User talk:Sarah777/Archive 4

Fore County Westmeath

Hello Sarah,

YOU have literally copied my text from Fore Abbey to Fore County Westmeath, which is in any case, is one of the same. Take it from a local.

Best regards,

Gav (as you call me). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gavigan 01 (talk • contribs) 11:33, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Dear Gav01 (will there be more?!) I did indeed copy your excellent text when I separated the article. Exactly to avoid what you did - lose text. The reason that I separated them was so that each could grow in their separate space; as happened with the sporting links; your move lost that! But being local I will defer to you on this (even if not on photography matters!) - just make sure to merge any Fore Village info that isn't in the Abbey page (nearly all of it) before redirecting.

ps I call you Gav because it sounds less formal than Gavigan; but I will call you Mr Gavigan if it offends you. (Sarah777 11:54, 21 October 2007 (UTC))

Irish place names

I've come across many articles which have no Irish translation and I've had trouble finding the Gaeilge for them. I'm taking note of the articles in Windows Notepad, but it's not ideal. Is there any way I can add these articles to a category so I can come back to them later? What do you recommend? Wiki01916 15:16, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I think that new Irish name Template automatically adds an article to a Category:Untranslated Irish place names. Check out Athgarvan for example.

For articles which are not about places I'm not sure the Irish Manual of Style calls for Irish versions of article names. Best bet is to ask User:Sony-youth who designed the new template and excels at (1) this sort of thing and (2) dragging me before tribunals of one sort or another. If necessary he can cook you up a template in the blink of an eye. Myself, I'm a bit challenged in the template creation stakes. (Sarah777 20:00, 21 October 2007 (UTC))

Category:Untranslated Irish place names only shows articles that have a Gaeilge name but no English translation. I was reffering to articles that have no Gaeilge name whatsoever, eg. Kilpedder. I'll give Bony a bell and see what he thinks. :p Wiki01916 22:11, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

St. Patrick's

Per your revert, you really think that interior picture is better? Besides being in color, mine is more than 10 times higher resolution. It's also taken from quite a bit further back, giving more detail (I took one from about the same place as the B&W one but it came out blurry and useless). I could crop out the bottom if you think that would help (I have a lossless cropping/rotating tool). —Wknight94 (talk) 23:00, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

OK. Don't really like the B&W artiness but that is pure pov; it is the composition rather than the resolution or colour; the totally symmetrical view. But I think yours is rather good too so if you feel strongly I won't impose my ideas. I'm just thinking of the other photographers reaction; as someone who puts up[ a lot of photos I get bugged when one is replaced if the replacement isn't obviously and clearly better. See what you can do with your cropping - it certainly isn't a bad picture and no offence intended. Regards (Sarah777 23:12, 21 October 2007 (UTC))

Oh, no offense taken. And I've uploaded hundreds of pictures and only replaced other's here in clear cases - but I thought this qualified. I'll admit that the B&W image fits nicely because it's vertical. Maybe I'll try making mine vertical (with the huge resolution, there should be little loss in quality) and crop out the noise at the bottom and see if that improves things. —Wknight94 (talk) 23:27, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I tried three crops: [1][2][3]. Of the five choices now, I can't decide... —Wknight94 (talk) 03:03, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd say def #3; the people give the whole picture scale and emphasise the size and function; nice one. (Sarah777 18:25, 23 October 2007 (UTC))

Mind you, if you live nearby the church - the President's pew is blurred (a complete no-no in my book) and the photo of the tiles is pretty poor given the potential; lovely tiles though and the colour quality is great; can you crop photos off the screen? (Sarah777 18:32, 23 October 2007 (UTC))

I live down the street - about 5,000 miles away in Florida. My chances of ever going back are close to nil. That's why I'm trying to make them useful now! Unfortunately, where I took the picture was not the same as where the B&W one was taken. Apparently the nice tile did not go as far back as I was when I took the picture. I'll get one of mine used if it kills me! —Wknight94 (talk) 18:39, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm. So I guess you won't be popping in for a snap? Put #3 in as I suggested - no?? (Sarah777 18:44, 23 October 2007 (UTC))

I'll leave it up to you. I don't trust my judgment when it comes to pictures. I put one picture up for peer review (Wikipedia:Picture peer review/St. Magnus Cathedral) and was soundly rejected for reasons I don't even understand. (What the heck is purple fringing?!) —Wknight94 (talk) 19:15, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

"Purple Fringing" is a disease endemic to Scottish sycamores. Everyone knows that, surely? (Sarah777 19:27, 23 October 2007 (UTC))

Despite the diseased trees I like this photo (left), which now does link to a Wikipage which is read by thousands of people every day. And my own submission (right) was rejected 'cos of White Fringing, which is endemic to limestone headstones in Cork. Is that spooky or what? (Sarah777 19:43, 23 October 2007 (UTC))

Suddenly it turned ugly. Oh well. I'll just take my lack of photographic skill and download other vacation photos instead. I need to start an Wikipedia:Unskilled amateur picture of the day. —Wknight94 (talk) 20:26, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Chin up Knight! You got some good ones into the Dublin Castle article. (Sarah777 21:53, 24 October 2007 (UTC))

RFC: Talk:Irish language#Order of the First Paragraph

Quick RFC. Wiki01916 04:38, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Re: Hello??

I unified the discussion at User talk:Kbdank71, for clarity, and commented there. - jc37 23:44, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

==River Avoca==

His spelling is correct. Wiki01916 21:30, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Good, wasn't sure. My command of our First National Language is shamefully poor. (Sarah777 21:39, 25 October 2007 (UTC))

Worried about you

Don't flatter yourself. I'm not the least bit worried about anything you could write - I just don't want your personal attacks or moronic opinions blighting my page. I'll happily post a HUGE BIG LINK to your attacks and my responses on YOUR page. I don't want them here. I like to keep rubbish in the bin. (Sarah777 22:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC))

In case you hadn't seen this on my user page, what does this describe?

(Delurking for a moment, although I have to get back to the non-Wiki stuff that I should be doing)

"Hurried forward by the agency of steam, the astonished passenger glides, like Asmodeus, over the summits of the houses and streets of our city — presently is transported through green fields and tufts of trees — then skims across the surface of the sea, and taking shelter under the cliffs, coasts among the marine villas, and through rocky excavations, until he finds himself in the centre of a vast port, which unites in pleasing confusion the bustle of a commercial town with the amusements of a fashionable watering resort."

(Not unconnected with an edit you just made) FlowerpotmaN·(t) 22:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Just gotta be a trip on the Dub-Kingstown railway line! (Sarah777 22:35, 25 October 2007 (UTC))

OK, so I did give a hint, but try this from the 1830's:

"It is a favourite place of resort for invalids from Dublin, for whom the mildness of its climate and the purity of the air are peculiarly favourable; and it is noted for numerous herds of goats, which, browsing among the mountain pastures, afford milk of very excellent quality."

Where's that? FlowerpotmaN·(t) 22:44, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Killiney Hill???(Sarah777)

Nope. Definitely no goats there now, or there wasn't the last time I got the LUAS at Christmas. (Narrowing it down a bit. ) FlowerpotmaN·(t) 22:50, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Dundrum! (Sarah777 22:53, 25 October 2007 (UTC))

Yup! :O) Found it in Lewis' Topographical Dictionary of Ireland, and I had to e-mail to someone there. FlowerpotmaN·(t) 22:59, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Nice quotes; could we work some of that material into the articles to give a bit of historical colour? (Sarah777 23:01, 25 October 2007 (UTC))

Actually, I was thinking that too. It's a decent source....FlowerpotmaN·(t) 23:03, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Market House Pix

Hi Sarah! Do you happen to have any images of Market Houses in Ireland? I need them for "my" pages: Market Houses in Northern Ireland & Market Houses in the Republic of Ireland. Any help would be appreciated Peter Clarke 09:17, 26 October 2007 (UTC) p.s. I recently upgraded these pages to include "sort column by" buttons (idea nicked from a list of Primary Schools in Texas!).

