Reviews are not done in any particular order. There is no reliable way to get to the front of the line, in fact there is no line, just a pile. You may continue to work on the draft, or on other drafts or articles, while waiting.

I hope those help. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 14:42, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Tooltips

I have been having trouble with tooltips navigation, since I accidentally disabled the click motion for it on User:Hartma9616 (my user page), and I was wondering how it worked. Thank you, Hartma9616 (talk) 18:12, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Hartma9616, what do you mean? That you disabled tooltips altogether? (By which I assume you mean navigation popups) — Yours, Berrely • ^Talk∕_Contribs 18:38, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, It has somehow disabled and I can't revert it. Hartma9616 (talk) 20:17, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hartma9616: Is Navigation Popups (the 6th checkbox) checked at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets? —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:38, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the help, does this edit count for the 'Infobox' part of it, when hovering or clicking over abbreviated text in the infobox like:

John Holiday

​

(m. 2007)​

Hartma9616 (talk) 22:06, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hartma9616: No, those tooltips are actually in the rendered page. I've never run across the problem. A couple more questions to help troubleshoot:

• 1. What browser, O/S, and device (e.g., Firefox/Win10/laptop, iPad, etc.)?
• 2. I'm sure you have, but have you rebooted the device?
• 3. Have you tried a different browser, if available?
• 4. Have you tried if the problem happens while not logged-in to Wikipedia?
• 5. If those don't reveal the problem, if you select the "m." in your example (double-click on it or click-drag), right-click, and choose "View Selection Source" (may be slightly different wording depending on your browser), does the result contain the following near the end? <abbr title="married">m.</abbr>
• 6. This, too, may seem obvious, but when did the problem start? Did it coincide with installation of any browser extensions or apps that you know of?

Someone with more knowledge in this area is, of course, welcome to chime in. The user does not have a custom Wikipedia js or css file (or any sub-pages of their user page, for that matter). —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 23:08, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, the device is an iPad and my browser is Google. I am unable to switch browser(s), I will try rebooting – (a few times). Hartma9616 (talk) 15:13, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: I did try your steps, can you guide me to find the "View Selection Source," as you explained? Hartma9616 (talk) 15:55, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: The problem started (as I was tending to edits), the box of which it had the "tooltip controls" (a pop–up information paragraph stating controls/functions etc.... Hartma9616 (talk) 19:04, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hartma9616: Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with the platform. I don't think it's a Wikipedia-specific thing, though. I think it's probably a browser or iPad setting (though I see nothing related in the desktop version of Google Chrome). You might find someone with expertise at WP:RD/C. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 06:57, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: The problem was fixed, thank you for guiding me. I appreciate the help. Hartma9616 (talk) 15:29, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi everyone!

Hello Wikipedia! I don’t really have a question - I just thought I would introduce myself to the community as a newbie editor before I get started (and I hope that’s OK :)

I suppose I could use some guidance about how I can help, for what it’s worth. Any any rate, hi everyone! I’m glad to be here. Anablerry (talk) 16:38, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi there, Anablerry. Welcome to Wikipedia and to the Teahouse. I've left a welcome message for you on your userpage. You might also like to try out The Wikipedia Adventure - it's our interactive tour with 15 different 'badges' you can collect along the way as you learn the basics. Pop back anytime you need any help or guidance, and remember that it's often best to start slowly by making small changes to articles, rather than rushing in and getting all muddled up. Regards from the UK, Nick Moyes (talk) 16:46, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Image removed

I had added an image into an article, from the public domain archive.org, there is an overzealous administrator who reverted the changes after I had done the change because he did'nt like the language I used to reply him, albeit it was harsh, not personal.

I had not violated any copyright rules and I have not vandalized the said article.

The said image was pulled from archive.org and there is not obvious copyright assertions. Now I have reservations about the image currently used under the claims of creative common license. The said website does not own the image and there is no proof of such. How can I get a clarification on this issue of overzealous self certified administrators. Srajakumar (talk) 16:28, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Srajakumar and welcome to the teahouse.

This seems to be about the image File:Sridevi.jpg.jpg, which it seems that you uploaded to commons and then added to the article Sridevi. It has been tagged for deletion as a copyright violation on commons, and that is where the effective debate, if any, will take place, not here. However I can enlighten you a bit on Wikipedia copyright policy and US copyright law.

You say above that the image is from the public domain archive.org. But most images on archive.org are not in the public domain, and there is no statement on your listed source page (https://archive.org/details/Sridevi53/) that this image, or any image on that page, is in the public domain or has been relased under any free license. Indeed most content on archive.org is copied from elsewhere on the wab and that site neither claims a copyright not purports to release the copyrights of others. 17 USC sec 102 says Copyright protection subsists, in accordance with this title, in original works of authorship fixed in any tangible medium of expression, now known or later developed, from which they can be perceived, reproduced, or otherwise communicated, either directly or with the aid of a machine or device. 17 USC sec 101 says A work is “created” when it is fixed in a copy or phonorecord for the first time; where a work is prepared over a period of time, the portion of it that has been fixed at any particular time constitutes the work as of that time, and where the work has been prepared in different versions, each version constitutes a separate work. No copyright notice is required for copyright protection under US law (or under the law of any country signatory to the Berne convention). See https://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html for detail. Wikipedia policy is that only images (and text) created by the uploader, explicitly released under a free license by the copyright holder, or verifiably in the public domain (such as items whose copyright has expired, works of the US Federal government, etc) are considered free. Some images may be used under a claim of fair use, subject to the terms of WP:NFCC, but almost never images of living people, except possibly historic images.

I would add that under out policy against legal threats, comments such as These kind of assertion will get thrown out in the court of law. ... Lets call the legal team in San Francisco to get involved and yall can sort this issue out. are approaching a level that merits a block on its own.

Do understand that Wikipedia policy on copyrights is stricter than US copyright law demands. There are various reasons for that, but as a private site, Wikipedia may set its policies as it wishes, so,long as it does not violate the law. It may restrict users from posting in whatever ways it chooses. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 17:27, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Accusation of copyright violation

I have been accused of having committed a copyright violation. I dispute that so I'm seeking a second opinion. The relevant discussion is at this talk page: User talk:Diannaa#Copyright. What I've done is that I have taken three sentences from a book, which I have rephrased and inserted into a wiki article and then linked to the book using the <ref> syntax. I don't think I have violated either American copyright law nor wiki policies both because the small number of rephrased sentences and because I added a reference to the source used. I think this issue is principally important because if what I've done is disallowed by policies, then I don't see how one could properly cite sources at all.ImTheIP (talk) 16:19, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, ImTheIP, and welcome to the Teahouse.

Please read Wikipedia:Close paraphrasing where it days that Close paraphrasing is the superficial modification of material from another source. Editors should generally summarize source material in their own words ... and goes on to say that Limited close paraphrasing is appropriate within reason, as is quoting, so long as the material is clearly attributed in the text ... Limited close paraphrasing is also appropriate if there are only a limited number of ways to say the same thing. Close paraphrasing without in-text attribution may constitute plagiarism, and when extensive (with or without in-text attribution) may also violate Wikipedia's copyright policy, ...

Note that in this version of Students for Justice in Palestine you provided a source citation, but you did not provide in-text attribution. That would be something like "as David Feldman recounts in Boycotts Past and Present" in the article prose text, not just in a footnote. The degree and quantity of close paraphrasing permitted in an article ism something of a judgement call, and User: Diannaa is an editor very experienced in copyright issues here. Note also that Wikipedia policy on copyright and copying is intentionally stricter than US copyright law requires, or than common academic practice, to deal with the majority of editors not begin identified by legal names or identities know outside of Wikipedia. The place to discuss whether this paraphrase was too close or too long would be Talk:Students for Justice in Palestine, but it looks to ne as if a significantly less clsoe paraphrase would be possible. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 17:49, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

ImTheIP, I read the section on Diannaa's talk page and agree with her assessment completely. I also agree with the other editors who commented there. The majority of the content you added was identical to the source and in the same order, with only minor wording changes. Our job as Wikipedia editors is to summarize our sources in our own words, not to repeat them almost verbatim. You always have the option of directly quoting a source, although quotes should be used sparingly. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 18:14, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Painting deleted- is this correct, thanks

Hi, I had recently contributed a painting (with correct license, permission from artist) to the page of Madhava the mathematician.

However the painting was removed stating that there's no way to verify that the person looked thus. As a new editor I have turned to you to ask for help in understanding :)

Would that not be true in all cases (unless a direct potrait). Furthermore, all aspects of the painting is attributable. Thanks Imagetoimageless (talk) 15:51, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Imagetoimageless. I see you have already posted at Talk:Madhava of Sangamagrama, which is the right place to do it; and Deacon Vorbis has replied. Your next step is to discuss it with them. Many articles about historical figures are decorated with paintings that were made long after they lived, and there is no reason to suppose they are good likenesses; but generally these are pictures which are widely known to represent the person. If I understand it, you are presenting a modern painting, and Wikipedia has no way to verify that Madhava is the subject. (

However, I'm also concerned about the licence: has the picture appeared in a public place (such as the artist's website) with an explicit statement that it has been licensed under CC-BY-SA 2.5? If not, has the artist sent an explicit release to Wikimedia Commons according to Donating copyright materials? If not, then it is not free media, and should not have been uploaded to Commons. Whether or not the artist has given permission for it to be used is irrelevant: all that matters is if the copyright owner (who is presumably the artist) has released it under a suitable licence, so that anybody may reuse it for any purpose. --ColinFine (talk) 18:28, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi ColinFine, thanks for all helping me to understand this. I will discuss with the artist to make sure the correct license and also attribution to the subject is applied. Will check how she can send donate it etc... Currently a letter exists that provides the license. Thanks

Sources

I added information to a page. The Source i cited with Billion Dollar Whale, published by Hachette. The information was just three lines, and pretty much just cited sourse directly. The post was removed because it couldn't be "verified." What's up with this. Here's what I posted: In fact, the FBI is now looking at whether at whether a donation of $100,000 to Trump Victory in 2017 originated with Low. And The Wall Street Journal reported that at point, $75 million was offered to Elliot Broidy, a businessman and a Republican fundraiser, and his wife if the Justice Department ended its probe into 1MBD. Are trump loyalists editing these pages? BKSanDiego (talk) 17:37, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi BKSanDiego, welcome to the Teahouse, and no, I am not allowed to assume that someone with a status is editing it. Can you quote the book, where does it say such statement? And you also do not appear to be citing the "Wall Street Journal" claim. Also, "In fact" is not the right word we use here. Fun facts are subjective; we just say the facts and nothing else. GeraldWL ✉ 17:43, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for this, Gerald. How about this: Authors of Six Billion Dollar Whale write that the FBI is now looking at whether at whether a donation of $100,000 to Trump Victory in 2017 originated with Low. In their book they also state that The Wall Street Journal reported that at point, $75 million was offered to Elliot Broidy, a businessman and a Republican fundraiser, and his wife if the Justice Department ended its probe into 1MBD. — Preceding unsigned comment added by BKSanDiego (talk • contribs) 18:06, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, BKSanDiego and welcome to the Teahouse. When citing a book, one should indicate exactly where in the book the statement is supported. I have restored your edit, modified a bit, with a Google Books URL link to the book, but a page number would, also help. It is important that facts stated in a Wikipedia article can be verified by readers, see our certification policy. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 20:47, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@BKSanDiego and DESiegel: I tweaked Jho Low a bit to add the page numbers and two targeted links in the book, but don't exactly like the result. The second sentence about the $75 million should really just be identified as a quote, I think, instead of (my) repeating it in the cite. I suppose this is an example of when it might be better to just cite the same book again instead of trying to get the one cite to do double-duty. Of course, if the WSJ article weren't paywalled, we could just eliminate the "WSJ reported", quote it directly and omit the second cite to the book. I know we could do it anyway, as supposedly the source needn't be accessible, but I hate leaving out an accessible source if there is one. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 19:20, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

User box for frontline healthcare worker?

