Talk:Ingress (video game)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Importance

Changed the Project importance to "high". Seems painfully obvious to me that for the moment, this is one of the more important entries in the videogame universe. 100K+ players in less than a month with no franchise to build on, plus several aspects not observed in any other games to date. As far as I know, the number of other popular planetary-scale augmented-reality videogames is, well, zero. Tim Bray (talk) 03:00, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

I believe it isn't a High-importance article now (rather Mid), a high-importance game article should "typically need a few years to assess this impact". (WP:VG/A#Importance scale) I can't find game is "wide commercial success" from this article, for Mid-importance article Uncharted 2: Among Thieves, it's a top-seller in US with lots of awards, but Ingress is not. That is the reason I reassess it to low-importance.--202.117.145.241 (talk) 08:59, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Is success really only measured by monetary sales in the project's ratings? Number of players and level of buzz and innovation seem like obvious measures of impact. ★NealMcB★ (talk) 04:01, 1 April 2013 (UTC)

I certainly think that this deserves at least a mid importance. "Achieved wide commercial success, critically acclaimed or had wide sub-culture effect outside of their country of origin". Specifically the latter part of that. Its country of origin is obviously the United States, but the sub-culture surrounding Ingress both in the US and internationally is absolutely massive. As TimBray said, it had 100K+ users in less than a month after its release, and based on its current download stats, it has at least 500,000 users (though it is likely at least some of those are multiple downloads from a single user). That alone should be enough for it to be considered mid-importance, but I would say one could almost argue that given its numbers and its immensely positive critical reviews, it is almost worthy of mid-importance based on the commercial success or critical acclamation. --Sauronjim (talk) 12:15, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Actually, per WP:BB, I've decided to go ahead and make it mid-importance. If anyone has a strong disagreement, please state your reasoning. --Sauronjim (talk) 12:18, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Portal Range calculation

Got idea from this doc the portal range seem to be calculated as

160m*(AvgResonatorLv)^4

Works out so far to me, anyone can verify? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Threedices (talk • contribs) 20:51, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

I've removed this. That's a good /estimate/ but the table is nonsense because portal range is not a function of average resonator level. 99.115.144.121 (talk) 01:31, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

The formular is right based on experience and experiment! When you upgrade a resonator the game even shows how much portal range you gain! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.94.164.34 (talk) 11:02, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Don't forget that upgrades increase portal range in a non-linear fashion as well. cliffsteinman -- Discuss 18:31, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Add "In Popular Culture" section?

Ingress is featured in the latest xkcd strip, so that should be mentioned somehow in the article. What's the best way to do that? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.164.21.9 (talk) 21:16, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

A comic strip mentioning a video game nothing relevent to an encyclopedic entry. KirtZJ 22:34, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

I disagree. XKCD isn't just any comic strip, it's an icon of geek culture. I'm putting in the section and the reference. kencf0618 (talk) 22:59, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

I actually do prefer the reference be there, but December 2013 has not yet arrived 99.108.140.97 (talk) 09:46, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Capitalization

Could someone with more experience have a look and figure out when things like Portals and Resonators and Control Fields and so on should be capitalized, and when not? I’ve totally failed to achieve consistency and I don’t know what the appropriate style guide is. Tim Bray (talk) 21:23, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

You're doing great, keep editing and adding new info. Once I finish touching up a few articles I will lend a hand with the consistency of the article itself. KirtZJ 21:54, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

The screenshot of the intel map should be retaken in full screen mode, so that the browser's navigation and tab bar will be excluded. This focuses the image solely on the game. Also, the screenshot as well as its description should be further down in the article and not be part of the introduction because it hints at the "Gameplay" aspect. Perhaps a new subsection. KirtZJ 22:00, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the help. Will fix up the screenshot. BTW, I think the section called "Portals" needs to be at the front of the Gameplay section, to explain what it is that the rest of the section is talking about. And I had put resonators and mods as subsections there because they only exist in the context of Portals. Tim Bray (talk) 22:40, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Here's the revised screenie. File:Ingress Intel Map full-screen.png You know more about videogame article conventions so I won’t rush to put it in right away, feel free to go ahead if you know where you want it. I’m going to grab a mobile-client screenie later this afternoon Tim Bray (talk) 22:44, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