Hello Peter. I'll have to root through the files - I never specifically targeted market houses. (Now that I know you're interested I'll keep an eye out in my travels). The list is great - also very useful as I wouldn't have a clue which towns/villages to go looking for a market house unless I was familiar with the place. Regards (Sarah777 09:52, 26 October 2007 (UTC))

Spam

Hi Sarah. The painting I took out as spam was uploaded by LongZ (talk · contribs) a.k.a. Olivier Longuet. I first came across a painting that he uploaded in Connemara [4] where he put his painting at the top of the article, moving 4 photographs down the page in the process. I took a look at his contributions and saw that he had also added his paintings to Salthill [5], pub session [6], Galway Hooker [7], Surf art [8], Irish traditional music session [9], and Roundstone, County Galway [10]. Most of the paintings had the caption "by Olivier Longuet", and he also added external links to a website where his paintings could be bought eg [11] and [12]. My view was that User:LongZ put his paintings in the articles to promote his artwork, so I took out all of them except the one in Surf art, which might be encyclopaedic. I called it spam because I was also taking linkspam out of articles last night, and I thought that the paintings were the same kind of self-promotional spam. If you think any of the paintings should remain in the articles, I'll put them back in. All the best, Bláthnaid 21:07, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that Bláthnaid. Your decisions were absolutely correct and well spotted. I didn't realise the painting was an editor's own work so I was just curious why you regarded it as spam. Support you 100% on this. (They are interesting paintings though - wish I could do that!) Regards (Sarah777 09:58, 27 October 2007 (UTC))

Thanks. I thought it was a interesting new way of self-promotion. My sister and one of my close friends are artists, so if anybody gets their paintings in Wikipedia, it's going to be them! Bláthnaid 11:19, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Disappearing images

Three apparently random images were deleted from apparently unrelated articles by a Bot on 26th October. Anyone got any idea why? (Licence was fine). Bot says "Removing deleted image" but the article record shows no prior deletion and the history of the image disappears completely along with the image.

Greystones

1. (cur) (last) 17:36, October 26, 2007 ImageRemovalBot (Talk | contribs) (15,488 bytes) (Removing deleted image) (undo)
2. (cur) (last) 03:14, October 26, 2007 Ww2censor (Talk | contribs) (15,456 bytes) (revert unsourced edit about Lotto) (undo)

Lough Ree

1. (cur) (last) 05:35, October 26, 2007 ImageRemovalBot (Talk | contribs) (2,758 bytes) (Removing deleted image) (undo)
2. (cur) (last) 22:25, October 19, 2007 Cydebot (Talk | contribs) m (2,779 bytes) (Robot - Moving category Loughs of Westmeath to Loughs of County Westmeath per CFD at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2007 October 14.) (undo)

Glenamaddy Turlough

1. (cur) (last) 05:35, October 26, 2007 ImageRemovalBot (Talk | contribs) (1,442 bytes) (Removing deleted image) (undo)
2. (cur) (last) 22:22, October 19, 2007 Cydebot (Talk | contribs) m (1,410 bytes) (Robot - Moving category Loughs of Galway to Loughs of County Galway per CFD at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2007 October 14.) (undo)

Sarah, were these images originally yours? The images themselves were deleted a day of two ago but you uploaded new ones using the exact same names, so going back through the articles' history will never show up with a image as deleted because images of those names now exists. In the specific case of Greystones I did notice the missing image obviously some time between the time of deletion of the old image and you uploading the new one. If they were your original images you should have received some sort of deletion notification, but I am not sure that always happens. Cheers ww2censor 15:07, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Seems someone may have moved them to Commons and not bothered to restore the link, then the Bot came along and removed the evidence. It was already as you see it when I reloaded. I suspected a bit of trolling as for some mysterious reason that I simply cannot understand (!) I attract a few miscreants from time to time! In fact it is a bit more worrying if people are moving stuff to commons and paying no heed to the conditions of the articles left behind as it could be happening on a wider scale - and the "system" does not allow easy tracking of who is doing it. (Sarah777 18:02, 27 October 2007 (UTC))

Would the guy who uploaded this Greystones image file be your culprit? Painful when the original file get deleted but no one bothers to update the original article. Naughty, though I doubt is is malicious. ww2censor 18:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Very likely. I doubt any malicious intent - though I imagine he has done this many times; I only noticed when he removed three of mine from articles which were on my humongous watchlist. How did you find that pic in Commons btw?? (Sarah777 18:22, 27 October 2007 (UTC))

Just searched Greystones and there it was, just like that. They may not all be as easy as that one. ww2censor 02:25, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Raheen County Laois

Whar are you Doing ????

Your photographs as lovely as they are... are disposed very poorly, as they partly obliterate the associated Headers and texts. You persist to di-pose images without revising the consequences of your acts with other Video monitor dimentions. Keep up the good work exercising particular care and consideration to technical display restrictions from other display screens other than your display.

Cordially, Jeanne dArc —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jeanne dArc (talk • contribs) 21:24, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Heck, I've only got one screen! I can only see how they look on that...not sure how to fix that - nothing very special about my screen...something to do with Firefox v IE maybe? Often, I move stuff around because it overlaps things on my screen. ((Sarah777 22:06, 27 October 2007 (UTC)))

Bot tagging discussion

Just in case you aren't watching the project pages, I thought I'd leave a link to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ireland#Project_tagging_of_article_talk_pages, where I'd welcome your comments. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:55, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

[13]

Either substatiate you allegations or remove this BS from my talk page Fasach Nua 19:52, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

WP:3RR requires 4 edits in a 24 hour period, not 4 edits over 48 hours, please SUBSTANTIATE YOUR ALLEGATIONS OR REMOVE THEM Fasach Nua 20:13, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Did you read the bit about "not a licence"? The warning is to prevent you from continuing warring till you step unambiguously over the mark - though many folk have been blocked for what you've already done. Oh..and regarding you remarks about WP:CIVIL do you regard "either substatiate you allegations or remove this BS from my talk page" as a civil start to a conservation? (Sarah777 20:25, 28 October 2007 (UTC))

Your first line is "You have violated the WP:3RR policy on the Mother Jones page", I want this substantiated or removed, there is no ambiguity in the WP:3RR

On your second point, it is not the start of a conversation, but a proportinate response to a conversation you initated by trolling my talk page. I am well aware of your WP history, and would have no interest in starting a conversation with you Fasach Nua 20:42, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Giving you fair warning as recommended in WP:3RR is hardly trolling. My advice to you, as someone experienced in these matters, is stop edit warring. (Sarah777 20:47, 28 October 2007 (UTC))

Substatiate your allegations or remove them from my talk page Fasach Nua 20:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Allegations are substantiated as far as I'm concerned. Maybe do a self-referral to 3RR and see what they think? Trolling my page and WP:HARASS ain't gonna change my mind. And if you stop edit warring there may be no need for me to issue any further warnings. (Sarah777 21:05, 28 October 2007 (UTC))

Yes, I'd have removed that too if I were you! Bit damning. (Sarah777 21:21, 28 October 2007 (UTC))

Constituent country

If you seek balance, you must first establish verifiable notability for a derogation from what is normal. Verify a decent and proper source (see WP:V) that shows three constituent countries to be common enough to be notable, and then we can consider inclusion.

As it stands, the weight of evidence is exclusively on the side of four. --Breadandcheese 16:16, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

If it's decided to drop constiuent country from Northern Ireland; the term must be removed from the relating articles. GoodDay 21:28, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I sorta understand your objection to 'constituent country' though. In my country (Canada), we've got thirteen components - ten provinces and three territories. You could argue - it should be thirteen provinces. Again, call Northern Ireland a province, state etc, if you like. Just don't make the change only there. GoodDay 21:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Irish language place names

Sarah, coming out from a few conversations with others, I've created a Gaeilge task force to coordinate translations of Irish place names and other Irish-language related work. Since you are the queen of Irish geography (and since you seem to have taken interest in the topic over on IMOS), maybe you could add your name to the list of participants? I'm sure the usual Sarah gusto will blow the cobwebs of any lingering untranslatables. I don't think a massive knowledge of Irish is necessary, just a good spirit and a dictionary. You might want to also drop a line on the talk page so that we can all "get to know eachother" as the man might say. --sony-youth^pléigh 15:40, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Archive talk page

How do you find the functionality of the archive template you use? I would like to do something like that too, but wanted to hear from someone else who uses it. Cheers ww2censor 00:32, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

AFD for Ballydung 666

You partially submitted an AFD for Ballydung 666. I agree that this article deserves and AFD so I completed it for you. You may wish to vote on it at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ballydung 666‎. Pilotbob 21:23, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

British Belfast

Thank you, though I must confess, Benny Hill is my ghost writer. GoodDay 22:18, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that!