I hope this is the right place to ask. I found the userbox gallery and looked around but I couldn’t find quite what I was looking for. I’m looking for a userbox that says something like “this user is a healthcare hero in the fight against COVID-19” - is there anything like that? And if so, where might I find it? Thanks Lungespine (talk) 02:40, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Lungespine. Thank you so much for the dangerous work you do during this horrible pandemic. Please make a request at Wikipedia talk:Userboxes/Ideas, and I am sure that a userbox programmer will help you. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 03:01, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Note: Request was answered about an hour later by Diriector_Doc. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 21:52, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Irene Lilienheim Angelico

Hi Editor,

Thank you for helping me.

Maurie Alioff, an academic and film reviewer, who has reviewed our films in the past, wrote three articles for submission to wikipedia. He found many references, but was aware that we had archived our old reviews on our website and asked me to fill in the gaps. i did this and then submitted the three articles under my name. This, I have since discovered, was a huge mistake. Can I send the article back to the writer and ask him to submit under his own name?

Also, the Wiki editor wrote that the submission does not show significant coverage in reliable independent sources. He/she particularly mentioned that IMDb is not reliable, so I removed all the IMDb references. But it is not possible that the other coverage is not notable or reliable. For the article on DLI Productions, for example, there are 36 article specifically about various DLI films, not just passing mentions, from newspapers and journals like the New York Times, The Globe and Mail, The Canberra Times, Macleans, the Canadian Forum, The Montreal Gazette, Film Kultura, etc. in nine different languages.

Any suggestion you have will be most welcomed.

Be well,

Irene```` Ireneangelico (talk) 21:07, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy links to drafts: Draft:Irene Lilienheim Angelico, Draft:Abbey Jack Neidik and a sandbox draft for DLI productions.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 21:21, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

You are not forbidden from submitting an autobiography, although the serious problem is writing about oneself and only including content that is in the references, not what you know to be true. The reviewer of all three (Irene and Abbey Declined, DLI not yet submitted) called out the the heavily promotional tone. And for DLI, the references need to be about DLI, not about the films DLI did. David notMD (talk) 22:47, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Request for Review of My Draft

Draft: Lockdown Ki Love Story is being under review from 5 days. Please review it and transfer to main space ASAP. I add all reliable sources. Unknownnreasonn (talk)

@Unknownnreasonn: Your submission has been in the queue for 5 days. There are 384 submissions that are in the queue for 2 months. Please be patient. Victor Schmidt (talk) 11:33, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Victor Schmidt: I am not curious but my draft is about a Indian Show that is coming in few days.So I only want to review the draft ASAP. Unknownnreasonn (talk)

Hello, Unknownnreasonn. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia, not a news source. Still less a vehicle for promotion. See There is no deadline. But if you want to get the draft accepted, I suggest you throw away all the material which comes from the show and its producers, and find some independent sources that talk about it. Many of your references are clearly to press releases, and so do not contribute in the slightest to establishing that the show is notable; nor do interviews. Remember that Wikipedia has basically no interest in anything said, written, or published by people close to the subject, whether directly or in interviews or press releases. It is only interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information by the subject, have chosen to publish about it in reliable sources. Please also see WP:TOOSOON and WP:CRYSTAL. --ColinFine (talk) 12:05, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@ColinFine: can you tell me about the independent sources that you are talking in previous statement?I don't know about it and why I throw away the materials that comes from the show and its producers? Tell me the reason. Unknownnreasonn (talk)

Unknownnreasonn Wikipedia does not accept as reliable what people or organizations or companies write about themselves, as grounds to confirm a topic meets Wikipedia's definition of notability. This extends to what people say about themselves in interviews. It is standard policy. Like parents answering "Because I said so." to a child's "Why?" An independent source would be published content written by a person with no connection to the topic. David notMD (talk) 13:03, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Also, the backlog of drafts to be reviewed is a pile, not a queue. Reviewers select what interests them (with a bit of an eye on the oldest). David notMD (talk) 13:04, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Unknownnreasonn: Have you read Help:Your first article, and the other documents to which it refers, like WP:Notability? —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 22:59, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

How to cite pages from a book, but also websites in the same article

Greetings, I'm back again for another question. This time it's about citation styles, and a draft I am working on. Basically, I have two types of sources: Websites, which I can only quote in their entirety, and books, which are so large that merely quoting them without adding a page number would basically shred verifiability. Thus, I looked around how to do that without it becoming a nigh-incomprehensible mess, and stumbled about this article and its reference section: The_Level,_Brighton#References

I found that to read pretty nicely, because it managed book pages through page references + bibliography, and websites directly and just once. But after reading on it seems I would be discouraged from doing it that way (see Wikipedia:Parenthetical_referencing#Consistency), and reading up about Harvard citation style this article: Climate_change#Notes was named as an example page which uses it correctly. However, I found that section to be incredibly hard to read, as it would also link to websites as if they were books - and I can't even do that "Harvard sytle" for some of my sources, because the websites do not have a definite author!

So basically, my question is: Am I allowed to cite in the same way as is done on the "The Level, Brighton" page linked above? Because I would very much prefer that, and personally do not see how that would confuse anyone. And if not, I would need another solution on how to include both types of sources (with pages and without) in my article. LordPeterII (talk) 20:11, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, LordPeterII and welcome to the Teahouse.

You can use any of several different citation styles in a new draft, but you should be consistent in using whatever style you choose.

• You may use footnoted, templated (CS1 or CS2) citations. In this case each reference would be inside a set of <ref>...</ref> tags. When citing a web site, use {{cite web}} or perhaps {{cite news}}. When citing a book, use {{cite book}}. When citing a magazine, use {{cite magazine}}. There are other specialized templates as well. For a book, or any source that has numbered pages use |page= (or |pages=) to indicate the page number cited. (There are also ways to handle it if you make citations to several different pages of the same book in the article, mostly using {{rp}}.)
• You may use Parenthetical referencing There are several versions of this, but in general a short indicator of the source name is shown in the text of the article, and these then link to a longer fuller citation. The indicators for books and other paginated sources will include a page number, the ones for unpaginated sources do not. If you use this, you should use it for all citations, and you should in fact use the same variant of it for all citations in the draft/article.
• You may use some other style, if you choose, than either of the above.
• What you should not do is mix two or more different styles. Many find this confusing, and any editor may freely change the citations to a single consistent style. It appears that this is what the The_Level,_Brighton article does. As wp:CITEVAR says: Generally considered helpful ... mposing one style on an article with inconsistent citation styles (e.g., some of the citations in footnotes and others as parenthetical references): an improvement because it makes the citations easier to understand and edit;.

The CS1 templated and footnoted style is probably the most commonly used style on Wikipedia. It allows for specifying the page numbers for books and other paginated sources, while not doing so for paginated sources like web sites. But if you want to use some mother consistent style, you may. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 20:39, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

I would add that when using "Harvard" style you may assign a website or other source where no author is known a name, and use that. I would also say that Harvard style IMO works best when all or most citations are to a book, journal article or similar source. It was invented for academic papers in which pretty much all citations would be to books or journal articles, and none would be to sources without stated authors. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 20:46, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks DESiegel, so as per your suggestion I will not use what was done on that Brighton article. That confirms my suspicion that it was shunned upon (although temping). I should note that I have hitherto almost exclusively used CS1 style for referencing, and had no intention of using Harvard if not necessary. My only worry is now: When I use CS1, I can indeed specify a page within a book. However, I would have to repeat that every time I quote that book again on a different page, thus producing "inflationary" amounts of references to that book which repeat all the other information (name, author, publisher etc.) and only changes the page. I assume that could be acceptable if it only happens a few times, but if I quote the book say 20 times (on different pages), it would become a mess. There is no way around that, is there? Like by just specifying a page, and otherwise using the general named ref of the book? Whoops! I almost overlooked that at first, but that {{rp}} thing you linked to is exactly what I was looking for. I also just read that my problem is acknowledged behind the scenes and being worked on. Using refpage for now will solve the problem, and in the future I might be able to use "subpages" directly from the cite book template. That's certainly good news! So thanks again, problem solved :) --LordPeterII (talk) 21:47, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@LordPeterII: DESiegel really knows his stuff! Personally (and many others feel the same (see this lengthy, ongoing debate)) I find our tolerance of multiple citation formats across articles both confusing and quite irritating. I frequently cite books, journals, websites and news media all within one article (e.g. Mont Blanc massif). I simply add inline citations using the big, obvious 'Cite' button provided within our editing tool. I select the relevant template to use and paste in either the DOI, ISBN or url to 'autofill' the majority of the details (by clicking the magnifying glass icon next to it), and then manually tidy up any loose ends. I prefer not to use our Visual Editor to create content, preferring the WP:Source Editor instead as it allows me to choose my own memorable 'Ref name' so its easy to reuse the same reference again and again within one article. I made my own little guide and video on this- see WP:ERB. Good luck, whatever method you choose. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:00, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: Yeah indeed, as a beginner I too find it slightly confusing, though I know the issue from real life (a few of my lecturers in university prefer - and demand - a slightly different citation style than the majority, and occasionally there's even a third opinion on how citations should look). And as much as I agree about the benefits of having a unified citation style, I don't have the energy to participate in that discussion ^^. I'll just stick to CS1 because with the {{rp}} extension it is sufficiently convenient for anything, and hope that the meta-people will phabricate something that makes quoting individual pages even more pleasing to the eye. But... as weird as it sounds, I had hitherto actually cited everything in source and by hand, meaning I typed in "|" followed by the attribute I wanted, followed by an equal sign and the value and so forth. That is... cumbersome, but for some weird reason I thought the automatic "cite" functionality would not work in source editor. Now thanks to you I know it does, and I will probably use it henceforth (I mean I can still add in stuff manually later if needed). Your video/page is also quite good as a tutorial, indeed better than the official tutorial page which maybe is less of a tutorial than a general explanation/introduction. I shall bookmark that page and point newcomers there myself, maybe alongside the official page. --LordPeterII (talk) 22:45, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@LordPeterII: I was not expecting you to join in the discussion - just to appreciate how we have so many different view. One Manual of Style on everything except citations, it would seem. You and I are alike in that I also began life here creating references totally by hand for the first year or so, until I somehow discovered the Cite Button. I think at the time I started it was an option you had to actively select. (About as useful as asking those at the back of the room to put their hand up if they can't hear me!) Yes, the {{rp}} template does it for me, too. For elegance on the page, I like to position those references without the rp template first, then put the rp refeences in afterwards. Two other little tips for you: i) If you tend to use the same sources again and again in articles, it pays to create a sandbox page in which to keep the text that you can then copy/paste in, just adding the rp template for the relvant page number(s) (my example, and ii) There's a tool in the editing bar in our basic WP:Source Editor that lets you call up and reuse a citation, without having to type anything at all. Look for 'Named references' in the toolbar, position your cursor at the end of the relvant sentence, then click the Clipboard icon to its right to see all your references you've give a 'refname' to. (I only discovered that facility last year, and I've been editing here over 10 years!) Nick Moyes (talk) 23:43, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: Nice, I shall keep that in mind as well! Guess I can spend more time on actually writing articles from now on :) --LordPeterII (talk) 00:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Page moved to draft

I edited a wikipedia page and someone put it as a draft before I finished it. I then went to save it, and it told me that my work had to be seen first. When I looked at my changes, it reverted back to the old page. Can you delete it so I can start over again? It's titled "Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series)" Thank you. Trevortnidesserped (talk) 14:45, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Trevortnidesserped, and welcome to the Teahouse.

