User talk:Dennis Bratland/Archive 5

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Letting you know about a sock you reverted earlier

See Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Lila Cheney 336. You reverted one of the socks (Senyaka 103 (talk · contribs)) earlier. Just so you know, this editor has been making similar disruptive edits for a couple of months, usually just one or two articles about corporations per account then it's thrown away. Cheers, -- Flyguy649 ^talk 00:13, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Hayabusa (disambiguation)

MOS:DAB states: "The description associated with a link should be kept to a minimum, just sufficient to allow the reader to find the correct link."

Per that statement, "fastest" anything does not serve the above described purpose. Big Bird (talk • contribs) 20:18, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Dennis Bratland. You have new messages at Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism.
Message added 15:30, 19 April 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Elockid has replied to your report. Minimac (talk) 15:30, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

pls read and understand art before editing

pls read and understand art before editing.Wdl1961 (talk) 01:29, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Do not feed the troll

Don't get drawn into a protracted discussion with a newly-registered editor who may just be trolling e.g. someone who is into motorcycles, firearms and 35mm cameras. Mmmm..., wonder who that could be? --Biker Biker (talk) 08:46, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

I agree -- when someone starts ticking off off-topic critiques of WP and sounding like Larry Sanger, they're probably trolling. But in case they're not, I think it's worth while to suggest that they should take that discussion to an appropriate forum, while not engage them in debating every point. I wasn't planning on continuing that conversation. --Dbratland (talk) 14:27, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Help with possible WP:RS dispute

I wouldn't mind some of your valuable insight at Talk:Yamaha YZF-R1 where I am engaged in a discussion with M4 work (talk · contribs) about the reliability of a single page that he/she is repeatedly adding to a number of articles. I've already pinged Tedder as another frequent contributor to motorcycling issues. --Biker Biker (talk) 15:14, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

You were completely right

Dbratland - I was not aware that I had literally copy pasted the press release! I just looked into the article history to try and understand why you seem so impassioned, and saw that I had copy/pasted the very first draft of my article, instead of the completed article... which consists of original text cited with reliable sources, and only a sentence from the press release. Thank you for your help and I apologize for my oversight. I have uploaded the correct article edits now. Best wishes. (Yodabirdblue (talk) 19:19, 2 May 2010 (UTC))

Attempt to make the article more neutral.

Hi Dbratland,

I spent house going down "wormholes" of wikipedia pages last night. I am really enjoying what I am learning and look forward to getting better at this. I toned down the article and tried to make it as neutral as it could be. It is balanced in that there is no information that I have been able to find that is negative, per se - or gives another side to the story. I would appreciate if you could take a look when you get a moment and let me know if you feel that I could make additional changes. If you think that the changes I have made are ok, would you still not object to removing the advert tag? I am going to continue to work on this article over time as things change about the company, and will add balanced neutral information as I find it. I am going to look at the Ian Barry article user: Biker Biker brought up, and make that better too. And then I am moving on to Shinya. Would it be ok if I ran that past you as well?

Thank you,

(Yodabirdblue (talk) 17:27, 3 May 2010 (UTC))

User Biker Biker has removed the tag. I am going to leave a message on his talk page saying thanks too - but not to worry about having to do that! (Yodabirdblue (talk) 17:32, 3 May 2010 (UTC))

Thanks for the assistance!

Dara —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.142.33.37 (talk) 22:31, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

Reformatting Edward Winterhalder

Thanks for the assistance!

Dara —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.142.33.37 (talk) 22:32, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Elena Myers

Gatoclass (talk) 00:02, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

removing interlanguage links

Hello Dbratland,

The article on "Pannier" (bike bags) on en.wikipedia are linked to articles about "Alforja" (a minicipality in Spain) on other languages. I don't understand why you undid my edit, and maybe you can help me correct this?