Hi Sarah, (my co-defendant) I think my talk page skills have improved a lot, and I don’t even feel the need to bite my lip. At least things are now moving on the article, material being added, and referenced. All good. I now feel I’m above all that petty snivelling backstabbing childness of the past and am starting to enjoy Wikipedia. I particularly try to think better of people. You must admit I’ve come a long way. Wonderful to talk again. --Domer48 22:35, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Réalta sciobóil

Sarah, for all the work you have done in taking so many great photographs and adding them to the articles on Irish towns and villages and Irish roads – contributing hugely to the value and interest of those articles – I hereby award you the Irish Barnstar of National Merit. Picapica 22:36, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Blushing :)

Thank you very much! (Sarah777 22:40, 1 November 2007 (UTC))

Just one teeeny weeny prob...I can't escape from this box!(Sarah777 22:41, 1 November 2007 (UTC))

OK. I got rid of the box. (My turn to blush!) See what happens when Picapica tries his hand at techno stuff? -- Picapica 22:51, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Downgraded article

Howdy Sarah. I see that you downgraded Development and preservation in Dublin from a B-class to a Stub-class when your complaint was with it being POV. Why not tag the it as POV? While I basically agree with you, it is definitely more than a stub (a short article of a few sentences but you know that) and this is, for sure, more than that. Even if you don't like it, Start-class would be more accurate.

and an upgrade

Were you just being silly with Sandyford Industrial Estate or really serious? ww2censor 21:47, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Sandyford; silly or serious? Neither really - I did that to illustrate a point to BHG re how we tend to score highly things we are interested in and then forgot to reverse it! As for the other article, surely a long rant is still just a rant? Hence my stub grade. (Sarah777 00:58, 4 November 2007 (UTC))

Commons account

Hello, I noticed that you upload a lot of images to Wikipedia. Do you not want to create an account on commons? The images uploaded to commons can be used same time on English Wikipedia or any other language. Cheers. Carlosguitar 01:00, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

I have one, and have even uploaded five images to it. Many of the others are floating up to commons without any input from me, especially those in infoboxes I notice. Some day soon I mean to sort it all out. But my upload speed is so goddam slow. (Sarah777 01:07, 4 November 2007 (UTC))

BHGbot

Any comments on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Ireland#BHGbot_to_tag_WP:IE_articles.3F? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:38, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Derry Sligo

(moved from top)

Hi Sarah777

I noticed that you have an interest in Irish geography, and wondered whether you might be able to help clear something up for me. My question concerns whether or not there is a place in County Sligo called Derry. According to the Derry (disambiguation) page, there is, but when I then added it to the list of towns and villages in the County Sligo article, someone removed it after a couple of days saying that the place does not exist. However, I have since found reference to a Derry on a map at this website. Please could you advise?

Many thanks 81.152.144.209 12:42, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Sarah, you may be interested in my response to the above, here. Cheers. --The.Q | Talk to me 16:37, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Regarding that 'Derry', it's just a townland and nothing more. Shouldn't even be on a map, Heapstown would be the printedc location there if anything. Owenmoresider 00:14, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Owenmoresider, would this "Derry" in Sligo qualify as a "Townlands of Sligo" category article? (Sarah777 00:21, 18 October 2007 (UTC))

Bring honest, I'm not sure if it even merits a page. Not a place of note by any means. Feel free to do that though. Owenmoresider 03:17, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Not me thanks! (Sarah777 13:55, 21 October 2007 (UTC))

A tag has been placed on Derry, County Sligo, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done for the following reason:

This article refers to somewhere that is nothing more than a name on some maps, not even a collection of houses. To even call it a townland is pushing it.

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, articles that do not meet basic Wikipedia criteria may be deleted at any time. Please see the guidelines for what is generally accepted as an appropriate article, and if you can indicate why the subject of this article is appropriate, you may contest the tagging. To do this, add {{hangon}} on the top of the page and leave a note on the article's talk page explaining your position. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would confirm its subject's notability under the guidelines.

For guidelines on specific types of articles, you may want to check out our criteria for biographies, for web sites, for bands, or for companies. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. ==Derry, County Sligo==

A proposed deletion template has been added to the article Derry, County Sligo, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice explains why (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may contest the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page. Also, please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. If you endorse deletion of the article, and you are the only person who has made substantial edits to the page, please add {{db-author}} to the top of the page. --The.Q^(t)(c) 13:42, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Mail

You have mail. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 21:40, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Cillian Murphy FA

Hey, thanks! Very nice to hear from you. I'm pleased about the FA, but also very relieved it's over. --Melty girl 05:50, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

oxymorons?

Don't get it. --sony-youth^pléigh 03:02, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Wha???????!(Sarah777 19:30, 5 November 2007 (UTC))

R400 photo

That photo you took of the R400 road is like just 500 m from where I grew up! Kinda freaky, but also nice to see it considering that I'm now living in France. Ga2re2t 09:28, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Small world full of Wikipedians! I took a photo of Glenealy and it turns out an editors house was in the shot (Sarah777 19:29, 5 November 2007 (UTC))

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Fester and Ailin'

Hi. You put an AfD tag on Fester and Ailin' but didn't complete the process, including explaining on the AfD page why you think the article should be deleted. Corvus cornix 21:46, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Conflicting styles

Sarah. More than happy not to link dates (ie years only) and only link full dates (ie day, month year) if that is the correct position. Many thanks for the barnstar - only just noticed it - comments very much appreciated. Ardfern 18:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome and deserve it! I'm happy with your current policy of linking the year only but I noticed that Ww2censor is reverting some of your tidying up as he follows you through the villages of Ireland! (Sarah777 18:57, 10 November 2007 (UTC))

Admin

Hey! Don't be so hard on us morons!(Sarah777 01:14, 16 November 2007 (UTC))

Hi Sarah - you know what I mean! There are always exceptions, but ...... -- Ardfern (talk) 19:54, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Massacres in Iraq

You see that I replaced the Mukaradeeb wedding party massacre on the List of massacres. It actually has an article in WP already. If you pull some of those sources in I think it makes a stronger entry. I am not opposed to having legitimate U.S. massacres on the list, but I recommend presenting less anti-American attitude if want help, instead of resistance. Collect legitimate sources first. Events like Haditha and Srebrenica are all over the major Western news sources and television networks. Left-wing anti-war blogs and agenda driven editorials are not a good starting place. If you have to scrape bottom barrel .org sites, then perhaps an event should not be included on the list. If an event dose not have an article on WP already, perhaps it shouldn't be on the list at all.--Knulclunk (talk) 20:55, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

I am not either anti-war or left-wing. But I think that removing Fallujah (twice and also twice by a serving US soldier) is wrong considering most of the, for example, Islamist massacres are not referenced at all. Should I delete them all on sight, or wait for the citation requests to be considered? I am not anti-American, or anti-British but anti-double standards on Wiki, which I'd reckon is an important part of WP:NPV. The fact that 90% of contributors to en:Wiki are British or American means that WP:NPV is something that must constantly be asserted by the small minotity who are not. I'm sure that Russian Wiki suffers from the same problem, but I don't read or contribute to Russian Wiki. (Sarah777 (talk) 23:17, 17 November 2007 (UTC))

I'm with you on Falludja, but I think that Tvoz is right with regard to guidelines on this particular article. See also the article's header. I have personally (and somewhat painstakingly) added the right column with all these ref needed tags, asking for users to look for proper refs. Removing all those that still are not ref'ed (and there might be some there til the end of time) because some [****] is dragging you into an edit war is not going to help us. Best, · Michel (talk) 11:32, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

PS: I love this Wikianglocentricanarianism box of yours. · Michel (talk)

Thanks! But Mr Swatjester below has already pointed out that ALL edits to the article could be regarded as a revert (figure that!) so I won't be adding or subtracting there for a while -:) (Sarah777 (talk) 11:44, 18 November 2007 (UTC))

For the record - my addition of Fallajuh was instantly twice reverted though all the "Muslim massacres" are left sitting there with no references at all. When I pointed that out I was told by the reverter that my source was "a joke" and this was endorsed by User:Swatjester who said it was unacceptable. So I added that the unacceptable site was actually quoting from The Guardian newspaper to be told that this was a "biased source". So, in summary -

• (1) There is instant and repeated deletion of American massacres which are MSM referenced;
• But
• (2) Removal of Muslim massacres which are totally unreferenced is POV editing and breach of 3RR.