The page Draft:Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series) is by no means ready for the main article space. The move to draft space was proper, if it had not been moved to draft, it would have been deleted pretty much right away. You can work on the pager in draft space, it does not need to be deleted for this. When you think it is ready, you may submit it for review or you may move it back to the main article space. If you submit for review, you will get feedback if it is not approved, and a chance to try again. However, review can take several weeks or more because of the number of drafts waiting. If you move directly to the main article space, and the article does not meet standards, it might be deleted through any on of several processes, depending on what the problem is and who notices it. I advise going through a review, but it is not required. I advise starting new articles in draft even if you never inhtend to submit them for review -- that is what I do when I create a new article (and I've been here for 15 years now). This is because I can't create a finished or even minimal acceptable article in one edit, and neither can most editors.

The move to draft was done by Captain Calm, an experienced editor.

I hope,this advice is helpful. I will put some additional advice on your user talk page. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 15:05, 23 August 2020 (UTC) @Trevortnidesserped: DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 15:06, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Trevortnidesserped and DESiegel: Draft:Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series) is a redirect to Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series) (the same page name in mainspace), but that page is a redirect to Now That's What I Call Music! discography#United States (a section of an existing article, first created in 2005).

Draft

I have a draft page that hasn't been reviewed yet. Could someone take a look at it for me to see if it meets standards? It is titled "Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series)" Trevortnidesserped (talk) 17:44, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I moved Now That's What I Call Music! 74 (American series) to draft, and it looks much better now, thanks, so I've moved it back to main article space. Captain Calm (talk) 17:57, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Issue that grinds my gears

I worked on a page last night. It was part of a discography, that for some reason, the 20 newest parts of it don't have articles. I put a tolerable amount of information, everything was in good shape. But for some reason, it looks like somebody deleted my page. It says it was "moved," but when I go to click on it, it redirects me to the discography page. It's almost as if they are planning to delete every page in the discography, I thought that until the draft of an article in the same discography was approved. I don't know if it was because I didn't protect the page, I don't know if it's because my page didn't meet standards...I don't know what's going on, and I need help.

Trevortnidesserped (talk) 18:54, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Trevortnidesserped and welcome to the Teahouse.

It would help very much if you indicated what page you were working on, or even what discography it was part of. You have worked on several different articles in the last day or two, I I can't spot any that seems to match you rather vague description. But I can assure you that no article to which you saved any edit has been deleted. I can't so easily check for moves. There are several reasons why a page might be moved, but most of them do not involve any plan to delete the page or the information on it. Please more information about what you were editing. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 19:19, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Trevortidesserped, I see that Velella moved Now That's What I Call Music! 75 (American series) over a redirect, saying theuy were restoring a hijacked title. You have opened a discussion on their user talk page, which is appropriate action: please wait for them to reply, and if you can't reach consensus, follow dispute resolution. --ColinFine (talk) 19:29, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Reply from User:trevortnidesserped Sorry for not ellaborating. I see that someone has already showed the page, so I don't think I need to do that anymore. Also, ColinFine, thank you for the context, I will wait for feedback.

...

Someone else deleted one of the other pages I made. I give up. I won't make any more contributions because they'll just keep getting deleted. Trevortnidesserped (talk) 22:19, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Trevortnidesserped: I'm sorry that you're discouraged. I know that it can be tough to have your work deleted. If you decide to come back, one thing I'd recommend is asking here before you start an article target, so that volunteers here can vet the article topic for you (based on your intended references for the article) before you start your work. That way hopefully you can avoid investing a lot of work into an article that later gets deleted or redirected. Calliopejen1 (talk) 23:15, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Calliopejen1: Thanks for stating this! After a few years of editing, I have found a person I would like to write about, for "my very first article". However, I wanted to assured of notability, etc., before I started the project. I had considered asking here, but was not sure if that was acceptable. Now, I can assemble my proofs, with confidence. Thanks again, Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:37, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Tribe of Tiger: I think someone here (forget where I read this) is trying to start a process/page along these lines. I think it's a great idea because most of the stuff that gets declined at AFC never should have been written in the first place (as a reviewer, I start by scrolling down to references, and many many articles get declined without me even needing to look at the article content). But until the process is started up, I'm sure Teahouse folks would be happy to help. Calliopejen1 (talk) 23:39, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Calliopejen1: I have wondered about that, myself. I think it would be better, for everyone, if we had a system where a prospective article could receive an "okay" in regards to notability, before the editor goes to the trouble of writing it. Having read the Teahouse over the years, this is a dreadfully disappointing situation for a new editor. They may produce a "technically acceptable" article, only to be informed that the subject is non-notable. I think we are putting the cart before the horse. A vetting system would reduce new editor frustration, (and increase new editor retention) as well as decreasing the workload on AFC and NPP. Whew! Anyway, that is why I wish to be assured of notability, first, before I write an article.Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 00:25, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I've moved the above three level-3 heading sections up here. Please try to edit your existing section when relevant instead of starting a new section. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 23:51, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Image stacking

Is there a way to do 2X2 image stacking? The multiple image template doesn't work, and there is nothing about that in extended image syntax or image help pages. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 04:44, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Aditya Kabir: Are you mean you take 4 images and arrange them in a 2x2 grid? If so, I suggest using a table without a header row or the newer display:grid css technology. For the latter, the following works more or less good:

I hope this helps. Victor Schmidt (talk) 09:42, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Victor Schmidt: This was super helpful indeed. Yayy. Let me try the table opion first. Most obliged. Y Let me pour you a cup of tea. It's better than beer, you know. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 10:49, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Aditya Kabir: For the German-impaired:[7] . The display:grid example there works in the current FFox, Chrome, and Edge on Win10. It also works on Firefox 68 and Chrome 84 on the now pretty old Android 5.0. It does not work on Win10 IE11 (it displays the boxes stacked in one column, screen width; there is no console error). There's also some more flexibility to it shown here. BTW, regarding the table solution, some people (not me) object ideologically to using tables for images. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 22:34, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@AlanM1: Awesome. Even for a German impaired. Tables are not for images, and I can share that prejudice happily. Looks like CSS it is then. Y A cup of tea? I can put some Vodka in ice tea, you know. Aditya^{(talk • contribs)} 00:33, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How to Handle vandalism ?

A long term inactive user who has been already warned against vandalism by an administrator such asthis one has gone inactive has become active again and has vandalised the page seeman by making large content removal which has sufficient souce such as this one and this one without mentioning any reason. It is seems he is ideological adherent to NTK party run by seeman and is making this kind of POV pushing which can be inferred from his edit such as this one.In light of this how to approach this incidence? JagatRaxak (talk) 12:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi JagatRaxak, good catch there! Normally it should be pretty easy to revert vandalism, although idk if it is available on mobile. At least on desktop, there is an "undo" button you can click when checking the article's history, which will revert the edit in question. This didn't work here though because of conflicting newer edits, so I manually pasted the removed text and added it back in.

A few notes though: Obviously, please first make sure that it is actual vandalism you are seeing. Sometimes, people edit in good faith, but in a way that their edits look like vandalism. Thus, completely undoing edits may sometimes not be optimal. Also, for articles about living persons extra care is needed, because controversial material might have been removed because it is slanderous. But you are right, in this case it was definitely a (politically motivated?) act of vandalism as the claims were sourced, and the sources seem trustworthy.

And lastly, please note that new questions should go to the bottom of the Teahouse page, otherwise they might be overlooked! Best just use the button provided at the top of the page, that handles that automatically ;)

--LordPeterII (talk) 19:38, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

How to make new questions to the bottom? it got automatically into top bcoz I dont know how to put it bottom.JagatRaxak (talk) 06:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

JagatRaxak, click either the big blue 'Ask a question' button or the 'New section' button. They will automatically start at the bottom. Giraffer (munch) 06:25, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Citing sources - Having a link from a reference link, not just bibliography

Hi,

I have included citations for information contained on a particular page. I thought I followed how to insert sources correctly - and it appears to have done so with the bibliography, as it is listed the same way as everyone else's, and you can click on the titles of the article and be taken to the article direct. My issue is that while the author's last name and reference is coming up in the reference list, it does not link to the article - how do I fix this? The display is also not quite right in the reference list - it has an additional & - and I am following the template and what I see everyone else has done, so stuck as to how to fix it! footnotes 43-45 in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_of_William_Shakespeare

Any assistance would be much appreciated! – Nectarine4505 (talk) 05:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Nectarine4505, I have two comments:

• References should follow punctuation marks, not precede them.
• It's not clear why the views of the non-notable Kauffman warrant an entire paragraph. A second paragraph, about a play written by Kauffman, is certainly not warranted. I see that Diannaa has already removed material which seems intended to promote Kauffman. Maproom (talk) 06:35, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

(ec) @Nectarine4505:  Fixed at Special:Diff/974652534. I removed the comma after the years. The page numbers needed the parameter name |pp=, e.g.:

{{sfn|Kauffman|2018,|1-87}} → {{sfn|Kauffman|2018|pp=1-87}}

The Kauffman 2018a ref in the bib had a date of January 2018 instead of 2018a, and did not have the |ref=harv parameter. I don't know if there's a better way of doing multiple sources for the same author and year, but others in the article were done this way (by adding a letter to the year). —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 06:43, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you! Your suggestions are super helpful - I can now see that one of the references in the reference list now comes up with the bibliography information when you hover over it (footnote 44), but not the other couple? Any ideas of what I need to do to fix this?Nectarine4505 (talk) 07:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nectarine4505: If I check it with a non-logged-in Win10 desktop Chrome browser, I get the bib info popup for all four Kaufman refs (and many others I tried) unless the bib entry is also visible on the screen at the time, in which case it highlights that bib entry in light blue (same as it does if you click on the short ref). Is that maybe what's happening? If I use my logged-in Firefox, because I have Navigation Popups enabled, that's the popup I get, unfortunately. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 08:21, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I am not sure? I logged out and had a look - and the actual bibliography seems to be working - yay - but the reference list, only 44 if you hover over it pops up? The other ones nothing is still showing for me...I cannot work it out as far as I can see all the references are listed the same...so not sure what the difference is?Nectarine4505 (talk) 09:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Why is this article in the "Wikipedia:" namespace?

I just found this article: [8]

I think it might have been mistakenly placed in the "Wikipedia:" namespace but I am not sure. I am not a regular contributor to the English Wikipedia. --TheRandomIP (talk) 11:00, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

 Resolved GeraldWL ✉ 11:02, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Copy paste content

The article 1957 Ramnad riots has an entire section called 'Events during riots' which doesn't cite any sources however further digging I found this one and the entire sections is a exact copy paste from this source, another problem is that that mentioned source doesn't seem to be reliable either(but not sure about it). Anyway this a blatant copyright violation. What should be done in this case? JagatRaxak (talk) 07:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi JagatRaxak. You'll find some information about this in WP:COPYVIO. You can also request assistance at Wikipedia:Copyright problems. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:55, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

The link I provided is wrong messed it up, anyways thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JagatRaxak (talk • contribs) 07:57, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I asked an administrator named Diannaa to take a look at this and she said that other website is a WP:MIRROR of Wikipedia; basically, this means that the content was on Wikipedia first and the other website just copied it. That sometimes happens and it’s OK for the website to do that as long as they attribute to Wikipedia. So, the Wikipedia isn’t infringing on the copyright of the other website. — Marchjuly (talk) 12:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How do i change our company logo that is showing please?

