User talk:MisterCake/Archive 1

Florida Gators

Cake, the history of the Florida Gators mascot/nickname is confused because the university and the athletic department used no nickname for the football team until 1911. Please note that the modern university did not come into existence until the summer of 1905, did not open the new Gainesville campus until the fall of 1906, did not field its first varsity football team until 1906, and did not officially adopt orange and blue as its athletic colors until 1910. The football team was the only varsity team fielded until spring 1912, when a varsity baseball team was sponsored for the first time. The "Bo Gator" origin story was discredited by Storter himself, and Storter should know: he was the captain of the 1911 team that was the first to adopt the Gators nickname. The 1948 Florida Times-Union story about the Millers, merchant father and lawyer son, did not appear until 1948 -- 37 years after the fact -- and confuses the dates of the book store's private pennant order with the Michie Company and the team's actual adoption of the nickname, and overemphasizes the book store's role. While the university historian accepts the core of the Millers' story, he also believes the dates are confused, and the son attributes a far greater role to himself than any documented history can substantiate. Even the Times-Union story suggests that the Millers' book store sold the first pennants in 1908, not 1907. Please note: this was not the university book store, but a privately owned book store that had no official standing to adopt anything; the official colors being adopted by the university in 1910, and the team and athletic department adopting the Gators nickname in 1911. Setting aside the exact dates, none of this is actually contradictory when you accept that a private book store -- not the university, not the athletic department, not the coach, not the team -- sold alligator logo (not "Gators") pennants for a couple of years before anyone with official standing adopted the Gators nickname. The team's use of the nickname can be tracked in the yearbooks, and it does not appear until 1911-12. In any event, attributing the origin of the team's nickname to Storter, which Storter himself refuted, is an error; that story did not appear until years after the fact, and was attributed to a member of the 1928 team. Storter's "Bo Gator" nickname appears in the yearbooks before the team nickname did. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 06:14, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for this dirtlawyer. The main reason for looking into this for me was the curiosity, or what I thought was the curiosity, of the year of the Millers in 1908 contradicting the wiki page. Surely that's the "Gainesville merchant" the page speaks about, though. This seems to give credence to Storter's story that it came ultimately from the newspapers before the Mercer game in 1910. At least, that's the closest to the 1911 date. I tried my best to reconcile the stories to a nut graph of sorts. I had never heard a story other than the Miller's for how UF was orange and blue until I saw the idea of a combo of two prior schools. The Storters have a great story of early Florida in Chokoloskee. Cake (talk) 06:27, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Yes, the Miller's book store is the "Gainesville merchant"; I know -- I wrote that text. Certain details were intentionally omitted because of the contradictions, and because of the head's up the university historian had given me regarding the reliability of certain sources. As for the Macon newspaper reference, please note that it refers to "Florida alligators," not the "Gators." It is quite probable, based on the details available, that the alligator/gators nickname was percolating for two or three years before it was officially adopted, and that reconciles most, if not all of the details of the various accounts. Regarding the Storters . . . without posting self-identifying details on wiki, I grew up in southwest Florida, and I am intimately familiar with the history of Everglades City, as well as the Smallwood, Storter, Turner and Collier families that figured prominently in the early history of Collier County. Happy to share more via email. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 06:57, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Fascinating stuff sir dirt, I may take you up on that in future. I'm a Tampa area fellow, my only ancestral Florida football connection is my great grandfather who for a short time backed up Lamar Sarra at center (going into the '25 season), so I have to like that Neal Storter was a center. Just found out Jack McDowall ran all over us in Tampa; would love to know where in Tampa it was.

I see a lot of sources call us the "Alligators," though maybe that's just their ignorance. Given that 1911 is when we first get the title, Storter or the Macon story sure make a lot more sense to me than some pennants in years prior, though I defer to you on the matter. Cake (talk) 08:56, 14 December 2014 (UTC)

Might this shed light on it? 1911. Cake (talk) 04:19, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

Florida Gators QBs

Cake, would you consider re-ordering the list in chronological (not reverse chronological order), so that it conforms with the lists of Gators coaches and All-Americans? I took a whack at the lead a couple of days ago, and I will also add the career and season statistical leaders, too, at some point over the holidays. I would also like to conform the graphics and colors -- please take a look-see at the UFHOF, All-Americans and coaches lists, and let me know what you think. Cheers. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 20:49, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Done. Also added sortnames. The blue does seem to make it a bit easier on the eyes, though I am unsure how to make the arrows for sorting a different color so they can be seen. Would appreciate a fix there if one exists. Cake (talk) 21:30, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, Cake. When I get a chance, I will add the coding to create fixed width fields and several other needed tweaks. I've got a to-do list of wiki-coding questions, and next time I have a template editor's attention I will inquire regarding the sort arrows color. Lots of work still to be done. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 01:50, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

Talk:Shipwreck Kelly

You have been one of involved editors of this article, so I invite you to a move discussion. --George Ho (talk) 07:35, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Your input is requested . . . .

