User talk:Thorncrag/Archive/December 2011

Incorrect warning

Fair call, I should have been reverting them as tests and warning as such. But good faith is a little hard to assume of a new editor whose very first action is to request autoconfirmed status, followed by twelve tiny, arbitrary and largely ungrammatical edits. --McGeddon (talk) 09:45, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Re:Incorrect warning

Hello, Mr. Thorncrag!

Thank you for guiding me in giving a warning to anonymous users. For the future I will try to follow your advice in accordance with the rules that passed here. Nice to meet you. Wagino 20100516 (talk) 00:14, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Username:Psubhashish/sandbox/Tharamangalam

{{resolved}}

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Regarding Username:Psubhashish/sandbox/Tharamangalam

Hey there, thanks a lot for the message, I was actually conducting a Wiki Academy and created the article as a demo article by mistake (Namespace Username instead of User, if you give a chance to editors for few minutes to correct, sometimes slow connections, 1 Organizer:53 participants don't allow you to execute things fast.) I was about to show how the "View history" feature works, then it showed the error message that page has been deleted, then I recreated it again and struggled for few minutes to give up :( Hope you understand how embarassing it is in a real life situations esp. while conducting a live demo session. Subha^Utter2me! 03:27, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

Fitness Direct Deletion

Reply on Thanouncer's talk page

Hello Thorncrag,

Can we discuss how I can make http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitness_Direct Wikipedia-friendly? This was all accurate, true information about my company; it was deleted without letting me make edits to it based on your suggestions (which I didn't recieve). I don't understand why, it was all true information, not unlike all the pages listed on this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Department_stores_of_the_United_States

I actually modeled my article off of this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremys so I am unclear why the article I created was labeled as "promotional." Please let me know how we can move forward with this.

Submitted respectfully. Thank you for your time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thanouncer (talk • contribs) 19:43, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

Chuckawalla/Chuckwalla

Thanks, Ben, for fixing the Chuck/a-what's-the-correct-name disambig page. It was my first venture into that small realm and I wish I had not created more work for other editors. (If you have any questions about law school, drop me a line.) --S. Rich (talk) 02:48, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

A Lucky Child

Dear Thorncrag, Please review the newest version of "A Lucky Child", especially the "AUTHOR" section and external links and references. I believe all your questions have been addressed. This book by Thomas Buergenthal is NOTABLE because it is written by a Justice of the World Court of the Hague (and an Auschwitz survivor). "A Lucky Child" has been translated into more than a dozen languages and has a FOREWORD by Nobel Laurate Elie Wiesel. Survivors of Auschwitz are rare birds indeed and first-hand accounts of this camp are few and far between. I may add that Auschwitz survivor Primo Levi had difficulty finding a publisher for “If this is a man” *(now rated #57 on Le Monde's 100 Books of the Century) partly because the Auschwitz experience was thought to be of little general interest and too depressing and the wounds too fresh at the time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by George.kvakovszky (talk • contribs) 15:17, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

I agree that the topic, and likely the book are notable, but are you able to provide any references to third-party sources mentioning or discussing the book? Including these in the article would demonstrate its notability.    Thorncrag  17:03, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

More on A Lucky Child

Dear Thorncrag, Please pick pick one or more of these reviews and review extracts you feel establish BOOK NOTABILITY to your satisfaction and I will add to A Lucky Child.

Editorial Reviews From Publishers Weekly http://www.publishersweekly.com/978-0-316-04340-3 Not many children who entered Auschwitz lived to tell the tale. The American judge at the International Court of Justice in the Hague, Czechoslovakia-born Buergenthal, is one of the few. A 10-year-old inmate in August 1944 at Birkenau, Buergenthal was one of the death camp's youngest prisoners. He miraculously survived, thanks, among others, to a friendly kapo who made him an errand boy. Buergenthal's authentic, moving tale reveals that his lifelong commitment to human rights sprang from the ashes of Auschwitz. 16 b&w photos, 1 map. (Apr. 20, 2009) Copyright © Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.

"A Lucky Child is an extraordinary story, simply and beautifully told. Heartbreaking and thrilling, it examines what it means to be human, in every good and awful sense. Perhaps most amazingly of all, Thomas Buergenthal remembers and renders the small mysteries and grand passions of childhood, even a childhood lived under the most horrific circumstances."-Elizabeth McCracken, author of An Exact Replica of a Figment of My Imagination "Buergenthal's authentic, moving tale reveals that his lifelong commitment to human rights sprang from the ashes of Auschwitz." - Publishers Weekly.