It's better. Go ahead and include it in the necessary subsection under Gameplay along with the relevant text. Everything is now where it should be. Later I will improve the Gameplay section by combining relevant data. This is because alot of it involves know-how on the game itself. If this were a packaged game, such information such as "portal hacking" as well as say use of "passcodes" would already be in any included media within the game itself or in print. Understand that an article of this nature isn't meant to attempt to explain every single aspect of a game, (even if they seem necessary) just the major ones. If this were the case, video game articles would be ridiculously huge. KirtZJ 23:15, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

I respun the caption to present it just as a snapshot of the state of play, to emphasize that the point of the game is contending for virtual territory in real space, took out all the stuff about how it’s done. And I still think the Seattle map belongs in the overview, not the gameplay section. Also, I’ll take a run through and try to de-jargon-ize the Gameplay. Also, I have a couple decent mobile-client screenies to drop in. Tim Bray (talk) 18:24, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

Augmented/Alternate

Are you really sure? Out there in the discussion about Ingress, it’s commonly referred to as an ARG and the A is augmented not alternate. This seems to me like the biggest example in the world of Augmented Reality in action. Tim Bray (talk) 19:10, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

Ingress is both. The software app is an Augmented Reality Game, and the lore of the game is being revealed in an Alternate Reality Game. Slickriptide (talk) 20:26, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

The game is essentially augmented reality, the way Google Goggles were. Reality still goes on around you and the game is laid on top of the real world map with real GPS. It augments or...in my opinion improves reality :D Alternate reality would be a true alternative with maybe a basis on reality but no real connection to it. cliffsteinman -- Discuss 18:40, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Augmented reality would be *seeing* the world through the phone, for example looking for that darn portal while looking around with your phone in front of you, not standing around like an idiot staring at your screen. 87.172.210.163 (talk) 19:19, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

Adding numbers to resonators and bursters

I think it is a good idea to add concrete numbers that explain how much energy resonators have per level and the damage and range of the bursters. I found information about the energy on ingress decode, and about the burster on the ingress fieldguide. I'm not a native speaker and I'm not (yet) very familiar with editing wikipedia, so I would be very grateful, if someone could add this information to this article. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sproksch (talk • contribs) 21:24, 2 February 2013 (UTC)

Purpose of the Game as Google Research Project

I find it to be negligent for this article to not have a section explaining the actual reason for this games existence: To enrich Google's wealth of knowledge. This game provides unmatched data on how people interact and move through the environment, enriches their POI (Points of Interest) database with real world usage and transport information, and furthers their development of photo-recognition technologies for overlay of advertising and information on real world scenes. All of this of course is vital to the Google Glass project for obvious reasons. I therefore believe the most fascinating aspect of the ingress project is that it is in no way a gift to the public. Rather it's a calculated and well designed (and even fun) platform to further broader Google goals and benefit it's other business units. There is quite a bit on the web written about these core motives, but I couldn't find anything authoritative. Best I found was here: [1] That said, I know these core motives are the reason the Niantic Project exists and that the cross pollination within the broader Google umbrella is what makes it *very* unique from essentially all other known games. Shall we add a "Google Research Project" (or similar) section to the main article? --Zebrazeb (talk) 11:14, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

That was just speculation by users. It has been officially denied. (not 100% sure I believe them!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHuj4pEdFr4 56 min in.

"What is Google doing with this information?" "....There was this speculation we were going to use this for improved driving directions,walking directions, it really hasn't been the goal of the team. As I said at the beginning of the Hangout, Niantic Labs was created to create adventures on foot, we really were founded as a small team to innovate in the space where we're taking all this geodata that we already have and have people build fun experiences that will get people out exercising and in their community. Our goal is really to build a fun game, that's our goal, there's no ulterior motive" 87.74.73.252 (talk) 22:34, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

A section on this might be beneficial to readers, but only to discuss the speculation. It could also include Google's denial. Jodayagi (talk) 18:11, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

I don't take that as a denial at all. The Ingress rep completely begs the question. Just because something isn't a goal for a specific team doesn't mean the data isn't collected, used, or shared with an entirely different team. Ingress users are bound to the general Google Terms of Service which state "The rights you grant in this license are for the limited purpose of operating, promoting, and improving our Services, and to develop new ones".[2][3] Only an explicit denial and alternate terms of service for Ingress would indicate otherwise. 108.26.56.121 (talk) 20:51, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