The following links appear to be correct:

de:Fahrradtasche sv:Cykelväska

and the following are incorrect:

an:Alforja ca:Alforja es:Alforja eu:Alforja fr:Alforja it:Alforja nl:Alforja ru:Альфоржа uk:Алфоржа vi:Alforja war:Alforja

Confusion probably arose from the fact that "Alforja" on en.wikipedia redirects to "Saddlebag", an article similar to "Pannier".

130.89.161.143 (talk) 23:26, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

You're right. Robots actually added the links; I only put the warning on your talk page. I've deleted the bad links to Alforja and struck out the warning I put on your talk page. My apologies. I also added a note for the two robots that made the mistake. It looks like Alforja means saddlebag in Spanish, and Alforja is also a place in Spain. The robots added links to the articles about the geographical location to the non-English pages, while on English Wikpedia, Alforja is a redirect to Saddlebag. --Dbratland (talk) 00:37, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Pannier

Hello, You are right my bot added some bad iw, it seems the mistake was introduced some days before, unfortunately bots may spread mistakes. The only way to prevent some other bot will repeat the mistake is to correct the error, I have corrected all the other wikis undoing the changes made by several bots but not the spanish one because I do not work with this wiki. Regards. --Loupeter (talk) 11:04, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good. Thanks!--Dbratland (talk) 15:24, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Honda NT600

Added section to talk page, please view. Thanks --87.232.123.231 (talk) 17:19, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

S Banack and Kawasaki Versys

Do me a favour and keep an eye on Kawasaki Versys and the actions of S Banack (talk · contribs). I have AIV'd him, but if he doesn't get banned then I'd rather not get into an edit war all on my own. See the page's history and his/my talk page but the summary is simple - he keeps adding the same club link into the article. --Biker Biker (talk) 16:37, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Sure. --Dbratland (talk) 16:54, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Much obliged. --Biker Biker (talk) 16:55, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

'Yezdi Roadking' to 'Ideal Jawa Yezdi Roadking'

Why did do do this naming change? The bikes were made under the 'Yezdi' brand, and were/are known as such. IJ also had a spirit-distillery business. According to the (absurd) naming convention you cite in your edit summary, Buell Blast should be named "Harley Davidson Buell Blast", or "Piaggio Moto Guzzi California", etc., you can see the point. 218.248.64.139 (talk) 21:07, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

The article says the manufacturer is Ideal Jawa, and Yezdi is simply a redirect to that page. The current article is completely lacking in source citations, so if you know of reliable sources, please, by all means, cite them and explain how Yezdi is a distinct unit within Ideal Jawa, if that is a case. Buell was not merely a H-D brand in name only. It was a distinct company and after Harley-Davidson acquired them, it operated as a separate business unit.

If the name of the article needs to be changed back, that is easily done, but the lack of verifiability is a far more serious issue than what the page should be called. --Dbratland (talk) 21:23, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm not saying that Yezdi was a unit within Ideal Jawa. I'm saying that the IJ folks never used the IJ name anywhere. Even the distillery business is called "Yezdi Distilleries" (see http://mysorecity.net/ViewRes.aspx?cls=395&id=123). All their commercial ventures bear the name "Yezdi" rather than IJ. IJ was a privately held company, and as such IJ can be considered a holding company with no products under its name. So the proper name for the bike is Yezdi Roadking, even though it is a brand of IJ. You can see the bike company website, www.yezdi.com. Its front page refers to IJ as the manufacturers of "Yezdi" bikes. The Products page clearly lists the names of their models, where IJ is nowhere to be seen. Even the Motor Transport documentation refers to the bikes' make as "Yezdi".