Hi How do i change the old company logo showing on wikipedia please Kind regards Jackie Hallewell Jackie Hallewell (talk) 11:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Jackie Hallewell, welcome to the Teahouse. If you want your company's Wikipedia's logo to be updated, you can upload one on Wikimedia Commons under a free license, and someone should probably change it. May I ask what article? GeraldWL ✉ 11:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Courtesy link MMCG. Theroadislong (talk) 11:47, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

The reply from User:Gerald Waldo Luis is only correct if you wish to release the logo for everyone to use under a free licence. It is more likely that you would wish to use the logo under a fair use exemption, in which case you'll find advice at WP:Logos. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Oh, and continuation to David's, if you're not the one designing, make sure the design team (or person) allows it. GeraldWL ✉ 13:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, Gerald Waldo Luis, but that's probably not right either. Most logos are uploaded with the non-free content criteria, and that does not require permission from anybody. --ColinFine (talk) 14:07, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Translations

Hello! I want to thank you for the invite! I was a Wikipedia several years ago before the "Drafting process" had been implemented. My interests have grown since as well. I shave studied Portuguese for a year and a half now and enjoy the language so much that I will be pursuing college in Brazil once I get married and receive my citizenship. I went to Wikipedia while writing an article about Wiktionary accuracy for a magazine I work for. I found an article while perusing Portuguese Wikipedia called Ann Syrdal which had no equivalent on English Wikipedia yet. I decided to translate the article for fun and try to publish it to EN before realizing that there was a whole new and unfamiliar system of editing and publishing. It would get published anyway with the help of my translation but I wonder about a couple things:

1. When did the drafting process come into effect? I couldn't find any specific timeline. Although it was a little inconvenient since I had yet to understand it, I feel like it is a particularly good checks-and-balance system.

2. Where do I find lists of drafts? When I searched Ann Syrdal, I could not find my own draft but could only go there when I typed Draft:Ann Syrdal directly.

3. What issues do editors face when translating articles into English? Do different language Wikis have different policies? What should I be weary about when translation articles so as to not produce an unusable version for the main site?

4. The final copy of Ann Syrdal is missing a New York Times source and had some irrelevant information removed but other irrelevant information (such as parent names) kept. I tried to keep it as concise as possible. Was I wrong in keeping The New York Times source in the translation as per WP:OR?

5. I wish to continue doing this because of the amount of fun and good practice it is. Is there a way to see Portuguese Wikipedia articles that do not have English translations yet? Is there a masterlist? MichaelIsAlwaysreal (talk) 18:09, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@MichaelIsAlwaysreal: welcome back. I can't answer all your questions, but for translations into english see WP:TRANSLATE and for translations out of english see WP:TRANSLATEUS. Each Wikipedia has its own rules and guidelines for what is needed for an article. What may be acceptable in the Portuguese Wikipedia may not be acceptable here and vice-versa. RudolfRed (talk) 18:38, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hello, MichaelIsAlwaysreal and welcome to the Teahouse, and back to Wikipedia.

I will try to answer several of your questions by number below, bypassing the ones where I have too little experience or knowledge.

1. The draft namespace was created following the success of the proposal Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)/Archive 107#Proposed new Draft namespace in late 2013. But the Articles for creation process existed for several years prior to that, using the Wikipedia talk namespace, in a rather awkward way. It was originally devised to permit IP editors to create drafts for articles even though they could no longer (after the Sigenthaler incident) create pages directly in the main article space. It was soon expanded to attempt to help inexperienced editors with creating articles. It has never been, and is not now, required. (Also, the previous use of userspace drafts was not so very different from the use of draft space.) Any autoconfirmed user may if s/he so chooses, create an article directly in the mainspace. However, I do not advise it. Indeed although i have been active here for over 15 years, I always start new articles in draft space (although I do not use AfC reviews) because I cannot create even a minimally acceptable artifice in a single edit, and it is my opinion that few editors can do so.

2. I don't know of any single master list of drafts, and if there were one, it would almost surely be too long to be very useful. Special:Search will find drafts provide that the draft name space is one of those listed in the "search in" pull-down. By default it is not listed. Also, if you start to create a new article, and there is a draft with the exact same name, a notice pops up informing the editor and offering the chance to work on the draft instead. That is, if Draft:Example exists, a notice will be shown if a user tries to create Example.

3. Different language versions of Wikipedia often ahve very different policies and customs, particularly in regard to sourcing and notability. An acceptable article on one Wikipedia may not be acceptable on another. I can't really speak to what other problems are faced by translators.

4. If a sources is relevant to the article I don't see how including it could ever be WP:OR. I am not sure I fully understand this question.

5. I don't know of any such master list, but someone else might.

I hope all that is a bit helpful. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 18:50, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@LordPeterII:, here is an editor who speaks Portuguese, if you are interested. I think you were looking for casual translators? Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 23:17, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Tribe of Tiger: Indeed I was! Thanks for pinging me, and although atm I have no urgent need for a Portuguese translation, you never know what tomorrow might bring!

@MichaelIsAlwaysreal: I'm afraid this is slightly off topic, but if you are eager to work on translations would you consider adding your name at the translators available page? That way, other users (like me, potentially, in the future) could contact you if they need help with some translation (e.g. of a source only available in Portuguese).

Back on topic: About your question 5 - there somewhat is, but not about completely missing, just about incomplete articles: W:Category:Articles_needing_translation_from_Portuguese_Wikipedia There's a whopping 1188 articles (at the time of this writing) that could be expanded from Portuguese there, so that's likely enough for a lifetime ^^ If you are looking for entirely missing articles, I think your best bet would be to do a Wikidata query, but you would need to ask for help with that because I do not know how to formulate such a complex query. Good luck anyway, and I personally appreciate your translation efforts (I try to do the same with German articles from time to time) :) --LordPeterII (talk) 00:09, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

For a previous discussion on Ann Syrdal, see User_talk:MichaelIsAlwaysreal#Ann Syrdal and User talk:Mitch Ames#Ann Syrdal. Mitch Ames (talk) 14:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Where can I make a complaint to the admins?

So last night I attempted to get an article published. It was speedy deleted and I understand why. So I moved it to a Draft to continue working and improving it. When I woke up, I saw people had begun the process to delete it. I honestly want to make a complaint to the admins because these 2 guys are working to delete a draft that is less than 12 hours old. The reason for the speedy deletion was because I didn't see enough notability. I had about 1/2 of the needed notability shown. So can someone tell me where I can make a complaint to the admins? Thank you. CurrentWeather (talk) 10:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather If your issue involves user behavior, you can go to WP:ANI. However, as an admin I don't really see anything actionable here. You have already gone to the deletion discussion page and raised your objection, and that will be taken into account. If you were to go to ANI it would likely be closed relatively quickly, as users are allowed to propose deletion in good faith. I might opine that an article about a high school athlete sourced only to the high school paper may not meet the definition of a notable high school athlete(which specifically excludes school papers as sources). 331dot (talk) 10:56, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Are you the person you are writing about, or do you know them? 331dot (talk) 10:58, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I know them and I disclosed that I am close to the topic CurrentWeather (talk) 11:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather while I disagree with the deletion nomination, and have said so in the MfD discussion, the nominator (a very experienced editor) has not violated any policy, guideline, or procedure in making the nomination. I am an admin, and I assure you that any formal complaint would be rapidly dismissed. Any editor who, in good faith thinks that a particular draft harms the project, or qualifies under our deletion policy, may nominate it for deletion at an MfD discussion. All interested editors may give their views. The discussion will last for at least 7 days, and may be continued beyond that. If, and only if, there is a consensus to delete it, it will be deleted. Even after that, it can be undeleted if significant new information comes to light. While drafts are not automatically deleted unless they are untouched for 6 months, they are not immune from deletion by consensus at any point.

If you have sources that indicate better than those already in the draft, I urge you to mention those sources, with links if possible, in the MfD and describe in what way they make Joyce significant. It needs to be something more than setting local HS athletic records, I would think. National or regional coverage would help, or something else out of the ordinary. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 15:04, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I have written two books that are available free to anyone about 'Tom Williamson the Golfer' and 'The History of Hollinwell and Notts. Golf Club'. I would like them to be available to Wikipedia readers.

I have written two books that are available free to anyone about 'Tom Williamson the Golfer' and 'The History of Hollinwell and Notts. Golf Club'. I would like them to be available to Wikipedia readers.

How do I create a link to them on the relevant Wikipedia pages?

There is no advertising related to them. I am the archivist at Hollinwell and these are detailed, referenced and informative. Cacosmia (talk) 13:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Cacosmia, Wikipedia is not a place for letting people know about your new work. If the book has information that an editor deems needed for a certain article, they will probably cite it at the claim they wrote. GeraldWL ✉ 13:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Cacosmia you might be interested in Wikisource.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 15:26, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

German POWs in America in WWII

There are numerous general accounts of German POWs in America in WWII. I'm trying to find out at which of the roughly 700 camps my father was interned. Sadly, no one in the family remembers where my father told us he was; two relatives think it was in S.C., but my husband and I lean more toward somewhere in the midwest. He talked about harvesting potatoes and beans, and that it was very hot there.

Does anyone know whom I should contact for POW rolls -- if they even exist? 70.35.176.142 (talk) 15:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

This question is probably more appropriate for the Reference Desk; this page is to ask questions about using Wikipedia. 331dot (talk) 15:38, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How long does a speedy deletion normally take?

How long does a speedy deletion normally take? So I recently created an article and it was requested for a speedy deletion. I did contest it and I gave a valid reason to contest it. Does anyone know about how long the process takes? Thanks for help in advance. CurrentWeather (talk) 00:09, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi CurrentWeather. It can vary on the type of page that is nominated and the reasons the page was nominated. A page nomimated for copyright reasons or spam reasons might be deleted fairly quickly as soon as some administrator comes across it. If the page you're referring to is Elijah Joyce, then that article has already be deleted per WP:A7 by an adminsitrator named TomStar81. If you look at Template:db-person (which was probably the template that was used), you'll see there's no specific time period that needs to pass before the file can be deleted. So, bascially the process takes as long as it takes for someone other than the aricle's creator who disagrees with the tagging to remove the template or an administrator to review the template. TomStar81 did leave a message on your talk page explaining why he deleted the page; so, perhaps that would be the best place to ask him any further questions if you have any.