And that, Your Honour, is the wacky Wiki recipe for "NEUTRAL POINT OF VIEW" (Sarah777 (talk) 11:59, 18 November 2007 (UTC))

And it is based on a string of incidences like this that I ruefully came to this conclusion:

• NPOV IMPLIESAnti-Wikianglocentricanarianism

Candidacy of Swatjester

I've moved your section on review of the Fallujah stuff on the massacres page to the questions talk page. The page exists to serve as a q+a forum with me, not as a page for review of your actions on List of Massacres. ⇒SWATJester ^{Son of the Defender} 02:59, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

But I'm not looking for just a review; I'm looking for your review, as a candidate for Arbcom. I believe that your attitude to this case might be very illustrative and useful to the community as to your likely position on cases that will come before Arbcom. Bit like your American Congressional reviews of the Presidents nominations to the Supreme Court. (Sarah777 (talk) 03:06, 18 November 2007 (UTC))

I'm happy to give you such a review on your page, but beyond the initial question I believe this has little to do with the way ArbCom works at all. And the analogy is not correct: Congress does not ask the Supreme Court nominees how they would rule on an issue of substantive law, as that would be prejudicial, most simply answer questions about their past decisions and decline to answer questions about future rulings. ⇒SWATJester ^{Son of the Defender} 03:09, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Wasn't aware of that. I thought they were quizzed as to their attitudes to abortion etc - mind you, I accept you aren't nominating yourself to the Supreme Court! (Sarah777 (talk) 03:23, 18 November 2007 (UTC))

Yeah, and ArbCom is different, I obviously can answer questions on how I would decide on certain things in the future, but it's difficult to do so because every case is different, even between cases of the same time (say for instance, two wheel warring cases may be completely different). ⇒SWATJester ^{Son of the Defender} 03:32, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

OK. Peace till the next time. Might even vote for you....exploring. (Sarah777 (talk) 03:56, 18 November 2007 (UTC))

genocide and arbcom

you wrote in Talk:List of massacres#Getting nowhere fast:

But it is an interpretation endorsed by Arbcom! They have ruled that referring to a genocide that occurred before the word was coined and defined as "genocide" was "original research".

I spend a lot of time firefighting on genocide articles, and did not realise that there was such an Arbcom ruling. Please could you provide me with a link to the page. --Philip Baird Shearer (talk) 19:50, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Hi. You'll find it here.

The decision is completely illogical nonsense - but I'm still bound to curtail my freedom of expression based on it. This is the bit you'll be interested in: Sarah777 engaged in original research 2) Sarah777 (talk · contribs) engaged in original research on Great Irish Famine over the usage of the term "genocide." ([14] [15] [16] [17] [18] [19] [20]).

Passed 7 to 0, 21:46, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

My argument that the famine met the current UN definition of famine was not disputed - but rather was dismissed as "synthesis" and hence "original research". (Sarah777 (talk) 20:14, 22 November 2007 (UTC))

Thanks. The Arbcom ruling is interesting.

NTW my own POV on that the famine was not a genocide. But see Genocides in history#Great Irish Famine two law professors were asked to give their legal opinion (due to British pressure on the New Jersey Commission on Holocaust Education) and agree with you. See

• Mullin, James V. The New Jersey Famine Curriculum: a report Eire-Ireland:Journal of Irish Studies, Spring-Summer, 2002)
• Mullin, James V.Irish Famine Education and the Holocaust 'Straw Man', Website American Chronicle, April 28, 2006.)
• The Great Irish Famine Approved by the New Jersey Commission on Holocaust Education on September 10, 1996, for inclusion in the Holocaust and Genocide Curriculum at the secondary level. Revision submitted 11/26/98.

--Philip Baird Shearer (talk) 20:48, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

If you disagree Philip, that is your prerogative. But Arbcom did not actually disagree or dispute the claim that the famine met current definitions; the significance of the ruling was that the deciding factor was that contemporary sources did not use the term (and in this case it wasn't yet invented!) Applying the "dictionary" or "UN" definition was "synthesis". (Sarah777 (talk) 21:05, 22 November 2007 (UTC))

And as you can see from the debate/war on "List of massacres", this ruling has implications for many incidents which are now commonly regarded as massacres but where several contemporary "reliable sources" can't be found using the term. (Sarah777 (talk) 21:09, 22 November 2007 (UTC))

Nonetheless they are great references Philip even if not contemporaneous to the famine itself. ww2censor (talk) 23:24, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Indeed they are. Very few genocides can be as evil as the Holocaust; but that sure leaves a lot of headroom for other great evils. (Sarah777 (talk) 21:09, 23 November 2007 (UTC))

Southern Ireland

Hello Sarah, excuse my naivety on this subject. Have you ever heard past country called Southern Ireland? I've never heard of this term. GoodDay (talk) 23:37, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Yep, it's common enough, usually used by English people in my experience but it pops up everywhere. (Sarah777 (talk) 23:41, 24 November 2007 (UTC))

Oh - you mean the article. It was a paper-state in British Law; a "legal" fiction. (Sarah777 (talk) 23:42, 24 November 2007 (UTC))

I see, thanks. GoodDay (talk) 23:58, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

"Southern Ireland" is a fairly common name for the Republic of Ireland in the UK, primarily because language abhores a vacuum. The state calls itself "Ireland", but that is clearly wrong since it was gerrymandered to include only part of Ireland. "Republic of Ireland" is a bit long-winded, so "Eire" is often used (because it appears on the coins, which used to flood the UK like - quite literally - bad pennies). But "Southern Ireland" is very common. One might as well object to the fact that the English call Finland "Finland", instead of Suomi. TharkunColl (talk) 00:05, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Eh..who was "objecting"?! (Sarah777 (talk) 00:09, 25 November 2007 (UTC))

Some people have objected. Just thought I'd pre-empt any such attempt. TharkunColl (talk) 00:11, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Hmmmm...right. Well done then I guess ;-) (Sarah777 (talk) 00:15, 25 November 2007 (UTC))

I wasn't objecting either. What just happened here? GoodDay (talk) 00:18, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Just nipping a potential argument in the bud, that's all. TharkunColl (talk) 00:24, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

G'day GoodDay - He suspected you had objectionist intentions! (Sarah777 (talk) 00:28, 25 November 2007 (UTC))

Oh I see; you're mistaken Tharky - I didn't come here to argue with Sarah; I came here to seek her help on an article I wasn't familliar with. I appreciate your good intentions. GoodDay (talk) 00:32, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

I didn't assume you'd come here to argue with Sarah. In my experience, most people who object to the term "Southern Ireland" do so from an anti-British perspective, and you have expressed anti-British sentiments in the recent past. TharkunColl (talk) 00:35, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

As this is Sarah's page, may we discuss this elswhere? My apologies Sarah & thanks for the clarificaton on the Southern Ireland article. GoodDay (talk) 00:45, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Heck, I don't mind if ye discuss it here - I'm not very page-ist! (Sarah777 (talk) 01:50, 25 November 2007 (UTC))

Tharky called me anti-British; I thought people saw me as pro-British? Maybe I'm sillyist. It's all very confusing, perhaps it was a bad dream. Anyways, thanks for not minding. GoodDay (talk) 03:27, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Possibly unfree Image:Colcannon 4215w.jpg