As the company went under before the blogging age, very few of its details are online, so sources are always going to be a problem. Its a miracle its website is still up (though not updated since a long time). I'll see what I can do. In the meantime, you should revert the article to the earlier name, and let someone with more knowledge of this brand fix this mess.218.248.64.139 (talk) 21:53, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

You first tell me they never use the name Ideal Jawa anywhere, then you direct me to the page http://www.yezdi.com/ where right front and center it says "Ideal Jawa (India) Limited" above Yedzi. I don't see how the products page tells us whether or not Yedzi is a business unit of Ideal Jawa or part of the model names. You might know what you're talking about but based on what you've supplied I don't believe you do. You seem to be guessing. But one of the beauties of Wikipedia is that it becomes irrelevant whether an editor is an expert or not. All that matters is what the sources say. Hence your best bet is to keep looking for sources to cite rather than try to talk me into doing anything, if this subject is important to you. I'll look into it myself some day but it might be a while before it becomes a priority. --Dbratland (talk) 22:43, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Sorry man. I didn't mean to offend you. I humbly submit that you simply undo the change you made to name of the article, and restrict your meddling/"editing" to topics/makes you are at least faintly aware of. If the sources were ambiguous, why did you have to change the name in the first place? It was correct earlier; now it isn't, thanks to your misguided attempt. Work with me here man. The least you can do is undo your mistake!

PS: I do know what I'm talking about here.

PPS: You really are not helping with statements like "your best bet is to keep looking for sources to cite rather than try to talk me into doing anything, if this subject is important to you." Well, the subject is important to me, and I am not talking you into doing something, I am trying to talk you out of a stupidity you have perpetrated. Sorry for the outburst man. If you don't have the time for "looking into" it, that's cool. Just give the article its older name back and it is done. Hoping for the best here.

PPPS: A possible source is http://jawaclub.com, which, despite its name, it is the website of the Yezdi-Jawa Owners' Club of India. There you'll find the whole scoop on Jawa/Ideal Jawa/Yezdi and their mutual relationships. Thanks for you time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.248.64.139 (talk) 23:05, 4 June 2010 (UTC) 218.248.64.139 (talk) 23:06, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Kindly reply or do the needful. 218.248.64.139 (talk) 00:03, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

I just realised (after an hour of being ignored by you), we do not need to have this discussion at all. Your modification clearly violated Wikipedia:UCN. Thus the article should have the common name, and that common name is "Yezdi Roadking". There are solid references to it. Eg. http://www.thehindu.com/mp/2009/01/05/stories/2009010550690100.htm That article actually refers to the bike as "Yezdi's" Road King model. How obvious can you get? That, by the way, is from one of India's most highly respected broadsheets. Change it back man! 218.248.64.139 (talk) 00:22, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

There are something like 100,000 editors besides me who could move this page back, and you may request that one of them move the page at Requested moves. With a trivial amount of effort, you could easily Create an account and become an Autoconfirmed user, and then move the page yourself. So while you have not convinced me of anything, that should be no barrier to you.--Dbratland (talk) 01:16, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

As you said, that's the beauty of Wikipedia man, that's the beauty of Wikipedia. Sorry for the different IP (can't help it). Though I will surely be creating an account now, I sincerely wish you had been more open-minded on this. Oh well, that's life! Bye. 218.248.64.151 (talk) 19:41, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

That's very nice indeed. Happy editing.--Dbratland (talk) 19:44, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Help me understand...

Hi Dbratland,

You removed my FullSpeed link from the motorcycle page (I also removed it from some other places I posted it per your feedback). I want to be within the guidelines, of course, so why can a news site (http://www.superbike-news.co.uk) be listed, but not my social network? Both are there for information and entertainment. Seeing the superbike news site actually gave me the idea...

Thanks for your help! Lreichle (talk) 18:22, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

The links to explanations on conflict of interest, spam, eternal links, etc. can be found in the welcome message on your talk page. Please read those carefully.

What is most relevant here is Links normally to be avoided. Links to social network sites, forums, discussion boards, etc. are not allowed, as explained in #10 and #11 of WP:ELNO. If superbike-news.co.uk violates the policy, it should be deleted too. Extended discussion of external linking can be found at Wikipedia:External links/Noticeboard.