I also see you're currently working on Draft:Elijah Joyce. The article seems to be about a high school athlete and all of the sources you cited seem to be from the high school newspaper of Dayton Christian where Joyce is a student. I'm not sure how many articles about high school athletes are created, even record-setting athletes, when the primary coverage about them seems to be mainly limited to their high school newspaper per WP:NSPORT and WP:YOUNGATH. You'll probably have a better chance at establishing Joyce's Wikipedia notability if you can show that he has received covered regionally or nationally. You can keep working on the draft if you want, but if it's basically a recreation of the article that was deleted, then it seems unlikely to be accepted by WP:AFC if you submit for review, or likely to be mominated or tagged for deletion again if you WP:MOVE the page to the article namespace yourself. Joyce may have a great career ahead of him in competitive swimming, but it might be WP:TOOSOON to try and create an article about him at this point. Maybe try asking about this at WP:SWIMMING to see if any of the members of that WikiProject have any suggestions on how to further improve your draft. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:44, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@CurrentWeather: For CSD the time frame is usually whenever the spirit moves an admin to go through the log page and start clearing it out or whenever an RC-patrolling admin spots an edit summary with deletion related material and moves to pounce on it. It can take a matter of seconds or it can be a days long affair, it just depends. As far as successfully contesting goes, that depends on the material, the tag, and the admin. In a best case an article stays, but this is usually rare, in most cases an article is axed and in a few cases the admins file for AFD. In all cases though those who would contest are usually asked to be familiar the guidelines and policies which apply to the article's material and as a show of good faith are asked to be familiar with Wikipedia:Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions and User:ReaderofthePack/Common notability arguments as those of us who swing axes grow very frustrated with the having explain for the umpteenth time why such and such an argument doesn't work. TomStar81 (Talk) 01:15, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

TomStar81 you wrote above: In a best case an article stays, but this is usually rare, ...} Not so rare as all that. When I patrol CSD , I find that depending on the sub category, I decline 1/4 to 1/3, sometimes as many as 1/2 of the tags. Look at Special:Contributions/DESiegel and search for "Speedy declined" to get some idea, although this won't show pages later deleted via PROD or AfD (or XfD). I am seeing some 22 declines in my last 500 edits and 24 deletions over the same time period (since 11 Aug). Of course I am probably not representative of all admins on this issue. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 01:33, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CurrentWeather, I think that the overwhelming majority of Wikipedia administrators would have speedily deleted this article about a run-of-the-mill high school athlete without any hesitation. Please read and study Wikipedia's notability guideline for athletes. It is very rare although not impossible for a high school athlete to qualify for a Wikipedia biography. If he had set a world record instead of a school record, then that would probably qualify him. The example that comes to mind is LeBron James, who went straight from high school to professional basketball. His Wikipedia biography was created in 2003 right around the time he graduated from high school, but before he had played professionally. However, he had already been on the cover of Sports Illustrated by then. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 05:54, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Comment: Irrespective of this particular case, the problem we have created for ourselves is that users whose pages are tagged for WP:CSD are provided with a nice shiny blue button on Template:Db, clearly seeming to allow them to contest deletion, and then a helpful notice on their talk page, too. But if I come along 10 minutes later and delete the page, they've had no chance to interact. Either we should give users a chance to contest, or we should not give it to them in the first place, but simply explain why their content has been summarily executed removed. It's a waste of my time contesting deletion if, once I've finished drafting my comments to contest it, I find the page has already been deleted. At the very least, we should consider changing the user talk page message fromn "This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted." to "Whilst this might give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it is often removed without delay." Nick Moyes (talk) 10:05, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Nick Moyes and anyone else - I suggest that the instructions for administrators who are reviewing speedy deletion nominations include an instruction to look at the talk page to see if there is an appeal. I think that would be a simple and reasonable addition to the procedures. The large majority of speedy deletion nominations are valid, and the majority of appeals contesting speedy deletions are of no real value, but occasionally a speedy deletion nomination is either mistaken (or actually done to make a point) or should go to AFD. I think it is just common sense to include that in the instructions for deleting administrators. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

In the specific case of Elijah Joyce, the author not only contested the deletion, twice, but removed the speedy deletion tag, although the instructions say clearly not to do that. What we have here appears to be an editor who doesn't understand what is meant by notability. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Newcomers Real Estate Help

How does a Veteran Real Estate Agent get listed to help newcomers? Chevy409 (talk) 17:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Chevy409 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm not clear on what your question has to do with editing or using Wikipedia, which is the purpose of this forum. Wikipedia is not a directory of real estate agents. Please clarify. 331dot (talk) 17:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

If a blocked account was unblocked, can it's block evasions will also be unblocked?

Hello! I'm asking you for a question. If a blocked account was unblocked, can it's block evasions also be unblocked?OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 06:52, 23 August 2020 (UTC) OrangeCD-ROM (talk) 06:52, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

No, I don't think that is done. Assuming that you're talking about an account that was blocked for some reason and then the person engage in Sock puppetry to try and evade their original block, then the blocked sock puppet accounts are almost always going to be indefinitely blocked. The primary account (i.e. the master account) may be unblocked per WP:UNBLOCK, but the other accounts pretty much never are. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:01, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

User:OrangeCD-ROM - No, as Marchjuly said, but evading the block via sockpuppets also makes it less likely that the master account will be unblocked. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:29, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

• Note. User now blocked. GMG^talk 17:38, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How best to check if a newly created article is 'substantially identical' to a deleted one?

I'm specifically thinking in terms of CSD WP:G4. For instance 'John Taurus' has had a delete result at AfD twice this year, but today I stumbled across Draft:John Tauras. Kj cheetham (talk) 19:03, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

P.S. I know only admins can see deleted versions, so really I'm asking which is the appropriate forum to ask them in. -Kj cheetham (talk) 19:06, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I can tell you that the draft is exactly the same, just with the filmography table added in. bibliomaniac15 19:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. -Kj cheetham (talk) 19:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How can I upload a photo in an article?

How can I upload a photo in an article? Nasimrezaei1 (talk) 17:57, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

This brochure gives a good overview of the process. I'd caution you, though, that the subject of the draft you're working on does not seem to qualify for a Wikipedia article. See WP:NMUSIC. So I would not invest a lot of time in the draft; you are likely to be disappointed when it is not published. Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

That includes not uploading a photo until a draft is accepted as an article. David notMD (talk) 19:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@David notMD: I'm not sure I understand your comment. Images are allowed in drafts as long as they are free images (and presumably the only images that would be permitted in this user's draft biography would be free images). Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Texas Elections and Politicians: Errors

2002 Texas Elections for US Senator: Democrat candidate for U.S. Senator was Kirk Watson. The photo in right-sidebar is not Kirk Watson.

Rick Perry: Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas, but is listed as Governor for several years. Wayne Roberson, Austin, Texas (talk) 20:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Wayne Roberson, Austin, Texas Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The proper place to note errors us on the article talk page of the relevant article. I'm not sure how you can claim Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas, he won three elections as Governor. 331dot (talk) 20:24, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

You say that "Rick Perry was never Governor of Texas"; the article Governorship of Rick Perry seems to disagree with you, so you would need very strong evidence to convince us. Similarly 2002 United States Senate election in Texas disagrees with you on the identity of the Democrat candidate. If you have published reliable sources to support your contentions, the talk pages of the articles concerned would be the place to discuss your thoughts. David Biddulph (talk) 20:34, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

How long until a new draft is approved.

Hi there I wanted to ask how long it takes for a new draft article to be approved and listed?

Also, is there a way to add a subject photo to the article for the artist who I’m writing about?

Thanks you. IrishContributor2020 (talk) 20:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@IrishContributor2020: Your article had not been submitted for review, so I submitted it. I also reviewed it and declined it. Please read the message at Draft:Karl Dawson to understand why it was declined. If Dawson doesn't qualify for an article (and I'm not sure he does), then it does not make sense to invest time in adding images to the draft. For now, please see if you can collect more significant coverage of Dawson and add it to your draft. Once it's been accepted, I'd ask here about how to add a photo to the article. Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Change the URL or make a new page? New guy needs help :)

I want to put up a page on Wikipedia at this URL https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly, but it's already taken with another company that's out of business.

The Neighborly I want to make an entry for is a totally different company at the same URL as the previous company (neighborly.com).

1) Should the new company be on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly?

2) If so, what should the current https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neighborly be changed to?

3) If not, what should the new company's URL be?

Thank you for your help! Govatos (talk) 20:36, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Govatos, and welcome to the Teahouse. There are standard ways of handling multiple articles with whose subjects have the same name; but my advice to you is not to worry about it, but use the articles for creation process to create a draft. When you submit your draft for review, a reviewer who accepts it will move it to main article space, and sort out any name clashes. You do realise that creating a new article is one of the hardest tasks for inexperienced editors? (I know you've been here 12 years, but you describe yourself as a new guy). Have you read your first article? --ColinFine (talk) 21:12, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

show a 12 hour clock

Bold textshow a 12 hour clock

l 2600:1700:ECD0:A7A0:607F:A00E:76FD:76B4 (talk) 21:07, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I checked preferences and I don't see this as an option. Perhaps someone can suggest a gadget that does it. In either case you would need to create an account to change the time format display. RudolfRed (talk) 21:20, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Copyright

I wanted to report copyright / blatant copy paste issue on the page Devendrakula Velalar which has content copied from thispdf in the url however it is not possible to report on page. What is going on? I read insctruction on wikipedia page about tagging copy right issue but editing not possible in that page it seems. JagatRaxak (talk) 17:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, JagatRaxak I will look into the issue. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 17:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

If you can't edit the article, you can raise the problem at Talk:Devendrakula Velalar. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:05, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

JagatRaxak I have removed the copied text. I considered re-writing it, but the source from whoich it is copied is missing key info such as the author's name, and seems to come from a thesis database, so it may not be a reliable source. I have used revision deletion to hide all revisions of the page (some 155) that included the copied text. The copied content did not have much context in the article in any case, and seemed to me of quite limited value. But this is not a field I claim to know well.

The page was fully protected earlier this month because of extensive edit warring. Edit requests and reports of problems may be made at Talk:Devendrakula Velalar. The page would, in my view, benefit from much work. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 20:08, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Sigh...while you are at it,DESiegel, the "Inscription" section has been closely/mostly copied from the same pdf in the url, see page ten. The only difference, afaict, is a change in names from Pallas to Devendrakula Velalar. I would be willing to try to rewrite this charming story, if someone can confirm the source, re:ibid. It seems to be from K.R.Hanumanthan, as cited in the article? I However, don't understand why Pallas was changed to Devendrakula Velalar. Sorry for the bother. Pinging JagatRaxak also. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 22:25, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger Thanks. From what I read on the talk page of this article, at least one editor thinks that "Devendrakula Velalar" is the proper name for the group others call "Pallas". Personally I don't know enough about the topic to have an opinion. The PDF linked above seems to be a chapter of a thesis, dn does not include any author's name. Perhaps the first part would, but I couldn't find that on the site. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 22:30, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

DYK

In order to nominate an article for DYK, a. do I have to review another DYK? How do I do that? b. Where do I write the hook – where it says "hook" or where it says "ALT1"? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 20:58, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Charlie Smith FDTB, provided the article in question complies with all WP:DYKRULES and WP:DYKSG, you can nominate it at WP:DYKNOM. For more info on the DYK process, see WP:DYK and Help:How to write the perfect "Did you know" hook. Also, what article are you thinking of nominating? Giraffer (munch) 21:42, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. I was thinking of nominating Moshe Rosenstain and Yeshivas in World War II.Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 21:45, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Charlie Smith FDTB. I think my reply to you got overwritten in an 'editing conflict', so I'm just popping it back again: You get your first 5 DYK nominations free, with no need to review another one. After the first five, you are expected to do one review for each of your own nominations. This is the QPQ - quid pro quo - you'll have seen mention of. As I recall, your hook goes where it says Hook. But if you have an idea(s) for an alternative hook(s), thet go in ALT1, then ALT2 etc. (I found the instructions for my first DYK to be harder to follow than creating my first article! Good luck. Nick Moyes (talk) 21:35, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you very much. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:09, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