Ingress Underage Players

In the beginning, the article says "suitable for ages 6 and up" with citation 4. It should be noted that according to Ingress's Terms of Service (Ingress.com/terms) "If you are not 18 years old, do not use the Products." This is debatable, since I personally know several people that are under 18 that play, and in fact Ingress/Niantic affiliated profiles have publicly shared stories of underage players, so Niantic/Ingress does not actively enforce this rule (not as much as their rules against cheating or abuse), but it still should be noted on the page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.219.154.147 (talk) 01:58, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

^^Fixed -Mitwilsch (talk) 07:37, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

TOS updated: Age 13 and up. — Fatprincess (talk) 15:03, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

More Encyclopedic

I have deleted the Guidebook and Too Technical tags after having extensively parsed the article. If readers want more technical details, they are welcome to play the game itself and to peruse its own wiki, Google Groups, and blogs. kencf0618 (talk) 20:04, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Userboxes

I've created a userbox for those who are Enlightened, just use {{IngressEnlightened}} or if you chose the route of hindering progress...{{User:Theaelix/ubx/ingress}} for the Resistance. If you have any questions or suggestions please let me know on my talk page. Below are examples.

This user is part of the Enlightenment

This user is part of the Resistance.

cliffsteinman -- Discuss 21:18, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Infobox for Ingress

I'd like to include the current numbers of mind units for the Enlightened and the Resistance. Useful? I'll keep this open for a little before deciding, let me know what you think. cliffsteinman -- Discuss 22:06, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

I've been poking around...the version number has been removed from the Template:Infobox video games due to its lack of significance across platforms for many games. In the case of Ingress, users are interested in this information. Current balance of power between the Enlightenment and the Resistance is also very important. While information like the current number of portals may not be significant enough to reach an encyclopedia article, I feel the current balance of power (game's objective) may be. To best display this I would remove the transcluded infobox and {{subst:}} in the box with the version number and balance of power included. I would maintain this myself. I'll attempt to contact the page's author to get a point of view. Thoughts? cliffsteinman -- Discuss 05:48, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

My reading of WP:GAMEGUIDE is that the version number and the state of play aren't encyclopaedic. Woz2 (talk) 11:43, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

I don't know, the current version may be acceptable. By what this says I can understand the reason behind not having a running list of versions but in the case where the game will only be on one version... Exhaustive version histories: A list of every version/beta/patch of a game is inappropriate. Consider a summary of the game's development instead. I'd be inclined to think the current balance of power and the ability to keep it current is one of the perks of an online encyclopedia. cliffsteinman -- Discuss 17:17, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

The released version is already out-of-date so I suggest we delete it. Woz2 (talk) 00:18, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

"Launch date" change

I have corrected the date listed in the "Reception" section of the article. Because this edit may be considered controversial, I offer the following detailed explanation.

The second revision of the original article (which was apparently made from an IP on the East Coast of the US) added an uncited claim that Ingress "was officially launched on November 16th, 2012". That sentence remained until the revision prior to my edit. The 14th revision of the article added an Infobox listing the "Release date{s}" as "15 Nov 2012 (Closed beta)"; however, this was changed by an anon editor on 03-Jan-13 to read "Closed beta as of January 2013", and when it was restored by KirtZJ on 21-Jan-13, the text became "Closed beta as of November 2012".

A review of primary sources (eg. "Google Launches Ingress, a Worldwide Mobile Alternate Reality Game", which was datestamped "NOVEMBER 15, 2012 AT 7:00 AM PT", and linked from the article within an hour of its creation, "Google launches Ingress, a mobile alternate reality game set in the real world", dated "Nov 15, 2012 at 11:29p", which states that "Google launched a closed beta for a free mobile app today", and "Introducing Ingress: The MMO by Google", dated "Nov 16th 2012 10:45AM", which states that Google "revealed its new massively multiplayer online alternate reality game, Ingress, yesterday") shows that the actual release date was 15 November, 2012. This date is confirmed by other non-journalistic sources (eg. IGN Australia, which lists the Release Date as "November 15, 2012"). (Note that various sites, eg. this wiki listing which was edited to include the incorrect release date on 13-Oct-13, have apparently used Wikipedia as a source for an incorrectly listed date.) As such, I have edited both the "Reception" section—and will now also edit the Infobox—to list the correct date. — JEREMY 05:36, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Ingress version not showing