Cake, I'd like to get your opinion on this revised infobox template: [1]. After determining what data points to include, we'll recruit a template editor to handle the coding for us. Once we determine what fields we're adding and what we're deleting, then we'll work on the modified graphics. Thanks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 02:10, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Not sure I use that template enough to comment as it seems to be intended for current players, as opposed to the gridiron football person one. Seems fine to me. My only template query was to have the college coach one include a spot for playing height/weight. Cake (talk) 18:21, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Cake, Infobox college football player is supposed to be the infobox template for both current and former college players, not Infobox gridiron football person. In the aftermath of this revamp of the CFB player template, all former college football players (excluding those who played pro football or coached) will be converted to this template. The "gridiron" infobox is supposed to be used by CFL players, not NFL or CFB players. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 18:45, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Oh. I see. Good then; it needed a death date spot and it's nice to have the school colors. However, a place for nickname like the gridiron one would be valuable. Cake (talk) 18:51, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

The team name/nickname is already built into the header (see, e.g., Charlie LaPradd), but we obviously will need to fix the field names and clarify the template instructions in the documentation. The graphics will be updated, too, with all section headers reversed out in white text. I intend to have the top header done in a "college stripe," with the primary color in the center bounded by two smaller stripes of the secondary color on the outside (with very narrow white stripes in between) -- like a helmet stripe. It should give the give the college player infoboxes a distinctive graphic look, and make them immediately recognizable as college players. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 19:00, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Not the team nickname but the player, say of John Simms Kelly or Germany Schulz. So often players are better known by a nickname as the first name, and more often are listed only by last name. Gridiron football player has this field, and I think NFL player ostensibly does but it never works. Cake (talk) 19:10, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Cake, you always have the option of using the nickname in the primary name field for the template if the player was well known by that nickname. Infobox NFL player does not have a nickname field, but I would consider adding one to the revamped CFB player infobox if that's what a majority of WP:CFB editors want. That's why we're having the discussion amongst football editors. So, go ahead and add another "[+]" discussion point at the bottom of the specific points section, and start a discussion about nicknames. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 19:17, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

@Dirtlawyer1: What to do with schools like Centre, Washington & Lee, Sewanee, Cumberland, and others' colors on the infobox?

Infobox college football player

Hey, Cake. I see you're chugging through the old-time CFB players and adding the CFB infobox to their articles. Couple of quick things --

• First, Infobox gridiron football person used one and two-letter abbreviations for player positions; Infobox college football player and Infobox NFL player do not use those abbreviations for American college and pro players. We do, however, pipe the links to avoid displaying parenthetical disambiguations.
• Second, in all sports infoboxes, we use 8-digit year spans for team tenures (e.g., 1982–1985), not 6-digit spans (e.g., 1982–85).

I hope this helps. Regards, Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 20:19, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Writer's Barnstar
	Dear MisterCake, thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia, especially your recent creation of Morgan Blake. Keep up the good work! You are making a difference here! With regards, AnupamTalk 19:53, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

SAIAA football season categories

Hi MisterCake. When you create new college football season articles (e.g. 1913 North Carolina A&M Aggies football team) for teams who played in the SAIAA. please place them in the appropriate subcategory of Category:South Atlantic Intercollegiate Athletic Association football seasons. I don't think you knew these categories existed, so I wanted to let you know. Thank you. Jrcla2 (talk) 02:17, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

I did not. Thank you. I wish someone more knowledgeable - perhaps one knowledgeable of track, would be able to shed light on my darkness for whether the association starts in 1907 or 1912. Cake (talk) 02:21, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

You created this 1907 football standings template... where did you get this info if you're not sure when the conference started? Jrcla2 (talk) 02:33, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

The members on the page were already given when I first saw it (listing 1907-1910 as some period of significance) and what few other places spoke of it mentioned 1907 as the starting date quite consistently. For example, one can see the source cited on the football champions part of the SAIAA article. I started the standings because one, at the time it is what was said; and two, because it helps to flesh out the members of the conference. I got the info by simply applying team schedules with the given league members - or at least those which I could reconcile as not members of some other conference, which were all but one. However, recently I've come to find talk of the association starting in 1912, and I cannot yet find talk of SAIAA champions before then in say a newspaper or journal. I do see 1910 Georgetown claiming champion of the 'south atlantic states,' - not quite the SAIAA. You might notice on this navbox I have not added any claimed champions before 1912 (e.g. 1907 NC State). Cake (talk) 02:42, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

Gotcha. If you happen to find a source (or numerous sources) that pinpoint the founding year, let me know. We might have to rename the categories. Jrcla2 (talk) 02:59, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

@Jrcla2: Well, only a baby step closer. One can find George Washington rather proudly claims a 1908 "South Atlantic" (SAIAA? not sure) Championship. Cake (talk) 18:09, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

So we know it starts in minimally 1908, given the similarity in name from what George Washington claims as a championship versus the actual conference name. Jrcla2 (talk) 18:44, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Infobox college football player

Cake, do you have time to start checking all of the college football player articles to which you have added Template:Infobox college football player in the last couple of months? There have been significant changes to the template coding in the past 48 hours, and we need to check a big sample of the articles that presently use the template and keep a list of any problems with how it being displayed or any problems with the input data that needs to be edited. Any time you have to devote to this in the next day or so would be greatly appreciated. Cheers. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 01:04, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

I've noticed the new format and have not noticed any hiccups, though I have not gone through all the articles piecemeal. Anything to look for? Cake (talk) 01:27, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Things that I've noticed already: (1) the football positions will need to be linked; (2) college teams will need to be pipelinked (e.g., "Florida Gators football|Florida"); (3) high school will need to be pipelinked (e.g., "North Miami Senior High School|North Miami Senior"). Please note the text and field of any text that line-wraps to a second line of text; I already suspect we need to widen the the width by the equivalent of five or six characters. I'll start compiling a list of problems, anomalies, issues, etc., and periodically update you. If you see anything that's odd; ping me and let's talk about it. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 02:06, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

@Dirtlawyer1: Are you saying for college I should put "Florida Gators football|Florida" rather than "University of Florida" or "University of Florida|Florida"? Forgive me if I come off as obtuse. Figured the football link was already at the top. Starting to fix the high school though a little confused as to why; agreed it looks cleaner if it's just a city, e. g. Scranton, but seeing just "Tech" for Atlanta's Tech High School (Bill Fincher; Judy Harlan) seems odd (maybe just because it has no article); or "Central" for the myriad central high schools around the country. If a school is not named X high school but say X academy (e. g. Montgomery Bell Academy) or just X school (e. g. Woodberry Forest School), should I pipe the link to merely X still? Wish I could bump "college" over to the left. Makes it hard to fit, say, "Middle Tennessee State" (e. g. Rupert Smith). Cake (talk) 18:53, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

"I should put "Florida Gators football|Florida" rather than 'University of Florida' or 'University of Florida|Florida'" for the teams listed under the "career history" history section of the infobox? Exactly so.