In addition, you are editing Wikipedia for the purpose of promoting your employer's interests. See Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. You should submit your website's link to the Open Directory Project [1] and not add it to any more Wikipedia pages. --Dbratland (talk) 18:33, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation. Lreichle (talk) 21:45, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Deletion nomination of Talk:Sport bike/Workpage

blanked page

Hi Dbratland, this is a message from an automated bot, regarding Talk:Sport bike/Workpage. You blanked the page and, since you are its sole author, FrescoBot has interpreted it as a request for deletion of the page and asked administrators to satisfy the requests per speedy deletion criterion G7. Next time you want a page that you've created deleted, you can explicitly request the deletion by inserting the text {{db-author}}. If you didn't want the page deleted, please remove the {{db-author}} tag from the page and undo your blanking or put some content in the page. Admins are able to recover deleted pages. Please do not contact the bot operator for issues not related with bot's behaviour. To opt out of these bot messages, add {{bots|deny=FrescoBot}} somewhere on your talk page. -- FrescoBot (msg) 23:08, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Sturgis, Daytona, Laconia see alsos

hi. I see you reverted my addition of a small "see also" section to the Sturgis, Daytona, and Laconia bike week pages. I feel this section was valuable because the category you say already covers this is a catch all category. It covers all the motorcycle rallies in the US no matter the size, while these three are the three largest. I am willing to create a navbox with perhaps other rallies included, but these three rallies really should have direct links between them.--Found5dollar (talk) 13:02, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

I think the usual practice on Wikipedia is to create a List of largest [Whatevers].

You could do that, or make a navbox, but I think it would be misleading to the reader, as they might not be the 3 largest. They are simply called the 3 largest and Harley-Davidson fans don't question it. The attendance numbers they advertise are self-serving and not based on any consistent method of counting. I prefer to mention attendance numbers from several sources but not to give them too much credence; often the police or media sources doing the counting have no idea what they are doing.

I also think there is reason to believe that these three are merely the largest white rallies. The ones making these boasts don't count the National Bikers Roundup or Black Bike Week. In other words, picking out these 3 rallies violates Wikipedia:Systemic bias. The category is not a catch-all: everything there met the criteria Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies), which is reasonably objective and consistent. --Dbratland (talk) 16:04, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps a navbox for all 100,000+ rallies? Brianhe (talk) 03:25, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, that seems objective. And safer, since it wouldn't have to rank them #1, #2, #3. I should admit that there is a relationship between the three rallies Sturgis, Daytona, and Laconia, and within the H-D world that means something. I'm only saying there is a big picture here too. --Dbratland (talk) 04:21, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree a nave box is best... is there any way to group them in the box to make the connections between these three and the conection between the National Bikers Roundup and Black Bike Week for example?--Found5dollar (talk) 04:28, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Pls follow up at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Motorcycling#US motorcycle rallies navbox — Brianhe (talk) 04:39, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Honda NH series

Hi. You seem to have edited a lot of useful information out of the Honda NH series page. Firstly, the new image you are now using is wrong. Whilst it is a Honda Vision it is not an NH-series scooter - it's an SH50. Honda used model names across the range like that. Also, there was the list of other scooters, sold by other manufacturers, that use NH-series mechanics. I think is important information - much like a family tree. So, please let me know how these changes can be reverted. As the owner of two NH series scooters I know a lot about them, but my wikipedia editing abilities need work. Mattsephton (talk) 16:21, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

I've put back one of the old pictures and added an infobox.

You are perfectly free to edit any page you like, but to avoid getting your edits reverted, or having too much controversy, I'd start by reading Wikipedia:How to edit a page. Also very pertinent: Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not and Links normally to be avoided. There is a lot of good information out there on maintaining a model, it's history, it's defects, and so on, but it is outside the scope of Wikipedia. How-to information and original research belong elsewhere, and forums and blogs are an excellent outlet for that. Keep in mind that readers are smart enough to use a search engine to find blogs and forums about the Honda NH scooters. For the Wikipedia article, it's best to stick with what can be verified via reliable sources.