The Ingress version is in the wiki code, but is not showing on the page. Can anyone help me with that? Thanks! Great50 (talk) 02:09, 14 July 2014 (UTC)

That field is no longer supported or used by the infobox, it's no longer deemed relevant. Яehevkor ✉ 08:31, 14 July 2014 (UTC)

See Infobox for Ingress above cliffsteinman -- Discuss 13:29, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Business Model

Hi, the article is completely missing information about the background, i.e. the business model behind it. Does anybody have anything to add here? --Morray (talk) 10:39, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

To the section already there, I just added the bulletin they sent out less than an hour ago about independence from Google, as a level 3 subsection within § Business model. --Thnidu (talk) 03:17, 13 August 2015 (UTC)

So... How do you play?

I feel like some level of instruction should be here. Not "press 5 to jump", but all it says is that you have to be "physically near objects on the map to interact with them". What does that even mean? Do you have to stand close to it for longer than someone else does? Is there a QR code under a rock somewhere? Hacking? Resonators? Are MUs the players or are they something you capture? I'm coming to this page because I've heard of it and I want to learn more -- but this page seems designed to explain the rules to someone who already plays, like those newspaper columns about bridge plays. Doesn't explain much to someone who doesn't already understand. Cantras (talk) 06:54, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

Anomaly Results section?

What do you think about adding a table that notes primaries, satellites and results for each measurement and totals? Does such a table exist elsewhere on the internet? I cannot find it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.96.93.252 (talk) 11:43, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

I don't know if such a thing exists, but it's unlikely beyond the scope of an encyclopaedia article. Яehevkor ✉ 11:56, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Game details are considered transient news rather than being encyclopaedic. If the Anomaly aspect of the game has reasonable external news sources discussing it (like this story?), rather than internal reports/marketing, then there may be a rationale for adding information about it. --Fæ (talk) 15:49, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Cast?

I was reading the article just to find out something about the game, after seeing many comments and blog posts about it. Most of it was new to me, but fairly clear and comprehensible, until I got to § Cast.

Excuse me, WHAT?? How does a massively multi-player online game have a cast, with actors playing parts? This needs to be explained. As has been observed in another comment on this Talk page, it's not enough for an encyclopedic article to address people already familiar with the topic; it's got to explain the concepts, not take them for granted. Thnidu (talk) 06:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

Very good point! Actually there's no info on the transmedia story(telling) in the article whatsoever.

There's the "Setting" section but no explanation of how that setting, the story etc. are mediated and brought to life.

So this should definitely become part of this article! Very broadly there are videos on YouTube produced in the style of news reports that breathe life and fictionality into real world events (and the other way round as well; plus simply providing info on the current state of things) -> google for Ingress Report. Those are interwoven with artificially created real world events such as "anomalies" in some cities around the world as well as interesting team-organized stuff (like drawing things onto google maps with Ingress portals; new records; having tattoos made; competitions between teams; heavily organized "operations" such as fields across the atlantic with one team driving to a portal on an island etc). In addition to that there are also mini-videos that take place in the "Ingress" parallel reality. Both further the story.

Furthermore there's also the Niantic Project website (Niantic is also the company which also produced the game which is mystified and incorporated into the game; btw. I don't think Google went for this game just to get some game going - rather it's [also] a social experiment that's relevant to google) which has images, texts, videos and so on which also serve to further and deepen the story. And lastly social media (Google+) is also being used for story-elements.

Note that you don't need to get into the story to take part in and have fun with the game though.

So that section should have a title with its meaning close to "Storytelling", "Construction" or alike.

Please somebody create that section; or at least make some suggestions here on the talk page.

--Fixuture (talk) 18:11, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

@Fixuture: Thank you! for the explanation and your proposal. - Since writing that comment I've registered and started playing the game. so I'm more or less answered, but of course my question and your reaction still stand . --Thnidu (talk) 20:38, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

@Fixuture: Better than a section with details about individual events would be a brief section describing the types of event — Anomalies, Mission Days, First Saturdays, and #NL-1331 meetups — in 1–2 sentences each, with a link to https://www.ingress.com/events, which is as authoritative and up-to-date as anything can be.