Both the college/university and the college football team should be linked in the main body text of the article, and from the text it should be reasonably clear that the university and team are related.

My major concern right now is getting all of the infoboxes to link to the football teams, not the colleges/universities. This, however, is only the first step, Cake. There's going to be a lot of work to get these infoboxes cleaned up after we're finished with the template. If you have any questions, take a look at the Gordon Brown (American football), Forest K. Ferguson and Larry Dupree articles, and ping me with any questions. Please note the formatting not only of the pipe links for the college teams, but also the high schools, All-American, all-conference, College Football Hall of Fame, and other honors and awards. As for prep schools, etc., that do not include "High School" in their names, a certain editorial judgment is required as to whether to include "Academy," etc., in the displayed pipe link. Like I said, though, ping me if you have any questions -- and a linked example is always helpful. Cheers, Cake, and thanks for your help. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 20:36, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

• LOL @ "Bachelor of Ugliness". This was for real? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 22:24, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

• Most coveted male undergraduate award at Vandy; their "most popular" if you will. Cake (talk) 23:09, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

GT Templates

MisterCake; I noticed you changed the color scheme of GT templates. The colors for these templates are determined by consensus reached on talk page of WikiProject GT. Please post the reason for this change on that talk page and we will discuss it there. Thanks -Mistercontributer (talk) 01:28, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

@Mistercontributer: Done. Pardon my ignorance on this wiki-history. Cake (talk) 08:38, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Seminole yearbooks at University of Florida

Cake, do you have access to these yearbooks through one of the services to which you subscribe? If so, what is the first school year for which the Seminole yearbook is available online? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:53, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

• It's just using what UF has digitized. As you see the earliest seems to be 1910. Cake (talk) 03:58, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

• Thank you, sir -- this was just what I needed. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 16:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

• Glad I could help. Did UF have a religious affiliation? In Tennessee the Episcopals have Sewanee, the Methodists have Vandy, and the Presbyterians have Cumberland. Cake (talk) 23:38, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Nope, Florida was a non-sectarian state school from the git-go, but our first and third presidents (Andrew Sledd and John Tigert) were both ordained Methodist ministers, and the sons of a Methodist minister and Methodist bishop, in addition to being professors. The fourth president (J. Hillis Miller) was an ordained Baptist minister in addition to being a professor. None of those connections stopped the usual campus, highjinks, including the firing of a civil war cannon from the first-year dorms at one of the merchant shops on University Avenue, opposite the campus and dorms. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 00:26, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

Color graphics for Infobox college football player

3-pixel accent with white text

Vanderbilt Commodores

Cake, check this out: Template:Infobox college football player/testcases#Joe Cool (typical example). What do you think of the colors, graphics, and layout and design? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 16:40, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

I like it; the colors more like the navbox is the most apparent thing to like, though college at the top also strikes me as better. Maybe those are the only the obvious bits. Is there anyway to avoid the text wrap of say that 4 year all american other than maybe putting a large picture in the box? I might have weigh_lb(s) and weight_lb(s) all included as the same parameter if possible. Cake (talk) 17:26, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

The 4-year All-American honors should not wrap in the "Joe Cool (typical example) -- the width of the infobox was specifically sized to avoid that; it will wrap in the narrower "embeded" version, which is basically the CFB player infobox scrunched inside Infobox person. As for parameter names, once we've resolved everything else, I want to turn your or someone else loose with AWB, Twinkle or another auto-editor and eliminate all of the odd variations in parameter names from the old versions of the template now in use. One step at a time, though. Glad you like the graphics. I think it's f***ing sharp! Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:38, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

It is; I just await the school with some strange colors to ruin its elegance. Since I have you, how is it that the Christmas bowl for Terry Snoddy wraps but it does not for Herb Covington. The only difference I can detect is you changed the latter – so I must be the problem. Cake (talk) 17:48, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

No clue! I'll take a look and see if I can't figure out what's going one. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 18:15, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Question

3-pixel accent with white text

Notre Dame Fighting Irish

MisterCake, what do you think about this edit? I personally think that white looks better than gold on the blue, but the other user disagrees. I know you deal with the colors and know more than I do about it, as I'm still learning about the whole colors thing. So for that reason, I thought I'd ask for your opinion. Thanks, Corky | Chat? 23:39, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

• Hey, guys. I suggest that you contemplate white text on dark blue background, with gold highlights. If you're looking for examples of howto code that in the context of a navabox, take a look at Template:University of Florida presidents or Template:University of Florida. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 00:00, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your input, Dirtlawyer1! That was one of the main reasons I reverted his/her edits (I based it off of what we talked about on my talk page). I haven't talked to the user yet, but will once I have two opinions on it. Corky | Chat? 00:30, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

• I am not some school colors expert I only saw many flaws in the colors and navboxes as it was and took to doing something about it. That said, I've changed it with what seems proper practice – feel free to dispute it. Cake (talk) 01:02, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Alrighty, thanks! Corky | Chat? 01:05, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

College football team navboxes

Cake, I've seen a bunch of your recent edits to college football team navboxes whereby you inverted the colors for the groupings. Another editor reverted your changes at Template:Michigan Wolverines football navbox and I'm inclined to agree with that move. The standard, uniform color scheme is simpler, easier to maintain, and, I think, looks better. I'm going to revert all the navboxes to the standard scheme. If you think this is an issue worth discussing, please bring it up at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football. Thanks, Jweiss11 (talk) 15:41, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