From Hazel Rochman, Booklist Magazine (March 1, 2009) You think you’ve heard it all: the roundups, deportations, transports, selections, hard labor, death camps (“That was the last time I saw my father”), crematoriums, and the rare miracle of survival. But this one is different. The clear, nonhectoring prose makes Buergenthal’s personal story––and the enduring ethical questions it prompts––the stuff of a fast, gripping read. Five years old in Czechoslovakia at the start of World War II, Buergenthal remembers being crowded into the ghetto and then, in 1944, feeling “lucky” to escape the gas chambers and get into Auschwitz, where he witnessed daily hangings and beatings, but with the help of a few adults, managed to survive. In a postwar orphanage, he learned to read and write but never received any mail, until in a heartrending climax, his mother finds him. In 1952, he immigrated to the U.S., and now, as human-rights lawyer, professor, and international judge, his childhood’s moral issues are rooted in his daily life, his tattooed number a reminder not so much of the past as of his obligation, as witness and survivor, to fight bigotry today. --Hazel Rochman

Review "In the plainest words and the steadiest tones (as an intimate would speak deadly truth in the dead of night), Thomas Buergenthal delivers to us the child he once was: an unblemished little boy made human prey by Europe's indelible twentieth-century barbarism, a criminality that will never leave off its telling. History and memory fail to ebb; rather, they accelerate and proliferate, and Buergenthal's voice is now more thunderous than ever. Pledged to universal human rights, he has turned a life of gratuitous deliverance into a work of visionary compassion."-Cynthia Ozick, author of Heir to the Glimmering World

"A Lucky Child is an extraordinary story, simply and beautifully told. Heartbreaking and thrilling, it examines what it means to be human, in every good and awful sense. Perhaps most amazingly of all, Thomas Buergenthal remembers and renders the small mysteries and grand passions of childhood, even a childhood lived under the most horrific circumstances."-Elizabeth McCracken, author of An Exact Replica of a Figment of My Imagination

"Buergenthal's authentic, moving tale reveals that his lifelong commitment to human rights sprang from the ashes of Auschwitz." - Publishers Weekly.

"The author's story is astonishing and moving, and his capacity for forgiveness is remarkably heartening. An important new voice joins the chorus of survivors." - Kirkus Reviews.

"Starred Review. Buergenthal regards the Holocaust as a moral compass for his life's path as a judge on the International Criminal Court in The Hague." - Library Journal.

"[A] powerful choice for teens looking for a mentor through emotional and political challenges of their own." - School Library Journal — Preceding unsigned comment added by George.kvakovszky (talk • contribs) 20:29, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

New York Times article discussing A Lucky Child

‘The Science of Evil’ - Explaining “Evil” and Human Cruelty, By SIMON BARON-COHEN, Published: New York Times,June 6, 2011 http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/07/science/14evil-excerpt.html?_r=1&scp=20&sq=buergenthal&st=cse “Cruelty for its own sake was a part of ordinary Nazi guards’ behavior. Sadly, there is no shortage of horrific examples, but I have selected just one from the biography of Thomas Buergenthal.4 At just nine year old, Thomas was rounded up with thousands of Jews and taken to Auschwitz. There he had to watch while an inmate was forced to hang his friend who had tried to escape. An SS guard ordered the inmate to put a noose around his friend’s neck. The man couldn’t fulfill the order because his hands were shaking so much with fear and distress. His friend turned to him, took the noose, and, in a remarkable act, kissed his friend’s hand and then put the noose around his own neck. Angrily, the SS guard kicked the chair away from under the man to be hanged. Nine-year-old Thomas and the other inmates, watching the man kissing his friend’s hand, rejoiced at that simple act that said (without words) “I will not let my friend be forced to kill me.” Thomas survived Auschwitz (perhaps because his father taught him to stand close to the shed when Dr. Mengele was making his selection of who would die)iii and described this story in his book A Lucky Child.4 The empathy within the friendship comes through so powerfully in this awful situation, as does the extreme lack of empathy of the guard. If the aim was to punish or to set an example, the guard could have just shot the escapee himself. Presumably, the guard chose this particular form of punishment because he wanted the two friends to suffer. — Preceding unsigned comment added by George.kvakovszky (talk • contribs) 21:14, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

Any of the above sources would make good citations in the article. These would probably make excellent supporting citations for the analysis section (assuming they support the analysis you already included there, or for additional analysis you might like to insert). I have started a little bit of cleanup on the article. Note that simply pasting review quotes is not really what's called for, just a citation supporting what you as a contributor claim in the article, which claims will help show the book's notability. This should be no problem given what you've found already. The article is definitely on its way.    Thorncrag  21:53, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

Juan Ponce de Leon II.