That would most logically be a subsection of a section on the real-world social interactions of the game. The subsection on Events is on my to-do list (unless you want it), but I'm (L3) not prepared or competent for the larger section. --Thnidu (talk) 16:55, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

"Video game"?

I propose renaming this article Ingress (game), with a redirect from Ingress (video game). Please discuss at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games § Title of Ingress article. --Thnidu (talk) 16:45, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Masem and Czar answered my questions over there. "Video game" is the correct disambiguator to use, as part of a well established system for these article names. --Thnidu (talk) 02:05, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Dead links on official support site

With Ingress's breakaway from Google, all the official FAQ have been migrated to another site and they redirect to the main page only, not the specific question. I tried to tag them all, but it was reverted as 'vandalism'. Please update the citations to the FAQ, because as they are, they don't cite the content. --110.20.234.69 (talk) 03:03, 5 September 2015 (UTC)

@Thnidu: Please check this. 110.20.234.69 (talk) 01:44, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

@110.20.234.69: I'll have a go at it, though not tonight. -- Why don't you register? It feels strange to be pinging an IP address. --Thnidu (talk) 01:59, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

@110.20.234.69: I see what you mean. They're not really dead links, but they are too vague. I've started fixing. To be continued. --Thnidu (talk) 03:35, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

@Thnidu:, as an IP editor, pings don't work for me, but my talkpage does. It looks as if Niantic Labs has chopped up or rewritten some of the answers as well, so they'll be hard to reconstruct. --110.20.234.69 (talk) 06:25, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

I've marked the dead links with {{not in citation given}} - they are too vague to be helpful, and explicitly marking them as problematic is helpful to the readers. It looks like the new "New Portal submissions" page requires registration to view, as well. --110.20.234.69 (talk) 23:40, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

Pokemon Go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4pyT0r66ks Niantic are making a mobile Pokemon game based on Ingress. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.151.120.220 (talk) 06:19, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

172 reacties

Ref "13Magnus" began with the peculiar string "172 reacties". AFAICT, "reacties" occurs on the Web only in Dutch and means "reactions". 172 is very close to the number of comments on the cited webpage, and the "Cite web" template call included "author=172 reacties". Whatever the reason for it, I've deleted it from the cite. --Thnidu (talk) 02:54, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

Table of Anomalies

I've reorganized § Anomalies into a table. Hopefully it will now be somewhat easier to read, and missing info (such as primary cities for Cassandra and 13MAGNUS) will be obvious. --Thnidu (talk) 02:00, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

Added one screenshot alone of the game's app

The only other screenshot is of the map on Ingress's Intel website, and not a screenshot of the game itself. Hence, I think readding one screenshot of the game (the one with portal info) is fair use. Please explain if you want to revert this decision. @Rehevkor:

Length?

I hate to raise the issue, but is the article inching toward being too long? Please {{Ping}} me to discuss. --Thnidu (talk) 00:46, 24 December 2015 (UTC)

"Special events"

@Fixuture: (See previous discussions on this page, #Anomaly Results section?, #Cast?, and #Table of Anomalies.)

As more and more kinds of special event develop (anomalies, mission days, Goruck events...) it becomes less and less practical, and less useful, to list every such event. As I mentioned earlier toward the bottom of #Cast?, I've now moved § Anomalies down from an H2 section to H3, within a new H2 section called Special events. I've added after it a brief section on mission days, without a list. I'm planning to add similarly brief sections on the other types of special events, describing them in a paragraph at most and linking to the places on the Ingress site where they are listed.

We should (and I plan to) keep listing Anomalies in the table, in the abbreviated form we have so far (e.g., not listing satellite cities). They are major events that happen about four times a year, in only a few cities apiece, and that can have significant and unique effects on the backstory. Not so the Mission Days, let alone the First Saturdays!