@Jweiss11: You may want to consider the maize text on navy blue background: the contrast is relatively low per WP:ACCESS. White text provides much higher contrast for legibility, and most of the football team navboxes already use white text. Frietjes has recently used software to calculate contrast ratios for team colors in comparison to white and black text on a background of the primary team color -- white text provides higher contrast and greater legibility about 90% of the time over text of the secondary team color and/or black text. (See User:Frietjes/ncaa.) If we want to continue to maintain the same color scheme for both the interior and exterior of the team navboxes, as we have for the last five years by established consensus and which you have stoutly defended, that's an entirely different matter. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:14, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Dirtlawyer1, if we need to move to a three-color scheme for Michigan (e.g. white text on blue background with maize border) and other analogous cases per WP:ACCESS, I have no objections. Jweiss11 (talk) 17:37, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Also, if we move to a three-color scheme for a given school, then all the athletic navboxes need to change in the same fashion. Jweiss11 (talk) 17:59, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I've received quite an education on "accessibility" issues during the back-and-forth with Andy Mabbett and Bagumba over the revamped Infobox college football player. Without getting into the hoary details here, let's just say I understand the core "accessibility" issues and also understand how they can also be disingenuously manipulated by someone who is bent on making existing infoboxes "more generic." I'm pleased that the new CFB player box will be anything but generic, and in answer to some of the template mavens' complaints, it's also fully compliant with WP:ACCESS and related accessibility guidelines. We got a lot of help from a new template editor named Alakzi (who can be relied upon to play it down the middle) as well as Frietjes. Frietjes has also taken the initiative to sort the college colors issues to a greater degree than before. It would be well worth your time to read my discussions with her on her user talk page to get a quick update on where we stand with colors. As always, I remain a staunch supporter of the standardization we started 5 years ago. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 18:26, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Newspaper citations

Hey, I know you do alot of work with turn of the last century articles and was wondering if you could let me know how to wikicite a newspaper clipping from a database, specifically newsok.com doesn't have the article (as they post some historical articles) but "The Oklahoman" database does. Thanks.UCO2009bluejay (talk) 00:26, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi there. I would like to help but I am not sure I understand. Do you mean behind a paywall? One can use the via parameter to say where it's from. Maybe I need an example. Cake (talk) 00:39, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

I don't know if it is behind a paywall I used a library account to access it. But let's say it is behind a paywall just in case. then yes.

UCO2009bluejay (talk) 01:13, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

I assume one has to pay or at least be in the area to access the library account. By behind a pay wall one means not open access – like getting a screen asking for a username and password instead of the article. I think if it's not open access ( ) it gives a closed lock, but I'm not sure if there is code for that to add on the end like with OA or if it's just the absence of the one for OA. Having |via=Oklahoman Digital Archives| or whatever as a parameter as much as the date or newspaper title would probably help. For everything else I would just cite it like a regular newspaper with the url and all. I. e. {{cite news|via=Oklahoman Digital Archives|title=Title|work=The Oklahoman|date=January 1, 1900|accessdate=April 7, 2015|page=1|url=http://www.metrolibrary.org/oklahoman-digital-archives-1901-present}} Cake (talk) 02:12, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

That is extemely helpful, I didn't find that when I was looking in WP:Cite. Thank you very much.UCO2009bluejay (talk) 02:27, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

CFB coaches and players

Hey, I've noticed that you've done a lot of great work with CFB players and coaches in the recent months. Feel free to drop me a line if you need any assistance tracking down names and dates. I've done a lot of that in the past and feel like I know where to look (especially for those pesky initials)....best, Connormah (talk) 00:15, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

I'll take a look hopefully over the next few months! Just a question, were you unable to edit my main talk page? I moved the list there. Connormah (talk) 06:24, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

I did not try - just went with the one which seemed to have the most posts. Cake (talk) 06:25, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Alright, sounds good. I guess I'll refer the list on my talk if I have any comments/notes, so perhaps you'd want to watch the page. Do add more if you feel inclined to do so (sometimes I try and seek out this kind of thing, so the more the merrier). Hopefully I can dig some of the missing info up. Working around nicknames and initials can be extremely frustrating sometimes. I remember looking for a certain player a few weeks ago (an article you started) for a few hours, to no avail. Turns out what I thought was a nickname was his actual name (or seems to be). Connormah (talk) 06:29, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Thanks again for the help. Inevitably I keep running into ones I forgot. Which article had the phantom nickname? Cake (talk) 06:32, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Just checked and it was Farmer Kelly. Complete phantom across all the yearbooks it seems. And in genealogical searches. Really strange.... usually when that's the case, something is off. There's [2] this though, but I can't find really anything correlating and tying him to the CFB player (if I recall correctly). Connormah (talk) 06:53, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

There are certainly people in the south christened with the first name Farmer as odd as that is. I've wondered but I think it is his name. Cake (talk) 06:59, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

I'd assumed that it was a family name or something that served as his middle name, but I guess it appears that it isn't. The things you learn while doing this stuff... Connormah (talk) 07:12, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Got a lot more time now and hopefully I'll be able to look into these soon. Was wondering if you could help on an article though... I'd been intending to start an article on Bill Kay, an Iowa All-American and All-Conference player in the 1940s. Not entirely sure how to go about it though, so perhaps you could create it so I can get a sense of how to go about creating CFB player articles? Thanks. Connormah (talk) 18:23, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Sure, I probably could at least start it. Is it the same Bill Kay taken in the 1949 NFL Draft? If so it will be a case of an NFL player article in the sense of the infobox used. Cake (talk) 18:51, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

@Connormah: See Bill Kay. Cake (talk) 19:13, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Many thanks. Connormah (talk) 00:58, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, I've been extremely busy as of late. I'll be sure to get to these at some point in the summer. Connormah (talk) 03:13, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

DYK for Robert L. Myers (coach)

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:32, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Fergie Ferguson jersey no.