An image that you uploaded or altered, Image:Colcannon 4215w.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree images because its copyright status is disputed. If the image's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the image description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Porcupine (prickle me! · contribs · status) 17:24, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Page move

Hi, Sarah. Thanks for supporting my suggested page move (Ballynacarrigy --> Ballynacargy)... and putting it into effect. It looks from the page history, though, and because the Talk page content was lost in the renaming, that you didn't use the normal "move" function. See (Help:Moving a page). Have now copied over the Talk content manually. Being no techie myself, I apologize in advance if I'm teaching anyone how to suck eggs :-) -- Picapica (talk) 09:12, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

No prob Pica - there was already a redirect the other way (Ballynacargy --> Ballynacarrigy) so the "normal" move method didn't work. The history was in the redirect page when I finished making a mess of it...I just knew some Gentleman like yourself would sort it out! Regards (Sarah777 (talk) 19:27, 29 November 2007 (UTC))

In such cases, which are not too often, just ask an admin to do it and they can move the talk page to the already existing page too instead of pasting backwards. Actually my official gazetteer says Ballynacàrrigy and even they redirect you from Ballynacargy and Irish Placenames of 1975 uses Ballynacarrigy, so I think your move was actually incorrect. Ballynacargy was listed as the spelling pre-1975 Irish Language Commission. Cheers ww2censor (talk) 19:49, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that, ww2censor. I still hold to the view, nevertheless, that the move was correct given usage "on the ground". Your "pre-1975 Irish Language Commission" reference confirms me in my view that Ballinacarrigy is more the result of linguistic correctness than of any reflection of the name "as she is spoke". -- Picapica (talk) 20:01, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Notification of only warning

Please note my warning here. Comments like this and this are totally unacceptable. Daniel 00:12, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Really, this is also toeing the line very, very closely. I suggest you step back and take the precaution of not talking about the user but about the content. Daniel 00:21, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Sarah, as Daniel is one of the mentors in the Famine arb case, I strongly suggest you listen carefully to what he has to say here - Alison ^❤ 01:03, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Is that what she is? She never mentioned that. But she needs to get a bit tougher on User:Sony-youth whose endless attacks on Irish editors seem to escape all scrutiny; and get tougher on User:Mackensen and rather than just seconding his remarks. Or is he another mentor? (Sarah777 (talk) 01:11, 5 December 2007 (UTC))

She's a he. But anyways ... Oh and Mackensen is a member of the Arbitration Committee - Alison ^❤ 01:37, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Although Mackensen is acting as an editor here, and I will not hesitate to ban him from the page if he does something which I would ban anyone else for. I sincerely hope he doesn't, just like I hope everyone else doesn't either. Daniel 01:51, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

OK - But I'm certainly not calling for Mack (or Sony) to be banned! Just maybe a light slap on the wrist!! Regards (Sarah777 (talk) 02:25, 5 December 2007 (UTC))

Comment

Well, no, you didn't call me a Nazi (or member of the Nazi Party) per se. You did, however, imply very strongly that I was an apologist for a group of people whom you considered to be morally equivalent to the Nazi party. You're welcome to put whatever gloss on it that you like; it was obvious to all concerned what you meant. Mackensen (talk) 01:38, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

If that is what "all concerned" think I meant then clearly it wasn't "obvious". However, least there be any confusion, I don't believe I called you a Nazi; I did not intend to call you a Nazi and I don't believe you are a Nazi. Sincerely. (Sarah777 (talk) 01:47, 5 December 2007 (UTC))

Just the peers then, but it'll do. Let's deal with the article. Mackensen (talk) 01:49, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

And a different comment

I feel a bit odd saying this, as I seem to sit on the same side of the table as you with respect to Giano's candidacy. But I am uncomfortable with some of the comments you are adding to the talk page of his vote. While we may not agree with the behaviour of other editors, or the reasons they've used to make their voting decisions, they do have the right to their own opinions. Giano has been (perhaps remarkably) very restrained in his response to the votes received, and I am not certain it serves him well that opponents are being challenged essentially at the ballot box. Would you consider refactoring some of your comments, or at least making further commentary on the talk page of the individual involved? Best, Risker (talk) 14:33, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Not sure what you are referring to. I made no comment on the behaviour of any other editor on the talk page of Giano's vote. Also, as I've said to many previous Wiki editors - I don't do code. If you have a problem with something I said somewhere, say it in plain English. Ta. (Sarah777 (talk) 21:03, 5 December 2007 (UTC))

Arbcom Elections - Talk Page Box

Though flattered, I'm no admin - just a volunteer election official person. So anything an admin might decide about the box will trump anything I could tell you. However, strictly in terms of the election - anyone can vote as they wish, so long as they have suffrage, and add a link to their user or talk page with a further (possibly lengthy) explaination of why they voted as they voted. I interpret your "I voted for Giano box" as such a statement. The fact that it happens to be at the top of your talk page is not relevant - the key is that you are not telling other users to how to vote, or attempting to drum up support for a candidate from users who would not otherwise vote. In other words, a statement on your talk page is not canvassing, unless you push it on others in manners prohibited by policy. So, you're probably OK. Hope this helps, ZZ ^Claims ~ Evidence 03:45, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks - I thought you were officiating at the election! With judgement like that when you go for Adminship you can count on my vote -:) (Sarah777 03:48, 8 December 2007 (UTC))

My pleasure - and I'll hold you to that if and when! Best, ZZ ^Claims ~ Evidence 05:00, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Article table; Dec 8 update

Where is Robotag?????? (Sarah777 01:04, 1 December 2007 (UTC))

I just asked her that the other day but no reply. ww2censor (talk) 00:37, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

I've asked about once every three days for the past month! Anyway, I've started tagging again and have just completed UK electoral constituencies in Ireland (a lot of work gone into them). I'm hunting for another interesting set of articles. (Sarah777 (talk) 00:42, 9 December 2007 (UTC))

I saw you were actively tagging again though I thought some of your constituency ratings were a little too generous. I have been assessing some of the already tagged articles but should restart to assess unassessed articles too, though I have some other real editing I would like to concentrate on, so let's hope BHG gets her bot back on track. Cheers ww2censor (talk) 00:58, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Yep, I concede I was erring on the "benefit of the doubt" side in my ratings. Took my Q from BHG that this was more likely to attract some attention than rating everything start or stub. But don't think I went overboard; feel free to downgrade and add tags for photos, boxes, attention etc. (Sarah777 (talk) 01:03, 9 December 2007 (UTC))

Nah, I won't change any unless I think they are way off the beam; it was just a general comment. Working late tonight! what's it like in Dublin this weekend? Cheers ww2censor (talk) 01:25, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Rust never sleeps WW. Tonight in Dublin it is wild and windy, cool and dry! Can hear the wind trashing the trees and whistling off the windows. And wherever you are?? (Sarah777 (talk) 01:47, 9 December 2007 (UTC))

For my sins, I'm living in New Jersey for the next few years but was back in Blackrock with my son in September and out in west Wicklow too. I must phone him tomorrow to see how he is. Cheers ww2censor (talk) 02:01, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Photo's

Hi, there's a photo on Wikipedia which you uploaded, that my mother took a while ago. What's the general procedure for publishing photo's on this website. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Delboy82 (talk • contribs) 17:16, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Hmmmm. How did your mother's photo get into my camera I wonder? Could you tell me which one she took, so that I might look into it, so to speak. (Sarah777 (talk) 23:16, 11 December 2007 (UTC))

So every photo you upload is taken by you? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Delboy82 (talk • contribs) 09:17, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Irish photos: New Article