If you prefer to learn by example rather than explanation, check out Wikipedia:WikiProject Automobiles/Featured articles, specifically Holden VE Commodore, Maserati MC12, and Talbot Tagora. There aren't yet any motorcycle model articles of that quality, but BMW GS and Suzuki Hayabusa are pretty good.

Please check out Wikipedia:WikiProject Motorcycling as well, and take advantage of Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Motorcycling to discuss any issues or ask questions. --Dbratland (talk) 19:05, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for adding the picture back. I'll do some reading and add some info back as and when in a more structured manner. Mattsephton (talk) 11:54, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Vespa

Hi Dbratland, I hope this finds you well! Just a courtesy note, but one of the owners of a blog that was previously listed on the Vespa article Talk:Vespa#Looking_for_a_specific_discussion:_External_links started a discussion there about why it ahd been removed. I defended your actions of last December for replacing/adding a link to DMOZ. Hope that was OK. Best Regards, - Trident13 (talk) 00:33, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Indeed, quite so. Thanks! --Dbratland (talk) 00:36, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

No problems - always happy to defend your honour! Rgds, --Trident13 (talk) 00:52, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Reformatting of Victory Motorcycles "Marketing Contest"

Thank you for your comments regarding my editing of the contest section on the Victory Motorcycles page. However, I respectfully disagree with you that the article I edited read like an advertisement. Rather, I was careful to make the information I provided very objective and merely stated the basics of the contest.

If you feel different, please help me by stating how the article read like an advertisement. Using adjectives like "lucky" when discussing contest winners in lieu of just describing them as winners would be promotional prose. However, I was careful not to do that. Nor do I believe that including the name of the contest in the section title or even listing the names of the winning riders is advertising for the company.

Again, I thank you for your constructive comments and encourage you to help me write better wiki articles by showing me where I may have gone wrong in your opinion.

Gospikego (talk) 03:30, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

See Talk:Victory Motorcycles. Just taking a wild guess, it might possibly be that the only reason you are editing Wikipedia is to promote Victory motorcycles. If so, then the guidelines in Wikipedia:Conflict of interest might be something to read and consider. --Dbratland (talk) 04:51, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

Dale Chihuly

Hi, I receieved the following message from Dbratland, "Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, at least one of your recent edits, such as the one you made to Dale Chihuly, did not appear to be constructive and has been reverted or removed. Please use the sandbox for any test edits you would like to make, and read the welcome page to learn more about contributing constructively to this encyclopedia. Thank you. --Dbratland (talk) 15:09, 31 May 2010 (UT I believe my addition to be accurate, a matter of widely held opinion, and not a negative criticism- unless you happen to feel entrepreneur is a negative I do not. I believe every new enterprise was founded by an entrpreneur. I believe Mr. Chihuly is considered by many to be mor entrepreneur than artist because he does not make his own art. Rather, he hires employees to make art at his direction. His company produces a remarkably high volume of art that generates significant revenue from sales. I respectfully believe your removal of my contribution leaves the Chihuly entry as less accurate. This unilateral editing of material- based upon the notion of, who knows?, reflects a major flaw in Wikipedia (in my humble opinion). Not being critical of you, but of the system. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.16.147.242 (talk) 13:16, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

You should post a note at Talk:Dale Chihuly with the suggested edits you wish to make and see what other editors think of them. I have no idea why you are complaining to me about the system; perhaps someone would like to discuss it with you at Wikipedia talk:Biographies of living persons. --Dbratland (talk) 15:38, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

Peckhammer TV

Thank you for your suggestions, and for making this a better article. Souris40 (talk) 20:41, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

No problem! --Dbratland (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2010 (UTC)