Cake, what are the odds you find a jersey no. for Forest K. Ferguson (Gators varsity 1939–41)? You've shown a remarkable aptitude for finding old game programs, etc., in the past . . . . I can normally find at least one photo of the old-time players wearing their uniform jersey, but I cannot find one of Fergie. Also, do you know what year NCAA players started wearing jersey nos.? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:05, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Let me answer in reverse order. No idea; I think it varies by university and in the early days ebbs and flows, some years with numbers and some years without. It seems pretty widespread in the 1910s, but this would be "original research." I wonder when it became a practice to have a player with the same number for more than say two seasons. Funny to mention Fergie - on the old NCAA Football 2003 (or 2004) video game they had an all-time florida team. The only old timer was Fergie as a third string tight end. I cannot find a roster of that team but it used to be online somewhere. I think he was 41, i.e. just using the year of his class, but it might be worth a check. Right now on his article it says he was number 8 so I assume you found it at least for one season. 8 was a common number for linemen for whatever reason (immediately to mind: Bob Rives, Ralph Maddox). If not the yearbook not sure at the moment where to look unless you happen upon a roster in a newspaper. Cake (talk) 02:40, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

For a good bit of their early years, the Gators had a jersey that looked like an orange-and-blue version of the Wolverines' helmet -- no number on the front, but I suspect there were numbers on the back. Makes getting jersey nos. from old photos a little more challenging. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:44, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

@Dirtlawyer1: You mean the "friction stripes" on e. g. Ark Newton? Yeah, those almost surely had numbers on back [see Bob Rives above]. Hek Wakefield in 1924 from the front and the back (14). It always helps if there are game programs online. There were numbers before the friction stripes even (a 1920s thing). There are myriad pictures from 1919 with numbers. Say the Rose Bowl or UVA-Vandy. Do these UT programs in 1914 and 1909 not list numbers (And did UT use letters before the 1909 game vs. Transylvania)? Nothing on the front and stripes on the sleeves is popular in the 1910s. If not that then maybe just a stripe across the chest. There was also this kind of rounded wing look you see in the 1920s (e. g. Georgia Tech or Michigan). However one classifies Tech's V-ish shape style jersey of the 1910s (like Everett Strupper) - it too had numbers on the back. Got all Vandy's numbers in 1922 with friction stripes due to the Sewanee program. Can see it's indeed the number in certain cases by simply looking (e. g. Tex Bradford is listed as 21 and can see it in that picture (on the line without the helmet)). Pretty sure practically all of the leather helmet days had the numbers on the back, and that pictures like those of Bill Dudley or Austin Downes with the number on the front are striking in early football. Cake (talk) 07:51, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

• @Dirtlawyer1:. Edwin Pope's Football's Greatest Coaches on page 232 says Amos Alonzo Stagg started numbering players in 1913. There are spots where Pope is close but wrong, so let's say c. 1913. This fits with, say, Bob McWhorter listed as wearing number 36 by UGA sources. Cake (talk) 23:38, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

• Interesting. So, that's the first reference we have to any CFB team with numbered jerseys? And everyone else gradually adopted the practice over the next decade or so? To date, I have not found any references to Gators jersey numbers before the 1930s, but I suspect that may be partially because the jerseys only had numbers on the backside and therefore were not visible in most photos. At least we know not even bother looking before World War I. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 13:52, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

• Stagg is listed as the inventor by two sources, so the first is probably Chicago unless it was nation-wide like if he did it as part of the rules committee. As I cover the south, yes, for me, the first is McWhorter and David Paddock at UGA (except those UT programs I show above). I trust Chicago is right, but there are multiple times Pope (who is the only one who gives a year) is off slightly with dates [he says 1891 for the 7-2-2 defense; fellow wiki editors cite 1890, though I can give better examples not w/ Stagg]. Paddock's number is the same as the number written on the team photo to identify him, and so I wonder if that is the case e. g. w/ Bull Kearley and others. Though it's possible of course I would be surprised if the Gators didn't have numbers when they wore friction stripes as everybody else seemed to have them. This image I've used before has numbers for that first great year of 1928 (Red Bethea?) - though I thought UF still had the friction stripes look then. There are also nicknames in the the 1910s which suggest numbers but I have yet to see it listed. For example, did "Big Six" Carpenter wear number 6 (he's not the only fellow with this nickname, though most well known)? Cake (talk) 15:00, 26 April 2015 (UTC) Cake (talk) 14:56, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

Infobox college football player

Cake, we've implemented the full graphics package for the revamped infobox today, and I am checking for any anomalies with the colors, etc. Could you check your list of articles that use the template, and report back with any issues that you see? Thanks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:05, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Will do. Is the black text intentional on pages like e. g. Frank O. Rogers? I figure it is for contrast. Might need to stick a wide picture in articles like Truxton Hare so the All-Americans don't wrap. Cake (talk) 02:49, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Is that wrapping on your monitor, Cake? The width == which is wider than a typical infobox -- was specifically sized not to wrap with up to four All-American years in the parenthetical . . . . Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:09, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

That's possible – guess I can always zoom out. It still might be worth looking for a landscape image. Cake (talk) 03:12, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Well, the infoboxes always work better with a square or horizontal photo. Long verticals should either be cropped or used outside the infobox. I'm keeping a list of those that I've come across. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:15, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Chigger Browne

Not seeing the reference connecting Chigger to the Gators track team in the linked article from the Ocala Star-Banner [3]. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 16:56, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

• Quoting the article: "Henry Camp of the prominent Ocala Camp family was captain of the varsity track team coached by Chigger Browne." The yearbook is also online and one can see it's him. Cake (talk) 20:38, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

• Gee whiz. Missed that. Had to look at the article twice, even when I knew what to look for. Good job. Another missing coach found. The initials sometimes make it a challenge. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 20:42, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

• No worries. I did the same when I found it trying to find what it was the search engine hit upon. Chigger is one where you have to account for the nickname with initials - might be A. L. or A. C. It was neat to see he had a UF connection. Browne was a sensational player – consider he forced Ray Morrison to move from his position at QB on the 1910 All-Southern team. Cake (talk) 20:51, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

SIAA membership for University of Florida in 1910

Got a source for 1910 membership: [4]?