I tried nominating an article at Template:Did you know nominations/Yeshivas in World War II but I don't know if it worked. Can you please check? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:48, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: You've still got one more key step to take. Having created the individual nomination, that is really only a sub-page, and you now need to stick that page inside the master page of all nominations. It might sound scary, but it's actually quite a simple process of 'transcluding' your nomination, so that it is physically embedded within the master page (not just copy/pasted), which means that any changes to your individual page also appear (live) at Template talk:Did you know. (I know this may seem counter-intuitive to be posting within a talk page, but it's a template's talk page, not a users or an articles - it's ok.)   Like I said, if you follow the official guidelines it's very complicated. I recommend these Instructions for 'Did You Know' that a normal human being can understand. Don't forget you should then also put the DYK nomination into your article's talk page, too. Make sure you watch your individual nomination page as that's where you'll get feedback or concerns raised. You'll probably need to indicate whether you either don't need to do QPQ, or link to the article concerned if you have done one. From memory, isn;t there a field in the template QPQ= but he tip is to look back at earlier nominations and follow how they have been done. You have 7 days from the time of your article's creation to submit your nomination, so you've plenty of time to sort this out. If you need further help from me specifically, please WP:PING me in any reply here (i.e. by including both my username and by signing your post within the same edit. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 08:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes:Thank you. I transcluded it under Template talk:Did you know#Articles created/expanded on August 21. Is that all I need to do? Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 17:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: Well done for doing that! If you look at the other, earlier nominations, you'll see each nominator has added a field 'Reviewed:' and then either indicated that they have made under 5 DYK nominations, or they've linked to the page that they have already reviewed - so you do need to add that, as appropriate. I've also added your DYK nomination to the talk page of Yeshivas in World War II. (Perhaps I could comment that (as an ignoramus on Jewish culture - and, indeed, many other things), I was confused that the lead didn't explain what Yeshivas are, and that it linked to a different word, yeshivos, which took me to Yeshiva. So forgive my ignorance, but I was left quite confused by the possible masculine/feminine or singular/plural ending confusion as you seemed to switch between '..vos' and '...vas' within the same sentence. I also suggest you expand the lead paragraph to explain in a couple of words what a yeshiva is, then where they were moved from (which isn't mentioned), and the fact that those which didn't leave were killed by the Nazis. If you can stand back and read the lead paragraphs with an open mind, it ought to tell a reader the essence of the story. Obviously, it doesn't help that I didn't know what a yeshiva is/are, but despite that I don't feel the lead really gets over to me the broad picture. So I think this is really worth you working on. Hoping this feedback is of use. Nick Moyes (talk) 18:54, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: I added explanation to the opening paragraph and changed all the "yeshivos" to "yeshivas" (they both are plural for the word "yeshiva". "Yeshivos" is the proper Hebrew grammar, while "yeshivas" pluralizes it with English grammar). As for the reviews (I don't need to because it's my first nomination), I don't known how to add that once the page is already published. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 19:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Charlie Smith FDTB: I've fixed it: it goes into the template that you created. It's possible that you may have gone the other way by perhaps adding a bit too much detail now, but not to worry. Nick Moyes (talk) 20:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. Charlie Smith FDTB (talk) 22:35, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Conflict of Interest for new wiki user not showing correctly

Hello. I am writing a draft for my company since we do not have a wikipedia page yet. I was writing the disclosure part (conflict of interest) according to the template provided and for some reason, after submitting, I see "Connected contributor paid should only be used on talk pages." According to a deck for creating an account and stating our conflict of interest, the screenshot for after submitting the disclosure was not the same as what shows for my screen and I am unable to submit my wikipedia draft for approval.

Any suggestions or guidance to fix this problem? Much appreciated and thank you! Meguatastro (talk) 21:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Meguatastro: Please use {{Paid}} for your user page. {{Connected contributor (paid)}} should go on the talk page of the draft you create. Calliopejen1 (talk) 21:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Meguatastro and welcome to the Teahouse. Thank you for declaring your conflict of interest. {{connected contributor}} is for use on the talk page of an article where a person with a COI has edited. {{UserboxCOI}} is for use on your user page. place it as follows:

{{UserboxCOI|1=Wikipedia article name}}

If there is more than one article for which you have a COI, add 2= and 3= and so on, for up to nine article names. However, if you are writing about your employer, use {{Paid}} as Calliopejen1 said above. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 21:40, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Meguatastro. In the interest of possibly saving you a considerable amount of disappointment and frustration, I would like to make some (possibly unwelcome) point.

• First, creating a new article is one of the most difficult tasks for a new editor, and I always advise against trying it before spending a few weeks or months improving existing articles and learning how Wikipedia works first.
• The task is even more difficult for an editor with a conflict of interest, because (since Wikipedia is basically not interested in anything that the subject says about itself, or the subject's associates or employees say about it) it will be necessary for you to forget everything you know about the company, and confine yourself to summarising what people unconnected with the company have published about it.
• Nobody in the universe "has a Wikipedia page". Wikipedia has articles about notable companies and other notable subjects. If your company does not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then all time and effort you put into trying to create an article will go to waste.
• Further, nobody owns a Wikipedia article. If you succeed in getting an article about your company written and accepted, it will thereafter not be your article, and you will not control its contents. You will be welcome to suggest changes on the article's talk page, but that will be the limit of your involvement.

If you still want to go ahead, I suggest looking at User:ian.thomson/Howto for a summary of how to proceed, and your first article for more detail, --ColinFine (talk) 22:44, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

CREATING A NEW PAGE/TOPIC

I am trying to create a new page for my client who owns a roofing company in Pennsylvania. I have edited more than 10 pages in an effort to receive the contributor status necessary to create a page. Can you please explain the process to me in a bit more detail? If I want to create a page about this roofing company, what are the appropriate steps to take? How will I be notified when I am able to publish the page? I appreciate any guidance! TEC2012 (talk) 13:11, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

TEC2012 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Since you state that you are editing for a client, you must read the paid editing policy and make the required declaration. (This is a Terms of use requirement and mandatory) You should also read about conflict of interest. Unless you have extensive experience in article creation, you should use Articles for creation to create and submit a draft for review by an independent editor, instead of directly creating it. You should read Your first article and be aware that Wikipedia only summarizes what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about a subject, showing how it meets Wikipedia's special definition of notability Wikipedia has no interest in what the subject wants to say about itself (such as through interviews, press releases, or routine announcements). 331dot (talk) 13:16, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

About "Wikipedia has no interest in what the subject says about himself," I think you mean "limited space for...". Some autobiographical citations may be used, but Wikipedia only allows it for few cases. GeraldWL ✉ 13:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Gerald Waldo Luis This isn't referring to citations, but the OP representing their client and telling the world what they want to say about themselves. That's discouraged. 331dot (talk) 15:10, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi TEC2012, welcome to the Teahouse. I would strongly discourage you to make a page about something/someone you have a close connection with; you'll have a conflict of interest which will decrease the level of encyclopedicness and will seem more promotional. I'd suggest you declare your conflict of interest towards said subject at your userpage; it's useful for other editors to know it. See WP:COI for more info.

You may, meanwhile, make more edits to Wikipedia (valuable edits, ofc) and when the time is right, make an article on something you don't have a conflict of interest with. You may think that you don't have a bias on your client, but it may be seen vividly on the final result; I've never seen any COI-backgrounded edits page creations successful. GeraldWL ✉ 13:19, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Gerald Waldo Luis I obviously cannot speak to what you have seen, but COI editors can and do make edits in the correct manner, either as edit requests or through AFC. 331dot (talk) 13:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Apologies for the confusion, I meant page creations. Saw the epidemic just today. I am obviously not saying COIers cannot make good edits, I just haven't saw them. I would love to someday. GeraldWL ✉ 13:26, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

An example of a good COI page (for anyone who wishes to see one) is Handschriftencensus, which Blablubbs and I helped create. The main author was Hrobeth Dunbar, who had a disclosed COI. It started as a draft and passed AfC. Giraffer (munch) 13:48, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gerald Waldo Luis:, perhaps this will be of interest. Yes, Giraffer, is correct, and possibly as a result of this initial good experience, with Giraffer and others, Hroberth Dunbar is now editing Lubeck law, and adding proper sources, etc to update a very old and poorly refed article. He even found an image, to enrich the article. Because they were not the sort of editors who would choose to violate our regulations, I have had good experiences with "academic" -type COI editors, that I met through the Teahouse, who have proved very helpful. See the talkpage of Judith Klinman for examples. Thus far, the academics, in my experience, readily understand and accept our COI regulations, plus they know how to provide well-formatted sources! Another Teahouse meeting occurred with JBonnerAnglican, in reference to a stub that had been started on his father, Gerald Bonner. His notes/sources, as stated on the talkpage, enabled me to expand the article. These "good faith" editors, despite their COI, are a benefit to the project. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 01:50, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks so much for your quick response! I definitely appreciate the concerns with the COI and have read up on that a bit. The purpose of putting the company on Wikipedia isn't for promotional purposes at all. They would just like for their company to have an article in this space. They've been around for nearly ten years, are among the Top 100 Roofing Companies in the US, they've been featured in newscasts in several states on the East Coast and the owner of the company has authored a book on roofing. I know there is a major backlog in getting an article published by someone else and that is why I was hoping to create the article myself. I write content for them only and am not on their staff. Not sure if that helps. What would be your best suggestion for me to try and move this forward? If I don't create the page, who would?

TEC2012 (talk) 13:47, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm sorry, TEC2012, but "they would just like for their company to have an article in this space" is an example of exactly what Wiipedia means by promotion. Wikipedia has essentially no interest in whether somebody wishes there to be an article about them (or, indeed, whether they wish there not to be an article about them). If a consensus of editors agrees that a topic is notable (which requires that there be sufficient independent material about them already reliably published, so an article can be based on that material) then Wikipedia would like to have an article on them, if somebody wants to write it. If there is not sufficient material for them to meet the citeria of notability, then Wikipedia will not accept an article on them. --ColinFine (talk) 14:17, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Kevin Coates

Good morning

KEVIN COATES: his current Wikipedia entry

Yesterday, Kevin Coates and myself spent all day up-dating his Wikipedia entry, with some difficulty! Eventually - after several false starts - we finally concluded our edit at around 19h00 last night.

However, devastatingly, we've just discovered that our entire new input has been "reverted" by ClueBotNG: how an earth can we get it permanently reinstated?

I'm new at this task and it seems that I should be able to revert to an earlier edit, or re-enter all the new text again, but we're concerned that it will simply be deleted again.

Kevin and I will be delighted for any assistance you might be able to provide.

Sincerely

Richard N Frost (on behalf of Kevin Coates) Richard N Frost (talk) 12:17, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello Richard N Frost and welcome to the Teahouse! Cluebot did indeed revert you, you changed the article from this [9] to this [10] and the bot is supposed to revert stuff like that. You were later reverted again by Justlettersandnumbers who left an explaination here: [11].