You have got to be kidding. I suppose that George HW Bush should have his bio modified to state that he was President of the US in 1981 when Ronald Reagon was shot!

The correct and accurate title for this particular person was Acting Governor. He had a definite beginning and ending, though the day may not have been set, it still was to end upon a certain event. Why is it so painful that the article state acting and acceptable to state temporary. I would rather be an Acting ________ than a temporary _____________

Please allow my edit to stand. The source cited says acting and not temporary. It is the same thing, at least when I was growing up and is much more undersatandable. A temporary governor is what exactly? They are all temporary... aren't they really? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.32.55.194 (talk) 07:01, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

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Blue light (pyrotechnic signal)

Reply on Hunleybluelight's talk page

Dear Mr. Thorncrag,

Thank you for your comments and guidance on my recently published page on the blue light pyrotechnic signal. I have made some changes at your request, and trust that they will make the page suitable for inclusion. As a new user of Wikipedia, I welcome your input, and will be happy to modify the page as you suggest.

Hunleybluelight (talk) 16:55, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

Need Your Help on Scott Goldstein listing

Wow. Spent a week editing and reediting the thing with numerous references and links to both external and wiki wages. I pulled up some comparison pages of producers in entertainment (Joel Silver comes to mind) and methinks there are more details in the Scott Goldstein article than in many. Having said that, I really need your advise on how to improve the article. What is missing? What can be done better? Many thanks for the help in advance! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mouton1945 (talk • contribs) 01:38, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

The article looks great, there are only some minor issues left with it, which is why I approved and moved it to Wikipedia. First is it is missing is a lead section - summarizing the bio. See WP:LEAD if you need help with that. I also see some external links within the article, which is not permitted (see WP:EL) -- so those should be removed and replaced with references to the source, with the links at the end in the external links section (or you can make them references if that is appropriate). Beyond that I don't see any issues per se, although the personal life could use some development since it is a biography. Hope this helps. Cheers!    Thorncrag  01:45, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Saw you update

many thanks. Just added the missing opening section — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mouton1945 (talk • contribs) 01:52, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Methinks I have made all the changes you suggested

Its better and hopefully I've done it all. Wheeeew! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mouton1945 (talk • contribs) 03:02, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Old park lane capital

Hey Thorncrag, This is my first post on wiki so not too polished. The company I'm writing it on are mentioned in wikipedia already, they were anyway. They appear to have been edited out on the 20/12/2012. They were on the list of stockbrokers and investment companies page. It was this page that made me think that they were worth the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott-Macon,_Ltd. They're a very similar Company and have received a fair amount of attention from the UK finance media over the last year. Having re read this page and some of the other firms it's clear that I need to make some changes to my wiki post. I submitted it a little too quickly and it needs drying up significantly. Do you think I should add links to other wiki sections about AIM, the ASX and other related finance articles?

I think one of the reasons I submitted a bit quickly was the "youngest CEO" stuff. Though I know this is true, I can only find dates corroborating the the story, no source clearly states it. Should I drop this from the post? I included it as a interest piece on Michael Parnes himself. He is the son of Anthony Parnes, a very famous/infamous 80's stockbroker who has a dedicated wiki page. I was going to link the Anthony Parnes page to this page and possibly a Michael Parnes page. It's an interesting development to the family story. If you look at The Anthony Parnes Wiki page you'll see there are other famous entreprenuers related to Michael Parnes. It does make for interesting reading. I think anyway. :-)

Anyway thanks for your feedback in the first place, sorry if my response has got a bit rambly. Thanks again, Patrick (Patrick A Ross (talk) 12:37, 27 December 2011 (UTC))

In fairness, a reading of the article for Scott-Macon reveals that it does not appear to be notable and should not have an article on Wikipedia at this time, so I have tagged it for deletion. That being said, you mention that Old Park has been the subject of media coverage. If that is the case, it may make the company notable enough for Wikipedia. If you document in the article this coverage, with inline citations to references by reliable third-party sources, then it may meet the criteria to be made a live article. Please see WP:VRS, WP:Notability (companies), WP:RELIABLE for hints on improving the article. Your article is not blocked, only declined for making it a live article in what was its current state, so you can continue to work on it. If you resubmit following these improvements, a reviewer may approve the article and move it into Wikipedia's main area. Cheers!    Thorncrag  20:46, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Excitor (company) article

Hi Thorncrag,

I wrote the post for Excitor (company) that you suggested be reviewed to meet Wikipedia policy on writing about companies. Thanks for the feedback. However, I'm just wondering what needs to be done for the article to meet the standard. I have endeavored to make the article as neutral as possible and to explain why the company is relevant in today's communications management industry. I used as a model the entry for one of Excitor's competitors, Good Technology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Technology), and then even stripped it back so it wouldn't come across as promotional.