--Thnidu (talk) 03:07, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

split from Google

This article mentions a split from Google without ever having mentioned Google before that in the article. -KaJunl (talk) 19:29, 9 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. Fixed, in lede.--Thnidu (talk) 06:39, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

"See also"

I'm restoring the relevant "See also" entries deleted by Dissident93. Struve Geodetic Arc and Geocaching are arguably irrelevant, but the other three apply to ingress. In particular, Transmedia storytelling is appropriate for a game with a complex ongoing storyline that is developed through

• online gaming
• in-person massively multiplayer Anomalies, and smaller Mission Days, First Fridays, etc.
• characters played by a cast of actors who appear in person at Anomalies as well as in videos, in-game and out-of-game newscasts (Susanna Moyer reporting on developments within the storyline as well as on Anomalies and other events, describing and showing the interactions of players as players)

--Thnidu (talk) 06:51, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

These should be written into the article instead of an "see also section" afterthought, as this is how the better written game articles do it. Why write an article if we could just put everything relevant into that? ~ Dissident93 (talk) 08:56, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Dissident93: (Since we are using bulleted lists, I changed your bullet to an indent to keep things clear.)

I didn't put them there, but you're right. Massively multiplayer online game (MMO) and Augmented reality are already in the article, which begins

Ingress is an augmented-reality massively multiplayer online location-based game

Transmedia storytelling is worth working into the text, and I'll do so, but not this minute.

--Thnidu (talk) 22:56, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Page views for Ingress

Because of Pokemon GO, Ingress is garnering more attention as the precursor app. ^ Here are its page views. --211.30.17.74 (talk) 06:17, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

@211.30.17.74: Source, please? --Thnidu (talk) 20:39, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

Source for what? The page views graph is a Wikipedia tool. There are several mentions of Ingress as a precursor app to Pokemon GO, cited to reliable sources, on the Pokemon GO Wikipedia article. --211.30.17.74 (talk) 00:54, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

@211.30.17.74: Source for the graph. I didn't know of the tool. Yeah, I should've realized it when I opened this section to edit it and saw the template, but I didn't; sorry. And yes indeed, I know of the connection between Ingress and Pokémon Go. --Thnidu (talk) 04:04, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

Scholarship

@211.30.17.74: Many thanks for creating this section and continuing to add to it.

If possible, would you add the access date, even if approximate, to the first two references in the section? I've inserted the parameter with a blank value at the end of each of them; it'll have no effect until filled in. TIA. Thnidu (talk) 04:03, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

My understanding is that access dates aren't needed for sources given without URLs. The section could use some more research, there's stacks on Google Scholar. --211.30.17.74 (talk) 04:29, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

Opt out

@WhalesharksKerman: In your recent edit to Ingress (video game) § Split from Google, you made the change

Users would be able to must opt out of this process in order to continue to play.

Do you have a source for this? It's not in the source I cited when creating that section; the Android Central article says

As an independent company, Niantic Labs won't be one of Alphabet's properties. However, Google will remain a backer, along with other upcoming partners. In an email to users, Niantic Labs says that Google will begin transferring user data over to Niantic on September 11, but users can opt out of this process if they so choose.

The link in the quote, http://www.ingress.com/optout, now simply goes to the ingress.com login page, and a Google search of the site for "optout" or "opt out" returns nothing.

Please {{Ping}} me to discuss. --Thnidu (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

Three days, no reply. I'm undoing the change. --Thnidu (talk) 20:58, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

Player count

The Tom's Guide article referenced (http://www.tomsguide.com/us/endgame-proving-grounds-beta,news-20650.html) says the following: "the Ingress mobile game, which has seen over 7 million players" which seems to me to reference a TOTAL player count, not an ACTIVE player count. Should the page not reflect that a bit more precisely? As written, it seems to imply that number is an active player count.131.131.192.210 (talk) 21:35, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

@131.131.192.210: Good point. I don't know if that information is available, but it's worth looking for. (I'm changing your reference here to just URL in parentheses because references on a talk page need a special template, which I don't remember at the moment, to keep them in the section and not be thrown to the bottom of page, or worse, have somebody else put another section after the references section.) --Thnidu (talk) 22:26, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

The "king" article by vice (in article) reckons that there were 8 million downloads of the app by January 2015. -211.30.17.74 (talk) 23:46, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

@131.131.192.210: That's a datum, all right, though it still doesn't tell us if those people are active players. You want to put it in, or should I? Please {{Ping}} me to discuss. --Thnidu (talk) 00:27, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

Maybe the player population and downloads should become a sectioned the reception. @Thnidu:, what do you think? 211.30.17.74 (talk) 01:19, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