• I used Saylor's table. I don't know if it's trustworthy (as he says the years may not be right) but never seen such a list having them all outside of individual years. Was he rounding with 1910? I now see the compilation of the Southern champs says 1912. Not sure which is right. Using a more inductive, "original research" method, I don't see them in it before 1913 as a conference win for Auburn. Cake (talk) 14:21, 20 April 2015 (UTC)

DYK for W. A. Lambeth

Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 20:32, 20 April 2015 (UTC)

College football national championship team navboxes

Cake, thanks for your recent efforts to create college football national championship team navboxes, e.g. Template:1904 Penn Quakers football navbox. When transcluding these navboxes onto bio articles, the accepted standard to first list tenure navboxes chronologically, then championship team navboxes chronologically, then awards and honors navboxes chronologically. When there's three or more championship and or awards/honors navboxes, those all get placed in a collapsed box, c.f. Fritz Crisler. Also, is there any reason you tend to transclude these navboxes using underscores instead spaces between words in the template name? Jweiss11 (talk) 18:23, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

• By tenure navboxes you mean say the ADs, head coaches, or QBs? The underscores tend to happen out of laziness from copy/pasting the relevant part of the url.Cake (talk) 18:29, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Yes, that's exactly what I mean by tenure navboxes. Say no to laziness! :) Jweiss11 (talk) 18:56, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Where's Waldo?

Ποιος είναι Πλακιάς

• Ha. Spelled it horribly wrong. It's supposed to be "πλακοῦς" - ancient cake. See Placenta cake.Cake (talk)

• I love good baklava with pistachios and honey, but I'm a little skeptical of something called "placenta" cake. BTW, what's this I read about you being a "Gators fan?" I thought you were a Vandy guy . . . . Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 03:48, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

• Honey everywhere with Ancient Greek dessert as I understand. My Nashville ancestors came to Florida, married some people who had been there before from the Virginias. Each side had its minor ties with both institutions respectively. But, raised a Gator fan in days of a spry Spurrier and side with them when the two come in conflict, which is most often. I think I liked most how he used Jacquez Green. I was there rooting along the 71 to 13 over Vandy the last time I saw him on our sidelines. I think that '01 team was my favorite. I've only been to Tennessee before I remember being anywhere at all - or so I am told. Vandy just has that deep history with the sport which Florida is too southern (literally/geographically) for, and so they get a bit more research focus. Just see Vandy's team our first year - 1906. It took a while for the sport to get to Florida. It's a shame they tore down Plant Field a bit more than a decade ago. Always fun to see the UF connections with Tigert, Hardage, Cody, and so forth. My small Gator history connection is a great grandfather on the 1924 freshman team (he was captain), and for a short while going into the 25 season he was Lamar Sarra's backup on the varsity. He was off the team before the season started. Some family speculates he was caught playing semi-pro ball or something like that, but he had ear problems all his life and the newspaper cited those as the reason. I like to imagine how he could've helped the 1927 team had he played his four years–made a bit more lamentable with how Middlekauff (on the varsity in '24!) came back that year. Cake (talk) 19:28, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

Vols

MC, thought I'd respond here. So far, I've gotten very little information on the three Volunteers you mentioned. One person confirmed that they are all Tennessee lettermen. Another said he thought Word's nickname was "Piggy" and said there is good info about the old-time Vols in a book called The Big Orange: A Story of Tennessee Football. http://www.amazon.com/THE-BIG-ORANGE-TENNESSEE-FOOTBALL/dp/B0041KRBO8 Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Thanks, again, for your work.BillVol (talk) 16:57, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the book recommendation. I will have to use "piggy word" as one of my search terms. The nicknames are often important to find for that era. Supposedly the school's colors of orange and white started in the early 20s with Roy B. "Pap" Striegel, which has me wondering the colors of what e. g. Farmer Kelly is wearing. Cake (talk) 19:12, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject Florida Gators

Hey, Cake. I saw that you were inserting importance ratings for several of the Gator old-timer player articles you created. Quick head's up: all University of Florida Athletic Hall of Fame members get an automatic "High" importance rating (e.g., Rainey Cawthon, Dummy Taylor), and players of historical significance like Neal Storter and Robbie Robinson probably rate a "Mid" importance rating. The "Top" importance rating includes all of the Florida Gators sports team main articles (e.g., Florida Gators football), all current head coaches, the three Heisman Trophy winners, and all past coaches who won either an AIAW or NCAA national championship at Florida. Football and basketball players who were first-team All-American selections (either consensus or major selector) are rated as "High". Most of the rest are either "Mid" or "Low" rated. Carry on. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 08:45, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. Trying to at least give WikiProject CFB ratings with touches of UF and basketball and etc along the way. Cake (talk) 08:49, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