I should look at the contributor as well as the article before I do a speedy. You recently added a new page with an Irish title. (I am sorry; I should have done a cut-and-paste on it so that I could make the right connection here.) On the page were two photos and a lot of what appeared to be coding of some sort. I marked it as a speedy because, in English, it was undecipherable and apparently unnconnected with anything. You might want to take a look at it, and let me know what I should have done. Bielle (talk) 23:54, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Now I have found the article (Sliabh na Caillí) and it would appear that the coding was meant to be (and now is)infoboxes. At the risk of asking a sensitive question, does the title of the article have an Eglish translation. (I am not trying to be rude, but en.wikipedia usually uses translated names.) {Perhaps there isn't one. I really hope there is a pronunciation guide for the name then. :-) Bielle (talk) 23:59, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Hi Belle...life gets complicated at times. I was actually in the process of moving the article to the English language version Slieve na Calliagh when you descended on me! I think it's OK now but we need to either delete or redirect Sliabh na Caillí! I'm trying extract the article about the hill from the article Loughcrew; which is about an area at the foot of the hill and a Megalithic Tomb up on the hill. (Sarah777 (talk) 00:07, 12 December 2007 (UTC))

I am working at the extreme edges of my knowledge right now, so although I am very sorry to have made things even messier for you, I can't do much for the clean-up. You could, when you have finished the move of the material, ask for a speedy yourself. I think there is a template especially for original contributors when no one else has been invoved. Thanks for being so kind about my multiple mistakes here. Bielle (talk) 00:16, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

No prob! It was pretty obvious your "intentions were good" as the song says! Regards Sarah777 (talk) 00:18, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

The Animals

• Sometimes I find myself long regretting
• Some foolish thing some little simple thing I've done
• But I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
• Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood

• - Can't get this damn thing out of my head now - Sarah777 (talk) 00:28, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

From FDNYirish

Sarah, im not too familiar with wikipedia and just created an account so I could leave you a message. Do you happen to have any more pictures of Clara in Co. Offaly? My family is from there and can't find more than a few pics around the internet. I'm in N.Y. so not really able to get there myself any time soon. Thank you! —Preceding unsigned comment added by FDNYirish (talk • contribs) (14:38, December 11, 2007)

We crossed over - I wrote a note on your page. I fixed your Clara image and re-inserted it. Not sure if I have many more of Clara; but I'll check and can email any I find if you wish. - Sarah777 (talk) 02:36, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Hi Sarah - I fixed this editor's Clara image license (tagged it {{PD-Ireland}} which should be right). Should be okay now :) - Alison ^❤ 03:11, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Ali - not so long since I was struggling with the same thing - Sarah777 (talk) 03:18, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Dicsussion

Huh? Ben W Bell talk 03:29, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

You eagle eyed editor you! I left another "County Carlow, the Ireland" - but this time I got there before you! - Sarah777 (talk) 03:35, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Oh I get what you meant, the edit I made to the talk page. I just have a real bug bear about people editing other people's comments, for any edit. So how are you doing, we haven't talked in a while? Ben W Bell talk 03:38, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Well, I've discovered some disgraceful Anglo-American POV in List of massacres and am backing a candidate for Arbcom - guess which one?! Apart from that by my standards I'm almost behaving myself :) - Sarah777 (talk) 03:43, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Oh - I see, it wasn't my edit commentary in some Carlow you are referring to but my comment on your page.....I was curious why you reverted "I have started a discussion" to "I have stared a discussion" - I doesn't seem to make any sense yet another editor made the same revert. What is it to "stare a discussion"? Not familiar with the concept! (Sarah777 (talk) 03:48, 12 December 2007 (UTC))

Yeah, I just reverted it as someone changed someone elses comment. I know it wasn't correct, but it's something I think shouldn't be done. I don't spend as much time on Wikipedia anymore, too busy trying to sort out my life and get things working. Keep up the good work. Ben W Bell talk 04:29, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Well done

Well done on all those R road articles (and other Irish articles) and the associated photography! You must really travel around the country some bit!

BTW, depending how interested you are in roads, maybe you would be interested in discussion at boards.ie commuting and transport forum or SABRE British and Irish roads forum, if you aren't already involved with either.

zoney ♣ talk 15:30, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Zoney - I've visited Sabre and CBRD but only as a browser. I like to check the the Irish photos on Sabre - see what the competition is up to - I keep an eye on your site too btw - waiting for an update :) Sarah777 (talk) 21:54, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use Image:OCDuallaSign 031c.jpg

Replaceable fair use

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Limerick Tunnel

Reply at Talk:Limerick_Tunnel#That_Name. Not an answer, really, but a reply :O) And only ten days after you left the message. FlowerpotmaN·(t) 04:24, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Ta Flower! I have responded in the tunnel (page) - Sarah777 (talk) 15:59, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Memory Lane

Sarah, I have adopted your image of the L8282

File:IMG Lane5599c.jpg

as my current "background image". Tusen(d) tak(k) -- that's my kind of road!

Have an awful urge, though, to want to pick up those fallen twigs on the left-hand side and throw them into the hedge -- a clear manifestation of the obsessive-compulsive tidy-up urge that has me shackled to Wikipedia... :)

Picapica (talk) 19:07, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Throw them into the hedge (or 'ditch' as we'd call it)?! I'd collect then for kindling :) Of course when the heavy branches were trimmed with a slash-hook they were lifted (with the hook) to fill in any gaps; poetry in motion to watch it - Sarah777 (talk) 19:19, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Would your slash-hook be the same thing as the billhook I remember wielding in my childhood? Kindling, though, needed to be something a lot drier than what you would have got from yesterday's hedge-trimming... :) Still and all, you remind me of the special pleasure of coming down early in the winter morning to lay the first match to the fire (to be) which your dad -- not you! -- had readied the night before. -- Picapica (talk) 19:47, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Baile Mhic Mhaoilir / Ballickmoyler (Co. Laois)

Yes, it does exist! At the junction of the N80 and R429. Was going to provide coords, but the relevant program seems reluctant to oblige at present... -- Picapica (talk) 19:55, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

That one...thought it was in Carlow. My mistake. Mind you I think 17 edits to produce Ballickmoyler has got be be some sort of record! (Sarah777 (talk) 20:26, 16 December 2007 (UTC))

Ah! It has grown I see Sarah777 (talk) 20:27, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

17 edits to produce Ballickmoyler has got be be some sort of record.

20+ now, and counting -- and every one a gem (even if I do say so myself). Ballickmoylerans, you should be proud of this day! -- Picapica (talk) 20:48, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Well, the first 15 were dodgy; you have certainly upped the pace - but I see you have placed that irregular location map. Nice'n'all as it looks will it not be replaced by the standard infobox? (I think I may done that myself once or twice). (Sarah777 (talk) 20:56, 16 December 2007 (UTC))

Well indeed it might, Sarah a chara, but -- in the original spirit of what I call "Wiki-constructive-anarchism" -- I feel I must do my bit to counter the forces of uniformism... The "standard" infobox is all well and good, but I find the "map on table legs" ugly and the "hunt the pale green circle" tiresome. Experience has taught me that resistance to uniformism may indeed be, in the short term, futile (especially when the uniformists come equipped with all kinds of multi {{{ }}} curly-bracketed techno-transclusions, as I think they're called) -- but in the spirit of 1916 I will persist for now in adding republican location maps where maps are currently absent. I am not so revolutionary as to insist on replacing already existing maps: though that may inevitably follow once the shooting of volunteers starts... -- Picapica (talk) 21:22, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Wow! That's like something I'd say :) Go vote for Giano quick! (Sarah777 (talk) 21:32, 16 December 2007 (UTC))

Mind, while the standard box has functionality way beyond your rebellious gesture it is ugly as sin. Is there a case for fusion, dare I say synthesis?? - Sarah777 (talk) 21:36, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Dare to say it, Sarah!

I'm not (all that) against infoboxes as such (anal-retentive alarms notwithstanding) -- it's just that I'd hope they could, mapwise at least in the case of Ireland, be improved... but you must be prepared to don some extremely thick personal-attack-proof armour should you ever want to try anything head-on against the techie/uniformists.

I'd be ready, though, to argue for synthesis in the form of an infobox-with-better-map.

Meanwhile (if there is still time!) tell me more about what I should know concerning Giano.