@211.30.17.74: Could, but it's awfully short. A separate paragraph, maybe. (BTW, I didn't get a notification, when you fixed the spelling of my ID :

The edit that adds this template must be signed with new signature tildes at a minimum, or the notification(s) will not work.

though no harm done here. My wife could never get it right either. It's deliberately a bit weird.) --Thnidu (talk) 08:26, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

Just a random note but you can't ping an IP either. :) At least, that's what I've been told. If it does alert, you can't guarantee who read it. -- ferret (talk) 14:15, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

I get no bells or whistles as an IP editor unless someone uses my talk page. I've done a light reshuffle, how does that look, @Thnidu:, @Ferret:? --211.30.17.74 (talk) 21:22, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

That looks good to me. Separate § for dev&release, 👍; combining all user count reports, 👍. Good job. --Thnidu (talk) 21:29, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

I've done a more extensive reshuffle of the reception, bringing it closer to Pokemon Go's format. --211.30.17.74 (talk) 22:04, 23 July 2016 (UTC)

Bolding

@Kuru: I understand why you reverted my bolding of the word "sponsorship" in Ingress (video game) § Business model. I was trying to apply a quasi-subhead to that paragraph to make it easier to find. But by itself, I agree that it looked pretty random. So instead of just reverting your reversion, I have put in what I hope are more proper-looking subheads, in boldface with a colon, at the very beginning of several paragraphs. I hope you find these more acceptable. Thnidu (talk) 02:08, 1 August 2016 (UTC)

Back story; italics

Dissident93, you are obviously much more familiar with video games in general than I am, and so I have to ask for an explanation here: Why is "as is the case with nearly every game ever made" a reason for

• deleting "complex" from "The game has a complex science fiction back story with a continuous open narrative"
• and deleting the sentence "Understanding the story is not necessary for playing and enjoying the game"? While this sentence may be inaccurate In an absolute sense, "Understanding the story completely is not necessary..." is certainly true. I can swear to that, because there are many aspects of this game that I haven't looked into, and I have plenty of fun with it, currently as a level 11 agent. I added that sentence so as not to scare off potential new players.

What is obvious to the widely experienced game player may be quite unfamiliar to the novice. Although I raised my kids on AD&D edn2 thirty years ago, I had very little contact with gaming, and especially with video games, from then till I started playing Ingress last year. I'm sure there are plenty of other players, or non-players interested in reading about the game, who have little or no familiarity with the breadth and depth of the world of video games, and they deserve to know these things too.

My other question is, Why italicize the name of the game? Is it called for by WP:MOS? Is it customary or standard in articles about other games? If not, surely capitalizing the name is more than enough to prevent any possible confusion with dictionary definitions of this uncommon word.

--Thnidu (talk) 06:02, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

• Playing the game without understanding the story doesn't need to be mentioned, as it's true for pretty much every game ever made. And while I do understand your point, games that get to WP:FA status don't normally state these sort of things. Using complex as a description is normally considered a peacock word, and should be written in a different way that doesn't claim it as 100% fact. And yes, all instances of works of fiction (which includes all games) on Wikipedia should be italicized, per MOS:TITLE. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 06:16, 16 July 2016 (UTC

Dissident93, thanks for the info & references. I'm reluctant to leave the complexity out of the article but the appropriate place to fit that in will be in discussion of transmedia storytelling, and by NPOV description rather than peacockery. --Thnidu (talk) 20:36, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

Sounds good. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 02:28, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

• I agree with omitting "complex." It's vague, hard to concretely verify, and doesn't really add anything. "Science fiction back story" in itself sounds complex. -KaJunl (talk) 15:34, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

pokemon

Is it worth mentioning anything about Pokemon GO and how parts of it are based on elements of this game in the article? I ask because even looking at the recent edits it's pretty clear that people have been paying a lot more attention to the Ingress article since the Pokemon GO release (and presumably have also been paying a lot more attention to the Ingress game).

-KaJunl (talk) 15:30, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

@KaJunl: Of course it is! But the article already features info on that: Data from Ingress was used to populate the locations for Pokéstops and gyms within Pokémon Go, released in July 2016. Are you saying that that's not enough? I'd say a sentence (at least in meaning) like Furthermore many other gameplay elements of Ingress can also be found in Pokémon Go. would be a good idea.