My advice to you, if you want to try to have some influence on the contents of that article (not impossible, but WP is a peculiar place), is to take the time to read WP:COI and WP:BLP, and then to start a discussion at Talk:Kevin Coates, suggesting what changes you would like to see, and the WP:RS that supports them. Nothing is permanently reinstated on WP. Change is one of the points of this project. Good luck. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:40, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Nothing is lost. It is all there in View history. And could be copied to your Sandbox to work on before pasting into the article. HOWEVER, given several reverts (deletions) of your attempts, you are strongly advised to start a discussion on the Talk page of the article rather than editing the article directly. And as GGS wrote, read WP:COI, as it clearly applies to you. David notMD (talk) 13:10, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Keep in mind that an article is not a CV regurgitation, and every fact must be referenced. David notMD (talk) 13:12, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Richard N Frost Yes, please see WP:MINREF, for our actual guidelines. Simple stmts that are not likely to be challenged, do not require a ref. If the info added is a quotation, or "contentious" biographical info, it needs a ref, but regular sorts of info do not. Example: "He grew up in a ranch-style house" does not need a ref. We do have to use common sense. Every fact does Not need a ref. I am not sure how contentious it is to make normal stmts about an artist's life and career. Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 03:42, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Another way to look at it, Richard N Frost, is to realise that, as an encyclopaedia, Wikipedia is basically not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves: it is only interested in what people wholly unconnected with the subject, and not prompted or fed information by the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If there is such independent published material, then the article should be almost entirely based on it; if there isn't, then the subject does not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, and no article on them is possible. --ColinFine (talk) 14:43, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Richard N Frost, well done for coming here for advice; I'd meant to leave you an invitation, but see that in the event I didn't do so – sorry about that! I concur with all the advice that others have given you (my thanks to those who gave it!). For the record, I reverted your additions twice; the edit summary I left the second time was "Again remove swathes of unsourced and WP:PROMOTIONal stuff – WP:neutrality is one of the five pillars of this project; if in doubt, take to talk". Please take the time to follow those blue links and read the pages they lead to, they are both helpful and important. Note to ColinFine and anyone else who cares: I'm pretty certain that Coates is fully notable by our standards, and deserves a considerably better page than we have at the moment. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 17:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Tribe of Tiger, however, in a WP:BLP I don't think WP:MINREF has that much weight. It's generally a bad idea to include "is married" and stuff like that without good refs. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:58, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gråbergs Gråa Sång: I suspect I may be a bit bothered on this topic, just now, sorry. I recently had to fend off several notes at Chemancheri Kunhiraman Nair. For one section, I had rewritten the last portion of a properly sourced paragraph, only to see it removed entirely, and the remainder of the info tagged as . I am absolutely puzzled as to why this statement, regarding a person born in 1916, in India, was removed as a "peacock issue".

"His mother died when he was only three years old, and then, at the age of thirteen, he lost his father. He had an early interest in the performances presented by visiting drama troupes, and at the age of fifteen, left his home to begin training at a Kathikali centre, some 25 km away."

The note, left in regards to the remaining text, pertained to the subject's place of birth. The entire original section, prior to the "selective removal" was sourced. I know this because I read the actual source. In reaction to the above, and other notes, I have sourced *Each* stmt, and suspect that the article has now ventured into WP:OVERCITE territory.

In regards to your notes regarding "is married", I must agree that this qualifies as a contentious issue, just don't tell my spouse that I said so! Tribe of Tiger ^{Let's Purrfect!} 03:20, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Questions about editing from a new editor for Wikipedia

I'm curious about many things, but my topmost curiosity is the overview process for Wikipedia. After spending a good deal of time editing an article and ensuring that it was cross linked with other pages, the article still includes statements that the article is an orphan with no other articles linking to it (I've definitely crosslinked other articles with it), that it needs more specific categories (I've added specific categories), and that it requires copy editing (I've copyedited extensively). If someone would kindly explain the review process, I would greatly appreciate your time.

Warmly,

Maria Ó Cluanáin Maria Ó Cluanáin (talk) 04:22, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Maria Ó Cluanáin: Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The tags at the top of Ciokaraine M'Barungu were added manually by editors. They can be manually removed once the issues they mention have been cleared up. I have checked them and they are no longer needed, so I've removed the tags. Thank you for your edits!ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:33, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

PS while looking at the article text, I noticed some of it may be a bit of a close paraphrase of the Google Arts and Culture source; I tagged it as such so that other editors can have a look.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:49, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Black Lives Matter

You need to change the copy...........NON VIOLENT? I love your site but this is WRONG!!! 2601:101:8200:DE7E:71A9:AEA0:5D25:3A74 (talk) 00:58, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

If yiu disagree with the content of an article you should post on the talk page of that article, but be prepared to cite reliable sources. DES ^(talk)_{DESiegel Contribs} 01:09, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

What article are you referring to? Anyone knows the courtesy link? GeraldWL ✉ 03:25, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Presumably Black Lives Matter.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:50, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Question about the subject of a prospective article

Hello Teashouse hosts. I am considering an ambitious article, specifically a list. I am inspired by the fact that I've not written a list article and also by a recent new article: Francis Drake's Circumnavigation. The article would be a list of SFD's landfalls, and each item would include pertinent information. I anticipate breaking the circumnavigation into sections of geographical regions, too.

I've had articles rejected in the past and do not want to put the work into this one with that as a possibility. You can see a record of what I've written [HERE]. I look forward to hearing from you. Hu Nhu (talk) 00:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hu Nhu: I think that would be a useful companion to the article (i.e., link to it somewhere appropriate in the article). I can see having tables with dates and locations, along with co-ordinates, notes, and refs. Maps with location pushpins would be good, too (see {{Location map}} and other templates in this category). Maybe something like List of Spanish missions in California. Some of the locations are pretty vague like a bay in Northern California – I don't know if there's better info in the sources, but most of them appear to be books which may or may not be online. You may need to do some library legwork and/or seek out someone with books at WP:RD. —[AlanM1 (talk)]— 02:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

@Hu Nhu: That sounds like a cool article. I agree with JohnM. Calliopejen1 (talk) 06:30, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Related to AFD voting

Where to find the articles for AFD voting ? Iitianeditor (talk) 13:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Iitianeditor. Try looking at WP:AFD#Current and past articles for deletion (AfD) discussions. — Marchjuly (talk) 14:18, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

AFD discusions are NOT votes; you will sometimes see them described as "!votes". The process is described at WP:Articles for deletion. David Biddulph (talk) 14:23, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

David Biddulph Thanks for the help, will check out the provided links.Iitianeditor (talk) 07:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia Change Page name (Move)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonographic_Performance_Limited

Hi, entering genuine edits her in respect of above page. Given valid reasons and cited for page name change but getting a little stuck how to request a page move which has ended up in a threat to block.

Any experienced editors out there that can help out? My goal is to share factual knowledge and expand access to correct information on this page.

My suggested name change is to "PPL - Music Copyright Collection Society" which will identify it for everyone who knows this company. "PPL is the logo of the Company and the name that everyone in the UK who knows it, calls it by - this includes the Company itself, it's 110,000 members (who all state they are members of the "PPL" and all the license fee payers!)

Any help appreciated. Thanks DJ888kmg (talk) 17:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

It would be wise for you to read what you were told on your user talk page. You were given a link to WP:Requested moves. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:10, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: Thanks for the advice. Have set up Move request and discussion taking place on Phonographic Performance Limited. DJ888kmg (talk) 08:19, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

My editing got removed

Hello, unfortunately all of my editing of the page below got removed for some unknown reason to me. The page as it is does not speak about this person accurately and I wanted to do him Justice! It only spreads some negative information that happened under questionable circumstances for 2 years of his 63 year long career and now we are supposed to highlight and focus on those 2 years. On the top of that, I have received a message from “unknown user” telling me that this page is about Remi Korchemny and not a scrap book about whom he coached. First of all I do not appreciate that sort of communication - at all and secondly I was just stating the facts and putting relevant information about the legendary coach instead of some nonsense shameful information text about some “doping scandal”. Also, of course Wikipedia is not a scrapbook to me - that is absolutely out of question!

I am asking you to restore my work as I was stating only information Remi Korchemny personally told me. Yes, him and me are fiends and I don’t see any conflict of interest when I am listing his accomplishments. And no, I am absolutely not promoting him and also not receiving any money from him for this!

Again, I am kindly asking you to restore my work so that I can complete all of his successes so that people can see for themselves.

Thank you.

P.S. Did you even read the list of references I included? I don’t think you did because if you only did, you would understand what I am talking about.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remi_Korchemny Radspeed (talk) 05:22, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The place to discuss changes to an article is on its talk page, in this case Talk:Remi Korchemny. David Biddulph (talk) 05:32, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Radspeed, an editor represents neither all editors nor the Wikimedia Foundation. Consider a better approach next time. I'll see what's going on right there. GeraldWL ✉ 06:01, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

You say "him and me are friends and I don’t see any conflict of interest when I am listing his accomplishments". Whether or not you see a conflict of interest, you have one. -- Hoary (talk) 07:00, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hoary, proved by their removal of the "BALCO" (Controversy) section. GeraldWL ✉ 07:02, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

None of the myriad of achievements and lesser trivia were supported by any inline references to enable verification of them. On that basis alone, it seemed to me to have been appropriate for those COI edits to be removed. We never take word of mouth content about any individual; their past conviction for drug cheating is irrelevant to that concern. Including a selection of a few good, independent references which mentions his coaching successes might be appropriate, but not vast list of random achievements with no inline sources to support them. Nick Moyes (talk) 07:59, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Note: Also followed up and then responded to on my talk page (here). Nick Moyes (talk) 10:28, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello

Hello, I'm currently making a wikipedia page for a notable figure. How do I keep it clean and professional and also follow wikipedia's guidelines?

The Work-In-Progress page: Draft:Datan Hopson KingOwnageXV (talk) 10:21, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

KingOwnageXV Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Please note that IMDB and social media accounts are not considered independent reliable sources. IMDB is user-editable, while social media accounts are not independent. Wikipedia is primarily interested in what independent reliable sources with significant coverage state. You would need to show with such sources that this person meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable creative professional. You may want to read Your First Article for more information. 331dot (talk) 10:26, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

And you should not have copy/pasted text from another copyrighted website, as you did for the two lead sentences. We do not allow that. See WP:COPYVIO Nick Moyes (talk) 10:34, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Footballers

Who is better Ronaldo Or Messi Ibelaka Anulika (talk) 12:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Ibelaka Anulika Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. This is a place to ask questions about using Wikipedia. Do you have a question about using Wikipedia? 331dot (talk) 12:13, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Copyright of a painting I own

Hi, I would like to write a page about Zambian artists between 1970-90. I want to include a few pictures of paintings and sculptures I own as samples of Zambian artists. All but one of the artists are now deceased, and the one still alive has given me their consent. Could someone please let me know if I can put these pictures on a Wikipedia page. I took the photos of the paintings and sculptures I bought many years ago. Any help will be very appreciated Lusaka80s (talk) 12:39, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Most likely not, unless they are under a siutable license. Note that normally copyright does not end immedately with the death of the artist, but rather some amount of years after that event (70 years is common, but there are shorter and longer periods). As such, its going to be difficult. (Disclaimer:I am not a lawyer and therefore cannot give you legal advice. If you need legal advice, please contact a lawyer of your trust) Victor Schmidt (talk) 13:16, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Move request Phonographic Performance Limited - Request for input on discussion

Hi, started a move request at talk:Phonographic_Performance_Limited - all Editor input welcome. DJ888kmg (talk) 13:18, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Requesting assistance with updates to law firm page

Greetings! I'm a marketing professional with Thompson Coburn law firm. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thompson_Coburn I posted a request for two small updates on our page's Talk page, but haven't received a reply yet. Could someone please take a look and let me know the best next steps? Many thanks! Spencecomms (talk) 13:49, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Spencecomms I have marked your article talk page post as a formal edit request; if you do that it is more likely to be seen by other editors. You may see this page on edit requests for more information. 331dot (talk) 13:52, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

331dot Thank you very much!Spencecomms (talk) 14:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

How to approve my article Draft:Poojabishnoi

 Naresh Prajapat 04:38, 25 August 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nareshprajapatmogra (talk • contribs)

Perhaps you mean to ask: "What can I do to Draft:Pooja Bishnoi in order that it will be approved?" If so, then the answer is "Make radical changes, supporting every assertion within your revised version with a reference to a reliable, independent, published source." Please read Help:Your first article. -- Hoary (talk) 06:57, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

You need to be realistic with your expectations. Not many 9-year olds are notable by Wikipedia's definition. See the guidance on notability for athletics and for cricket. --David Biddulph (talk) 10:24, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

The article actually doesn’t have enough notability of the person or even the layout. It looks like the whole article was written in the lead.Nihaal The Wikipedian (talk) 14:37, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Question about edit requests by an editor with a COI related to the article

I have a COI because I an connected to the subject of an article (She is a politician and I am a supporter or her candidacy and do some volunteer work for the campaign). So, following the instructions I have received, I request edits on the talk page of the article. I have done so. I have posted my question there, but have not received a response from the editor who has read the request. I am waiting for additional responses. I would like to know whether it is appropriate to make edits to my requested edits, or are they set in stone until the review is completed?