Picapica (talk) 22:08, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Giano is the anti-Establishment candidate; the rebels choice, beloved of the non-conventionalist. The spirit of Spumoni File:Animalibrí.gif - can any words be so eloquent? - Sarah777 (talk) 22:22, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Abandoned station

Sarah - no info on Kilbricken in Railscot - will see what else I can find.Ardfern (talk) 20:15, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Looking at the map it would be the next up the line from the Ballybrophy halt in the Dublin direction. Oddly, though there appears to be various railway buildings there isn't any sign of a raised platform. Looking at the photo in the article there are signs of some sort of platform at track level. All very odd. (Sarah777 (talk) 20:21, 15 December 2007 (UTC))

Here is a photo of the buildings in the 'railway yard'. (If you enlarge the thumb you'll see a train left of picture - shows where track is). Building in the foreground could be a house (but note lighting fixture), but the warehouse type building with the overhanging roof looks some sort of freight related structure. - Sarah777 (talk) 20:36, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

(Butting in :)) Just looking at Johnson's Atlas and Gazetteer of the Railways of Ireland - which I must give back to someone - but which has a fairly comprehensive list of all stations, present and past, and I can't find anything. Next thing north-east of Ballybrophy is the Cuddagh road crossing (opened 1847 - see; really detailed) and then the closed Mountrath station. Can't find anything about Kilbricken. FlowerpotmaN·(t) 01:21, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

PS: Although it's non-existence there isn't apparently a serious obstacle to calls for its reopening (article in the Laois Nationalist paper) FlowerpotmaN·(t) 01:32, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Indeed, or the fact that I had a pleasant stroll through it's buildings just some weeks ago! Found this other pic in the files - the same train as it zoomed past where I was standing (can you see the LED "Dublin-Heuston"?) - and across the track the remains of station lights. Spooky! - Sarah777 (talk) 09:35, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Whereabouts is it? I sort of vaguely remember Kilbricken being on the road out of Mountrath (where some of me ancestors came from) towards Abbeyleix - going straight on instead of turning right onto the Limerick road, I think -but that's all I know. FlowerpotmaN·(t) 01:29, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

About 5 km due south of Mountrath; 3 km southeast of Castletown - triangulate! - Sarah777 (talk) 01:38, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Eureka moment reply : LOL! Yup, that just dawned on me too :O). Must be the Mountrath-Castletown station. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Flowerpotman (talk • contribs) 02:00, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Eureka moment?!

It has just dawned on me - could this be the "Mountrath & Castletown" station referred to in the Castletown article? - Sarah777 (talk) 01:53, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

wrong edit of Rochfortbridge website

your edit changed the word "prevention" to "relief", please give an account of your sources to back up this change. the meeting held in Gaulstown mentioned "famine prevention" and not relief. please do not amend text to suit popular image without prior authentication. famine prevention means to prevent famine whereas relief means to relive victims already suffering famine, two totally different things wouldnt you agree.

Hi Anon. I found the edit you refer to. It was one change in a host of changes I made during a full copyedit. The item was in a sea of such poorly spelt, syntactically challenged and grammatically grating gunge that I assumed it was just another error. My humble apologies. - Sarah777 (talk) 09:42, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Block

So far I've been reverted without comment and accused of calling this user a troll all for refusing to permit an entry supported entirely by POV-pushing sources. You have reverted entirely or substantially my edits more than three times. Your edits in the article List of massacres‎ match the very definition of WP:TE. As a result of all these factors, you are now blocked from editing. Rklawton (talk) 06:49, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

You are not fit to be an administrator, you are abusing your powers in an edit war that you are obviously emotionally caught up in. I call on you to resign. I would also call on you to allow me communicate with more balanced admins so that I may be speedily unblocked. (Sarah777 (talk) 06:51, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

If you believe this block is unjustified, you may contest the block by adding the text {{unblock|your reason here}} below. Insults won't help your case. Rklawton (talk) 06:58, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I am uninterested in your views on what will or will not "help my case". You have abused your Admin powers in an article in which you were yourself edit warring. (Sarah777 (talk) 07:00, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Actually, I observed an edit problem between you and another editor on this subject, reviewed the matter, noticed that you relied on POV-pushing (non-reliable) sources, and attempted to rectify the matter. In the process, I explained to you what needed to be done (find some reliable sources), and pointed out the problems with your edits. Indeed, I expected that you would be able to do so and was surprised that you couldn't. During this process, you made up some stuff that I never wrote (calling you a troll, for example), and have had to put up with several additional insults. If you continue to use this space to abuse me, I will put a stop to that, too. However, I would rather you just post your unblock request so that another administrator can review this exchange and make an independent decision. For the record, I am not in the U.S. Army, though I did serve over twenty years ago. Rklawton (talk) 07:07, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Same difference. Your judgement in the case of sources which called the US Army massacre a massacre is pure 24 carat pov. Block me here if it helps - you are simply not fit to be an administrator. Period. (Sarah777 (talk) 07:16, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

It's hard to feel bad for either of you. Of course the block was unjustified, and Rklawton knows it. Then again, Sarah, you were edit warring like crazy on that article, and my sympathy is fairly thin for a block here. The Evil Spartan (talk) 07:23, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm actually quite concerned here. Rklawton had done quite a bit of reverting, regardless of motive. Then he seems to have blocked Sarah without warning. What I see is Sarah making best effort to come up with sources for her additions (which, BTW, look a whole lot POVish to me, but how and ever). I see edit-warring from Sarah all right, but I also see a block from an admin with whom she is edit warring and I don't like that at all. I've already emailed Rklawton and asked for clarification but in the meantime, Sarah has also pmailed me since then. Guys - what's going on here? - Alison ^❤ 07:38, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Well Evil (if I may call you that) I don't accept I was edit-warring; Fallujah is a legit massacre; the references were challenged by the former US Army edit-warring Admin. I kept adding new ones and he kept arbitrarily dismissing them. I added THREE additional refs and resubmitted a "massacre" (that was deleted on the grounds of lack of refs) only to have it reverted by editor in breach of 3RR (who conveniently was an admin with blocking power) and I was blocked because he decided he didn't like the refs. The abuse of Admin power here (and the bias issue) is a far more serious issue than anything I have been accused (wrongly) of doing. I am not an Admin and don't wish to be one; this guy (amazingly) is - so we should expect some basic adherence to WP:NPOV and restraint in issues he is obviously emotionally involved in. (talk)

Thanks Ali - I still don't accept I was warring; I was playing by the rules against a tag-team. That's my view anyway. (Sarah777 (talk) 07:43, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

I have opened up a thread on ANI about this. The Evil Spartan (talk) 07:44, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, Evil S., you beat me to it :) Let's just get some neutral opinion here. Sarah, please tone it down about the army POV stuff, though. That doesn't help anyone here - Alison ^❤ 07:47, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

• If Sarah777 is blocked for POV pushing then I'd say blocking might be applicable for Rklawton as he violated WP:3RR([21])--NAHID 07:53, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

OK Alison - but as you know I'm not out to win any popularity contests - truth is truth - fairness is fairness - whether folk like it or not. Fact is on the Fallujah issue the involved editors and Admins contain a lot of US Army guys - those accused of the massacre. No cute way of saying that. In a court of law that would be prima facie evidence with the burden of proof on the rebuttalists! As for blocking Rklawton, based on his record he seems a good editor but unsuited to be an Admin. (Sarah777 (talk) 07:58, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Sounds like you were POV-pushing in a big way, though, Sarah. Saying, "Admins contain a lot of US Army guys - those accused of the massacre." is the worst possible way of putting it. That's tantamount to saying that RK is complicit in massacre. Please tell me you're not saying that here??!! - Alison ^❤ 08:11, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I don't think a block is warranted for RK. Lara❤Love 08:02, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I agree. He's just doing his job here. I'm not seeing any final 3RR warn, though - Alison ^❤ 08:11, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

