Talk:Starry Night Over the Rhône

Scorpion

Unsourced statement inserted by anonymous user: 216.49.114.77 removed from main page:

• The sky is illuminated by the southwest view of the September setting of the constellation Scorpius (the scorpion), not Ursa Major as it is often mistaken for but would only be visible to the artist's back.

Van Gogh's own announcement refers to the Great Bear, and please note no artist at no time is forced to reproduce reality like a camera would do. --rpd (talk) 20:07, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Image

Why is the painting cropped on the bottom?! The painting should show the man's right foot but the image in the article does not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.193.133.193 (talk) 03:23, 31 July 2012 (UTC)

Edit improvement suggested

Could someone improve the 3rd bullet on the Genesis section, and perhaps suggest better references?

Thanks,

The Guy Who Put The Bullet Point In — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.98.230.39 (talk) 18:34, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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Title is wrong

The title of the work is not "Starry night over the Rhône" - it is simply "Starry Night" (La nuit étoilée), as can be seen here: https://www.musee-orsay.fr/en/collections/works-in-focus/search/commentaire_id/starry-night-7190.html

and here: https://artsandculture.google.com/asset/starry-night/uQE3XORhSK37Dw 213.245.152.220 (talk) 14:17, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

There is no consensus for this change of title. Frankly because there already is a painting with that title at MoMA in NYC - The Starry Night - and because this is Wikipedia this title should remain in order for the 2 paintings to be clearly differentiated...Modernist (talk) 12:42, 17 November 2019 (UTC)

The title of the one in NY is “The Starry Night”. The title of this one is “Starry Night”. The title of this Wikipedia article is fake and not the real title of any work. 2A01:CB01:2035:7E34:4C31:A375:8F39:9B24 (talk) 12:09, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

It has now been renamed. -Kj cheetham (talk) 15:54, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Reverted the page move as an undiscussed, controversial move. The simplest web search or book search would have confirmed that there are hundreds, or thousands, of occurrences of "Starry Night Over the Rhone" in reliable sources. Whether either one is the WP:COMMONNAME is to be determined. This was incorrectly raised as a technical request when that was unjustified. Follow proper procedures at WP:RM#CM. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 22:55, 28 September 2020 (UTC)

Post-script: The only thing I'm certain of, is that this was a controversial move, not a technical request. It's quite possible that the original move may gain consensus, but the proper path to that is through discussion.

I haven't done any serious research in order to determine WP:COMMONNAME, but one observation I wanted to make off the top, is this: whatever the official name is, doesn't count for much; and what the French official name may be, *especially* doesn't count. This is en-wiki, and determination of the proper title will depend on what reliable English sources call it. Bear in mind, that a perfectly plausible result might be, that this article and the article on fr-wiki might have different names; or putting it another way, it's possible that "Starry Night" ends up referring to one painting in English, but a different painting in French, and there's nothing wrong with that. We say, "Mona Lisa" (ans so do most other languages), but the French (and Spanish, and Italians) call it, "La Joconde". The point being, what the painting might be called in other languages, is irrelevant to any move discussion here.

I've made Starry Night a disambiguation page; there are at least three pages a viewer might be thinking of, when they search that term. If "Starry Night" is determined to be the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for one of the paintings, then that the disambig page should be renamed to Starry Night (disambiguation). Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 00:45, 29 September 2020 (UTC) updated unclear antecedent; Mathglot (talk) 22:05, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

I agree that the French name doesn't matter to the English Wikipedia. However, it is also clear that the official title of the painting is "Starry Night". If there are two paintings, one in NY officially named "The Starry Night" and one in Paris officially named "Starry Night", I can't see a "problem" - each painting gets to keep its own correct title, with disambiguation links in the lead, as I had done. It seems to me it would only be fair to keep "Starry Night" as a disambiguation page if the same is done to "The Starry Night" - otherwise we will clearly be being biased. Arrasarro (talk) 08:08, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Please read Wikipedia's policy on WP:Article titles. Clear or not, the "official" title is completely irrelevant, in whatever language. You're still new here; please learn about title policy, and disambiguation pages. This article might one day get renamed to the title you suggested, but none of your arguments are helping your cause. You'd do better to have a look at WP:RM#CM.

Oh, one other thing: please read WP:THREAD about how to properly reply to ongoing Talk page discussions, and the use of indentation for threading. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 11:50, 29 September 2020 (UTC)