Sorry to be a nuisance, but would you mind offering me further, more particular, guidance?

Many thanks, Hamish — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hamboy81 (talk • contribs) 06:24, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately that is not a good article to use as a model because it does not show the notability of that company (hence why I opened a deletion discussion). An article about a company needs to show how and why the company is notable supported with references to reliable third-party sources, such as media outlets. If you can include this in your article, it may pass the requirements. See WP:VRS as a starting point as well as WP:Notability (companies and organizations).    Thorncrag  19:57, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

TV Konzen article

Hey, the article is important for many people living in the area the sport club operates in. There are some clubs in this area and many people want to inform themselves about the offer of the club and the training possibilities. Therefore I am sure that the article has the notability to be mentioned in Wikipedia. Would you undelete the article? Thanks in advance! Juliane Krings (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 19:57, 29 December 2011 (UTC).

I am not able to un-delete the article. It was deleted because the article apparently did not assert why the organization is notable. I would recommend that you recreate the article using the Article Wizard and submit it to articles for creation so that it can be reviewed and so you can get better feedback. Cheers.    Thorncrag  00:54, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Andrey Tverdokhlebov article

Hi. Thanks for reviewing my article. I would welcome any specific feedback on how to make it better. I also am not sure why I am not allowed to upload any images. Am I the wrong kind of registered user?

Thanks again for your help!

Maria — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mashaf11 (talk • contribs) 23:37, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

The ability to upload files requires autoconfirmed status on your newly created account. This means you need 10 edits and 4 days, so you should be able to upload within the next day. If you don't want to wait, you could use WP:Files for Upload so you can submit your file and another user can do the actual upload for you. For a complete collection of tips on writing good biographies, have a look at Wikipedia:BTIP. Cheers!    Thorncrag  01:14, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Questions on Notability

Hi Thorncrag,

Thanks for the welcome.

You reviewed my page (Great Malnad Challenge) earlier today. You have raised a concern about notability. Can you please provide more detail?

Significant coverage Reliable Sources Independent of the subject

Which of these four areas is the concern? GMC is now an annual event, generating sufficient interest in the region to get coverage in multiple, mainstream media sources. To me, this is sufficient criteria for notability.

Or do you feel, this is more appropriate as a sub-section on an existing page?

Your inputs are greatly appreciated.

Thanks! Shsomash (talk) 02:25, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

I was concerned that the article would have been tagged for deletion due to notability issues. One of the references you included doesn't seem to mention the event. A few additional references to reliable third-party sources, such as media would make the article safer from deletion.    Thorncrag  05:31, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Editing Article

Hello!

I am new to creating content on Wikipedia, and I just had a question about your change request

(this is for the following article: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Articles_for_creation/Alice_Sweet_Alice&action=edit)

Can you clarify the following comment:

We're sorry, but we cannot accept unsourced articles, or sources that are not reliable per the verifiability policy. Please cite reliable, third-party sources in the article. Third-party sources are needed so the information can be verified, and so the notability of the topic can be established.

And how it relates to my article? Are ALL of my sources wrong or was it a few? Which sources need fixing?

I apologize for my NOOB questions here, I just want to make sure I get this right.

Thank you so much for your help and for what you do!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Spindlebox (talk • contribs) 16:01, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

First, the article needs to show how the band is notable, examples of criteria are located at WP:MUSIC (e.g., award nomination, a song on a national chart, a major tour event covered by media). That notability asserted within the Wikipedia article must then be evidenced by references to reliable third-party sources. None of the sources that you included would be considered reliable third-party sources (e.g., web blogs are not typically considered reliable sources). WP:RS provides information on what are considered a reliable source. In our case, you would need to show how the band is notable, such as by being covered in media outlets or other third-party sources. Then document that with more reliable sources. Cheers!    Thorncrag  16:46, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Thank you very much! I will see if I can dig up more relevant sources; meanwhile, is it OK if this remains pending? Thank you very much!! Spindlebox (talk) 19:40, 30 December 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Spindlebox (talk • contribs) 19:32, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Thank you very much! I will see if I can dig up more relevant sources; meanwhile, is it OK if this remains pending? Thank you very much!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Spindlebox (talk • contribs) 19:36, 30 December 2011 (UTC) fixed Spindlebox (talk) 19:40, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

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