I am new to Wikipedia editing and am not familiar with protocol. I'm hoping to learn more about it here. I'm a little gun-shy after making one edit, which was not promotional in any way, and being immediately block for "promotional/COI" editing. I know now that it was COI editing, but I didn't know at the time, and the edit was absolutely neutral. I have made no edits to the page since. Anyway, I was happy to find the Tea House, where I can get some information in a friendly environment. – BiostatSci (talk) 23:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

BiostatSci Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. To increase the odds your request will be seen by another editor, I have marked it as a formal edit request. Another editor should see it soon and comment. In the meantime, please review and comply with the paid editing policy(which includes unpaid-in-money volunteer work). 331dot (talk) 00:24, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply! It helped. I have read WP:PAID and believe that it does not apply to me. Let me explain more about my COI. I am a supporter of the candidate and have indeed taken on some tasks as a volunteer for the campaign, but editing the Wikipedia article is not one of them. That idea was my idea. I got it when I looked at the article and saw how incomplete it was. It was based solely on information that was nearly 2 years old and contained nothing about her work as a legislator. I saw a request by Wikipedia for someone to help make it more complete by adding content. I and a friend decided to work on it. I did some research, sent it to the friend and she made the first attempt to edit. When she showed me what she put up, without giving me a chance to review it before publishing, I was disappointed. It was not appropriate for a Wikipedia article. So, I started editing myself. My friend has never volunteered for the candidate, as far as I know, but has done some writing for the county Democratic party. I believe that she has given up on making or suggesting further edits. Neither of us were "asked" to update the page by either the candidate or the county Democratic party. The idea to do it was entirely mine. I have not and will not receive payment of any kind for this effort from anyone or any organization. I have no affiliation with the county party, except that I am registered to vote in the county as a Democrat. So, I believe WP:PAID does not apply in my case. If I'm wrong, I will make the disclosure (but I prefer not to if not required). It' the word "paid" that gives me pause. Is there a way to disclose without giving the impression that I was paid to do this? That would give the wrong impression. I don't mind saying that I am a volunteer, even though I was not "asked" to do this. I great appreciate you advice! BiostatSci (talk) 05:25, 25 August 2020 (UTC)BiostatSci

BiostatSci If you have not been asked or directed to edit Wikipedia, you may not need to say that you are "paid", but you still have a conflict of interest that, while not required by the Terms of Use, you should disclose. 331dot (talk) 13:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

I have already disclosed that I have a conflict of interest with regard to this page. I did it within a day of the first request by the editor. It's at the top of the talk page of the article (Melanie Stansbury). It does not say that I am a volunteer, however. I don't see a way to edit it to disclose, more specifically, that I volunteer for her campaign. If you can edit it, and have the time to, I would welcome it. I am not editing the article directly, so I can't disclose it with each edit. I can also disclose on my talk page, if that helps, but I don't see that that template allows for specifics about the nature of my connection with Ms. Stansbury. I want to be in compliance! I just don't want to do it in a way that looks like I am being paid. That would misrepresent my connection with Ms. Stansbury. I would not want a viewer to see the disclosure and think that I have been paid, or am claiming to have been paid, when I wasn't. So, I would appreciate your advice on how to make any additional disclosure that might be necessary. I have edited my request for revision on the article talk page to make clear what my connection is, and I have added a tag on my talk page, with an explanation of the specifics on the history page. If I need to do anything else please advise. Thank you again. 2601:8C0:180:7490:D97:F32B:BB6C:4B97 (talk) 14:40, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Original research

1957 Ramnad riots has a section named 'Events during riots' but there was no single citation for the content. I digged through the internet to find sources that I can add but whatever I found seems either to be copied from wikipedia article or the source is unreliable blogspot. So I conclude that this might be a possible original research given the absence of citation. Kindly advise whether the content should be removed? JagatRaxak (talk) 10:54, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, JagatRaxak. Another editor, (Gerald Waldo Luis) appears to have now added a notice to say that that section is uncited - though they forgot to come back an explain their rationale to you. My feeling is that we shouldn't rush to delete uncited content if it is not contested, and is likely to be correct. It might have come from a book or 1957 printed newspaper- it sounds like you aren't sure either. Unless you seriously doubt its veracity, I'd be inclined to leave the content there - possibly adding a note on the talk page to prompt anyone that sources might be helpful. (You could even trace back in the article's history to see who made the original edit and contact them if they're still active here). Just deleting stuff that is likely to be true, but not cited, isn't always the best thing for an article - it's often a case of using one's judgement, and explaining your actions so others can judge your reasoning, too. Hoping this helps, Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 14:06, 25 August 2020 (UTC) 

Apologies for not putting a disclaimer here. I wash on a rush to preparing for a family TV time. Again, apologies, will try slowing down next time. GeraldWL ✉ 15:06, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

And to clarify, I am just putting a disclaimer that there's no citations; I'm not requesting deletion. Editors who is willing to grab sources are welcomed. GeraldWL ✉ 15:10, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Shubham Rathi

Original post in Hindi

बचपन से ही पिताजी ने अनुशासन और देशभक्ति की प्रेरणा दी तथा जिसके फलस्वरूप बचपन से ही देश के लिए कुछ करने का जुनून था और देशभक्ति की भावना थी। स्कूल के समय से ही कुछ देशभक्त व समाजसेवी राजनीतिक नेताओ के चरित्र का प्रभाव पड़ा जिसके फलस्वरूप कक्षा 10 से ही एक छात्र संघठन में जुड़ कर छात्र हित के लिए अपने युवा जोश के साथ कार्य किए। वर्ष 2010 में इंटर करने के पश्चात मुरादाबाद मंडल में सरकारी यूनिवर्सिटी बनवाने की मांग उठाई और वर्ष 2012 में हिन्दू कॉलेज में ग्रेजुएशन में एडमिशन लिया और यही से अपनी छात्र राजनीति की शुरआत करी। लगभग 6 साल एक छात्र संघठन से जुड़ा रहा और बहुत से आंदोलन छात्र हित,राष्ट्र हित व किसानों के लिए किए। मैंने 2015 में अपनी ग्रेजुएशन उत्तीर्ण की तथा 2017 में अपनी पोस्ट ग्रेजुएशन पूरी की और 2018 में लॉ (LLB) में एडमिशन लिया जिसमें कि वर्तमान में अध्ययनरत हूं। वर्ष 2017 में युवा छात्र - छात्राओं की आवाज़ को बुलंद करने के लिए एक छात्र संगठन उत्तर प्रदेश स्टूडेंट्स यूनियन का गठन किया जिसका उद्देश्य छात्रों की समस्याओं को सुलझाना , मुरादाबाद मंडल में सरकारी यूनिवर्सिटी व सरकारी मेडिकल कॉलेज बनवाना और गरीब छात्र - छात्राओं के लिए हॉस्टल बनवाना तथा पूरे उत्तर प्रदेश में युवाओं को आवाज़ को बुलंद करना है। वर्ष 2018 में संगठन का रजिस्ट्रेशन कराया और सर्वसम्मति के साथ संगठन कि बैठक में मुझे उत्तर प्रदेश स्टूडेंट्स यूनियन का प्रदेश अध्यक्ष बनाया गया। हमारा छात्र संगठन उत्तर प्रदेश के विभिन्न जिलों में कार्यरत है तथा युवाओं की आवाज़ को बुलंद कर रहा है। मैंने अब तक अनेकों आंदोलनों में हिस्सा लिया जो कि आतंकवाद के विरूद्ध आंदोलन थे,चाहे वो किसानों के हक की लड़ाई हो या और कोई सामाजिक मुद्दे हों। अनेकों किसान आंदोलनों तथा बहुत से राष्ट्र हित व युवाओं के लिए आंदोलनों को आयोजित किया और आगे भी करता रहूंगा।

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Raghavvishnoi10 (talk • contribs) 06:18, 23 August 2020 (UTC) ‎

Hi there. Your words are Hindi, so my device cannot render it. If you want to talk something about the Hindi Wikipedia, talk it there, not here. By the way for other editors, using Google Translate, this is what it says:

Google translation of original post

From childhood, Dad inspired discipline and patriotism and as a result, from childhood, he had a passion to do something for the country and a sense of patriotism. From the time of school, the character of some patriotic and social political leaders was affected due to which a student from class 10 joined the organization and worked with his youthful zeal for student interest. After intermission in the year 2010, he raised the demand to build a government university in Moradabad division and in 2012 he got admission in Hindu college for graduation and started his student politics from there. For about 6 years, he was associated with a student organization and made many movements for student interest, national interest and farmers. I passed my graduation in 2015 and completed my post graduation in 2017 and took admission in Law (LLB) in 2018 which I am currently studying. In the year 2017, to raise the voice of young students, a student organization, Uttar Pradesh Students Union was formed which aims to solve the problems of the students, to build government universities and government medical colleges in Moradabad division and hostels for poor students. Youths have to be raised in the entire state of Uttar Pradesh. In the year 2018, I got the organization registered and I was made the state president of the Uttar Pradesh Students Union in a meeting of the organization with consensus. Our student organization is working in various districts of Uttar Pradesh and is raising the voice of the youth. I have participated in many movements till now, which were movements against terrorism, whether it is the fight for the rights of farmers or any other social issue. Organized many farmer movements and movements for many national interests and youth and will continue to do so.

What are you trying to say, friend? GeraldWL ✉ 06:24, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Update: I went to the photo's description's website, and the "About" page is literally the whole Hindi text, see http://www.shubhamrathi.in/about. Can you clarify your intention here, Raghavvishnoi10? This is only meant for questions regarding the English Wikipedia, not a marketing place. GeraldWL ✉ 06:30, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

(Biographical content deleted) This is a help forum. What is your question? Nick Moyes (talk) 08:36, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

He's asking us to make an article about Shubam Rathi, I'm an Indian so I understand what he's saying. The whole text is actually Shubam Rathi's biography. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Powering everyone (talk • contribs) 15:12, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Follow-up to Draft:SysCAD

Hi, I'm seeking some assistance with Draft:SysCAD - could someone please review and let me know what additional information would need to be seen to satisfy product notability? DanMunchie (talk) 08:11, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello DanMunchie, and welcome to the Teahouse! Notability means that the subject should be covered by multiple reliable, independent sources with in-depth coverage of the topic. This doesn't seem to be the case for your draft. A quick Google doesn't provide many secondary sources. The submission was declined twice because it wasn't notable enough, and unfortunately it doesn't look like it will pass again. You can't increase notability yourself, so it might be time to stop working on the draft. For more info on notability, see WP:GNG and WP:N Giraffer (munch) 08:23, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi Giraffer, thanks for the reply. I am confused because many of the other entries in Category:Chemical engineering software would have the same issue. As it is field with heavy IP protection, very few public articles are written describing the base software used in chemical engineering projects. Similar to how no-one would write an article on Excel when doing an accounting project. Reference (3) especially is as in-depth as you could get from a third-party. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DanMunchie (talk • contribs) 11:14, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

There are >six million articles in English Wikipedia, many of which are poorly referenced or deletion-worthy. See Wikipedia:Other stuff exists. David notMD (talk) 15:21, 25 August 2020 (UTC)