WP:CFB importance

I would think all Heisman Trophy winners would be rated as "high" importance: [5]. Surprising that Berwanger was not. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 12:20, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• According to the guidelines, "hiesman" winners and consensus all americans should be rated 'high'. Berwanger was far from the only one I had to fix from a lower rating. Charlie Ward, Chris Weinke, Barry Sanders, Tony Dorsett, Marcus Allen, OJ Simpson, Earl Campbell, Pat Sullivan, Mike Rozier, Ricky Williams, Eddie George, Ty Detmer, Archie Griffin, Johnny Manziel, all had different ones. I've only started. Cake (talk) 12:23, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• Okay, you found this: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football/Assessment#Matrix proposal? To the best of my recollection, Cmadler's proposal was never formally approved, but it's a good place to start, it's relatively well structured and fairly comprehensive. I was one of the advocates of automatically rating all Heisman winners and consensus All-Americans as "high" importance. Carry on, sir. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 12:30, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• Yes, though I get lost in the footnotes/asterisks such that I have to backtrack sometimes, it seems far better than whatever haphazard intuition runs some of the current selections. For example the 2013 Temple Owls and 2013 Arkansas Razorbacks were high but Archie Griffin and Jim Brown and Red Grange and Doc Blanchard were not. I will not oppose further refinement, but chugging through this should at least get them closer to how it should be. Cake (talk) 12:36, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• Cake, thanks for your work on this. Jweiss11 (talk) 12:47, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• Guys, at some point in the not-so-distant future, we ought to finish what Cmadler started. It's mostly done already, and God knows he spent a lot of time on it. With a few tweaks and additions to his importance matrix, we should formally adopt it, and turn loose Cake, WO-9 and the other guys who enjoy doing clean-up work. I'm in the process of creating importance rankings for WP:SWIMMING and WP:Gators, so I may have a few evolved thoughts in a few weeks, but I think Cmadler's rankings project still holds up pretty well. I suggest we read through the discussion again, and revisit the matrix in the next couple of weeks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 12:53, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

• I would like that, especially for how to deal with the regional differences. E.g. is an All-Southern counted like an All-American? A tier below? Not counted at all towards importance? Maybe can apply the composite All-Southerns a tier below the consensus All-Americans? All-Southern and All-Western teams are also the old standard for how to look at a leather-helmet "conference season." Cake (talk) 06:46, 17 May 2015 (UTC)

Cake, I don't have every former CFB player and coach on my primary watch list, but I note that you have down-graded the importance of several CFB Hall of Fame members: [6]. Is this intentional or accidental? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 09:34, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

• Not an accident. Huerta, for example, won a conference and is in the hall of fame, both of which alone raise his level to mid from the standard 'low' for a coach. Had he won a national title, he would get a high ranking, per the table. That said, there are without question a few coaches I would argue deserve a 'high' ranking who never won a true national title when we discuss things further. E. g. Dan McGugin, Bo Schembechler, Clark Shaughnessy. I've upgraded plenty of all-american hall of fame members as well. Cake (talk) 16:03, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Please comment pertaining to new school articles and categories

I began an important issue that will affect the college football, basketball, and baseball projects. You are a regular editor within any or all of these WikiProjects and your input is requested. Please weigh in at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College Basketball#University of Texas Rio Grande Valley athletics. Thank you! Jrcla2 (talk) 01:42, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Tiger Mayberry

Cake, I have no idea how to work the "clipping" function in Newspapers.com, but you really should link to the entire All-SEC article, not just the little "infobox" that lists the first, second and third teams. The full article confirms a number of details about Mayberry. Cheers. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 20:20, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

• It does not say much aside from about Carl Hinkle, but can do. The picture of his used was the same as on the article, but far worse quality. Cake (talk) 20:23, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

• I was afraid that Tiger would turn out to be marginally notable or even non-notable; I'm really excited about all the good sources you're finding. Tiger is certainly more notable than the Auburn–Tulane football rivalry. LOL

Free advice: be careful about relying on Buddy Martin for anything important. In my experience, he gets a lot of details factually wrong. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 18:13, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

I got excited for the recent source with dates of birth and death. Noted on Martin - luckily with his source for Tiger it's just looking at a list and seeing nobody before him. Probably so on Auburn and Tulane, but they were both quite good on the cusp of the 30s. It seems a bit like Tenn to Spurrier was Aub to Bierman/Cox/Dawson, deciding the conference favorite, or at least which one was competing with Neyland at Tenn and Thomas at Bama. Here is a message board post with some cool bits on Mayberry; wish it came with sources. Cake (talk) 18:24, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Autopatrolled

Hi MisterCake, I just wanted to let you know that I have added the "autopatrolled" permission to your account, as you have created numerous, valid articles. This feature will have no effect on your editing, and is simply intended to reduce the workload on new page patrollers. For more information on the patroller right, see Wikipedia:Autopatrolled. Feel free to leave me a message if you have any questions. Happy editing! Beeblebrox (talk) 20:12, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

DYK for Walter Mayberry

The DYK project (nominate) 19:32, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

• Well done, sir. A good Gator, and a damn fine American. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 19:39, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

• ~salutes box of plastic~. Would've been fun to see the Gators then - got little family connections to just about Mayberry's whole coaching staff. Gotta love that Mayberry has as many interceptions as Tannen or Oliver. Wonder if Florida Hall of Fame inducted him into the hall on the year of his number on purpose.Cake (talk) 07:24, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

• "box of plastic?" That you will have to explain, Cake.

Be careful about over-subdividing article content. I know the trend for NFL articles is to break out every year/season, but it really is an atrocious practice for short, one and two-sentence seasons. An article like Mayberry's that has a relatively brief three-paragraph college sports career section really does not need to be subdivided. Cheers, old man. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 15:54, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

• Even if more is added about each year? The box of plastic is my computer. Cake (talk) 17:11, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
• @Dirtlawyer1: Check out the little description of Mayberry on the UP All-SEC team. Cake (talk) 17:44, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for creating Noah Armstrong. Curious if you are interested in Montana history or horse racing generally, or if that was a one-off? Montanabw^(talk) 19:04, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