The warning, such as it is, is here. Rklawton (talk) 08:16, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Can someone tell me what point there is bringing this up as ANI when I can't edit ANI? UNBLOCK ME NOW. - Cos someone needs to sort out Rklawton - or else block him and even the pitch - Sarah777 (talk) 08:17, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Nope Ali; I'm not saying he was involved in the massacre; I'm saying their is prima facie evidence of bias. Not complicity. And, if you don't mind, it is past time this block was lifted OR that one was imposed on RK. (Sarah777 (talk) 08:20, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Hello? Any sign of an unblock? Note that an Admin has now reverted Rklawton's last edit - the one he blocked me for making. OK? That means his block is a dud. So, why am I still blocked? (Sarah777 (talk) 08:33, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Comments like this aren't helping your case any. As this issue is being reviewed on ANI, you'll need to hold tight for review. There are enough people watching right now - Alison ^❤ 08:38, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Sorry Ali. I don't crawl, I don't beg. The block was outrageous; it should have been reversed an hour ago. I want justice and consistency; I have zero interest in sympathy. This case is cut and dried. Either I should be unblocked or RK should be blocked. Now. Immediately. Your comments oppose a block of RK and your (in)action has left me blocked. We live and learn I guess. (Sarah777 (talk) 08:45, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

(ec) Nobody's asking you to "crawl" or "beg", Sarah. A little patience and civility for the uninvolved would go a long way, however. We're all human and we're all volunteers here. We're working the issue on ANI right now, so please ... just let's figure this out, okay? - Alison ^❤ 08:51, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Well as I (a) don't know what ANI is and (b) can't partake in it - I cannot take much comfort in its deliberations. There are a whole host of critical issues that are brought up by the List of massacres that can't just be suppressed. When an Admin can simply dismiss a source as "left-wing" Wiki is in serious trouble - I mean it is in a POV ghetto, big time. (I'm not the least left-wing, btw, but I sure shouldn't have to explain that). (Sarah777 (talk) 09:07, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

(outdent)I decline to unblock. I've already criticised Rklawton for blocking someone he was in conflict with, but you did continue to revert, which you know you're not allowed to do. If it takes this for you to learn that edit-warring is not allowed, then so be it. I'll leave your template up as I know this is being discussed centrally. You really need to learn from this, whatever happens. --John (talk) 08:50, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

The only thing I'll learn from is that the systems stinks and that none of the Admins have the moral character to oppose one of their club. You "criticised Rklawton" did you? How about blocking him? I did NOT revert, get that? I added references each time. "I'll leave your template up" - what are you talking about? - Sarah777 (talk) 08:58, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

The more I think about this, the more outrageous it is. My contribution is deleted - not enough refs. I add one. Deleted - not enough good refs. I add another. "No - didn't like that one". I add another. "Sorry - 3RR, blocked". Frankly, any solution other than an immediate unblock and sanction of all the Admins involved in the blocking and supporting the block will be inadequate. (Sarah777 (talk) 09:19, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Ok, it's nearly 2am here, so bear with me. I'm willing to unblock here, as the block was arguably done outside of process. It was done in good faith, IMO - RK meant well - and you were edit warring. If you undertake not to edit that article for the next 31 hours, in deference to what's gone on there tonight - you were edit-warring there and a number of admins have declined so I'm sticking my neck out - then I will unblock. Deal? - Alison ^❤ 09:48, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I think the block should be unconditional, the block was wrong according to our policies. That is, the admin was involved in the article. It sends out all the wrong messages, an admin can block an editor they are in a dispute with, against policy, and have no action taken against them, while the editor is blocked regardless. --Domer48 (talk) 09:59, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Well, there's a lot of debate as to whether the admin "was involved" or not - that's the problem. While I agree the block was done out of process (as above), a number of admins have already declined here and it's seems obvious to my 2am brain here, that Sarah was also revert-warring. I'm doing my best to resolve all this to everyone's satisfaction, but right now, I should be in bed. I'm only sticking around to try to help here - Alison ^❤ 10:08, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I would like the unblock to be unconditional but with both parties agreeing voluntarily to leave the page alone for a specified duration. However Sarah would be wise to agree to be unblocked and then take this matter through the proper procedures elsewhere if she wishes too. She does not have to serve the sentence to have a justified complaint. Giano (talk) 10:13, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I think Sarah was edit warring but she was drawn into it by an admin who I think over-stepped his bounds by blocking someone with whom he himself was edit warring. This is not the first time he has muddled his editing and admin roles. I agree with an unconditional unblock but hope she might think about staying away from the article for a day anyway. Either way though, I'd leave it up to her. Gwen Gale (talk) 12:00, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I would agree. --Domer48 (talk) 10:29, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

i really need to get to bed here. Its nearly 3 and my kids had me up at 6am this morning. I'll see y'all in a few hours here. G'night! - Alison ^❤ 10:39, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

11am here;) Night night. --Domer48 (talk) 10:57, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Rklawton restrictions noted too

Done. I added the talk page because it's a fairly common stricture in cases like these. Daniel Case (talk) 02:44, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

OK Thanks - I thought there was a bit of "sanction creep" occuring! (Sarah777 (talk) 02:55, 23 December 2007 (UTC))

Irish county navigation box

Take a look, I think for a first try it's looking pretty damn perfect! (In case you're wondering, this would be my specialised Irish-only version.) Schcambo (talk) 15:04, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Very fine effort! The "townlands" will need watching as they could explode in number in the future but I guess you jump that shark when you come to it! (Sarah777 (talk) 15:12, 23 December 2007 (UTC))

Uh no I don't think that was me! Schcambo (talk) 15:26, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Note:List of massacres this block is now expired

Nice one Sarah, I never even got a hearing. --Domer48 (talk) 19:17, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Nor would I had a couple of concerned Admins not shown up. They are not all bad you know! (Sarah777 (talk) 19:22, 23 December 2007 (UTC))

I've been reading the archives of this article - worth a look - see how the "opposition" tends to end up in bad shape. (Sarah777 (talk) 19:25, 23 December 2007 (UTC))

Dromore Castle

Hello there. I am the original creator of the article for Dromore Castle, which you rated as start class back in September, which I think is quite reasonable - I'd be keen to improve it, and so I was wondering what kind of thing you'd be looking for in order to see it rise higher than that? It was rated start class for the architecture project by another user a few days ago, but as of yet, they have not responded to my request for feedback, so I thought I'd have a go asking you! Thanks, Robotforaday (talk) 21:39, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

I was hoping for something more specifically about the article itself, but thanks all the same. Robotforaday (talk) 21:56, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Rklawton Unfit for Adminship

Thanks Ali now that I have cooled down a bit - and stayed well away from "the list". But this can't be the end of the affair; I do not accept I was edit warring; and I do not accept the block was made in good faith. Read the history of this article; there is a long history of cooperative editing by a certain group to keep certain types of massacre off the list. This is the second time this year that I have been blocked by an Admin involved in a personal dispute. I think Rklawton must resign his Adminship or be relieved of it as he is manifestly not fit for the job. What is the procedure for removing him? (Sarah777 (talk) 16:35, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Like to identify that group?67.161.166.20 (talk) 16:48, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Not to any anon IP, no. (Sarah777 (talk) 23:10, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Then post it so everyone can see it.67.161.166.20 (talk) 23:27, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Let me expand on my first reply - I have no intention of even responding to anon IPs on this issue. Except maybe to zap any comments they leave on this page. That's pretty clear now, innit? (Sarah777 (talk) 23:32, 22 December 2007 (UTC))

Never been able to understand that. How is a web address that never changes more anonymous than your own "pen name" which can be changed in a couple minutes?67.161.166.20 (talk) 23:36, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Nobody remembers IP numbers; no track record, no form, no history - no way of telling if they might even be some "pen name" one is having a row with. Same goes for "new" named editors who start off with an obvious knowledge and expierence. It isn't the name so much as the trail it leaves allows us to sort the trolls from the rest. (Sarah777 (talk) 01:23, 23 December 2007 (UTC))

Thank you.67.161.166.20 (talk) 02:23, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Hi Sarah. I just woke up here and am playing catch-up. Your case was discussed here last night, by the way. Your best bet, now that you're unblocked, is to tag your opinion on over there or to open a completely new case and allow the community to have a good look and decide accordingly. Right now, though, it looks like people are quite divided on the issue. Either way, best option is to present your case over there should you wish to - Alison ^❤ 17:10, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Ali - I'm looking at the options. - Sarah777 (talk) 23:10, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I've spent the last 20 minutes reading over this dispute, and I agree with Sarah777's position: Rklawton does not appear fit to be an admin. Ledenierhomme (talk) 11:55, 25 December 2007 (UTC)