--Fixuture (talk) 18:39, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

Ah, I didn't see that before, thanks for pointing it out. Maybe a mention of increased downloads of Ingress/increased attention to the game after Pokemon Go's release? If that claim can be backed up. -KaJunl (talk) 21:13, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

As long as it's sourced, I would think it makes sense to add another sentence about that. —PermStrump(talk) 22:19, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

VGSCOPE

Since there's several editors already working on this article, I opt'd not to blank this content outright. Please review WP:VGSCOPE and consider a drastic trimming of the game play section, most notably the lists and long descriptions of various items, per #3 and #7 of the guideline. -- ferret (talk) 11:14, 1 August 2016 (UTC)

I agree with that, especially concerning #7. It seems like there's a huge list of practically every item in the game which really doesn't need to be there. Radioactivated (talk) 22:34, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

I've cleared the section, as I didn't feel there was a need to trim it further. This article has plenty of excessive detail as is. -- ferret (talk) 20:09, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

Also removed Cast per VGSCOPE #11. And Special Events probably should also go. Recommend the article's major maintainers give a read over WP:VG/GL in general. -- ferret (talk) 20:15, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

Deletion of § Game items

@Ferret: Deleting the entire "Game items" and "Cast" sections was a rather drastic move. It would have been much more considerate to open a discussion here before doing anything of the kind. Please undo your recent massive edits and come here to discuss them. --Thnidu (talk) 20:22, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

See #VGSCOPE above. A discussion has been open for some time. -- ferret (talk) 20:28, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

@Ferret: Yes, I just saw that and was deleting this section when you posted your answer. Is it too late to reopen the discussion? — Ummmm... no, sorry, don't bother to answer that till I've had a chance to read WP:VGSCOPE, which I cannot do at this moment. I'll comment up there or down here when I have, in the next day or so. --Thnidu (talk) 20:32, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

If you feel some of the content can be worked back into the Gameplay section, feel free to do so. The content I removed was specifically in relation to lists of game items (#7 of VGSCOPE) and a cast list (#11 of VGSCOPE). I did feel nearly a month was long enough to wait on this. -- ferret (talk) 20:34, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

@Ferret: Yes.... I'm baffled. I check my watchlist regularly, which includes this article and (automatically, I believe) this talk page, and I don't remember seeing that discussion... or maybe I saw it listed and didn't follow it because I didn't know the term VGSCOPE, which was the whole of the section title, and I didn't realize that the section was a proposal was for blanking large parts of the article. It might have been clearer to use the WP: section's name, Inappropriate content, instead of just its abbrev. --Thnidu (talk) 20:44, 27 August 2016 (UTC)

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Name of This Article

Ingress is more then just a video game player interact with the real wold. In ingress disambiguation page suggest it is an augmented reality game .**My Cat inn @ (talk)** 16:03, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

@My Cat inn: Agree. Having "(video game)" in the title is very problematic here. I just boldly moved the page to Ingress (game). Any other suggestions? I'd oppose Ingress (augmented reality game) but Ingress (location-based game) might be a good choice(?) - it's a bit long for an article-title though.

--Fixuture (talk) 13:02, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Could you move it back please, per WP:NCVGDAB, @Fixuture? It's a video game. The parenthetical name is only to disambiguate the topic from other Ingress articles. There's no one who comes looking for Ingress who doesn't understand what they'll get with (video game). -- ferret (talk) 15:02, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

@Ferret: No, I won't move it back: it's not an ordinary video game and article-titles should always and foremost be accurate. Instead WP:NCVGDAB could and probably should be updated for such transreality games. --Fixuture (talk) 15:07, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I disagree. First and foremost, it's a video game. The NCVGDAB puts them at video game to improve clarity against with board games, sports games, etc, etc. (At least, that's my reading). You said you BOLDly moved it, and I wanted to politely request you revert for discussion. If you want the guideline changed, proper venue (to start at least) would be WT:VG. -- ferret (talk) 15:13, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

@Ferret: Alright I moved it back and created a discussion at: Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (video games)#What about mixed reality games like Ingress (video game)?. I'll leave the article as it is until things are decided there. --Fixuture (talk) 16:25, 26 December 2016 (UTC)