• Hi there. A one-off is the short answer. The long answer is: My interest on Noah centers around the fact that he is the in law of A. J. Turner, for the Turners are in my blood. Charles Turner marries Emma Armstrong. Charles has a fascinating story which goes through Montana, and those parts of Montana history connected to him most spark my interest. Montana also has a certain charm as a place to get away from it all and live in the woods, though I've never been up that way. Aside from that, there is Montana as a simple extension of American history; but no, I cannot pretend to have ties to Montana. Though not the only subject for which I have an academic interest, college football is what most of my edits here are about, for the subject is far from exhausted here. So, as sport, I can and do appreciate horse racing, find much interest in the story of Spokane; but no I would be lying to say I had an interest in horse racing as such. In fact I think I'd have a nervous breakdown from the fear of the ride were I to be transported to the 18th century and must ride a horse everywhere. Though if I do not climb atop one I prefer most animals to people (small bits of this in my history as well, e. g. made Peritas). Forgive me for not knowing what it is Noah mined – copper? I show here my ignorance of Montana. Cake (talk) 00:19, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

• • So Emma Armstrong was his daughter? From the looks of this, I'd say the answer to what he "mined" is that he made his fortune off a smelter that processed a whole bunch of stuff - copper, silver, lead, etc... The article says, "the Glendale smelter was busy producing about one million ounces of silver and thousands of tons of lead and copper annually until it burned down in July, 1879." Look up Butte, Montana for an overview, Twin Bridges and the Pioneer Mountain range where Armstrong hung out is less than 80 miles away. Absolutely wild and crazy mining history there, Anaconda Copper Company and all. His horse breeding adventures (noted here) remind me of the old joke: Q: How do you make a small fortune with horses? A: Start out with a large fortune! Montanabw^(talk) 22:51, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
    • Yes, she was. Quite the head of curly hair. I made an article for her husband Charles Turner here. The Armstrong Turner mentioned in that cowboyfame article was their first son. They have grandchildren still alive from the other son. Charles and Noah were around each other often after meeting in Montana, as one can see in Seattle. I did see what it said in that link but I am glad you can reiterate it – for I knew a little (very little) about Clark and there are references to how cool it is for Spokane's color of copper like out of the mines. But then I also see ads for the smelter mentioning other things. I find it interesting how it says Butte is quite Cornish. Would've guessed more Germanic if I had to do so. As to the fortune, ha, I can say I've seen that apply elsewhere. Frank Wall seemed savvy at making money everywhere but never had a horse win anything of which I am aware. A story goes that when one finished among the also-rans, he waited amongst the judges until his jockey and horse returned and said "Hey boy! What detained you?" PS Jacoby Lowney, a direct descendant, has tons of great stuff on these subjects. Here is a great old picture of the round barn. Cake (talk) 15:22, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

• • • • Butte is, most of all, hardcore Irish. (Quite the St. Paddy's day soiree there to this day) hardscrabble mining town with people coming from all over the world (there was a Finntown, a Chinatown, still has Eastern Orthodox Serbian folks, etc...) that had a peak population of 150,000 it its heyday,now about 30-35,000 left. Once was called "the Gibralter of Unionism", hotbed of IWW organizing, elected a Socialist as mayor in 1914. Huge civic pride, still considered a tough working-class town. Man, if we could prove first publication of those images prior to 1923 or something else to get them in the public domain, I'd give my eyeteeth to have images for the Spokane article, also want to do one on the barn. Montanabw^(talk) 05:09, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

@Montanabw: Only now realized you took the pictures for the Doncaster Round Barn article (yes?). An extra well done for those. I must like Armstrong's cake-based inspiration. Cake (talk) 20:21, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

DYK for 1922 Princeton vs. Chicago football game

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:35, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

CFP

Thanks for rating the College Football Playoff article. (I had asked a few times for a peer review on the College football and American football projects' talk pages, but no responses.)

What do you think are its deficiencies? Would you be willing to do a formal assessment? What do you think is necessary to get it up to GA? Would you like me to stop peppering you with questions? Thanks in advance for any guidance. Woodshed (talk) 20:49, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

• I am on a quest to get enough college football articles' importance assessed to hash out previous errors as well as further refine the guidelines. While passing by, saw the article was rated a stub with 70+ cites and decent amount of prose, etc, figured it was at least a C and went on. I've only a single GA myself, and have never reviewed one. Cake (talk) 22:46, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

DYK for 2009 All-SEC football team

Gatoclass (talk) 13:07, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Long overdue . . .

		The Florida Gators Barnstar
		Presented to MisterCake for his good and thorough work pertaining to articles about his favorite   college sports teams, the Florida Gators. Awarded by User:Dirtlawyer1, July 11, 2015.

Your good work on Florida Gators subjects has not gone unnoticed, Cake, including Goldy Goldstein, J. Rex Farrior, Walter Mayberry, Bill Middlekauff, Ark Newton, Rammy Ramsdell, W. M. Robinson, Neal Storter and Earle Taylor. Well done, sir. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 07:04, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

• The best one yet. Most of all Middlekauff, Robinson, and Storter still need work. Cake (talk) 13:37, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

• Frankly, I was surprised you found as much about Middlekauff and Robinson as you did. Storter, of course, being possibly connected to the origin(s) of the team nickname, gets a fair number of hagiographic mentions when the Gators' origin myths are discussed in the media. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 14:05, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

Things that make you go "hmmmm"

Accident: [7]? Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 12:17, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

See here Cake (talk) 13:34, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

Yep. I thought that might be what was going on. Please note that all of the CFB football season categories are attached to the Gators decade articles, which have actual text, not the individual season redirects (which exist for every year, not just 1917) that have no substance. Categorizing the redirect pages potentially leads a reader using the category system to a page with no text. Cheers. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 14:01, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

No need for one-paragraph articles

Cake, there is no need for this: [8]. These Gators decade articles exist, they are stable and they are well organized. Until they are substantially expanded with sourced content beyond their existing content, there is no reason to split these into single-season articles. It is stub article creation for the sake of article creation. Thanks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 04:50, 20 July 2015 (UTC)